This Is The Time At SDA When I Ask The Readers – Updated

Roadkill 125 Comments

As so many of you contributed with advice, I owe you an update.

It broke my heart, having waited months, but I’ve cancelled the factory order. Back to the drawing board. But I may have a lead on a Savana 15 passenger 4wd conversion, so there’s that.

Original post below.
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Only for those who have direct experience, please.

About half a dozen times a summer, I tow this 17ft toyhauler to destinations no further than a 500 mile prairie radius (Calgary, North Dakota. etc).

Last summer, I ordered a 2023 Chev Express 3500 passenger van, with the 6.6l V8 to replace my old Ford E350. 12 – 18 month wait.

Today the dealership called to advise the engine is no longer available, and now only has the 4.3L LV1 V-6 (8 speed).

OTOH, this van will be doing trips without a trailer as far as the US east coast and California.

My question — again — is only for those of you who drive late model Chev V-6 trucks. How would you rate the real world towing capacity of this engine?

No snark, and no speculation, please. Just real world experience. This is important.

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Thanks all, now I have a headache.  Ugh.

125 Replies to “This Is The Time At SDA When I Ask The Readers – Updated”

  1. I love 4 wheel drive. The only way to deal with real winter and a huge safety factor when on winter tires. My modified Forester XT hit 333,333 km last night. Did perfect donuts at 5 am on highway 2 to celebrate

  2. “I still think a truck with a cap and enclosed trailer combination would be the cat’s arse. But the van would be heated, so maybe that’s an issue with prized companions/champions.”

    Heated and air conditioned is non-negotiable. The dogs are worth more than the vehicle, and some of them are client dogs.

  4. An 8ft topper will work not hard to install aux heat and A/C. If it was me I would find a 8-10 ft truck camper that already has heat and A/C strip it down put shelves for crates and leave the sleeping area up top back under and go when you need it.

  5. I think some of the guys here talking about custom jobs may have a point. An E450-sized cube van, with custom-built kennel space and storage space, with heating and AC, and easy access from the cab, and a hitch for towing cargo, maybe sell your big trailer to help finance it. I think you may be able to step up in size/power and buy used, with a killer inspection, and still be cheaper than buying new. Also, as is well known in the industry, larger engines and trannies last way longer. Cubes are also cheaper to do body work on.
    Maybe even a Hino.
    Think outside the box, and to a crapton of research.

  7. Kate, used mecedes diesel van or dodge equivalent with same diesel would be a good choice, other tenant here runs a merc, and tows a boat a lot, no problems, and good on fuel. Or you could have a pro install a volume metric paxton blower on the new 4.3. My experience with a 4.3 is that they tow good, but was a pig on gas. That would keep you out of hi pressure range, and give you 40-60 HP more, plus better low end torque .

  8. When you get a real feel for what you seek.
    Maybe we visitors can be of help.
    As you are aware some of us are well off the beaten path and may be able to source older vans in great shape..
    Like a E350 with a 7.3l diesel.
    Or the customized camper vans that have spent more time sitting parked than on the road.
    Now I don’t pay much attention to vehicles anymore,I run two 7.3l Fords and love them.
    But they are over 20 years old..
    But I do notice when a 7.3 is offered for sale.

    So when you,Kate,have a short list of what you seek..
    Big Van.
    Sliding Doors.
    Tow capacity..
    Turbo Diesel?
    Perhaps your faithful readers could look around their neighbourhood,with your specification in mind.
    For until we look,most of us have no idea what is available.
    Anything to improve your headache.
    Or is that add to it?

  11. Looks like the US government has been leaning on manufacturers to drop V8 engines. My jeep has a V8 hemi, that configuration is no-more. They replaced it with an in-line 6 engine. It might well get better gas milage, but it would not be suitable for towing my trailer.

  12. Brain dump, will throw more in as I think about it

    Most fleet co’s have gone away from diesels as the total cost of ownership turns out to be much higher. While 1000 lb of torque is nice there is such a thing as overkill for the application. Argue all you want but it’s fact. And quality of fuel available affects both your mileage and longevity immensely.

    I sort of prefer the old school GM and Ford products as both were simple and easy to repair with the Chevy being a bit roomier and nicer to drive and the Ford being more rugged and basically bulletproof, and both perfectly suited for the task at hand. Obviously with GM not playing ball and Ford only having the cutaway this complicates a new one a bit.

    Don’t know much about the Promasters or the big Nissan’s, can tell you the Transits are very nice to drive and with the turbo engines can easily do the job. They aren’t as rugged as the old e-series and you do have to treat the turbo engines like turbo engines with warm up and cool down cycles, synthetic oil, etc.

    Based on prior experience there is no way in hell I would recommend a Sprinter to anyone I liked or was even fairly disinterested in.

    What’s really wrong with the old one? I know it’s getting on in years and miles, but I’d wager there’s more million mile Ford vans on the road than anything else, still hauling around construction stuff or picking up or delivering.

    As mentioned by Hiho a cube may be a decent option, a single rear wheel e-350 with the 7.3 and a small box/bus body might work well for you. And when it comes to DIY customization, the sky is the limit.

    1. Reason I ask about the old one, especially as it’s set up for you already, as long as the platform is still good, you can repair and refresh them for very reasonable money.

      More Transit brain dump- if you use it in the winter at all, AWD only and budget for a decent set of tires as the stock ones are well suited for use in a tire barrier at the local go kart track. Watching the rear brakes as the miles pile on is also recommended.

    2. “What’s really wrong with the old one? I know it’s getting on in years and miles, but I’d wager there’s more million mile Ford vans on the road than anything else, still hauling around construction stuff or picking up or delivering.”

