212 Replies to “Say What You Like About Harper (Bumped)”

  1. I especially liked the stunned look on Bob Ray’s face when he said “This is not the way to act in a democracy.”
    I expected him to continue whining “It’s not fair if we can’t force taxpayers to support the losers!”
    It’s not often I get a laugh from CTV news. Good for Harper. Now for the bureaucracy.

  2. The single problem with limiting campaign contributions and spending is that to get your name before the electorate, you must already have your name out to the electorate!
    Anyone trying to start a new party is hamstrung by a lack of money. Incumbents will always get “free” media coverage because they are the incumbent ie. the local media should report what the local MP says as it rightfully is news. An unknown candidate will be ignored and cannot buy media coverage because of funding limits and campaign spending limits.

  3. pete e: “I don’t want a country where money can buy elections.”
    Money can’t buy elections. The Charlottetown Accord referendum proved that, where the Yes side outspent the No by 12-1 and still lost (thank God, or the country would have been toast by now).

  4. “‘They’re going to have a hell of a fight on their hands. This is not the way to behave in a democracy,’ Liberal leadership contender Bob Rae told CTV News.”
    Yeah, it is. Democracy is about electing governments from among the parties that spring up and that get voluntary support from the electorate. It isn’t about taking money from all taxpayers just because you think you want to get elected and think you are better than everyone else.
    “‘For the smaller parties, this public funding is what allows us to participate fully in democracy,’ said New Democrat MP Pat Martin.”
    So why don’t the Libertarians, Christian Heritage parties etc. get public funding? They barely get to participate at all, let alone “fully”. What’s with the arbitrary vote percentage cutoff? Why not pay $1.95 per vote, period?

  5. Would the election take place before or after the Liberal Leadership convention? Would Dion get to lead the Libranos into another election…? Stay, Stephane, stay! On another note from the article, I think Harper intentionally bloated the incoming cabinet so that he could shuffle and shrink it at an opportune time. Parliamentary chess at its finest!

  6. Johnnyonline said:
    “corporations cannot influence elections the way they did in the past”
    …until they get creative. Weren’t you watching that Obama thing down south? Granted Corporate/union influence is harder now and for that I am grateful.
    nv53 said:
    “Money can’t buy elections.”
    True, message matters AND money matters. A clever, popular start-up’s best hope is 10% vote and/or 2 seats in a single election (think Reform). To win, you need to be in the ballpark financially (to have, say, 1/3 the money of the wealthiest party.)
    It’s in our long-term interest not to hobble startup parties with a viable platform . (And it’s in our short-term interest not to hobble small parties with a non-viable platform 🙂

  7. pete e,
    Somebody mentioned that the policy has been in place for 6 years. So your example of the Reform Party doesn’t make sense. If anything it proves that if a startup party has enough followers (which in turn provides financial backing from within)then it would be able to make it to Ottawa on its own momentum–without the requirement of gov’t monies.
    favill

  8. Bob Rae: “They’re going to have a hell of a fight on their hands. THIS IS NOT THE WAY TO BEHAVE IN A DEMOCRACY [my emphasis].”
    Well, Bobo should know how not to behave in a democracy, but in this case he’s dead wrong.
    This is EXACTLY the way to behave in a democracy: Save the taxpayers money that shouldn’t be paid to the political parties in the first place. You want a real democracy, Bobo, where political parties (and hacks) aren’t constantly guzzling at the public trough?
    Then, this is it: Make political parties (all FIVE of them in Canada) raise their own funds. If Canadians think what they’re offering is relevant and good for the country, they’ll pony up the funds.
    That’s democracy.
    As for pete e’s statement: “”I don’t want a country where money can buy elections.” ARE YOU KIDDING? That describes Canada under the Librano$. The fact that political parties like the Greens and the BQ are almost solely propped up by public monies, making it difficult for any party to gain a majority in the HOC, actually cripples our democracy.
    I say to PMSH “Bring it on.” Let these whining pigs at the trough find their own food. I’m tired of feeding the whole darned bunch of them.

