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Three motorists (including a reporter) saw a person fitting Curtis Dagenais’ description on Saturday, the day after the shootings, well south of the search zone. It wasn’t until photos were released some time later that they realized they may have seen someone who at least looked like the suspect “standing in the ditch” near Hwy 12. However, the search remains centered on the original area south of Spiritwood.
In other information released yesterday, his father, Arthur Dagenais, was arrested Saturday and obstruction of justice charges filed. He’s been remanded in custody.
The two wounded officers are still in intensive care in Royal University Hospital.
Some of the media discussion on radio has been a bit surreal – an interview on CKOM (with a Sask wildlife official ?) yesterday where they discussed matters such as how Dagenais might be able light a fire without being detected to keep warm at night, the “difficulty” in finding food, with discussions about how “easy” it is to catch a ground squirrel, but difficult to cook it or eat raw.
The Spiritwood area isn’t pure bush – it’s a combination of cropland, pasture and wooded areas. Now, I’m no survivalist, but I know a crop of field peas when I see one. And how to “stay warm” at night in July.
The one question asked by journalists I haven’t heard answered is how long the delay was between the shootings and the beginning of the manhunt proper. When asked, the RCMP spokesperson pleaded ignorance. I’m not sure I buy that. The suspect has decades of experience living in (and presumably, hunting in) the area. Had he more than a 2 or 3 hour head start before police could arrive in significant numbers, the assumption that he’d still be in the region after a day, much less four, seems a little shaky.
Providing he’s still alive.
There are lots of rural Saskatchewan readers here, so I’ll ask you – if you were dropped on your own farmland at the height of summer, in good health – how easily do you think you could find food and water, and how far do you think you could get in 12 hours?
Hell, when I was a kid, I knew 4 farmyards within easy walking distance that had vehicles sitting with keys in the ignition.
The Star Phoenix has more.
Hi Kate,
Just my 2 cents(US) but if he took a vehicle
wouldn’t it be reported missing???
If houses are also unlocked he could hide in an
attic & be nearby.
I hope they find his lifeless body somewhere…
You can go a couple of days without food as the CodePinkers can testify. A man in average condition can walk 25 or 30 miles a day as long as he has water.
Farms in the area were evacuated relatively soon after the incident. In addition, it’s not uncommon for a farmer to have a half dozen vehicles around, some used infrequently. It might be a while before a truck used for field errands was even noticed missing.
I’d like to think that the police have these sorts of questions covered. There must be specialized officers (investigators, forensics specialists, profilers, etc. etc.) that can put a lot of these same questions together, and draw some theories based on fact. Plus other info we, the public, don’t know about.
They ARE the greatest police force in the world!
Grew-up in Sask. just west of Glaslyn and did a lot of hunting when I was a kid. When I was 17, I joined the army and consequently, spent a lot time in the outdoors trying to hide from people (and also trying to catch people!).
First thing, whether he is still in the area (or even still alive) is hard to determine. In one way, a person may stay in the area with which he is familiar. On the other hand, a smart person would get the heck out of there! A person can travel quite a distance even on foot. When I was in the army, I could cover several kilometres at night, over rough terrain, with only a map and compass for guidance.
This time of the year the weather is warm, even at night, so that isn’t a problem. Getting food shouldn’t be a problem either, lots of berries will be ripening this time of the year (saskatoons, strawberries, raspberries, gooseberries, blueberries)that could provide food. Lots of gardens and chicken coupes that could be raided (watch out for the dogs!). Last time I was home in 2004, everyone was commenting in the large number of deer, so there’s more meat; the only thing, any shots would draw attention of the police. The same goes for open fires.
Also, holing up in an abandoned building would provide shelter and warmth, and, a chance to start a small fire to cook food without detection.
