A Cease Fire In the Trade War

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For now anyways.

Doug Ford – Please see a joint statement from United States Secretary of Commerce Howard Lutnick and myself: 

Today, United States Secretary of Commerce @howardlutnick and Premier of Ontario Doug Ford had a productive conversation about the economic relationship between the United States and Canada.

Secretary Lutnick agreed to officially meet with Premier Ford in Washington on Thursday, March 13 alongside the United States Trade Representative to discuss a renewed USMCA ahead of the April 2 reciprocal tariff deadline. In response, Ontario agreed to suspend its 25 per cent surcharge on exports of electricity to Michigan, New York and Minnesota.

More here

Ford video

117 Replies to “A Cease Fire In the Trade War”

      1. Really a smart guy like you of all people?
        I guess you missed Ford talking tough during the start of Covid.

        1. Trump is no lightweight himself.

          And he’s the one that likely had Lutnick reach out to offer a meeting in exchange for a delay in electricity tariffs.

          1. Prove it! It was a joint statement.
            But someone who is so smart as yourself should know the difference between fact and opinion.
            …or do you?

          3. @KM! Believe me, I showed incredible restraint in my last post.
            and it was more like a rhetorical question rather than a personal insult.
            I’m wondering if you know the difference between that as well.
            You see, a personal insult would be something like “you’re a slimy Lieberal fat pig,” or “your mother wears lieberal army boots…” something along those lines.
            You can see that I don’t do insults very well, which is why I don’t use them in my posts, although sometimes I am tempted.
            The only exception is, and I think you can guess who I’m talking about.
            However if you choose to accept my statement as an insult, then that is entirely up to you, and I can’t be held accountable for how you feel.

          4. How about no personal references at all? That’s be good. These other guys are not something you should emulate.

            Myself, I don’t fire unless fired upon. I used to not make personal references at any time, but the blog owner made it clear she didn’t care, so I changed policy,

          5. Trump blinked! Oh, you sad dunce.

            And he didn`t insult you. I’d be more than happy to teach you what a real insult actually looks and feels like. Just ask me!

          6. “How about no personal references at all? That’s be good. These other guys are not something you should emulate.”

            How about you stop insulting our collective intelligence all the time with your constant regurgitation of bullshit Liberal talking points?

          7. “And he’s the one that likely had Lutnick reach out to offer a meeting in exchange for a delay in electricity tariffs.”

            Wrong. Ford’s people made the call after Trump increased the tariff on steel to 50% (and also speculated in front of reporters that any threat to cut off electricity to the US would be “an act of war”). Ford must have turned white when he heard that, since he was dumb enough to make the threat.

      2. “Which one?”

        The one who had ZERO chance of winning but still thought he could bluff his way out of this.

        (…but you already knew that, didn’t you? Stop trolling…)

        1. Canada can’t win this trade war, but the US — and the Trump administration in particular — can sure lose it.

          2. By tanking the US economy and raising prices. It might even trigger a recession.

            And Trump will take the blame, disillusioning many of his supporters. The Trump Slump, they’ll call it. Years from now, t’ll be studied by economics students. And they’ll ask the same thing we’re asking ourselves: Why did Trump start this trade war? What did he want?

          3. @KM: Interesting hypothesis.
            I have a rather different version of how history will see this, so we’ll just have to wait and see how that plays out.
            My guess is that you will be eating your hat, but that’s just my humble opinion.

          4. It’s difficult to be approximately right, but it’s infinitely more difficult to be precisely wrong.
            But you pulled it off with your ridiculous assertion Trump would lose in a trade war with Canada.

          5. Trump might well lose. The reason is that the US and Canada are playing different games.

            Trump is trying to feed his big fat bloated ego, but has little backing from the rest of the country over this. It doesn’t even know why he’s doing it.

            Canada is fighting for its very existence, and is willing to drag both countries through the mud if necessary. The government has the backing of most of the people on this issue, SDA perhaps being the exception.

