Emerging in an unlikely place;
The recent rains and flooding took a toll on a by-pass road to the East of Kandahar City and caused severe damage. The dyke that protects the road failed and allowed fast flowing water to erode the road itself and many places along the side of the road as well. In total, a 15 metre gap was made when the water washed away a culvert and the road on top of it, and 300-400 metres of the road and its shoulders were also damaged.
A soldier’s first hand report that you won’t read in the Globe and Mail.
Swell. Only I wouldn’t be surprised if the actual reason why the Canadian KPRT hasn’t been tasked with rebuilding the road is because that work has already been contracted out to another foreign private contractor, and not to a self-sufficient local government:
After the expenses, salaries and profits have been taken out, there isn’t enough money to build a decent road. Without maintenance — which has not been funded — the road will not last more than five years, according to one of the engineers.
The Berger Group insists it is not beholden to political promises or even community expectations, but that it answers to a higher power: the spending cap on its contracts.
“I understand their problems and needs, but I also have an obligation to keep within the budget of the taxpayers’ money,” said Peter Pengelly, Berger’s project manager in the camp. “To the community, we’re guilty until proven innocent.”
The community to which Pengelly refers includes about 1,000 drivers, farmers and other concerned Afghans who signed a petition complaining that the road is substandard, and demanding what they were promised. Drivers say the gravel on the road has punctured their car tires and broken their windows, and that potholes create hazards and delays.
But the real discontent is about water. The road is built close to mud homes, which have been here for decades. The old dirt road was low and allowed run-off to drain away. The new road is built atop a raised berm, blocking drainage. If a heavy storm strikes, the villagers fear the mud homes they built with their hands will collapse.
They submitted their petition to the governor of Sar-e Paula province, but the governor has no power over the single major highway in his jurisdiction, which was designed and built by outsiders.
“USAID can take advice and suggestions from the Afghan government, but they don’t have to listen to it,” said one of the contractors. “USAID will spend the money in the way they want.”
An Afghan-American’s first hand report that you won’t read on SDA.
Smoke, the road in the article to which you linked was built in the northern provinces of Afghanistan. The Canadians are based in southern Afghanistan in Khandahar province. It would be interesting to learn whether the Berger Group’s road building efforts extend throughout the whole of Afghanistan or whether they are confined to the north.
Why bother to blog what you get wall to friggin’ wall on the MSM, Smoke?
Maybe the mud house owners will have to shake a leg and dig a wee drainage ditch eh? Those poor victims of American hegemony!
Or maybe if they ask the contractor real nice a guy will run a Bobcat through there and save them some digging?
Foreign aid is often a boondoggle?
Pouring money down a rat hole?
Shock. Horror.
Seriously, some foreign does good things, but way too much of it is just wasted.
The Canadian media unaimously supported the invasion of Afghanistan and has been steadfast and unanimous in it support of the occupation.
For greater clarity:
1)Every single newspaper in Canada currently supports the Afghanistan mission.
2)Every single newspaper in Canada has officially supported the Afghanistan mission over the past five odd years.
Despite this, the good folks at The Torch insist there is a conspiracy among the media – the same media that unanimously supports the mission – to sabotage the mission.
I just wanted to point that out.
Look, I can point out a dozen horribly biased items in the media every day; none of them have anything to do with Afghanistan.
There is a significant opportunity cost associated with war blogging; every post done on the subject of Afghanistan is one less post done on what ails Canada. And there is plenty that ails Canada.
Accordingly, I call on the closet Liberals at The Torch to shut the hell up with their idiot conspiracy theories and say or do something remotely conservative for once in their miserable lives. Because you are either with us, or against us. We will make no distinction between socialists and those who aid and abet socialists.
I see Andrew is off his meds again.
Back under your bridge Andrew, there’s a good troll.
I accept your capitulation, Phantom, and remind you that Kate has repeatedly implored commenters here not to use the word “troll”, probably because it is a weak substitute for rational debate.
