3 Canadian soldiers were killed in Afghanistan today. What caught my attention was that the last several Canadian deaths have involved soldiers on their third rotations to Afghanistan. Being somewhat familiar with the way things work in the CF, I know that not a single Canuck serving in Afghanistan is there against his or her will. In fact, Canadian soldiers are lined up to go in numbers too great to accommodate … there are that many who want a chance at the mission.
What amazes me more than the heroism and willingness of our soldiers, is the continued view by some that soldiers are either victims or felons. I suppose it’s a natural reaction for those who can’t fathom the fact that there are those among us who rush in when most flee … and who stand fast when most recoil.
For Canadian soldiers though, the mission has long ago ceased being just about 911 … and has instead become about helping the people of Afghanistan. That is, without a doubt, the single most common theme expressed by those who have been “over there“.
Junker @ Cjunk contemplates the issues in Might, Will, and Sacrifice:
So where does the tally of might, will, and sacrifice leave us? To be sure, might is most visible, and leans heavily in the west’s favor, even though eastern asymmetrical warfare has dealt deadly blows in the past. A mere 60 years ago western societies had the will to see through the bloodiest conflict in history, whether or not they could do it again today is uncertain. Most worrying of all is the modern day West’s threshold for sacrifice. Can a society willing to give up so little overcome another that is destined to be much more numerous, and willing to give up so much more? Only time will tell.
Just think of the celebrations at NDP HQ tonight
His THIRD rotation in Afghanistan. And it is on a volunteer basis. Where do we find such selfless, dedicated, honourable men? And given the percentage of people in this country who, at best ignore their sacrifices and, at worst, mock them or denigrate the mission that they clearly believe is worthwhile, how is it that we deserve them, and their sacrifice?
Support the troops: BRING THEM HOME.
Enough with the killings, the terror and the war.
What else can you say to someone who is willing to step into harms way for others or for me, but thank you.
God speed and God bless
“Support the troops: BRING THEM HOME.
Enough with the killings, the terror and the war.”
spoken like a true coward, we will fight them there or we will fight them here, but make no mistake there WILL be a fight. My guess is you would be hiding behind Mama’s skirt screaming “protect me”
Chickendoves make me want to puke
Those who stand for nothing will fall for anything
atheist quebecois separatiste: There is no greater way to insult our soldiers than to treat them as victims or felons.
~
“We have become too civilized to grasp the obvious. For the truth is very simple. To survive you often have to fight, and to fight you have to dirty yourself. War is evil, and it is often the lesser evil. Those who take the sword perish by the sword…”
-George Orwell
AQS is clearly under the misapprehension that the troops -want- to come home.
They all volunteered to go over there, my troll-like friend. “Pretty please can we go shoot some Taliban? Please please pleeeeeese?!!!!” There’s a frickin’ WAITING LIST.
What does that little datum do to your intracranial pressure, separatiste? Approaching head explosion in 3, 2, 1….
Thank you Soldier.
Today I agree with Justin Trudeau, Now often. http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=740255
I don’t think I insult the soldiers because I want to save their live. Get real!!!!
Afghanistan is a place stuck in the middle age. That place was used by Bin Laden as his personal headquarter. That’s the only reason why we are there. Why are we in Afghanistan and not in Sudan?
This is not a war, this is nation building. We cannot alter that process using external forces. We need to pull out and let the normal Darwinian social evolution rule that place.
USA pulled out of Vietnam in 72-73 without winning anything. Now 30 yrs later Vietnam is one of the fastest growing place in the world and Intel is building a 300 millions $ factory there. Had the USA not pulled out in 72-73, the war would still be going on as of right now.
Where do we find such selfless, dedicated, honourable men?
Buried mosly in Europe, Hong Kong, the Balkans, Korea and other far flung places where they served and on the bottom of the oceans. very few are buried here in comparison, unless brought back for their families.
Sorry that was Alexandre, not Justin. I always mix them up. They are both so similar papa boys.
