Good evening ladies and gentlemen, welcome to SDA Late Nite Radio. Tonight, for your delectation and pursuant to our Friday night old-time radio crime-detective show, here is the Music To Die By episode of Casey, Crime Photographer (1948, MP3, 6.6 MB, 28:36), brought to you by the Anchor Hocking Glass Corporation. Interestingly, perhaps, the last word in the show, before station identification, is Canada.
Your Reader Tips are, as always, welcome in the comments.
Glasnost wrote… “Please, somebody, give us tonight’s Coren show with Sid Ryan.” (Jan 9, 10:46PM)
Just watched it on tape. The hypocrisy of Sid Ryan is incredible. Coren, who disagrees with Sid’s opinions on the conflict, gave Ryan the first 2 segments of the 1-hour program ALL TO HIMSELF (approx 20 minutes), in spite of two other guests on the panel.
Sid used his, um, uninterrupted free speech time to justify his view that those whose opinions on the conflict he disagrees with should face punative measures.
Irony is lost on this man.
That said, it was a good program. A lot of heated exchanges.
Good thing it’s The Michael Coren Show and not The Sid Ryan Show. If it was the latter, the other 2 guests, as well as Coren himself, wouldn’t have been on the show if Sid had his way.
G:
The taxes are supposed to be given back tp citizens and companies – via reduced income taxes – so they can reinvest in the reductions via Exxon et al technology. No doubt the government will skim funds for their own purposes (see: the recent SC finding that Martin and Chretien stole from the EI fund).
Remember that Exxon – a compnay that I consider to be the finest and best run of all the big oilcos because it never forgot the philosophy of it founder John D. Rockefeller – is in the energy business. Right now it is gasoline/diesel that are the source of choice. It used to be kerosene (for lamps). In the future it could be hydrogen, compressed NG or some form of stable liquified fuel that is cleaner than gasoline/diesel. whatever it is Exxon wants to lead the parade in producing it.
On a different topic:
the ever ditzy Barbara Yaffe has a puff piece in the VTC entitled “Canadians should enjoy liberal-leaning Obama –
As we enjoy one president getting the boot(s), new U.S. leader should flourish”
http://www.vancouversun.com/columnists/Canadians+should+enjoy+liberal+leaning+Obama/1162251/story.html
In it she quotes the following:
“According to the Conference Board of Canada, Canadians to date have exhibited “a positive, if somewhat innocent attitude” toward the coming administration of Barack Obama.”
Further on she demonstrates the she is one of the innocent/ignorant by stating this:
“Obama has shown little interest in or knowledge of Canada. He grew up in Hawaii and Indonesia and was senator for the northern state of Michigan.”
Michigan? How could she possibly screw that up especially after all of the goings-on with the scandal surrounding BO’s replacement as a senator from Illinois?
and how did the Editors miss it?
There is an Ipso poll out showing that a majority of Canadians think Canada is on the right track.
A few weeks ago the coalition was taking credit for the coming budget and deficit. But in Halifax the great unelected interm leader of the liberal party said it is a conservative budget, not ours.
He can’t have it both ways but will try.
Re PMSH saying there will be two parties on the next ballot, the conservative and coalition. What will the coalition do if they have to do with a lot fewer seats than now. Quebec will be about the same, as some Bloc might go liberal or vice versa, same number of opposition.
Toronto will also stay the same, with ndp/lib changing. Same number of opposition.
They will not get a majority.
Wait till Jan 27 to see liberals rush to support the throne speech and budget, leaving Layton all by his lonesome. Of course he and Gilles could form a coalition opposition.
Was anybody else somewhat shocked when Michael Ignatieff said yesterday that, in essence, It was not HIS job to give ideas for the budget. It was not HIS budget. HIS job is to criticize it – not to help produce it.
Sort of like the school teacher who only grades papers but does not do the work to produce one.
As in, those who CAN -Do. Those who CAN’T-TEACH.
Here is an excerpt from the National Post’s article on Iggy’s writings today. It appears that this man has always been just a critic – he can point out problems but has no capacity to develop solutions.
Scary that he wants to lead our country when he has never even managed anything but his own career???
