“Well, mommy, I learned that Stephen Harper is a…”
Two of Canada’s largest unions paid to bus hundreds of school kids to Parliament Hill on Tuesday to rally against what they call government inaction on First Nations education.
Officials with the Public Service Alliance of Canada and Canadian Union of Public Employees denied the elementary school students were enlisted as props in the unions’ ongoing public battle against Prime Minister Stephen Harper’s government.
Lisa Howell, a teacher at Pierre Elliot Trudeau School, deadpanned –
“I don’t feel like we’re advancing an agenda.”
Of course not. Don Moran, a senior officer with CUPE:
“We sponsored the bus to bring them…CUPE and PSAC. We kind of had a joint venture to bring them down so that all the voices could be heard here…I think (the kids) are speaking from their hearts. I don’t think there’s any brainwashing.”
h/t ET
Black Mamba writes, “People need to stop lying to themselves about this stuff. Idiots and fools go into teaching – easily led twits who aren’t fit to educate and care for hamsters. There are some good teachers. Not very many.” As an educator, I agree that there’s a lot of truth in that statement.
However, there really are more than a few very good teachers: they steer clear of the politics, and, keeping their heads down and teaching what the kids really need, they do the best they can. Think of the unions as the government: most teachers have as little to do with the union as possible. Considering the teaching culture—teachers are extremely busy doing their jobs in classrooms with lots of kids—and the political correctness that now reigns (it didn’t used to)—teachers mainly shut up with each other about political issues—it’s true that intelligent, independent-thinking people are unlikely to choose teaching as a career. (And the really good teachers who go into administration—most avoid that route—are co-opted by their gigantic salaries and the fact that they’ll be—figuratively—beaten over the head if they actually try to address real issues: that, of course, would mean telling the truth about all kinds of politically correct fictions. We can’t have that, can we?)
The system is so dishonest, corrupt, and thuggish, from top to bottom—a gulag full of PC ministry, union, and board bullies—and teachers are so isolated (we spend our days in classrooms surrounded by—often, bully—kids), that putting up resistance is virtually impossible and not at all productive. (Nothing will change, except that the teacher will be targeted, punished, and battered and bruised.) As I’ve said, the best teachers—who get out as soon as they can, or must—keep their heads down and do their job, often very well. Putting one’s head above the rampart just means being slapped down and humiliated—and not being able to actually TEACH as effectively as one wishes to. So, the best teachers, under the radar, make their choices very mindfully.
I do think the time might well come when only the drudges and political activists, who don’t give a hoot about real education, but like the perqs of teaching (great salary, benefits, holidays), will be able to stand the repressive culture that teaching has become.
As teaching is controlled by politicians, it’s up to those who say they’re conservative or libertarian to make a move. I guess we’ll be waiting a long time for that to happen.
There is a flaw in your thinking Victim Toes. NO ONE is forced to live on a reserve. ANY ONE at any time can leave the reserve. Some of my family members did exactly that. They decided that reserve life was not healthy for them or their children and moved into Edmonton. They had a struggle adapting but they persevered, found gainful employment and have integrated fully into the society at large. As one of my family who so moved said of the turmoil on the Attawapiskat reserve, “Don’t whine to me about your headache when you won’t stop hitting yourself in the head with a hammer”.
Meanwhile, in Winnipeg, A principal was forcible removed by the government from his position at a Catholic School for encouraging students to participate in a prayer vigil for the unborn.
Victim, when I read ET’s lucid and well-reasoned posts, and then I read your vague and emotional ones, it’s pretty clear who knows what they’re talking about.
You have been co-opted by the victim industry (hence your choice of name?) and worse, you allowed your child to be used by groups who have zero interest in the well-being of your child and are quite willing to exploit him/her to make a political point.
I’m actually having difficulty believing that you really are a parent.
gosh, victim toews – what’s your proof that your child knows more than me about the reserve system? Oh, and that I’ve never been to any reserves? Please provide explicit proof.
As for the Minister outlining the realities of the situation – that takes more than a brief five minute assertion. Oh- and why wasn’t this already explained in the school, by the teachers, such that the students would know that the govt couldn’t instantly solve all the problems? Therefore, what was the point in the children demonstrating to the govt is such is the case?
If you say that the kids would have understood this, then, why wasn’t this already done by the school? And the UNIONS?
