Based on all the cases of Canadians being charged after protecting themselves, is it incorrect to assume that this young woman would have been charged north of the U.S. border?
Based on all the cases of Canadians being charged after protecting themselves, is it incorrect to assume that this young woman would have been charged north of the U.S. border?
Speak for yourself, dragmann.
Crown prosecutors and liberals force Canadians to…shoot…shovel…and shut-up! It does happen here. Lots of forrest, prairie and ocean to get rid of the home invader that meets his fair and just reward.
Generally good points sasquatch…
Though when I told the Federal Court of Appeal, in respect of my son’s type 1 diabetes, that I could think of a number of ways to ‘demonstrate a group of vital organs failing’ (according to Revenue Canada letterhead), accompanied by a number of photographs by family members in uniform, it seemed to get them somewhat exercised, when I suggested none of the ways involved family members.
The learned justices said ‘it may construed as a threat’. Well no kidding…
Perhaps, Revenue Canada shouldn’t be so monumentally stupid in sending out ‘love letters from Dr. Mengele’.
All very comedic considering these clowns take an oath to the Crown and the Crown knighted Sir Frederick Banting for ‘prolonging the lives of millions’ according to the bronze plaque at the University of Toronto.
As for trusting government clowns with your life, they would be among the very last…
Thus far I have yet to be arrested.
Cheers
Hans Rupprecht, Commander in Chief
1st Saint Nicolaas Army
Army Group “True North”
james says “Almost shocking to hear these two liberal journos on side with this.”
Yeah, that was a surprise. But don’t worry….the clucking hens on “The View” will take a run at it.
I know its only January, but she’s definitely mother of the year!
Damn, she was just as calm as a rattle snake.
I wonder what the last thing going thru his brain was, oh yea, I know, it was buckshot.
,
Sadly if we did that in Canada we’d be arrested on murder charges, and in Eurabia you’d be locked up for a lifetime whilst the perp’s family sued you into poverty. Another reason to hate liberals, they expect us to roll up into the fetal position until the cops show up if they show up atall.
The police are only a phone call away…so keep your 12 gauge between your bed and your telephone.
In Canada she would be completely within the criminal code definition of a rightful armed self defense – but she would be arrested and charged with both firearms act violations and criminal assault – until she puts up enough bucks to buy the type of legal defense that will get the charges dropped. Ultimatly the crow would conceed or the bench would rule this defense to be proper and reasonable, but not befre the victim had spent 20 grand or more trying to get justice from a legal system which has as its core directive the abuse and repression of civil liberty.
You tell me what message the cops are sending out to citizens when a rightful CCC authorized armed defense resuts in arrest and indictment.
Friggin’ fascists.
Joey said: “But don’t worry….the clucking hens on “The View” will take a run at it.”
Dude! That comment is an insult to poultry everywhere. Those women are harpies.
Now, sasquatch has brought up a pet peeve of mine. “The basic doctrine of “necessary force” is predicated on both the defender and the assailant…..hence what is reasonable.”
The “doctrine of necessary force” in Canadian law is nothing more than Monday morning armchair quarterbacking. It necessarily assumes that the man on the spot (you and me, right?) cannot be trusted to do the right thing, and so our split-second decisions in the heat of a gunfight shall be examined afterward by -lawyers- in the comfort of the judge’s chambers. At length.
Its a fancy way of imposing “guilty until proven innocent” without actually saying so.
Its also completely insane, because the human mind does not function normally or reasonably during life threatening situations. Sometimes higher intellectual functions don’t operate at all, and it is impossible to tell ahead of time who’s going to “see red” and go berserk. That’s neurology, not ideology.
That’s why the power of the judiciary to second guess people in this regard is totalitarian and must be removed. The “castle doctrine” is the proper way to go about that, IMHO. Absent actual -evidence- of foul play, castle doctrine compels the Crown to accept the judgement of the man on the spot.
That’s the proper role of the Crown in a free country where people have actual rights. The “doctrine of necessary force” is for serfs who have to be kept in line by their betters.
