Where did they get those numbers? I wish the healthcare was that good. I took it upon myself to become a well read physician because the reality is that when it comes to your own health or that of your family, the best doctor is often yourself. Like the police reference, when seconds count, the police are minutes away, in medical emergencies, when seconds count, the emergency room removes the clocks.
I wonder what the health care costs are of all the folks that have never paid a nickle into it, refugees, welfare bums, the homeless, natives…….
Another … *sigh* personal story to illustrate
I JUST had a hip replaced (BTW Canadian friends … my incredibly -popular- surgeon made my first appointment within a week, and performed the surgery on the exact date I chose this past May). I had put the surgery off way too long, and the results are nothing short of miraculous. I finally replaced my massively arthritic hip (I was limping like a wounded animal) BECAUSE … the Obamakkare “Cadillac tax” finally forced our Employer to DUMP my Health Net insurance coverage. I was going to LOSE my preferred surgeon (who has performed more than 4,000 hip replacements) in July 2017. So I finally had it done. Quickly. Efficiently. and Wildly Successfully !
It was barely 1-month from my first phone call to the orthopedic surgeon – referral from my General Practitioner – X-ray updates – and multiple surgery preps – tests – education, etc. to the day of my surgery. And this RAPID schedule from one of the MOST in-demand Orthopedic Surgeons in my region of the SF Bay Area. My Ortho uses the more “modern” ANTERIOR replacement surgery which is more like arthroscopic surgery than the traditional butt muscle cutting, hacking, and hewing. This approach requires a specialized surgical table which provides computerized guidance for bone alignment and equalizing leg length. Real EXPENSIVE $$$ state of the art sh*t! And the results … are nothing less of MIRACULOUS. Oh, and BTW … my Ortho Surgeon has his OWN X-RAY lab right in his own offices. No need for more appointments, travel, delay … just walk down the hallway and get updated X-rays.
My surgery was started at 9:00A (I checked-in at 5:30A), I awoke from the surgery at about 11:30A, was in my Hospital Room by 12:00P, had lunch, and walked the hospital corridor at 3:00P the same day. I was doing so well … I asked to be discharged after ONE DAY in the hospital. I took a fairly mild opiate pain killer for less than 2-weeks and literally experienced NO PAIN … whatsoever … after having my femur sawn-off, pelvis bone ground-down, and metal-ceramic-and”space age”plastics JAMMED into my modified skeleton. And now, I walk completely pain-free and “normal”. I cannot detect any difference WHATSOEVER between my artificial hip and my remaining (somewhat) normal hip. Nothing “feels” artificial whatsoever.
The point of all of this ?
1. Timing: My Cadillac health plan delivered IMMEDIATE “elective” surgery.
2. Quality: The total care that I received was simply FANTASTIC. State of the Art. Best Surgeon available. Most modern techniques and EXPENSIVE sh*t used to restore my health. I don’t begrudge ANYONE involved in my care the $$$ they EARNED. They have PROVEN their worth and deserve to be $$ REWARDED. Yes … even the insurance bureaucrat who authorized every bit of my care.
3. God BLESS our Free Market (for profit) healthcare: We are one of the lucky ones, who have OUTSTANDING medical insurance and care … because we have JOBS.
4. Not Canada: sorry … but I am GLAD I don’t live in Canada, or England. Really glad.
5. Socialized Medicine sucks.
my health care plan consists of NOT doing stooopid stuff including synthetic rec drugs, daredevil sports, poking around where biological hazards abound, NOT morphing into a sports fan couch potato.
Im 66, havent needed or owned a car since ’07, bicycling instead which includes paying the fckutards an occasional fine for moseying on the sidewalk when traffic gets dodgy.
earlier this year I shoved an enormous weight on a 45 degree leg press (think 4 digits imperial), this despite 3 older siblings having joint replacement surgery.
bottom line, I do NOT and NEVER WILL put full faith in public health care. the wynne cabal is making *&#^$& sure that too is irrecoverably clobbered. I think that by%%#atch has OCD the way she manages the public interests.
stay active, cross your fingers, do what you can, and bravo for you kenji.
There’s some hope. The strategic surgery initiative and other experiments in healthcare will hopefully be Canada’s version of ‘Glasnost’/Perestroika. Let the nightmare end.