  10. I have some misgivings on this one. A reduction in public subsidies is sound policy but what of the ramifications? A bankrupt LPC? The PM’s move may create such vitriol in the left that, collectively, they may rise up en masse and defeat us. Not an entirely implausible scenario given their very political lives are at stake.
    And $30,000,000 in savings. Really? That’s the equivalent of one oral discharge into a spittoon. Notwithstanding the fact that Canada’s economy is relatively well grounded, the gloabl economy could be headed towards a meltdown and PMSH moves to cut public subsidies? Gimme a break. Hardball politics for sure but I don’t like it. A pure salute to optics for sure.
    I’ll now remove my shirt and tie myself up to the grating to receive my lashes. But please keep it under a 100. 😉

  12. PhilM is right on the money. The CP will benefit in the short term but the backlash will come back and bite PMSH in the ass big time. For every action there’s an equal and opposite reaction except in the case of politics when the reaction can be much greater than action that caused it.
    Trying to obliterate your competition in one move will cause them to strengthen. A better way is to starve them out slowly. This will cause them either not see it coming or to make one bad move after another, eventually leading to a permanent demise.

  13. Anybody seen a name of an actual person associated with this other than “senior officials”? Or is it an election style trial balloon designed to make the opposition parties howl for no reason and make themselves look petty and selfish?

  14. Anybody seen a name of an actual person associated with this other than “senior officials”? Or is it an election style trial balloon designed to make the opposition parties howl for no reason and make themselves look petty and selfish?

  15. It is a great move. It leaves the government pinned. If they refuse to go along they will force an election that they can not afford. If they go along they will lose money they can not afford. The only way to save themselves might be to make a deal that allows them to survive. Perhaps by agreeing to pass a stack of legislation unhindered and unamended through the Parliament and Senate.

  16. It wont pass but the opposition will be made to look like the fools they are. This is all being filmed for the next set of election commercials.
    “In uncertain times Canadians save, they postpone and they forgoe. Some parents put off music lessons, others…go without dinner.
    Canada’s opposition parties continue to take government subsidies, fly business class, have catered buffets and private massage. The only belt tightening is from an expanding waisline.
    Someone is out of step with the times.”

  18. “It wont pass but the opposition will be made to look like the fools they are. This is all being filmed for the next set of election commercial”
    BINGO !!
    Fish, barrel, shoot.

  19. Oh Poor Me, Cry Me Another Song.
    Yesterday we seen a clip on Davies & Dusanjh crying the BLUE’S because they might have to Fly Economy.
    Today there was a clip on the Perks the MP’s get, From free Meals To Massage’s
    Where your socialist Now! They are the ones Yelling at the Govt to do something because of the Economic Crisis But will they Give up any Perks NO all they want to do is Complain Howmany Cabinet Ministers are in Limos.
    Typical Response from the Left, Do as I say Not as i Do.
    I hope this Taxpayer Gift to the Political Parties is Gone forever.
    BTW I would like to Know Which Party & when this started?
    Anyone?

  20. Konichiwa May-San, Layton-San, Dion-San, Duceppe-San. Your rebellion has failed. Do you prefer financial or political seppuku? I shall show you the correct method for the first cut.
    Thank you gracious Lord Harper-Sama.
    We the Liberal Party choose financial seppuku.
    We the NDP — political.
    We the Block — political.
    We the Greens shall accept the choice of the others.
    Very good, then let us unsheath our budgetary swords that in the hope of our political rebirth we may show the Canadian people how political parties die honorably.

  21. The biggest Joke of All is that the taxpayers of Canada give a Gift to a Political Party that only runs Canidates in 1 province & they want to break up the Country. And on top of that We the Taxpayer give a gift to another Political Party that dont even have Representation in the HOC.
    Good Riddance Finaly a PM with the Balls to Take action When the Taxpayers the ones that pay their wages are taking a hit.

  22. Bob Rae: “They’re going to have a hell of a fight on their hands. THIS IS NOT THE WAY TO BEHAVE IN A DEMOCRACY”
    What else can you expect from a silk stocking closet communist?

  23. The oppoition parties might just find they dont have any support for this position.
    Sure Canadians want a fair fight in an election but they dont like being taken for patsies. In a weird way the cons may actually be helping the opposition parites end their addiction.
    I think Pat Martin may have spoken out of turn…no shock there….it is in the Dippers best interest to go along with this. It will kill the Greens and kill the Libs and stick a fork in the BQ where the Dippers can pick up votes.
    I think nasty Jack will show up and decide that this should be done….Does harper need to shine the silverware for Layton as well….my goodness this is best thing for the DIPS….not doing it means they deserve the status as perpetual also rans.

