Open for comments.
Also, some links sent along, for your enjoyment;
The Larry, Curly and Moe Accord: see the “No Surprises” clause on page 2. The “within the limits of common sense” passage seems especially ironic.
More on that “A permanent consultation mechanism.” they offered the BQ.
Historical Summary of Canadian Elections
Drop others in the comments if you so wish.
Update – This is a good one.
Much fun in the LIberal.ca forums (h/t Shaken)
Kate, I was one who wanted to see the showdown occur on Monday. Whichever way it went, the Libs as they currently exist would be finished.
The GG granting prorogation (sp?) tells the “coalition” she doesn’t think they are the right way to govern Canada now. She may allow them to try once a budget is presented and defeated, but, I think she would lean toward another election unless the “coalition” can show very concrete reasons why the budget is bad for the country.
The best news today might be that we get nearly two months before the people from the government arrive to “help” us.
Le question est maintenant qu’est-ce qu’il se passera est actuellement qu’est-ce que nous souhaitons que se passera. C’est important que Messrs. Dion-Dceppe-Layton +/- Mme. May du ‘Coalition de Sedition’ soient absolument convaincu qu’il vont gagner l’election du printemps dans leur deguise de Coalition. Pas s’ils prennent le temps pour reflechir qu’ils feront mieux bagarrer l’election commes Mensongeberaux, Tetes Bloquistes, et Syndicat-Amants Socialistes. Dans ce cas, les Mensongeberaux auront le chance to regagner une minorite – pourriez-vous imaginer la premiere idee qu’ils vont avoir dans le cas qu’un Parti parmi eux a plus des sieges que maintenant ?
When I worked in Quebec in the late 80’s, I had business dealings with farmers in Portneuf County. I asked an elderly farmer what he thought of this whole separatiste thing. His reply:
“Laissez-moi vous dire quelque chose. Mon grandpere etait Canadien. Mon pere etait Canadien. Moi, j’suis Canadien. Mon fils est Canadien. Et chali*e, mes maudits vaches sont Canadien!
I believe the vast majority of Quebecers outside Montreal are staunch federalist Canadien(nes) and they will have nothing to do with this Coalition. The danger is the Coalitionistes ‘deform’ prior to the next election and ‘reform’ after it, since finding ways to skirt the truth seems to be a Liberal mindset and cash transfers in brown paper bags fits right in. Quebec won’t buy it; the West won’t buy it; hopefully Atlantic Canada won’t buy it; Ontario seems to be buying it.
Apologies for the ‘three-years-in-rural-Quebec-twenty-years-ago French’
Aureus Puer
A proud Conservative in Iggy’s riding.
Fife reported this a.m. that Lib and NDP MPs who were in a bar last night nearly came to blows over the embarrassment of Stephane’s Al-Quaeda-produced home movie. Cell phone footage of that would be absolutely priceless (and of higher quality than Stephie’s vid).
the rat at December 4, 2008 11:36 AM
What negotiations are you referring to?
At the end of the day,Mr.Harper is still at the helm,the rest is Ted….oops,I mean history.
sorry about the multi post… I got excited
GG Michaëlle Jean is nothing but a tool of the Liberals! Oh wait… she made a decision that wasn’t partisan?
What is it with these Libs? Thinking thoughts and not just following party doctrine?
sorry
Another poll gone horribly wrong:
CTV
Did GG make the correct decision?
71% Yes
29% No
I am curious to hear the GG’s reasoning for accepting prorogation this quickly.
Dion’s in a world of hurt.
In respect of the Koalition of Klutzes, I believe the GG took to heart the immortal words of Trudeau — an apprehended insurrection in a time of national emergency.
Bwaah!
MSM did its best to downplay the BQ/separatist threat to national unity last night.
Does this mean that it’s not a real threat after all? That we have been duped by the LPC about need to elect them for the sake of national unity all this time?
Which would the MSM have us believe now? BQ good for Canada, or bad for Canada.
If bad for Canada, then what are these LPC clowns doing make a deal to establish ‘permanent consultation’ with them?
If not a threat, then what has the past 40 years of LPC branding as the party of national unity been all about?