I’ve had surgery three (3) times in the last 16 years. All for cancer. The longest I waited to see a specialist was two (2) weeks. The longest I waited for surgery (including the time to see the specialist) was four (4) weeks. The fastest time was the last time….5 days, but that was extenuating circumstances. All the surgeries were done at the same hospital, two by the same specialist, while the third was done by another specialist in a completely different field.
Strangely, every time I needed surgery it occurred in early October. Maybe folks should only need surgery or specialist time in early October. At least in Alberta, or in Calgary where mine were. I’ve used some of the more remote places like Grande Prairie & Sylvan Lake for services & other than having to wait on a typical Saturday in the ER, the experiences were not stressful nor excessively time consuming. I’ve waited longer in Calgary on a Saturday night, when all the weirdos show up with more pressing issues than mine. Other’s experiences might be different.
I think a lot of the friction has to do with where you live in Canada and then where you live in relation to where the local health services are in your particular area. Rural folks have my sympathy, because they do get the short end where it comes to health care. That’s where STARS comes in.
I live in a major center & take the LRT & a bus to get to where I need to go. I do that because the space I don’t take is taken by someone from rural Alberta. In emergencies, I call my own ambulance. Freaks them right out! It’s expensive, but the last thing anyone needs is bogged traffic or the emergency becomes more urgent & it becomes tough to do CPR or something while driving at 80 kph up Crowchild, then have to wait for the ambulance anyway. It’s tax deductible as a medical expense.
I don’t favour socialism for most things. Health care is an exception. Great that you got wonderful care, but it is a problem when others have poor care or none. I think most countries are facing the same dilemma — more and more expensive health care needed, fewer resources. There probably is not an ideal solution.
The biggest LIE told to sell Obamakkare is that … “America doesn’t provide medical care for the poor”. “The only industrialized nation to let people die” … yadda yadda yadda … All LIES. Medicare, Medicaid, VA, etc. … the USA has provided FREE health care for every single American in need. The only group of people falling between the cracks were the working “poor” … low income wage earners who either could not (or chose not) to purchase health insurance. Too “wealthy” for FREE medical, but incapable (or unwilling) to provide their own coverage. My own daughter, upon graduation from college, was in this category. I found her a “major medical” policy that cost less than $100.00/month which she could easily afford on her (temporary) waitress job. It was like fire insurance. It would kick in if anything really bad happened. And it had very reasonable deductibles and thresholds. However, one of my adult boys has a serious medical condition, and a low-paying job. Since he left (not graduated) college, he has received totally FREE medical care from the State of CA and our local County. Totally FREE. And he sees lots of Doctors, and is on VERY EXPENSIVE medication. All totally FREE. And really quite good care considering. His care has not been altered one iota by Obamakkare. All Obamakkare accomplished was to crush the middle class (who had to purchase Obamakkare policies) with massive costs, and crappy care.
Canadian politicians quit using the term ‘best healthcare in the world’ during the chretien era. They know it’s BS.
Last time I bothered to check we were ranked 29th or so in the world.
We’re spending close to 50% of our total budget on health care. We’re unable to move up the ranks. Time for a change of direction.
Canada and Vietnam are the only countries in the world that have no abortion law.
It’s legal at any time from conception to full term.
But what is “in need”? You are on your last legs? My mother was American. I watched her die while she hid symptoms from the doctors because she was worried about costs. I thought it was barbaric. I have a son who required a lot of care as a child. I will forever be grateful for the many specialists he was able to see (Canadian system ) at no cost to me, a single parent at the time. I understand that the system in Canada is not perfect, and I think Obamacare is not workable over the long term. But personally, I am still supportive of the Canadian system, even if we have to wait. It’s called sharing.
What is the appropriate amount government should spend on healtcare? If 50% can’t get it done maybe 60% or 70%.
Maybe education should be cut to accommodate health costs? Or roads or the military?
The system as it exists can’t be sustained.
A few years ago Ontario government figures stipulated that Health Care costs accounted for 47 cents of all tax money collected by the Provincial government. Does anyone think that those costs have gone down in the last few years? Only an idiot could believe that to be true.You don t have to have a degree in economics to realize that this system is not sustainable. In the meantime while these costs continue and escalate the Provinces infrastructure deteriorates. So if the 47 % figure continues, every tax dollar collected on gasoline, Diesel,propane, electricity AKA as hydro, natural gas etc. is funneled into the Health Care single payer monopoly.Why should the Taxpayer be on the hook to pay for free health care for immigrants,welfare bums,natives who have never worked and never intend to,or any one else who does not contribute or at least attempt to pay their share.
