And you can add the evidence chain and forensic science to the defendants.
If the FBI wins this, the ‘cloud’ services are basically screwed. One of the selling points of the ‘cloud’ is that they don’t have or keep copies of the keys that users create to safely upload their data, backup their systems, keep their application data secure, etc.
A ruling against Apple would basically set the precedent that data services would require a tool to break the encryption of whatever they store in case the FBI or another gov’t agency required it.
If you’ve been dealing with computers for any time in the last three years, you know that there has been a mass migration of applications and data from local centralized systems to remote data centres and remote applications. Like everything else in computers, there are now certifications available for too much money to tell people that you can study and pass tests about the cloud and cloud security.
Data integrity is the single biggest reason to use the cloud. With an Apple loss, that integrity is gone.
Google Web Services. Microsoft OneDrive, Apple iCloud, Symantec Backup, Backup4All; everything people do now a days is cloud based.
And the majority don’t live in the US.
Update: Gizmodo was on the conference call with Apple. If true, Oops gov’t employees.
If you think you have any privacy from the pointy heads at Faceplant, Apple, or Alphabet, you’re dead wrong. Their intrusion into your privacy is not much worse than what the FBI might want.
Besides, I don’t wear a turban or a burqa, and not a Mook, so worries
Yes, but the “Federal Busybodies Internment” society, the “Neue Secrets Agency” und “Homeland InSecurity” needs a backdoor to the entire world because your ‘safety’ depends on them having access to several quintillion terabytes of data.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-nsa-is-building-the-countrys-biggest-spy-center-watch-what-you-say/5338302
As a result of this “expanding array of theater airborne and other sensor networks,” as a 2007 Department of Defense report puts it, the Pentagon is attempting to expand its worldwide communications network, known as the Global Information Grid, to handle yottabytes (1024 bytes) of data. (A yottabyte is a septillion bytes—so large that no one has yet coined a term for the next higher magnitude.)
It needs that capacity because, according to a recent report by Cisco, global Internet traffic will quadruple from 2010 to 2015, reaching 966 exabytes per year. (A million exabytes equal a yottabyte.) In terms of scale, Eric Schmidt, Google’s former CEO, once estimated that the total of all human knowledge created from the dawn of man to 2003 totaled 5 exabytes. And the data flow shows no sign of slowing. In 2011 more than 2 billion of the world’s 6.9 billion people were connected to the Internet. By 2015, market research firm IDC estimates, there will be 2.7 billion users. Thus, the NSA’s need for a 1-million-square-foot data storehouse. Should the agency ever fill the Utah center with a yottabyte of information, it would be equal to about 500 quintillion (500,000,000,000,000,000,000) pages of text.
The data stored in Bluffdale will naturally go far beyond the world’s billions of public web pages. The NSA is more interested in the so-called invisible web, also known as the deep web or deepnet—data beyond the reach of the public. This includes password-protected data, US and foreign government communications, and noncommercial file-sharing between trusted peers. “The deep web contains government reports, databases, and other sources of information of high value to DOD and the intelligence community,” according to a 2010 Defense Science Board report. “Alternative tools are needed to find and index data in the deep web … Stealing the classified secrets of a potential adversary is where the [intelligence] community is most comfortable.” With its new Utah Data Center, the NSA will at last have the technical capability to store, and rummage through, all those stolen secrets. The question, of course, is how the agency defines who is, and who is not, “a potential adversary.”
And you know governments, the one thing they can’t get enough of is CONTROL!
Cheers
Hans Rupprecht, Commander in Chief
1st Saint Nicolaas Army
Army Group “True North”
The vast majority of corporate cloud services are NOT encrypted in any way. All they do is replace in house management of computer systems with external management of those systems. The providers compete with each other by promising physically and electronically secure data centers (e.g. encryption is not necessary because we will keep people out).
There are a few consumer centered services that offer the ‘unbreakable’ encryption but it really makes no difference what the FBI does because it will always be possible to design a system that cannot be cracked with the computing resources available.
It stuns me how easily people give up privacy and other information best left unshared.
If one watches “Person of Interest” (and if one is NOT watching it, one is watching TV wrong), one character claimed to have invented and then exploited social media because people gave up information on social media pages that they would never have shared with the government.
Fiction, life and so forth.
This time the FBI is asking permission from Apple.
They probably asked permission from TOR for help too and denied.
When they cant get what they want by asking/ requesting/ compelling they just outsource it, have a program developed so they can take what they want.
The computer science department at Carnegie Mellon University, Qatar Computing Research Institute and MIT cant help them this time.
I wonder how many innocent people were de-anonymized and under surveillance while the FBI conducted their research/attack on TOR? No one will really know.
