145 Replies to “Influential Muslim Beheads Wife In Rijadh”
Well, I think that DN’s post is not relevant to this particular situation. He’s referring to radicalism, the radicalism of Islamic fascism and fundamentalism.
This is ONE situation, where a man kills his wife, and there is no logical process that we, without evidence, can use to declare that his action was due to his religion.
dp, I think your reduction of ‘Christians live in a guilt society’ and Muslims ‘live in an honour society’ is a bit too simplistic. I certainly agree that the Christian culture is focused on sin and guilt (particularly since Augustine!). It’s also focused on love and charity. And Islam, as a tribal culture, is indeed based on loyalty to the kin-group.
And it isn’t the case that all ‘white men’ (Non Muslims?) who kill their wives also commit suicide. I’m sure you know the data doesn’t show such a conclusion. Nor does ‘walking into a police station’ mean that they are bragging about it. Is running from the act, lying and denying it, found only among non-Muslims?
Again, because someone killed their wife, does NOT mean that this act was due to their religion. You can’t come to such a conclusion without evidence, just as you cannot say that because a priest abused young boys, it was due to his religion. Nor can you say that there is any ‘prediliction’ to do so within the Catholic religion.
Remember the old ‘correlation is not causation’.
ET,
Re;your 11:42 post.
I don’t think too many of us here are reading the incident in question as a man ‘killing his wife BECAUSE he is a muslim’.
The method, the target, and the history all led me to conclude he was muslim, even if not presented with this info ahead of time.
When I come across stories of child abuse, or molestation, I need plenty of background info to conclude which social strata, religion, culture, or geographical region the perpetrator comes from.
When stories of financial crimes come up, ditto.
The problem we’re having with your pseudo-defence of this man/ his background is the facts that you’re ignoring.
The Dennis Miller quote way up there in the comments fit best. Profiling has somehow taken on taboo status.
It’s not bad to atribute certain traits to chosen groups of society. It’s simply acknowledging ones experience with numerous examples.
Show me some data to start changing those ideas, and I’ll likely amend my ‘profile’.
For now, when stories like this come up, I’ll continue shaking my head in disgust at this seemingly backward, barbaric way of thinking…whether religious OR cultural.
Otherwise, I usually agree with your assesments on other issues.
Sam S.
To bring up the Greyhound beheading has got to be the limpest dicked attempt at ‘moral equivelancies’ I’ve ever seen.
Until we see a rash of beheadings of the good wives of Christian televangelists, ET’s cry of ‘But we are all beheaders’ is pure comedy.
I think if a news report leads with ‘MAN beheads WIFE’, there’s a 99 and 44 one hudredths percent chance that anyone with an IQ above ‘drooling village idiot’ can formulate that the husband also has the ’99 and 44′ odds of being named Mo’ either as his first, middle or surname and faces a certain shithole mid east city 5 times a day and prays to a pedophile prophet.
In an age of ‘let’s look for root causes’, it’s funny how many people seem content to just whistle while walking past the graveyard.
For someone allegedly ‘eduacated’, ET certainly isn’t very smart.
ET
Isn’t the debate, in a larger sense, all about cultural relativism?
Assumptions are a necessary part of daily existence, some are correct and some are faulty.
Based on the available evidence I choose to assume that this heinous act was in all likelihood the product of culture, ideology and psychology.
b_c @ 12:22 makes my point.
You, on the other hand, choose to assume that in this case cultural or ideological influences had no part in the outcome or at the very least a causal relationship is unprovable.
So be it, different assumptions produce different conclusions.
As far as my previous posts are concerned please apply the maximum amount of sarcasm you can conjure.
Syncro
Eskimo,
WOW!
I spit coffee all over my flat screen reading that middle paragraph.
Agree or disagree, that…was…awesome!
Sam S.
ET is somewhat clumsily making the point, which may better be made by counter example.
Willy Picton was a white man, in a culture that allows rampant pornography, strippers and prostitution.
Willy ground his women into pig fertilizer.
Thus all men who enjoy pornography, strippers and hookers, prefer to grind their women into pig fertilizer.
The logical error is to leap to a conclusion that all men who enjoy pornography, strippers and hookers will eventually grind their women into fertilizer.
Perhaps a more relevant consideration would have been that Willy the pig farmer graduated from slaughtering four legged creatures to two legged creatures.
Willy, not being the sharpest knife in the drawer, failed to draw the distinction between bacon and humans.
So called “honour killings” are not unique to the Muslim culture, but take place in other well known cultures.
IE Killing for the purpose of securing another dowry in marriage etc. Killing females as they are a financial burden in a particular culture etc.
One can however debate the frequency of ‘dishonour killings’ between cultures.
Cheers
Hans-Christian Georg Rupprecht, Commander in Chief
1st Saint Nicolaas Army
Army Group “True North”
ET- Sometimes “simplistic” is needed to get us past the insanity of our great mosaic. I’ve given up trying to analyze every event in the news. It doesn’t help me deal with my fears.
I have three young sons, about to embark on the journey of adulthood. Should I ask them to ignore the obvious threats out there in the world? Should I preach tolerance, and acceptance that all cultures are equal? Fat chance. I taught them which neighbourhoods are off limits. I taught them how to fight to win. I taught them which cultures are the most dangerous, and which countries should be avoided. Most of all, I taught them not to be fooled by cults.
I know you’re a stickler for accuracy, Kate. Isn’t it “influential”?
Last week in Delta B.C. a man was sentenced to 11 years for second degree murder. He took the head off of his 2 year-old daughter because she was female. ———————————–http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2009/02/06/bc-lakhvinder-kahlon-sentenced.html?ref=rss——— This article does not state the religion of the man,but in all likelihood he also smacked his head on the ground five times a day.
[ Muzzammil Hassan is the founder and chief executive officer of Bridges TV, which he launched in 2004, amid hopes that it would help portray Muslims in a more positive light.]
[ Orchard Park police are investigating a particularly gruesome killing, the beheading of a woman, after her husband — an influential member of the local Muslim community — reported her death to police Thursday.]
Kate can speak for herself, but I believe the above statements are the main reason for the post.
We do not, in fact, know for certain that his religion drove him to this despicable act. His culture may have.
We do know the Politically Correct in Canada are quick to point out even the smallest of faults in Canada’s and America’s traditional way of life. Front page coverage. Whether, religious, economic, family values, protecting one’s home with a gun – the Latte Left Crowd will use even pathetically small examples to bull-horn ‘us-bad, they-good’. The stereo-typed White Males being the prime target.
What Kate’s post demonstrates in spades is the irony of it all.
Fact; He was an influential member of the local Muslim community.
Fact; He was the founder and chief executive officer of Bridges TV, which he launched in 2004, amid hopes that it would help portray Muslims in a more positive light.
Fact; This is the worst form of domestic violence possible.
Fact; She had an order of protection that had him out of the home as of Friday the 6th [of February]
A quick google just now;
‘orchard park beheading cbc’ … nothing.
‘orchard park beheading ctv’ … nothing
‘orchard park beheading g&m’ …. nothing.
I guess our beloved media is trying to portray some groups in a better light than others.
The enemy of my enemy is my friend – no matter what. An ultimate case of discrimination if there every was one. Discrimination – ok when performed by the Latte Left.
C’mon … everyone knows that Islam is the culture of Islam. Their religion and culture are one and the same.
ET is trying to separate the two. It can’t be done.
Like a man once said “if you put iced cream on shit and eat it, it will mostly taste like shit”. Islam is what we taste, the iced cream is the lame excuses that people like ET and the rest of the PC establishment are using to bullshit us into believing it’s iced cream.
Islam is a plague on our world. The Christian world used to play that role, but has succumbed to debauchery, money and tropical vacations. We can only hope.
