Horst Mahler was a leader of the German radical left in the 1960s and ’70s. Now he’s a member of the radical right, sitting in jail for denying the Holocaust. But he’s reportedly verified reports that he informed for Communist spies in the ’60s.
That would be the “right” as in neo-national socialist party “right”.
Update: More from Ed Driscoll
h/t Maz2
Exactly.
Well, the one on the right was on the left
And the one in the middle was on the right
And the one on the left was in the middle
And the guy in the rear was a Methodist
h/t Johnny Cash
From a while ago . . .
“The issue of the definition of fascism is easily explained. Marxists view fascism as being “right-wing”, but then EVERYTHING other than their own Marxist ideology would be to their right.
Fascism is without question a creature of the left.
“We are socialists, we are enemies of today’s capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance, and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions.” –Adolf Hitler-Speech of May 1, 1927.
That same quote could have come out of the mouth of Jack Layton on May 1, 2011.
And then there is this…
“Most cruel joke of all, however, has been played by Hitler & Co. on those German capitalists and small businessmen who once backed National Socialism as a means of saving Germany’s bourgeois economic structure from radicalism. The Nazi credo that the individual belongs to the state also applies to business. Some businesses have been confiscated outright, on other what amounts to a capital tax has been levied. Profits have been strictly controlled. Some idea of the increasing Governmental control and interference in business could be deduced from the fact that 80% of all building and 50% of all industrial orders in Germany originated last year with the Government. Hard-pressed for food- stuffs as well as funds, the Nazi regime has taken over large estates and in many instances collectivized agriculture, a procedure fundamentally similar to Russian Communism.”
(Source: Time Magazine; January 2, 1939.)”
I really get a good laugh when fools like the CBC try and explain how “collectivized agriculture” is right wing.
Yeah, I always get a bitter laugh at the media when they try to understand left and right.
I remember the CBC and some American (and Euro) news channels when the actual hard line COMMUNISTS in Russia tried to push Boris Yeltsin out ( you remember he was standing on a tank in a crowd in a fine piece of political theatre).
Yep, the Russian “hard right” had attempted a coup against sweet drunken lefty Boris.
After I fell out of my chair laughing and recovered enough to realize they were being serious, and it wasn’t a howler of a mistake, I realized that to the news reporters it is as simple as “right wing” = bad, left = good (And “Il n’y a pas d’enemie a gauche”), and there is no more thought associated with this than with breathing.
Suddenly, the world made more sense. So much of my cognitive dissonance stop echoing. I also stopped getting the paper and the TV news to a great measure, and went looking for better sources of information.
I’m a fervent believer in the Holocaust.
I’m not quite sure why, of the gazillion events that have occurred in history, only ONE has severe penalties for being a skeptic.
Just to be on the safe side, I’m also a firm believer in that Trojan Horse thing, just in case Greece should criminalize doubting Thomases.
Same goes for Scotland and my devout belief in the Loch Ness Monster. Better safe than sorry.
“Mahler was a prominent figure in West Germany’s so-called ’68 student movement which was angered by residual Nazism in West Germany and by the government’s involvement in the Vietnam War. When a left-wing protester named Benno Ohnesorg was shot dead in 1967 by a West Berlin police officer, students catalyzed around the conviction that West Germany was a “fascist” state. Mahler helped lead the way.
The shot that killed Ohnesorg has long been considered a turning point in German politics. The 1970s saw the rise of the Baader-Meinhof gang and a rash of anti-government terrorism from the radical left. Two years ago a fresh investigation revealed that the West Berlin officer who fired the gun, Karl-Heinz Kurras, worked for the Stasi.”
Student protestors (and ourselves) duped by the left.
The control of words has become a full time job for the gate-keepers these days.
Right-Left-socialist-Marxist-Christian from the West-fascist are but a few of the words which no longer hold their original meaning but are thrown around, and, depending on which room you happen to be standing in or which news or blog page you happen to be reading, their meanings can be vastly different.
Here is an article which I found to be pretty helpful in bringing some enlightenment:
http://bigjournalism.com/dloesch/2011/07/23/a-quick-lesson-for-media-on-the-definition-of-right-wing/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDSN1F72QU4
and …burned his drivers licence
h/t Joe
Let’s see….
Terms defined and rendered meaningless by the lefties….
Rightist….
Leftist….
Liberal….
