The Lies Jack Layton Told Me

62 Replies to “The Lies Jack Layton Told Me”

1. Fred – you have one thing wrong. Layton’s pension doesn’t depend on corporations. He’s been on the public payroll virtually his whole life. His pension depends on the largesse of taxpayers. Its publicly funded and inflation protected so he doesn’t need to worry about how much the economy get screwed up, because you can bet his kind will take their cut before anyone else gets theirs.

2. GYM,
   Nice try, but faulty logic.
   Those $450 government gifts are indeed a second incoming arrow as they do Not come directly from the *customer*.
   They come from *taxes-paid* to cover benefits and services to the tax payer.
   Taxes pay for values of good government, freedom and countless services.
   If you think you get no value for taxes, try living in Darfur for six months.= TG

3. How much of that $27 billion in taxes does Exxon pay vs. how much is written off?

4. Any significant ExxonMobile tax write off and your monthly cheque will shrink proportionately. = TG

5. “In 2003 alone, 46 companies paid zero or less in federal income taxes. These 46 companies told their shareholders they earned U.S. pretax profits in 2003 of $42.6 billion, yet they received tax rebates totaling $5.4 billion. Almost as many companies, 42, paid no tax in 2002, reporting $43.5 billion in pretax profits, yet receiving $4.9 billion in tax rebates. From 2001 to 2003, the number of no-tax companies jumped from 33 to 46, an increase of 40 percent.”
   http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Tax_page/Freeloaders_BushTaxes.html

6. Pete, maybe you should actually consider reading what I am writing. I am not talking about 2 different eras I am talking about 2 different time lines a not inconsiderable difference. Both time lines end today so are relevant.
   What does raising the price after a loss got to do with the conversation.
   Taxes are for the most part a known. If they weren’t no one could do business because you would have no way to factor in the ability to be sustainable. You couldn’t plan ahead and build a new plant because you wouldn’t know what your net net position would be.
   How would a business plan for contingencies like disasters if they have no clue what their net profit position is going to be.
   Every dime of costs are factored into the costs of any product. Neglect the second largest cost to your business and you wont be in business very long.
   Lastly if your premise where correct then insurance companies could not exist because how would you ever know what premium to charge because hey you can’t read the future.

7. Iberia,
   Interesting site but hardly a neutral authority.
   New Society Publishers
   PO Box 189, Gabriola Island
   BC, Canada VOR LXD
   Very green, very well meaning very biased.
   Even so, the site lists many legitimate Income Tax deferral methods for corporations only the inflated values seem problematic.
   Did it occur to you that the USA IRS is all powerful and not at all likely to allow undue grace to any corporation.
   Maybe if you had an impeccable source like CSM or Brookings. = TG

8. Jeff, pardon me for being rude, but are you stupid? How can a company know in advance their tax burden, when that burden is based on profits? No profit, no taxes, small profit, small tax burden, etc. Therefore it’s impossible to factor your taxes into your pricing. Let me make this extremely simple for you to understand. Company A manufactures widgets. It costs them $10 to make. They sell them for $15. At year end, when their accountants submit their tax return, they made zero profit. Therefore no taxes. The next year, they do some better advertising, sell a whole bunch more. Still cost $10 to make, still sell for $15. This time they report a profit of $20 million, and have to pay 38% of that $20mil to the Feds. Get it? So now explain to me how your statement that the customer is the one paying the taxes works. Because in one year, when the customer bought the widget for $15, there was no tax paid. But in the next year, same widget for $15, now there’s taxes to pay. Why didn’t the customer have to pay more for the widget?

9. TG:
   Sorry, my response to you got filtered last night. Google “corporate tax freeloaders” and educate yourself.

10. I understand that this can be a difficult concept to get your head around but nevertheless I will try
    again.
    Where does the money originate to pay those taxes, is it created out of thin air or does it come from someones pocket to pay for some product.
    If a companies costs are greater than its revenues then they don’t pay taxes, but that has nothing to do with where the money comes from to pay the taxes.

11. I think you’re all looking at this incorrectly in terms of who pays corporate taxes.
    In my opinion, corporate taxes are NOT from the corporation’s pockets and they are NOT from the customers. The people who are paying corporate taxes are the shareholders.
    If there were no corporate taxes, this money would be distributed to the shareholders. When the corporation pays tax, it comes from this money that rightfully belongs to the shareholder.
    But, then again, what do I know…I let my wife handle all the money.

12. Jeff, it’s only a difficult concept because you’re making it difficult. By your logic, where does the money in the customers pocket originate from? Are they manufacturing money at home in their basement? Or did they get it from their employer? By your logic, the consumer isn’t paying the corporate taxes, the consumer’s employer is! And that’s a ridiculous argument to make. Corporate taxes are the price of being successful. The more successful the business, the more taxes paid. But that cost isn’t passed on to consumers. Otherwise, prices would fluctuate drastically from year to year depending on whether the company posted a profit or a loss. And that’s not how it is.