Time for MSM/LPC to decide which it is: good or bad.
The mask has slipped a little. We’ve noticed.
I’d say that as soon as people go home from parliament, the liberal party’s Brutuses will be dragging Dion’s political corpse to the forest for an anonymous burial.
I would also say that Iggy just tied up the leadership and that Power Corp’s Bob Rae is finished. All of which may be bad for the CPC because it’s healthy for the liberals. Although, I think the liberal brand has taken such a beating it may not be possible for a mere purge to save it. More than leaches and bleedings may be necessary.
Stay Dion, Stay!
Harper is in an extremely strong position now. This nonsense that he must resign is simply a wish from the left because Harper outsmarts them at every turn. The Libs and the ND’s have opened their kimono too far and the public doesn’t like what it sees. It seems there has been a hidden agenda all along and it lurked in the heads (notice I didn’t say minds) of the Liberal and the NDP “leadership”.
I am kind of bothered by how long the meeting went. I suspect Harper got a lecture from the Governor General. She has seen the guy three times in two years for two proroguings and an election.
This fiasco is the best argument for having another election and Canadians just electing a majority government. If I was the GG, I would have called an election hoping this minority nonsense would finally end.
FYI the 0n-line petition: Our Right to Vote on the Coalition Government has just sailed by 1/4 million signatories, and increasing by the hundreds every few minutes.
link http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?CANADIAN&1
Everyone seems to feel that proroguing was choice #1, my feeling that Harper’s first choice was an election after a non-confidence vote, but he and the GG couldn’t agree so proroguing was a compromise.
Just my opinion, I know that we’ll probably never know.
Go Stepehen! we’re behind ya!
I heard that she was discussing Harpers new book on Hockey.
He has been holding off publishing it till the Leafs win another cup or backdoor Jack Layton becomes PM.
Anyone interested in seeing what Harper really wanted to say last night should read:
http://www.beerbellybuddah.com/2008/12/this-just-in-copy-of-harpers-real.html
Rumor has it from the hill is that Layton held a secret meeting with Dion days after the election to explain what he and the separatists had concocked. Dion was enticed when Jack told him, you will be the PM. The deal was sealed and when the time was right they would strike.
Dion and 11 other Liberals knew about it and the Wednesday before the update the Liberal Caucus was told of the deal. Sounds like it went ballistic.
Power blinds, if was not so sad it would be funny. Wait it is funny. Ole’ Ralph in Regina is not answering his phone or emails. The gig is up.
All I know is at the end of the day,Mr.Harper is still at the helm. ‘post by h.ryan’. I am in complete agreement with this part.
Rumor has it from the hill is that Layton held a secret meeting with Dion days after the election to explain what he and the separatists had concocked. Dion was enticed when Jack told him, you will be the PM. The deal was sealed and when the time was right they would strike.
Dion and 11 other Liberals knew about it and the Wednesday before the update the Liberal Caucus was told of the deal. Sounds like it went ballistic.
Power blinds, if was not so sad it would be funny. Wait it is funny. Ole’ Ralph in Regina is not answering his phone or emails. The gig is up.
ryan – I can speculate as well; I speculate that Harper was explaining to her the full extent of the Hidden Agenda of the Coalition.
Ted, we aren’t in an economic crisis; we are in an economic downturn; our GSP is still up; we are still solid. Those industries that structured themselves out of the competitive market, eg, auto industries, shouldn’t expect the taxpayer to fund them to stay the same. They’ll have to restructure. Same with other industries.
The global financial shift is a symptom of the entry of masses of middle class consumers from China and India into the global financial and economic network.
The Coalition is a deeply undemocratic agenda. Notice that it deliberately rejects the October democratic vote; and refuses to take its idea of a coalition to the people. It’s set up that way, with the Bloc guaranteeing no fall of the coalition for several years. In return for 1 billion and several Senate seats. Is that democracy?
And, they’ve set up a two-tiered House of Commons. All Motions will be approved by MPs who are voted in by 100% of the electorate. But this won’t be enough; these motions have to go to a higher tier. The Bloc, whose MPs are elected by less than 20% of Canadians. Over 80% of the electorate are barred from voting for this level of the House. A two-tiered House. That’s not democracy.
