Stormbringer:
“You may have seen the Truther websites that ask ‘If it’s true that a Boeing airliner hit the Pentagon, what happened to all the parts of it? Why did we not find more pieces of it? Where did all that mass GO?'”
The answer, in a fraction of a second:
My recollection of that fateful day revolves around the Pentagon Building.
My questions as I was watching the Pentagon attack and the aftermath were: Why are there gravel trucks dumping load after load of gravel all over the lawn around the building and the crash site and bulldozers pushing a one-two foot layer over top of a crime scene? Don’t you want it as undisturbed as possible so you can get as much evidence from the area as possible?
I have asked that question many times and I get the same response each time to that question. Blinking eyes and drool running down the corner of the mouth from every body who is asked.
Any criminologists or government officials out there who can stab an answer back at this question?
Uh two problems: 1, the planes on 911 didn’t hit a solid concrete wall (at least 10 feet thick like in the video, and probably reinforced too), and 2, the video doesn’t show what wreckage resulted from the crash?
HAHAHA!! An F4, that at most weighs 40,000 lbs hitting a reinforced concrete wall that is at least 5 feet thick at 500 mph is not the same as a Boeing 757 (which weighs around 250,000 lbs) hitting a building at a much slower speed.
glacierman
I may be able to at least partially answer your question.
I was 30 years in the RCMP, and about 7 years working homicide.
In an unsatisfactory number of cases, the forensic pathologists were simply unable to provide me with a cause of death. So according to science, the victims were not dead…although I was well aware that they were.
Accordingly, although I knew I was dealing with a murder in those cases, my hands were tied, without a cause of death, I had no case…no-one was more unhappy with the outcome than me.
My point is this…there are some things in life that are simply unexplainable.
The pentagon case is just one of those cases. Put it this way…the building did just not explode on its own. The fact that not many pieces of the aircraft were found (although several pieces were found) does not support the theory that this was some nefarious plot of the US government.
Nuff said
Obviously watching this one can only come to ONE conclusion.
Kate & SDA are part of a Zionist/ George Bush conspiracy to cover up 9/11 and help kill little brown babies in the deserts of the Middle East.
Where is Kate now, one would ask? Hanging out on GWB ranch, taking pot shots at pregnant Mexican refugees desperately crossing the property. Prove me wrong, I dare you.
Knight…I assume you are being sarcastic.
If that is not the case, then you are just being an a$$hole…
If you are just being playful, I apologize for my earlier remarks.
Thank you, Knight, and my apologies to Kate for knocking the lid off the septic tank.
Wowee.
Glacierman et al: the post referred to the Pentagon, which was a, erm, highly reinforced building to put it mildly. Here’s my question to you: What, specifically, could they have gleaned by collecting, analyzing, and erm, “not disturbing” atomized dust, in light of the fact that “they” were fully, comprehensively aware of a) what happened b) who the perps were, c) what the motive was, and d) what type of aircraft hit the building?
Do you think they were going to reassemble the plane, or someone’s tooth? Do you think they were dumping gravel over a notebook mission-statement from one of the hijackers, or…
Watch the video. Then look up “atomized.” Then ask again why they weren’t looking for “evidence.”
COAB.
I knew a girl that was hotter than the sun. But then she said 9/11 was an inside job.
THE END.
Sad, really.
There are a lot of fools out there, trust me.
Physics is beyond the intellectual capacity of most of those who want the state to wipe their noses when they sneeze.
Go to snopes dot com, type in Pentagon
Highway tractors, (I hate calling them ‘semis’) like aircraft, also use aluminum as a construction material in an effort to reduce weight. When a highway tractor burns all that is left is the steel frame and engine. No expensive tests needed, just a trip to the local SGI salvage yard.
500 MPH = 733 feet per second. Most parts would be disintegrated.
I saw that video about the pentagon. All BS!!
It is kinda sad, Erik.
EBD, you have no idea how sad it was – but even *I* have principles. Sigh !! Must be those conservativistic roots. D*mn!!!
Glacierman et al: the post referred to the Pentagon, which was a, erm, highly reinforced building to put it mildly.
