Best shot of the beginning of the crash @ .53. Great still shot @ 3:10 & best shot of crash near the stands @ 3:27
33 Replies to “Hell Bent For Success Part II”
Why oh why oh why is the pilot of a crashed aircraft always a ‘hero’. This aircraft was out of control and the pilot was along for the ride. If an aircraft crashes into a school yard, the pilot is a hero for missing the building – I can say quite frankly that I would rather hit the grass than the @#$%^ building. This was a tragic accident likely caused by the failure of the elevator trim tab if the still photos are to be believed, and I do.
Rob, no offence, but a better choice of words for this tragic event would be fitting.
As in “best shot” makes it a bit like a circus event, not a tragic death.
‘Best shot’ would be the burnt kid in the wheel chair.
Sorry, have friends who were there and still awaiting to hear if they escaped.
Aviator
As I understand it these aircraft are highly modified to maximize speed and the loss of the elevator trim tab would make the pitch axis difficult to control at speed.
The age and physical strength of the pilot may have exacerbated an already bad situation.
That’s life and in this case death.
Sad but stuff happens.
Yes, I have to agree that “best shot” and “great shot” are an extremely poor choice of words.
This will probably end this event for keeps….too many accidents….
Then there is the simple principle that air racing on an oval makes the standard safety technique impractical….
ALL air shows now observe the principle that at no time is energy directed towards the spectators….this negates Newton’s first law of motion if a pilot loses control…….
I have no issues with air show safety, because I don’t care to go to them. No need to add my voice to regulating others safety at air shows. If worried about safety simply turn the channel by doing something else for the day.
Was the guy a hero? It’s USA 2011 unless he was a visible minority he doesn’t qualify by default.
Y’know, life is a funny thing – my son and I had left our seats in that section not 1 minute earlier to get a jump on the crowds for our bus. We would have been about 100 feet from the crash. Not that we WOULD have been injured, but it does make one think…
Reno was a very somber place Friday nite after the sirens settled down.
I am told this may be the end of the line for shows like Reno. I hope that is not the case, but if it is – then I am glad I got to see them at least once.
more than 37,000 deaths a year due to drug over dose, and more than half of those were by prescription drugs, so lets stop air racing were the death count is ALMOST zilch
The guy was a hero for strapping on that plane in the first place. I looked him up, he was The Real Deal. He did his best to miss the stands, and missed most of it. Sad for the people who died.
When you go to watch the races, even the car races, you have to accept you could -die-. People sometimes do. Get hit by a wheel, chunk of shrapnel from a blown engine, these things happen. Racing isn’t safe, only idiots pretend it is. Not safe for the races or the spectators. Wanna be safe, stay home.
Life isn’t safe. In fact it is invariably fatal over the long haul. Its sad, but its still true. No amount of government regulation is going to make it safe either. We are mortal. Deal with it.
Don’t know if the pilot was conscience, but if so, his last thoughts were about avoiding the spectators.
again “best shot” “great shot” isn’t describing a triumphant moment, Rob, nine people died there and many were sliced up or burned, be more mature or don’t post.
We can’t regulate death away.Particularly sporting events of all kinds. You can bet these shows are over. They are disappearing just like telephone booths.
As for the Pilot, we will have to wait for the report.
Horrible ending for Reno & its people.
I was at the mouth of the Niagara River in, um, 1990 when I heard a highly recognizable but rare sound, a P51. I turned around just in time to spot the pilot bank left, ie west over the lake.
a couple years later a P51 crash was reported and I had a bad feeling it was this one. I think we should retire all the remaining WWII planes, focussing all attention on just a few each year to be flown.
CEO
“I think we should retire all the remaining WWII planes”
if you thought, you wouldn’t post such stupid drivel
No guts no glory…no glory no guts…simple equation.
The day after this occurred I attended an air show at Mountain Home AFB, Idaho. Everything there occurred perfectly.
While I have great sympathy for those hurt and for the loved ones of those who died, I certainly hope the standard knee-jerk reaction of “canceling all future air shows” doesn’t occur.