Some problems he could be experiencing;
– Mosquitoes/black flies/horse flies/etc. would be murder;
– Keeping dry goes with keeping warm. Getting caught in a downpour is not a good idea. Hypothermia is very possible;
– Short nights. According to my weather program sunrise is 05:30 A.M. and sunset at 9:30 P.M.. However, you have a couple hours of “false dawn” before actual sunrise, so you only have five hours or so of actual darkness. This lack of darkness makes travel difficult;
– How good of shape is he in?. That could determine how fast and far he could travel, and how he can handle living in adverse conditions; and
– Finally, how good an outdoorsman is he? Would he know what kind of food to look for? Does he know how to navigate at night? In the bush? One thing, it’s quit obvious that he knows how to use a firearm.
One last comment and that is about how easy it is to hide in the bush. When I was in army cadets there were occasions when I was able to camouflage myself by simply covering myself with leaves; good enough to reach-out and touch someone’s ankles when they walked by. Even hi-tech gear such as thermal cameras may not be good enough. Contrary to what you see in the movies they cannot see through heavy foliage.
Just some of my thoughts.
this dude is long gone from the search area. you can cross the continent in the better part of a week in a vehicle and there are HUNDREDS of back roads.
the area of the search increases geometrically the further one is from the location of the event.
10 kms distant, 100 kms search area
100 kms distant, 10,000 kms search area.
do the math. he’s long gone at this point. and even if he aint, my hunch is he had ‘safe houses’ lined up years ago just in case.
time to call in the clairvoyants !!!
LOL !!!
I know I shouldn’t repeat myself, but, I sincerely hope this guy does NOT commit suicide.
If he does, the left liberals will again mount an attack on guns and honest citizens. Gun control will be on the political agenda again, and it could be the impetus to give the Liberals a victory in a fall or winter election. Gun control plays big in Toronto.
The best scenario is if he gives himself up, hires a good lawyer, at taxpayers’ expense, and plea bargains his way to the usual ridiculously light sentence. This might wise up some of the Saskatchewan voters who consistently vote LEFT, Federally and Provincially.
And it might get the ranks in the RCMP to publicly state what they often say in private about our lax laws, which border on contempt of the victim.
“There are lots of rural Saskatchewan readers here, so I’ll ask you – if you were dropped on your own farmland at the height of summer, in good health – how easily do you think you could find food and water, and how far do you think you could get in 12 hours?”
Speaking as a newly minted rural Albertan, I could pull this off no problem. Most farms have vehicles with keys in the ignition sitting around. Most have gardens in, and the lettuce, radish, and onions are coming up right now. It’s also pretty bloody warm at night, so no fire needed.
Has the Sask wildlife official been outside of his office in the last ten years?
“I’d like to think that the police have these sorts of questions covered.”
Sorta like they had Caledonia covered?
*cough*
So, his dad was arrested for “obstruction”.
His dad likely helped him. Money, car, whatever.
If he’s still emotionally attached to his situation/property/ex-wife etc., he’ll show up eventually on his own. The Mounties won’t get him by crawling around in the bush.
If he’s had time to calm down and think things through, he’s long gone. New identity, new location far away, all in the works. If it was me, I’d be delivering pizza in Toronto by now, that being the last place anybody would look.
I suspect they’ll find an abandoned stolen pickup near a bus station…
The charges against the father reportedly stem from him entering the off-limits area to “help” with the search. RCMP took a different view. Info is sketchy, to say the least.
…where are the jihadist’s when you need them?
CBC Saskatchewan has an update on the guy spotted on HWY 12. A couple of people who know him saw the guy in the ditch and say it wasn’t him.
CBC SK reports that:
Crown prosecutors also said police found $27,000 in cash and two rifles hidden in a piece of machinery on Art Dagenais’s farm.
The Crown wants Arthur Dagenais to stay in jail until his trial, saying he has a 20-year history of animosity toward police officers.
The court was also told that Curtis Dagenais phoned his father while on the run from police in the hours after the shooting, saying he was worried that his old truck wouldn’t be able to outrun the RCMP.
Then the phone went dead, the Crown said.
cbc.ca/canada/saskatchewan/story/2006/07/12/dagenais-court.html
A little more info on the father has come to light since his court appearance – he was arrested for going back to a farm building, where a search uncovered several firearms, stock certificates and $27,000 in cash. Because he doesn’t trust banks.