Absolutely. It was deliberately built that way…exactly the opposite of the WTC buildings. It had also been recently upgraded seismically, which made it even stronger.
My favorite ‘Truther’ moment on this is a picture of the crash scene with a caption saying “where’s the plane?”. Some wag then took the same photo and circled in red two or three pieces of the plane that were *right there* in front of everyone (he even showed before/after comparisons of the pieces). Classic…
PS – I never had a clue about how expensive planes were . . . . .
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/prices/
Erik (2:09), some principles are so deeply embedded that they’re just laws of nature or…limbic directives. I wouldn’t even consider dating a woman who was a truther, or a leftist, or who chews gum, or who has ‘tats’, or who wears high-heels and makeup, or…
Oh, man…
tats = tramp stamp.
high heels, make up, Japanese school girl uniforms? Uh, never mind.
Funny how we have our preconceptions – I expected you to be 55+
Erik, I’m a fair bit younger than 55. And I like unadorned, reasonably sturdy women in natural form.
TMI, but there you have it. It’s your fault.
Thanks for pleasantly diverting the unanticipated ‘Truther’ deba….er, discussion.
/:>˚>
Black Mamba – where are you 🙁
OK, back to topic – I remember the first time I saw a movie and the “good guy” (government) – actually turned out to be the bad guy – ie government gone bad.
A nice plot twist – but really – it was a plot twist – and real life isn’t that way.
Bad people do bad things.
Bruce>
Oh dear, would never have thought that comment would need an explanation.
Try sarcastic, playfull & bored.
Knight…then please accept my heartfelt apology
😉
I’ve been in the pentagon (as a tourist) and it is a very solid building (and this is pre-911).
One of the best interviews I’ve heard about 911 was from a former NHL hockey player, and now an administrator for either the Panthers or the Lightning (and people who follow hockey will know who he is – although I’ve forgotten his name right now). The interview was on the FAN590 (sports radio) and is usually repeated every 911.
He had just finished his career in Florida and was sent on a management course at the WTC. They were on around the 90th floor. The first building got hit by the plane and they heard a sound and then their building started for vibrate seriously. All the fire alarms started to go off and they were told to evacuate down the stairwells. Most of the people did leave because the vibrations in the building were scary and so they knew something was wrong (skyscrapers sway anyway from wind, etc. and are designed to sway back and forth a bit – but this was different). The descent was very orderly and cordial and people were helping people in wheelchairs and with disabilities. When they got to about the 30th floor, the fire alarms stopped and an announcement came on saying that things were okay and that they could return to their offices. He turned around, as did everybody, and started to head back. Within a minute of turning around though there was a huge shudder. Their building had been hit. The stairwell literally moved 5 feet to one side and 5 feet to the other side and kept moving and shuddering. Everyone was knocked down and holding on like crazy. The alarms went back on and they all turned around and started heading down (they were still about 30 stories up). When he got to around the 15th floor suddenly firemen started flying up the stairs and so they had to give way. The stairwell was still shaking and vibrating pretty violently. When they reached ground level they were told to go through the mall (a couple of floors lower) and were directed by firemen and cops on the way out. This guy who had a wife and kids was pretty scared. They were directed out an exit and told to scram down a street as fast as possible. When he reached street level the first thing he saw was a huge semi-intact jet engine in the middle of the street. That’s when people started to speculate that a plane hit their building. As they scrammed down the street the buildings started to collapse.
I hear about these ‘truthers’. I think that if they physically were there or in a building next and saw what happened, they would get off of this angle. Their time is better spent focusing on sector 51.
Substitute ‘Truther’ for ‘defense attorney’ in the following and the joke still works.
In a particularly gruesome murder case that had the town buzzing, the defence was in a pickle. The defense attorney’s only hope was to discredit the medical examiner’s credibility.
Defense Attorney: When you arrived on the alleged crime scene, did you assess the victim’s condition?
Med. Examiner: No
DA: Did you provide CPR or check for a pulse?
ME: No
DA: Did you provide any sort of life saving procedure?