Sorry Andrew, I find it unsporting to enter into a battle of wits with an unarmed man. Or kid, in your case.
Back under your bridge now.
And the eco-wackos will blame this on GLOBAL WARMING knowing how out of touch with reality they are
Naw Spurwing, George Bush diverted that river personally.
I mean, we know he likes to drive earth movers, right? That’s all the guy does on that ranch of his, dig holes with a front end loader.
Obviously he flew over there in an SR71, drove a bulldozer through the dyke and then booked it back to Warshingtoon when nobody was looking.
New York Times has (Photoshopped) pictures!
“remind you that Kate has repeatedly implored commenters here not to use the word “troll”,”
No, I haven’t. I’ve asked commentors not to engage them.
Anne in swON: It would be interesting to learn whether the Berger Group’s road building efforts extend throughout the whole of Afghanistan or whether they are confined to the north.
Berger is among the lead organizations contracted by USAID to manage much of the physical infrastructure reconstruction agenda across Afghanistan, including the southern regions. Among their projects is the much touted Kabul-Kandahar highway. Even if they’re not the group directly responsible for the road reconstruction discussed in The Torch entry, the odds are that, at this stage, the work (and the commensurate aid money) is still being performed by a foreign rather than local presence.
From the conclusion of this Tiri report:
The real dilemma in the road reconstruction is their symbolic use as evidence to show the
progress of assistance. In the case of Afghanistan, the two roads described in this study,
Kabul-Kandahar and Kabul-airport road were highly symbolic in that sense. They illustrated
the reconstruction success of the post-Taliban intervention. As a result, the symbolic use of
road construction increased the amount of money available for it and fuelled the capacity to
waste assistance, making it lucrative for private companies specialized in physical
reconstruction. Only very weak procedural constraints were set up on the donor side in order
to control these risks. In addition, the implementers gained more recognition for their
contributions to the reconstruction if the work was done quickly, exclusive of quality or cost
effectiveness. With such time driven constraints, preparation of highly effective maintenance
mechanisms after the handover to the government would at least help to preserve the
fragile and highly symbolic road, which, according to current standards, may soon need a
second reconstruction.
Mr. Phantom: Why bother to blog what you get wall to friggin’ wall on the MSM, Smoke?
Balance. Since you appear loathe to read the MSM, preferring instead to get your news from blogs like SDA, I’d hate for you to develop only a one-sided view of the situation. The Torch and SDA have suggested that, because the Canadian PRT isn’t fixing the road, that this is prima facie evidence of self-sufficiency. I’m pointing to documentation suggesting otherwise. Ideally, you’d have read both before coming to conclusions — hence, balance.
Maybe the mud house owners will have to shake a leg and dig a wee drainage ditch eh? Those poor victims of American hegemony!
Had you read the entire link, you’d have discovered that the house owners did in fact attempt to dig a drainage ditch. They were arrested for doing so:
“On a sunny Friday morning last October, three villagers dug a ditch right through the new roadbed in an effort to create a drainage canal before the rainy season. They were arrested for damaging public property. The contractors pointed out that, according to an obscure and rarely-enforced Afghan highway law, no structure may be with in 30 meters of the road. Therefore, they argued, it was not the builder’s responsibility to deal with homes that may flood because they are too close to the road — even though the homes were there first. Two months later, the frustrated villagers dug a new ditch in the road. Because the road is guaranteed for a year against defects, Limak, with the advice of the Berger Group, agreed to build 63 new concrete culverts. When the culverts proved to small too accommodate the water flow, the contractors built additional ones next to them (and billed for it). Limak and the Berger Group point to this as a moment of altruism, rather than poor advanced planning.”
…the odds are that, at this stage, the work (and the commensurate aid money) is still being performed by a foreign rather than local presence.