What’s barbaric is coercing others into providing healthcare. It not only involves stealing their money, but, ultimately, requires that doctors be forced into service. It is slavery. Would you also force people to donate blood and tissue?
All of those Countries that scored higher have parallel private health care options available in addition to their own brands of socialism. Canada has a few token clinics for diagnostics and government paid workers compensation / auto insurance claimants but no private options for the vast majority of patients on waiting lists. When it comes to Canadians choosing to shorten up the waiting times for others by spending their own money on relieving their own misery within their own country, “Das ist streng verboten!”. I’ve had surgery in Canada and the US and the quality of service in the US is much better. Canada’s rationed system spends roughly half of the per capita cost of US health care…. and it shows.
Look at health care from a historical perspective. There are big improvements everywhere over the last 50 years. The US system has fueled more than its share of innovation. However, I’m not a fan of big pharma and lawyers.
Hopefully I can avoid hip replacement until Kenji’s Cadillac care is routine in Canada.
Not only that, but euthanasia for everyone is a disincentive for good care. Caring can be expensive and death is cheap, cheap, cheap.
Unionized healthcare workers + actually delivering healthcare means less raises and benefits for the Unionized workers.
It ain’t rocket surgery.
For once you are correct, put an x on the calendar cause i am sure this does not happen often, you said that coercing others into providing health care is barbaric. So why am I and thousands of other taxpayers being coerced {your words not mine} into covering the health care costs for immigrants,welfare bums,natives who have never held a job and never intend to etc. called barbaric according to you? If you believe so strongly in what you seem to propose why don t you contribute to the various charities that support the groups being reffered to,I m sure there are plenty.Your Left Wing B/S does not give you or anyone else the right to commit my money to contribute to your collective mediocrity wet dream.
“Why should the Taxpayer be on the hook to pay for free health care for immigrants,welfare bums,natives who have never worked and never intend to,or any one else who does not contribute or at least attempt to pay their share.”
Only one problem, that’s not where all the money goes. The money is NOT SPENT CARING FOR THE POOR. Let me repeat that, immigrants,welfare bums,natives etc. do not get that money. At all. Doctors do not get paid all that money for looking after indigents.
The money, my friends, goes to the bureaucracy. You have wait times for surgery because the doctor can’t get operating room time. There’s plenty of doctors, and plenty of nurses. The government rations hospital OR time. They ration it so much that there is now a thriving business in same-day surgery, where you go in, have your procedure in the doctor’s private facility, and leave.
Why would a doc go to all the trouble and expense of doing that? Because he can’t get OR time.
Why can’t you get an MRI without waiting three months? Because more MRIs means more diagnoses that the government can’t ignore anymore. So they ration MRI time down to the point where their narrow little pipeline can handle the demand.
You want to eliminate waiting? Eliminate government issue healthcare and pay cash. Kapow, instant service.
The joke is that its going to happen anyway, it’ll just be black market. You’ll be slipping a 50 in the tip jar to get to the front of the line at the hospital.
In what country other than Canada is it against the law to use your own money to pay for your own health care?
Go out and try to find a doc in Canada and hire him to treat your problem. It’s against the law. You have to leave the country to do it.
Regarding Cadillac care – I had the opposite – Lada care.
I had back surgery 10 years ago in Ontario.
I had been approved after several ‘flat-on-my-back’ episodes and subsequent MRI tests, then I was told the wait was one year. That’s right – 12 months.
This with significant pain and a calf muscle that was in spasm the entire time. I got a call 10 months later, for surgery which was sort of successful in that my back was better but I was left with permanent nerve damage in my foot.
That’s the reality of socialized medicine.
I do not disagree that the Bureaucracy burns up money like fire wood at a campfire. However the groups that were mentioned, ie: immigrants. welfare bums. and natives who have never held a job and never intend to still get a free ride that is paid for by the rest of us. No matter how you distribute the 47 % of Provincial money the system is not sustainable, which is what I was trying to say.