If he had beaten her to death or shot her that denotes spousal murder. Beheading her is an honour killing, it’s the final insult to the victim for dishonouring him. It’s not the result of religious teachings it appears to be a cultural practice amongst the Indo, Arab, African community. I’m not aware of many beheadings in the west that were committed by westerners. Beatings and gun shots are the norm here.
“The Christian world used to play that role…”
It met it’s match in Humanism, though.
ET once again ignorantly bleating about a topic she knows little about and understands even less.
However, she may have clumsily stumbled upon a partial truth – that it’s not about religion. Rather, Islam is a complete ideology, encompassing all of life, including the political, social, legal and religious aspects. Oh, and which hand to wipe your ass with.
Here are some facts:
The Pakistan Institute of Medical Sciences has determined that over ninety percent of Pakistani wives have been struck, beaten, or abused sexually — for offenses on the order of cooking an unsatisfactory meal. Others were punished for failing to give birth to a male child. Dominating their women by violence is a prerogative Muslim men cling to tenaciously. In Spring 2005, when the East African nation of Chad tried to institute a new family law that would outlaw wife beating, Muslim clerics led resistance to the measure as un-Islamic.
Muslim men bring this religiously sanctioned violence with them when they immigrate to the West, even to the United States. The prominent American Muslim leader Dr. Muzammil H. Siddiqi, former president of the Islamic Society of North America (ISNA), has said that “in some cases a husband may use some light disciplinary action in order to correct the moral infraction of his wife…The Koran is very clear on this issue.”
In 1984, Sheikh Yousef Qaradhawi, who is one of the most respected and influential Islamic clerics in the world, wrote: “If the husband senses that feelings of disobedience and rebelliousness are rising against him in his wife, he should try his best to rectify her attitude by kind words, gentle persuasion, and reasoning with her. If this is not helpful, he should sleep apart from her, trying to awaken her agreeable feminine nature so that serenity may be restored, and she may respond to him in a harmonious fashion. If this approach fails, it is permissible for him to beat her lightly with his hands, avoiding her face and other sensitive parts.”
The permission to beat one’s wife is rooted in the Islamic holy book, the Qur’an, and Islamic tradition.
The Qur’an says: “Men shall take full care of women with the bounties which God has bestowed more abundantly on the former than on the latter, and with what they may spend out of their possessions. And the righteous women are the truly devout ones, who guard the intimacy which God has [ordained to be] guarded. And as for those women whose ill-will you have reason to fear, admonish them [first]; then leave them alone in bed; then beat them…” (4:34)
The Islamic prophet Muhammad was once told that “women have become emboldened towards their husbands,” whereupon he “gave permission to beat them” (Sunan Abu Dawud, book 11, no. 2141). He was unhappy with the women who complained, not with their husbands who beat them.
Muhammad even struck his favorite wife, Aisha. One night, thinking she was asleep, he went out. Aisha surreptitiously followed him. When he found out what she had done, he hit her: “He struck me on the chest which caused me pain, and then said: Did you think that Allah and His Apostle would deal unjustly with you?” (Sahih Muslim, book 4, no. 2127).
………………….
Of course, the most important fact is that Muslims are commanded to obey the Quran and emulate Mohammad. Included in the Quran training is that women are a “tilth” – a possession of their husband – and their lives are worth half as much.
(Much of the above via Robert Spencer)
ET at February 14, 2009 12:20 PM
“Vince Li…well, he wasn’t Muslim”
dp at February 14, 2009 12:36 PM
“ET- Since you opened this door, I’d like to comment that Vince Li might have been a muslim, after all”
I recall MSM reports shortly after this horrible event that Mr Li was a Chinese Muslim influenced by his readings of the Koran. This comment was quickly expunged from all subsequent news reports.
Reminds me of the Montreal massacre committed by Mark Lepine (nee Gamil Ghurba). A new film titled “Polytechnique” opened Feb. 6 in Montreal portraying Mr. Lepine as a young, white French Canadian. “the film documents the events of December 6, 1989 through the eyes of two students who witness a gunman murder fourteen young women before committing suicide.” (wiki)
Jim
Well, ET is right
Show me the data re domestic violence in Muslims vs non-Muslims. Once I see real data, we can then draw conclusions, either on a case control or cohort basis.
Lots of televangelists have been in the news because of their sexual peccadilloes. That doesn’t mean that Christians have weird sexual proclivities.
Without data, we are talking about anecdotes, and while it’s fun to talk about how cold it is today, it doesn’t mean that “climate change” is real.
Yes, irwin daisy, Muslim men really seem to have a hang up. Women must be dominated. They must be kept subservient to males. Do not let their attraction get to you. Women must be covered up.
Correct me if I am wrong. The Jihad against the West and America in particular seemed to explode about the same time Muslim and Islamic men around the world saw the most powerful man in the world being laid bare on the Oval Office desk by a young women. No connection ?
IMO, it is the ‘horror factor’ that is intended to be emphasized by the radical hard left wing elements of humanity. Imagine yourself being beheaded or imagine yourself watching as a member of your family got beheaded. Imagine having a hand or a foot cut off with a axe, knife, sword or machete. Then imagine getting shot! Getting shot is infinitely more appealing to most people because death is quick. The guillotine, incidental, was invented by Mr. Guillotine as a ‘humane’ instrument for killing people. Prior to the guillotine, axes often failed to kill the victim on the first three or four tries…ropes broke or stretched when hangings took place – the guillotine made death swift and sure. It was ‘humane’ in a time when people still had imaginations that were not dulled by horror TV and computer games.
What are people thinking when they shriek about words spoken or written about other people? They do not usually know the people so it is not out of love that they squawk, what are the same people thinking when they remain silent about people being mutilated in public places? This is my question for the media types and the hard left outfits like SOW. The answer whispering in my ear is ‘follow the money’.
What horror TV has done is remove people from reality by another degree (remember Plato’s 3 degree’s from reality scenario?). What denigrating God has done is remove the horror of Jesus Christ being crucified. The hard left have no imagination, consequently they have little capacity for love. Love is what is missing – imagining your own Mom having her head chopped off by your own Dad! In my day, if my Dad yelled (back) at my Mom us kids were horrified! Now it is called an ‘honor killing’ to take the head off some-one’s Mom and treated as 2nd degree murder? Where is the outcry? This is savage, cruel, unthinkable thing that should rock the core of society. Lack of imagination and the inability to love and trust are the foundation of tolerance for this incident, IMO. The hard left is silent because they do not see any $$ or vengeance against the people they envy and despise – the people who know how to love and are members of a family who love each other (in their hearts). The agenda of the hard left (especially the SOW types) is destruction of the love and loyalty of families; for this reason they tolerate all evil that seeks to destroy the most powerful unit of a free society – and destroy Christianity too, as Christianity is based on Love. Love, is of course, an Abstract noun and the ‘reality’ education and TV shows leave people at a loss to understand Abstract nouns…this happened to the people of the Dark Ages – that is why they were called the “Dark Ages”; in fact some city people don’t even have a literal perception of ‘dark’, never mind a figurative perception of the same.
The posters here at SDA have posted very thoughtful and insightful passages about this horrific incident within the Western sphere of influence, this proves that we have not lost our way totally (that is we are not all in the ‘dark’). It is clear to me that ‘East is East and West is West and ne’re the twain shall meet’ is and always will be figuratively true. I do not understand the capacity for hate and uncontrolled fury that would prompt such a horrific deed, I do not understand how a man could live in his own family after doing such a dastardly thing, I do not understand how conflicting emotions within a family after such a deed could allow them to remain sane…I do not understand the mindset of families who live together but do not love and respect each other.
When a nation throws a lethal, contradicting mindset at it’s citizens and forces those citizens to ‘accept’ such a contrary mindset then that civilization is hell bent on it’s own destruction, IMO. It is up to the citizens to stop the destruction. I am proud to acknowledge the efforts of the web master of the Best Conservative Blog and the gold mine of posters/thinkers who are keeping our Western, freedom thinking/loving system of belief alive and vibrant. Well done.