From NP:
“The thing with Ignatieff the reporter, though, is that he’s a provoker of thought rather than a solver of problems. Good journalists are skilled at that: raising issues, asking questions, pointing out contradictions.
Solutions are someone else’s business, and the journalist reserves the right to criticize those as well.
That makes assessing Ignatieff the politician based on Ignatieff the writer a difficult task: Yes, he has an artful eye in identifying problems and assessing their roots. Is he any good at devising a remedy? That’s what we don’t know yet”
Epitaph: ““elegant executioner,””.
Location: The PET Cemetery, Ad$Cam Row.
…-
“Jean Pelletier, confidant of Jean Chretien, dies of cancer
Jean Pelletier, a close confidant of Jean Chretien who was dubbed the “elegant executioner,” died of cancer on Saturday. He was 73″ (nnw)
Hysterically inverted?
Will the “historical cold” reach Goreacle’s domicile/houseboat*?
“historical cold is forecast for the coming weeks across most of the midwest and eastern US.”
…-
“10 01 2009
Mid-Winter Report Card
Guest post by Steven Goddard
We are almost at the half way point for the meteorological winter (December through February) and it is a good time to evaluate how the NOAA CPC (Climate Prediction Center) and UK Met Office winter forecasts are doing so far. As seen below, CPC forecast the highest probability of warmth for Alaska and the upper midwest.”
[…]
“Looking at the results, it appears that the CPC forecast map was approximately inverted from what has actually occurred. The near record cold air which has been sitting over Alaska, is now pouring into the upper midwest. As of this morning, the temperature in International Falls, Minnesota is -22F, and historical cold is forecast for the coming weeks across most of the midwest and eastern US.
Here is the Month of December: […]
“On the other side of the pond, The Met Office famously forecast another warm season for the UK.
Trend of mild winters continues
25 September 2008
The Met Office forecast for the coming winter suggests it is, once again, likely to be milder than average.
Their scorecard is doing equally well, with the UK having it’s coldest winter in decades, as reported by the BBC.”
http://wattsupwiththat.com/ (Vote for WUWT)
…-
*See Al Gore’s Houseboat | Skeptics Global Warming
See it here: http://dirtyharrysplace.com/?p=3478 Update: It evidently didn’t have solar panels until a local whistleblower ratted him out. So only now.
http://www.skepticsglobalwarming.com/global-warming-myth/politicians/al-gore/see-al-gores-houseboat/
That CBC clip at Blue Like You is a must see.
I understand the so-called CPC’ers are turning their backs on PMSH because he hasn’t done enough WRT the HRC’s.
The CBC is more of a prioirty IMO.
fire.them.all
Tusk, tusk. Who eats the tusks? Beeb doesn’t mention ivory.
The valuable ivory tusks rise to the apex of Mugabe’s socialist pyramid.
…-
“Zimbabwe troops ‘eat elephants’
Zimbabwe has more elephants than its parks can hold
Zimbabwean soldiers are being given elephant meat for their rations, a wildlife campaigner* has told the BBC.”
“It is cheaper and easier to use elephant meat
*Jonny Rodrigues”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7820885.stm
Please explain something to me, ET…
There are two countries bordering Gaza. BOTH countries have sealed their borders. Why is only ONE of those countries being criticized by you for sealing the border?
If Israel is a big meanie in causing Gazans to suffer by closing its borders, Egypt is EVERY BIT AS BAD when they close theirs. Why are you silent about Egypt’s role in this?
Just watching the remainder of the Sid Ryan videos now. I think I’ve gained some insight into the Radical Left mindset.
A Fundamentalist Muslim is anti-Jewish and is not a Leftist.
A Radical Leftist is not inherently anti-Jewish but rather is … wait for it … anti anti-Hamas.
There is actually a difference but we all know the old saying, “My enemy’s enemy is my friend.” So at this time in our devolution (sic) there is indeed a marriage of convenience between Jew Haters and anti anti-Hamas people. The fact that the latter group denies this is beyond laughable.
Let me repost something I wrote last night:
With apologies to Martin Niemöller, let me provide a modern version of his famous poem:
First they came for the Jews.
I remained silent, for I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the Christians.
I remained silent, for I was not a Christian.
When they came for the conservatives,
I remained silent, for I was not a conservative.