Now that Layton has swallowed the Liberals, who can never shake free of being tainted in this way, will a break-away section of the Liberals emerge, to start up the New Liberal Party?
Congratulations Canada. Canadians are on the precipice of throwing away the one piece of identity that truly differentiates them from their cousins to the south. We are about to do something that America accomplished back in 1776. When the Fathers of the American Constitution signed the Declaration of Independence they created a republic wherein the final arbitrator of Justice is the State. In Canada we retained the system of British Common law, including the retention of the Monarch as the final arbitrator of Justice. A small difference in the greater scheme of things, right? Both systems are based on British or English Common Law, which is based on the Magna Carta. So on the eve of the eighth hundred anniversary Canada is on the verge of throwing the Great Charter, to put it in the American vernacular, under the bus. The solution to the litigation that is lurking behind the latest American election, requiring Obama to produce his birth certificate, is that the Crown in the personage of the Queen could demand that Obama prove that he is eligible to become President. In a society there must be a system of law to retain order and good governance. A system that embodies an ephemeral substance as its figurehead has a disconnect from the people who want to exist within the system. In Canada under the system we have evolved, the Sovereign with the assistance of the Supreme court, would adjudicate. Now we’re about to get into the same mess that America is in. How do you ask? As a politician would respond that’s a very good question, and I really am at a loss as to how our country has reached this point because it was all explained to me back in high school.
When King John signed the Magna Carta he rescinded the Divine Right of Kings and allowed the Lords of England at the time to select a group of them to assist Him in ruling the Realm. Since then through the course of time we have come to the system that we have today. This system is encoded in the Statute of Westminster. The one thing that hasn’t changed is that although the Crown has relinquished total authority to rule, the Crown still has the authority to request an election to be called to select a group of citizens to assist the Crown in governing the Realm. In other words the Sovereign is supposedly to be seen as to be still in charge. So for the last eight hundred years we’ve been using this system where the Crown calls for assistance to govern. It worked pretty well, sure there have been some rough spots, the English Civil War is one instance, but all in all it’s worked for the last almost eight hundred years.
Under the present system the Crown in Canada is represented by the Governor General and the Governor General decrees that an election should be called in order that the people of the country can select their representatives to represent them in the House and ensure good governance and order. After the election the leader of the party with the most seats or representatives elected to the House meets with Governor General and formulates for the Crown the party’s plans for governing. If it meets the Crown’s requirements and is accepted then the Throne Speech is read and a government is formed and all members of the House are empowered to govern with the Crown’s consent. All members swear allegiance to the Crown, as the Crown is a singular visible sign of authority. If for some reason the ruling party in the House of Commons looses confidence of the House then the Prime Minister must approach the Crown and state that the ruling party has lost the confidence of the House and he requests the Crown to call another election. At this point the Crown has a number of options, but basically it boils down to the Crown can order a cessation of Parliament for a short time, the Crown can request the Prime Minister to go back to the House and try again, it can request the Prime Ministers resignation or the Crown can request the Leader of the next party with the most number of representatives in the House to attend the Crown. At this meeting the Crown can request the Leader of the Opposition meet with the other members of the opposition and decide if they can form a government. If they can reach a consensus then the Leader of the opposition returns to the Crown and informs the Crown how the Opposition intends to govern. If it meets the Crown’s acceptance then the Crown will again read the Throne Speech and a new government is sworn in. Fairly straight forward, it’s been operating like this for hundreds of years now. It’s all a matter of protocols, conventions, traditions, formalities and the like. For a society to function it needs to operate under a system of laws. We have one of the best, if not the best system in the world. Now we are about to throw the very foundation of our system under the bus.
