“[Prime Minister Stephen Harper] miscalculated, with nearly catastrophic results for the country…” – Determinedly determined Michael “Everything I Know About Canada I Learned From The New York Times” Ignatieff
“[Prime Minister Stephen Harper] miscalculated, with nearly catastrophic results for the country…” – Determinedly determined Michael “Everything I Know About Canada I Learned From The New York Times” Ignatieff
Points for honesty
Wow, $54 billion ,mother of all boondoggles by the Liberals and our government gets 12 months to pay it back. Sure, they had huge surpluses to buy voters, but at our expense. They’ve also proven they’re poor managers, they’re more broke than the Dippers.
Now lets see Iggy poo come demanding big bucks for his ideas on how the Conservatives should manage the country!
Tough titty to have this happen just when they’ve finally found their saviour to lead them power.
Kind of takes the shine off his crown.
No wonder the old boys refuse to get involved with the party in it’s hour of need, they probably knew about this, they were there when it all happened.
I guess the past two weeks is what JackTheWeasle was meaning when the said in the campaign “The New Strong”. Weasle words you can keep.
You know, when I read stories related to the coalition or even Canadian federal politics I see a lot of sentences that describe the Bloc as a party “intent on separating from the rest of the country.” Am I the only one that thinks this is a load of bull? It seems to me the only real objective that the Bloc has is using the decades-old threat of separation to extort the rest of the country. This extortion is not limited to cash, but political power as well. It’s completely sickening how this farce is continually described as a legitimate separatist movement. It’s a never-ending blackmail op is what it is.
If anyone can explain to me how a separate Quebec would be a negative development for the rest of the country, on the whole, then please educate me. Otherwise, let’s really start cultivating the will and courage to remove the west from this sham of a country. If for no other reason than to do the opposite of what the EU is doing. The opposite of their glaring stupidity must be blatant genius, no?
Did anyone else find it irritating that Iggy said that , in essence, he had no ideas to give to PM Harper in relation to the economic crisis; that Harper “should know” what’s needed and that Prince Iggy would wait to see the budget and it said budget “is not in the interest of Canadians” HE would decree it bad and vote it down.
Basically – Iggy and the Liberals have NO ideas of their own; if they do Harper must read their minds and Conservatives are the evil sort who would bring in a budget that “destroys” Canada so Iggy, the Professor will be the saviour from the evil Harper and give it a failing grade if he so deems.
I feel like I am in Mugabee country.
I hear WK has taken Ivison’s comments as complimentary…
BBwwaahhhh….
The flip side of this statement from Ignatieff is that when Harper barks, the opposition jumps. They are nothing more than Pavlov’s dog salivating at a the prospect of a little treat.
I remember the first days of Harper’s leadership of the Conservatives…Bad suit, bad hair, beaqdy snake like eyes and nervousness out the wazoo.
Come to think of it…not much has changed!
Iggy is technically correct, governments propose and opposition opposes or relents.
Of course the recent opposition has ignored that. For all the claims that they know how Parliament works, they ignore that….the opposition wants power without responsibility. And look at their definition of consensus, doesnt include the conservative point of view, apparently that is illegitimate.
I think iggy is a more rational player and someone that the conservatives can predict a little better….Dion had the attention of a housefly and perated in apparently nobodies interest…well except Elizabeth May’s
I remember the first days of Harper’s leadership of the Conservatives…Bad suit, bad hair, beady snake eyes and nervousness out the wazoo.
Come to think of it…not much has changed!
“Come to think of it…not much has changed!
~not stirred enough said
More poor you.
Why don’t you ask Santa to give you a “makeover’ for Christmas?
I remember the first days or Dion’s leadership of the Liberals…lies,lies,and then some more,nothing’s changed.And as far as appearances,that is exactly what I look for when deciding my vote.
Why was the liberal party and the CBC bashing Harper for the possibility of running a deficit then two weeks later they tried to topple the government because he didn’t include a stimulus package that would have caused a deficit?
I think the chattering classes believe that the American election results somehow overturn the Canadian election results and that they should now be in charge, even if it means catering to the Bloc. We need an election to resolve this, and hopefully there will be enough of a shift in English Canada to create a majority Conservative government early in 2009.
Then the chattering classes can move to America if they like Obama so much. Damned pro-Americans.
