Business Owners are Thieves, Liberal edition.

56 Replies to “Business Owners are Thieves, Liberal edition.”

1. Wiping out the middle class with one idiotic tax policy after another.
   Small businesses aren’t mega-corporations with unlimited deep pockets; who can buy the tax policy they like, via suggestible politicians.
   More cheap shot, divide and conquer crap; fomenting the socialistic envy mantra, and slinging enough mud to excite the working stiff vote by tossing out the “fair share” canard.
   Tax integration has already leveled that playing field…but let’s all gloss over the important facts by ginning up tax hysteria.
   Cheers
   Hans Rupprecht, Commander in Chief
   1st Saint Nicolaas Army
   Army Group ‘True North’

2. It would perhaps be helpful to the doctor’s cause as well, if they were ALL to take holidays at the same time, December for example, when they’ve “earned enough” for the year.
   The entire month, is my suggestion.

3. The cynicism of the Liberal Party! Does anyone believe the “trans” kid at the tax town hall wasn’t a plant? I’m disgusted.

4. “… Finance Minister Sir Thomas White introduced a plan for Canada’s very first income tax in the House of Commons. It was three years into the First World War, and days after the adoption of compulsory military service. White had suggested that Parliament consider whether or not to keep the tax after the war. Since we’re all still paying, someone, somewhere in Ottawa must deem this anniversary worth celebrating.”
   http://business.financialpost.com/opinion/what-the-man-who-introduced-canadas-income-tax-100-years-ago-actually-intended
   Guess the party?

5. What it comes down there is whether or not it is in the best interests of society and the country to incentivize risk-taking.
   The left as usual believes that economic growth is a given – that tax and Regulatory policy has no impact. They have to because if they acknowledged the facts – that the laffer curve is a obvious fact (many still argue that trickle-down reaganomics didnt work) – the they would not be able to add more regulation and raise taxes to create the socialist utopia they envision.
   Sheer needs to do a good job of communicating the above…

6. Finally Trudeau has done something that might come back to bite him on the ass next election.
   Yeah,I know,Omar and the 10.5 million, forgotten now by most of the public, but this tax hits people where it hurts and it won’t go away like Omar,and a lot of those about to get the tax shaft are LIBERAL voters. Almost every doctor or lawyer I’ve ever met is a good Liberal.
   Okay, Andrew Scheer, you have a chance now to demonstrate that you’re not just Liberal-lite, attack this tax,promise to rescind it. Make it an issue and make damned sure no one forgets it. Get some of the young geniuses in the CPC offices to think up,(or do you prefer “conceptualize”,) a bumper sticker slogan on this to be repeated endlessly until it sinks into the thick skulls of every Canadian.
   In 2019,defeat this f***er,save Canada.
   Or is it SO comfortable up there at the top of the Exclusive Club you don’t mind another few terms in Opposition?

7. Trudeau is outright lieing . There is no way I know of by using a small Corp you can make 250k and access the money and pay less tax than someone making 50 k . Corp tax 10 to 15 % and dividends are taxe at 17 % . 27% of 250 k is less than the tax paid on a 50k salary ? “Sprinkle” it ? We have 5 x 50 k and it’s less than 1 50 k salary ? The corrupt broadcasting Corp supports his narrative by informing people on that on the 250 k only 10 to 15% would be paid . They say also some income would be treated as capital gains and would get even more favourable treatment . While a business sold gets capital gains treatment , in my experience capital gains earned inside the Corp are treated as the normal course of business.The narrative also totally ignores the fact that only 20% of these Corp have income in these ranges . It also also ignores the fact to produce that income most active businesses would likely produce over 50 k in gst alone . All this misinformation supported by a Corp that relies on 1.6 billion from taxpayers.