  24. “I am in favor of cutting taxes under any circumstances and for any excuse, for any reason, whenever it’s possible.”
    Milton Friedman
    Elections became just another way these scumbgs feathered their nests with our money.
    There was an incentive to vote against the government and throw our country into an unneeded and wasteful election.
    Canadians deem that the block be given 75,000 dollars not 3.5 million.
    Now maybe these politicos will be forced to do something instead of creating over the top false outrage at every little thing.
    Al a Boob Ray’s, hissy fit.

  25. Good.
    Voting should come from the will to have a particular MP elected to provide the voice in Ottawa for a segment of Canadians.
    It was very sneaky for the former government to bring in a financial bonus based on that vote, not for the people they represent, but for themselves.

  26. It’s actually a fascinating process to watch.
    First, we acknowledge that it was Chretien who set this up when he stopped the large (multithousands) corporate and individual donations to political parties. These big corporate donations and wealthy individual donations (all with generous tax reductions which meant that the taxpayer WAS in effect subsidizing the parties) were the basis of the Liberal financial power. Chretien removed this elite niche of funders. Harper further reduced individual donations to the current level of 1,100 per individual per year.
    Chretien instead set up the taxpayer funding of a per-vote subsidy. Remember, the corporate and individual donations were given substantial tax reductions so, in effect, the taxpayer was heavily subsidizing the Party. BUT, BUT…without voting for that party. So, it was a strategy that forced the taxpayer to subsidize a party he didn’t want.
    And another But, But..is that the Liberals, as the party of the elite, always ignored the peasants on the street and hobnobbed only with the wealthy and privileged.
    And the Bloc? Quebecers are not known for their personal involvement; they expect The Government, and especially the federal govt, to pay for everything. So, they didn’t have much of a donation pool right from the start.
    Chretien’s tactic was ‘if you voted for the party, your taxes will go towards the party’.
    What if you don’t pay any taxes? That means that someone else is paying your shot. So, we are back to the original system, where taxpayers are paying for parties that they did not vote for.
    Chretien’s original intention, of course, was to cripple the Liberal Party, so that it would be part of his legacy that – after him – there was nothing. That’s his narcissism speaking.
    But now? All the parties will scream. If they are seen by the public as ‘living off the trough’, that’s bad optics. None of them, except for the CBC, have much financial support by the public. Hmm, aren’t leftists, so many of whom are in govt jobs – aren’t they willing to donate to their political parties? No? Why not? They get it back in their tax refunds!!!
    We must know that none of them could afford to incite an election over their assumed ‘entitlements’ to the taxpayers’ money.
    The opposition can’t coalesce and ask to form the govt – not over their assumed entitlements to the taxpayers’ money.
    So, will they pass it? And then, plot with the Liberal dominated Senate to refuse it? That would give Harper more proof to kick out the Senate, as blocking the Will of Parliament.
    Or will the NDP support the CPC while the Liberals and Bloc refuse?
    Heck, what a chess game. Played by a master.

  27. To hear Bob Rae being so offended because of financial cut backs in these challenging times and when even unions are being asked to cut back only tells Canadians and Liberal leadership voters that Rae has not learned a dam thing from his disasterous days as Ontario Premier when he thought to spend your way out of a recession was the way to go.
    He is misleading Canadians when he says he learned his lesson when he was Premier – unless he now believes that everybody should cut back but himself and his chosen ones.

  28. “Will the prime minister reduce his cabinet to a sensible level?” – Wayne Easter
    I really hate it when I start my day by agreeing with a Lib but I can take heart from it only being partial agreement – 26 is still too many to be a sensible level.

  29. Oh the weeping and wailing from the Opposition, snared by Harper, so delicious!
    They’re all between a rock and a hard place on this one and they look good in this proverbial place.
    The funniest is the hooting from the verbose, sarcastic Pat Martin of the kitchen table party, among first out of the gate.
    The best is the Bloc will be getting their nuts in the mousetrap and it’s long overdue. Why should we in the ROC subsidize a group of Blocheads out to separate from the Country.