Greg,
Your inane bluster is outdone only by your chauvinistic ignorance. Not only do you clearly fail to see that there could be justifiable opposition to the mission in Afghanistan, your petty attempts at either humour or political partisanship are utterly scurrilous. To suggest that the NDP would be anything but profoundly horrified and saddened by the news that yet more of our remarkable soldiers have died is contemptible. It is conduct unbecoming even of the backwater conservative that you are.
p.s. cowardice and non-violence are not necessarily synonymous. In my view, bullies are nothing but cowards just as, in my view, some of the bravest social movements in history have been informed by absolute commitment to non-violent resistance (e.g. early Christianity, Gandhi’s Satyagraha, Tibet’s struggle for autonomy).
AQS:
“We cannot alter that process using external forces. We need to pull out and let the normal Darwinian social evolution rule that place.”
ya – that’s what we need to do – give the place back to the Taliban monsters that will enslave a nation.
AQS – you’re an idiot.
My sympathies to all the brave Canadian soldiers that have given their lives to free the Afghans from tyranny.
The Vietnamese were not known for blowing up Manhattan sky scrapers. Don’t compare the two completely separate issues. Also, Pol Pot’s victims in Cambodia will also surely disagree with your assessment.
Our men and women in the armed forces are fighting those who are actively engaged in wanting to destroy our civilisation. And, I am thankful that they are fighting them over there and not having to do so on our front steps.
Godspeed our warriors, they are the backbone of our society. We`ll never forget you.
AQS: go smoke your gauloise, eat your frommage and masurbate mentally in private, and let the professional soldiers protect your ass as you live your soft life, you sick son of a bitch.
AQS,
If I could reach through the internet, I’d snap your neck like a brittle chicken bone.
Thank you to all the men and women of the CAF.
“Greg,
Your inane bluster is outdone only by your chauvinistic ignorance. Not only do you clearly fail to see that there could be justifiable opposition to the mission in Afghanistan, your petty attempts at either humour or political partisanship are utterly scurrilous. To suggest that the NDP would be anything but profoundly horrified and saddened by the news that yet more of our remarkable soldiers have died is contemptible. It is conduct unbecoming even of the backwater conservative that you are.
p.s. cowardice and non-violence are not necessarily synonymous. In my view, bullies are nothing but cowards just as, in my view, some of the bravest social movements in history have been informed by absolute commitment to non-violent resistance (e.g. early Christianity, Gandhi’s Satyagraha, Tibet’s struggle for autonomy).”
Bill,
First off I did not post the comment about NDP HQ, however, I do agree with it. Taliban Jack Layton will be doing his Lennin pose any moment now, trying to score political points on dead soldiers bodies. Sorry but Jacks actions speak much louder than his words.
And, please do feel free to ply us with your justifiable opposition to the war.
Thank God you yellow bellies were not around for the second world war, you would have surrendered
at the first shot fired back at you.
Heil Hitler Bill, or in todays terms Allah Akbar Bill. sing it for us
Ah, the ‘distinct and I am special’ one is very stinky today, heh.
A true Q Separatist would never even utter those words let alone think them.
“Home” is not “Canada” to a QS.
I know I was born a free person, people flee to this country to be a free person, to this very day; because many died a soldier to make it so.
Thank you to all who have given this ultimate sacrifice.
For you AQS:
“War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight . . . is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself”.
—John Stuart Mill
Go lay down and lick your leg.
CRB
First off,
My bad, I did confuse your comment with Fred’s. But since you agree with Fred, I’m curious how someone could justifiably hold that sentiment without resorting to cliche conservative talking points that are as disingenuous as they are false. The Taliban Jack bullsh** is one thing when you’re trying to be pettily partisan or to justify your blood lust, but in the context of honouring 3 dead Canadian soldiers, it’s preposterous and tasteless. Please do elaborate with any degree of integrity on “Sorry but Jacks actions speak much louder than his words.”
btw I’ll try to spell the names of your heroes correctly (i.e. Hitler, Bush, Wolfowitz) if you do likewise. It’s Lenin. Vladimir Ilyich Lenin. Although judging by your attempts to denigrate Jack Layton and the NDP, you probably meant Stalin.