8. “When normals get in financial trouble, we cut back on spending, forgo the wants and re-evaluate the necessities.”
   Funny thing. When Premier Wall did exactly that for the good of the province, his popularity took a nosedive, the media vilified him as heartless and the public service unions spent millions on negative advertising. Contrast that to the NDP approach to dealing with hard financial times … increased taxation, more mindless borrowing and accelerated hiring of government employees.

9. http://business.financialpost.com/opinion/jack-mintz-mere-tweaks-wont-fix-the-liberals-draconian-tax-reform-plan
   The prime minister says that the rich will be asked to “pay a little more” to help the middle class, which shows that he has a sense of humour. Really, more than 70 per cent of families receiving dividends from small business CCPCs have household income below $200,000 (a majority of families have two-earners, so the practice of business owners income-splitting with a spouse is relatively minor). These are not Canada’s one-percenters.
   A lot of middle-class taxpayers will be hit by the new rules. And it won’t be just doctors, dentists, accountants, lawyers and other professionals. Those groups account for just 12 per cent of federal small-business tax revenues. There will be manufacturers (12 per cent of small-business revenue), high-tech innovators (10 per cent) and construction operators (12 per cent), among many others.
   Morneau’s new tax proposals are supposedly aimed at evening out the difference between corporate and personal taxes paid on income earned by private corporate income with other self-employed income, making the system “neutral.” In some ways they will, but in other ways they’ll actually make things less neutral. Under the new rules, public corporations and non-Canadian private corporations will be more favourably treated and certain other remaining disparities between business types will remain.
   The proposals also introduce a new form of distortion
   Under the existing system, the government gives preference to losses experienced in self-employed income — which can be deducted against other income — compared to corporate losses that are, in most cases, trapped in the company. In this way, the government helps itself to a healthy share of the corporation’s profits, but not its share of losses, penalizing risky investment more heavily for corporations than for the unincorporated. The proposals do little to improve the maltreatment of corporate risk.
   The proposals also introduce a new form of distortion. They plan to claw back the difference between corporate tax rates (15 or 17 per cent, depending on size) and personal tax rates (roughly 50 per cent) if corporate profits are invested in passive investments, rather than active business operations. I can think of no country that has introduced this form of distortion. Maybe one reason is because it can plainly lead to owners making marginally profitable investments simply to defer paying tax. It also effectively turns the small-business tax deduction into an investment and employment tax credit.
   If one really wanted to achieve neutrality between unincorporated and incorporated businesses, a different approach would be to treat the private corporation as a partnership (much like “S corporations” in the U.S.). Then, any income would flow out of the company, to the owners. That way, when governments want to provide incentives for business expansion, they can use tax credits for investment and employment tax credits available to all businesses, whether or not they’re incorporated. This would be a far better an approach than the monster of complexity the government is now promising to create.
   If one really wanted to achieve neutrality, a different approach would be to treat the private corporation as a partnership
   If you want a sense of how draconian these new proposals get, consider this: Under the new rules, passive income could now be taxed at an almost-confiscatory tax rate of over 70 per cent, as government claws back the benefits of the low corporate income tax rate on business income. The rules also result in heavier taxation on family succession compared to selling the company to unrelated domestic or foreign investors, resulting in a potential 90 percent “estate tax” on distributions of corporate shares to children.
   All of these huge upheavals to our existing small-business tax system are meant to happen largely in one fell swoop. It is unusual for Canada to attempt such an abrupt move, with so little by way of a gradual, transitional relief plan. Millions of Canadians have been basing their business decision on a system that has been in place for 45 years. Incredibly, their tax plans will apparently enjoy no amount of grandfathering. Given these excessive tax rates and poor transition rules, I already know of one high-income owner of a private corporation now arranging to leave Canada because of this. I’m sure there will be others.
   Cheers
   Hans Rupprecht, Commander in Chief
   1st Saint Nicolaas Army
   Army Group ‘True North’

10. The damage to PM Leisure suit Larry won’t be immediate it will be cumulative.
    His backbench Mps have been getting an earful from their constituents and he’s acting tone deaf. The net result is that those same MPs feel a tad resentment. This is a similar scenario to how the back bench felt under his father, under Chretien, and as well under Martin. All it will take for civil war to break out is someone in the liberal caucus with leadership ambitions for them to follow.
    Trudeau I had Turner, and of course the vitriol between Chretien and Martin was historic.
    The other notable feature of this is the divide in the liberal party usually runs between the blu-libs and the radical progressive side.
    Slightly related is who got passed over in the last cabinet shuffle.

