In their never-ending march down the path of stupidity, the “intelligentsia” in Vancouver is now offering free booze to alcoholics. And of course, they have an endless number of “studies” to “prove” that this is a good idea.
David Berner disagrees.
In this video, John Robson & Barbara Kay discuss the insanity that has become reality.
Dear Trolls: If you’re going to take the time to add your voice here on SDA, at least strive to stay on topic. Thank you.
Its true. We need harm reduction for winos. Because who knows how many hundreds of thousands have died from drinking out of a dirty glass.
Thank you for the timely deletion, Oh Great SDA gods. Somewhere a bridge is saved.
I get the feeling from many researchers that the abstinence idea is excessively puritanical and therefore should be ruled out. Over the years there have been many attempts to teach alcoholics how to drink responsibly, There’s a book by journalist who tried one of those “breakthrough programs”, and almost died.
I wish these idiots would stop experimenting with desperate people – best way to stop drinking is to stop drinking. Counseling might help, get all the help you need, but you have to stop for a period of time before you even begin to think clearly enough to know the nature of the problem.
(Yes, as a matter of fact, this is very important to me.)
Interesting choice: Smirnoff.
” When chronic alcoholics dilute a 500 millilitre bottle of rubbing alcohol it provides the equivalent of 30 beers, says Joe,”
Well no Joe, saying it doesn’t make it so. Rubbing alcohol is 70% alcohol. Beer is 5% alcohol.Beer is sold in 355 ml. bottles. Math is hard,but it can be done.
The rubbing cocktail is 350 ml. of alcohol. A beer is 17.5 ml.of alcohol. Mr.Joe has overstated his case by 50%.
However,I think the program has benefits. These people are hopeless. They will be with us forever. If it is cheaper to give them their booze than to let them fend for themselves,it should be done. We can’t give them hot shots,so the cheaper alternative is to minimize our cost.
So, by this logic (and because I’ve been told that our culture is “addicted to oil”) is someone going to give us free gas for our cars? I’m guessing the answer is a big YESSIR! But only in prescribed amounts – for our own good, of course.
No wonder the occurrence of stockpiling and interest in self-defense “matériel” is on the rise.
How many on this board have driven thru the Downtown Eastside, let alone actually walked a block? It’s been 25 years since I dared walk it, but have been thru there on occasion since (driving, to see the ‘animals in the zoo’). I thought it was B-A-D then, but somehow it is even worse today, DESPITE “HARM REDUCTION” “THERAPY”.
The people they are treating are the worst of the worst of the worst. Beyond help, and a safe bet, aboriginal as well, typical of the DE population. I thought the natives wanted to get back to the land?….but I digress….. Their abuse of rubbing alcohol, mouthwash, etc, has already damaged their livers (and other organs) beyond repair. Giving them nice pure vodka may save them from being wasted drunk all the time, but they are still drunk, and just a matter of time until chronic organ failure and death. Work? Are you kidding? These people are chronic drains on our social safety net, drunk or sober.
Isn’t it better to just let them go quicker on their rubbing alcohol, than to give them vodka therapy, and keep them draining the health system for years longer? Why can’t we let Darwin’s theory reach its inevitable conclusion?
Miguided, but as with typical leftard programs, gives those working in it, a nice, warm, fuzzy feeling.
No, I didn’t click on the links, (Wanting to save some sort of sanity this afternoon)
BUT
How much booze do I have to consume before I get on the program and get me some McCallums Scotch 10-year-old cask strength?
And
Is it Abuse if they don’t give me the good stuff if that’s what I want?
So when do they start providing free child prostitutes for incurable pedophiles?
Vodka eh.
Forget it, I’m out,,, I’d put that stuff in my Diesel before I’d drink it.
Child prostitutes for pedophiles the next big progressive program. Giving drunks booze, yea like we didn’t see that coming.
Think I will go there to get primed before the game tonight …..lol.
Thank you tax payers for the free booze. Yeee hawww!
And I thought bc sucked …I thought Alberta was the place to live ..but this …this is a game changer …it am gone go there befor I go to the bar cause 7bucks a beer is no match for free stuff ..lol.
Duckin fummies!!!
So let me get this straight free booze for alcoholics ,free dope for druggies, so then free sex for sex addicts is next and after that free children for pedophiles, come on folks what comes after that help me here ..lol. What’s next ..lol..you just can’t make this stuff up….lol.
Why am I spending my after tax money on booze ?
So when do they start providing free child prostitutes for incurable pedophiles?
That is just about the most realistic comment on the whole ‘harm reduction’ fiasco I’ve seen, ever.