And if we were to vote based on appearances,let’s see,Dion looks like he’d be more comfortable in high-heels,Layton goose-steeping isn’t very attractive,and Iggy should trim that run-away caterpillar spreading over his eyes,and when speaking,should be mindful that while nice teeth are,well,nice,I don’t really need to see every last molar.
Is it reasonable to expect that when an “intellectual” speaks that something intelligent should flow from his or her mouth.
So much for Iggy being an intellectual. I can hear the Liberal’s next campaign theme; “A vote for me is a vote for catastrophe.” Not just catchy, but factual too.
So now Iggy and his cohorts are up in arms about the rules making EI tougher to collect and the mean old conservatives had “better listen or we’re taking you down”!!!.
HEH. If you read the Supreme Court decision on how the Chretien and Martin LIBERALS mis appropriated EI funds so they could fool the peoplle that THEY were “good money managers” you will also note that it says “Paul Martin and Jean Chretien changed the rules for EI in the 90’s making it harder for people to collect”.
So, now Iggy wants the Conservatives to UNDO LIberal bad policy.????
Priceless.
“I hope that Western Canadians forgive and forget, to be very blunt, some of the errors that the party has made in the past,” he said.”
Well that should do it ! Proves Iggy “gets” the West and he can now plan on a red tidal wave of new MP’s next election !
Uh huh. Right on Iggy. Good call
Harper has made a bunch of miscalculations:
1. He should have had a majority government in the last election even though he did not have a clear election platform and even though he was running against someone as useless as Dion. He suddenly wanted to to cut arts and culture funding without properly explaining what he wanted to do and what it would mean. He had to reverse his decision fast because his Quebec guys told him that this was seen as a blow against Quebec’s culture. He ended up losing in Quebec and lost a majority. There was no real need for this election and he could have stayed in power for a couple more years – he thought he could pull out a majority because Dion is a stiff.
2. He comes out with an economic update – attaches some stuff to screw the other parties – which is something that should be evolved in a non-partisan way if electoral financing reform is needed – and then makes it a vote of confidence – which he does not have to do – even though he supposedly knew that there was a big conspiracy against him that is itching for a confidence vote to bring him down and that he would be playing into their devious hands.
3. Now even before the coalition deal is signe, he backtracks on his ‘screw the other guy stuff ‘ as fast as possible. He goes and gets prorogation as fast as possible – setting up Iggy to take over as fast as possible and giving the Liberals 2 months head start on re-grouping in terms of financing, organization and policy – plus it gives Iggy a couple of months to promote himself and the Liberals across Canada.
4. He gave Iggy a bat to beat him with – the coalition. Harper was clearly freaked out that he could be defeated – he’s running scared and the Libs know it.
5. He is in further trouble because in all probability the polls we see in the next couple of weeks are going to be dramatic. The Liberals are probably going to go up to around 33 or 34% and the Conservatives are going to go down to around 36 or 37% (partially because of the Dion factor). So the whole dynamics will change for the budget – Iggy may not need a coalition and Harper now knows this. Harper is going to have to crawl on his hands and knees and kiss Iggy’s feet and come up with Liberal budget.
I missed the Iggy statements yesterday but I heard a couple of sound bites. Iggy is clearly not going to take any lip from Harper and he is clearly going to get out there as fast as possible and push the Liberal case.
None of this needed to happen. Harper is a dummy and needs to go.
bob c, Iggy is not an intellectual, he’s a leftist inbred academic from Harvard. Think the movie Deliverance, but in a campus setting. “Da-da-dum-dum-dum…”
“Come to think of it…not much has changed!
Posted by: not stirred enough said at December 11, 2008 1:08 PM”
Including, evidently, your diaper. I thought I smelled something when I came in.
“I hope that Western Canadians forgive and forget, to be very blunt, some of the errors that the party has made in the past,” he said.”
Yeah, that Green Shaft plan was so ancient history.
(note the non-specific form of the apology which allows for the same specific “errors” to be re-enacted)
cconn, I have never read a statement so short-sighted and tactically wrong in all my life. You’ve managed to buy into every bit of opposition spin possible and still managed to fashion a festive tinfoil hat to wear this Christmas.
I hope to gawd you hold no office higher in the conservative party than lawn-sign installer.
cconn, your assertions lack both facts and logic.