And – you are ignoring the causes of these problems – the Indian Act, the refusal to allow private property and economic devt on the reserve, etc – Why don’t you talk about that?
Who is saying anything about Chinese etc? Anyone in such a situation would turn out the same? Is anyone here saying that it’s genetic????
And – why did you, if you admit that the govt can’t solve it all – why did you allow your child to be used by a Union in such a reprehensible manner?
Thanks, Joe. ‘Seems you know more about the situation on Attawapiskat and other reserves than Victim Toews, who views it through the filter of his/her bleeding heart — and assumes that his/her daughter (how old, I wonder?) “understood what she was doing …” I wonder just what she understood in a situation fraught with ambiguities.
The whole damned system is broken beyond repair and I hope to God that someone in the government and in the Native community has the guts to name the problems and begin to fix them. Reserves ghettoize Natives and keep them dependent on government handouts — which nine times out of ten, when it comes to essential services like housing, education, and health, aren’t efficiently or adequately delivered anyway.
Corruption is rife in the reserve system and needs to stop. Native chiefs need to be held responsible and accountable for the government funds their bands receive. Only when Natives name their problems, own them, and resolve to make the necessary changes and corrections themselves will anything change for the better.
CUPE and PSAC demonstrations using young students as fodder to their cannons are not the answer — and parents and teachers who allow their children/students to be used as political pawns should be ashamed of themselves. Let the adults demonstrate but leave the children out of it.
Victim—great name for a person like you—as someone’s pointed out, the Liberals have been in power for most of the past 100 years. So, why not expect the Liberal Indian Affairs shadow cabinet member to address the kids about the problems on the reserves? IMO, good for the Minister for ignoring this extortionist and altogether political charade.
Tribalism/undemocratic structures have altogether undermined the MASSIVE support and privileges aboriginals on reserves have been given for well over a CENTURY: so let’s not indulge in the racism of low expectations. And, contrary to your assertion, I’d imagine that, from documentation of the more mature and responsible behaviour of such groups, Chinese, American, and English communities would very likely have made wise use of the massive (unaccountable) $ hundreds of millions pumped into the reserves for far too long.
At what point does one expect the aboriginals to use more productively the massive resources provided to them by hard working Canadians, and to stop blaming (extravagantly generous) others for their problems? I think it’s called growing up: it’s about time our on-reserve aboriginals decided to do so. And, if they won’t, it’s about time they stopped blaming the RoC.
P.S. I’d imagine that Victim’s kid goes to an alternative school. There are no more PC, intolerant, arrogant, non-diverse, indoctrination kiddie mills in the system than the alternative schools. These schools are progressive factories that indoctrinate children. These schools are all about a Marxist, secular, anti-Christian, alternate sexuality, Gaia worshipping agenda. The kids are taught to be superior to and disdain those who don’t agree with them. In decades of teaching, I’ve never encountered such a group of spoiled, rude, arrogant, self-satisfied bigots—and their teachers encourage them to behave that way. Like the reserves, the alternate schools—all left-wing, all dogmatic, all the time—are altogether a travesty.
It isn’t the federal govt that encourages this perpetual adolescence; it’s the Indian Act. And the native chiefs/councils do NOT want this Act changed, do NOT want this lifestyle to disappear.
Correct, ET (and welcome back!) but INCOMPLETE.
Neither the native chiefs/councils NOR the government and its attendant bureaucracy want this act changed. This is dependency writ large; an idealized version of the non-native dependency which is the objective of all governments liberal and conservative.
That is the BUSINESS of government. The manufacture of dependency. Dependency = Power the only thing any government seeks, notwithstanding the platform platitudes. And that includes the estimable Stephen Harper.
Me No Dhimmi, don’t forget to add NGOs.
Let me apply Daniel Hannan’s wonderful phrase to your post, Me No Dhimmi:
What we need, and are unlikely to get, is ” … small government, big citizen …”
Snippet: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaesaJMxJ1g
Full speech: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BujuEpGmKMg
lookout 2:32 PMP.S. (I’d imagine that Victim’s kid goes to an alternative school.)
You have a fair chance of being correct (that is if Victim is truly a parent of one of the kids involved).
From the article: “The children, from Ottawa’s Lady Evelyn alternative school, Gatineau’s Pierre Elliot Trudeau School and Kitigan Zibi First Nation, brought signs and sang songs about First Nations education.”