Booze is cheap and legal, it’s not like giving druggies all the free drugs they want as often as they want so they OD and stop petty crimes to feed their expensive addiction. Shooting galleries only make the problem worse.
The Downtown Eastside itself is a complete mystery to me. It’s on the most expensive real estate in Canada. Why does the city pay for these people to stay here, when they could be making money hand over fist from developers and property tax?
Wally said “These people are hopeless. They will be with us forever.”
No they won’t. They die at an alarming rate. They are replaced pretty quickly. If you find a way to make them live longer you will just have more of them to deal with.
I am addicted to food, and my car is addicted to gasoline. It’s not our fault. We are victims. Research shows that I am more productive and happy when fed. Same for my steed.
Wet houses are successful in treating alcoholics. One model in particular that provides housing and recognizes periods of sobriety between relapse has been shown to be effective with an impressive % of tenants remaining sober for a year.
That being said, the effectiveness of wet houses is due to housing and support as opposed to limiting alcohol consumption.
The program described in this article is a cheaper version that will not be as effective because it ignores the housing and support, recognition components. It was found that the freedom to fail can paradoxically lead to success – demanding perfection, by self or others, is part of the reason many are addicted to begin with.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/49885009/Wet-House-Stephanie-McIntyre-Churchill-Report-2009
Meanwhile here in Alberta booze is being taken away from the addicts:
http://www.globaltvedmonton.com/molson+pulls+high+alcohol+drink+from+shelves+after+becoming+popular+among+addicts/6442583662/story.html
I can see this going really well until one of these patients is involved in somebody’s death.
Why do we keep interfering with the laws of natural selection. Stupid is as stupid does. Who would of thought Forrest Gump was a visionary.
FKA gord— ” They die at an alarming rate. They are replaced pretty quickly “.
That is what I meant,not that each one will live forever.
There is a problem,the question is how to deal with it at the lowest cost to the working class. If giving them cheap vodka (not Smirnov’s)works,let’s do it.
It comes down to a moral question. Should we euthanize the derelicts or keep them alive at the lowest overall cost possible?
gordonkneehill @ 6:51, “So when do they start providing free child prostitutes for incurable pedophiles?”
That about sums up the ludicrousness of this idea.
Is it possible that this is being done deliberately to speed up the Darwin process.
Booze is cheap and legal, it’s not like giving druggies all the free drugs they want as often as they want so they OD and stop petty crimes to feed their expensive addiction. Shooting galleries only make the problem worse.
North of 60…. if that refers to your IQ, it ain’t much further north, is it?
It’s simply amazing to what length Intellectuals go in order to legitimacy there existence, believe me it isn’t about the betterment of the alcoholics life’s but there own.
On this one issue alone I disagree with SDA.
The alcoholics will get their preferred drug regardless, from noxious sources generally. These people cost the taxpayer enormous sums.
So a program that will dispense a drug to a drug addict is horrific because of what?
Will it do these people any more harm? No. Will it do less harm? Yes. Will it save the taxpayer some money? Yes.
Offending the sensitivities of a few persons is about all the detriment this program possesses.
If they would only do the same for cocaine, heroin, and prescription drug addicts.
Regards,
Gary Marshall
I’m an alcoholic.
Giving me liquor is like giving an atom bomb a detonator.
I joined A.A. (yes, good old-fashioned Alcoholics Anonymous), followed the 12-step program, and have been sober AND HAPPY ABOUT IT for almost a year.
These programs will not work. Correction, perhaps there are some people they will work for, but for alcoholics like me they will not work.
‘Nuff said.
When are the people going to wake up to the socialist/statist stupidity of the looney left…this is so stupid these people should be commited to asylum for the mentally ill..if the Eugenics people were still around in force….these people would have a classifacation for sure…///
Free booze? What if I want foo-foo drinks, are vegetables available? Are the “have-not” provinces going to fund this?
And *most* importantly, where do I sign up?
wally said “It comes down to a moral question.”
Actually it doesn’t.
Well I said if they were going to give out free contraception, I wanted free whiskey and ice cream too. So where is my Ben & Jerry? http://evilbloggerlady.blogspot.com/2012/02/debbie-wasserman-schultz-says-all-women.html
Well I said if they were going to give out free contraception, I wanted free whiskey and ice cream too. So where is my Ben & Jerry? Wee.
Ken, it’s all about perception. What is called the MSM has pre-decided on many issues, shoving themselves into the advocacy slot. Yay.
It ain’t for nothing that Kate has a category called “Not Waiting for the Asteroid”.
PiperPaul
Is it possible that this is being done deliberately to speed up the Darwin process.