          1. Trump’s goal is clearly stated: move manufacturing to the U.S., creating high paying jobs and reducing dependence on other nations that are a threat, like China. Whether this works or not is a legitimate question. Careful tariff policy to protect American manufacturing might not increase consumer costs enough to exceed benefits. Screwing over Canada is not the goal, nor should it be. Getting CBSA to shut off fentanyl smuggling is

      4. President Trump imposed a 25% tariff. Premier Ford increased the price of electricity by 25%. President Trump said he’d increase the tariff to 50%.

        Premier Ford agreed to supply electricity at pre-tariff price in exchange for President Trump keep the tariff at 25%. Which one “caved”?

  2. “The knowledge that one is to be hanged in a fortnight concentrates the mind wonderfully.”

    1. Thanks Trodwell.
      One of my favourite sayings. Suits this situation well.
      I watched Jaws last night. Great movie. Someone said to Trump,
      “You’ll need a bigger rope”
      He found it. Doug blinked.

    1. claypound cramer
      fat ford is fatso, You need to read what is actually taking place on this file. Fatso is going to talk to (be told what to do) by Lutnick.

      1. Yes gym. More than likely, this meeting will be about Lutnick reading the riot act to flubbie Dougie.
        (Man, this truce is lasting longer than I thought!)

  4. We are not even in their league, it’s frankly embarrassing. However, anybody ever thought that if we do become the 51st we can get rid of metric and the French at the same time? Tempting.

    1. Yup. And the CBC.
      And gain 2A and proper free speech and USD.
      And we could encourage the Liberals to remain as a party in order to split the prog vote between them and their just-as-filthy cousins, the Democrats.

    2. And we’d also have our Castle doctrine re-newed not to mention the Mighty 2nd. Amendment. Win/win on all accounts. I would like to keep our Robertson screws though.

      2. Love the Robertson btw. Great screw head.

        When did Doug Ford start running the country?!?

        1. Well… things like this happen when there is a significant Vacuum of leadership at the top.

    3. We’d have to (give up the metric system, that is).

      Not sure about the French, but likely it will disappear on it’s own, since many of the language laws in Quebec will have to be struck down by a) the constitution, and b) Trump’s EO making English the official language of the ENTIRE country.

      2. French in Quebec is hardly the problem. They actually speak French there. It’s the imposition of French in the rest of the country where the language is not spoken that causes all the problems.

    4. However, anybody ever thought that if we do become the 51st we can get rid of metric and the French at the same time?

      We get the same thing w/ WEXIT. And, and, we don’t get screwed over when the Dems take the reins again. And they will.

  8. If premiers can negotiate does this mean Premier Smith can start negotiations for a pipeline? Lets do it!

  9. This is absurd. The Canada Mexico US treaty is a federal matter in which Ford is at best a bit player. What we are seeing is an attempt to fill a vacuum and a rather stupid one at that. it is one thing for someone like Danielle Smith to meet and greet in Washington on behalf of Alberta, but it is quite something else for Ford to pretend to represent the nation in this type of negotiation.

    Ford does not control the RCMP. He does not control the fentanyl labs. He does not control the money laundering going on in Vancouver and Toronto. What does he think he can offer the Americans? Maybe his own all dubious loyalty after the campaign he just ran? it’s absurd from beginning to end.

    1. Maybe he could take money away from overpaid neo-Marxist teachers/professors and give it the OPP to start fcking up organized crime.

    2. He does have control over the Canadian side of a rather significant border crossing. And his province is also a hub for drug and human trafficking (and some rather hideous things have happened out on those Great Lakes ships) — where those are, so is money laundering. He could, finally, offer up some due diligence on that; odd how he hasn’t, no?

      But, he may prove useful; especially when it’s time to deal with the other provinces — like Quebec (peut-etre, les croupion por le fin…please forgive my shoddy, American French).

      1. Quite right, uj. He also controls a significant provincial police force NOT under federal control (unlike the RCMP). The mandate of the OPP can be expanded to cover lots of things if the provincial government wishes.

        And because the Welland Canal is solely in Ontario, he can also affect (or refuse to hinder) US trade going though the St. Lawrence Seaway. Certainly the mandate of the OPP can be expanded to increased lake patrols or policing if Ford and the Ontario government find it useful. There are lots of areas in closing down smuggling on assorted Ontario-US waterways in which Ontario and the US can cooperate. As they have done so in the past.