From the Lady Evelyn website: “We hope we are preparing our students to be ethical, caring, productive citizens and life-long, reflective learners who will make a positive difference in their own communities and in the world.”
Whenever a school’s mission includes the words “we hope” as a substitute for describing intended outcomes, and when the outcomes themselves are couched in grandiose but unspecific terms, I know what sort of school you’re dealing with.
The other two schools are, more or less, what you would expect.
I have a theory that Victim is more of a apologist or an organizer of this little junket rather than a parent.
rita: “I have a theory that Victim is more of a apologist or an organizer of this little junket rather than a parent.”
Me too (@ 1:53 PM).
Let’s see, didn’t the Government already try Native education? I think it was called RESIDENTIAL SCHOOLS!
It was a sincere effort by sincere people to educate Natives, unfortunately it included a policy of identity-destroying assimilation (versus integration), and some of the agencies contracted to do the work had high instances of abuse.
But the most important lesson why Residential Schools didn’t work is because Native children were removed from their families far away from the reserves. There wasn’t the infrastructure in these remote Native communities back then and it remains the same today.
So how do the Unions propose to get around that? You can’t go back to residential schools. So the problem is the same: either Natives move to the larger urban centres where they can get a good education, or they accept the fact that if they want to live in remote reserves and a more traditional simple lifestyle closer to the land then you simply can’t expect to have the same education opportunities.
But you can’t have both, and any sensible person who has lived in “the bush” knows that you can’t have both, Native or White, or otherwise. So what are the Unions suggesting? That we turn all of these remote reserves into booming urban centres? I don’t think many of the Natives who live there would agree to that, apart from the fact that it would impossible cost-wise.
In the end Natives have to decide how they want to live and how far they want to develop, and if they want it bad enough they have to “put the shoulder to the plough” and develop it themselves. All the Government should do is provide the tools and access to resources.
So do the Unions have an alternative plan apart from making political hay in the name of their god Marx and class warfare tyranny imposed on Canada’s aboriginal people? ‘Cause that’s about all these Unions are good for anymore — education isn’t their strong point, recruiting ignorant followers who never question their motives is.
Victim Toews >
“I can honestly say you could put 100 Chinese, English or American people in a hole like Attawapiskat with no decent school, no jobs……….”
Is there any reason that they can’t move to Toronto and get some education and jobs?
If I’m not mistaken, no one is holding them there by gun point, unlike millions of other so called immigrants or refugee’s around the world that come from actual totalitarian “holes” and make a life for themselves in Canadian society.
There is a huge difference between a nation’s society and its physical land mass. As I understand it many of the First Nations want to live outside of the Canadian Nation. I have no obligation to support their nation any more than I expect them to support mine.
Why are you trying to force me and my fellow Canadians to support theirs more than we have already done, including the long standing offer to integrate with ours?
” my kid knows exactly what’s going on regarding Attawapiskat. ”
Wow,That is one very astute 12 year old.
It’s more likely that the child knows exactly what she has been taught. That is rote,not understanding. Garbage in,garbage out.
I’ve never been to a northern Ontario reserve,but I have spent some time on a southern Alberta reserve. My aunt did teach on a reserve outside of Kenora back in the seventies.We had a discussion about the issue of reserve schools.
We both agreed that the main problem in the schools was that there was little to no parental support for the concept of structured education. School was not a priority for many parents and this was passed on to the children. There was open disdain for the white man’s ways. Those parents that believed in education as a way out from the problems of the reserve would place their kids in off-reserve schools,or move completely off the reserve. This invariably leads to classrooms composed primarily of disinterested children with no direction from home. Absenteeism was not a problem for the parents.
The kids,in many cases,do not have a stable home life. They are treated like currency in some families because of the added benefits that having them in your care bring from the gov’t.
I hope that Atleo who ran on a platform of education may start the change,but it is a huge undertaking,perhaps impossible under the current structure. This is a generational problem that is influenced by the whole system of institutionalized dependency,mistrust and racism.
Victim Toews >
Will you support a movement to preserve dying European Caucasian heritage though the formation of a new nation existing within, but separate from Canada?
It will be completely void of all other races except those of Celtic, Nordic, Germanic and Slavic ancestry, customs, and traditions, be given a separate land reserve of prime real estate along with billions of dollars in financial support by the remainder of Canada.
This thread would benefit from someone who has been on the inside of reserve,…Louise?