When they came for the atheists,
I remained silent, for I was no longer an atheist.
Then when they came for me,
I expected someone to speak out,
But there was no one left to defend me.
“In a surprise move, it seems likely the first genetically engineered animal approved for commercial use … ”
Frankengoat:
http://tinyurl.com/9cx7os
Does O realize he married 2 women? ‘Course he doesn’t.
But, it’s “at least temporary”.
As Henny used to quip, “Take my wife—please! My wife is a light eater. As soon as it’s light, she starts eating. My wife wanted her face lifted …”(quotes)
…-
“Mom-in-law moving into White House
Get ready for the in-law in chief. President-elect Barack Obama’s mother-in-law, Marian Robinson, is moving into the White House at least temporarily to join Michelle Obama and the two children, transition officials said Friday.”
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2162220/posts
eeyore – I criticize Egypt for sealing its border but not for the same reason. Egypt doesn’t have a networked economy with Gaza.
My criticism of the Israeli closure of Gaza is because the economy of Gaza and Israel were intimately linked. Gas, hydro, water supplies all come from Israel; these were cut off to minimal. Importantly, the money-earning economy was completely destroyed.
Gaza’s economy has been intimately linked to Israel acting as 100% consumer of its goods. The goods were primarily fresh fruit and vegetables and furniture. The fresh fruits/vegetables came from both the land and the greenhouses.
The greenhouses had been built by the settlers. When the settlers left, they insisted on payment for these greenhouses or they would demolish them. The Gates foundation purchased some of them; about half were left – half demolished by settlers and also by Palestinian looting (not all Palestinians, eg, Hamas, want Palestine/Gaza to succeed).
The ones that were left, along with the other farms, provided a key part of the Gaza economy, for all the produce was exported to Israel.
In addition, other Gaza residents worked in Israel. This was ended.
When the gas, hydro, water supplies were reduced, and the export economy ended, and the work rights ended – that meant that Gaza was economically reduced to nothing. That meant that Hamas could move in like a tornado and sweep up the anger and despair.
That’s why I criticize Israel for shutting the border. OK?
If we study all of us human
and may be small as one in compare with big population of world
just being similarity of all of us are human and must act human
give us similarity of action we can share and
give us the way live together as society
All purpose of relgion culture jews christian and Muslim or hido or budsim came to save
human right human sprituate and human life
for better or best way to live
it is good to live in GOOD way
and some may have better life
and some live in the best life so many wish for
We are here to talk about people who live in bad and worst senario and their life as bad or worst made all rest of us in trouble and for some reason link us and we may stock here for that purpose and all world stock to
HOW to resolve issue such as I-P
feeding all world at least
how to stop crime rate
and so on
etc…
If we focus to goal then the rest will come follow after that
Canada’s Police among Worst Offenders for Freedom of Information Compliance…..
As in previous years, the CNA’s 2008 audit finds that officials across Canada are disturbingly inconsistent in their compliance with laws that underwrite the public’s right to know.
“Information freely available from some government agencies was denied by others. And when it wasn’t denied, prohibitive fee estimates often took it out of the reach of all but the wealthiest requesters,” he said.
The full audit is available on the Canadian Newspaper Association website: http://tinyurl.com/9r263y
Hat Tip Evening Telegram
The Canadian Newspaper Association (CNA) audit – undertaken in conjunction with the University of King’s College in Halifax – gave the province (NL)a grade of C+.
http://tinyurl.com/75gsea
“In the future it could be hydrogen”
No it won’t. H2 is an energy carrier, not a fuel. And it’s not dense enough (“bang-per-buck”) as compared to other energy storage solutions.
Yes, it’s cool and science-fictioney.
The best way to store liquid hydrogen (for, say, space shuttle applications or later compression to 3000 PSIG) is in hyper-insulated tanks at -428 degrees. Unless it is used promptly it will boil off into the atmosphere.
Piping that carries LH2 is so cold that the exterior of the pipes’ surfaces actually liquefy the surrounding air, creating ‘liquid air’ that drips – this is NOT condensation, it’s actually air in a liquid state. Fun stuff.
H2 molecule size is also problematic.
