One mining company president told The Times that governments that had promised a way out of economic turmoil with bold schemes to subsidise green cars, solar panels and other environmental technology had “spoken without understanding the upstream of modern products”.
Don Burbar, the chief executive of Avalon Rare Metals, said: “The crux of the matter is that there are now a lot of technologies that can’t work without rare earths, and China is currently in effective control of the global supply. China has positioned itself to retain control, and meanwhile politicians around the world do not appreciate how the supply side of green technology works.”
h/t Tomax7
The Law of Unintended Consequences kicks into gear and starts to impose reality on The Believers.
Politicians not understanding supply-side economics?
Gosh. That seems hard to believe…
“Politicians around the world do not appreciate how the supply side of green technology works.”
Ummmm, most politicians around the world don’t understand how ANYTHING works. They are the epitome of what Thomas Sowell calls “Stage One Thinking”. And that’s a big reason why we’re collectively in so much trouble.
another reason to not want those giant fans, eh Kate?
I don’t see greens worrying about this. They’re practically uber socialists anyways.
“China has positioned itself to retain control, and meanwhile politicians around the world do not appreciate how the supply side of green technology works.”
Yes. And how did they position themselves to obtain control? Thanks to your Walmart dollars. Next time you congratulate yourself on saving a dollar (or screwing a unionized worker out of one), think about the two dollars that are going to China.
Another newsflash. If you think Alaskan oil is going to save you in the long term, well, good luck. This recession has dampened the US economy. With savings rates going up people will spend less, and companies will look to the countries where spending is increasing – ie India and China – as their target audiences. Those two countries arent crazy about oil prices. They re going to want the cleaner stuff, which in their countries is always going to be cheaper than oil. If you think California screwed you over by making cars environmentally friendly, wait and see what comes next.The doors are closing on American firms, and Asian firms are looking towards Asia to make money. And Liquid Natural Gas is doing pretty darned well in both those countries.
If China and India want green cars, then thats what the rest of the world is going to have to adjust to. But hey, you saved your dollar.
Can someone translate uh huh‘s post into something resembling coherent English?
Crispytoast,
Apologies. Economics is not your forte. English is, apparently, not mine. I would like to see the translation, too. I am trying to learn English these days. I suggest you should try to learn some economics.
This is a shot in the dark but bear with me… were you that guest on Adler yesterday blaming Syncrude for your frozen zucchinis…. ?
uh huh
Well when some union wants 30 bucks to make a 10 dollar plastic fan. He/she has NO room to cry.
You shut yourself out of a job for asking more than the market can support.
Dustoff,
Fair enough. But at the end of the day, China ends up in the driving seat. Geithner is in China kissing Chinese ass for Chinese foreign exchange reserves that were made by selling plastic fans to Americans. 1.2 trillion dollars. That is how much China has invested in US treasury bills and securities. Where do you think that 1.2 trillion came from? Zimbabwe? Or from the wallets of many many pennypinchers who pay 8 dollars for a 2 dollar fan, just so that they can pay 2 dollars less than they would for a 10 dollar fan.
I suggest you should try to learn some economics.
That the majority of union flag-wavers have never advanced their economics background beyond hard-core mercantilism is nothing new.
Your suggestion that I pay the maximum possible for every item I purchase is certainly intriguing, though.
What’s a “collision coure” and when did Don Bubar change his name?
The Australian seems not to be waiting for the asteroid either….
Uh huh’s bit would have them in the isle.
“Chinese financial assets are very safe,” Geithner said. His response drew laughter from the audience.
http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idINPEK12423320090601?rpc=44
I believe what happened with the rare earth mines is that China essentially low-balled the existing market (I believe there was a rare earth mine somewhere in the States). Chinese prices were half of the going price at the time…so everyone switched to the Chinese supplier–effectively closing out the mine the US. So the discussion would be should we trade with regimes that can pay a very low wage to their workers at the detriment of our strategic abilities. By the way, those rare earth materials are used for things like your car, cellphones, computers and guidance systems for missiles.