Should have said ” on the inside of reserve schooling “.
Knight 99 – no wops, huh?
Black Mamba >
“no wops, huh?”
Well it was a rhetorical question.
In reality both wops and nips would be included, providing they stick to tile work, pizza and sushi restaurants. Bean’ers and other Taco’s would need to take the domestic jobs the rest of us don’t want, while the kike’s would need to run our jewellery stores and banks.
After all we are all just Kaffers and Dhimmi’s to the camel jockeys, so they of course wouldn’t be included.
Oh my god, I just described Calgary.
Another no mind useless protest by Unions and Teachers. If I didn’t read it here I wouldn’t have heard of it.
Useless jerks.
Victim Toews – if I ever have a child in any school, public or private, but especialy public, which “Lady Evelyn” seems to be, and her teachers spent weeks indocrinating (rather than, you know, what was that thing, oh, um, teaching) her, and then dragged her and her class off to what amounts to a blantantly partisan political demo, I would be outraged. I would be outraged even if I agreed completely with the political agenda in question. It is an abuse of the (State funded) educational process, such as it is, and it is entirely inappropriate (that word the left loves so much to apply to the slightest deviation from their orthodoxy). Totalitarians brainwash children in political agitation. Civilized societies, and civilized individuals, do not.
Oh Victim Toews you must be describing my next door neighbour. He and his wife and kid moved off a reserve a few years back. He recently finished his degree and has been offered a job with a local firm. I wish him well. He and his wife are doing a great job raising their son. They enrolled the son in the local French Immersion school and the young lad is top of his class.
I was talking to an old school chum who went into social work and now works for the provincial government. His job is helping natives on a reserve in Western Alberta. He doesn’t have too many kind words to say about the reserve system and the social problems resulting. He would love to be put out of work by shutting down the reserve so the people can actually get on with their lives and not live up to some federal bureaucrats ideal of what ‘native’ is. Oh did I mention my old buddy is native? His family left a different reserve before he was born and he seemed to do as well as the rest of us.
Victim Toews >
“yea, blame the chiefs, blame the parents, blame the Indian Act. And do nothing to help the kids.”
Yea, let’s do something new and blame us instead!
There’s nothing like throwing someone else’s money at the problem though is there “victim”?
Maybe if you pay attention to what the Harper government is saying and has been doing a little more carefully, you may not be so critical of the fact that years of dumping money into the problem is no longer the solution.
Is it the First Nation People, OR the People of Canada we are talking about here?
Ya’ll better make a decision at some point in the near future. At the rate Canada is becoming ethnically diverse in our wonderful “cultural mosaic”, there is not going to be allot of room for white man’s archaic treaties and Indian Acts by the millions of new Canadians setting up micro countries within Canada’s borders.
Have you been paying any attention at all as too how the rest of the planet treats their indigenous populations? Take a big fat guess at what’s coming here in the future.
VT,maybe go back and read my comment,or better yet have your child read it to you.
The people here do care about the kids,and they do lay blame. ” blame the chiefs, blame the parents, blame the Indian Act. The lousy schools,lousy food and clothes,drunken parents,corrupt chiefs,etc.,are a result of the ongoing policies that perpetuate the problems. Change will not happen unless there is change. Blaming this gov’t or the last ones is not change,it has been tried,it doesn’t work.
If your child was messed up,would you want more of the same and a few more dollars,or would you be looking at the root of the problem,which can be found in a mirror?
Vic, at the risk of lowering the tone of this fine discussion, this is for you. A tad unwholesome, no?
Knight 99 – can Adam Carolla still have a radio show?
Black Mamba,if you have a few minutes,check out the Alex Harvey version of that song. One of my favourites.
Black Mamba >
He he, don’t know.
What I do know, is that Liberalism and political correctness have put us in allot of mess on many different levels. The current First Nations mess notwithstanding.
The First Nations needs to either piss or get off the pot. This hypocritical Liberal Progressive agenda will not save them from the globalized socialist utopia they themselves have been creating. One way or another the First Nations are going to be swallowed up in the future, and they will either sink or swim.
My vote for survival if I lived on a reserve, and I do personally know many who have, is to get off the un-producing liberal plantation and join the greater Canadian society like so many other unfortunate and downtrodden have in the past.
Knight – well, I like doing my own tiling. I’m surprisingly fond of it, actually.