The present situation in Canada should be resolved very quickly by referring to the Statute of Westminster. The coalition that was precipitously formed last week prior to acquiring the Crown’s consent has conspired to overthrow and usurp a duly elected and appointed government. Someone within the ranks of the opposition should have warned them before they began this process. To act in this manner is in effect to dictate to the Crown, and by dictating to the Crown they are dictating to the Canadian people. We have never and hopefully will never elect a dictator in this country, however we may never get another chance, if we throw out eight hundred years of law in the next few weeks we may find ourselves in a morass that has no bottom. In order to step away from this poisoned chalice the coalition should withdraw from parliament and the signators of this coalition document should resign. They were never elected under the mantle of a coalition and they were never given the authority or the Crown’s consent to form a coalition. They have acted without authority and as such this is illegal. This better be resolved somehow and in the present situation we have already tossed aside the Justice of the Crown.
The Prime Minister has Put a Lock on the Door to Parliment, This is Not what Canadians Want!
jack layton
Well there you go Again Jack saying this is Not what Canadians want
No Jack Your Wrong, we had a Democratic Election Not 6weeks ago where Canadians Expressed their Democratic Rights of What they Want! And that is Leadership & Good Governence When we are about to go into a Period of time that Rivals the Dirty 30’s.
So If you dont Like Democracy Jack Pick Up Your Pail & Shovel & Go Home! Cause Canadians are sick & tired of you & your Rabble saying this is what Canadians Want & need.
ET: **Now that Layton has swallowed the Liberals, who can never shake free of being tainted in this way, will a break-away section of the Liberals emerge, to start up the New Liberal Party?**
The conservatives reframed themselves into today’s Conservatives why not the liberals. Certainly, now would be a good time to start such a movement.
Antenor…thanks for the lecture, but I don’t have the time to read your self-absorbed babbling. If anyone wants some real entertainment, go over to the CBC website and check out some of the comments there. The left is going ape-$hit. But it really is an interesting look into the mentality of some of these bozos.
Oh…..and I’ll bet Lizzie May is miffed today…that Senate seat was oh so close!
FYI the 0n-line petition: Our Right to Vote on the Coalition Government has just sailed by 1/4 million signatures, and increasing by the hundreds every few minutes.
link http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?CANADIAN&1
Everyone seems to feel that proroguing was choice #1, my feeling that Harpers choice was an election after a non-confidence vote, but he and the GG couldn’t agree so proroguing was a compromise.
Just my opinion, I know that we’ll probably never know.
Go Stepehen! we’re behind ya!
Ted is history.
I cannot believe that Dion just had the stupidity to come out & say when someone asked if it was about the budget or about taking Harper out – & Dion said straight out that it was about getting rid of Harper. To hell with the country – this was personal. They know they can’t beat him so a coup was their only way to take power, & since they still intend to do this they really don’t give a damn about our votes. But boy are they ever crying that that they were denied THEIR vote in the house!
naaahh . . she just made him sit through the entire slide show of the pictures from her recent euro trip
Dion, wait until Jack starts moving towards the center. What space do you think the Liberals can occupy then?
I suggest we start a collection for the broke LPC to buy them some tar and feathers. In his quest to “show them”, he has pushed the LPC off a cliff.
Jack played the Dunce like a fiddle, and the Dunce fell for it.
Please check out this CBC video on the King-Byng Affair. It begins in 1926 instead of 1925 and it claims that Byng refused to allow King to dissolve Parliament and call an election. Not true. King asked Byng to ignore the results of the recent election, which gave Meighen a minority government, and let him stay on as PM with the help of the Progressives. Please help by complaining to the CBC that a more accurate picture of the 1926 crisis must be forthcoming and until then, this deceitful and incompetent piece of journalism be taken off the air. It draws a false analogy between then and now.
NB: The piece was first aired on The Journal in 2004, so it couldn’t have been made to draw a false comparison at that time.
I am sure she will call an election if the Jan. budget is defeated. There is no way she can let the coalition govern. It is signed by the Libs and Dips – not enough seats. They would have never let the Bloc sign it – very bad optics. If the budget is good for all Canadians and it goes down to defeat then the Libs and Dips wear it.
I believe the PM played his hand well and threw this hardball at them to bring the co-conspirators out for all to see. He is just what we need as a leader. Those wolves are always at the door.
Has anyone seen any “real” polls on this? Nanos or whatever. This is at least as important as the election, where polls came out every few minutes.