        1. Ontario has the longest border between the United States and it is mostly waterways.

        2. Yes, messing with US shipping in the welland canal would be as bright as increasing electricity costs to the US.

          This country hasn’t a clue how to deal with Trump. Worse, we haven’t figured out he’s the same learning and stumbling guy he was the first time around, and this time his cabinet is solid and has his back.

          FAFO could get really bad this time.

          mhb23re

      1. Of course he did. You always make polite noises at the scumbag about to become PM. But YW is right that all of this helps undermine the Liberal administration in Ottawa. Politics is the art of having an effect, not simply what is blathered in the media.

      2. A “progressive” conservative statist oxymoron, endorsing Carney is the best news Poilievre could hope for.
        Ford clearly plays for the other team, the one of big, incompetent, irresponsible and dishonest government.

    2. I don’t know about that…….he was talking pretty independent and tough during the start of Covid , and folded like a wet rag.

    1. No, Trump blinked. Ford already knew before the announced electricity tarifffs that the Ontario economy was in dire jeopardy. He had little to lose.

      Trump has got one foot on the brake and the other on the accelerator, and that burning smell is the markets going up in smoke. These games he’s playing are grossly irresponsible, but even he must know that there are limits.

      2. “No, Trump blinked. Ford already knew before the announced electricity tarifffs that the Ontario economy was in dire jeopardy. He had little to lose.”

        Probably the dumbest statement you have ever made here…(and there are LOTS to choose from). Trump was about to devastate the Ontario auto industry in response, and Doug Ford knew it. He went whining to Trump, cap in hand, and BEGGED for mercy. Trump then threw him a bone.

        1. Had Trump implemented his threatened tariffs on April 2, Ontario’s auto industry would have been destroyed anyway, Ford had nothing to lose.

          That was Trump’s mistake. Never leave your opponent with nothing to lose. They’ll do something rash.

          Now get your lips off of Trump’s arse.

          1. They’ll do something rash.

            Your hero Ford then rescinded his rash decision.

            According to you, that’s Trump “blinking”, not Ford.

            Only in your broken-brained world could the guy making a threat, and then rescinding it, not be the guy who blinks.

            How does Doug Ford’s giant glutinous ass taste, sycophant?

          2. To be honest and frank KM and with reverence to the men and women that built this once great country up till the time I started investing my own sweat and blood in it fulltime at 16.
            The only sweat and blood I’ll invest in it now is for my bread and butter . Saving the rotted soulless husk of what we let this country become is the worst thing that could happen because the whole rotting mess deserves to rot back into the land or be buried.
            Canadians have sold their souls for comfort, stuff they can’t take with them, and children that don’t know. We as a whole are soulless and so is our country.
            So I guess you’ll understand where my firey old soul places it’s loyalty . The place where freedom just might mean something.
            I owe it to the men and women that taught me that.
            Not my fking bank account.

          4. Dustof: My rule is this. I don’t insult others until they insult me. Then I may return fire.

            I used to sanctimoniously instruct people that the blog owner has asked everyone to remain civil, but she made it clear to me that she wasn’t interested in enforcing that, so I don’t do that anymore.

          5. Your rule is: piss down the front of the pants, shit down the back of the pants, and leave a balanced mix of excrement smeared behind you as you waddle stupidly down the road. “Mindless vanity, and to hell with the stench!” is your motto.

      3. Idiot Dead Rat. Flubber Duggie DROPPED tariffs.
        POTUS 47 did not.
        Trump didn’t.
        FAFO.
        Now shut up Karen.

      5. KM… I don’t know where you get these ideas from, but get your head out of the sand for just one moment, and ask yourself… “who has all the cards in this deal?”

        At 10 times the GDP, and American ownership of the big three, the answer should be obvious to anyone with even half a brain cell.

        With a market 10 times the size of Canada, do you think for one moment, the automakers are going to jeopardize risking access to the US market? Ford should know this, but sometimes I wonder. I also wonder who gives him this crappy advise to participate in a trade war with the US?