In all seriousness, this isn’t a discussusion about Attawapisket and other native issues, as compelling and nighmarish as those are. It is or should be a discussion about this sick, ruined “school” system of ours. Make no mistake (as Obama would say), the rot starts here, with the corruption of the little children. Gradeschool is first goosestep of the Long March through the Institutions. Not that I’m not at all religious, but something about a millstone, and the ocean…
Black Mamba >
“In all seriousness, this isn’t a discussusion about Attawapisket”
I agree entirely.
Although there is an interconnection with the failed “school systems” the unions, and the Liberal Progressive agenda and their shameless propagandizing of Attawapisket to continue the corruption of our once functioning institutions.
In fact it’s their policies that have created the climate to use the failures of First Nations to further this demented line of political and social control in the first place.
Do you have local school board elections in Canada? Do people vote? Or is it like Texas, where people complain on the ‘net but never vote?
— Mack in Kirbyville
Posted by: Black Mamba, pulling a Godwin at February 19, 2012 6:20 PM
Hey, Mamba, how did you ever get an pre-release of one of obama’s upcoming election ads?
mhb23re
(going for 2-point Godwin conversion)
Mack in Kirbyville, Texas – forgive me if I’m wrong, but I enviously view Texas as something of a libertarian paradise. Am I wrong?
As far as I know Americans generally get to vote for everything from dogcatcher to Judge to Prosecutor to State Congress/Senate-critter to President. Perhaps you don’t undestand how restricted we are, under a parliamentary system. We vote once, and when we vote for our Member of Parliament (MP) (that means Congresscritter), we simultneously vote for our Head of Government. Our Head of State is the Qreen.
I have no child in the system, but I believe the local schoolboards are elected (at least here in Halifax).
Very interesting exchange, but I expect that you are all flogging a dead horse. The brainwashing is complete in this case.
Joe, a native couple, friends of one of my daughters and her husband, left a reserve in Alberta a number of years ago and the husband has a thriving tile business in Saskatoon. He wants nothing to do with the corrupt reserve system nor its accompanying federal system.
Hiding my name here, because I have taught on a reserve for ten years. Biggest issue? Attendance. By grade 9 the average FN student has missed 2 years of school.
We use the provincial curriculum, have tons of technology, but due to low numbers and no union, staff are paid about 30k a year less than provincial.
The res I’m on does have privately owned businesses and many kids who want out. The problem for them is that they get such a poor start pre-school, that they’re behind as soon as they hit K5. Low attendance rates means they stay behind. Add in a ridiculously high teen pregnancy rate and the cycle continues.
I’m not the least bit sure how this is Harper’s fault, or how more money makes any of this go away.
@ XXXXXXX
Indian Affairs was set in stone when Harper was a child and as a social experiment has been a disaster since conception. It has been very good for the vast bureaucracy it has created and the thousands of civil servants and social workers who have built their life around it, not to mention the hundreds of victim lawyers who have fleeced the pulic purse for decades. At 10 billion dollars a year it feeds a machine that has little to do with making students smarter or bringing a people into the 21st century. The whole idea that they want to be natives but want every amenity the white man has to offer, without working for anything will hit the wall sooner or later. They don’t want to move forward and can’t move back. The solution would be to stop treating them like children, make it clear that that was then and this is now. Give them whatever reservation land they are on, to do with as they please, with individual title like all other Canadians. Free education for 5 more years. Welfare status unchanged for another 5 years and then a 10% cutback yearly until zero. In other words, get a life, get a job and get out of our wallets. Job training and relocation help where required. All land claims over. Welcome to the grown ups world and now it’s up to you. Disband Indian affairs and tell them to get a life, get a job and get out of our wallets. Any politician that apologizes for the past should be fired.
Sooner or later it will come to this anyway. Sooner the better.
Victim – you have no idea what you are talking about with regard to natives and the govt and economy.
And, you allowed your child to be used in a political demonstration – that’s reprehensible.
Again, the problem is: the Indian Act – and no, most native chiefs do NOT want it removed; that’s a major roadblock – the chiefs want that Act to remain. It keeps them and their families in power, political and economic power.
Within Ottawa, the bureaucracy around the Indian Act is one of the largest – and a bureaucracy becomes an incestuous job-for-life system that sets up its own huge roadblocks to change and even, dissolution.