Interesting post ET. I had not realized that the settlers destroyed some and that the “Palestinians” also destroyed some of the greenhouses. Remember though that Jews have a legal right to live anywhere between the Jordan and the sea (no legal right to live in Jordan).
Question: Was Israel’s sealing of the Gaza border a hateful whim? Or was it provoked in some way? If provoked, what would the better solution have been? Recall, the wall — which also seriously harmed the “Palestinian” economy — went up only AFTER about 1000 innocent Israelis were murdered by homocide bombers, most from Judea-Samaria.
Canada to be Obama’s first foreign trip as president. AP
G&M
http://tinyurl.com/a4g3lq
Look how the MSM try to downplay the meeting down further in the article..
Obama meets Monday with Mexican President Felipe Calderon, his first in-person meeting with a world leader since winning election. (So Harper’s meeting with O isn’t the “first” meeting.)
U.S. presidents typically use Canada as their first international trip. (Nothing to see here folks.)
ET wrote: “What would have happened if Israel had instead, rather than setting up the blockade, interacted directly with the Palestinian workers (NOT Hamas)…”
Depends. Are they unionized? C’mon ET, lately you’ve gone all edmucational and ivory towerish.
Hello? Hello? Reality is calling, but we seem to get a recorded voice message.
How many gigloles you wan in your “live streams”?
…-
“Technology casts newspaper in new role
Sat, January 10, 2009
The Free Press live streams the Tavares news conference”
http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/News/Local/2009/01/10/7979841-sun.html
…-
“New York Times hires U2’s Bono”
“Bono called the gig “an honour,” and joked that he’s “never been great with the full stops or commas.””
“Times editorial page editor Andrew Rosenthal said Bono “is an extraordinary man who thinks deeply about his art and the major issues confronting the world.” (nnw)
“Barack Obama’s mother-in-law, Marian Robinson, is moving into the White House”
He’s screwed already. I have to feel sorry for the guy.
So Mr Iggy thinks it’s not his “job” to give ideas for a budget, my, how rich is that! In other words they can criticize but have nothing better to offer. That, in spite of the fact a “Coalition” was concocted by Layton and Duceppe, with the Liberals all signed on, to present themselves to the GG as ready to govern!
Ready to grab power and fly by the seats of their pants, grabbing goodies for their special interests, is more like it.
Piper:
I’M not saying hydrogen is the fuel in a gaseous form but it could be what is combusted in the cylinder or fuel cell how the hydrogen is stored could be any number of ways such as in a liquid that releases it’s hydrogen component via some kind of enzyme or catalytic reaction or perhaps from another more easily transproted gas such as natural gas.
Sigh.
ET – “My criticism of the Israeli closure of Gaza is because the economy of Gaza and Israel were intimately linked. Gas, hydro, water supplies all come from Israel; these were cut off to minimal. Importantly, the money-earning economy was completely destroyed.”
ME – If Gaza hadn’t launched terror attacks and lobbed rockets indiscriminately into Israel, maybe Israel wouldn’t have done this. You know, don’t spit into the wind, don’t tug on Superman’s cape and all that.
ET – “Gaza’s economy has been intimately linked to Israel acting as 100% consumer of its goods. The goods were primarily fresh fruit and vegetables and furniture. The fresh fruits/vegetables came from both the land and the greenhouses.”
ME – So the Gazans started terror attacks and rocket attacks on their ONLY customer? There’s some good planning!
ET – “The greenhouses had been built by the settlers. When the settlers left, they insisted on payment for these greenhouses or they would demolish them. The Gates foundation purchased some of them; about half were left – half demolished by settlers and also by Palestinian looting (not all Palestinians, eg, Hamas, want Palestine/Gaza to succeed).”
ME – So, you don’t think people should get paid for stuff that they built and then were forced to leave? And you think that Israel should be held accountable for Hamas destroying what was left? How does THAT make sense?
ET – “The ones that were left, along with the other farms, provided a key part of the Gaza economy, for all the produce was exported to Israel. In addition, other Gaza residents worked in Israel. This was ended.”
ME – Again, I would say that it was highly unwise for them to p!ss off their only customer. Why can’t they sell their crap to Egypt?
ET – “When the gas, hydro, water supplies were reduced, and the export economy ended, and the work rights ended – that meant that Gaza was economically reduced to nothing. That meant that Hamas could move in like a tornado and sweep up the anger and despair.”