11. It’s definitely the death knell for personal professional corporations. Without the income splitting/sprinkling, the advantage is wiped out for the vast majority of people. Hitting the cash retained in the corp just drives the stake through the heart.
    Small businesses will still obviously incorporate for liability reasons but the owners will be poorer and have less money while they are being asked to do more. It needs to be kept in mind that these changes are not in isolation. Between annual increases to property taxes and business fees, income taxes, carbon taxes, rent, etc., businesses are being squeezed by the tax man. And all this while the public sector continues to expand and flourish.
    It’s the goose that laid the golden egg fable brought to life.

12. The Potato tax grab has nothing to do with fairness. What a great way to fund uncontrolled frivolous spending. This edict probably came from our elitists and globalists and Trudeau has no idea of what he speaks. It’s much easier to control (or buy) the thoughts and actions of the Takers,Unions and large Corporations than individual Businesses. Someone needs to explain the meaning of the “Little Red Hen” fable to our leftward liberals.

13. All these people do is create every single new job. How does that compare with tax increases, I mean “investments” in the “middle class?”
    I wonder just how far we are from actual feudalism.
    I work with many of these terrible people who take all the risks, who hire employees when they can’t turn business away because they do a good job.
    Those who earn revenues of $250,000+ work their cans off, create a couple of jobs that Dustin hasn’t a clue about, and have $100,000 in expenses.
    Unlike government’s statist wards or their attendant apparatchiks, who are paid regardless of performance without the bother of considering cost.
    BTW, John and Jane Q Public, this is the first group of shareholders Justin will go after when his marginal tax revenues shrink to near zero or even go negative, should he get another term (maybe before 2019?). How are your mutual funds doing? Can’t wait for the cashless economy?
    Neither can the government for easy access to your bank account for a bail themselves out fiscal haircut of your dough, a la Greece.
    Productivity drops, inflation rises, interest rates rise, government debt rises ….
    All that’s missing in the progressive scheme of things is corruption and war. Ok just war – for now that is.

14. This story is one example of why Liberals benefit from a population very weak in basic mathematical skills, See last week’s story of Ont students woefully instructed in Ont schools. Liberals want it that way.
    Jr has zero experience or interest in Canada’s middle class which he is so prone to prattle on about. His wealth is inherited as was his father’s; maybe a stiff inheritance tax would expand the government coffers, don’t expect to hear much of that from ruling Liberals.

15. I feel for the people who didn’t vote Liberal but anyone that did deserves it real hard. Elections have consequences.

16. “People who make $50,000 a year should not pay higher taxes than people who make $250,000 a year.”
    That is a misleading statement because Trudeau is compared a salary to a corporate gross income (assuming no cost of sales).
    Let’s simplify that and compare an employee who earns $250,000 to a self employed consultant who earns $250,000 and operates as a corporation.
    First of all, the employee has no cost of sales. As a consultant my cost of sales averaged about $60,000 per year including software licensing, accounting, sales and marketing, traveling, banking and insurance costs, which employees don’t pay (or are reimbursed).
    Second, employees get paid holidays. If I don’t show up for 6 weeks I make 6 weeks less gross income.
    Third, their source deductions are paid in part by their employer whereas I pay ALL (employer + employee) my source deductions.
    Fourth, employees have benefits such as medical and dental plans. I pay my own.
    Fifth, employees have corporate savings plans and pension plans. I save my own.
    Finally, an employees only real risk is in being laid off whereas I have to generate my own income (which in some years has been close to zero).
    Employee $250,000 pays less than $100,000 in tax (due to progressive tax rate. only top tax bracket is 50%) = $150,000 take home.
    Self employed ($250,000 – $60,000 (cost of sales) = $190,000 net income – 17% corporate tax = $157,700 – 27% effective tax rate = $115,121.
    Without “loopholes” a self-employed person would pay more tax and receive less benefits than an employed person.