Well, isn’t this inconvenient to the Islamic movement?
Nah. Just watch the Big Media cover it up, as they pretty much do with other “honor” killings…
Islam’s got nothing to worry about. Only the aware-few know about the bad stuff, thanks to the dhimmi dummies in the Big Media… Onward, Islamic Jihadists… onward… convert everyone!
Yep… future belongs to Islam… oh, shee-it… what to do… what to do… except keep speaking the truth, raising awareness… and, when the Jihad SS in their historically-correct, evocative retro-modern Muslim-Nazi uniforms finally break down your door to gruffly demand conversion, enslavement or death of you, then let out a non-submissive whoop, “Let’s Roll!”… you’ll know what to do…
I feel like I’m in a movie, The Prime of MS.ET Brody.
ET your right he did not kill her because he WAS a Muslim. He killed her because she wanted a divorce. You cannot dismiss however the misogynistic Muslim male view of females and the concept of male honor possibly influencing his decision to let her live or kill her. Especially by his chosen method.
However the main point of this story is the delicious black irony about the perps/victims desire of bringing Islam to a prettier place in the unbelievers eye that has now been undone by the founders patch of unpleasantness.
Why do you defend Islam ET?
I’ve never seen a Muslim ET didn’t like.
Nor, for that matter, have I ever seen a Israeli she did.
Typical comment, so praise her to your heart’s content. She sticks to her convictions.
Personally, I’m taking my laptop in for a cleaning. I spewed my blueberry fritter when I guffawed.
Bl@kbird – in my opinion, what needs to be done is to get “the most senior Muslim leaders” in Canada together, and interview them, and ask them their opinions on this.
If they say unequivocally that this act was reprehensible, then we have something. If they say the husband was justified in his actions, we have something else.
What I’m talking about is neither defending or condemning Islam. Let’s get the facts, air them, and see where we all are right now in Canada.
Talking into the echo chamber here may relieve frustrations, but it doesn’t change anything.
I guess some people don’t recognize sarcasm. I was parroting the feminist response to Aqsa Parvez’ honour killing in Missasauga.
If they say unequivocally that this act was reprehensible, then we have something What I’m talking about is neither defending or condemning Islam
Of course they’ll say the “act” was reprehensible, but they’ll never say the man that committed the act is reprehensible. Muslims will not speak against a follower of Islam.
kyla….got the sarcasm….and I really hope perfesser ET was being sarcastic to…if not…sigh.
If they say unequivocally that this act was reprehensible, then we have something.
Not recessarily. Taqiyya?
You have to know a LOT about Islam to effectively interview Muslims. Sadly, most of our elites in the media, politics, and academia, don’t have the requisite knowledge. Remember, Tony Blair once described Islam as very progressive; Bush, a Religion of Peace. Our religious leaders, mostly good liberals, who naively seek “dialogue” are the most clueless of all.
BTW, I just read that this guy had received an award from Hamas front group CAIR.
As to the notion of “bridges” you have to be skeptical and wonder how sincere his desire for “dialogue” (in the sense we hear the word) really is? CAIR, for example, before the FBI finally caught on, was doing all kinds of “outreach” programmes. You have to get what outreach means, which is: reaching out to your jugular.
Or, as I like to call them: Brown Supremacists
“Well, ET is right”
“Show me the data re domestic violence in Muslims vs non-Muslims. Once I see real data, we can then draw conclusions, either on a case control or cohort basis.”
I thought I did, but, oh well, here it is again:
“The Pakistan Institute of Medical Sciences has determined that over ninety percent of Pakistani wives have been struck, beaten, or abused sexually — for offenses on the order of cooking an unsatisfactory meal. Others were punished for failing to give birth to a male child.”
“Data gathered between 1999 and 2004 shows that, since 1999, the five-year rate of spousal violence has remained unchanged at seven per cent.” – StatsCan
………………..
“If they say unequivocally that this act was reprehensible, then we have something.”
“Not recessarily. Taqiyya?”
Quite right, MND.
Raymond Ibrahim has this to say on taqiyya:
“…many jurists have decreed that, according to Koran 4:29, Muslims are obligated to lie.”
Much of this revolves around the pivotal doctrine of taqiyya, which is often euphemized as “religious dissembling,” though in reality simply connotes “Muslim deception vis-à-vis infidels.” According to the authoritative Arabic text Al-Taqiyya fi Al-Islam, “Taqiyya [deception] is of fundamental importance in Islam. Practically every Islamic sect agrees to it and practices it. We can go so far as to say that the practice of taqiyya is mainstream in Islam, and that those few sects not practicing it diverge from the mainstream. … Taqiyya is very prevalent in Islamic politics, especially in the modern era [p. 7; my own translation].”
None of this should be surprising considering that Muhammad himself — whose example as the “most perfect human” is to be tenaciously followed — took an expedient view of lying. It is well known, for instance, that Muhammad permitted lying in three situations: to reconcile two or more quarreling parties, to one’s wife, and in war (see Sahih Muslim B32N6303, deemed an “authentic” hadith).
More demonstrative of the legitimacy of deception vis-à-vis infidels is the following anecdote. A poet, Kab bin al-Ashruf, offended Muhammad by making derogatory verse concerning Muslim women. So Muhammad exclaimed in front of his followers: “Who will kill this man who has hurt Allah and his prophet?” A young Muslim named Muhammad bin Maslama volunteered, but with the caveat that, in order to get close enough to Kab to assassinate him, he be allowed to lie to the poet. Muhammad agreed. Maslama traveled to Kab, began denigrating Islam and Muhammad, carrying on this way till his disaffection became convincing enough that Kab took him into his confidences. Soon thereafter, Maslama appeared with another Muslim and, while Kab’s guard was down, assaulted and killed him. Ibn Sa’ad’s version reports that they ran to Muhammad with Kab’s head, to which the latter cried, “Allahu Akbar!”
Saudi king reads SDA.
In RIYADH: “and a cleric who condoned killing the owners of TV networks that broadcast “immoral” content,”.
SDA gets results.
…-
“Saudi king shakes up religious establishment
DONNA ABU-NASR
RIYADH, Saudi Arabia (AP) – The Saudi king on Saturday dismissed the chief of the religious police and a cleric who condoned killing the owners of TV networks that broadcast “immoral” content, signaling an effort to weaken the country’s hard-line Sunni establishment.” http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2185749/posts
Well, ET is entitled to her opinion, as are we all.
Doesn’t matter if one is mistaken, let ’em be mistaken all they want.
I just wish ET would try to prove her surprising points about Islam, because, really, it behooves her to do so. I, for one, cannot understand her statements on Islam, as they fly in the face of observed contemporary reality and seem, to me, to be more argumentative than descriptive of observed contemporary reality.
But of course, that is, I concede, just my opinion…
That said, please continue as you wish, ET, sweetie… 🙂 We’re, after all, allowed to disagree. After all, we aren’t the Liberal Fascists of the University of Calgary, or the ones at yours, whichever one it is… 😉
Oh, and speaking of my opinion, I also did a post on this story, if anyone wants to see what I said… and, as usual, I call it as I see it… http://thecanadiansentinel.blogspot.com/2009/02/spotlight-on-islam-beheading-in-buffalo.html
ET my opinion of you has not changed. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. You are an apologist for the cult of death. You’ve chosen your side. My eyes glaze over reading your novel like posts. You better hope the good guys win or else start fitting yourself for that halloween costume you’ll be wearing.
irwin daisy – thanks I saw those stats for Pakistan. No doubt there are problems in the once fertile crescent.
What I was referring to was statistics of domestic violence for Canada/US, based on country of origin, age, years in Canada/US, etc. That is important to know, and I don’t know if those figures exist.