ME – Boo frickin’ hoo. If you can’t handle the punishment, don’t do the crime. And no, not ALL of them are guilty…blah, blah, blah. THEIR government that THEY voted in acted in THEIR name and THEY didn’t object…they’re complicit. I have no sympathy for them.
Anyway, I don’t want to pick or pile on you, ET. I enjoy and appreciate your contributions here and I don’t deny that you make valid points about the Middle East situation…but I can’t for the life of me see the logic in defending people who have set their own house on fire and then cry when the get burned.
“China’s Communist Party leaders have long sought to sway public opinion by controlling what the media can report.””
>>> “paid “internet commentators””? How much you pay to scoul intelnet?
…-
“China’s internet ‘spin doctors’
bbc ^ | 16 December 2008 | By Michael Bristow
China is using an increasing number of paid “internet commentators” in a sophisticated attempt to control public opinion.
These commentators are used by government departments to scour the internet for bad news – and then negate it.
They post comments on websites and forums that spin bad news into good in an attempt to shape public opinion.
Chinese leaders seem aware that the internet – the only public forum where views can be freely expressed – needs close attention.
China’s Communist Party leaders have long sought to sway public opinion by controlling what the media can report.”
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2162226/posts
eeyore (and me no dhimmi) – I tried to link three articles about Gaza, but as usual when I insert links, even the tinyurls – I get sent to the corner. I’ll try again, taking out a few points.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=45884
The above shows that Palestinians and Israelis work just fine together; the Palestinians are also afraid of the fundamentalists in their area.
Here’s another one. Don’t know if it will work.
http://www.boston.com/news/world/middleeast/articles/2005/10/31/greenhouse_project_endangered_in_gaza/
Confusion say, STOPIGGY.
…-
“Iggy to the The Rock
St. John’s Mayor Dennis O’Keefe has learned that Michael Ignatieff will soon be visiting the province, and he looks forward to meeting with the Liberal leader.” (nnw)
…-
“Iggy skips The Rock” (nnw)
Just to change the subject, but…..
I’ve been waiting all day for a report on the so-called demonstration in support of the Palestians
in Toronto today, but so far have seen squat.
Anybody out there know what happened?
CBC, CTV, Red Star, G&M etc.-Nada.
Could it ever be that (horrors) nobody showed up?
Taking Chance
After they are brought to Dover Air Force Base, all fallen soldiers, Marines, airmen, and sailors are escorted home to their families and loved ones by a uniformed member of the U.S. armed forces. In mid-April 2004, 38-year-old U.S. Marine Lt. Col. Michael R. Strobl, a manpower analyst assigned to the Combat Development Command in Quantico, Va., accompanied the body of a young Marine killed in Iraq to his final resting place in Wyoming. Strobl wrote the following description of his journey to Wyoming in a small, spiral notebook on his way back to Virginia…
http://tinyurl.com/8hozsh
This hour has 22 minutes spoofs Iggy @ Halifax
….little advice on the coalition, in my experience 3 ways never turn out the way you fantasize. You get 2 people who are really into it and the third guy just watching it…even Harper’ll secretly videotape it too.
Kickass musician not from central Canada. April Wine’s also not Torontois.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randy_Bachman
I went to the rally in Saskatoon today. There was no counter protest. These people pretty much ignore the actions of one side and blame Israel for everything. It’s all about the occupation. There were some pretty naive signs and only one that I’d call really Anti-Semitic. It had a star of David with a swastika in it. The naive one said ‘If you don’t believe in peace it will never happen.’ C’mon people let’s believe! I missed the rally part at city hall, I only caught the march to River Landing and the speeches there.
Here’s more about Gaza. Since I so often get sent to the corner if I provide a link, it’s in the NY times July 15, 2005, by Steven Erlanger
“About half the greenhouses in the Israeli settlements in Gaza have already been dismantled by their owners, who have given up waiting to see if the government was going to come up with extra “payment as an inducement to leave them behind, say senior officials working on the coordination of this summer’s Israeli pullout from Gaza.”