  30. Any single individual, or incorporated entity, like a union, association, corporation, NGO, CBO can make a donation to a federal political party that is limited to $1100 in a single tax year. In fact, if the donation exceeds that amount, it must be refunded to the donor, during the tax year it is collected. A party may not take donations for next year’s tax calendar during this year’s calendar.
    Thank you JC fop this great policy.
    The CPC is not controlled by corporations; it is financed by thousands of people across this country that ponies up $550/avg each, every year because they believe in a vision that CPC represents.
    This donation, by the way, is already partially funded by the tax payer. There is a large TAX CREDIT applied to every dollar raised from tax payers.
    I’m guessing the tax credit stays. And all the other parties are welcome to use the tax credit to create revenue for their own internal and election operations.

  31. I will be donating to the CPC for the first time this year if this passes. I think a facebook campaign should be started to support this move and to support the CPC even more to make up for the funding and to suck it away from the LPC and BQ even more.

  34. A very smart move, by our P M, hard to believe that 86% of the BQ’s funding comes from us, as for the rest “root hog or die”
    Cheers Bubba

  35. Comment of the Day goes to ET (so far)
    Heck, What a Chess Game. played by a master
    Bang On ET Bang on.
    Kate this topic should be moved up, this baby is going to be the talk of the Coffee Shops for days.
    Man iam going to be on CPAC today at 4 for sure & i hope the Camera’s pan the Opposition Bench’s.
    Now i Know Turkeys can Fly, Cause the opposition will be just flapping. The Scrums after will be something else, Oh the Agony of it All.

  36. So Bob say’s this is not the way to behave in a democracy. What a load of BS.
    For any of you who are against this move, please explain how the parties raised money before Cretin’s hand dipped into the pot?
    *crickets*
    My thoughts exactly.
    I believe this proves that the Liberals saw the downward trend back in the 1990’s in funding from grass roots donations. So Cretin found a clever way to keep the war chest full without that support. Party of the people my ass.
    I hear a death knell. Or should I say: “THEY” hear a death knell.

  37. So, according to Deceivin’ Stephen and Deficit Jim…
    – economic stimulus to businesses and Canadian workers… can wait
    – making a decision one way or the other about bailling out the auto sector… can wait
    – balanced budgets (and avoiding the payment of interest to foreign investors)… can wait
    – cutting spending for luxury flights to cabinet members… can wait
    … but the one thing the Conservatives find they can do is practice transparent petty partisanship to change the rules of Canadian electoral democracy, once again, in their favour.
    If this was part of a larger economic plan, maybe you could convince Canadians that this is about the economy and not simply about sticking it to the opposition. I actually don’t like the subsidy.
    But does Deceivin’ Stephen really think that Canadians are so dumb they won’t see this as a transparent petty partisan distraction from dealing with the real issues of the economy.
    As the Liberals found out in 2006 and Deceivin’ Stephen will find out in 2009, Canadians aren’t so dumb as he thinks we are.

  39. Poor Ted, desperation has reached epic proportions.
    The only thing Canadians will remember will be form the endless clips of Ujjal whining on about having to fly economy and Boob Rae saying it is not democratic.
    The more the opposition complains, the better it works for PMSH.
    Harper has skewered the opposition, put them on a really hot BBQ and then turned up the head and slowed down the rotation speed.
    What a delicious meal he is cooking up.

  40. Ted:
    So, Harper somehow caused these ‘real issues of the economy.’
    You figure Canada’s going to have a deficit?
    Just listen to the screaming as more and more money is left in the hands of the taxpayer.
    The screaming sound you’ll hear will be from the people who figure they know how to spend your money better than you can.
    I’m just going to sit back and watch the fun, while enjoying the money I worked hard to get.
    Any questions?

  41. “Harper has skewered the opposition, put them on a really hot BBQ and then turned up the head and slowed down the rotation speed.”
    Exactly, Fred. Canadians will see right through this transparent attempt. Deceivin’ Stephen has shown he cares about one thing and one thing only: screwing the Liberals. All the “we have to make Parliament work”, “we need to work together for Canadians” is all BS.
    The problem for him is that Canadians don’t want any more of this partisan BS and that’s all that Deceivin’ Stephen and Deficit Jim have to offer.