I assume by your intensely articulate and original response, that you disagree with the viability of non-violent resistance and the view that non-violence is not necessarily cowardice. I mean dismissing my suggestion by calling me a yellow belly. I’m stumped, you win.
Posted by: CRB >
Well Quoted!!!
To add WS “Macbeth” “Something wicked this way comes” can be no understatement of our times, culture and civilization.
We are plagued with the “Atheist Quebecois Separatiste” types in our societies and epoch. They are random by-products or “afterbirth” of lazy well to do societies.
Impossible the youth today to see beyond the gut wrenching disembowelment of a human child by a holy warriors machete. Rather they lack the foresight to see the evil of enslavement of those same children, along with their mothers and fathers as brutal sex objects and pull apart playthings, disposable objects of “gods chosen beings”.
The masters who intend to enslave the west, demand obedience and worship. Make no mistake, the horrors fall well beyond the human physic of physical pain… they are already on our doorstep and within our midst.
AQS – you are a weak fool to not see your children’s future otherwise.
Long time daily visitor. First time on the comments.
“…it’s a natural reaction for those who can’t fathom the fact that there are those among us who rush in when most flee…”. Nuff said.
I come here to find words for what I feel in my gut. Thank you CJunk, and thank you Kate.
Dear Bill,
My husband was in Afghansitan last year.
Thank You for your concern for our soldiers, however, my husband did not, and does not need to be “saved” from his job…he volunteered, and has volunteered to go back, for reasons that I am sure many would not understand…but he is most definately not a victim, or a felon…just a soldier fufilling his sworn oath to his country, just as his father did in WW2.
*************************************************
They shall not grow old as we who are left grow old
age shall not weary them nor the years condemn
at the going down of the sun and in the morning
we will remember them
Bill Stewart wrote: “I’ll try to spell the names of YOUR HEROES correctly (i.e. Hitler, Bush, Wolfowitz) IF YOU DO LIKEWISE. It’s Lenin. Vladimir Ilyich Lenin.”
Are we to assume then Bill, that Lenin was indeed a hero of yours? Would that be the Vladimir Lenin responsible for the deaths of millions, by bullet and famine?
Too bad those millions didn’t understand the concept of ‘non-violent resistance’ eh! Surely, had they passively resisted, they would have lived rich, full and lengthy lives under the glorious leadership of the great and noble Lenin.
Sometimes, you just gotta FIGHT or die. And sometimes, a few great men are willing to fight that others might live.
Whoops!!! my post was in response to AQS’s comment:
“I don’t think I insult the soldiers because I want to save their live. Get real!!!!”
Apologies to Bill
It is trivial to argue that passivism is selfish. Perhaps it is the ultimate selfishness. And selfishness like cowardice is merely pride disguised. Passivism is the easy way out; it is extremely short-sighted.
Of course, passivism cannot defend itself. It welcomes the enemy through the front door.
Elements of excessive passivism — do I dare to call it fascist passivism? — are rampant throughout left-wing thinking. It has effectively infiltrated Christian and other religious thinking. Declaring it to be the reasonable, modern, and moral imperative, it has managed to breed ideas of multiculturalism, and to paint evil as fictitious.
Islam, like the rabid Russian Bear, must be restrained, whatever it costs. Our brave soldiers in Afghanistan are fighting for our survival. Our brave freedom-of-expression fighters here at home are also fighting for our survival.
Fighting the Taliban is as important as fighting the CHRCs, and the laws that permit their disgraceful, treasonous behaviour.
I am increasingly of the opinion that those medieval savages are not worth a drop of Canadian blood. Having said that, AQS is wrong because this war is in our national interest and we really don’t have any good choice but to win it. As the Americans have discovered in Iraq, it’s going to be a lot costlier than we thought. I don’t know if we (the West) have the fortitude.
Noel, I presume you mean pacifism. It’s a stupid utopian idea that can only work if every last person on the planet is a pacifist. As soon as some show up who aren’t, everyone else becomes enslaved or dead.