1. No, a majority was not a certainty and there is no reason to claim that Quebecers are so shallow that cuts to their arts funding would override their concerns about the changing global economic situation – and Harper has shown that he is capable of dealing with that situation.
You also ignore that the Bloc is the default party in Quebec; quite frankly, Quebecers know that they don’t need to vote Conservative; they have the Liberals and NDP both using them to bolster their own appeal, and by such use, handing over millions to Quebec.
The reason for the election was because parliament was stalled because the MPs were not behaving responsibilty, as elected MPs representative of Canadians but within partisan politics. All their decisions were being made for the political advancement of their parties. Not for the people of Canada.
2. All financial bills are confidence votes. The economic update was geared to smoking out the Coalition, which had been planned for months, with an agenda of unleashing it on an unsuspecting House on budget day. Harper forestalled their agenda and saved us from that coalition. The coalition deal was signed before the update; I’m sure you know about Layton’s conference call.
3. He certainly did give not only the Liberal, NDP and Bloc time to rethink their outrageous attack on democracy; he also gave the Canadian people the opportunity to examine, discuss, and reject this blatant powergrab. The way the Coalition members were planning it, Canadians wouldn’t know what hit them until they realize that their democratic rights had been completely stripped away by this coalition.
4. No, the coalition is not a ‘bat to be used by Ignatieff’. Quite the opposite. Ignatieff signed it – and it’s a plan that, as I said, is a deep violation of the democratic rights of Canadians.
5. I’m sure you saw the polls of last week, though you do not refer to them, or to the conclusion that the people are deeply hostile to the coalition. So, I expect that the polls will reduce their ‘extreme range’ now that the first scare is over. Ignatieff won’t dare to actually enable a coalition or he’s ‘toast’.
6. You are right that none of this needed to happen – that is, Layton, Dion, Duceppe shouldn’t have hatched their plot to take over the government without the will of the people and all the opposition MPs, including Ignatieff, shouldn’t have signed on their agreement to such a violation of the people. But they did.
Stan…rhetorical question, right?
cconn:
I don’t know why many people still fail to realize the poison pills that Harper inserted into the economic update generated the response he was looking for. He knew that something along the lines of a planned attack was coming from the opposition….he suggested this in his interview with Mansbridge, and this was confirmed by the Layton recording. The Liberals had absolutely no choice but to fight it or they were dead.
Interesting that the elimination of the vote subsidy did receive a resounding level of support in public polls. Might be an election issue in the future that the CPC could roll out?
I think Harper was brilliant in what he did. It sure made for great political theatre, and renewed a lot of people’s interest in politics. It also highlighted to the general public the LPC’s thirst for one thing and one thing only – power above all else – and I don’t think people will forget that very soon.
At this point, I’m not really that concerned with Iggy. He is certainly a lot more formidable than Dion, (but then, so was my daughter’s gerbil).
One thing I do know about him is that he is determinedly determined to be the best puffin poo-hiding Liberal Canada has ever known.
I do not believe that Harper miscalculated. He needed at least some from the Liberal benches to support him if he was to have a stable government. Otherwise, the fiasco of the previous government would continue(partisan nastiness on all sides, unmanageable, embarassing committees, conservatives thwarted at every turn). I strongly suspect that he knew something about the coalition being planned. Dion was a very poor match for Harper and (ironically) it made Harper also look bad at times. I think Ignatieff at the helm of the Liberals will give Harper the stability he needs for some months — possibly a year or more.
Silly me! When Ignatieff was coronated as the new leader, I actually had some hope that he would immediately turf the coalition and work with Harper to steer the country through these rough economic times. After all, anything would be an improvement over Dion. However, Ignatieff is already posturing and sabre-rattling, probably in an attempt to impress his coalition buddies.
And to think that they refer to PMSH as “divisive”.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: The only goal of a Lieberal Leader is to assume their rightful place on the throne. As for the rest of us Canuck peseants… “let them eat poutine”.
TY ET for reading cconn’s stuff and replying. I quit after the second line because it was the same BS he has been saying for two weeks now.
