“So yesterday we paid the wind turbine operators $4,229,280 ($135 per MWh) to produce their record 31,328 MWh and exported it at an average price of $21 per MWh generating about $650,000 in revenue for a net cost of approximately $3.6 million. We also paid Bruce $931,000 ($65 per MWH) for steaming off (using your comparative drop from same day last year) the 14,325 MWh of nuclear so the net cost to produce the 31,328 MWh from wind fully costed was $4.5 million or $143 per MWh for power we didn’t even use! “
I admit maths are hard but this doesn’t add up well…unless I can figure out how to get paid large for doing nothing…occupy Sesame Steet..?
Going green is great for the investors but hell on the end users that see the massive spikes in their electrical bills. If mother nature can not produce cheaper power than a coal fired plant then all funding to green energy should be cut off until it is cheaper. I have yet to see anything green that is not inferior to what it’s trying to replace. Going green is definately killing what’s left of the struggling economy.
This is what people should be protesting, the 1% who are profiting from the losses subsidized by the 99% known as suckers (or in BC and Ontario, voters).
I guess communists don’t care if we get hosed, good conditioning for the hosings they plan for after the revolution.
And conservatives are too busy working to take to the streets.
Wind energy is like a store clerk with a Porsche, looks good from a distance, but makes no economic sense.
Boy, wait ’til Hudak hears about this!
Dildo McDinky’s in for a real thrashin’!
Alas-even if this was announced prior to election time, the average Ontario voter is either mathematically challanged, or too ambivalent to care.It would not have changed the outcome.
Are you really surprised?
How many times have you seen these wind turbines motionless on a windy day? That’s another stupid thing these clowns do…the “entreprenuers” get paid for the juice they don’t produce.
cobisco
“Alas-even if this was announced prior to election time, the average Ontario voter is either mathematically challanged, or too ambivalent to care.It would not have changed the outcome.”
We’ll never know because it wasn’t…there’s the rub.
One of the most perfect cons ever designed.
The way to beat it is to relentlessly expose it.
I’d suggest linking the CBC budget and teacher’s salaries to the losses. Every day windpower costs more than it produces, they get whacked in their wallets.
Yes but it feels good…. /sarc
“Wind is first to the grid so even if we don’t need it, the producers get paid the exorbitant FIT rates.”
And please note that the excess power does NOT go toward juicing up Jimmy Greenbrain’s electric car in Ontario with carbon neutral electricity. It gets sold to the Americans at a -loss-.
Buy high, sell low. Dear lefties, please defend this.
But Dalton McQuimby is such a nice guy …
/average Ontario idiot mode off
Hudak should’ve been all over this crap, and the insanely-high solar rates as well. You don’t get economic prosperity through octupling your energy bill.
“You don’t get economic prosperity through octupling your energy bill.”
Or by funneling public money to friends of the regime, either. I think that’s called “stealing” or something, isn’t it?
Meanwhile…every month I see elderly ladies, living on a fixed income (old age pension), standing at the counter at the bank with electric bill in hand. They are pleading with the teller as to why their bill is now 300$ a month instead of the former 80$…”What am I suppose to do?” they ask…and you just know, to keep the lights and heat on, the elderly are living on tea and toast…or cat food.
Is the end game of the green movement to “cleanse” us of our elderly seniors? Sure looks like it….
This is criminal and McGuinty should be jailed, not starting a third term to keep fleecing the people of Ontario. In the end though, especially in this case, they got the government they deserved.
The facts around the wind blowing when the power is not needed, the wind not blowing when the power is needed, the requirement to build new gas-fired stations to keep the lights on when the wind isn’t blowing, transmission difficulties caused by wind farms and all of the other inefficiencies and burgeoning costs are all pretty well known. Sometimes Ontario even has to PAY Michigan and New York to take the surplus wind energy off our hands! Sheer stupidity!! But these problems generally haven’t been picked up by mainstream media whose reporters seem to have pretty well been at the head of the line for drinking the Gore/Suzuki kool-aide. The Ontario government and the wind farm advocates are silent which means they are not being honest. As Fred said at 8:19, the only “solution” is to be relentless in exposing it. Again and again and again.
And now this:
http://ottawa.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20111017/OTT_Green_Energy_111017/20111017/?hub=OttawaHome
Ontario will soon have the highest energy costs in the developed world. Guess the Prairies is not getting any of it’s equalization payments to Ontario back some time soon.
It’s neat how they just make up numbers without bothering to provide even the most basic references, and yet manage to get so many fools to believe them. I guess that’s how propaganda works, huh?
For an alternate viewpoint, Energy Analyst Carl Gustav estimates that Ontario wind farms yesterday generated 1.21 GIGAWATTS of power and exported it forward in time, earning ONE HUNDRED BILLION DOLLARS! Clearly Carl is a much more trustworthy guy than this “Scott Luft”.
Green “education” is state-sponsored terrorism. It is the Western equivalent of Islamic Theocracy. Green theology dominates the public education system. Politicians like McGuinty, Swartzenager and others, pimp to the hysteria, negating science and numeracy while corporate rent seekers line up at the trough. The eventual decline will see the West resembling the ME, a basket case.
I live in rural Ontario. Not many months ago we were getting glossy ads selling solar panels for installation on barn and implement shed roofs EVERY damn day in the mailbox. The day after the election, a conversation was had with a young fellow, who was rushing off to the bank to see about borrowing 80,000$ to put the giant mirrors on his barn roof. The company selling the panels had been in the day before (election day) pushing for him to sign a contract.
The bank would give him 6 years to pay off the loan.