17. The only thing that this planned tax change along with the upcoming carbon tax will do is force separation from Canada. That this idiot is that out of touch is truly astounding. I know the man was dim but this is beyond retarded(can I still say that?) Morneau, is really no better. I guess birds of a feather. In Saskatchewan we need Alberta and Yukon only to separate. We can then pipeline to Valdez were they have ample loading facilities that are underutilized for oil. The nice thing is, that we can give the middle finger to Trudeau and B.C. simultaneously!

18. My preference would be for a zero corporate tax rate, a single individual tax exemption of say $10,000 and a 15% flat tax for all other income. Hundreds of thousands of private sector and public sector bean counters and shysters would then have to find productive employment, likely in the managerial accounting field as we would experience significant real(private sector) economic expansion. That’s not the direction we are going however, as the Spawn’s team only knows one direction and that is growth of leviathan along with increased transaction costs of everything along with global lemming-like de-industrialization.

19. Doctor’s work is not 9-to-5 and this is why they need support of a partner working half-time or not working. This particularly apply to female doctors with children. This is how the business of providing medical services runs. The moron in Ottawa thinks that being feminist is about bi-sexuality..or something.

20. Someone in Britain said tax changes should be made with a scalpel not a chainsaw.
    That certainly applies to PM Bozo and his trust fund sidekick Bill the Lumberjack Moroneau

21. Another Trudeau in the house and the Conservatives once again select a waffling weak chinned Red Conservative. Canada is doomed.

22. What I find delicious in all this is Trudeau is killing his own donors. Those bad people, the doctors, lawyers, retail store owners etc. with the $250k+ incomes? They’re the ones donating at all the $1,000 a plate “meet the candidate” dinners. They did not support Trudeau to get all their worldly possessions confiscated by the tax man.
    They’re going to politically slaughter him, if he does this. I wouldn’t rule out a leadership non-confidence vote in the Liberal caucus.

23. “In Saskatchewan we need Alberta and Yukon only to separate”. So, where’s the capital going to be?

24. I misinterpreted the “related” picture … I thought that Bull was in the process of fecal elimination … I hardly noticed the fence.
    If it hasn’t yet been mentioned, I have to remind everyone WHY government will ALWAYS HATE small business and embrace BIG corporations … the frequency and predictability of tax payments. Big corporations are effectively … government partners … in collecting taxes. Big corporations TAKE tax withholdings from each of their employees and faithfully (and predictably) remit the TAXES every quarter. Small business tends to be much more unpredictable with some strong quarters, and some weak ones. And all the legitimate business expenses really annoy the hell out of the liberal money grabbers. Big government would LOVE each and every citizen to work BIG soul-sucking corporations … who PAY ALL their employees quarterly taxes … consistently … without fail.

25. Steve said: “Without “loopholes” a self-employed person would pay more tax and receive less benefits than an employed person.”
    That’s okay. There won’t be any employed people, so it will all be super fair. Right? Right!

26. These businesses also shouldn’t pay more taxes than Warren Buffet’s secretary.

27. One has to agree that everybody should pay even taxes.
    Huh?
    Yes, the taxes should be lowered for those that are paying more than their fair share.
    There should be severe cuts in spending.
    Is there an independent study on the waste the politicians of all stripes are supporting to keep in the dough?
    There are healthy young people that need to stop smoking the casitas and get up and go to work.
    Who for?
    McDonalds is hiring, may not be the most glamorous job though it is a job. Gets you in the getting up and going to work routine.
    While doing the flipping you can think of what the hell to do with your miserable existence.
    The possibilities are endless.
    You can even hit it rich.