ME. No
DA: Then I submit that it is possible, that the victim was alive when you arrived on the scene and through your own negligence the victim died some time later.
ME. Given that the victim’s brain was in a jar on the shelf, I suppose it’s possible that he was out practicing law at the time of the murder.
This “truther” “where did the airplanes go” stuff is getting really tiresome.
High-speed impact
Intense burn
Rapid compaction resulting in pulverization
All the truthers have to do is take a Physics 101 (Force) course and the blinders will drop off.
Some of the responses here neatly highlight how pointless it is to argue with the tinfoil hat brigade.
They always find a way to rationalize their pet theories against every fact offered in a bizarre, delusional form of one-upmanship.
And when that fails, they simply say you’re part of the conspiracy.
The best tactic for dealing with them?
Ignore them. Never give ’em the time of day.
What happens when you strap a truther to a rocket sled and slam them into a wall? Sounds like a good theme for a Mythbusters episode.
For those with a physics background: can you describe what’s actually happening to the F4 when it hits the wall? Are the aircraft components shattering? Melting? Sublimating directly from a solid into a gas? Just wondering.
Agreed,JJM. Truthers will ,and do, cite hundreds of studies that support their theories. However,they cannot find anyone that actually does demolition work to agree with their controlled demolition hogwash. However,that doesn’t faze them at all,because the demo people are part of the gov’t cover-up also. It’s kind of sad.Luckily they have little chance of breeding.
Mass x Velocity Squared . . . that’s whats happening
The Pentagon IS a reinforced concrete building.
Furthermore it is built in multiple layers and this is exactly how the armor of a modern tank is built; multiple layers disspate the energy more efficiently than one thick layer.
But those are facts, so leftists reject them and substitute their own “reality”
“One thick layer” coincidentally also accurately describes a troofer’s skull.
My favourites in the “truther” brigade are those who believe it was a controlled explosion from inside.
When I try to explain the workings of a controlled demolition for the purpose of taking down a building,ie months of work by dozens of explosives experts placing charges in plain sight at strategic spots, their eyes glaze over and they tune me out.
And I, suffering acute exasperation, do the same to them.
http://science.howstuffworks.com/engineering/structural/building-implosion1.htm
This is a good site that explains the logistics of imploding a building in layman’s terms. All 9-11 truthers should visit it once in a while, just to get a bit of grounding in reality.
9/11 truthers are merely a subset of that sad, sad group of conspirists and UFOers that will basically believe anything but the truth.
Im sure there is a name for it in the field of psychiatry.
Great Post, and you won’t hear me say that here too often. Given that a not insignificant minority of the crowd here are likely truthers, this rates as a genuine public service announcement.
Now back to the regularly scheduled global warming skepticism while Russia burns and Pakistan submerges.
Gray, pretty impressive statement. Now, would you like to actually provide some evidence for your contention that “a not insignificant minority of the crowd here are likely truthers.”?
Yeah didn’t think so.
Erik, congratulations…you are a strong man of principles. Know what you mean though, it can be tough.
JJM, you are right. Arguing with “truthers” can lead to a rise in blood pressure.
EBD @1:43 – there may have been a note in the atomized fuselage the CSI lab guys could have deciphered as they rocked out to The Who:
Psych! You guys are so gullible! Ha ha!
Sincerely,
Darth Cheney and some Mossad Bigshot!
But we’ll never know now, will we?
(p.s. what’s “COAB”? I googled it and all I found was Cable Operator’s Asssociation of Bangladesh.)
Bruce – Knight 99 was obviously being sarcastic, much as I was @4:21 on the Gone To A Better Place thread.
What you say? Forests are burning? Never heard of that happening before. Is this the first time? And what’s this thing about excess water in Pakistan? I thought all water stayed where it belongs, in the form of ice at the polar caps.
gray @9:47 “Given that a not insignificant minority of the crowd here are likely truthers, this rates as a genuine public service announcement.”
Everyone here is a brainwashed teabagger who worships W. as the Second Coming, gray. Get with the program. This isn’t the Daily Kos.