Where did they get those numbers? I wish the healthcare was that good. I took it upon myself to become a well read physician because the reality is that when it comes to your own health or that of your family, the best doctor is often yourself. Like the police reference, when seconds count, the police are minutes away, in medical emergencies, when seconds count, the emergency room removes the clocks.
I wonder what the health care costs are of all the folks that have never paid a nickle into it, refugees, welfare bums, the homeless, natives…….
Another … *sigh* personal story to illustrate
I JUST had a hip replaced (BTW Canadian friends … my incredibly -popular- surgeon made my first appointment within a week, and performed the surgery on the exact date I chose this past May). I had put the surgery off way too long, and the results are nothing short of miraculous. I finally replaced my massively arthritic hip (I was limping like a wounded animal) BECAUSE … the Obamakkare “Cadillac tax” finally forced our Employer to DUMP my Health Net insurance coverage. I was going to LOSE my preferred surgeon (who has performed more than 4,000 hip replacements) in July 2017. So I finally had it done. Quickly. Efficiently. and Wildly Successfully !
It was barely 1-month from my first phone call to the orthopedic surgeon – referral from my General Practitioner – X-ray updates – and multiple surgery preps – tests – education, etc. to the day of my surgery. And this RAPID schedule from one of the MOST in-demand Orthopedic Surgeons in my region of the SF Bay Area. My Ortho uses the more “modern” ANTERIOR replacement surgery which is more like arthroscopic surgery than the traditional butt muscle cutting, hacking, and hewing. This approach requires a specialized surgical table which provides computerized guidance for bone alignment and equalizing leg length. Real EXPENSIVE $$$ state of the art sh*t! And the results … are nothing less of MIRACULOUS. Oh, and BTW … my Ortho Surgeon has his OWN X-RAY lab right in his own offices. No need for more appointments, travel, delay … just walk down the hallway and get updated X-rays.
My surgery was started at 9:00A (I checked-in at 5:30A), I awoke from the surgery at about 11:30A, was in my Hospital Room by 12:00P, had lunch, and walked the hospital corridor at 3:00P the same day. I was doing so well … I asked to be discharged after ONE DAY in the hospital. I took a fairly mild opiate pain killer for less than 2-weeks and literally experienced NO PAIN … whatsoever … after having my femur sawn-off, pelvis bone ground-down, and metal-ceramic-and”space age”plastics JAMMED into my modified skeleton. And now, I walk completely pain-free and “normal”. I cannot detect any difference WHATSOEVER between my artificial hip and my remaining (somewhat) normal hip. Nothing “feels” artificial whatsoever.
The point of all of this ?
1. Timing: My Cadillac health plan delivered IMMEDIATE “elective” surgery.
2. Quality: The total care that I received was simply FANTASTIC. State of the Art. Best Surgeon available. Most modern techniques and EXPENSIVE sh*t used to restore my health. I don’t begrudge ANYONE involved in my care the $$$ they EARNED. They have PROVEN their worth and deserve to be $$ REWARDED. Yes … even the insurance bureaucrat who authorized every bit of my care.
3. God BLESS our Free Market (for profit) healthcare: We are one of the lucky ones, who have OUTSTANDING medical insurance and care … because we have JOBS.
4. Not Canada: sorry … but I am GLAD I don’t live in Canada, or England. Really glad.
5. Socialized Medicine sucks.
my health care plan consists of NOT doing stooopid stuff including synthetic rec drugs, daredevil sports, poking around where biological hazards abound, NOT morphing into a sports fan couch potato.
Im 66, havent needed or owned a car since ’07, bicycling instead which includes paying the fckutards an occasional fine for moseying on the sidewalk when traffic gets dodgy.
earlier this year I shoved an enormous weight on a 45 degree leg press (think 4 digits imperial), this despite 3 older siblings having joint replacement surgery.
bottom line, I do NOT and NEVER WILL put full faith in public health care. the wynne cabal is making *&#^$& sure that too is irrecoverably clobbered. I think that by%%#atch has OCD the way she manages the public interests.
stay active, cross your fingers, do what you can, and bravo for you kenji.
There’s some hope. The strategic surgery initiative and other experiments in healthcare will hopefully be Canada’s version of ‘Glasnost’/Perestroika. Let the nightmare end.