The P-51 is a beautiful aircraft. I don’t know
how modified Leeward’s was – off the production line the
later models could do 450 mph in level flight – a
powerful beast. Probable speed at impact might have
been well above 500 mph. The kinetic energy is
very great. There is a reason why the Red Bull
races use lighter slower aircraft but there is more thrill with the P-51.
“a couple years later a P51 crash was reported and I had a bad feeling it was this one. I think we should retire all the remaining WWII planes, focussing all attention on just a few each year to be flown.”
Really all you have to do is spend your own money to buy them up and you’re free to do this. But you knew that right?
Between this and all the stage collapses, is this the year to stay at home?
Oh and don’t forget that dead satellite about to crash somewhere soon. Really folks, quit jumping on the bandwagon every time there is an accident. And equating the accident to the P-51 being a WW2 plane is bull tweet as these aircraft do have to comply and pass FAA regulations. Heck, there is even a Canadian Air Carrier that flies older aircraft.
Texas Canuck
More than just one air carrier…. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_DC-3
“The very large number of civil and military operators of the DC-3, C-47, and related types means that a listing of all the airlines, air forces and other current operators is impractical.”
Probably more DC3/C47 were built than any other type..ever…and despite 70-75 years of attrition many are still in regular service….showing “zero accumulated fatigue damage.” Many have been been repowered with various modern turboprops…
Originally designed for a maximum tackoff weight of 27,000 lb they regularly tipped the scales at over 34,000 at takeoff from Belem, Brazil on the WW2 South Atlantic ferry run……
P51’s were designed and built from the get-go to withstand the incredible stress involved in air-combat….
hey monkeygym, you missed this part: “focussing all attention on just a few each year to be flown.”
feel free to suggest we keep letting them splat into the unforgiving terra firma and also burn up like they did at Hamilton airport until they’re all gone.
in the mean time feel free to fcuk off.
This thing was so modified, it’s really a stetch to even call it a P51, clipped wings, modified fuselage to accomodate the replacement canopy. ETC ETC. The only claim this plane had to it roots any more was it’s power plant. A Rolls Royce Merlin V12 produced under license by Packard.
@ CEO:
We should probably also ban breathing.
Re “the bear”: the modifications sure were extreme: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Galloping_Ghost_%28airplane%29
However, it still looked like a P-51; and the most distinctive feature of the P-51 is not
so obvious: it is the use of the NAA/NACA 45-100 laminar flow airfoil. If that hadn’t been modified
I’d still be inclined to call the “Galloping Ghost” a Mustang.
John, I’m a bit too much of a purist, I don’t even consider Mk XXIV Spitfires to be “real” LOL. Maybe a bit extreme given the obvious connection to the original. As an aside, many people do not even realize that the P51’s roots also lie with the Spitfire.
America’s version of the running of the bulls. I’ve been to one airshow, and it doesn’t take a genius to figure out there are risks. There was a P-51 at the show I attended, and it was the star of the show. It was a vintage plane(no modifications), and it did a low level fly over at full throttle. Kind of stole the show from the Snowbirds.
CEO, are you suggesting a partial ban is somehow an acceptable solution? Naah, you couldn’t be that obtuse. Bubble wrap anyone?
Last night I commented – it failed to be posted – and after stating that I normally refrain from commenting on aircraft accidents until after the facts are in, I continued to say that i agreed with Aviator; It appeared to be a primary flight control failure. Tonight, after dinner I glimpsed a still photo of a vertically descending P-51 with no driver visible in the canopy. It’s looking like there may be more to the accident than first blush.
My thoughts are with the families that lost loved ones.
CEO said: “I think we should retire all the remaining WWII planes, focussing all attention on just a few each year to be flown.”
“They took all the trees,
Put ’em in a tree museum.
And they charged the people
a dollar and a half just to see ’em.”
Behold, the very base, fundamental thought process of the modern liberal. Translation: “You people can’t be trusted with these valuable antiques. The all-knowing, all-seeing government must regulate your access to make sure you don’t break something, because you are stupid and must be controlled. No sparrow shall fall!”