28. Agreed,the morons would rather have the kids of small business owners in daytime residential
    schools (daycare).

29. For me, Trudeau’s inference that small business owners are simply rich people using loopholes to avoid paying their ‘fair share’ is equally offensive as Obama’s “you didn’t build that!” comment. Two leftist imbeciles that have never been responsible for a payroll, risked their own capital or created anything worthwhile in their lives.

30. For me, Trudeau’s inference that small business owners are simply rich people using loopholes to avoid paying their ‘fair share’ is equally offensive as Obama’s “you didn’t build that!” comment. Two leftist imbeciles that have never been responsible for a payroll, risked their own capital or created anything worthwhile in their lives.

31. Andrew Scheer is the candidate the CBC wanted in charge of the not even conservative anymore party of Canada.
    As others have mentioned, I have never in my lifetime seen any government (civic, provincial, federal) shrink no matter who was in charge. Not even Mike Harris.

32. Is there a problem with taxes being too low? No, there is only one problem a Liberal spending problem.
    2015 Liberal Election Promise – Budget Surplus / (Debt)
    2016 – 2017 (9.9) billion
    2017 – 2018 (9.5) billion
    2018 – 2019 (5.7) billion
    2019 – 2020 +1.0 billion
    Total (24.1) billion
    2016 Liberal Actual / Forecast – Budget Surplus / (Debt)
    2016 – 2017 (23.0) billion actual
    2017 – 2018 (28.5) billion forecast
    2018 – 2019 (27.4) billion forecast
    2019 – 2020 (23.4) billion forecast
    Total (102.3) billion
    2020 – 2021 (14.3) billion forecast

33. If you price Canada’s GDP in USD it is lower today ($1.53 T USD) than it was in 2008 ($1.55 T USD).
    A $25 billion deficit represents over 8% of government revenue.
    Almost 50% of tax collected by the federal government is for personal income.
    Canada spends about 9% of its revenue on interest payments.

34. turdeux isn’t *ignoring* the discrepancy, he’s ‘just'[in] a complete ignoramous idiot doofus about much of the verbal puke he specializes in.

35. One would only assume that Warren Buffet’s Secretary was smart-enough to INVEST a fraction of her paycheck (a tax deduction) and have her gains taxed at the same rate as her employers investments. But then, I am a LOGICAL, intelligent, observer of media manipulation when creating straw-woman arguments for investment crushing capital gains tax increases. I would further expect that Mr. Buffet would offer stock options as part of his employment agreement. I would like to know exactly how much $$$ Mr. Buffet’s (lowly) Secretary has invested in the stock market … being taxed at the “low-low” rate of 15% ? I would like to know how large a fraction of her net worth is being taxed at 15%? BTW … if her annual salary is taxed at an effective rate MORE than 11% … then she is paid wayyyyy too much … to be so stupid.

36. What I particulalry don’t like about this LIberal campaign is the pure nastiness invoked by the liberals who are well cushioned from any adverse effects of this campaign against the Canadian Kulaks.

37. In my experience the number of taxpayers who split income with children is none. Quite a few give jobs to children but they do work. Most of the corporations I see are just working stiffs struggling to make a living like anyone else. That’s the part that Shiny Pony doesn’t understand. Income splitting with wives is common but in many situations, the wife is the brains of the operation and the husband is the brawn. Trudeau’s tax thieves will likely make the determination that they used to make that women are too stupid to make an economic contribution to business.