But, it’s a disaster – and the Reserve System is itself a disaster. Can you imagine – isolating a population, removing them from participation in the ongoing economy of the nation around them, confining them to a non-industrial economy and yet, unable to live within a now untenable hunting and gathering economy. Yet – not allowing an industrial infrastructure to be developed on a reserve.
You can’t own private property on the reserve, start a private business, get a private mortgage to start a business – because it’s govt land, and is communally held by the reserve. You are kept by the govt as dependents – because, theoretically, by living on the reserve, you have chosen a non-industrial economy. No roads, no possibility of developing industry. No farming is possible on the northern reserves.
Have you read the posts by people who know what reserves are like? No education? Whose fault is that – the natives who reject education, the teachers who try, the govt? No skills? Same questions – whose fault is that?
Again, the Reserve system is a major faultline for natives – but, the chiefs won’t let it go; it’s a great source of income for them and their families. But you can’t set up an industrial economy on a reserve – yet, the people there want to live with industrial technology – and demand that the govt/taxpayer provide it all for them.
Why?
The Indian Act is a travesty – the Chiefs and Liberal bureaucracy won’t let it be dissolved. Until changes are made to it, and until changes are made to the internal Reserve culture – with its insistence on dependency – natives will continue to live in this manner. It’s up to them.
Again, allowing your child to be used in this manner was reprehensible. If you know all about the facts, as you say you do – then, why wasn’t your child taught all of this – in the school – and not used by the Unions to demand yet more money from the govt????
Victim–the accusation that people here don’t care about Indian kids is simply not true. Giving money to corrupt leaders without any accountability is not the way.
Those who would want to reform the system that leaves native kids in substandard housing, with substandard schools and substandard prospects for the future, are up against a very entrenched and corrupt system. It’s a lot more difficult to confront this than to sing a few songs on Parliament Hill. People on the reserves are hostages to those who use them to wield political clout and extract money. Actually, there’s a similarity to how people on reserves are used by their leaders, and kids being used by manipulative adults and cynical groups to make political points.
The following might explain where some of the money goes.
http://www.torontosun.com/2012/02/17/oxycontin-numbers-dont-lie
Public Unions should be illegal. Indians figure we stole their land so any outrage is considered okay by them to the white man. Gee what happens when their is no treaties because there is no white men left enough to coddle them in welfare? Its our responsibility after all to keep them forever in booze with oxycotin. Its all our fault for giving them reservation with Welfare. They are right to an extant. We have allowed this to go on to long.
VT, a true Liberal. All the excellent posts here in response to this Liberal are just wasted as he/she is a product of this mentality and you will never, never get through to them as they see the world only through their cloud-dwelling environment.
An example of this is the constant repeating by my Liberal friends that Mike Harris was responsible for Walkerton and the dead and injured from this tragedy. No matter how many times the true facts are told to them it never penetrates as they believe what they want to believe.
peterj, rita, and ET, excellent points.
Victim, I’ve reread ET’s post and have not been able to find any ad hominems: lots of disagreements, but that’s it and it’s fair comment.
You say, “. . . the chiefs DO want an end to the Indian Act. Harper just [sic] said he’s keeping it.” No he didn’t “just” say that. Your over simplification is disingenuous.
In his recent meeting with chiefs in Ottawa, Harper said (Sun News, Jan. 24, 2012), “Our government has no grand scheme to repeal or unilaterally rewrite the Indian Act . . .”
What he did say was “the government will focus on modernizing the act to create ‘real change.’ The Tories say they have introduced legislation to give additional powers to those living on reserves, including more say in how elections are conducted. . . .”
Further, (Global News, Jan.24,2012), “Canada’s federal government and its First Nations leaders agree the Indian Act doesn’t work, but they are divided on what role it should play in the future of their relationship. [What else is new?]
“Prime Minister Stephen Harper pledged to replace parts of the Indian Act, with modern laws . . . ‘Why do we wish to change the rules? Because from the rules you set, come the results you get,’ Harper said. ‘And the incentives buried in the Indian Act self-evidently lead to outcomes that we all deplore.’”
So what’s this about he “just said he’s keeping [the act]”? If you and the Lady Evelyn Alternative School “just” told the kids that, they’d be pretty angry at such a Neanderthal PM. But, from my experience of alternative schools and the kind of parent who’s in favour of serious progressive indoctrination of their children, that would be just the kind of propaganda and angry response they were planning on. Providing the kids with FACTS and TWO SIDES of an argument aren’t the modus operandi of the left.
