20 Replies to “Public Unions vs. The Public”

  1. The only coruption is what the sun news network makes up. The have a democratic right to collective bargaining.

  2. the problem is with politicians who sign these labour agreements knowing they will eventually bankrupt the government at whatever level. they put their short term ” no lengthy strike by public employees” wish ahead of the financial responsibility they should be putting first.

  4. What? Unions corrupt? They have long ago lived out their best before date. Sorta like commies and socialists.

  5. I’m almost afraid to admit it but ….. having been a manager in the federal government (U.S.)….., I have seen first hand how government unions operate. There is nothing more inimical to good management of personnel and programs in government than employee unions. They are obstructionist and greedy in the BEST case. “Pigs at the trough” was one expression I used and lived to regret. I won’t even touch the worst case. And, since I worked with state employees as well, I found they were no different. ALL public employee unions should be banned. They are an insult to the tax paying public. I’ve been saying this to an empty room (no one listening) for 30 years.

  6. I belong to a public employee union and I don’t like my union at all. I’m not given a choice. If I want to work, I’m part of the union.
    In the last provincial election, I got a letter from my union saying that they were taking $60 of every member’s dues — surely illegal? — to contribute to McGuilty’s campaign — which would be one of the reasons this moral-pygmy twit got re-elected, simply to prorogue parliament for six months and then go AWOL for good.
    When I point out to other union members that our salaries and benefits are gold-plated and paid for by taxpayers, most of whom make nothing near what we make, they’re singularly unimpressed. I guess because I haven’t always belonged to a union, I can see both sides. Entitled union members who’ve never worked in the private sector wear blinkers the size of pumpkins. They’ll never acknowledge how good they’ve got it — and how bad their good fortune makes others. Eventually greed will bring the unions down because there won’t be any more money to pay their inflated salaries and benefits.
    Scripture’s admonition to “love your neighbour as yourself” takes on added heft when confronting unions’ greed, graft, and singular lack of gratitude.

  7. “ALL public employee unions should be banned. They are an insult to the tax paying public. I’ve been saying this to an empty room (no one listening) for 30 years.”
    No,David. Some of us are listening. I have worked for the last 15 years in a union free trade,and have my own company. Two union shops in the same area have gone down the tubes in 6 months.The former employees came to our place looking for a job.HEH. Not a hope in heck,guys/gals.You start working,sweeping the floor.Minimum wage,and no benefits,pensions,etc.A few did sign up,and they are excellent employees.And they have been rewarded.They now realize that they help us improve,you also improve.They learned that you must be a productive employee,not a parasite.The gal who answers the phone for me,she is polite,informative,knows the product inside out and backwards,because she was willing to learn,and also knows the customer is NOT always right.She now has benefits,and she earned them,along with a very decent paycheck.When you help the company PRODUCE,without so called union benefits,and gubbermint handouts,you can only go forward.
    And yeah.I have been “boycotted” by said unions.They are still down the tubes,and we quietly carry on serving our customers.And by “we”,I mean everybody,from the “top” down to the gal answering the phone.Without her,there would be no business,and no need for her or me.
    But ask Sid Ryan if he understands that concept.

  8. Unions run health care, government services and the education system in Canada. Yet the vast majority of Canadians don’t think we have a problem.
    Don’t expect the CBC to run a Fifth Estate investigation on this one. The CBC is the biggest joke going in this country and we do not a any politicans with the gonads to shut it down. That includes PMSH who I assume thinks he can manage the problem.

  9. Public Unions vs. The Public
    It’s pretty clear who prevails once they run out of other people’s money.

  10. Actually you are conflating collective bargaining – which is a “right” with closed shop laws which are not rights but rather laws currently in force in some states and all provinces that were enacted by democratically elected governments but that can be removed via the same process.
    What lies at the root of union/employer strife is closed shop. States that had outlawed it have gone on to prosper and have higher employment rates than those who remain in the political thrall of unions. Thankfully more states and soon some provinces (AB Wildrose’s policy is to liberate the shop floor) are bringing freedom and “rights” to shop floors and worksites.

  11. No the only corruption is that Unions do not allow democracy. The right to not join or pay dues. Its the least Democratic organization we have.
    In effect you pay a tax so they can use your money against your own political beliefs.
    They have made this mandatory. That horse is called Totalitarianism.