Smoke, you would do well not to equate the USAID and U.S. military reconstruction philosophy, which puts more emphasis on “quick impact” projects with the CIDA and CF approach, which aims to build indigenous capacity while engaging in reconstruction and development.
“One team, one fight” doesn’t mean one consistent approach across all the allied forces operating on the ground. Which, in this case, might be a good thing.
I wonder if this new construction will yet again serve the Taliban with an opportunity for kidnapping and murder of forein workers.
Kate says “No, I haven’t. I’ve asked commentors not to engage them.”
Hmmm, I figured that on September 16, 2006, at 11:18 AM when you said:
“And if you find yourself typing the word “troll” in a response, then please stop and consider what you are doing.”
…you meant that people should not type the word “troll”. To be fair, the rest of the quote in context is:
“Ignoring trolls means just that. Do not respond, do not engage, do not call names. If individuals become especially troublesome, I will deal with them in my usual fascist manner.”
Regardless, blurting out “troll” is weak. Yes, my comment is angry and meant to provoke but excuse the hell out of me if I’m a little chuffed at the fine individuals who fiddle while Rome burns.
The only thing sillier than arguing on the internet is agreeing on the internet.
Damian: Smoke, you would do well not to equate the USAID and U.S. military reconstruction philosophy, which puts more emphasis on “quick impact” projects, with the CIDA and CF approach, which aims to build indigenous capacity while engaging in reconstruction and development.
True, I agree that CIDA’s capacity-building, whole-of-government approaches are superior and more promising in the long-term. But I think it’s still too premature to read into this anecdotal incident signs of self-sufficiency.
Here’s where I think a fundamental flaw lies: Such capacity-building PRT projects need to be intensified (incidentally, this is the NDP’s position, which isn’t to simply withdraw the troops but rather to redirect Canadian resources to reconstruction rather than combat) if Afghanistan is to become truly self-sufficient. But they can’t be intensified yet because the security situation is still too fragile. So most of the money for Afghanistan is still earmarked for military purposes. But the military campaigns are themselves fueling the ongoing insurgency and regional instability.
Mr. Smoke, seems you’ve never heard the phrase, “The law is an ass.”
You’re sure no highway ever built in North America ever inconvenienced anyone? No law was ever applied unfairly?
These villagers will no doubt be devastated. They will be forced to use the new -all weather- road and whine about the huts they had to rebuild while the wheels of their goat carts don’t sink up to the hubs in the no-mud.
Dirt roads under the Taliban were soooo much better, particularly in the spring. And the Taliban never arrested anybody for stupid reasons either, just lined ’em up and shot ’em. Much better!
Grow a brain, can’t you?
Sorry about swinging the cluebat at the trolls Kate. I know there’s not a 2×4 in the world can penetrate bone that thick.
I’m just feeling a bit cranky this AM. Stupidity irritates me.
The only thing more annoying and disruptive than trying to determine the trollish posts to skip over,is to have to sift through the garbage of certaine gullible regulars here TOO STUPID to ignore them.
Like almost every other thread on this site,instead of exploring the ins and outs of this interesting story,we eventually just get to read a 101 variations of “I’m right,you’re stupid”.
Kate,since my return to your site,I honestly thought “Don’t feed the trolls” was no longer policy.At least very few seem to conduct themselves by it these days.A troll only needs to dangle one ‘shiny lure’ in a thread and he gets multiple responses.No wonder they are so prolific here now.
The problem,as I see it,is too many people hang around sites such as this for little other reason than to argue with social misfits from the left.All they ever end up doing is wasting all readers’ time by spinning in endless circles and resolving nothing,yet they always go back for more.DUH!!
It has also created an atmosphere where anyone with a POV left of center with something intelligent to say(I can hear you now…impossible,you say)is buried under an avalanche of’leftards’and’leftoids’.
Oh…and Phantom,I may be wrong but I have always understood trolling as meaning fishing for gullible idiots,not hunkering under a bridge.