The Indian Act is 136 years old and, in the last century, was largely administered by the LIBERALS. So, let’s get that straight. And, if the kiddies on the Hill think that as monolithic and entrenched a problem as the Indian Act is going to be scrapped, “hey presto”, they need a few more lessons in how governments work.
I’m willing to give the Harper government some time and space to modernize the Act for “real change”. Rome wasn’t built in a day and the despicable Indian Act, with its multitude of stake holders won’t be altogether changed in the twinkling of an eye. Despite what Charlie Angus, the NDP MP for Attiwapiskat said—“the kids fully understand the First Nation education issue”—I’ll bet they were only given shallow, left-wing, anti-Conservative talking points and really have no idea of the complexities of what’s going on re the Indian Act. Dissing the Prime Minister—you know, with ad hominem comments like “Mr. Harper, have a heart”—is not a very helpful way to support a cause. Charlie Angus was at the rally. Give me a break: the kids should have been holding HIM and the adults on the reserve to account: Attiwapiskat’s multitude of horrors has been happening on their watch, right under their noses, for years.
(NOW TO LADY EVELYN ALTERNATIVE SCHOOL. The info from its web site has confirmed my assessment of the kind of school it is: entitled, hypocritical, lefty.
There were meetings there, facilitated by a Joel Weistheimer, a University Research Chair in democracy and education at the University of Ottawa. Although the school says that it “follow[s] all Ministry and Ottawa-Carleton guidelines, curriculum and expectations”, how would one assess that, as Weistheimer was going to “discuss how an achievement-oriented system discourages deeper consideration of important ideas and limits in-depth critical analysis”. Really? What poppycock.
More poppycock: The School Council had a discussion about “No marks on Report Cards” because here’s what really counts at Lady Evelyn School: “THE ULTIMATE, INTRINSIC REWARD FOR STUDENTS IS THAT THEIR OPINIONS AND WAY OF SEEING THE WORLD ARE VALUED AND THEY FEEL A SENSE OF BELONGING” (Emphasis mine). Isn’t that just the ticket for turning out entitled, arrogant, rude, full of themselves students, who hypocritically judge and look down on those with whom they disagree? A huge amount of instructional time is spent on political grievance mongering at these schools. The “peace and harmony” they preach is altogether one-sided: for me but not for thee.
Truth telling is a challenge for schools like Lady Evelyn. E.g., At “the results of Lady Evelyn’s 2011 review of our Alternative Philosophy Tenets”, there’s a list of things “You won’t see” at Lady Evelyn. They’re virtually ALL straw men: note the all or nothing descriptors. You won’t see “Exclusive use of prepared, unvarying programs” or “All students doing the same thing all the time”. Guess what? One doesn’t see those things at ANY school!
Too many alternative schools are progressive indoctrination kiddie mills. Lady Evelyn’s obviously one of them. They claim to be non-judgemental, irenic oases of “critical thinking”: they’re anything but. See for yourself:
http://www.ladyevelyn.ca/)
(I’ve just had a long, two part post put in the filter. I’ll try one part at a time.)
peterj, rita, and ET, excellent points.
Victim, I’ve reread ET’s post and have not been able to find any ad hominems: lots of disagreements, but that’s it and it’s fair comment.
You say, “. . . the chiefs DO want an end to the Indian Act. Harper just [sic] said he’s keeping it.” No he didn’t “just” say that. Your over simplification is disingenuous.
In his recent meeting with chiefs in Ottawa, Harper said (Sun News, Jan. 24, 2012), “Our government has no grand scheme to repeal or unilaterally rewrite the Indian Act . . .”
What he did say was “the government will focus on modernizing the act to create ‘real change.’ The Tories say they have introduced legislation to give additional powers to those living on reserves, including more say in how elections are conducted. . . .”
Further, (Global News, Jan.24,2012), “Canada’s federal government and its First Nations leaders agree the Indian Act doesn’t work, but they are divided on what role it should play in the future of their relationship. [What else is new?]
“Prime Minister Stephen Harper pledged to replace parts of the Indian Act, with modern laws . . . ‘Why do we wish to change the rules? Because from the rules you set, come the results you get,’ Harper said. ‘And the incentives buried in the Indian Act self-evidently lead to outcomes that we all deplore.’”