And he also writes:
Under international law, that includes removing the settlers’ houses, including the rubble. Last month, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice reached an “agreement in principle” that the Israelis would destroy the houses and then pay the Palestinians to deal with the rubble, but the Israelis have refused to accept the rubble for disposal in Israel and the Palestinians have refused to accept it for disposal in Gaza. Now Israel is negotiating with Egypt to take the rubble – which would include dangerous materials like asbestos and fill at least 60,000 truckloads – and bury it in the Sinai Desert.”
There’s more links, and I hesitate to post them; Israel had shut off the water after the purchase, so the crops already in the greenhouses died. August 29, 2005, Aaron Klein, WorldNet Daily.
“After months of intense negotiations recently culminating in a deal allowing for the transfer of Gaza’s high-tech Jewish greenhouses to the Palestinians, several former Jewish residents who briefly returned to their farms told WND they were shocked to find most of their produce has died because Israel turned off the water in the area.
“I couldn’t believe it. Almost all of my crops are dead, and the rest is dying,” Anita Tucker, one of the pioneer farmers of Jewish Gaza told WND. “I hope the Palestinians aren’t expecting fresh produce. … A fortune in crops is now all gone.”
My points? The whole scenario is complex not simple. It’s an error, in my view, to reduce this complexity to X is good and Y is bad. Complex reality doesn’t work that way; there are errors on both sides, there are multiple agents and actors in the whole situation, each with different agendas and contrary actions…It’s not that simple that we can relax and make absolute conclusions.
From an article in today’s TorStar:
“Farid Ayad, president of Mississauga’s Palestine House, says it is unfair to say Israel ‘drops’ bombs (‘it sounds peaceful’) while Hamas ‘fires’ rockets’.”
http://www.thestar.com/News/GTA/article/562219
I had a previous commitment to an elderly parent today and couldn’t make the demonstration on Bloor Street. I did my bit, however, trying to persuade said-parent that Sid Ryan was not “a nice man” of whom said-parent was “very fond.” Said-parent doesn’t even KNOW Sid Ryan. Give me a break!
I also spent an inordinate amount of time countering pro-Palestinian arguments (one being that obviously the Israelis were the aggressors because they killed far more Palestinians than Palestinians killed Israelis and because the poor Palestinians’ weapons were of inferior quality) coming out of both sides of said-parent’s mouth.
I’m not sure why I even tried. I don’t respond to trolls on blogs and my parent was using all the trolls’ arguments and was impervious to the facts I reiterated many times.
In the TorStar article, pro-Israeli groups feel no need to launch public demonstrations seeing as the government’s position on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict seems to be supportive of Israel.
As far as the assertion by Jenny Peto, a member of the Coalition Against Israeli Apartheid, that the Toronto demonstration will show “the Conservative government that its position on Israel’s military operation in the Gaza Strip ‘does not represent the majority of Canadians,'” I don’t think so. A large pro-Palestinian demonstration launched by all the usual suspects does not represent a majority opinion. It simply demonstrates one view of a very biased group which likes to use inflammatory language such as “Israel’s massacres” when referring to the Hamas-Israeli conflict. No mention, of course, of Hamas firing rockets into Israel.
Posted by: G at January 10, 2009 8:11 AM
Exxon is just ahead of the curve. Gub’mint expands and taxes more, just ask Harper.
In terms of levying a consumption tax upon carbon, you can do it through cap & trade (commoditize emissions, really a production tax), or one can tax carbon itself – a consumption tax.
The latter is more equitable by being progressive.
Europe got burned 2x by installing a production tax (cap & trade). Entities game the system, exemptions bought (wind power & alt fuels), and administration requires far more expensive bureaucrats. Lots more friends for the politicians to hire.
That’s why the Cons are going the weaker of the two routes.
Business simply want stability in budgeting and regulatory environment. Politicians want power and money.
Bravo Eeyore!
ET – you mean those mean old greedy “obstacle to peace” settlers didn’t just want to hand over their hard earned greenhouses,infrastructure, lucratice businesses to the very people who want to kill them? Shocking.
I’m sure there are many here among us who would gladly hand over their houses and businesses to people who had been firing rockets at them? Wow, those “settlers” (read people who think that Jews should be allowed to live everywhere and anywhere) really are bad.