I’ve had surgery three (3) times in the last 16 years. All for cancer. The longest I waited to see a specialist was two (2) weeks. The longest I waited for surgery (including the time to see the specialist) was four (4) weeks. The fastest time was the last time….5 days, but that was extenuating circumstances. All the surgeries were done at the same hospital, two by the same specialist, while the third was done by another specialist in a completely different field.
Strangely, every time I needed surgery it occurred in early October. Maybe folks should only need surgery or specialist time in early October. At least in Alberta, or in Calgary where mine were. I’ve used some of the more remote places like Grande Prairie & Sylvan Lake for services & other than having to wait on a typical Saturday in the ER, the experiences were not stressful nor excessively time consuming. I’ve waited longer in Calgary on a Saturday night, when all the weirdos show up with more pressing issues than mine. Other’s experiences might be different.
I think a lot of the friction has to do with where you live in Canada and then where you live in relation to where the local health services are in your particular area. Rural folks have my sympathy, because they do get the short end where it comes to health care. That’s where STARS comes in.
I live in a major center & take the LRT & a bus to get to where I need to go. I do that because the space I don’t take is taken by someone from rural Alberta. In emergencies, I call my own ambulance. Freaks them right out! It’s expensive, but the last thing anyone needs is bogged traffic or the emergency becomes more urgent & it becomes tough to do CPR or something while driving at 80 kph up Crowchild, then have to wait for the ambulance anyway. It’s tax deductible as a medical expense.
I don’t favour socialism for most things. Health care is an exception. Great that you got wonderful care, but it is a problem when others have poor care or none. I think most countries are facing the same dilemma — more and more expensive health care needed, fewer resources. There probably is not an ideal solution.
The biggest LIE told to sell Obamakkare is that … “America doesn’t provide medical care for the poor”. “The only industrialized nation to let people die” … yadda yadda yadda … All LIES. Medicare, Medicaid, VA, etc. … the USA has provided FREE health care for every single American in need. The only group of people falling between the cracks were the working “poor” … low income wage earners who either could not (or chose not) to purchase health insurance. Too “wealthy” for FREE medical, but incapable (or unwilling) to provide their own coverage. My own daughter, upon graduation from college, was in this category. I found her a “major medical” policy that cost less than $100.00/month which she could easily afford on her (temporary) waitress job. It was like fire insurance. It would kick in if anything really bad happened. And it had very reasonable deductibles and thresholds. However, one of my adult boys has a serious medical condition, and a low-paying job. Since he left (not graduated) college, he has received totally FREE medical care from the State of CA and our local County. Totally FREE. And he sees lots of Doctors, and is on VERY EXPENSIVE medication. All totally FREE. And really quite good care considering. His care has not been altered one iota by Obamakkare. All Obamakkare accomplished was to crush the middle class (who had to purchase Obamakkare policies) with massive costs, and crappy care.
Canadian politicians quit using the term ‘best healthcare in the world’ during the chretien era. They know it’s BS.
Last time I bothered to check we were ranked 29th or so in the world.
We’re spending close to 50% of our total budget on health care. We’re unable to move up the ranks. Time for a change of direction.
But but but were in Top & out of 198: https://hotair.com/archives/2017/10/11/post-fact-checker-7-198-nations-allow-abortion-20-weeks/
Canada and Vietnam are the only countries in the world that have no abortion law.
It’s legal at any time from conception to full term.
But what is “in need”? You are on your last legs? My mother was American. I watched her die while she hid symptoms from the doctors because she was worried about costs. I thought it was barbaric. I have a son who required a lot of care as a child. I will forever be grateful for the many specialists he was able to see (Canadian system ) at no cost to me, a single parent at the time. I understand that the system in Canada is not perfect, and I think Obamacare is not workable over the long term. But personally, I am still supportive of the Canadian system, even if we have to wait. It’s called sharing.
What is the appropriate amount government should spend on healtcare? If 50% can’t get it done maybe 60% or 70%.
Maybe education should be cut to accommodate health costs? Or roads or the military?
The system as it exists can’t be sustained.