  12. Public sector workers should have never been allowed to unionize in the first place. There’s an inherent conflict of interest in their very existence. Here’s why:
    Every few years Public Sector Union Officials (A) negotiate with Government Representatives (B) about what wages & benefits should be paid to the clients of ‘A’. There are two inherent problems with this. First, ‘B’ are not the ones paying for ‘A’. Another group, Taxpayers (C), are. Yet ‘C’ has no direct involvement in the negotiations. Furthermore, and even worse, ‘A’ actively works at controlling who are the people that make up ‘B’. To do this, ‘A’ frequently spends the money of ‘C’ to change the makeup of ‘B’ in their favour.
    That’s a complete Conflict of Interest that should never have been allowed. But it has gone too far now, committing more money than ‘C’ even has. There’s no correction that can be made save for disbanding Public Sector Unions altogether and then rectifying the “promised” payments in much the same way that a bankruptcy court would. If you think this sounds “nuts” then you clearly don’t understand basic mathematics: the promised monies can NEVER be paid so let’s stop pretending otherwise.

  13. There’s no correction that can be made save for disbanding Public Sector Unions altogether…
    Banning compulsory membership might be politically wiser. That would avoid shrieks of “denying collective bargaining rights” and, if lessons can be learned from the USA experience, union membership decreases and productivity increases in right-to-work jurisdictions.

  14. Robert;
    Unfortunately another conflict of interest between A and B is that quite often B’s pay is indirectly based on whatever settlement A gets. The makeup of B is as you suggested actively manipulated. How many school boards have spouses on them? A hugh number here in BC.

  15. Great Video
    In 5 minutes, it explains why public employee unions are not only a drain on our economy, but a threat to our democracy.
    Save the video to your favorites, and send it to those who try to defend public sector unions.

  17. The problem with the public service is not the unions but the many lazy and incompetent managers that are in supposedly charge. This is best exemplified in Canada by the incompetent and corrupt President of the Treasury Board, Tony “Gazebo” Clement.

  18. The first problem with the unions is that fictional concept called a “bargaining unit” – a group of employees deemed to have the same interests and who therefore must be represented together. This is the first notion that has to disappear.
    There is nothing wrong with unions provided they are voluntary. This and only this respects freedom of association, which is guaranteed in our Charter of Rights. That document is heavily flawed but they got this bit right. The problem is that it is not respected in practice.
    Compulsory unions should not be doing anything or spending money on anything except wages and benefits. With voluntary unions, there might be a case for broader spending on “social issues”, because a member who disagreed could just quit.
    In the 1991 Lavigne decision, the Supreme Court of Canada got this last issue dead wrong, to the detriment of all Canadians (except union leaders). Judge Wicked Bertha Wilson refused to accept the correct definition of freedom of association, falsely claiming that it did not include the right not to associate. She may have known the law but she was ignorant of fundamental human rights – precisely the wrong person who should have been “interpreting” the Charter.
    The whole union field becomes even more ridiculous when you discover that some large unions try to organize employees in shops they have no real interest in. For example, I read the other day that CUPE is trying to get a union going in Westjet airlines, which has nothing whatsoever to do with government employees.
    I agree that the public sector should not allow unions at all. The Supreme Court decision on this issue came some decades ago, I believe in the 1970s, and I haven’t read it.

  19. uiop, since you appear to be a staunch supporter of public sector unions, will you be honest enough to declare whether you are a member of one and if so, which? I think it important that one provide such a disclaimer in the interest of fairness.
    Public sector workers should not be unionized for the simple fact that they hold MONOPOLY positions. If my local grocer’s workers strike I can go to their competitor, thus putting pressure on the employer to reach an equitable settlement for fear of losing business. Or, if I don’t wish to deal with union workers who may provide inferior service, I can again go to a competing business. With government we have no such option.
    This doesn’t even take into account the higher pay, extremely generous benefits (including bankable sick days and often, every other Friday off} and indexed pensions, coupled with iron-clad job security vs. the private sector worker who is taxed to provide them.
    How can we justify foreign service workers {Level 2 – $83,000} striking for more, while crippling the agricultural and tourism industries whose workers earn less than half that amount?
    I have a relative who manages the aquatic programs for a medium sized municipality, earning $120K/yr. Sure, he has a couple of degrees but he has never, ever considered seeking work in the private sector because he knows he could never enjoy the pay, perks and benefits that taxpayers provide for him.
    How can this be justified?

  20. uiop – By that standard, the one-time frozen snapshot, China will never be close to matching the USA in terms of economy. However, economies are like living beings. They never stay the same, they grow or they shrink. Stagnation is one form of shrinking. If the host has not been killed by the parasites that does not mean that it’s healthy, whatever size it may be. The overpayment for productivity that is heralded as a great thing in your link is actually showing the opposite: that the parasites are overcoming the host. What will the parasites do when the host dies? Some will move on to a new host. Some will change and adapt. And some will turn canabistic on the younger union members.

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