It isn’t X all good, Y bad (how about X mostly trying to do good, sharing our values, acting as our ally,etc, while Y mostly not?) Why shouldn’t we pick a side in this battle? If one side definitively wins, doesn’t that mean an end to hostilities?
Here’s what Robert Spencer said about handing over greenhouses in 2005:
Rewarding jihad terrorism with charity
“How Old Friends of Israel (Mortimer B. Zuckerman, real estate magnate and publisher of The Daily News and James D. Wolfensohn) Gave $14 Million to Help the Palestinians”
Moral blindness, dhimmitude, naivete, and more. Will the recipients of this largesse now realize that the Jews are not as bad as they have thought? No. They will laugh at their weakness and continue the jihad.
ex-liberal, for heaven’s sake, calm down. My posts said nothing and implied nothing about the settlers ‘being obliged’ to hand over their greenhouses.
What this post was, was a continuation of the debate about the greenhouses; I had previously posted that the whole set of greenhouses didn’t come into Palestinian control; about 1/4 were dismantled by the settlers, about 1/4 were looted by Palestinians; that left half in operation. OK?
Please don’t assume, in your mind, what other people are debating and posting about.
And if you bothered to read the links, and you obviously didn’t, you would have known this. You would also have known that Palestinians and Israelis working in those greenhouses got along very well.
Try gathering some facts rather than opinions; there’s a difference between the two.
ET: Link embeds: tutorial. Hope this is OK Kate.
(a href=
“http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=45884”
)Your comment or title(/a)
1. replace round with pointy brackets in same direction
2. delete spaces for full line wrap
3. Preview to see if it works. Don’t worry about “no follows” that show up.
4. Your link should show with your comment/title, underlined.
5. Click on it in preview to see if it works
Note: put quotes around link; get your link from the navigation bar when you’re at the site, copy-paste.
Palestinians: Get us out of Gaza
ET,
the impression I get is that you think Israel should supply Gazans with water, electricity, etc no matter what gets fired out of Gaza and no matter that Hamas want to destroy Israel. What normal sane person/country would do that?
Again from Robert Spencer: May 2008
Gaza dumps raw sewage into sea, UN blames Israel
Step back for a moment and consider: the Hamas regime in Gaza has made no secret of its intention to destroy Israel. In response, the UN expects Israel to supply Gaza with electricity, uninterrupted, no questions asked. Did the League of Nations scold Poland for not supplying electricity to Nazi Germany?
“The Palestinians have been pumping partially treated or untreated sewage water into the sea for years, and not just since the beginning of this year. The State of Israel assists in various ways to the pumping and water distribution and to the continued operation of the sewage treatment plants. That assistance includes approval to transfer most of equipment the Palestinian Authority has requested – the rest is in the process of being verified – and all the diesel fuel necessary to run the plants,” Schor said.
“Israel is very much assisting in the approval, funding [$45m.] and in executing a large project to deal with northern Gaza’s sewage, despite the continuing situation,” he said, “Likewise, the construction of a large treatment plant in central Gaza has also been approved, and Israel is willing to help build two more plants in the southern region of the Strip.”…
me no dhimmi – many thanks. I’m a computer and mechanical idiot and can’t figure out the most basic tactics. I’ll try to deal with links.
ex-liberal, yes, you are right. I don’t think that Israel should cut off water, electricity, gas to Gaza. Why not? And don’t make it sound as if these supplies are free; they are paid for by Palestine. But why should these basic systems be maintained – apart from the fact that the infrastructure is that these supplies come only from Israel?
Because stopping them doesn’t stop Hamas; it actually increases its recruitment capacities and activities because it drives the Palestinians into a dead end where they have no economy, no hope of an economy, no ability to live (water, electricity, hydro).
You refuse to acknowledge that not all Palestinians are radicals; quite a large number reject the fundamentalists.
The way to deal with radicals is twofold. Yes, you must confront and fight back and reject their agenda. But above all, you must, absolutely must, acknowledge that they do not speak for all people. And it is these other people that you must reach out to and attempt to work with.
So, if Israel were to focus on the average Palestinian, not the radicals, but the average, and assist them, openly, constantly, daily, in developing an economy – then Hamas and the ranks of Hamas would weaken and wither. But to treat them ALL, as ‘Hamas’ – that drives all of them into either joining Hamas or allowing Hamas to control them.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akn6K1DGKCs
Put on your thinking caps for this one.