Is it just me, or are the maunderings of AQS starting to read, in style at least, like those of haye? Could it be the troll is beginning to confuse its multiple unpersonalities?
Worst of all, if we don’t win think of all those Afghani refugees well be forced to take in……coming to a neighborhood near you! Kill the Taliban bastards with everything we can afford, we’re rich enough to buy the best killing equipment or whatever you call it that money can buy!
My son is serving his 3rd tour in Kandahar with 3 PPCLI. During his mid-tour break he showed me several dozen pics of his men, and the Afghan soldiers they helped teach to defend their own country after we leave.
Dave stressed that most of the Afghan soldiers despise the taliban and eagerly take them on when given the chance. Several of the ANA guys in the pics were killed or severely wounded in firefights, and our lads trust these guys just as they trust each other.
One pic showed the floor of a LAV (I believe it was) which they used to convey an Afghan sergeant who took shrapnel in the thigh but kept firing until Dave literally had to drag him away because they were going to be surrounded on three sides. The guy survived, but his boot was full of blood, and Dave said he couldn’t believe the quantity of blood lost by one man. He also said the guy was as solid a fighter as any he had met.
The reason for my posting this is simple. My son volunteered to go to a foreign country not because he’s a highly-trained killer, but because he wanted to make a difference in the lives of ordinary Afghans. He went back the second time to train Afghans to learn to defend their country from the extremists. The third time was because the job the Canadians do over there is far from finished. And yes, we do a hell of a good job there in reconstruction, but we’re very much under-manned and under-funded. Seems that anything positive we do is forbidden to be reported.
I wish I could show you the pics but I promised my son they were only for immediate family, as any Afghan soldier identified on the internet would become a bullseye to the taliban. They’re stuck there and have to fight for a decent way of life, heck just to survive, unlike the boot-licking AQS troll who enjoys a soft, safe, comfortable but cowardly life in our most socialist province.
It is absolutely necessary to prevail in Afghanistan and defeat the Taliban. It is also quite likely that NATO will have to intervene in Pakistan, before the situation there gets completely out of control. The comparison with Vietnam is ludicrous. Vietnam had never attacked the continental U.S. and did not sponsor terrorist training camps dedicated to the destruction of the west.
A withdrawl from Afghanistan would be a disaster for world peace and security and a tremendous victory for the Jihadists. An attempt at spreading their violent, poisonous brand of Islam through terror and war worldwide would surely follow. They’ve said as much themselves.
The Jihadists credibility in the Islamic world would skyrocket, and make it very difficult for moderates and reformers to counter their argument that Islam must once again take up the sword and complete its conquest of the world. Sound insane? Maybe it is, but they honestly believe that with God’s help it is possible.
Not everyone who opposes the Aghan mission does so out of ignorance, cowardice, or political opportunism.
But the quotes in this Post article by Trudeau’s self absorbed and elitist progeny really takes the cake. Read only on an empty stomach.
People like Trudeau aren’t worthy to worthy to polish the shoes of our CF members in Afghanistan.
Thanks to your soldiers for educating, rebuilding and yes, fighting, alongside ours. It is a worthy endeavor. Hopefully the critical thinkers will sway the fashionable or the West will indeed be lost.
Thanks randall g.
I was thinking “passivism” includes both pacifism and pacificism. Floating around in a cloud of cumulus theory doesn’t prepare for the impending storm.
Grant it, peaceful or passive means are useful, laudable, and sometimes successful, but they can be the delusion of wishful thinking the loony left thrives on.
Somehow the misinterpretation of “turn the other cheek” has found its way as a foundation for passivism and its variants. Its context of “eye for an eye” and revenge, missed almost completely.
As a chilling and terrible recent example read what the Patriarch of Moscow (Alexei II) has prayed for peace — not a single mention of Georgia, the country invaded. A cowardly affirmation that permits the Russian Bear to dig in and secure its claws in freedom’s flesh and soul and spirit of happy expectations.