        1. Trump is more vulnerable than he appears.

          If this trade war is seen tanking the US economy and raising prices, support from him will wither. Congress might then move to remove or limit the ability of the president to impose tariffs. And yes, even some Republican congressmen might support that, especially from the northern states. They know who a disgruntled electorate will take their frustrations out on in the upcoming midterms.

          And in regards to the automakers, it will take some of them years to switch to building cars solely in the US. Manufacturers can not turn on a dime. In the meantime, their cars will be more expensive and they’ll lose marketshare.

          In short, Trump is creating an enormous mess, and politicians and industry leaders know it. Consumers and employees might soon come to know it too.

          1. One tiny flaw… Trump is coordinating with the big three regarding his strategy. Don’t be so naive to believe that Trump hasn’t figured out all the angles. As I keep repeating, “DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE TRUMP’S RESOLVE.”
            I’m sure even Trump knows that there will be short-term gain. He even admitted that himself. What he’s betting on is the bounce-back in the long run.
            If this trade war continues, both countries will start at the bottom, but while the US economy will grow, the Canadian economy will crater. We do not have the talent, nor the capital to outlast the US in a long trade ware. In short, we don’t build any shit, so there’s going to be little to no growth in our GDP, while the US will recover very nicely once they get there supply chains set up.
            What was that that Margaret Thatcher said about socialism running out of other people’s money?

          2. I don’t think Trump has figured out any angles. That’s why he’s threatening, applying, and removing tariffs at a bewildering pace, all without coherently explaining why he’s doing any of it. The only things he’s accomplished is to (1) make businesses, investors, and the average American nervous, and (2) needlessly piss off an entire country.

            The American people are noticing. Their satisfaction with how Trump is handling the economy is dropping like a rock.

            https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-approval-rating-drops-50-152411668.html?fr=yhssrp_catchall

          3. “If this trade war is seen tanking the US economy and raising prices,”

            It won’t. You can stop fantasizing now.

            If an actual trade war happened between Canada and the US, by the time the US even went into a recession Canada would look like the dystopian hell of a Mad Max movie.

            That’s how great the economic disparity between us is. And yet you would stand up defiantly waving your little Canadian flag around while our entire economy CRASHED and BURNED, wouldn’t you?

            You’re an idiot. Seriously.

          5. Fred from BC

            Thank you for that brave prognostican, but even Trump wouldn’t deny the possibility of a recession, and is now telling Americans there may have to be some pain on the road to Nirvana.

            And yes, Canada will be badly hurt by a trade war, but Trump could take serious damage himself, and congress may be moved to act against the president if they think he’s harming the economy.

      6. The “markets” (aka the FIRE economy) has been decoupled from the actual real economy (manufacturing, production, resource extraction) for a very long time. Most of the “market wealth” is now tied up in derivatives (via “startegy” ETFs, CTAs with trend-following furutres algos, etc.). No connection to economic fundamentals at all.

        Let it burn. The youth of today (the real economy of tomorrow) do not hold much of this fake “wealth” so they see liquidation of the market as a necessary shrinkage of the money supply, to help bring down real estate prices.

        Let the market burn. You can’t eat derivative securities.

      7. You seem to have difficulty with reality. The good news, though, is nobody cares what you think.

        1. I don’t know about that. Those of us who are on the lookout for ludicrous stupidity to mock follow him closely.

          1. People laugh at all kinds of things.

            You’re basically the “football in the groin” guy.

            The most amusing part is that you sincerely believe that you’re a serious thinker. That just makes it so much funnier.

            Keep up the unintentionally-hilarious work.

    2. Not so sure about that. I like Trump don’t get me wrong but he does not seem the type to hand out complements to those he is bargaining with. “Speaking to reporters outside the White House, the president referred to the premier of Ontario, whom he did not mention by name, as “a very strong man” and expressed grudging admiration for his negotiating skills.” If he really had Doug by the ba!!s he wouldn’t be handing out complements.