There was a rare earth mine in the states (Mountain Pass in California), I recall reading an article about it just a week ago (of course I can’t remember where). The jist of it was that the mine was closed because China was a cheaper source but with China reserving more and more of its supply for domestic use, there was speculation that the US mine might be worth opening again.
China may be able to wield influence in the short term, but if they restrict supply and drive up the price too much, other sources will become economically viable.
Here is some Rare Earth: ‘GET READY’ Wonder if it translates the same in Chinese?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPE5kWbTPIM
Rare earth elements exist in significant quantities in Saskatchewan as well. In fact there is exploration being conducted and will soon be development of the resource by great western minerals.
http://www.gwmg.ca/
Another facet of the broad resource base we have in this province. Regardless of what you think of the green applications, I’d still gladly sell Japan all they want when we get it out of the ground.
DT wrote:
Rare earth elements exist in significant quantities in Saskatchewan as well. In fact there is exploration being conducted and will soon be development of the resource by great western minerals.
http://www.gwmg.ca/
There would be hope but developing this will be delayed by the usual suspects demanding environmental assessments and then insisting that the uninformed opinions of eco-freaks rule….the same usual suspects who seek to shut down the Oil Sands….in fear of a plentiful supply of oil….which runs counter to their ambition to sending us back into the stone-age.
Remember these freaks favour among other things such as deplopulation and destroying hydro dams to “free the rivers”…..
DT wrote:
Rare earth elements exist in significant quantities in Saskatchewan as well. In fact there is exploration being conducted and will soon be development of the resource by great western minerals.
http://www.gwmg.ca/
There would be hope but developing this will be delayed by the usual suspects demanding environmental assessments and then insisting that the uninformed opinions of eco-freaks rule….the same usual suspects who seek to shut down the Oil Sands….in fear of a plentiful supply of oil….which runs counter to their ambition to sending us back into the stone-age.
Remember these freaks favour among other things such as deplopulation and destroying hydro dams to “free the rivers”…..
Wouldn’t it be nice if the newsguys just didn’t cover the greentards?
~~favill~~
sasquatch; the fear is that China will buy up this Saskatchewan mine via a proxy Canadian company in order to control supply.
I doubt we have Strategic Resource Legislation in forever Liberal Canada. Let’s hope for a CPC majority before Mr. Cretin et al deals it all away.
Who owns Great Western Minerals? Is it Hutchison Wampoa or one of it’s subsidiaries?
So the greens and the Commies have us by the balls. Nice.
uh huh
China is making Wal-Mart garbage due to comparative advantage. That makes poor people here AND there better able to afford a better standard of living.
It seems like your Econ. isn’t any better than your Eng.
And the reason that Asia imports so much LNG is that they have to. The US is the world’s 4th largest PRODUCER of natural gas after Russia, Qutar and Iran (notice the lack of Asian names?) The Yanks don’t have to go through the expense to liquefy it just to ship it to themselves (and the rest of their demand is piped in from Canada – it doesn’t need to be liquefied either. Piping it across land is far cheaper.)
And what heats your house? Mine runs on Natural Gas.
As per China’s 1.3 trillion in treasuries, they didn’t so much “invest in them” as were forced to hold them as any attempt to reduce their dollar reserve tanks the US dollar and eliminates their competitive advantage which then tanks their own economy. The US really needs to devalue its currency at this point.
Further, China is really concerned that Obama will inflate the debt away rather than pay it.
The only reason China is in the driver’s seat is that the government there owns a piece of everything in the country and can buy up companies abroad. Many of the companies they own are not mobile and are subject to foreign government review.
As a graduate student, I worked on a REE deposit in Quebec. It was very rich, but uneconomical because Chinese rare-earths were so cheap and the demand was modest. If the Chinese want to blackmail the world by controlling REE supplies, they will find lots of other countries have deposits as well.