Yes CEO, we know what you think. All things in life must be regulated, all money must be appropriated to pay for it. That’s why we work for your defeat and the ouster of your party from government.
Aircraft from the Canadian Warplane Heritage fly directly over my house pretty much daily. Last week I was treated to the sight of a Mitchel bomber, Harvards, a Stearman, a Westland Lysander, a Hawker Sea Fury and a Hudson. Oddly, I did not feel moved to phone them up and threaten them for flying those ancient things over my house. On the contrary, I ran outside to watch.
If they all crash over the years, I’m very sure the CWH and men all over the world will build -more-. There are Sopwith Camels and ME-262s still flying. What can be made once can be made again.
YOU Mr. CEO are a fine example of everything that sucks about this socialist state we laughingly call a free country. I look forward to thwarting your every controlling impulse, starting with this coming election.
The Phantom – you do know that there are absolutely no known blueprints of the early Spitfires right? I’m not saying don’t fly them, but it’s foolish to believe that we can make exact replica’s of something no longer has a plan in existence.
the bear said: “…it’s foolish to believe that we can make exact replica’s of something no longer has a plan in existence.”
Bear, there’s a re-manufactured Bolingbroke sitting almost finished in the Canadian Warplane Heritage hangar. They’re going to be flying it in the not too distant future. They built it out of a bunch of wrecks and hand-made most of it. You think they had the plans for every little piece of that thing? Not.
You can measure one and build new parts from that. People do it all the time, its called reverse engineering.
In fact, these days you can generate a wire-frame of anything you can take a picture of with your cell phone. Take it from several angles, send the file to somebody who has the program, poof! Instant plans. Good to a couple thousandths they tell me. Good enough for a milling machine to punch out a copy.
Besides, sooner or later somebody will have to start making Merlin engines. they don’t last forever no matter how well you take care of them. Neither do propellers, or tires, etc. All that stuff gets made new all the time.
Besides, when a Mark I Spitfire flies overhead, do you care if its a 100% perfect rivet for rivet copy? I don’t.
Why oh why oh why is the pilot of a crashed aircraft always a ‘hero’. This aircraft was out of control and the pilot was along for the ride. If an aircraft crashes into a school yard, the pilot is a hero for missing the building – I can say quite frankly that I would rather hit the grass than the @#$%^ building. This was a tragic accident likely caused by the failure of the elevator trim tab if the still photos are to be believed, and I do.
Rob, no offence, but a better choice of words for this tragic event would be fitting.
As in “best shot” makes it a bit like a circus event, not a tragic death.
‘Best shot’ would be the burnt kid in the wheel chair.
Sorry, have friends who were there and still awaiting to hear if they escaped.
Aviator
As I understand it these aircraft are highly modified to maximize speed and the loss of the elevator trim tab would make the pitch axis difficult to control at speed.
The age and physical strength of the pilot may have exacerbated an already bad situation.
That’s life and in this case death.
Sad but stuff happens.
Yes, I have to agree that “best shot” and “great shot” are an extremely poor choice of words.
This will probably end this event for keeps….too many accidents….
Then there is the simple principle that air racing on an oval makes the standard safety technique impractical….
ALL air shows now observe the principle that at no time is energy directed towards the spectators….this negates Newton’s first law of motion if a pilot loses control…….
I have no issues with air show safety, because I don’t care to go to them. No need to add my voice to regulating others safety at air shows. If worried about safety simply turn the channel by doing something else for the day.
Was the guy a hero? It’s USA 2011 unless he was a visible minority he doesn’t qualify by default.
Y’know, life is a funny thing – my son and I had left our seats in that section not 1 minute earlier to get a jump on the crowds for our bus. We would have been about 100 feet from the crash. Not that we WOULD have been injured, but it does make one think…
Reno was a very somber place Friday nite after the sirens settled down.
I am told this may be the end of the line for shows like Reno. I hope that is not the case, but if it is – then I am glad I got to see them at least once.
more than 37,000 deaths a year due to drug over dose, and more than half of those were by prescription drugs, so lets stop air racing were the death count is ALMOST zilch
The guy was a hero for strapping on that plane in the first place. I looked him up, he was The Real Deal. He did his best to miss the stands, and missed most of it. Sad for the people who died.