Kate…I thank you for teaching me,when I first discovered your site 2 yrs ago,the philosophy “Do Not Feed the Trolls!”
It has served me well throughout the blogosphere and saved me COUNTLESS hours of WASTED time.
Sorry for going WAY off topic,but I believe it is vital to the quality of these of conservative blogsites in general to educate the naive to ignore these idiots whose only reason for being here is to push conservatives’ buttons hard enough to make them react.
Grow a backbone.
The Phantom: You’re sure no highway ever built in North America ever inconvenienced anyone? No law was ever applied unfairly?
Sure it has, on both counts. And it’s always been the case that it inconveniences and treats unfairly the relatively powerless for the benefit of the relatively powerful. Evidently, Afghanistan is no different.
What’s your point, exactly? That because voiceless people get screwed in North America, that voiceless people in Afghanistan should be happy with the same?
These villagers will no doubt be devastated. They will be forced to use the new -all weather- road and whine about the huts they had to rebuild while the wheels of their goat carts don’t sink up to the hubs in the no-mud.
Funny that when you read the phrase “mud home,” the operative word for you is “mud” rather than “home.” With attitudes like yours, no wonder attempts to win the hearts and minds of local Afghans has been such a struggle to date.
All this could have easily been avoided had the contractors decided prior to construction that, (a) indeed, Afghans are people too, and (b) we’re building this road for them, not us, and thus their input might actually be worthy of consideration. Had they done so, they’d have learned about the importance of drainage for the nearby farmers, and could have inserted sufficiently large culverts at the design phase. All would have been happy, and the locals would have come to see the reconstruction efforts in positive terms, which in turn would reap exponential benefits for the Good Guys.
Instead, because the construction project was treated as symbolic, and because the contractors were motivated primarily by finishing quickly and getting paid, and because the drainage issue was allowed to become confrontational and punitive, the road is now crumbling, extra (tax-payer) dollars will now be needed to fix the second-rate job, the locals are now more leery of foreign “good-will,” and the only people to come out of this on top are the private contractors who collect tax-free profits for their work.
Dirt roads under the Taliban were soooo much better…
And now you’ve effectively resorted to calling the villagers ingrates. Bravo, your humanitarianism is inspiring.
Oh, and by the way, I think Canadian Observer just called you a “gullible idiot.”
But the military campaigns are themselves fueling the ongoing insurgency and regional instability.
We’re going to disagree on that point, Smoke. To my mind, that’s like saying chemotherapy is poisoning you. Yes, there’s a certain truth to that, but it misses the bigger picture: it does more good than harm if you’re cancerous.
Conducting aggressive COIN ops can be problematic when it comes to winning hearts and minds, especially when mistakes are made that cost civilian lives or livelihoods. But the alternative is worse: capitulate and allow the Taliban to retake the country. Try doing any long-term development in a nation that won’t allow meteorologists to forecast the weather because only Allah knows what the future will bring.
No, I say that the Canadian course, while not perfect, strikes a reasonable balance: kill bad guys and improve living standards without making more enemies than you make friends. As improvements in security and governance take root, it will be much easier to focus more resources on development.
Applauding the NDP position is ridiculous, though. It gets the order of operations wrong by putting development before security. To be honest, if the NDP was serious about helping Afghans, they’d be promising more boots on the ground to set the conditions for intensive development. If anything, the current pace is too slow, and the only thing that will improve it is enhancing security in the south more quickly.
Applauding the NDP position is ridiculous, though. It gets the order of operations wrong by putting development before security.
Not to mention that it converts “development” into a militarized task, and thus makes development workers ‘legitimate targets’ in the eyes of the Taliban and their ilk. The roles of security and development need to be complimentary, but strictly seperate.
Hmmm, go with the clue bat or the flame thrower? Decisions, decisions.
Think I’ll sleep on it.
The roles of security and development need to be complimentary, but strictly seperate.
