Between 2009 and 2017, the price of solar panels per watt declined by 75 percent while the price of wind turbines per watt declined by 50 percent.
And yet — during the same period — the price of electricity in places that deployed significant quantities of renewables increased dramatically. […]
What gives? If solar panels and wind turbines became so much cheaper, why did the price of electricity rise instead of decline?
As an electrical engineer with a Ph.D. and 20+ years of experience there is so much I could say about this.
These technologies are largely nonsense. Solar may have a role in some very limited cases in areas with plenty of sun and mild climates, but the tired suggestions by the Green Fascists that Canada for example can easily be powered only by wind and solar – if we would just get on with it! – are irresponsible nonsense.
Wind and solar are the playthings of wealthy left-wing liberals. Almost everywhere in North America the electricity market is regulated, and this is the prime reason wind and solar have made any headway at all. The second reason is that wind and solar live like a sort of parasite on base-load electricity that comes from hydro, coal, nuclear, and natural gas operated turbines. The more that parasite grows, the more it is becoming apparent that the stupid idea of putting wind and solar everywhere will never ever work.
Here in BC at various Utility Commission hearings BC Hydro as openly called solar electricity that is sold back to the grid by homeowners as “dirty”. They are prepared to accept some of that electricity to keep vain politicians happy, but they are not prepared to have it completely pollute their grid.
Shellenberger is right, but there’s an additional point not included here. Electricity is a manufactured product. It must be made to precise standards specifying constant voltage, frequency, and amperage. Intermittent sources do not do this and cannot do this because of solar and wind variations. Integrating intermittent sources into an electrical system which demand these product standards is where the excess cost comes in.
The current economic system also brings in unnecessary cost. Unlike any other manufactured good, electricity cannot be inventoried. And it must be supplied at the instant of demand. So, to counter the variability of intermittency, other generators must pick up the load instantly. This entails additional cost. As the proportion of intermittent generation rises, so too does the cost of countering intermittency rise. It does not really matter if solar panels were free; the electricity costs will still rise.
Excellent points.
When considering the costs to hard working families it is tragic that there is no legal way to penalize the companies peddling these technologies as well as the politicians forcing them on us.
The Green Fascists want to go after big oil for their purported role in so-called global warming. Does that mean we can go after the fascists for lying about low-carbon energy? What is good for the goose is good for the gander, no?
And some people still wonder why Trump got elected.
BC, I can suggest two things:
1. Left of centre governments always prefer greater dependency on government services by the public. Remember Orwell: “The object of Power is Power.”
2. The Green Fascists are convenient and useful to the gas companies. They’ve been funding antinuclearism since the late 1960s, funneling it through a variety of US trust funds. The gas companies understand very well that more RE means more burnt gas.
I believe your point about the voltage and frequency requirements played a role in a state-wide grid failure (aka blackout) in Australia.. was it last year? The article I read on the subject noted that the grid operators had no choice but to significantly increase the allowed variance of both V & F on their grid as more & more green power (mostly wind, I think) got pumped into it. So the grid was already more unstable than would typically be seen. A particularly bad wind storm caused huge variations in the wind power supply (duh!) and the resulting increasing instabilities started tripping the grid. Moments later, the whole grid went down because they simply couldn’t bring replacement power on line fast enough. Green politics was clearly to blame.
I’m too lazy to search out a link at the moment but it probably won’t be too hard to find.
Yes it did.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-03-28/wind-farm-settings-to-blame-for-sa-blackout-aemo-says/8389920
Go to the first subhead. The grid collapse sequence is mostly there. There is a rather unsubtle attempt to blame the system protection settings for the failure. Those settings exist for a lot of very good reasons, power quality not the least of them. You cannot have a functioning electrical system injecting six voltage drops over two minutes.
The reality is that energy PRICES are set by POLITICS. Specifically, all the energy utilities are government regulated utilities. In my utility’s case … regulated by the California Public Utility Commission. The PUC has allowed PG&E to raise rates at 5x the national average … in order to PUNISH energy use. Imagine that! The PUC is punishing … rather than protecting … the consumer. The PUC has become a tool of leftist politicians bent on “greening” every energy user whether they like it or not.
PG&E spends $$ hundreds of millions of ratepayer dollars on virtue-signaling their “greenness”, their hiring “inclusivity”, and on LECTURING consumers on how NOT to consume the product they monopolistically produce. NONE of this should be funded by ratepayers. Except the leftist politicians have no interest in protecting the consumer. The leftist politicians have succeeded in making energy use an … IMMORAL act against Gaia. Thereby punishable with usurious energy costs! Imagine that … keeping your family safe and warm … is “IMMORAL”
Kenji, you have accurately described the state of many regulated electricity markets in North America today. The situation is more or less the same up here in Canada, Ontario being the best example, but other provinces not far off. (To say that Ontario’s energy policy is a disaster would be understatement of the century).
As I noted in my earlier post, if these markets were not regulated the Green Fascists would have a much harder time forcing their useless energy plans on the citizenry. If the market were free those consumers who wanted to be “green” would have to pay more than the rest. But unfortunately because of the nature of regulated markets we all end up paying for this utter stupidity.
The original idea of regulated markets was that regulators would manage them in such a way that even though the energy provider was a monopoly, the price of energy paid by the consumer would be close to what would be paid of the market were the market competitive.
That ideal has long ago been abandoned, with many regulators now becoming advocates for both the Green Fascists and shallow politicians who want to virtue signal at every turn.
It really is a travesty.
“However, forcing utilities to buy rooftop solar power at retail rates puts extraordinary strain on the grid, as these customers are not contributing to the two critical elements of electricity rates: transmission and distribution. Thus, as more and more power is purchased by power companies at retail rates, utilities have to shift more of the grid costs to non-rooftop solar customers. This is known as net metering.”
Net metering is a good single shot answer to the question.
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4174374-sunrun-inc-may-go-bankrupt
Posted this link in tips for May 15th as it principally discusses why Sunrun, a major competitor with Tesla in home energy, is likely to go bankrupt. Tesla will go first as their vehicles are not the only troubles they have.
Not trying to beat a horse. It’s just a good quick read.
Why is the cost of electricity rises despite the cost of the equipment going down? As our dear leader, the prancing pony put it the best way to reduce bad human behaviour is to drive up the cost of doing it….I guess we’re using too much electricity, time to go back to living in the cave and going to bed when the sun goes down.
The simple answer is that the price for electricity is no longer related to the cost of electricity. Just look at the breakdown of your electricity bill.
I appreciate the points made by BC. I know a wee bit about power transmission, like how 3 phase can get ‘out of sync’ over distances. I still cant figure out 3 phase transformers though.
but the notion of getting one’s surplus wind/solar amperage pushed *onto* the grid . . . how close to exact phase synchronization does it have to be, to be acceptable?
betcha a lot of the queens park mandarins havent a cluuuuue what phase synchronization even is.
which for me raises an enormous red flag as to the viability of their future policies, AND explains their current (pun intended) policies.
the pro wynnedfarm election signs are popping up now.
gawd help us if the LIEberals have ANY influence in the next prov gubbamint.
gawd help us.