Here in North American, we have lots of reporting of numerators, but little regarding the denominator(s).
I’m aware of taqiyya (who would have thought ten years ago I would have known so many Arabic words).
A skillful interviewer could also address this.
But, many are just too lazy and intellectually bankrupt to conduct meaningful discussions.
Some of you are focusing on the fact that this man beheaded his wife; you are declaring that this mode of killing, which is ‘more common to the Muslim world’….proves..? What does it prove? Nothing.
My point is that you cannot, logically, make the conclusion that BECAUSE he is Muslim, his killing of his wife was due to his religion.
You can only say, without specific data:
He is Muslim; he killed his wife.
You cannot say:
He killed his wife because he is Muslim.
That’s called the ‘fallacy of affirming the consequent’ if anyone is interested.
Blackbird, don’t be silly; I’m not defending or accusing Islam. I’m point out the illogical thinking of people here rushing to accuse a man who killed his wife that ‘he did it because he’s a Muslim’.
That would mean that any man who killed his wife has to be a Muslim. Is that true? Or is it that he’s only a Muslim if he does it by beheading. But, if he kills her with a knife wound or a gun or strangulation…all methods which have been used by men…does that mean that he isn’t religious? That he belongs to no religion? Or, were all these acts because the man was Christian?
I gave other examples, where you can’t claim that a Catholic priest abused children because he was Catholic.. and Hans gave a nice example of pig farmers and prostitutes.
And I have no idea why people are bringing up the theme of cultural relativism which is irrelevant to this topic.
“But, many are just too lazy and intellectually bankrupt to conduct meaningful discussions.”
Not true, Erik!
North Americans are just… well… preoccupied, is all.
“And I have no idea why people are bringing up the theme of cultural relativism which is irrelevant to this topic.”
ET, you chose to rap with Neanderthals.
It’s your fault.
Highwayman – that is funny, and I think I get the analogy.
The media’s incuriousity with Obama and his political background and hatred of Palin reminds me of how happy they are to kick the Pope around, while not asking difficult questions of other religious leaders.
The guy on BBC’s hard talk I find to be cowardly. He to me seems to be afraid of being racist or culturalist, so he only seems to give certain people difficult questions.
The thing that bothers me about interviewers is that they seem to have a script, and want to jump on to the next question, rather than probing, dissecting and clarifying what people are saying.
“The thing that bothers me about interviewers is that they seem to have a script, and want to jump on to the next question, rather than probing, dissecting and clarifying what people are saying.”
The simple answer is that it’s never been about getting to truth… it’s about popularity and R-A-T-I-N-G-S.
Like here.
Eric Larsen,
I doubt data like that would be collected, let alone published.
I recall a few years ago that the Toronto Police had stats on violent crime showing that one minority group was responsible for a very high percentage. They were not allowed to make the report public.
“I recall a few years ago that the Toronto Police had stats on violent crime showing that one minority group was responsible for a very high percentage. They were not allowed to make the report public.”
Because… there’s only ONE “minority group” we’re talkin’ about… right? 😉 Chopper Read’ll tell ya!
irwin daisy – that is bad. I’m not in favour of ignoring problems.
We all know that natives have a high incarceration in Saskatchewan compared to other groups. Natives do not possess a genetic predisposition to crime. But, sadly more work is put in to shaking down the government for money rather than seriously addressing root issues, such as the archaic relationship between the government and natives. (I’m not in my element here, don’t know facts or figures though)
Similarly, when something happens related to race or religion, is seems that first response off the bat (as pointed out by Steyn and others) is “we fear hatred may be directed towards this group”.
I remember the CBC interviewer talking to a U of C prof about the Mumbai horror show when it was still taking place. (I think he must have been born in Mumbai, and that’s why they were interviewing him). Whilst there were still hostages in there, he said his “biggest fear” was a backlash against Muslims in Mumbai. Well, at that time, my biggest fear was that more innocents would be killed in that hotel.
The interviewer really did not do his job. Hardly any do. And that is a sad, sorry, state of affairs to find ourselves in.
Domestic violence is not restricted to any culture or religion. The methodology may conform to cultural norms such a be-heading instead of shooting but the fact remains that emotional people react when their world seems to be falling apart. Male on female killing happens when the male’s control over his female is endangered leaving the male with the perception that his status amongst his peers is imperiled. Sometimes this is exacerbated by his culture or religion but this is usually used as a justification for his actions and not the cause of the killing. Thus I don’t hold that the beheading of the woman is the result of Islam any more than I believe the woman killed by her ex-common law husband in Lamont Alberta is the cause of Christianity, humanism or any other religion.
wrong highwayman . it was the Haitians.
LGF has mug shots up.
…-
“Bridges TV CEO Arrested for Beheading Wife Received Award from CAIR
The founder and CEO of the Islamist channel Bridges TV, arrested today for beheading his wife after she filed for divorce, was given an award in 2007 by the Hamas-linked Council on American Islamic Relations:”
urlm.in/brat
“Stop in the name of love
It is to be sure, a unusual city for the Middle East, but the story goes that every Valentine’s Day in Beirut is like a holiday. The event is advertised. Tables at restaurants become scarce. The travelers at some hotels might discover a complimentary gift from the management that may come in many forms, but always in pairs.
What is paired to Feb 14, 2009 is political change. The Associated Press reports that the Saudi King has sacked the powerful religious authorities who authorized the murder of media figures who they regarded as immoral — and appointed a woman deputy minister to government into the bargain. These acts are regarded by commentators as gigantic events in a culture war. It would be difficulty to think of a less apt moment to rival mighty legends of defiance than Valentine’s Day. But maybe in this most fascinating and ancient region of the world, perhaps nothing is more fitting than that red should also be the color of less bloodshed.
RIYADH, Saudi Arabia (AP) — The Saudi king on Saturday dismissed the chief of the religious police and a cleric who condoned killing the owners of TV networks that broadcast “immoral” content, signaling an effort to weaken the country’s hard-line Sunni establishment.” http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/02/14/stop-in-the-name-of-love/
“I think, before rushing to judgment, a few facts would be useful. After all, is this situation one where this man killed his wife BECAUSE he was Muslim or did he kill his wife AND he was Muslim?
There’s an enormous difference. After all, do we assert that Madoff robbed all those people BECAUSE he was Jewish (national treasurer of the American Jewish Congress) or that he robbed AND he’s Jewish.
Do priests abuse young boys BECAUSE they are Catholic or…well, I’m sure you get my point.”
Well ET, here is my take on it.
First of all he IS a muslim.
Secondly, beheading is common in Radical muslim.
Thirdly.beheading in North America is a very uncommon method of murder
Fourthly- he beheaded his wife.
Conclusion………you tell me!
How do we know ET isn’t Muslim?
In most Muslim Nations he would not be arrested nor would he stand trial for murder, the fact is it’s culturally and religiously acceptable to kill females if a man deems they dishonoured him. I will never understand why Muslim men have no moral or personal responsibility, how utterly cowardly a male can do whatever he wishes morally but it’s women who dishonour those cowards.
Good thing there is two stage of hell in Islam, when their god is done with him my god and the Jewish god will make sure he rots in perpetual enternity of misery and hell fire.
joe
the killing may be because, as you said , that the man’s world and control of events are evaporating, the be-heading method is cultural/religious, this method has special significance in the muslim(especially mid eastern)world, even Aqsa’s throat was slit
ET
profiling is what many in here are doing, and this is a legitimate tool to use. It is often used by the FBI, CIA, and local police forces to find a criminal. Also we use it daily in our business world, and on the “street” in general, thus bettering our chances of survival. You “logical” assertions don’t apply in this case, as statistics dictate that this mode of killing would probably signify a muslim perp., and is therefore as valid form of assessment of events.