Again, I’ll disagree. The Taliban and their ilk won’t allow that separation. If western militaries are creating a safe space for the development to occur, insurgents of the type we currently face will conflate the two and attack the weaker link. Heck, the development worker doesn’t even need to be western – look at what the Taliban are doing to local Afghan teachers who are considered “collaborators,” or to children who commit the capital offence of giving bread to ANP officers.
And alternatively, if western militaries don’t intervene, the development and aid becomes nothing more than bailing with a leaky bucket – a band-aid solution that treats the symptoms of the societal disease rather than the cause.
So that I don’t take up too much of Kate’s comment space with my own writings on the subject, I would refer you to an expanded commentary on security and development with NGO partners in Afghanistan here.
Damian @ August 2, 2007 3:30 PM. Thank You for the post. I sat here trying to figure out how to say the same thing,and you beat me to 🙂
Liberals are the most rediclous bunch of jerks around
It has also created an atmosphere where anyone with a POV left of center with something intelligent to say(I can hear you now…impossible,you say)is buried under an avalanche of’leftards’and’leftoids’.
I have to agree with that.
Having slept on it, I decided on a bit of the flame thrower first.
Canadian Observer, you don’t like my comments, don’t read ’em. Maybe you can pre-emptively ban me from your blog if it will make you feel better.
Mr. Smoke, let me say your holier-than-thou,condescending attitude is unsupported by your clear lack of any sort of clue regarding the topic at hand.
And now the clue bat.
Mr. Smoke, you seem to be under some kind of confusion regarding the Canadian mission in Afghanistan, and indeed why there is any war there at all. The reason NATO and the USA are there is primarily to destroy the Taliban, so as to deny the area to Al Qaeda, in the interests of preventing another 9/11 attack.
Meaning this is not a humanitarian mission, its a war.
All-weather roads have military uses, mud huts generally don’t. It is hard to drive a tank down a dirt road in the rain. It is easy to drive one down a proper gravel road. Ok so far?
Since this is a guerrilla war, it can only be won by enlisting the help of the locals. Additionally, since we do not want the country to fall back into chaos and give the enemy a chance to move back in, we must create a self sustaining state to keep the place together. Cutting down the opium trade wouldn’t suck either. An indigenous, democratic, free state will be the most successful type to get all that done.
Therefore we build non-military infrastructure to aid the local people, and provide for a civilized state. Like all weather roads.
Since you obviously have not a single clue about it, let me smack some info into your tired little neuron. When horses (cows, goats, whatever) walk on a well drained dirt path in good weather, the path looks like somebody took a rotor tiller to it. In the desert horses create fine dust inches deep and pretty much dig gullies wherever they pass. Add rain and you get an impassable mire, which as an added bonus is septic from all the horse crap mixed in.
Driving through deep mud on a Sunday in a 4×4 can be a giggle. It loses its charm if the mud goes on for 50 miles, and you need to get your pregnant yak to the vet real bad. Or your poppy crop to the market. Or you just want to visit Auntie Macassar in the next village.
As a staunch Leftard you understand that the greatest good for the greatest number is the basis of all government planning, and also that money does not grow on trees. So it should be a no-brainer for you to go for the nice, new all weather, high speed road at the expense of a little private property. Expropriate the bums and drive on, its the NDP way.
Ultimately we do not want our army and our resources building roads. We want AFGHANS doing it with THEIR money, while our army kills bad guys and breaks things like they are supposed to. That is major progress toward Victory, capital “V”. Kate posts evidence of exactly this, your response is “But what about these guys and their shacks? Kate is a Meany!!!”
In a free country, the guy with the shack OWNS the land. He has the power to tell the government to either buy him out or take their new road and shove it. That is what I would like to see happen in Afghanistan.
But Mr. Smoke, Afghanistan is not currently a free country. It was a religious murder-ocracy under the Taliban, and is currently in the process of becoming free but isn’t there yet. They are stuck in central planning mode just at the moment, with the problems one expects from same.