I did catch the part about how PMSH could have maintained a stable gov’t for the next two years if he didn’t call the election. What HofC has cconn been watching for the last two years? We’ve had a dysfunctional HofC since the Liberals were made opposition. The only reason the government didn’t fall is because the Liberals abstained from doing any heavy lifting. Sure they opposed in question period and on TV; but, when it came to take a stand for something(heavy lifting) the Liberals didn’t do anything. I have more respect for a leftard voting with his heart (regardless of how stupid they are) than people who take a cheque but carry no responsibility because they didn’t decide anything.
It appears that cconn is the new New round here.
Ah yes, the boom days of wine and roses in the car industry when autoworkers got scalped on UIC premiums and the chances of collecting same were about nil. GM wasn’t complaining much with the very favourable exchange rates for exporting product to the US and car dealers were reaching deep in their pockets and filling up the Liberal coffers big time.
In Cape Breton UIC tightened up too as educators had complained and so the high school students found they couldn’t drop out and get on the deadend gravy train the same week. After several of the ridings went NDP after they made it an issue in a later election, Chretien saw the light and loosened things up again for the youth of CB.
Told me all I needed to know about Liberal and NDP morality.
The Employment Insurance ripoff is not the only ticking time-bomb that the Liberals set in motion. There is also the $30B that they took from the Public Service Pension Fund. I know we love to bash the public service a lot and in a lot of cases perhaps it is deserved but we’re not talking the gold-plated MP pensions here. They basically said there was a “huge surplus” in the fund so they took it, then turned around and said “by the way, you’re not paying enough into it so we are raising the rates.” This is being fought in the courts now of course and it’s very possible that money will have to be returned.
See how easy it is to get rid of a $50B deficit when you grab $54B + $30B that you shouldn’t have? Yeah…that Chretien/Martin regime were real miracle workers.
‘Really think it was not by accident Iggy spoke of his interest in the Puffin and the fact they hide their poop. That’s because he studied them as a requirement to become Liberal leader. Nobody hides poop like Liberals and nobody has more to hide than they do.
The SC has handed down a decision they can’t hide and pass the blame on to this government but this government will have to deal with it. The MSM will either report this factually or hear from a lot of angry people. It’s not an honest mistake either, Opposition parties were after them on it long ago.
I noticed while Ignatief was in front of the cameras yesterday his eyes would shift back and forth. He would not make eye contact with the camera, directly in front of him. I will not trust someone who speaks for Canada (Lieberals) and cannot look directly into Canadians eyes.
Roberto, same feeling here.
Had to watch that farce of an interview while in the line at the hospital.
Dion was a dork.
Iggy is a power lustful monster.
I am moving out of the country if he becomes a PM.
My wife saw him for the very first time yesterday and immediately called him ‘an evil jester from a horror movie’.
He spouted lie after lie with a stone mask on his face, only eyebrows moving like on a puppet and… no eye contact with the askers or camera.
“Iggy is a power lustful monster.” — I don’t really think so. I think he is simply a big ego attached to a big brain. Does that make him suitable to be the Prime Minister and solve real world problems? Not in an of itself. The shifty-eyed thing does not bother me too much. It is a sign of someone living much in their own heads. His focus is on his own thoughts — rather than the people around him, communication and interaction with others. Thinking — that’s what he is good at. I think this will prove a weakness in the long term — but a tendency to think carefully and move slowly may help bring us a stable (Harper) government in the short term.
I think Priggy was refering to the hurt feelins of the Separatists and how it might cause them to, well .. separate.
Calling Separatists, Separatists, is, .. well, racist.
That’s it ! That is how the media will help the coalition. The victim ploy.
Lorrie Goldstein does not buy it;
[ What is the grip the Grits hold over so much of our aging punditocracy, anyway, since these days the Liberals most resemble a company heading for bankruptcy — poorly run, in debt, on their third CEO in five years and unable to survive without publicly-funded bailouts?
According to this crowd, the “correct” view is that Harper rolled the dice with national unity last week when he described the proposed Liberal/NDP coalition government, backed by the Bloc Quebecois, as a deal with “separatists.” ] LG
http://www.torontosun.com/comment/columnists/lorrie_goldstein/2008/12/11/7703816-sun.html
lindal – I wouldn’t consider that Ignatieff is ‘good at thinking’.
After all, with just a one-minute break for thinking, he ought to have concluded that agreeing to an unelected coalition that was being held in place by a political party that was out of the electoral reach of over 80% of Canadians – was a violation of democracy.