  12. I was looking at the aluminum tariffs and wondered why almost all production was in Quebec (with a single smelter in BC) Digging down, I discovered that Canada has NO reserves of Bauxite (the base ore for aluminum) The smelters import bauxite (or alumina) and then convert it to Aluminum using the high amount of electrical power needed for the process. Canada imports the ore from other countries (NOT Australia) including the USA and then processes it. Australia has the highest level of world reserves, followed by China (I believe). And it appears that Australia has closed down all its aluminum smelters. Also the largest aluminum smelter in Quebec is a subsidiary of an American company. Cheap Canadian power is why we produce so much aluminum (8th in world production)

    1. Look up the Kemano Generating Station near Kitimat in BC. It’s construction was completed in 1954 by Alcoa in order to provide electricity for their aluminum smelter in Kitimat. An incredible feat of engineering and a testament to the entrepreneurial nature of corporations of the time.

      I dare say it would be impossible to build today, especially with our new green prime minister.

  13. Called on the carpet.. I suspect any illusions of victory for Canada will get a large bucket of cold pee thrown on it..
    Maybe Ford will roll over and give us a 3 dollar block of cheese?.. I know, the stakes couldn’t be higher..

  14. Gotta wonder, did Ford figure out what a mistake he was making all by himself, or did all the other premiers and prime ministers and opposition leaders jump on him?

  15. As a member of a Canadian political party, I have written today to various Canadian politicians to suggest the following template for a solution to the current trade war that is escalating between Canada and the United States.

    I think this template would lead to an amicable solution and reduce the unpleasant tension now existing, which is deterring ordinary people from making travel plans or considering business deals. This is not a situation that is helping either country in its present form, and my suggestion would place it in a more optimistic framework.

    First suggestion is that there would be a 90-day pause to allow Canada to have a federal election in April or May and this would give Canadians a chance to empower a new government with policies they wanted to see pursued in any talks with the American government.

    Second suggestion is that we rule out any notions of political union (annexation of Canada). This is not desired by any more than a small percentage of Canadians and frankly, it would not play into any recognizable long-term goals of the current U.S. administration, as Canada would no doubt be an additional source of votes for their opponents, the Democrats. I could note in passing that many Canadians are finding it rude for a foreign leader to casually imply that we should join the United States, as one new state when our land area is actually greater than that of the U.S.A. in total. There is almost zero support for the idea among Canadians; some western Canadians are upset with the Ottawa government but most of them favor independence, not political annexation.

    A third suggestion is that we consider a renewed economic union based on the lowest set of tariffs, if not a total elimination of all of them, similar to the European Union, but without the political apparatus of the EU.

    And finally, a fourth suggestion is that comprehensive talks between our leaders (once Canada decides on its new government) would go deeply into issues of border security, drug trafficking, and the influence of foreign countries, notably China but also any other third parties.

    I would favor having parallel talks between U.S., Canada and Mexico at a later date; any economic union between United States and Canada would likely not be feasible to extend seamlessly to Mexico, so there it would be necessary to renegotiate the three-country trade agreements in place. Border issues between the U.S. and Mexico are clearly on a different scale and that part of the process would no doubt be advancing regularly while this U.S.-Canada process went forward.

    I think it’s fair to say Canadians don’t want a trade war and many Canadians are not that well-informed on specific tariff issues that are irritants. The dairy sector seems to be a particular flash point. It is ridiculous in the extreme to toss out a long history of friendship and mutual co-operation between two sovereign nations over the price of eggs or milk. A full renegotiation of U.S.-Canada trade will allow all these issues to be fully debated and in my opinion the negotiations should take place in public so that the populations of our two countries can see what their representatives are saying to each other on these important matters. There should be nothing to hide, even on matters like Chinese interference — this is already an issue in both countries, let the people see what’s going on and what our leaders propose to do about it.

    Personally I would like to see complete free trade between the two countries, no tariffs, and reduced barriers to trade. Canada has internal issues to solve in this regard, it will no doubt be an election issue to resolve long-standing interprovincial trade concerns.

    The 90-day pause should not be viewed as problematic on either side. We need to get some clarity in Canada about what our policies will be and who will be in charge. Americans would be similarly upset and displeased if a foreign power leaned heavily on the U.S.A. in the October of an election year and through the interval between election day and inauguration day especially if the voters had chosen a different party to lead. This is potentially the situation in Canada now.