The thing that pisses me off is the total biases in the media.
Harper is a bully, cant play with others, they openly question him saying that its his mistake.
BS, Harper passed more bills then most any previous prime-minister, he did so with a minority government.
This could not happen if he wasn’t playing well with other party’s. We all know this was planned before the election, and would of happed no mater what he said. I wish someone out there would say the truth.
Peter
First of all – thanks to the GG. She at least proved that she’s not a Liberal pawn.
Second, this ‘solution’ is the best for the vast majority of canadians (e.g. Conservative and Liberal supporters).
While certainly not positive for the Conservatives, it is the best of a bad situation. The only better solution was to have a small group of Liberals cross the floor, but clearly this was not going to happen this week.
It’s good for the Liberals, who now have a month to resuscitate their party, and re-establish it at their leadership convention. If they really want to run out the Conservatives without an election, they must do it AFTER a new leader is picked. Bob Rae is clearly a “coalition” leadership candidate, and Ignatieff could be a strong Liberal leader.
As for Dionne & Layton – they are clear losers, but whose interests do they really represent?
News Flash: British Columbia Labour Union officials are outraged that the GG made the decision she did.
Most telling isn’t it. The Radical Left can’t wait even a few hours to show their true colours – namely that they only believe in Canada’s Constitutional process … when it suits them.
Incidentally, is it also becoming clear to the rest of you that the unions are some of the most primary ones propping up this whole Coalition travesty? I’m hearing from some union members that they’re mighty peeved that their leaders are saying that all union members support Le Coalition.
Antenor. . . . Thanks. Your post was well written and I enjoyed reading it. Helped make the situation more clear.
The political situation in Canada is now crystal clear. You have Old Canada (Golden Triangle) represented by the left wing of the Libs, the NDP and the Marxist Bloc who are losing grip on power and it is getting nervous. Old Canada is not able to understand that while they are still in their little make believe bubble of socialist Nirvana, the illusion is breaking down around them and they don’t want to be woke up from their fantasy. The imperialist/colony model of Canada is fracturing and like many empires throughout history, Old Canada is blind to the reality. This Old Canada power grab has revealed the true intentions of the left all along. This entire drama was caused by the Marxists in Quebec, the hard socialists in the NDP and the left wing of the Liberals along with the union “leaders” across Canada (many of which are public sector unions) and supported (not that they matter much), by Lizzie May and her greens and by the Communist Party of Canada. This entire bit of theatre is really little more than a Bolshevik-like attempt takeover of Canada. That much is now revealed. The three stooges have been stripped naked for the Canadian public to see. And they don’t like it.
Hope I didn’t post this elsewhere too. I’ve been having a few computer problems on this site.
We won a battle I guess, but guys like the three stooges never stop coming. There is always three more stooges waiting to join the game.
I hope the Western Premiers are watching things closely and building a firewall wall around the West. A bad word? Don’t care anymore. I’ve just seen the face of Toronto and Montreal and I didn’t like it.
I also am thankful to God for our voices being heard by the GG.
Long live the Western Republic, I don’t see any other choice.
I’ve got a question for posters on this forum: can you name one political pundit of any repute who predicted the formation of a Bloc/NDP/Lib coalition to defeat Harper prior to this week?
All we’ve heard from the MSM over the past week is that Harper was stupid, arrogant, careless….blah blah blah, and that “he should have seen this coming”. I find it odd that I don’t recall any MSM pundits foretelling the emergence of a coalition either, even though that was always theoretically possible at any time since Harper took power. Can anyone else?
It seems to me that his move was not stupid, it just wasn’t clairvoyant. So I don’t think it’s fair to malign Harper for not seeing something that no one else did either.
Ryan 1:25– two prerogies and a lecture?, seems like meagre fare. glasnost 1:43– “Layton swallowed liberals” heard Laytom didn’t swallow.
The GG had to swear allegiance to Canada and to uphold the laws of Canada when she took the job.
There is absolutely no way she could/can have any dealings with a party like the Bloc that is dedeicated to breaking up the country.
Her job is to protect the federal govt in Canada, not to molly coddle Quebec separatists.