Furthermore, that this political party, the Bloc, had signed an agreement not to vote against the coalition’s financial Motions for 18 months. Again, a violation of the democratic principles for which we, the taxpayer are paying them. They must not vote for partisan alliances but on the basis of the value of the Motion put to the House. They were promising to vote without seeing the Motion!
Then, this coalition was never suggested to the electorate; indeed, the leaders who signed it told the electorate that they would NOT form a coalition. But they did. Such a reversal violates their commitment to the electorate to represent themselves in a certain way and then, do the opposite. But above all, the coalition was not a choice of the electorate, but of a Set of Ruling Parties – who had moved themselves out of the reach of the electorate. That’s a violation of democracy.
Now – it ought to have taken Ignatieff less than one minute of thinking to realize this. Yet, he signed the document.
So I went to YouTube to listen to the acceptance rant given by the Liberal Party’s new American/Canadian leader. It was then that I realized who he reminded me of. So I immediately typed in my query on the YouTube search window, I hit “Go”, and Presto! There he was, “Mr. Soup Nazi” from the Seinfeld TV Program. So I watched and had a good chuckle.
After watching it a couple of times, I thought of how ironic it was that the leader of the Liberal/Separatist/Socialist Coalition reminds me of the person who became famous for uttering those now infamous words :
“NO COUP FOR YOU !!! NEXT !!!”
Oz
“I hope that Western Canadians forgive and forget, to be very blunt, some of the errors that the party has made in the past,” he said.”
Yeah, that Green Shaft plan was so ancient history.
(note the non-specific form of the apology which allows for the same specific “errors” to be re-enacted)
I think Iggy was referring to Turdeau’s NEP. (I misspelled Trudeau but liked it so left it :-))
Well, R-Rat, it really doesn’t matter what he may have been referring to if we don’t know what it was specifically.
Now he has to give an apology for the shoddy mealy mouthed apology and then get the apology right or how are Westerners supposed to forgive something non-specific and forget something non-specific?
Additionally, the Green Shaft was going to be NEPII as far as it’s affect on our economy so what is any apology worth if it is insincere and unrepentant?
The man is so blatantly phoney. The way he was talking at the media conference last night was just plain funny. The threats he levelled at PMSH just daring him to go after his (Iggy’s) character the way he went after Dion.
The way I see it Harper should go forward with the best budget he can put forth and if he is defeated then Canadians must DEMAND from the GG AN ELECTION. NO to a coalition that needs to be supported by separatists. Call Iggy’s bluff. I think Canadians and Western Canadians in particular would love to administer a good old fashioned ass whipping to the Liberal Party of Canada.
I noticed that Iggy did not attend SDA U.
Oh well, I’m sure he is going to get some lessons and an education from the SDA U fraternity whether he wants them or not.
Heh.
Piffle. Prince Michael not a Canadian? He was born in Toronto and educated at Upper Canada College. How much more Canadian could he be?!?
Aside from birth and education, he’s acting exactly like a Liberal machine politician, 1998-2008 vintage.
We have the answer that Ignatieff is prepared to give Canada a coalition government with the NDP and the Bloc and prepared to do that without an election, or Canadian people having their say. Ignatieff will be damned, if he would allow democracy to get in his way, in the lust for power and to become Prime Minister.
Without the Bloc support, and giving the Bloc the power to pull the strings Ignatieff can’t survive. What the Bloc has told Canadians time after time, is that they are not interested in what is good for Canada. How does this coalition plan, give any confidence to Canadians in B.C. ,Ont., etc., that we will get good government, when the lynch pin of this coalition, the Bloc with their 49 seats, is not interested in good government for Canada. In fact what we just recently heard from Pauline Marois and Parizeau is, that this coalition is good for Separatism, because it proves that Canada does not work. Ignatieff is prepared to divide this country, in his quest for power, without an election, not as much because the Bloc has the votes to cause separation in Canada, but they will be an integral part of the ruling government, and they have no desire or interest as they have told us, to vote for what is best for Canada, and certainly have no desire to make Canada work. Who in their right mind would partner with the Bloc, to govern Canada, when the Bloc not only is not the least bit interested in passing legislation for the good of Canada, but is also determined to break up Canada, and if Bloc can succeed in making Canada not work, who needs a referendum. It is a bit rich for Ignatieff to say, he is putting the interests of Canadians first.