    So, my saying all this means nothing, but if one of the Canadian political parties picks up on these ideas, it may give some added weight and lead President Trump towards considering a 90-day pause, so long as Canada follows through with an early election call (we don’t legally have to call an election before the late summer into autumn, or as a result of non-confidence vote in the House of Commons, but newly installed PM-designate Carney will be wise to follow tradition and call an election as soon as feasible to allow voters to confirm or deny his party’s choice — this was done in 1984 when John Turner was similarly elected leader after Pierre Trudeau resigned).

    I hope my suggestion of adult supervision will not come as a shock to the system. I believe there can be a great economic partnership between the two nations but only after a fair discussion and the mutual respect that a fair discussion requires.

    1. How dare you approach people, especially politicians, with rational, cool-headed, well-reasoned and judged plans?

      1. Doesn’t address how Canada ceases being a kleptocratic narcostate and defence freeloader, entirely controlled by the CCP.

  16. So D’oh Ford slapped a 25% tariff on $300,000.00 of electricity. Washington threatened a 25% tariff on $62,000,000,000.00. In the words of Crocodile Dundee ” That’s not a tariff. Now THIS IS A TARIFF” as poor little Dougie the D’oh boy Ford’s eyes grow big and he runs to Washington to make peace. Hey Ontariowe you voted for him. Good luck with that.

  17. ♬ Blubber Douggie, you’re so dumb
    Your mommy told you, don’t play with guns
    But Blubber Douggie, you just shot your dick in twooooo.♬

    2. I loved the part where he used Yahoo news /USA today as a real news service…
      For someone who “claims” to be so smart. Using them was really dumb.

  20. It would be a Real Shitty Deal if we banned the export of Toilet Paper heading to Canada.

    3. Exports In 2023, Canada exported $1.62B in Toilet Paper, making it the 6th largest exporter of Toilet Paper in the world. At the same year, Toilet Paper was the 57th most exported product in Canada. The main destination of Toilet Paper exports from Canada are: United States ($1.59B), China ($6.17M), United Kingdom ($6.1M), Mexico ($3.8M), and Australia ($3.19M).

      The fastest growing export markets for Toilet Paper of Canada between 2022 and 2023 were United States ($219M), Netherlands ($1.93M), and Italy ($1.08M).

      Imports In 2023, Canada imported $1.44B in Toilet Paper, becoming the 4th largest importer of Toilet Paper in the world. At the same year, Toilet Paper was the 76th most imported product in Canada. Canada imports Toilet Paper primarily from: United States ($1.25B), China ($124M), Mexico ($22.6M), Germany ($10.1M), and Netherlands ($3.78M).

      The fastest growing import markets in Toilet Paper for Canada between 2022 and 2023 were United States ($67.6M), China ($14.9M), and Germany ($5.04M).

      https://is.gd/jZIsei

  21. Good news.

    Once again, a Trump hating power luster blinks and is forced to suck it up and negotiate instead of attack.

    As Trump the treat to world peace secures a ceasefire, once Russia agrees, who like the rest must roll over to the strongman. I hope Canadians finally get this reality no matter their disdain for Trump, he holds all the cards.

    We will see. In the meantime, progressive statists will try to use the Trump hobgoblin for a power grabbing election.

    I was worried Trump had made a terrible mistake that would ultimately defeat Canadian conservatives and elect the same power-hungry morons and their useful idiot judges who try to limit him now, who had used every dirty trick in the book to keep him out of the White House, but it seems he gets it after all. I live in hope.

    1. I doubt Russia is going to agree to ceasefire. The entire last 2.5 years has been mop up. Why stop now? The ceasefire terms Russia will accept are unacceptable to the West, and vice-versa. So the MIC keeps the City of London money laundering operation going.

      1. I doubt Ukraine will agree to a ceasefire.
        I doubt Trump will reverse his tariffs once we call uncle.
        I doubt Trump can win the election.
        Trump is getting everything he wants. I’ll let unfolding events reveal your lack of common sense.

  23. Canadian politicians are all playing a finite game. Trump and the patriots are playing the infinite game. This isn’t an endorsement of the man, but those who go against him seem to end up in quicksand.

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