Well, I think that DN’s post is not relevant to this particular situation. He’s referring to radicalism, the radicalism of Islamic fascism and fundamentalism.
This is ONE situation, where a man kills his wife, and there is no logical process that we, without evidence, can use to declare that his action was due to his religion.
dp, I think your reduction of ‘Christians live in a guilt society’ and Muslims ‘live in an honour society’ is a bit too simplistic. I certainly agree that the Christian culture is focused on sin and guilt (particularly since Augustine!). It’s also focused on love and charity. And Islam, as a tribal culture, is indeed based on loyalty to the kin-group.
And it isn’t the case that all ‘white men’ (Non Muslims?) who kill their wives also commit suicide. I’m sure you know the data doesn’t show such a conclusion. Nor does ‘walking into a police station’ mean that they are bragging about it. Is running from the act, lying and denying it, found only among non-Muslims?
Again, because someone killed their wife, does NOT mean that this act was due to their religion. You can’t come to such a conclusion without evidence, just as you cannot say that because a priest abused young boys, it was due to his religion. Nor can you say that there is any ‘prediliction’ to do so within the Catholic religion.
Remember the old ‘correlation is not causation’.
ET,
Re;your 11:42 post.
I don’t think too many of us here are reading the incident in question as a man ‘killing his wife BECAUSE he is a muslim’.
The method, the target, and the history all led me to conclude he was muslim, even if not presented with this info ahead of time.
When I come across stories of child abuse, or molestation, I need plenty of background info to conclude which social strata, religion, culture, or geographical region the perpetrator comes from.
When stories of financial crimes come up, ditto.
The problem we’re having with your pseudo-defence of this man/ his background is the facts that you’re ignoring.
The Dennis Miller quote way up there in the comments fit best. Profiling has somehow taken on taboo status.
It’s not bad to atribute certain traits to chosen groups of society. It’s simply acknowledging ones experience with numerous examples.
Show me some data to start changing those ideas, and I’ll likely amend my ‘profile’.
For now, when stories like this come up, I’ll continue shaking my head in disgust at this seemingly backward, barbaric way of thinking…whether religious OR cultural.
Otherwise, I usually agree with your assesments on other issues.
Sam S.
To bring up the Greyhound beheading has got to be the limpest dicked attempt at ‘moral equivelancies’ I’ve ever seen.
Until we see a rash of beheadings of the good wives of Christian televangelists, ET’s cry of ‘But we are all beheaders’ is pure comedy.
I think if a news report leads with ‘MAN beheads WIFE’, there’s a 99 and 44 one hudredths percent chance that anyone with an IQ above ‘drooling village idiot’ can formulate that the husband also has the ’99 and 44′ odds of being named Mo’ either as his first, middle or surname and faces a certain shithole mid east city 5 times a day and prays to a pedophile prophet.
In an age of ‘let’s look for root causes’, it’s funny how many people seem content to just whistle while walking past the graveyard.
For someone allegedly ‘eduacated’, ET certainly isn’t very smart.
ET
Isn’t the debate, in a larger sense, all about cultural relativism?
Assumptions are a necessary part of daily existence, some are correct and some are faulty.
Based on the available evidence I choose to assume that this heinous act was in all likelihood the product of culture, ideology and psychology.
b_c @ 12:22 makes my point.
You, on the other hand, choose to assume that in this case cultural or ideological influences had no part in the outcome or at the very least a causal relationship is unprovable.
So be it, different assumptions produce different conclusions.
As far as my previous posts are concerned please apply the maximum amount of sarcasm you can conjure.
Syncro
Eskimo,
WOW!
I spit coffee all over my flat screen reading that middle paragraph.
Agree or disagree, that…was…awesome!
Sam S.
ET is somewhat clumsily making the point, which may better be made by counter example.
Willy Picton was a white man, in a culture that allows rampant pornography, strippers and prostitution.
Willy ground his women into pig fertilizer.
Thus all men who enjoy pornography, strippers and hookers, prefer to grind their women into pig fertilizer.
The logical error is to leap to a conclusion that all men who enjoy pornography, strippers and hookers will eventually grind their women into fertilizer.
Perhaps a more relevant consideration would have been that Willy the pig farmer graduated from slaughtering four legged creatures to two legged creatures.
Willy, not being the sharpest knife in the drawer, failed to draw the distinction between bacon and humans.
So called “honour killings” are not unique to the Muslim culture, but take place in other well known cultures.
IE Killing for the purpose of securing another dowry in marriage etc. Killing females as they are a financial burden in a particular culture etc.
One can however debate the frequency of ‘dishonour killings’ between cultures.
Cheers
Hans-Christian Georg Rupprecht, Commander in Chief
1st Saint Nicolaas Army
Army Group “True North”
ET- Sometimes “simplistic” is needed to get us past the insanity of our great mosaic. I’ve given up trying to analyze every event in the news. It doesn’t help me deal with my fears.
I have three young sons, about to embark on the journey of adulthood. Should I ask them to ignore the obvious threats out there in the world? Should I preach tolerance, and acceptance that all cultures are equal? Fat chance. I taught them which neighbourhoods are off limits. I taught them how to fight to win. I taught them which cultures are the most dangerous, and which countries should be avoided. Most of all, I taught them not to be fooled by cults.
I know you’re a stickler for accuracy, Kate. Isn’t it “influential”?
Last week in Delta B.C. a man was sentenced to 11 years for second degree murder. He took the head off of his 2 year-old daughter because she was female. ———————————–http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2009/02/06/bc-lakhvinder-kahlon-sentenced.html?ref=rss——— This article does not state the religion of the man,but in all likelihood he also smacked his head on the ground five times a day.
[ Muzzammil Hassan is the founder and chief executive officer of Bridges TV, which he launched in 2004, amid hopes that it would help portray Muslims in a more positive light.]
[ Orchard Park police are investigating a particularly gruesome killing, the beheading of a woman, after her husband — an influential member of the local Muslim community — reported her death to police Thursday.]
Kate can speak for herself, but I believe the above statements are the main reason for the post.
We do not, in fact, know for certain that his religion drove him to this despicable act. His culture may have.
We do know the Politically Correct in Canada are quick to point out even the smallest of faults in Canada’s and America’s traditional way of life. Front page coverage. Whether, religious, economic, family values, protecting one’s home with a gun – the Latte Left Crowd will use even pathetically small examples to bull-horn ‘us-bad, they-good’. The stereo-typed White Males being the prime target.
What Kate’s post demonstrates in spades is the irony of it all.
Fact; He was an influential member of the local Muslim community.
Fact; He was the founder and chief executive officer of Bridges TV, which he launched in 2004, amid hopes that it would help portray Muslims in a more positive light.
Fact; This is the worst form of domestic violence possible.
Fact; She had an order of protection that had him out of the home as of Friday the 6th [of February]
A quick google just now;
‘orchard park beheading cbc’ … nothing.
‘orchard park beheading ctv’ … nothing
‘orchard park beheading g&m’ …. nothing.
I guess our beloved media is trying to portray some groups in a better light than others.
The enemy of my enemy is my friend – no matter what. An ultimate case of discrimination if there every was one. Discrimination – ok when performed by the Latte Left.
C’mon … everyone knows that Islam is the culture of Islam. Their religion and culture are one and the same.
ET is trying to separate the two. It can’t be done.
Like a man once said “if you put iced cream on shit and eat it, it will mostly taste like shit”. Islam is what we taste, the iced cream is the lame excuses that people like ET and the rest of the PC establishment are using to bullshit us into believing it’s iced cream.
Islam is a plague on our world. The Christian world used to play that role, but has succumbed to debauchery, money and tropical vacations. We can only hope.
ET….
Go to this link and get educated from someone who has done research in this area.
http://www.anthropoetics.ucla.edu/ap1202/muja07.htm
anthropoetics?