The foolish constitutional experts keep referring to the Bing/King GG precedent.
Both of the political parties involved then swore allegiance to the country.
Bing/King is irrelevant today because this one involves people dedicated to breaking up the country.
And the Bloc will never swear allegiance to Canada, because they put Quebec first, last and always.
Antenor… I read about 2/3s of your post and I think there is definitely going to be some constitutional problems going forward. The coalition really upset a delicate constitutional balance by forcing the Governor General to make such a call.
A prorogue was the best option for her. Now if the government falls in two months, she can just call an election because the government lasted a few months.
The bigger problem is how stable and unstable this minority government arrangement has been since 2004. While no government has been defeated on a budget, there have been 2 proroguings and 3 elections.
Canadians just need to elect a majority government because this love affair with minority governments is getting out of hand. Anyone who continues to support proportionate representation should seek mental help after this crisis.
The Liberal party lets out a large sigh of relief, that they no longer have to stand behind a coalition that Jack Layton convinced them to join. The most likely scenario is that while Dion was trying to decide to stay or go, Layton approached the Bloc with an idea of how to kill the Liberal party. Take the first opportunity to declare a coalition that the Liberals would join and form a government. The Liberals would lose all support in the west and Quebec and most of their support in Ontario. The new liberal leader would be handcuffed by the coalition partners who would defeat his government at the most convenient time for them not him.
Fortunately for the Liberals Harper discovers the plan early and decides that he will open the door for this coalition. Dion helps out with an amateur hour tape last night and the Liberals escape extinction
Dandy @ 2:27, I am also thinking that Jack pulled a fast one on the Dunce, and the real objective was goal was just as you stated, destroy the LPC. There is no downside for Jack in this play at all. Only upside.
I am surprised, nay, shocked, that the MSM pundits could not see this coming. Maybe they were too busy trying (and apparently failing) to train their puppies.
Antenor – that was a nice post. A few paragraphs would have helped; You wrote:
“The coalition that was precipitously formed last week prior to acquiring the Crown’s consent has conspired to overthrow and usurp a duly elected and appointed government. Someone within the ranks of the opposition should have warned them before they began this process. To act in this manner is in effect to dictate to the Crown, and by dictating to the Crown they are dictating to the Canadian people.”
Exactly right. The correct process was that IF the government of the day falls, then, the Crown has a number of options. The Crown must review the options. You write:
“At this point the Crown has a number of options, but basically it boils down to the Crown can order a cessation of Parliament for a short time, the Crown can request the Prime Minister to go back to the House and try again, it can request the Prime Ministers resignation or the Crown can request the Leader of the next party with the most number of representatives in the House to attend the Crown. At this meeting the Crown can request the Leader of the Opposition meet with the other members of the opposition and decide if they can form a government.”
As you point out, the Coalition did not wait for the Government to lose confidence and did not wait for the Crown to call the Liberal Party in and ask if they could form a government. The Coalition burst forth on its own, to declare its intention of so doing. As you say, they had moved into a position of dictatorship to the Crown and to the Canadian people.
Nice post; again, try a few paragraphs for easier reading.
Harper knew about their plans, and his ‘cuts to funding’ announcement was geared to bringing them out in the open to make their Hidden Agenda public. Now, we know – and can tell the Stooges what we think of them and their dictatorship.
yup, time to look at that flawed document cobbled together by that kommunist dressed as lieberal
if the powers that be won’t address this constitutional fault line than we the electorate (of all politial stripes) should demand it!!!
Best quote I’ve heard all week about this mess:
“This Coalition makes me feel like Luke Skywalker seeing the Death Star for the first time: ‘I have a very bad feeling about this.’ ”
Given the economic crisis only the insane would long for a stay in Parliamentary proceedings. The hyper partisanship on all sides will only serve the petty while damning the many. Harper’s desire to co-ordinate his return to Parliament with Obama’s inaugural proves two things:
1. – he is devoid of original ideas.
2. – he would prefer to subject us to unnecessary economic peril to save his own political skin. Our dollar will fall through the floor between now and January.
My PM = coward.