Conservative…
Fascist…
Racist…
Progressive…
Enlightened….
Sceptic…
Extremist…
Radical…
Moderate…
It’s beginning to be an entire new language…..
aka ‘media spin’.
It is everywhere.
It is dangerous to a free society.
It must be exposed for all to see.
It allows crazy people to rule over us.
It must be stopped.
[ Well, go to Hell. All of you.] Goldberg
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/273444/hell-you-people-jonah-goldberg#
Me bad or still sleepy….
I omitted….
Fair…
Reasonable…
Compromise…
The National Socialist German Workers’ Party is to Socialism what the German Democratic Republic is to democracy.
This article has no surprises,political whores/animals, most of whom hide distinct mental pathologies very well,move from Party to Party to cause,to counter-cause with the complete freedom of the person who believes in nothing,but his own lust for power.
Today’s radical leftist can easily be tomorrow’s extreme rightist if the opportunity opens up on the far side of the political arena.
Yes, many people in the West were duped by agents of the USSR or their proxies,who concentrated on universities and peace movements here to further their agenda. It was sad to talk to so many of these kids in the ’60’s who swallowed the lines carefully poured into their little pot-addled brains by agents provocateurs in the guise of hippie organization leaders,and their armies of useful idiots.
I was fortunate to have a relative in the Canadian secret service at the time, and was apprised of the situation with all the “movements”.
It’s too bad he died so young,as his knowledge would have made a very interesting and embarrassing book.
The 1968 Gun Control Act -written and passed by Democrats- is a word for word copy of the Nazi gun control act.
There is no Left, there is no Right. There are those who benefit from the growth of the state, and there are the rest of us who do not.
Iberia would seem to be in the former camp, given his tireless efforts at disinformation.
Posted by: lberia at August 2, 2011 1:26 PM
Both are natural progressions of Germany’s world-leading experiment with socialism.
Just read The Road to Serfdom by Hayek.
The problem the Right has (not so much in Canada) is the social conservatives open the door for the Left to slander us. I’ve no qualms with social conservatives, but they are definitely the what holds the Right in a stalemate with the Left(in the USA).
PMSH has clearly demonstrated that throwing the social conservatives under the bus IS the way to move the fiscal and foreign policy conservative movements forward.
In the USA, the social conservatives MUST take one for the team if the GOP is to pull-ahead for the long term.
If just once the GOP candidate would follow PMSH’s lead and guarantee he/she will not assail the abortion issue, 2012 will be a slam-dunk for the GOP, and for the long-haul.
I love you guys, but in the view of well over 50% of the population, you are the scourge of our party and movement. You open all doors for conservatives to be called “racists”, “Knuckle Draggers”, “Idiots” and so on and so on. I know Kate hates it… but perception IS reality in politics.
I think the US midterm election shows a fallacy of Indiana’s argument. Besides, I think people are starting to recognize that being called names like that reflect Godwin’s law.
I think the conservatives need to either take back the meaning of ‘right’, or push a different nomenclature altogether. After all, I believe the right and left terminology originated with Marx anyway.
I’m with Indiana in the sense of ‘who are we to judge?’
Although I believe in the sanctity of human life, for example, I cannot impose my will onto others. In effect, that would give somebody else an implicit right to impose their will on me.
I care very little about those who portray themselves as victims … in most cases it’s a result of bad choices and a direct result of their own free will, albeit on a very complicated path they have taken.
When somebody purports to tell me they know how to spend my money better than I do, that’s when my dander gets up.
So, stick to the economics and keep your own moral codes private and we’ll all get along … whether you’re a commie like Iberia, a buffoon like chesterfield or any other troll that does not understand it’s a bad idea to stick their nose in my life.
It works both ways. I certainly don’t want to live under a lefty system, which history has shown always ends in failure.
Years ago I read a quote from Mussolini. I cannot remember his words verbatim, but when asked to define fascism he said “Everything inside the state, nothing outside the state. Everything for the state, nothing against the state.” Sounds like another system, doesn’t it? The placing of fascism and communism at opposite ends of the political spectrum is based only on the fact the Hitler and Stalin hated each other. However, their hatred was not based on opposing ideologies; they were like two bullies on the same schoolyard who are bound to fight eventually, not because they are so different, but because they are so similar. Fred2 nailed it – because history has declared Hitler to have been bad, our thinkers have labelled him right wing. The National Socialist party was anything but right wing. Hitler was a socialist who promised a government job for every worker. He must be kicking himself in his grave now – Europe has voluntarily adopted the socialism that he tried to militarily force on them so long ago, and they even have huge segments of their population who see the Jews (now Israel) as responsible for much of the evil in the world. I guess the pen really is mightier than the sword, even when it comes to deception.