If he had beaten her to death or shot her that denotes spousal murder. Beheading her is an honour killing, it’s the final insult to the victim for dishonouring him. It’s not the result of religious teachings it appears to be a cultural practice amongst the Indo, Arab, African community. I’m not aware of many beheadings in the west that were committed by westerners. Beatings and gun shots are the norm here.
“The Christian world used to play that role…”
It met it’s match in Humanism, though.
ET once again ignorantly bleating about a topic she knows little about and understands even less.
However, she may have clumsily stumbled upon a partial truth – that it’s not about religion. Rather, Islam is a complete ideology, encompassing all of life, including the political, social, legal and religious aspects. Oh, and which hand to wipe your ass with.
Here are some facts:
The Pakistan Institute of Medical Sciences has determined that over ninety percent of Pakistani wives have been struck, beaten, or abused sexually — for offenses on the order of cooking an unsatisfactory meal. Others were punished for failing to give birth to a male child. Dominating their women by violence is a prerogative Muslim men cling to tenaciously. In Spring 2005, when the East African nation of Chad tried to institute a new family law that would outlaw wife beating, Muslim clerics led resistance to the measure as un-Islamic.
Muslim men bring this religiously sanctioned violence with them when they immigrate to the West, even to the United States. The prominent American Muslim leader Dr. Muzammil H. Siddiqi, former president of the Islamic Society of North America (ISNA), has said that “in some cases a husband may use some light disciplinary action in order to correct the moral infraction of his wife…The Koran is very clear on this issue.”
In 1984, Sheikh Yousef Qaradhawi, who is one of the most respected and influential Islamic clerics in the world, wrote: “If the husband senses that feelings of disobedience and rebelliousness are rising against him in his wife, he should try his best to rectify her attitude by kind words, gentle persuasion, and reasoning with her. If this is not helpful, he should sleep apart from her, trying to awaken her agreeable feminine nature so that serenity may be restored, and she may respond to him in a harmonious fashion. If this approach fails, it is permissible for him to beat her lightly with his hands, avoiding her face and other sensitive parts.”
The permission to beat one’s wife is rooted in the Islamic holy book, the Qur’an, and Islamic tradition.
The Qur’an says: “Men shall take full care of women with the bounties which God has bestowed more abundantly on the former than on the latter, and with what they may spend out of their possessions. And the righteous women are the truly devout ones, who guard the intimacy which God has [ordained to be] guarded. And as for those women whose ill-will you have reason to fear, admonish them [first]; then leave them alone in bed; then beat them…” (4:34)
The Islamic prophet Muhammad was once told that “women have become emboldened towards their husbands,” whereupon he “gave permission to beat them” (Sunan Abu Dawud, book 11, no. 2141). He was unhappy with the women who complained, not with their husbands who beat them.
Muhammad even struck his favorite wife, Aisha. One night, thinking she was asleep, he went out. Aisha surreptitiously followed him. When he found out what she had done, he hit her: “He struck me on the chest which caused me pain, and then said: Did you think that Allah and His Apostle would deal unjustly with you?” (Sahih Muslim, book 4, no. 2127).
………………….
Of course, the most important fact is that Muslims are commanded to obey the Quran and emulate Mohammad. Included in the Quran training is that women are a “tilth” – a possession of their husband – and their lives are worth half as much.
(Much of the above via Robert Spencer)
ET at February 14, 2009 12:20 PM
“Vince Li…well, he wasn’t Muslim”
dp at February 14, 2009 12:36 PM
“ET- Since you opened this door, I’d like to comment that Vince Li might have been a muslim, after all”
I recall MSM reports shortly after this horrible event that Mr Li was a Chinese Muslim influenced by his readings of the Koran. This comment was quickly expunged from all subsequent news reports.
Reminds me of the Montreal massacre committed by Mark Lepine (nee Gamil Ghurba). A new film titled “Polytechnique” opened Feb. 6 in Montreal portraying Mr. Lepine as a young, white French Canadian. “the film documents the events of December 6, 1989 through the eyes of two students who witness a gunman murder fourteen young women before committing suicide.” (wiki)
Jim
Well, ET is right
Show me the data re domestic violence in Muslims vs non-Muslims. Once I see real data, we can then draw conclusions, either on a case control or cohort basis.
Lots of televangelists have been in the news because of their sexual peccadilloes. That doesn’t mean that Christians have weird sexual proclivities.
Without data, we are talking about anecdotes, and while it’s fun to talk about how cold it is today, it doesn’t mean that “climate change” is real.
Yes, irwin daisy, Muslim men really seem to have a hang up. Women must be dominated. They must be kept subservient to males. Do not let their attraction get to you. Women must be covered up.
Correct me if I am wrong. The Jihad against the West and America in particular seemed to explode about the same time Muslim and Islamic men around the world saw the most powerful man in the world being laid bare on the Oval Office desk by a young women. No connection ?
IMO, it is the ‘horror factor’ that is intended to be emphasized by the radical hard left wing elements of humanity. Imagine yourself being beheaded or imagine yourself watching as a member of your family got beheaded. Imagine having a hand or a foot cut off with a axe, knife, sword or machete. Then imagine getting shot! Getting shot is infinitely more appealing to most people because death is quick. The guillotine, incidental, was invented by Mr. Guillotine as a ‘humane’ instrument for killing people. Prior to the guillotine, axes often failed to kill the victim on the first three or four tries…ropes broke or stretched when hangings took place – the guillotine made death swift and sure. It was ‘humane’ in a time when people still had imaginations that were not dulled by horror TV and computer games.
What are people thinking when they shriek about words spoken or written about other people? They do not usually know the people so it is not out of love that they squawk, what are the same people thinking when they remain silent about people being mutilated in public places? This is my question for the media types and the hard left outfits like SOW. The answer whispering in my ear is ‘follow the money’.
What horror TV has done is remove people from reality by another degree (remember Plato’s 3 degree’s from reality scenario?). What denigrating God has done is remove the horror of Jesus Christ being crucified. The hard left have no imagination, consequently they have little capacity for love. Love is what is missing – imagining your own Mom having her head chopped off by your own Dad! In my day, if my Dad yelled (back) at my Mom us kids were horrified! Now it is called an ‘honor killing’ to take the head off some-one’s Mom and treated as 2nd degree murder? Where is the outcry? This is savage, cruel, unthinkable thing that should rock the core of society. Lack of imagination and the inability to love and trust are the foundation of tolerance for this incident, IMO. The hard left is silent because they do not see any $$ or vengeance against the people they envy and despise – the people who know how to love and are members of a family who love each other (in their hearts). The agenda of the hard left (especially the SOW types) is destruction of the love and loyalty of families; for this reason they tolerate all evil that seeks to destroy the most powerful unit of a free society – and destroy Christianity too, as Christianity is based on Love. Love, is of course, an Abstract noun and the ‘reality’ education and TV shows leave people at a loss to understand Abstract nouns…this happened to the people of the Dark Ages – that is why they were called the “Dark Ages”; in fact some city people don’t even have a literal perception of ‘dark’, never mind a figurative perception of the same.
The posters here at SDA have posted very thoughtful and insightful passages about this horrific incident within the Western sphere of influence, this proves that we have not lost our way totally (that is we are not all in the ‘dark’). It is clear to me that ‘East is East and West is West and ne’re the twain shall meet’ is and always will be figuratively true. I do not understand the capacity for hate and uncontrolled fury that would prompt such a horrific deed, I do not understand how a man could live in his own family after doing such a dastardly thing, I do not understand how conflicting emotions within a family after such a deed could allow them to remain sane…I do not understand the mindset of families who live together but do not love and respect each other.
When a nation throws a lethal, contradicting mindset at it’s citizens and forces those citizens to ‘accept’ such a contrary mindset then that civilization is hell bent on it’s own destruction, IMO. It is up to the citizens to stop the destruction. I am proud to acknowledge the efforts of the web master of the Best Conservative Blog and the gold mine of posters/thinkers who are keeping our Western, freedom thinking/loving system of belief alive and vibrant. Well done.