Gray; havent you heard of the East Anglia scandal? Or read the water temps in Lake Michigan in the hundreds of degrees.The temps were posted here on Aug 15 courtesy of the NOAA and the U of Michigan.I have found one thing over the years,liberals have NO morals or ethics and they think that everyone else is the same.If in power THEY WOULD demolish buildings with people in them and blame it on someone else.I have NO doubt about that.They have done it before,Pearl Harbour comes to mind.
You can’t talk to 911-Troofers. They are impervious to science, logic, physical evidence, pictures, and probably even an iron pipe to the head.
I looked into building an airplane a few years ago. Airplanes are mostly empty space. The parts are -thin-. Modern airliners additionally are in large part made of carbon composite, which allows for parts to be even thinner. A very large percentage of the mass in an aircraft is the cargo and the fuel, OBVIOUSLY, because the less airplane there is to haul around the farther it can go. Duh.
One of the interesting things about aluminum and composites is that they will burn to ash at the right temperature. Yes, metal -will- burn away just like paper given the right amount of heat. The heat generated in the WTC and Pentagon crashes was around 1800F, that’s way more than enough to burn away thin aluminum sheets and carbon fiber. Oh, and its an -exothermic- reaction, it gets hotter when it burns. Aluminum is quite reactive. Carbon fiber of course will burn like coal once it gets going. Its carbon, right?
Aluminum melts at 1220F anyway, so even large pieces like landing gear would have disappeared.
Aircraft that only hit the ground and burn don’t leave much wreckage. Aircraft that hit buildings pretty much get consumed in the fire.
But you can’t tell that to a Troofer. Their ignorance is invincible. They aren’t just naturally stupid, they work at it.
Kinda like gun control freaks, eco-freaks, jihad-freaks, liberals and snake handling toothless hillbillies. Same shlitz, different pile.
First time in history concrete has melted aluminum.
Erik Larsen, I feel your pain.
Or I used to anyway, my dating years were spent in Toronto. There were one HELL of a lot of really, really dumb girls in Toronto back in the ’80s. Its so sad when you start in chatting up some babe and you realize she’s got the mental acuity of a house plant. Just fine for a lost weekend, but for dating? Nonono!
Eventually I turned to the import models, they had much better educations and moral standards. Sikh girls from India, Buddhist girls from China, Muslim girls from Ethiopia, smokin’ hot and without the unpleasant stupidity. Like, they could actually balance a checkbook! Even better, they could grasp the fact that the money you spend on beer tonight is money you don’t have for gas to go to work tomorrow.
Unfortunately these days the second generation from those mega-hot immigrants all graduated from the same stupid-factories that wrecked my generation, so import is no longer necessarily an indication of higher quality.
Truly, liberalism can wreck anything.
So this isn’t a good time to bring up the moon landings is it?
Ever burnt an aluminum beer can in the campfire? What’s left? Even truthers should be able to figure this out even as they get inebriated from their sorrows.
Phantom – my third cousin (or second twice removed, or something) from Ukraine, Yrena, is under 40, very pretty, working as a “consultant”(?), childless, planning on going to law school, and a little unsure about her immigrant status. Her mother’s a maths prof, but she’s very practical. Three divorces, so those guys won’t be a bother.
Interested?
langmann – et tu? Tell me you’re kidding.
Nobody has answered my question as to why gravel was spread all over the crime scene.
This has nothing to do with whether or not Flight 77 hit the building. There is a ton of evidence.
But why cover a crime scene with gravel?
glacierman, are you sure it was gravel? Could it have been an absorbant to suck up jet fuel, fire fighting foams, biologics from the remains etc.
Not really a concern wrt the whole crime scene thing. That evidence would mostly have been in the remains of the building. Protecting those working there would take precidence over any evidence, especially in a crime scene left with little doubt as to the who, when, where, why and how.
Glacierman, go to snopes dot com
re the “but why cover a crime scene with gravel.?
to preserve it more completely from damage during rescue and recovery efforts . they are making it an archeological type of investigation. preserving volatiles and preventing further burning and degradation of evidence and material from the plane.