Langmann >
Relax and pull your panties up, I could care less about gays. It’s just a sure way to bait “alex” into another mindless defence of liberalism on yet another thread. That or use Christianity of course.
BTW it’s has to be a pretty gay cop to take a gopher hunter down on his families driveway and poke his rectum for awhile. Just say’n.
Langmann >
Relax and pull your panties up, I could care less about gays. It’s just a sure way to bait “aalex” into another mindless defence of liberalism on yet another thread. That or use Christianity of course.
BTW it’s has to be a pretty gay cop to take a gopher hunter down on his families driveway and poke his rectum for awhile. Just say’n.
Was in Oak Harbor, Washington, at an ACE hardware, where the fastest selling firearm was a hot pink .38 special. Clerk told me it was $25 to license and $25 to carry it concealed. He was proud to say he couldn’t remember the last time he heard of a store robbery or street mugging. It’s amazing what a deterrent it is to someone who is looking for a “crime of opportunity” when they don’t know who may be packing.
Mama Bear protecting her cub.
nice grouping
Sarah
I am guessing these two journos were on board because they live in Oklahoma, and know they would probably lose their jobs if they didn’t.
Moosemilk said: “It’s amazing what a deterrent it is to someone who is looking for a “crime of opportunity” when they don’t know who may be packing.”
This is why the crime rate always goes down in stated that pass “shall issue” concealed carry laws. The number of rapes, armed robberies, murders AND shootings all go down together. Because , DUH!, you don’t have to actually shoot a guy to scare him away, do you?
We have no guns in our home, but I have strategically placed golf clubs. I wonder how that would fly if an intruder earned himself a divot?.
Golf clubs- very effective! Just ask Tiger.
$50 million effective! Just ask Elan.
Polly >
Blunt instruments are the #3 choice of murder weapons in the US according to the FBI and the number #1 murder weapon of choice for the Hells Angels.
That said, you can’t be wrong in such company, unless you have bad aim and weak arms.
Unfortunately Canadian law considers a weapon a weapon, even martial art skills. The good news for those that do prefer to crack skulls manually is that there is a greater penalty for doing it cleanly and efficiently with a firearm than using a blunt instrument.
Which of course is bad news for older or weaker, possibly disabled people who have difficulty swinging bats against 250lbs drugged out assailants.
The proposed amendments to clarify the citizen’s arrest provisions of the criminal code, neither mention nor alter the anti self-defence Cdn. Firearms Act and regulations.
It is designed to assist defending citizens who outnumber (the Toronto Chen grocery store case) or who are stronger than their attackers. Look, it was proposed by Olivia Chow NDP Member of Parliament. Stephen Harper realized it was popular in Toronto and decided to back the idea.
The Harper Conservatives have made no move what so ever to recognize citizens right to armed self-defence. To date they remain with Kim Campbell and Alan Rock in that regard.
Not every life is precious. Good riddance.
Make sure the cops see that there is a warning shot hole in the ceiling or floor.
Whether the warning shot comes first or second is up to you…
Larry >
I think it’ll take many single steps to gain back the Canadian right to defend themselves after decades of Liberal rule and gradual domestication.
If anything the country needs more foreign people to be assaulted and offended at the liberal laws to have any voice for the rest of us these days in Canada. They apparently are the only ones allowed Human Rights and an ear from government.
GOOD FOR HER!!!
what I like about Oklamhoma law is that the perp’s accomplis has been charged with murder one, as he was caught committing a crime that ended up causing a death, just got to luv that:-))))
GYM >
“…the perp’s accomplis has been charged with murder one,…”
Yea, but if they did that every lefty in Canada that advocated gun bans for law abiding citizens would be accomplices and go to jail for murder one every time a citizen was murdered. Why you think they won’t go for that law here?
These stories remind me of an Edmonton lady killed in her on home.Early ’90’s I think. Stabbed by an intruder whose name is meaningless.
HER name was Barb Danellesko. I’ve never forgotten that incident.
Castle Law.Governments can’t take it away!
Shoot on sight.
gobi desert, The interesting thing about living in the US is when the media presents these kind of self defence stories, quite often it is done in that manner – without judgement of the victim and without any sense of suprise regarding the use of a gun. There isn’t the usual tsk tsk’ing that media up here seems to do whenever someone has to use violence to defend themselves.