When you go to watch the races, even the car races, you have to accept you could -die-. People sometimes do. Get hit by a wheel, chunk of shrapnel from a blown engine, these things happen. Racing isn’t safe, only idiots pretend it is. Not safe for the races or the spectators. Wanna be safe, stay home.
Life isn’t safe. In fact it is invariably fatal over the long haul. Its sad, but its still true. No amount of government regulation is going to make it safe either. We are mortal. Deal with it.
Don’t know if the pilot was conscience, but if so, his last thoughts were about avoiding the spectators.
again “best shot” “great shot” isn’t describing a triumphant moment, Rob, nine people died there and many were sliced up or burned, be more mature or don’t post.
We can’t regulate death away.Particularly sporting events of all kinds. You can bet these shows are over. They are disappearing just like telephone booths.
As for the Pilot, we will have to wait for the report.
Horrible ending for Reno & its people.
I was at the mouth of the Niagara River in, um, 1990 when I heard a highly recognizable but rare sound, a P51. I turned around just in time to spot the pilot bank left, ie west over the lake.
a couple years later a P51 crash was reported and I had a bad feeling it was this one. I think we should retire all the remaining WWII planes, focussing all attention on just a few each year to be flown.
CEO
“I think we should retire all the remaining WWII planes”
if you thought, you wouldn’t post such stupid drivel
No guts no glory…no glory no guts…simple equation.
The day after this occurred I attended an air show at Mountain Home AFB, Idaho. Everything there occurred perfectly.
While I have great sympathy for those hurt and for the loved ones of those who died, I certainly hope the standard knee-jerk reaction of “canceling all future air shows” doesn’t occur.
The P-51 is a beautiful aircraft. I don’t know
how modified Leeward’s was – off the production line the
later models could do 450 mph in level flight – a
powerful beast. Probable speed at impact might have
been well above 500 mph. The kinetic energy is
very great. There is a reason why the Red Bull
races use lighter slower aircraft but there is more thrill with the P-51.
“a couple years later a P51 crash was reported and I had a bad feeling it was this one. I think we should retire all the remaining WWII planes, focussing all attention on just a few each year to be flown.”
Really all you have to do is spend your own money to buy them up and you’re free to do this. But you knew that right?
Between this and all the stage collapses, is this the year to stay at home?
Oh and don’t forget that dead satellite about to crash somewhere soon. Really folks, quit jumping on the bandwagon every time there is an accident. And equating the accident to the P-51 being a WW2 plane is bull tweet as these aircraft do have to comply and pass FAA regulations. Heck, there is even a Canadian Air Carrier that flies older aircraft.
Texas Canuck
More than just one air carrier….
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_DC-3
“The very large number of civil and military operators of the DC-3, C-47, and related types means that a listing of all the airlines, air forces and other current operators is impractical.”
Probably more DC3/C47 were built than any other type..ever…and despite 70-75 years of attrition many are still in regular service….showing “zero accumulated fatigue damage.” Many have been been repowered with various modern turboprops…
Originally designed for a maximum tackoff weight of 27,000 lb they regularly tipped the scales at over 34,000 at takeoff from Belem, Brazil on the WW2 South Atlantic ferry run……
P51’s were designed and built from the get-go to withstand the incredible stress involved in air-combat….
hey monkeygym, you missed this part: “focussing all attention on just a few each year to be flown.”
feel free to suggest we keep letting them splat into the unforgiving terra firma and also burn up like they did at Hamilton airport until they’re all gone.
in the mean time feel free to fcuk off.
This thing was so modified, it’s really a stetch to even call it a P51, clipped wings, modified fuselage to accomodate the replacement canopy. ETC ETC. The only claim this plane had to it roots any more was it’s power plant. A Rolls Royce Merlin V12 produced under license by Packard.
@ CEO:
We should probably also ban breathing.