I would think that would be an agreeable outcome for you. But by your statements it seems you’d rather that we be defeated and leave, the Taliban be victorious, and your hut owners be reduced to slogging through liquid horse crap every rainy season. Well, until the poppy growers association shoots ’em anyway.
Making you a great humanitarian I’m sure.
Oh, Phantom, so self-confident, yet so spectacularly off-the-mark. Three challenges for you: (1) Show me where I opposed the building of all-weather roads in Afghanistan. In fact, (2) show me where I even remotely insinuated that I’d “rather that we be defeated and leave” and “the Taliban be victorious.” In doing so, be sure to cite the words I actually wrote, rather than the ones you put in my mouth.
If you’re so inclined, (3) try and argue against my actual point, which all along was that said roads should indeed be built, but (a) should of sufficiently high quality that they don’t fall apart within a few years from normal usage (which is what some stretches of highway are doing now), and (b) should be constructed in a way that respects the needs and interests of local inhabitants, including the simple insertion of drainage culverts where necessary and feasible (two conditions that were both present in the project I cited). To do so demands that the contractors place the best interests of the locals ahead of their own profiteering, a requirement that evidence suggest may not always be the case.
My guess is that you will fail on all three counts, and so instead will hurl some childish insults at me and then run away. But by all means, prove me wrong. I would relish it.
Missing the point again Mr. Smoke. What a surprize.
The contractors are doing what they are supposed to do, slap a decent road down on the required coordinates as fast and as cheap as possible, while being shot at. They are not getting paid to do what you want, which sounds like a major highway project in Michigan or something.
Your statement (made in the absence of any evidence by the way) that they are “profiteering” indicates some kind of gross mental malfunction on your part, not malfeasance on theirs.
Your willingness to slag good men doing a nasty job at great personal risk is unseemly. Typical of what I’ve come to expect from your fellows.
As to the rest of it, you going to tell me that I’ve misread you? You love it that Canada is in Afghanistan and you want us to stay there until victory is complete?
The Phantom: The contractors are doing what they are supposed to do, slap a decent road down on the required coordinates as fast and as cheap as possible, while being shot at.
Yeah, but ideally, “decent” should have taken precedence over “fast” and “cheap.” In what way is a “decent” road one in which the following is acceptable?
“Drivers say the gravel on the road has punctured their car tires and broken their windows, and that potholes create hazards and delays…according to current standards, may soon need a second reconstruction.”
Note that last bit especially, Phantom — a second reconstruction. Put in a way you’ll understand, is a “decent” house paint job one in which your client requires major retouching work within a few years’ time?
Mr. Smoke, you impenetrable retard, what part of “war zone” has failed to get your attention?
Is it possible that the quality being delivered by contractors who regularly have RPGs shot at them and have to de-mine the path before they put the gravel down might be different than that of a road crew in sunny southern Ontario?
Is it possible the military wanted a really, really cheap road instead of a really really good one, because they have to build a whole lot of roads with not much money?
Is it possible that military vehicles have tracks on them and a few pot holes don’t matter a damn to the functionality of the road? Which is for tanks and APCs to haul ass down while gunning for the Taliban.
Is it possible that pot holes and sharp rocks are preferable to foot deep mud and wash-outs?
Is it BARELY possible that the new Afghanistan Road Fixin’ Service will presently get out there and fix all these problems with Afghan tax money instead of my money? Hell, they may even pave it!
Apparently not in Retard World. In Retard World it doesn’t exist unless it makes Chimpy BushHarper look bad. Happy retardation Mr. Smoke.
By the way, a decent paint job is one where I do what I said I would do and get paid. If the customer wants the super cheapo special even after I tell him it’ll all fall off by next year, that’s what he’ll get.
Sometimes cheap is all people can afford Mr. Smoke. Should I work for free?