Sadly only 4 of thousands of readers will click the link.
ET,
I have never said that all Palestinians are radicals or fundamentalists. As the article linked to by MND describes (and I’m sure you could find countless similar accounts), Israelis/Jews work, employ, celebrate with Arabs all the time.
Your argument that fighting terrorists just makes more terrorists actually enables the bad guys and gives them a chance to fight another day. Should Israel just continue to receive rocket attacks and do nothing? Several times a day, the sirens go off, and then there is 15 seconds to get to a bomb shelter. Would you like to live like that? Or might you insist that your government do something, shut the border, turn off the electicity (even if they pay for it), and finally after some 4000 or more rockets take military action?
If we continually do nothing and/or reward Hamas, we do not help the non-radical non-fundamentalists among them.
“Lorianne
The NY Times actually reported this?
Freaking Amazing!”
…-
“A Gaza War Full of Traps and Trickery
New York Times
The grinding urban battle unfolding in the densely populated Gaza Strip is a war of new tactics, quick adaptation and lethal tricks.
Hamas, with training from Iran and Hezbollah, has used the last two years to turn Gaza into a deadly maze of tunnels, booby traps and sophisticated roadside bombs. Weapons are hidden in mosques, schoolyards and civilian houses, and the leadership’s war room is a bunker beneath Gaza’s largest hospital, Israeli intelligence officials say.
Unwilling to take Israel’s bait and come into the open, Hamas militants are fighting in civilian clothes; even the police have been ordered to take off their uniforms. The militants emerge from tunnels to shoot automatic weapons or antitank missiles, then disappear back inside, hoping to lure the Israeli soldiers with their fire.
In one apartment building in Zeitoun, in northern Gaza, Hamas set an inventive, deadly trap. According to an Israeli journalist embedded with Israeli troops, the militants placed a mannequin in a hallway off the building’s main entrance. They hoped to draw fire from Israeli soldiers who might, through the blur of night vision goggles and split-second decisions, mistake the figure for a fighter. The mannequin was rigged to explode and bring down the building.
In an interview, the reporter, Ron Ben-Yishai, a senior military correspondent for the newspaper Yediot Aharonot, said soldiers also found a pile of weapons with a grenade launcher on top. When they moved the launcher, “they saw a detonator light up, but somehow it didn’t go off.”
Every soldier, Israeli officials say, is outfitted with a ceramic vest and a helmet. Every unit has dogs trained to sniff out explosives and people hidden in tunnels, as well as combat engineers trained to defuse hidden bombs.”
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2162411/posts
God Bless George Bush, POTUS.
God Bless America.
…-
“Ballots take the place of bombs in Iraq
The city’s name is synonymous with some of the fiercest fighting in the Iraq war. Five years later, the battles have long finished and the ballot rather than the bomb is the buzzword as campaigning begins for a provincial election at the end of the month.
“I want to vote because it is important for our future,” said Mohammed Abdul Wadood, 29, a labourer clearing rubble off the city’s pavements.
Blast walls erected to protect shop-fronts and houses from explosions and gunfire during the darker days are now covered by posters of candidates, each with a slogan promising improvements to voters’ lives.
Election teams go from door to door, encouraging people to vote – a novel concept for many who were either too afraid or mistrustful to take part in the first election in 2005 when security was still dire.”
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article5484993.ece
Thanks, PiperPaul, got it, to be featured at SDA LNR later.
ex-liberal, if you would bother to read both the links and also what I actually wrote, you’ll see that I didn’t say to NOT fight radicals. I specifically said to fight them, but I also said that Israel ought to assist those non-radicals in developing a viable economy.
You have a different opinion. That’s that.
Israel goes out its way to help non-radicals, but for some reason you just don’t see it, or it is never enough, or you think something about X good, Y bad. While the rest of the Arab/Muslim world does nothing, you think Israel should do more than it already does to help develop a viable economy for people who vote over 80% for Hamas (and the other 20% vote for Fatah and its Holocaust denying leader/Arafat sidekick). You must think Jews are either superhuman or crazy.
Yes indeed we have a different opinion.