SYF: “Although I believe in the sanctity of human life, for example, I cannot impose my will onto others.”
Given the definition of “sanctity” how can you possibly adopt this position?
Our culture, traditions and moral codes, much like our economic system, have evolved over millenia. Religion played a large role in that evolution and continues to protect and conserve traditions and moral codes. The religious have a legitimate place on “the right”.
As your link shows, the neo-nazi party Mahler currently belongs to is called the National DEMOCRATIC party.
That party is about as ‘democratic’ as the National Socialists were ‘socialist’.
I’m quite conservative, but to call Adolf and crew ‘socialist’ is laughable.
Aftr all the killings after WW@ you would think this nonesense would have disapeared. Nope humans being humans , especialy those of the Busybody crowd have selective memories. To them Stalin or Mao are hero’s not mass murders. Denying the Holocust is just another manifistation of the people who want us to be ants. I don’t care what their called , they all hate individualism with iniutive. Principles or morals.
They love chaos, pain, murder with mayham. They all drool for the Superman LeaDer to tell them how to live. Everyday is a new day, all history bunk to them In fact this group believes all that others have is really thiers by dint of being born. Lets not forget their relativism, that excuses all evil as just mirages.
JMO
No, Kate, that would be “right” as in “member of the NPD” right. I know you have a short attention span, but you could at least read the second paragraph of the article if you plan on commenting.
Trolex is just another obtuse “useful idiot”….literally another unwitting dupe.
Poq Gai, gweilo.
Posted by: JR at August 2, 2011 4:55 PM
The point was about imposing my will on others.
Try not to twist it.
Malice or a desperate search for personal meaning no matter the cost? I’ll let someone else hash that out as this is Shark Week and I don’t want to miss a moment of it but needless to say this person and all like him are scum. The Nazis were socialists- left on the political spectrum- and butted heads for power just like Stalin’s communists did.
How about everyone stop bleating about this left-right nonsense which bears no more relationship to reality than the friggin tooth fairy. I can’t believe the brain trust on the conservative side is unable to frame the discourse intelligently, and that includes many here. The basic dichotomy bears no relation to the putative seating arrangements of the French National Assembly post-revolution, when the remains od the old regime were seated on the right side.
Get this clear: the discourse is between collectivism and individualism – full stop. The nazis were colectivists, as were the communists, as are the socialists and the islamists – get over it, it is an indisputable hisorical fact, and forget the left-right garbage which beguiles the small mind. The future of western civilisation hangs on whether collectivism or individualism carries the day. Don’t fracking argue the nazis were leftists to try and score cheap points. If you so-called conservatives want to make you point, at least get the basics right. The only place for left-right-left is when the sergeant-major calls out the pace. What we are fighting against is collectivism – any and all collectivism.
jr & shawn
I’m happy to have social conservatives on my side. My point is that the Harper Conservatives threw them under the bus as a political calculation. Harper laid the road map for conservative victory in this decade. I’m suggesting Americans follow.
My opinion about American politics is anecdotal because I’ve spoken to a few Democrats here that say THIS issue keeps them from changing votes. I’m not saying they’re correct, I’m saying that’s what they think.
I too believe abortion is wrong, and can see why people would object to paying for abortions with tax $$. Like I said, I’m talking purely politics here.
I’m also not saying ‘forever’, but for the short term, as I believe PMSH is a social conservative himself and hopefully will pick-up the good fight down the road once the other issues are put to rest.
“Get this clear: the discourse is between collectivism and individualism – full stop.”
I wish that were true; unfortunately, the “individualist” side is constantly trying to impose collective rules on others on the basis of “morality”, while the “collectivist” side is constantly fighting for their individual rights to be spoiled children. If our political lines actually reflected the collectivist/individualist divide, that would be awesome, but the truth is that both sides support both collectivism and individualism, depending on which issue we’re discussing.
Plus, to say that the Nazis were collectivist is about as accurate as saying that the Republicans are collectivist. There’s some truth to it, sure, but it’s highly misleading.