Well, isn’t this inconvenient to the Islamic movement?
Nah. Just watch the Big Media cover it up, as they pretty much do with other “honor” killings…
Islam’s got nothing to worry about. Only the aware-few know about the bad stuff, thanks to the dhimmi dummies in the Big Media… Onward, Islamic Jihadists… onward… convert everyone!
Yep… future belongs to Islam… oh, shee-it… what to do… what to do… except keep speaking the truth, raising awareness… and, when the Jihad SS in their historically-correct, evocative retro-modern Muslim-Nazi uniforms finally break down your door to gruffly demand conversion, enslavement or death of you, then let out a non-submissive whoop, “Let’s Roll!”… you’ll know what to do…
I feel like I’m in a movie, The Prime of MS.ET Brody.
ET your right he did not kill her because he WAS a Muslim. He killed her because she wanted a divorce. You cannot dismiss however the misogynistic Muslim male view of females and the concept of male honor possibly influencing his decision to let her live or kill her. Especially by his chosen method.
However the main point of this story is the delicious black irony about the perps/victims desire of bringing Islam to a prettier place in the unbelievers eye that has now been undone by the founders patch of unpleasantness.
Why do you defend Islam ET?
I’ve never seen a Muslim ET didn’t like.
Nor, for that matter, have I ever seen a Israeli she did.
Typical comment, so praise her to your heart’s content. She sticks to her convictions.
Personally, I’m taking my laptop in for a cleaning. I spewed my blueberry fritter when I guffawed.
Bl@kbird – in my opinion, what needs to be done is to get “the most senior Muslim leaders” in Canada together, and interview them, and ask them their opinions on this.
If they say unequivocally that this act was reprehensible, then we have something. If they say the husband was justified in his actions, we have something else.
What I’m talking about is neither defending or condemning Islam. Let’s get the facts, air them, and see where we all are right now in Canada.
Talking into the echo chamber here may relieve frustrations, but it doesn’t change anything.
I guess some people don’t recognize sarcasm. I was parroting the feminist response to Aqsa Parvez’ honour killing in Missasauga.
If they say unequivocally that this act was reprehensible, then we have something
What I’m talking about is neither defending or condemning Islam
Of course they’ll say the “act” was reprehensible, but they’ll never say the man that committed the act is reprehensible. Muslims will not speak against a follower of Islam.
kyla….got the sarcasm….and I really hope perfesser ET was being sarcastic to…if not…sigh.
If they say unequivocally that this act was reprehensible, then we have something.
Not recessarily. Taqiyya?
You have to know a LOT about Islam to effectively interview Muslims. Sadly, most of our elites in the media, politics, and academia, don’t have the requisite knowledge. Remember, Tony Blair once described Islam as very progressive; Bush, a Religion of Peace. Our religious leaders, mostly good liberals, who naively seek “dialogue” are the most clueless of all.
BTW, I just read that this guy had received an award from Hamas front group CAIR.
As to the notion of “bridges” you have to be skeptical and wonder how sincere his desire for “dialogue” (in the sense we hear the word) really is? CAIR, for example, before the FBI finally caught on, was doing all kinds of “outreach” programmes. You have to get what outreach means, which is: reaching out to your jugular.
Or, as I like to call them: Brown Supremacists
“Well, ET is right”
“Show me the data re domestic violence in Muslims vs non-Muslims. Once I see real data, we can then draw conclusions, either on a case control or cohort basis.”
I thought I did, but, oh well, here it is again:
“The Pakistan Institute of Medical Sciences has determined that over ninety percent of Pakistani wives have been struck, beaten, or abused sexually — for offenses on the order of cooking an unsatisfactory meal. Others were punished for failing to give birth to a male child.”
“Data gathered between 1999 and 2004 shows that, since 1999, the five-year rate of spousal violence has remained unchanged at seven per cent.” – StatsCan
………………..
“If they say unequivocally that this act was reprehensible, then we have something.”
“Not recessarily. Taqiyya?”
Quite right, MND.
Raymond Ibrahim has this to say on taqiyya:
“…many jurists have decreed that, according to Koran 4:29, Muslims are obligated to lie.”
Much of this revolves around the pivotal doctrine of taqiyya, which is often euphemized as “religious dissembling,” though in reality simply connotes “Muslim deception vis-à-vis infidels.” According to the authoritative Arabic text Al-Taqiyya fi Al-Islam, “Taqiyya [deception] is of fundamental importance in Islam. Practically every Islamic sect agrees to it and practices it. We can go so far as to say that the practice of taqiyya is mainstream in Islam, and that those few sects not practicing it diverge from the mainstream. … Taqiyya is very prevalent in Islamic politics, especially in the modern era [p. 7; my own translation].”
None of this should be surprising considering that Muhammad himself — whose example as the “most perfect human” is to be tenaciously followed — took an expedient view of lying. It is well known, for instance, that Muhammad permitted lying in three situations: to reconcile two or more quarreling parties, to one’s wife, and in war (see Sahih Muslim B32N6303, deemed an “authentic” hadith).
More demonstrative of the legitimacy of deception vis-à-vis infidels is the following anecdote. A poet, Kab bin al-Ashruf, offended Muhammad by making derogatory verse concerning Muslim women. So Muhammad exclaimed in front of his followers: “Who will kill this man who has hurt Allah and his prophet?” A young Muslim named Muhammad bin Maslama volunteered, but with the caveat that, in order to get close enough to Kab to assassinate him, he be allowed to lie to the poet. Muhammad agreed. Maslama traveled to Kab, began denigrating Islam and Muhammad, carrying on this way till his disaffection became convincing enough that Kab took him into his confidences. Soon thereafter, Maslama appeared with another Muslim and, while Kab’s guard was down, assaulted and killed him. Ibn Sa’ad’s version reports that they ran to Muhammad with Kab’s head, to which the latter cried, “Allahu Akbar!”
Saudi king reads SDA.
In RIYADH: “and a cleric who condoned killing the owners of TV networks that broadcast “immoral” content,”.
SDA gets results.
…-
“Saudi king shakes up religious establishment
DONNA ABU-NASR
RIYADH, Saudi Arabia (AP) – The Saudi king on Saturday dismissed the chief of the religious police and a cleric who condoned killing the owners of TV networks that broadcast “immoral” content, signaling an effort to weaken the country’s hard-line Sunni establishment.”
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2185749/posts
Well, ET is entitled to her opinion, as are we all.
Doesn’t matter if one is mistaken, let ’em be mistaken all they want.
I just wish ET would try to prove her surprising points about Islam, because, really, it behooves her to do so. I, for one, cannot understand her statements on Islam, as they fly in the face of observed contemporary reality and seem, to me, to be more argumentative than descriptive of observed contemporary reality.
But of course, that is, I concede, just my opinion…
That said, please continue as you wish, ET, sweetie… 🙂 We’re, after all, allowed to disagree. After all, we aren’t the Liberal Fascists of the University of Calgary, or the ones at yours, whichever one it is… 😉
Oh, and speaking of my opinion, I also did a post on this story, if anyone wants to see what I said… and, as usual, I call it as I see it…
http://thecanadiansentinel.blogspot.com/2009/02/spotlight-on-islam-beheading-in-buffalo.html
ET my opinion of you has not changed. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. You are an apologist for the cult of death. You’ve chosen your side. My eyes glaze over reading your novel like posts. You better hope the good guys win or else start fitting yourself for that halloween costume you’ll be wearing.
irwin daisy – thanks I saw those stats for Pakistan. No doubt there are problems in the once fertile crescent.
What I was referring to was statistics of domestic violence for Canada/US, based on country of origin, age, years in Canada/US, etc. That is important to know, and I don’t know if those figures exist.