I’m not sure about the rare earths claim. Australia has huge deposits of rare earth mineral readily accessible and certainly not owned by the Chinese.
the pasr few days there has been numerous stories on cbc and others about Belinda’s daddy buying Opel and satisfying our demand for green cars. Frank is boasting about the car’s ability to go “up to 160 km. before needing a recharge”.Rejoice all,except for those who actually take a trip farther than an hour away or use a vehicle for work,for that you will need the good old internal combustion under your hood.You won’t see many of these on the 401 or Trans-Canada.That means two car families for most,or more of the same for us regular folk. Dream on Frank,and please don’t name the first one after your daughter. Remember the Edsel.The Belinda would be just as big of a disaster.
“China is making Wal-Mart garbage due to comparative advantage.”
Artificial comparative advantage, including an yuan-USD exchange rate that is completely artificial. Not to mention government subsidised wages etc etc. Of course, you don’t want to pay the ten dollars it takes to get a torchlight made in America, or 8 dollars in a free trade and non-aggressive regime. No you want to save those six dollars by buying a 30 cent Chinese torchlight, for 2 dollars. GUess what – one dollar out of that is going into Chinese coffers. Sorry buddy, but artificial comparative advantage is the antithesis of economics. Its a recipe for disaster. And Americans will realise that in the next couple of centuries.
“As per China’s 1.3 trillion in treasuries… then tanks their own economy.”
Is that why Geithners in China trying to convince the Chinese that everything will be okay? Have you forgotten the unabashed scolding the Chinese premier launched at the US earlier this year? Or the Chinese central banks assertion that the world needs to replace the dollar as the reserve currency? Its more complicated than this, of course, and I don’t want to go into the details, but China is less concerned about the state of the dollar, and more concerned about the drop in exports. Their economics are predicting that with US savings rates going up, US citizens will end up buying government debt etc and keeping the dollar high and dry. Which is pretty much why Geithner is there trying to woo Chinese money. They aren’t keen on investing in the US at all. For what its worth, the Chinese are investing all over Africa.
“And the reason that Asia imports so much LNG is that they have to.”
For what? For the heating? Doubt it. For electricity? Doubt it -they both run almost exclusively on coal, hydro and nuclear plants. The CNG etc is the cheap alternative to petrol. Travel to Asia sometime. Public transit in many countries is required by law to run on compressed/liquid natural gas. Guess where the big orders for buses are going to come from. India and China. Guess what kind of engines they are required to have. Big firms arent going to worry about western states wanting fast buses with solid acceleration. Nope, its more economical for them to keep it down to as few engine models as possible. And those are going to be CNG engines. Try drivign an SUV with a lng engine. Its terrible. But the market dictates, and the market is increasing there and decreasing here.
“The only reason China is in the driver’s seat is that the government there owns a piece of everything in the country and can buy up companies abroad.”
Yes. And how can they afford it? Your walmart dollars at work. They’re stocking up on everything from diesel to nickel right now. Kind of like the American”strategic oil reserves”, except with more diverse materials. Oh and foreign governments dare not challenge the Chinese. Theres too much money involved. Truth is, they re outplaying America at America’s game. What America did in the 1950s, China is doing now. Thanks to “comparative advantage”. And cheap chinese consumer goods.
“I’m not sure about the rare earths claim. Australia has huge deposits of rare earth mineral readily accessible and certainly not owned by the Chinese.”
Funny you should say that. The Australians are already in a tizzy about how to deal with China. The Chinese aren’t making any bones about it. They ve bought a huge share of the energy resource facilities coming up around Darwin, and their stimulus package is currently creating a network of pipelines to distribute the natural gas imported from Australia across the country. Point being, the Australians don’t know how to say no to the Chinese. They can’t. Stockholders want short term profit and don’t care about long term security. Kind of like American consumers.
I say, Vitruvius! Is there any chance that our resident DJ can fight the Chinese rare earth monopoly by spinning a little Rare Earth?
Ooops! Sorry, Esther, you’re miles ahead of me.