A few years ago Ontario government figures stipulated that Health Care costs accounted for 47 cents of all tax money collected by the Provincial government. Does anyone think that those costs have gone down in the last few years? Only an idiot could believe that to be true.You don t have to have a degree in economics to realize that this system is not sustainable. In the meantime while these costs continue and escalate the Provinces infrastructure deteriorates. So if the 47 % figure continues, every tax dollar collected on gasoline, Diesel,propane, electricity AKA as hydro, natural gas etc. is funneled into the Health Care single payer monopoly.Why should the Taxpayer be on the hook to pay for free health care for immigrants,welfare bums,natives who have never worked and never intend to,or any one else who does not contribute or at least attempt to pay their share.
What’s barbaric is coercing others into providing healthcare. It not only involves stealing their money, but, ultimately, requires that doctors be forced into service. It is slavery. Would you also force people to donate blood and tissue?
All of those Countries that scored higher have parallel private health care options available in addition to their own brands of socialism. Canada has a few token clinics for diagnostics and government paid workers compensation / auto insurance claimants but no private options for the vast majority of patients on waiting lists. When it comes to Canadians choosing to shorten up the waiting times for others by spending their own money on relieving their own misery within their own country, “Das ist streng verboten!”. I’ve had surgery in Canada and the US and the quality of service in the US is much better. Canada’s rationed system spends roughly half of the per capita cost of US health care…. and it shows.
Look at health care from a historical perspective. There are big improvements everywhere over the last 50 years. The US system has fueled more than its share of innovation. However, I’m not a fan of big pharma and lawyers.
Hopefully I can avoid hip replacement until Kenji’s Cadillac care is routine in Canada.
Not only that, but euthanasia for everyone is a disincentive for good care. Caring can be expensive and death is cheap, cheap, cheap.
Unionized healthcare workers + actually delivering healthcare means less raises and benefits for the Unionized workers.
It ain’t rocket surgery.
For once you are correct, put an x on the calendar cause i am sure this does not happen often, you said that coercing others into providing health care is barbaric. So why am I and thousands of other taxpayers being coerced {your words not mine} into covering the health care costs for immigrants,welfare bums,natives who have never held a job and never intend to etc. called barbaric according to you? If you believe so strongly in what you seem to propose why don t you contribute to the various charities that support the groups being reffered to,I m sure there are plenty.Your Left Wing B/S does not give you or anyone else the right to commit my money to contribute to your collective mediocrity wet dream.
“Why should the Taxpayer be on the hook to pay for free health care for immigrants,welfare bums,natives who have never worked and never intend to,or any one else who does not contribute or at least attempt to pay their share.”
Only one problem, that’s not where all the money goes. The money is NOT SPENT CARING FOR THE POOR. Let me repeat that, immigrants,welfare bums,natives etc. do not get that money. At all. Doctors do not get paid all that money for looking after indigents.
The money, my friends, goes to the bureaucracy. You have wait times for surgery because the doctor can’t get operating room time. There’s plenty of doctors, and plenty of nurses. The government rations hospital OR time. They ration it so much that there is now a thriving business in same-day surgery, where you go in, have your procedure in the doctor’s private facility, and leave.
Why would a doc go to all the trouble and expense of doing that? Because he can’t get OR time.
Why can’t you get an MRI without waiting three months? Because more MRIs means more diagnoses that the government can’t ignore anymore. So they ration MRI time down to the point where their narrow little pipeline can handle the demand.
You want to eliminate waiting? Eliminate government issue healthcare and pay cash. Kapow, instant service.
The joke is that its going to happen anyway, it’ll just be black market. You’ll be slipping a 50 in the tip jar to get to the front of the line at the hospital.
In what country other than Canada is it against the law to use your own money to pay for your own health care?
Go out and try to find a doc in Canada and hire him to treat your problem. It’s against the law. You have to leave the country to do it.
Regarding Cadillac care – I had the opposite – Lada care.
I had back surgery 10 years ago in Ontario.
I had been approved after several ‘flat-on-my-back’ episodes and subsequent MRI tests, then I was told the wait was one year. That’s right – 12 months.
This with significant pain and a calf muscle that was in spasm the entire time. I got a call 10 months later, for surgery which was sort of successful in that my back was better but I was left with permanent nerve damage in my foot.
That’s the reality of socialized medicine.
I do not disagree that the Bureaucracy burns up money like fire wood at a campfire. However the groups that were mentioned, ie: immigrants. welfare bums. and natives who have never held a job and never intend to still get a free ride that is paid for by the rest of us. No matter how you distribute the 47 % of Provincial money the system is not sustainable, which is what I was trying to say.