Here in North American, we have lots of reporting of numerators, but little regarding the denominator(s).
I’m aware of taqiyya (who would have thought ten years ago I would have known so many Arabic words).
A skillful interviewer could also address this.
But, many are just too lazy and intellectually bankrupt to conduct meaningful discussions.
Some of you are focusing on the fact that this man beheaded his wife; you are declaring that this mode of killing, which is ‘more common to the Muslim world’….proves..? What does it prove? Nothing.
My point is that you cannot, logically, make the conclusion that BECAUSE he is Muslim, his killing of his wife was due to his religion.
You can only say, without specific data:
He is Muslim; he killed his wife.
You cannot say:
He killed his wife because he is Muslim.
That’s called the ‘fallacy of affirming the consequent’ if anyone is interested.
Blackbird, don’t be silly; I’m not defending or accusing Islam. I’m point out the illogical thinking of people here rushing to accuse a man who killed his wife that ‘he did it because he’s a Muslim’.
That would mean that any man who killed his wife has to be a Muslim. Is that true? Or is it that he’s only a Muslim if he does it by beheading. But, if he kills her with a knife wound or a gun or strangulation…all methods which have been used by men…does that mean that he isn’t religious? That he belongs to no religion? Or, were all these acts because the man was Christian?
I gave other examples, where you can’t claim that a Catholic priest abused children because he was Catholic.. and Hans gave a nice example of pig farmers and prostitutes.
And I have no idea why people are bringing up the theme of cultural relativism which is irrelevant to this topic.
“But, many are just too lazy and intellectually bankrupt to conduct meaningful discussions.”
Not true, Erik!
North Americans are just… well… preoccupied, is all.
“And I have no idea why people are bringing up the theme of cultural relativism which is irrelevant to this topic.”
ET, you chose to rap with Neanderthals.
It’s your fault.
Highwayman – that is funny, and I think I get the analogy.
The media’s incuriousity with Obama and his political background and hatred of Palin reminds me of how happy they are to kick the Pope around, while not asking difficult questions of other religious leaders.
The guy on BBC’s hard talk I find to be cowardly. He to me seems to be afraid of being racist or culturalist, so he only seems to give certain people difficult questions.
The thing that bothers me about interviewers is that they seem to have a script, and want to jump on to the next question, rather than probing, dissecting and clarifying what people are saying.
“The thing that bothers me about interviewers is that they seem to have a script, and want to jump on to the next question, rather than probing, dissecting and clarifying what people are saying.”
The simple answer is that it’s never been about getting to truth… it’s about popularity and R-A-T-I-N-G-S.
Like here.
Eric Larsen,
I doubt data like that would be collected, let alone published.
I recall a few years ago that the Toronto Police had stats on violent crime showing that one minority group was responsible for a very high percentage. They were not allowed to make the report public.
“I recall a few years ago that the Toronto Police had stats on violent crime showing that one minority group was responsible for a very high percentage. They were not allowed to make the report public.”
Because… there’s only ONE “minority group” we’re talkin’ about… right? 😉
Chopper Read’ll tell ya!
irwin daisy – that is bad. I’m not in favour of ignoring problems.
We all know that natives have a high incarceration in Saskatchewan compared to other groups. Natives do not possess a genetic predisposition to crime. But, sadly more work is put in to shaking down the government for money rather than seriously addressing root issues, such as the archaic relationship between the government and natives. (I’m not in my element here, don’t know facts or figures though)
Similarly, when something happens related to race or religion, is seems that first response off the bat (as pointed out by Steyn and others) is “we fear hatred may be directed towards this group”.
I remember the CBC interviewer talking to a U of C prof about the Mumbai horror show when it was still taking place. (I think he must have been born in Mumbai, and that’s why they were interviewing him). Whilst there were still hostages in there, he said his “biggest fear” was a backlash against Muslims in Mumbai. Well, at that time, my biggest fear was that more innocents would be killed in that hotel.
The interviewer really did not do his job. Hardly any do. And that is a sad, sorry, state of affairs to find ourselves in.
Domestic violence is not restricted to any culture or religion. The methodology may conform to cultural norms such a be-heading instead of shooting but the fact remains that emotional people react when their world seems to be falling apart. Male on female killing happens when the male’s control over his female is endangered leaving the male with the perception that his status amongst his peers is imperiled. Sometimes this is exacerbated by his culture or religion but this is usually used as a justification for his actions and not the cause of the killing. Thus I don’t hold that the beheading of the woman is the result of Islam any more than I believe the woman killed by her ex-common law husband in Lamont Alberta is the cause of Christianity, humanism or any other religion.
wrong highwayman . it was the Haitians.
LGF has mug shots up.
…-
“Bridges TV CEO Arrested for Beheading Wife Received Award from CAIR
The founder and CEO of the Islamist channel Bridges TV, arrested today for beheading his wife after she filed for divorce, was given an award in 2007 by the Hamas-linked Council on American Islamic Relations:”
urlm.in/brat
“Stop in the name of love
It is to be sure, a unusual city for the Middle East, but the story goes that every Valentine’s Day in Beirut is like a holiday. The event is advertised. Tables at restaurants become scarce. The travelers at some hotels might discover a complimentary gift from the management that may come in many forms, but always in pairs.
What is paired to Feb 14, 2009 is political change. The Associated Press reports that the Saudi King has sacked the powerful religious authorities who authorized the murder of media figures who they regarded as immoral — and appointed a woman deputy minister to government into the bargain. These acts are regarded by commentators as gigantic events in a culture war. It would be difficulty to think of a less apt moment to rival mighty legends of defiance than Valentine’s Day. But maybe in this most fascinating and ancient region of the world, perhaps nothing is more fitting than that red should also be the color of less bloodshed.
RIYADH, Saudi Arabia (AP) — The Saudi king on Saturday dismissed the chief of the religious police and a cleric who condoned killing the owners of TV networks that broadcast “immoral” content, signaling an effort to weaken the country’s hard-line Sunni establishment.”
http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/02/14/stop-in-the-name-of-love/
“I think, before rushing to judgment, a few facts would be useful. After all, is this situation one where this man killed his wife BECAUSE he was Muslim or did he kill his wife AND he was Muslim?
There’s an enormous difference. After all, do we assert that Madoff robbed all those people BECAUSE he was Jewish (national treasurer of the American Jewish Congress) or that he robbed AND he’s Jewish.
Do priests abuse young boys BECAUSE they are Catholic or…well, I’m sure you get my point.”
Well ET, here is my take on it.
First of all he IS a muslim.
Secondly, beheading is common in Radical muslim.
Thirdly.beheading in North America is a very uncommon method of murder
Fourthly- he beheaded his wife.
Conclusion………you tell me!
How do we know ET isn’t Muslim?
In most Muslim Nations he would not be arrested nor would he stand trial for murder, the fact is it’s culturally and religiously acceptable to kill females if a man deems they dishonoured him. I will never understand why Muslim men have no moral or personal responsibility, how utterly cowardly a male can do whatever he wishes morally but it’s women who dishonour those cowards.
Good thing there is two stage of hell in Islam, when their god is done with him my god and the Jewish god will make sure he rots in perpetual enternity of misery and hell fire.
joe
the killing may be because, as you said , that the man’s world and control of events are evaporating, the be-heading method is cultural/religious, this method has special significance in the muslim(especially mid eastern)world, even Aqsa’s throat was slit
ET
profiling is what many in here are doing, and this is a legitimate tool to use. It is often used by the FBI, CIA, and local police forces to find a criminal. Also we use it daily in our business world, and on the “street” in general, thus bettering our chances of survival. You “logical” assertions don’t apply in this case, as statistics dictate that this mode of killing would probably signify a muslim perp., and is therefore as valid form of assessment of events.