Well done, Alex. You’ve hit it right on. This is the heart of the problem. The self-definition between left and right precludes a clear distinction between what really matters. The Repubs are no more individualist than the dems. Our Cons aren’t much different from the Libs. Each pick and choose based on self-interest.
See.. The political labels we use have about as much use as teats on a boar hog. And yes, the nazis were collectivists more than anything else – das volk, das reich came before the individual. You cannot be cognizant of the history of that era without coming away with the firm notion that nazism demanded that the individual be subsumed by the state. If that ain’t collectivism, it sure ain’t individualism
Memo to Canadian progressives: just be thankful you are dead wrong about there being thousands of “right wing extremists” wandering around the countryside, because if there were, you’d be in a lot of trouble. Fact is, the people you describe as “right wing extremists” are just conservatives who want smaller, more responsible government.
That in itself is of course enough of a threat to entitlements to consider raising a fuss, and that’s what is really behind lawfare and the infamous max-disrupt mentality of the Ottawa legal in-crowd.
Oh, I agree that they were collectivist, in the same sense that many conservatives exhibited collectivist tendencies immediately following 9/11. The whole with-us-or-against us thing, combined with the flag waving and branding as “unpatriotic” or even “treasonous” of anyone who didn’t immediately support unconditional and unlimited warfare. Of course, Nazi Germany was far, FAR worse in how far they were willing to go with those beliefs, but the mindset was nearly identical. I’d like to think that this difference is evidence that we’ve grown as a species … but I’m afraid it may just be due to the fact that George Bush wasn’t good dictator material.
well what’s my last name?
hears a hint—–look down
right and wright is a name given to tradesmen, engineers and living race car drivers.
No useless parasites get that name.
“…many conservatives exhibited collectivist tendencies immediately following 9/11.”
Yes, this is why I call you Trollex. Because all your posts are calculated to annoy, even when somebody agrees with your previous point.
Get thee back under thy bridge, troll.
I know I also use the term “leftist”, but Tanker is right, it is a war between collectivists and individualists.
@ set you free, the only problem is, the collectivists have slowly over the last few decades constantly ratcheted the moral bar lower to the point where nothing is absolute anymore and everything is acceptable. The “progressive” conservatives have compromised time after time and each time the bar dropped. This is what the Bolsheviks wanted, except they were in a hurry, and this is what the Frankfurt School wanted and used the slow brainwashing method.
“Yes, this is why I call you Trollex”
Naw, you call me that because you have no idea what the word “troll” means, and are unable to see past your own perverse biases. Plus you get pissy whenever anyone disagrees with you, and you’re immature enough to believe that giving me a silly nickname will annoy me.
If you need any more help understanding your motivations and desires, it’ll be $75 an hour.
Tanker, are you saying that people are not true to their motives or that each side bears qualities of both? It is not incorrect to say that the Nazis were socialist/collectivist because a case could be made for that.
set you free at August 2, 2011 8:25 PM
No twist intended, SYF. You expressed what appears to be a conflicted position. There are many moral issues which the right is in conflict with the left on and which bear consideration of imposing legal sanctions (ie. imposing ones morals) eg. late term abortion, drugs, prostitution, euthanasia, assisted suicide, etc. The religious right is at the forefront of debates on these issues.
BTW, I don’t belong to the religious right. I’m just right.
Sasquatch:
You may also have missed,
is.
Celina, that is is a classic!
Fascism and communism are indistinguishable in practice; the only difference is the targets. The fascists revile other races and ethnic or religious groups, the communists revile the businessmen and the well-off. The results in both cases are rivers of blood. They may each claim any motive, as Ayn Rand observed, but love of humanity. Their only goal is to seize power and give orders, while living the high life in government and spending other people’s resources that they have not earned. They are empty shells of people with no productive goals in life.
And yes, they are collectivists who resent productive individuals. They were unleashed by Immanuel Kant and G. W. F. Hegel.
Interestingly enough the pro-pali left are now the “holocaust deniers” since they took up with Islamic extremists. To accept Palestinian claims as legitimate and their nationalist organizations (Hamas)as legitimate one MUST be antisemitic and have dismissive revisionist ideas about the holocaust.
The radical left have become the bogymen they denounced as the “holocaust denier” extremist right just last decade. More proof that leftist activism is a mental disorder.
Where extremism meets political branding is a blurred, irrational, non-linear gray zone – a no mans land where political labels don’t apply.