38. All political events are rigged. WHen hostile events happen at a political event, someone screwed up.

39. I’m not supporter of the Liberals but they are right on this issue. It’s not about punishing people who are successful, it’s about tax fairness. Why should a doctor earning $300,000/yr who is incorporated pay less tax and be able to shelter their income while a doctor earning the same amount who is not incorporated has to pay the higher personal rate? How is that fair? A dollar is a dollar is a dollar. Andrew Coyne has written extensively on this issue. There are many reasons to incorporate but tax reasons should not be one of them. It has been abused by some high income earners and they are right to put a stop to it. Most of the people incorporated now will not be affected by these changes anyway.

40. hey russy, do you own a small business? Do you understand “taxing”, or are you a lieberal shill?

41. A question for you Ruse .Do you actually believe they are ” consulting ” too ?

42. My advice to Dr. ‘B’ … is … to incorporate. If you choose NOT to play according to the rules … you cannot possibly expect to win. You will be severely punished for your stupidity. A Dr. should know better.

43. Hi Russ.
    You are asking the wrong question. A doctor who earns $300,000 will incorporate to pay less tax or he/she is an idiot.
    The question you should be asking is why should a doctor who incorporates and earns $300,000 per year pay the same amount of tax as a senior manager at a bank who also earns $300,000?
    The senior manager has job security, a savings plan (not taxed because it goes into his/her RRSP), a pension plan (not taxed), holidays, medical and dental benefits and mostly importantly NO DIRECT EXPENSES. Everything is paid by his/her employer.
    Go start your own business. Buy supplies, insurance, business banking, etc. and then go have a chat with someone who earns as much as you do, but is employed by someone else. You might learn something.

44. Paying fair share seems to be the mantra.
    What is fair share? A certain percentage?
    I believe what is meant by fair share is that everyone pays enough taxes so that everyone’s take home pay is the same.
    I believe that the government just wants everyone to generate numbers. That’s what we work for…numbers…ain’t cash till you go to the ATM.

45. “I believe what is meant by fair share is that everyone pays enough taxes so that everyone’s take home pay is the same.”
    Why should a medical specialist who studied for 9 years have the same take home pay as a high school dropout?
    If “fair share” were really implemented, everyone would be high school drop outs and not bother to acquire or develop skills.
    It’s clear that Zoolander’s government’s idea of “fair” ain’t fair. It’s just social justice style economic suicide.

46. “fair share” means I need more tax $$$$$ to piss away in foreign countries, to buy me a UN seat

47. Bill Morneau has stated that a professional earning $300,000/yr with a wife and two adult children can save $48,000/yr in taxes by using just one of these loopholes. This means that an incorporated professional can pay an effective tax rate less than nurse or a police officer. See Globe and Mail column by Mr. Morneau. And the lifetime capital gains exemption will still be $1M for farmers so they can leave the family farm to their children. He is trying to be fair to ALL taxpayers regardless of your professional status or income. That is the way our tax system should be. The individual making $50,000/yr struggling to feed a family and put a roof over their heads is subsidizing this by paying higher taxes than they should be. Totally wrong.

48. Anyone who can’t live well on $50k a year should become a doctor and earn $300k.

49. “The individual making $50,000/yr struggling to feed a family and put a roof over their heads is subsidizing this by paying higher taxes than they should be.”
    Every tax payer is paying higher taxes than they should be. The government has a spending problem, not a revenue problem.

50. All taxation is theft. The tax system is convoluted because of rent seeking, social engineering, and as various comments have affirmed, envy-resentment politics. Generally, if you want more of something you tax it at a lower rate and conversely if you want less of something you tax it at a higher rate. If, as a politician you are an appendage of big business, big green, big labour and or the bureaucracy, you want fewer entrepreneurs and independent businesses which brings us to the Spawn’s team. An employee making a 6 figure salary or from wages is a tax slave, paying more than 50% on everything earned above taxable earnings of roughly $72,000.00. The left are slave holders and those that support them politically are either on the public payroll or voluntary slaves (including those of the mindless middle that vote for nice hair). The left loves to share their misery and strive to maximize the slavery of all others under the banner of “fairness”.