He did just come out of a divorce settlement, so that’s another explanation as to why there’d be $$$ squirreled away.
Having grown up in SE Sask, and having been out in the fields in all seasons, I think it would be very easy to put some miles behind you in a hurry. There are tons of empty buildings and many gardens. If he has even a decent knowledge of the land, he could be hard to find. Especially if the RCMP officers are not Saskatchewan natives.
“I’d like to think that the police have these sorts of questions covered. There must be specialized officers (investigators, forensics specialists, profilers, etc. etc.) that can put a lot of these same questions together, and draw some theories based on fact. Plus other info we, the public, don’t know about.
“They ARE the greatest police force in the world!”
— JackFish
One, why do you think they are the greatest police force in the world? Other than blind and baseless patriotism, what evidence is there for this assertion?
I’m not a critic of the police; I’m a fan of them. I’m just curious what, if anything, causes you to state this.
Two, the issue isn’t whether they know police stuff. It’s whether they know farming, the territory, and the community.
Remember, RCMP officers aren’t allowed to start their careers near their homes so while they would be used to the towns they work in, businesses, etc., it’s a stretch to think most of them would be experts on the area.
Will they get him? Bloody hope so, however, I don’t see how you reached your conclusions.
Chris, there are many types of “”police””, but I was STRICTLY talking about the RCMP as a whole. Not municipal police, or county police or whatever. The Federal RCMP are more than just “beat cops” patrolling small-towns. Similar to the Americans’ FBI, CIA, etc., our RCMP contain those type of branches under the huge RCMP umbrella. I cannot understand how you could not conclude how great of a police force this is!?!?!
Ottawa was promising so many policy changes when Mayerthorpe occurred and so far nothing, except another Mayerthorpe type of situation involving Curt Dagenais. It’s really all about political correctness being paramount as far as treating the bad guy nice so as not to offend. It seems that the Canadian justice system no longer has power. The courts support police less,the victims of crime and law enforcement just keep taking the abuse, in this case, a bullet, and I have heard that in today’s world the police still have to treat the scumbag criminals with dignity and respect. They refer to them as “clients” rather than low life criminals they are. We need to stand up to the legal system that has been allowed to develope to it’s current state and the criminal element and say, enough is enough and start dishing out some old fashioned justice, politically correct or not. This shooters father,too, has a long history of animosity towards police and government and is now facing obstruction charges as he tried to zip out to his farm to possibly assist his son. Police found firearms and $27,000.00 in cash on his farm. Like father, like son. Hopefully he didn’t get bail today. It would be interesting to know the comparison of bad guy killed in the line of their dubious duty compared to peace officers killed on duty. I’m willing to bet the bad guys are winning! Jails allow gangs to organize, the food is great, television and movies are available, the gyms are state of the art and the responsibilities are nil. A great number of seniors don’t get that kind of service. It’s time for a real correction.
I’m talking about the RCMP too, JackFish. I’m pointing out some limitations of the force in a situation like this, which other people have commented on as well.
For example, the fact that they aren’t local to the area.
I’m not criticizing them… I’m just asking what, if anything, you’re basing your conclusion on that they are the best police force in the world. Once again, you haven’t given one affirmative reason why this is so other than, presumably, that they’re Canadian.
Actually Chris the force now does allow cadets to be stationed near if not in their home communities. The task force after the shootings were from all over Canada so local knowledge would not be strong.
As for all the vehicles around the country with keys left in them – unless you are carrying booster cables I doubt many would start.
If he was dead in that area, wouldn’t the police dogs sniff him out. You would think in this heat he would start to smell pretty quick?
I feel sorry for the police, all the bleeding hearts in the legislature etc. have made it tough for them. The cops have their hands tied and have to treat the criminals “with respect” whereas the criminals do what they darn well like.
My condolences to the families of the two mounties killed in the line of duty near Spiritwood. Question…..why was there a memorial service in Edmonton for the Mayerthorpe mounties but none of that here in Saskatchewan? That must knock the crap out of morale, I would think, of the rest of the police community!