What really grates on me is that all the government LE, surveillance and spy agencies were so silent when profiling was deemed illegal BUT conducting surveillance by applying filters on data collection of EVERYONE is entirely acceptable.
The NSA already tap all the data hubs going through the US. GCHQ in Britain does the same. I wonder if CSIS does it or uses the NSA by default.
The NSA also has a backdoor with a LOT of US based cloud service companies
http://arstechnica.com/search/?ie=UTF-8&q=cloud+services+NSA
Would someone please explain something to me. If someone had committed a murder and they had a safety deposit box at the bank, and the police wanted to see the contents of the safety deposit box, they would go to a judge, get a court order ordering the bank manager to let them in, and they would get access. I don’t think anyone would have a problem with that. How is this different in any significant way? Maybe it is different but at this point I don’t see how.
The truth is that if Apple & Silicon valley are selling Industrial Grade Encryption, they are in violation of existing Law….That grade is not exportable and comes with more than a marketing glib
claim…ALL encryption depends on a probability measure of difficulty…
Time to end the stupidity of Silicon valley that “pretends” to provide security in TOYS…
The Market for California diddly are Drug Cartels & Terrorists. The time to break each & Every Encryption scheme overwhelms Federal resources..
NO EXPORT of Industrial Grade Encryption…and jail those that violate the law
the ghost of j edgar hoover the cross dresser lives on, fondly remembering the bonanza of information dug up by the illegal wiretaps and millions of incidents of informants put under severe threat of prosecution, hounding, stalking ‘enemies’, turning the great society into a police state.
why couldn’t anybody get rid of that bug eyed abomination? because he had the ‘goods’ on EVERYONE. that is what the FIB wants again. the ‘terrorist’ angle is just a ruse. they are showing their true colours yet again. dominate, monitor and control ALL aspects of information exchange, finances, communication of all manner.
the technology has the potential of making the FIB 20 times, nay, 50 times worse than the KGB. is that what you want mr ‘I gots nuthin’ to hide have at ‘er’?
give them that access, that unprecedented capability and it WILL be abused massively. the FIB is manned by flawed humahns itching to once again get the ‘goods’ on EVERYONE, this time including foreigners in *their* land.
this is like the judges that ORDER a reporter or whistle blower to identify their anonymous source. oh ya, it works that one time, but it puts a gigantic chill on any and all future bean spillers knowing they can be outed. solve one ‘problem’ by creating multiple thousands more. just like the politishuns who give the judges that power.
Yeah, I don’t see the difference either. Also seems irresponsible of Apple to create an OS whereby it’s possible to construct a program which would be a key to every phone. Like making safety deposit boxes all with the same key.
But, as someone else pointed out, it’s just a toy. Not a very serious issue.
another thing, back in the days when I was up to my elbows in the Intel-Microslop architecture, I surmised a scenario with my fellow geeks to whit, what if the mfgs got together with the gubbamint and added secret memory addresses out of reach of the applications s/w, putting highly secret OS code there which could monitor and report on the activities on any given desktop?
it was all hypothetical ‘conspiracy’ ‘spy’ stuff but it did give pause to some of the more skilled and technically adept audience. seriously; memory storage does NOT have to be contiguous. that’s where my scenario started, and finished by concluding those in power will stop at nothing to maintain that power. looks like my ‘prediction’ has come true in some aspects.
naturally, it’s all fobbed off as part of ‘national security’. that’s the guaranteed sales pitch. same one that worked for the Nazis, i.e. ‘we’re doing this in the interests of the nation, we need a free hand to look anywhere we want to root out the enemy’. I still say no one has surpassed Goebbels in his understanding how propaganda works. The man was truly an exceptional genius in gift wrapping the Nazi ideology to the gullible and resentful German people.
my final verdict on all this? fits like a glove with prophesy of the end times. we ARE headed for a police state where freedom of expression and privacy, fundamental rights, personal choice are ALL anachronisms. surrendered in the interests of ‘public safety’ or some such claptrap.
Its not Just one safety deposit box. Apple is being asked by the US for a master key for ALL the safety deposit boxes. There is no way for Apple to unlock one phone. They are being forced to rewrite the OS to de-encrypt ALL iPhone 5 OS. Once they are able to succeed ALL OS are fair game.
The problem with Apple giving up the encryption of its phone OS to the FBI is that the argument Apple has made to China, Iran, Russia and any other repressive regime is lost.
A court within any country can force Apple to give up encryption keys to the current regime and future regimes.
The NSA, FBI and Homeland have trampled on innocent civilians rights in order to obtain intel.
Snowden reported NSA and affiliated contractors were easily looking through personal data and very personal photos of civilians who did no wrong. These agencies have placed the gathering and dissemination of intel into the hands of people who have no conscience or regard for the rights of its citizenry.