When asked how much he would earn selling electricity, the answer was maximum 12,000$ per year, and he was absolutely convinced that the electricity sales would cover the loan costs.
When told “Do the math, man!”…all you got was a I-drank-the-koolaid blank stare.
I hope for his sake (and his young family) that the bank said “NO”.
I’ve said it before…and I’ll say it again…solar and wind is nothing more than a green ponzi scheme.
trollex said: “It’s neat how they just make up numbers without bothering to provide even the most basic references, and yet manage to get so many fools to believe them.”
Trollex going with the tried and true “Big Lie” offensive defense plus name calling, eh? Sticking with the classics, trollex.
Still living in mum’s dawg house, btw?
Alex, there’s nothing new in this. Denmark has been losing money for many years on its wind fleet for precisely this reason. Most Danish wind power when it’s in surplus offsets against Norwegian hydraulic, at a huge loss to the grid operator. When it’s in deficit it has to come from peaking gas, again at a large net cost.
Ontario is no different. This problem is essentially permanent until such time as there is a large storage capacity for surplus wind generation.
This by the way is precisely why Denmark dropped its FIT subsidy about two years ago, substituting instead Green Energy Certificates.
And after all of that 4800 MW of Danish wind construciton, how many Danish coal plants have been closed.
Zero.
And how much total coal burn has been reduced in Denmark by wind energy?
Zero.
It’s up over the past decade, largely as a result of the closure of a Swedish nuclear plant, and will be up greatly as a result of German nuclear plant closures.
The simple fact is that wind turbine production does not match grid demand, and there’s a large cost to pay for that beyond the raw kWh price of wind turbine production.
“Alex, there’s nothing new in this.”
Yes, I know that there’s nothing new about pundits making up figures to support their politics, but it’s still a bit sad, don’t you think? Wouldn’t it be nice to see some actual evidence, for a change? Wouldn’t it be awesome to see people demanding real evidence, instead of mindlessly believing anything that any like-minded idiot tells them?
Alex, I’ve posted up the numbers on this so many times over the past several years I’m bored with it.
If you want to continue denying reality, go right ahead. Wade through the IMO website. You’ll find that Ontario’s wind turbines are producing about 1.5% of rated capacity during summer highs. Wade through StatsCan’s Electric Power Statistics. The annual capacity factors are trivially easy to derive. You’ll find the same thing during winter high pressure zones as well. In Quebec, the capacity factors for the Gaspe turbines, probably the best wind regime in Canada are less than 18% lifetime, let alone the failure to match with grid demand.
These are just a few of the facts, Alex. And if you don’t know them you have no business wading into this discussion. What would be truly awesome is if you actually knew something about energy production, consumption and demand.
Hey Alex the real idiots built solar panels that are still sitting idle and could be indefinitely because they listened to idiots like you.
There is lots of evidence out in rural Ontario Alex, tons of it.
Hot off the press:
http://www.thestar.com/business/article/1071332–power-prices-will-rise-steeply-study-says
“Alex, I’ve posted up the numbers on this so many times over the past several years I’m bored with it.”
Yeah, so did Carl. He still seems more trustworthy.
If the figures were legit, it would take all of 5 seconds to provide a credible link. The fact that none of the “information” posted here is ever supported by any verifiable data speaks volumes about Kate’s approach to fact-checking (avoid it like the plague). I have no reason to believe you’re any better. Provide some real numbers and we’ll talk.
Did I miss something? Didn’t Ontarians just agree to let this stuff go on for at least another 5 years?
Alex, go here:
http://www.wind-watch.org/documents/eon-netz-wind-report-2005/
It’s the 2005 report by E.On Netz, the organization that operates the Schleswig and Lower Saxony grid. It’s one of many, many utility reports on the performance of their wind system.
@ Alex
This is also worth looking at.
http://notrickszone.com/2011/07/04/weed-covered-solar-park-20-acres-11-million-only-one-and-half-years-old/
@cgh:
You’re quoting statistics from Germany to show that a Canadian wind farm cost $4 million to generate 31k MWH of electricity?
Give your head a shake.
Peter, your link is so off target it makes cgh look like a sniper in comparison. Does anyone here actually understand how to support a claim, or do you all just flail around randomly, hoping you’ll get lucky? The Hellen Keller machine-gunnery approach?
Alex, try not to be too big a dolt. ALL wind generation systems work as badly as the one outlined by EOn Netz. The Germans have just documented the failures of theirs the best.
If you wade through IMO’s daily and weekly production stats you find the same thing in Ontario.
And did you miss EOn’s observation that the bigger the wind system gets the worse it performs? Both displacement ability and capacity factors both go down with the size of the system, not to mention their other key conclusion of increased grid stability because of large amounts of electricity or large sag-outs that the system cannot accommodate.
As I said before, Alex, this really isn’t a discussion you belong in.
“Alex, try not to be too big a dolt. ALL wind generation systems work as badly as the one outlined by EOn Netz. The Germans have just documented the failures of theirs the best.”
I’ll just take your word on that, shall I?
You’re REALLY not getting this whole “evidence” thing, are you?
Alex, you wouldn’t understand evidence if it drove over you.
I gave you evidence. What do you have? Nothing, same as always.
“I gave you evidence. What do you have? Nothing, same as always.”
I don’t need to offer evidence since I’m not the one making a claim; we can add “burden of proof” to the list of things you’re clueless about. However, in this case, and in light of your low standard for what you consider evidence, I’ll provide some anyway:
2+2=4
4+4=8
Germany is located in Europe.
Therefore windmills generate unlimited energy for free.
There ya go – cgh-style evidence, for a fraction of the cost! Enjoy!