Re “the bear”: the modifications sure were extreme:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Galloping_Ghost_%28airplane%29
However, it still looked like a P-51; and the most distinctive feature of the P-51 is not
so obvious: it is the use of the NAA/NACA 45-100 laminar flow airfoil. If that hadn’t been modified
I’d still be inclined to call the “Galloping Ghost” a Mustang.
John, I’m a bit too much of a purist, I don’t even consider Mk XXIV Spitfires to be “real” LOL. Maybe a bit extreme given the obvious connection to the original. As an aside, many people do not even realize that the P51’s roots also lie with the Spitfire.
America’s version of the running of the bulls. I’ve been to one airshow, and it doesn’t take a genius to figure out there are risks. There was a P-51 at the show I attended, and it was the star of the show. It was a vintage plane(no modifications), and it did a low level fly over at full throttle. Kind of stole the show from the Snowbirds.
CEO, are you suggesting a partial ban is somehow an acceptable solution? Naah, you couldn’t be that obtuse. Bubble wrap anyone?
Last night I commented – it failed to be posted – and after stating that I normally refrain from commenting on aircraft accidents until after the facts are in, I continued to say that i agreed with Aviator; It appeared to be a primary flight control failure. Tonight, after dinner I glimpsed a still photo of a vertically descending P-51 with no driver visible in the canopy. It’s looking like there may be more to the accident than first blush.
My thoughts are with the families that lost loved ones.
CEO said: “I think we should retire all the remaining WWII planes, focussing all attention on just a few each year to be flown.”
“They took all the trees,
Put ’em in a tree museum.
And they charged the people
a dollar and a half just to see ’em.”
Behold, the very base, fundamental thought process of the modern liberal. Translation: “You people can’t be trusted with these valuable antiques. The all-knowing, all-seeing government must regulate your access to make sure you don’t break something, because you are stupid and must be controlled. No sparrow shall fall!”
Yes CEO, we know what you think. All things in life must be regulated, all money must be appropriated to pay for it. That’s why we work for your defeat and the ouster of your party from government.
Aircraft from the Canadian Warplane Heritage fly directly over my house pretty much daily. Last week I was treated to the sight of a Mitchel bomber, Harvards, a Stearman, a Westland Lysander, a Hawker Sea Fury and a Hudson. Oddly, I did not feel moved to phone them up and threaten them for flying those ancient things over my house. On the contrary, I ran outside to watch.
If they all crash over the years, I’m very sure the CWH and men all over the world will build -more-. There are Sopwith Camels and ME-262s still flying. What can be made once can be made again.
YOU Mr. CEO are a fine example of everything that sucks about this socialist state we laughingly call a free country. I look forward to thwarting your every controlling impulse, starting with this coming election.
The Phantom – you do know that there are absolutely no known blueprints of the early Spitfires right? I’m not saying don’t fly them, but it’s foolish to believe that we can make exact replica’s of something no longer has a plan in existence.
the bear said: “…it’s foolish to believe that we can make exact replica’s of something no longer has a plan in existence.”
Bear, there’s a re-manufactured Bolingbroke sitting almost finished in the Canadian Warplane Heritage hangar. They’re going to be flying it in the not too distant future. They built it out of a bunch of wrecks and hand-made most of it. You think they had the plans for every little piece of that thing? Not.
You can measure one and build new parts from that. People do it all the time, its called reverse engineering.
In fact, these days you can generate a wire-frame of anything you can take a picture of with your cell phone. Take it from several angles, send the file to somebody who has the program, poof! Instant plans. Good to a couple thousandths they tell me. Good enough for a milling machine to punch out a copy.
Besides, sooner or later somebody will have to start making Merlin engines. they don’t last forever no matter how well you take care of them. Neither do propellers, or tires, etc. All that stuff gets made new all the time.
Besides, when a Mark I Spitfire flies overhead, do you care if its a 100% perfect rivet for rivet copy? I don’t.
purist phantom purist 😉 lol…
and just for CEO, happening @ Downsview TODAY!
http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1056639–canadian-air-and-space-museum-evicted?bn=1
Yep, CEO is clearly a Torontonian. In spirit if not in location.