Gym, That’s actually part of old English law, felony murder rule I believe. And yeah you do have to love it, and in some ways it seems just.
Knight, yeah well you’re not doing anyone any favors and Alex can be a goof without help most of the time.
gobi desert, The interesting thing about living in the US is when the media presents these kind of self defence stories, quite often it is done in that manner – without judgement of the victim and without any sense of suprise regarding the use of a gun. There isn’t the usual tsk tsk’ing that media up here seems to do whenever someone has to use violence to defend themselves.
Gym, That’s actually part of old English law, felony murder rule I believe. And yeah you do have to love it, and in some ways it seems just.
Knight, yeah well you’re not doing anyone any favors and aAlex can be a goof without help most of the time.
I guess the murderers name was Sonny Head,30 some year-old POS.
Langmann >
“yeah well you’re not doing anyone any favors”….. by sticking to the politically correct anal retentive bullcrap that has gotten us into this mess in the first place.
I’m tired of politely watching the liberal left snatch our freedoms while we politely stand by. Excuse me if I start to point out that I don’t agree with cops sticking their fingers up a gun owner’s ass on his property because he was out shooting gophers. If I want to humiliate these bastards in the most uncivilized way, then so be it. The polite alternative over the last 30 years hasn’t worked very well so far has it?
You don’t need to speak for me or any others by taking some politically correct moral high ground. We’ve watched and have seen the end results. I can do diplomacy, but the gloves are off for political correctness, it was never our cultural forte’.
Have to agree with Phantom’s reasoning on the citizen possessing an absolute right to shoot anyone who has entered the home. We all know that criminals know the law, and adjust there behavior according to the probability of meaningful punishment. As to the one in a million case where, under an absolute castle doctrine, a drunk tries to break into a home, thinking it is his own ( and without criminal intent ) and is killed by the homeowner, that is no more an argument against the doctrine, than the death of innocent people on the highway is an argument for shutting down the highways to prevent such deaths. The castle doctrine should be absolute, because the right of a citizen to security within his abode is absolute.
In fact, a law that sets explicit conditions for self-defense in the home is de facto a constitutional negation of any innate right of the individual to life, because innate rights are by definition unlimited.
The US Congress should institute a civilian marksmanship badge for shotgun, and give one to this lady, as an official recognition by the people of the US of the importance of a well-armed, and arms proficient citizenry. Accompanying it with an official award for excellence in motherhood would also be a nice touch. I hope her hometown, her family, and everyone she knows celebrates her for protecting her child, and herself.
@ small c conservative
From what I saw on the news she is being hailed as a hero in her town and inundated with gifts for both she and her baby. Unlike our “hold on to the power trip at any cost” police, the cops in her town personally congratulated her and are doing extra patrols around her neighborhood to comfort her. How refreshing that they put a honest citizen above human garbage like we do here.
“Make sure the cops see that there is a warning shot hole in the ceiling or floor.”
Good comment Stan. My neighbor was a retired RCMP cop who confirmed your point. As long as there is an indication you gave a warning to the creep breaking into your house you are free of being charged.
He confirmed that as long as their is a hole in the roof the cops won’t be able to establish whether it got there before or after you blew the head off of the miscreant.
Remember, splash the brains, shoot the roof, call the cops, relax.
P.S. Retired cop also said make sure the miscreant is DEAD.
Wounded and you’ve a big problem.
The Phantom at January 6, 2012 4:37 PM
Well reasoned.
WOW, it’s pretty frigging scary that in 2012 people actually debate whether or not they can shoot someone breaking into their home!
Your F_cking forefathers would not only twist in their graves they should come out and slap you one side up the head!
How come no one is asking the question, “what was her German Shepherd doing during all this?”
Shepherds, even the betas, have an intimidating bark. The intruders would have had to have been quite determined to ignore a gs barking its head off if it was inside, esp. if they were only armed with a knife.
Sadistic Eristic >
Great point.