      It had 7 windshield changes in a previous life as a gravel road Hutterite van, and now is so rusted at the windshield-roof line that the structural integrity is gone. The rust is starting on the lower panels as well, and it’s getting close to 250k. I’m certain it’s never had a tuneup, and I don’t want to keep it long enough to be forced into major repairs.

    2. I followed prices on Cargurus for months, and – yeah, it’s why I ordered new. It was less money to buy a new factory order than comparable used.

  14. If possible, avoid Gasoline Direct Injection, which unfortunately is most gas cars and trucks nowadays except Ford and Toyota. The intake valves don’t get washed by gasoline, and so they load up with crankcase carbon sludge via the PVC system, and eventually the engine runs like crap at 80 or 100K km. This is a widespread problem on all cars with GDI only fuel systems. You have to have the intake manifold removed and the intake valves blasted with walnut shells. Ford and Toyota are the only companies I’m aware of that use a dual GDI and port injection system and thus don’t have that problem.

  15. Read through this with some interest / concerns.
    1. It seems a lot of people don’t understand direct injection engines. They are game changing for the better and worse.
    Recommended: https://youtu.be/MIDItBqX3SQ
    My company truck 08 F150 3.2L di, 28 mpg 4 month avg. Awesome because I only haul stuff for 10 miles or so maybe once every 2 weeks.
    My 05 F150 quit me in the traditional 5.4 way after 265K (135 mine) but I worked the 5h1t out of that truck. Looking around we see auto makers under pressure to eliminate V8s. But there, to date, is only 1 non V8 gas engine out there in a van that will do the job. The 3.5L EcoBoost.
    I owned two 2010 Ford Flexes (sleds). One standard 3.5 (anemic) and one EcoBoost. The EcoBoost is the most over all impressive engine I’ve ever experienced. Bar none.
    I’ll add one more link below.
    (PS. If you get a V8 or go diesel check the engine’s reputation; and remember the 3.5L EcoBoost has more torque than the 5.0L Coyote. )
    (PPS the LV1 forgoes the 6-4-2 cylinder step down of the typical Express LV3 engine presumably for load consideration, meaning in a long wheel base passenger van the load already exceeds the feasibility of cylinder step down fuel management)
    (PPPS AMSOIL is, in fact, awesome. I currently have 5 vehicles, all used, I can’t afford AMSOIL. Mobil 1 is good but I suspect when it gets old, as such, it loses viscosity quickly. So… Royal Purple HMX for me (Not star certified!) If I were to buy new, AMSOIL right after break in.)
    (PPPPS Even though the EcoBoost has both direct AND port injectors I’d put a catch can on it, (that’s what killed mine after 225k)

  16. After you ran this the first time I got interested (managed to hurt myself badly over Christmas and am bored as &^%&) and thought about your issue a bit. So, some thoughts:

    1 – you probably want a cargo van rather than a passenger van. The right tool for the job etc etc
    2 – I have a friend who owns a a Nissan cargo van. Loves it, serious power, good handling, etc. However, geared for in-city rather than highway use. If you can get one geared for highway ops, this might be good choice.
    3 – the RAM van is an Eurodesign. Good for short hauls, not good for Alberta highways.
    4 – a 2023 ford cargo van. medium roof height, full towing package, highway package (rec vehicle package), V6+Eco, AWD, upgraded tires, is about $65K all in. I’ve driven the 2021 version of this and thought it pretty great. Do yourself a favor and go test drive one. You’ll like the power and appreciate the tight turning radius – do go show parking being the mess it so often is. The small wheels suck visually but are part of the final gear ratio and contribute a lot to handling (turning and accelleration). Do not skimp on the AWD – very valuable when things turn tight or nasty.

    1. Ram is out, the nose profile is too short for moose-deer-antelope highway driving. New and even used transits are too pricey, even if I did like the spinny little wheels, and I don’t.

      Cargo means I have finish work to do with insulation and aftermarket air-conditioning for the back. And did you know that the late model Chev cargoes don’t have tilt steering? Checked three of them. Unbelievable.

      Pretty much limited to another low mileage Ford E-350 or the Express/Savannah passenger.

  17. I do not want to sound like a Ford salesman and I absolutely agree the small wheels look wrong, but from an engineering viewpoint they are right. With AWD in particular, they pay off in good accelleration and very tight turns. When I drove one of these (the 2 wheel drive el cheapo Enterprise bought to rent to the city – no cruise control even) to Edmonton and back in high winds and snow I expected instability, but experienced very little of it.

    The $65K list (approx) guess includes the rec vehicle pre-wiring which makes adding a commerical rooftop air unit easy and cheaper – and makes the the kludge/redneck approach of using a home depot $700 room airconditioner even easier as you can just plug it in and vent out a window. (You will also find that decent floor and sidewall finish options are available – I made middle-of-the-road choices to estimate the cost).

    I have no idea what adding a moose catcher costs – the hutterites here have them on pretty much all of their vehicles but I’ve never looked at the cost. (On the other hand, I have hit a deer – see winface.com/oldwin/deer/deer.html for the video – and understand why adding one makes sense.) I also have no idea what your financial situation is, but can point out that current ford lease rates (lease now, own later) at about 4% are well below inflation and can be locked in for up to five years – meaning that using their money instead of yours can save you a bundle.

    1. Further: I know you don’t want to finance and understand why. However.. if you borrow $65K from ford at 4% for 5 years while putting about $40K into a TFSA at 4.5% (current scotia bank non redeemable 2 years is 4.75%) you will pay ford about $72K (probably a fully deductable expense if you’re set up that way and have adequate revenue) while your TFSA grows to about $50K -i.e. on net your truck costs you about $22K over the five year period – and quite a lot less than that if your tax situation permits and/or if inflation causes your tfsa return to rise while the ford rate is locked in.

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