You may be only slightly north of 60 but you’re definitely above the positively equatorial kulak. What was 60 anyway, cretin, imbecile, moron, or little dead mind?
Giving me liquor is like giving an atom bomb a detonator.
I hope you don’t explode anytime soon (just looking out for you). Have you notified local authorities of your potential?
In any case, the runaway rhetorical beast and the escaped exagerated metaphor are on the loose. Media reports that none have been harmed, so they’ve stopped looking.
” wally said “It comes down to a moral question.”
Actually it doesn’t. —FKA gord
——————
Explain your reasoning Gord.
I believe that it is a significant moral question.
Where does society draw the line when dealing with the dregs of society? These addicts are by and large beyond retrieval.We cannot spend millions hoping that one out of 20 will become productive again. There will be many that disagree,but that is reality. There is not a magic cure. You could spend thousands of dollars and hours on each one,and have little or nothing to show for it. Where do you draw the line? When do you realize that your 64 Impala SS is too costly to be made roadworthy?
It is a moral question. We have the technology to prolong life way past the best before date. It would be foolhardy to do so. A 24 year old may be worth some investment. A 70 year old one,not so much.
I’m not crazy about giving drunks free booze,but I’m less crazy about putting them to rest because they cost too much to keep alive. They cannot be ignored,they are a real flesh and blood problem,and it is costing us plenty.
Johnny
WELL DONE.
hmmm.
In essence they are using the dependency to bring alcoholics’ lives back into control. It’s interesting, and is a method designed only for very severe alcoholism. If what they claim is true about changing attitudes and quests for sobriety, that’s good news. A commenter suggested this method allowed for his son to transition to sobriety with greater ease.
So, with a legal substance, I cannot object to the attempt. There is no comparison between this method and the heroine houses run by Insite. So Berner’s rebuttal is baseless in that comparison. He also fails to see that the clinics he boasts of may well be the next step for these people.
These folks have undoubtedly shortened their life span. I see nothing wrong with this modest attempt to get them to their maker sober.
@Wallyj
With “dregs of society” and “addicts” for ever more government funding only to have little or nothing to show for.
Are you referring to the alcoholics or the intellectuals?
Hmmm, I wonder what a billboard put up in the local rubbie neighborhood here would cost to advertise the free booze out there in BC.
Move To Beautiful BC, Warmer & FREE BOOZE!
I do hope that the authorities provide a decent vintage!
The druggies and drunks are most useful – as warnings. I remember in 1996 my wife and I were staying in the East End, a little beyond Chinatown, and there were a lot of
moderately healthy streetwalkers around. We went back in 2007, and I think we saw some of the same women – comprehensively wrecked, no nerve in their bodies or brains undamaged.
Shakes, tremors, twitches, drooling, you name it.
I dunno, if they have a respectable single malt I could be tempted to front up for a couple-a shots.
Paul in Calgary: Here you go ( from Berner’s site): The program of free Ford autos for car thieves starts next Thursday.
@ Posted by: Gary Marshall at February 18, 2012 9:05 PM
The downside for Vancouver is what Al the fish alluded to above. This utopia for alcoholics and druggies will be a magnet that will attract Canada’s lost souls from all over the country once word gets out. BC has to pay for this experiment and the more successful (or less) it becomes, the more it will cost. Other provinces will probably watch with interest but will provide nothing but encouragement and maybe free bus fare to get rid of them. If these fine folk wanted to get clean and sober they could have done it at home. But great climate, free booze and drugs is a great reason to head west. Vancouver people know that every life is precious and take it personal if they don’t live to at least 70. No matter what the cost or how little they contribute to society. As long as they don’t try to smoke within 3m of a doorway they will all be welcome. Vancouver cares about everyones health.
Gee, are all the folks at the Vancouver Coastal Health Authority delusional? That is the most benign interpretation of their free booze program that I can come up with.
PiperPaul@9:40PM:
OK, my alcohol-addled brain apparently cannot comprhend the razor-sharp wit of your reply.
However, thanks for your interest.
Regards,
Johnny
@ small c conservative at February 18, 2012 11:18 PM
Don’t forget that Vancouver took pride in emptying most of their mental institutions and most of the inmates drifted into government jobs, as they tend to do. There is a good reason BC in general is referred to as California North. The home of weenies, whiners and wingnuts. McGregor the Mayor is in a continual game of one upmanship with California. Cal. outlawed playing frizzby and throwing balls on the beach and McGregor came in with no smoking on the seawall or parks. Brutal war on sanity continues with California enjoying a slight lead, but Vancouver determined to catch up. Free booze should do the trick.