JMD, your comments about oxycontin make as much sense as banning guns because all they do is kill people.
In a self-defense situation the first rule is protect yourself however you consider necessary and, as others have noted, it’s far better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6. Also, in Canada, there is a provision in the firearms act that one can keep loaded firearms around when one has a problem with varmints and I can see a lot more justification for shooting 2 legged varmints than 4 legged ones as the 2 legged variety are far more destructive.
As far as citizens arrest powers go, we already have that power to arrest someone who is performing a criminal act. I’ve posted this before, but if one tells a criminal caught in the act of breaking into ones house that you’re making a citizens arrest, you are entitled to use whatever force is necessary to effect that arrest. If that means blowing the POS’s brains out, that is allowed – especially if the POS attempts to attack you. Just don’t tell the judge that you shot to kill – say you shot to stop and a head shot is far more likely to stop a criminal in their tracks than a leg shot.
Loki,
Great points loki.
People also need to remember “SLASH don’t stab” if your gun jams or is grabbed and you need your backup or EDC knife.
Anyone chosen to sit on jury duty should be aware that they are free to decide the fate of those charged, in spite of, and independent of whatever the judge’s instructions are.
With that in mind, she wouldn’t be convicted with me on the jury, and I do think she’d be charged with something in Canada.
One word: “Justified”
Let me tell you guys something.
I LIKE the couch. I got my beers, my nibblies and my arse positioned for optimum relaxation and if left alone, all will be just hunky-dory for everyone.
But if I ever…EVER…see a young mom like that being hung out to dry by some liberal meat hole of a judge – or his lickspittles in the jury – I will get up off my couch, get my own rifle – and I will head down to the court house in a VERY bad mood.
Just sayin’. It’s in everyone’s best interest for the courts to dispense justice and not liberal a$$ hattery!
marc in calgary “Anyone chosen to sit on jury duty should be aware that they are free to decide the fate of those charged, in spite of, and independent of whatever the judge’s instructions are.”
This is something to remember. The defence lawyer is not allowed to tell the jury that they can totally ignore the law and the judge won’t. Juries seem to think they can recommend things to judges. They can’t. Their discretion is in finding guilty/not guilty. There is also a danger in finding someone guilty of a lesser offence because the judge usually sentences to the maximum. If you think someone is a bit guilty – find him not guilty.
Interesting. Here in Calgary around March 2011, a police officer shot a man who was approaching him in a dark yard carrying a screwdriver.
The chief called it justified because the officer had just completed a high speed chase after the man, who then approached the officer. And the chief said that the officer was no longer the aggressor in that situation – this meant he was justified.
I can’t put myself in the cop’s position – but it makes me wonder – why is it OK for a cop to shoot when they are being approached but not an innocent homeowner?
This tells me loud and clear – two sets of rules.
Knight 99 at January 7, 2012 4:11 AM:
People also need to remember “SLASH don’t stab” if your gun jams or is grabbed and you need your backup or EDC knife.
What’s the rationale for that, Knight?
R. Ed Neck at January 7, 2012 12:26 PM:
Interesting. Here in Calgary around March 2011, a police officer shot a man who was approaching him in a dark yard carrying a screwdriver.
…
why is it OK for a cop to shoot when they are being approached but not an innocent homeowner?
Maybe “approaching him” in this case means “sprinting toward him at full speed from out of the shadows”.
There was some case years ago here in the States, in Philadelphia IIRC, of a woman who was shot in her own kitchen by cops. The usual suspects raised a hoot-and-a-holler about it, but the woman, who weighed about 400 lbs., had charged the police officer from 10 ft. away while wielding a large kitchen knife.
The police do need to be watched since the nature of their positions can make any misbehavior on their part horribly unjust or even fatal, but I think everyone should keep in mind that there is a well-trained, well-organized group of professional agitators who make it their business to condemn every action taken or not taken by a member of law enforcement and who do not hesitate to distort or misrepresent events to do so. Sadly, those agitators tend to get a lot of cooperation, sometimes deliberate, sometimes not, from the media.
Sadistic Eristic >
Slashing is usually considered defensive by courts, stabbing offensive.