Actually, this is becoming an issue for bookkeepers and accountants in Canada. Various programs are promoting “cloud” computing. There are several concerns with this. The first is where is the data stored. If it’s in the US, it’s subject to the patriot act. The second issue deals with what happens to the data should one decide to no longer use the service. In traditional service contracts, the data is stored on a local server and so is available – subject to licencing regulations – after a contract is finished. In the cloud – not so much.
This could be a false flag story too.
Publically, Apple gives a huge FU to the FBI, no way in Hades do we co-operate, etc etc etc
Behind the scenes, full compliance, and the mooks are slowly and silently taken out, with no fanfare.
Stranger things have happened
I also think that the FBI has handled this wrong. Because they want to maintain the chain of evidence they must own the encryption keys. In this circumstance if they were to privately approach Apple and have them unlock this particular phone (with a high courts ruling) I wouldn’t be entirely opposed. Terrorism within a free society must be destroyed.
I go back to my earlier comment. What is wrong with profiling terrorists?? Why do the rights of all citizens have to be bent in order to satisfy the progressives agenda???
That makes sense. In order to continue to say FU to China, Iran et all.
Riiiiiiight … Apple is sooooo looking out for your security and privacy … thank you for carrrrring so much for all us little people, Timmahy ! And if you believe that, I have an “all new” iPhone 9 with week-long battery life for ONLY $ 2,750.00 … come and get em … suckahs. What’s that ? you don’t have a job and can’t afford it, because of all the H1-b Visa workers slaving-away for high tech in America ? Tough shite, LOSER!
There is no way for Apple to unlock one phone.
Yes, that’s what I was pointing out. Rather irresponsible to create so many locks that could be opened with the same key. Poor engineering.
Apple is plainly in the wrong. This is a criminal case, not a privacy issue. The FBI has a valid search warrant and court order. Apple will have to comply. The legal situation is explained by Patterico:
http://patterico.com/2016/02/19/the-apple-iphone-and-the-san-bernardino-shooters-its-not-what-youve-been-told/
I don’t buy that there is no way to unlock just one phone. My phone is “locked” by a 4 digit numeric code. If you have that code you have access to all my data (which isn’t much). I think this is all the police are looking for. If they get that four digit code, or fingerprint or what ever then they get access to his calendar app and contacts list. That is all they are looking for. In the past it would have been his “daytimer” or address book, now it’s his phone.
Isn’t the encryption that people are talking about intended to stop people from steeling you data while that data is in transit? Isn’t intended to stop people from steeling you banking data by sitting on the road in front of you house while you do online banking and capturing your account information? If someone has my computer, has my passowrd and my bank card, they have access to my bank data. If your documents are stored in “the cloud” they are encrypted so people can’t steel your data from the cloud. But if you have my login name and password you have access to my documents, unless I am using some device specific encryption software, and even then, you are only a password away from the data.
Anyone who thinks that anything they store on someone else’s property is private, is an idiot. The reason Apple, Google, etc want the cloud is so they can scan and view that data. In all the fine print it says when it comes down to it, hey own the hardware, and in that case they hold everything that is on it.
Cloud computing is a big promise of access anywhere, but it really is access to your data by whomever is holding it. I said this 3-4 years ago when they started the big push.
As well, if a court order is given, apple should use the keys and open the lock. I think Apple’s concern is that Gov’t agencies can learn how to make the keys and then they can open the lock whenever they want without a court order to determine if they want to spend the time to get the court order. I don’t think any bank would hand over their SD keys to the police so they can make copies, and so it should be with the electronic devices.
However I also wonder what Apple wants to charge them fee wise to open the door?
The FBI can turn on any iPhone remotely and use the camera and microphone for surveillance. This capability has been exposed in court, despite the FBI trying to keep it secret.
The FBI can also track the position of any iPhone, when it is turned on. So if they can’t see stradivarious, they turn his iPhone on. Oh look, there he is.
The NSA famously records and keeps the records of every internet packet and cell-tower ping in the Western world. They don’t need to crack the actual phone, they already have every bit it ever transmitted in their database. But they can’t admit that in court. It’s too soon.
If you think the FBI can’t crack the miserable four digit code on an iPhone you are seriously deluded. There’s a box issued to state and city level police highway patrol officers that will crack and download the contents of a cellphone on the side of the road during a traffic stop. They couldn’t get one of those?
What they want here is a crack they can safely admit to in court, and they want to be seen pushing Apple around.
The FBI can also track the position of any iPhone, when it is turned on. So if they can’t see stradivarious, they turn his iPhone on. Oh look, there he is.
Heh, never know, they might learn some wisdom…
Anyway, if you know this, presumably Apple does as well. Which means they’re either complicit or negligent.