So what’s this about he “just said he’s keeping [the act]”? If you and the Lady Evelyn Alternative School “just” told the kids that, they’d be pretty angry at such a Neanderthal PM. But, from my experience of alternative schools and the kind of parent who’s in favour of serious progressive indoctrination of their children, that would be just the kind of propaganda and angry response they were planning on. Providing the kids with FACTS and TWO SIDES of an argument aren’t the modus operandi of the left.
The Indian Act is 136 years old and, in the last century, was largely administered by the LIBERALS. So, let’s get that straight. And, if the kiddies on the Hill think that as monolithic and entrenched a problem as the Indian Act is going to be scrapped, “hey presto”, they need a few more lessons in how governments work.
I’m willing to give the Harper government some time and space to modernize the Act for “real change”. Rome wasn’t built in a day and the despicable Indian Act, with its multitude of stake holders won’t be altogether changed in the twinkling of an eye. Despite what Charlie Angus, the NDP MP for Attiwapiskat said—“the kids fully understand the First Nation education issue”—I’ll bet they were only given shallow, left-wing, anti-Conservative talking points and really have no idea of the complexities of what’s going on re the Indian Act. Dissing the Prime Minister—you know, with ad hominem comments like “Mr. Harper, have a heart”—is not a very helpful way to support a cause. Charlie Angus was at the rally. Give me a break: the kids should have been holding HIM and the adults on the reserve to account: Attiwapiskat’s multitude of horrors has been happening on their watch, right under their noses, for years.
” … the Kelowna Accord …”
What Kelowna Accord? It was written on a napkin and was never ratified. The “Kelowna Accord” was a number of suggestions that came out of a conversation in Kelowna between the Liberal government and Native representatives — at a luxury resort, bill footed by the taxpayer.
To accuse to CPC of “scrapping” it is disingenuous in the extreme, seeing as there was never a genuine Accord to scrap. Double-speak by a true Liberal believer — and a continuation of the blame-Harper game.
VT, there is a growing number of Canadians who are getting heartily sick and tired of Liberal-party cheerleaders like you who like to whitewash the Liberals’ gaffes, scandals, and sheer incompetence while laying blame for all of their “perfect party’s” deficits on PM Harper and his government.
The Liberal$ had 13 years of majority government to move ahead on a number of issues and they chose not to. Deal with that.
My part two, with information about Lady Evelyn Alternative School has been held again. Maybe it’ll get through later. For now:
Too many alternative schools are progressive indoctrination kiddie mills. Lady Evelyn’s obviously one of them. They claim to be non-judgemental, irenic oases of “critical thinking”: they’re anything but. See for yourself:
http://www.ladyevelyn.ca/
Meanwhile, back at Lady Evelyn School: here’s an update (Dec.19, 2011) of its Attawapiskat plan, at the school’s web site: “Shannens [sic] Dream working group has been working on helping Attawapiskat. We got the grant of $750 to help make awareness [sic]. This page will tell you what we are doing in the working group. Last week we worked on a play, which we will present to other schools. In the play we are sending a silent message [was it a mime?] that show [sic] how Aboriginals have been treated over the years.” Grammatically challenged, n’est-ce pas?
This is no surprise when one considers Lady Evelyn’s philosophy (at the school’s web site): “. . . . [an] achievement-oriented system discourages deeper consideration of important ideas and limits in-depth critical analysis” and “The ultimate intrinsic reward for students is that their opinions and way of seeing the world are valued and they feel a sense of belonging.”
Yes, children should feel that they belong at school and that their opinions are valued—sometimes, by being challenged—but, in order to EDUCATE, one also needs to add both academic rigour and objective assessment to the mix, both of which are obviously rejected by this alternative school, which prefers opportunistic photo-ops to meaningful dialogue.
Victim Toews >
Actually no one here cares what you do with your kid. We care about what you do with ours.
Get out of our kids heads.
Liberal Progressive political ideologies have no business being forced on other people’s children in schools. There will be a backlash eventually; even you must see the awakening of the conservative majority in the last decade throughout western countries.
Hmmm. Interesting. The divergence of points of view. The Liberal: Feeling their pain and spreading blame. The Conservative: FIX THE BLOODY PROBLEM. Can you see a difference?
Troll.
“They also learn to be politically strong, rather than hide behind fake names on web sites.”
Okay, “Victim Toews”.