Ignatieff will seek the support of the NDP in a coalition government. The Liberals have been telling Canadians for months now, and Canadians understood, that the NDP policies and platform would destroy Canada’s economy – need more be said about this partner.
I expect that the political pundits, will see the eminent danger, Ignatieff is taking this country from day one of his leadership, in resurrecting separatism and their forces and dividing the country. Canadians and the pundits can see for them selves that it is not Harper that is causing this crisis, but the direction and steps that Ignatieff and the Liberals are prepared to take, to become the government without an election, and consulting Canadians.
It is a joke for Ignatieff to say, he is not prepared to hypothesize about a future government involving a coalition. Somebody should inform Ignatieff that as part of a democracy, leaders must tell the voters what their plans are, and in an election although you don’t know if you will win you tell the people what your government will do and how it will work. You certainly don’t tell Canadians and the pundits, I won’t answer that, because it is a hypothetical question, as I don’t know if I will be Prime Minister, but I want the reigns of power.
Iggy Ignoramus is trudeau incarnate. Typical intellectual and articulate reality hick that couldn’t find his own ass with his hands behind his back. A liberal savior wrapped up in optics and bull sh!t. A professor, a teacher, a father figure of the teat sucking class that will lead them and the world to a larger teat. The press is about to crawl on their calloused knees before this prima donna.
Reality is torture to these types, they just can’t face honest work or a different opinion. A true liberal.
The new narrative never misses a beat from these porcine power pimps.
It would be unnatural for Liberals to admit a mistake so blame the real victim.
In the mean while. Iggy who is there to keep a united Canada .WAS involved in the power grab with the Separatists. Than of course Blames Harper. As I have said before this whole vote paying scam was initiated by Liberals only 5 years ago after many losses in a Liberal Supreme Court. He did a Ralph Kline so that by cutting government , anything else would have been easier. Hard to argue with people who do, not just talk. As well the Separatists would have lost funds supplied by the ROC, who shouldn’t be paying parties in the first place if they can’t get finance. How else can new ones form? No this was a naked grab for power by three losers, with evil council. Allied with a willing cabal from the past including IGGY.
If the liberals cannot get funds from their own. I say boo hoo to that. It should die & begin anew. As the Conservatives had to when found wanting. Always the easy way with these types of leeches.
Maybe Ralphy Goodytwoshoes can come out and explain how his fiddled the EI funds and if it helped to buck up their surplus. He was finance Minister under Martin and would know a bit about it.
The way things are shaping up maybe their flirtation with the Separatists will be the least of their problems. $54 billion is a lot of collateral to heist from a file illegally. People as clever as Chretien, Martin and Ralphy had to know what they were doing, no?
This is quite a revelation. Were the Liberals bragging about a bogus surplus?
“I hope that Western Canadians forgive and forget, to be very blunt, some of the errors that the party has made in the past,” he said.”
Oz 2:05 pm
“Yeah, that Green Shaft plan was so ancient history.
(note the non-specific form of the apology which allows for the same specific “errors” to be re-enacted)”
It’s a lot more recent than that: Iggy is still holding the current liebral crime against our western throats ( the coupalition) while he claims to be asking forgiveness! Aren’t you supposed to stop sinning first???
From the NP article:
…….miscalculated, with nearly catastrophic results for the country…….
Why would the newly minted leader of the official opposition say something so stupid?
It is well known that he spent a lot of time in school. As all the all knowing and wise, tell in their sermons, he is the next Messiah albeit of the small population of this country.
Contrary to this wise man’s remarks, Harper, just going by the final results calculated exactly right and the results were pretty much of an ordinary nature as opposed to catastrophic.
What is it that happens to the wise men of academe, when they get into politics? They seem to start talking stupid, this is not meant as an insult, it is an recent phenomenon and an observable fact.
It is true that the professors live in another world, in large part removed from reality, they concentrate mostly on extremely narrow subject of their choice and get never-ending praise from all those around them.
Somehow, they seem to translate it into the idea that they actually know anything and everything, because they are academics and others are not.
That would seem rather strange not knowing on the part of the all knowing.
Would it not be more edible to say “I know nothing, though this is what I think about this”, rather than say “I know everything” and turn out to be an asshole?