  42. Ted, how do you stimulate business, bail out the auto sector and balance the budget, all at the same time? I like the belt tightening optics of the funding cuts. I expect other measures will be introduced on a timely and thoughtful basis.

  43. I am still giggling at this cut. If, this means the end of the Bloc and the Green party, yahoo! To fund a party with taxpayers dollars that wants to separate from Canada, this is way over due. If it means that we will no longer have a party that pulls 8-9% of the vote away from the core parties, good, (maybe, Lizzy with have to take the bus next time). Let the Liberal’s elect another academic, look what Dion couldn’t accomplish. I was so proud of PM Harper at the APEX summit last weekend, Canada has a leader finally that the rest of the world respects. With this move, maybe now the rest of Canada will support the best Prime Minister this country has had in a very long time! This is like watching a Chess Master, taking out the opposition’s “pawns” one at a time. Check, Mate.

  45. Hey Ted,
    Perhaps being a lawyer, you only know how to count the 28 hours a day you get to bill your clients.
    For those of us who can count, the government has put up $100,000,000,000 (so far) PLUS a plan to guarantee interbank lending. Given our population is approx 1/10th the size of the US (and our banks aren’t even bankrupt,) that’s the equivalent of a TRILLION put up by the US (where their banks are bankrupt.)
    As for the automakers, I notice the US put them off as well. First and foremost, it would only make sense to a liberal/dipper/lawyer to throw good money after bad. Either the Detroit 3 AND their unions agree to completely restructure, AND the US bails out their side, OR there is no point in the Canadian government acting at all. So yes, auto bailouts can wait. Preferably forever.
    As for balanced budgets, I’m sure Harper would like to balance the budget by slashing spending but that’s not what you do to stimulate the economy in a crisis. Your points are contradictory.
    Cutting spending for flights is happening. So no wait.
    It seems the only thing you have is bitterness that your party is bankrupt because all of its lawyer supporters refuse to give their own money to fund them. No, you lot expect the rest of us to do that for you. So your quip that you are “against” the handout is put up against your more-than-usual hostility to Harper and I’m going to say you aren’t being entirely honest.
    As for the odds the handout will go, it’s one hell of a risk for Harper. The left’s need for other people’s money may be the only thing that gets them all to cooperate enough to form a coalition which would take Harper off the PM’s seat. The Bloc wouldn’t work with the Libs for any other reason. Given the GG is a CBC lefty, I can see it happening.
    As a side note, it seems the “death of democracy” is when the leftards don’t get their own way. Just like a “stolen” election is one where they lose. Fricken arseholes.

  46. Ted better have a look at that poll on ctv.ca
    Looks like the Public that you think will backlash the PM don’t agree with you
    Now this is What Canadians Want

  47. I wonder, does the $1.95 per vote have anything to do with falling voter turnout? This is a question I have never heard asked.

  48. Also, why to folks like Ted come up with these stupid names – deceivin’ Steven? Almost as funny as lyin’ Brian. Of course I do remember more witty ones from many years ago such as Ed Bentbroadly but I digress. Perhaps we should have a little contest and think up some fun names for the leaders of the Crying Opposition. Taliban Jack is taken.

  49. I dunno Warwick, seems to me a heck of a lot of Canadians are at least just as likely to say ‘We’re all suffering here, and your first major act is to carry on with more of the same stupid partisan crap? This is why we gave you a minority again. None of you can be trusted to think first about Canadians, only yourselves.’

  50. No Ted,
    What it seems like is the Liberals and most of the media are simply unaware or deliberately lying about the 100 BILLION already allocated, on top of the other simulative measures taken and on the boards. Like multiple (and significant) drops in interest rates, acceleration of infrastructure spending, guarantees for interbank lending to increase liquidity…
    Action still counts if the libs and journalists ignore it. Just cause you pretend it didn’t happen, doesn’t mean your invented reality becomes real.
    It seems to me like the partisan lies and rhetoric is going mostly in the other direction. The Tories are losing the most money in those cuts. So quit whining.
    Harper can both deal with the economy AND bankrupt his rivals at the same time. Besides, the libs spent more than they could afford (as usual,) and put themselves in the mess they are in. It’s not the taxpayers responsibility to pay for them. They’ve had some time to figure out how to fundraise beyond Power Corp and the Bank CEO’s.

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