But should he have demonstrated overt empathy also for the Georgians, defended the Truth, the Orthodox state privilege could be smashed and crushed without a moment’s notice.
Passivism, pacifism, pacificism can have lethal consequences. Vigilance is not wishful thinking, “soft winds and roses”.
I hope those Soldiers of ours know that some of us here at home think about them, offer prayers, and support them in many ways. Daily, if not more often.
Kate, I’ve also noticed many of our lost soldiers were on their third tour, and wondered why that is so.
Maybe, it’s because these guys have the most experience and training, and therefore, are put in the most dangerous areas and given the toughest tasks.
Not sure, but that may be the reason.
Shamrock…after spending ten years with the Airborne Regiment I can tell you that these front line soldiers are there at their request,the same reason for their third tour.As tough as nails bunch of guys who never drop the ball and always have your back.I would not want to be a Taliban terrorist coming up against these guys,then again,if martyrdom is the objective then meeting a canadian soldier on the battle field would be a good thing.Wherever honor and glory lead.
Do not forget that AQS and his ilk are the same one’s who threw their weapons and packs overboard in Halifax harbour during WWII,rather then fight on the side of the “anglais”,and help free their own pathetic countrymen.Both my grandfathers fought in WWII,and one also fought in WWI. I will never forget their courage and dedication to freedom,but sometimes I seriously wonder if that worthless hunk of ground called Europe was worth saving. In that vien,I hope that the facists/marxists/jihadis do have their way. Unfortunately,all the Europeans that would fight for their countries would have long ago fled to Canada,U.S.A.,Australia,etc.,except for the Israelis. Put a fence around the whole stinking lot,and turn it into a parking lot for the world’s biggest Macs!
Yes, h.ryan, I know they’re volunteers. I’m just saying that, nothwithstanding their volunteer (and incredibly brave) status, they may be taking on more dangerous missions than some others, because they have more experience and training.
Our combat arms soldiers are now the best in the world; they can take out an enemy like no other, but still show great restraint in limiting civilian casualties. I read Christie Blatchford’s book and was quite steamed when I read that Canadian troops were denied an air strike because ROE had been changed (WRT how far civilians are from enemy). Soon after a mortar came in and killed two of our guys.
Give our soldiers what they need to complete the mission. I’m sick of twits like Sacha who do everything in their power to undermine the mission, through ignorance and denial of resources, them trumpet how we’re failing.
Hey, Sacha, you’re the one who is failing our troops. Stop blaming them, or even better, shut the f**k up. Time and time again these idiots are held up as “experts” when they have zero knowledge or training on the issues.
Let’s not forget what the Liberals (Chretien) did to the Airborne. They executed the prisoner and then held the trial. Disgusting crap from a party that will resort to any low to try to get power, and the keys to the treasury, back.
Shamrock…did you know that the same year Chretien screwed the Airborne they made history in Lahr Germany by winning an infantry contest competing against the best infantrys the world has to offer.On top of that it was the first time a first time applicant won the whole thing.The contempt I or any ex Airborne soldier has for Chretien is immeasurable.
CBCpravda , All Taliban Jack All the Time
3400 militants killed to date. and CBC calls it what.
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2008/08/22/afghan-civilians.html
“Support the troops: BRING THEM HOME.
Enough with the killings, the terror and the war.”
-Atheist Quebecois Separatiste
Hey AQS a question for you: How many frenchmen does is take to defend Paris??
Answer: No-one knows its never been tried!!
God hates a coward.
yeh, and if we really went to war we could finish this shit in about a month.
Shamrock:
There are a number of reasons why some soldiers are on their third tours.
1. In the right units
2. They have seniority and pull so they jump the cue
3. Experienced NCOs are an enormous asset so they are a priority when tasking
4. Some request to go (particularily true in the reserves)… some even badger their NCOs.
I can assure you from personal knowledge, that in some units where only a limited number are chosen to go, that those left behind are a bitter bunch. Some actually VR after being turned aside too often. There are many who joined specifically for Afghanistan … and they just haven’t been lucky enough to go.