83 Replies to “Occupied Territories Of The Little People”

  1. There is no evidence of fakery here.
    The first bulldozer looks bigger partly because it’s sitting on a piece of ground raised between one and two metres higher than the foreground. See the side of the little cliff it’s on? You need to pay attention to where the bottom of the machine stops and the (shadowed) cliff begins.
    With respect to the people, there is no evidence of fakery either. The business end of the second bulldozer, with the Israeli soldier in front, looks about 1.8m tall, and that’s completely consistent with the apparent size of the corresponding part of the first bulldozer.
    Of course, you to have to take notice that the people in the foreground throwing stones look less tall because they are bent over. They’re picking up rocks to throw in symbolic resistance to the destruction being wrought.
    Also, the pictured Palestinians are children, and children are smaller. Especially Palestinian ones in their ghetto-prisons who often suffer from poor nutrition, including diseases like rickets.
    All in all, this page is a reprehensible slur designed to assist with political cover for a racist colonisation based on ethnic cleansing. You are blaming the victims for the image while utterly ignoring the real crime it depicts.
    The Israeli collective punishment being depicted here is a war crime, no matter what size the bulldozer. And you are an apologist for it.

  5. R. Cheesman: Your comments are completely uninformed vis a vis the ‘photoshopping’.
    I’ve got more than 30 years in the photography business with the credentials to back it up. The upper photograph, without a doubt, is not ‘as taken’.
    Even a ‘super-telephoto lens’ would not exaggerate the background in relation to the foregroung objects.
    And in suggesting that this is an example of Israeli oppression, why would this machine have it’s blade down, unless it was doing something like road building or other construction? If this were an instance of them coming to destroy homes, doesn’t it make sense from a ‘propaganda’ perspective that they include the object of their threat ie: the home(s) about to be bulldozed?
    As for the ‘war crime’ bit, are you a chicken or an egg kind of person? You’re suggesting that the bulldozing of someone else’s home incites others to strap on the old ‘splody vest’, but I’d suggest it’s the reverse. If I know that, based on past experience, the home of my brothers, sisters and parents is almost certainly going to be demolished while I’m cavorting with all those virgins, I might be less inclined to strap on the vest to begin with.
    And how ‘innocent’ are those brothers, sisters and parents when they are complicit in the act: raising their children both at home and in school, to believe that the death of infidels (especially Jew infidels) is the height of honour? Or that they celebrate the success of the ‘martyr’ and turn them into heros? Or the acceptance of cash payments for offering up what should be the most cherished thing in their lives in order to destroy what is most cherished in others?
    I read your post and see only self-loathing for all that ‘the west’ represents and a lack of understanding that your peril is no less than that of me or anyone else. Do you really believe that your sympathy for Hamas would spare you should push come to shove?
    And lastly, how does retribution for a family offering a son or daughter to a terrorist act become a ‘collective punishment’? The fact that their home, out of tens of thousands surrounding it, makes it a pretty strategic and targeted act of punishing perpetrators, not innocent civilians.
    I guess the word apologist is pretty flexible, depending on where you stand.

  7. no guff,
    Can you tell if the pic is cropped?
    I ask because it appears that the guy on the right is about to toss a rock or start jogging to get down a road to HIS left (on the very right of the frame) before it is blocked by a tree the dozer is about to push.
    BTW – I would argue that the pic is real but entirely out of context.

  8. BTW – I would argue that the pic is real but entirely out of context.
    What does ‘real’ mean to you? Obviously it is photographically based (as opposed to an etch-a-sketch)but does it convey the reality of the situation, or the intention of the photographer?
    We’re living in a new reality, where photographs may no longer be introduced as evidence in a court of law without provenence. Yet we’re supposed to accept at face value, a photograph from people with a proven track record of falsification of the truth?
    Check out the photographs of the Hamas members of ‘parliment’ sitting in supposed darkness, with their little candles all lit. Meanwhile, all the curtains are drawn excluding the brilliance of obvious daylight.
    Poor widdle Pali’s can’t even afford an emergency generator for their own highest level of government. Or maybe they just didn’t have any fuel to run one, due to those heartless, genocidal Israelis.
    Neither you nor me have any clue what the ‘guy on the right’ is doing, but since the photograph came directly from the ‘International Middle East Media Center’, which in their own words, “combines Palestinian journalists’ deep understanding of the context, history, and the socio-political environment with International journalists’ skills in non-partisan reporting.” I guess we can assume, is absolutely ‘non-partisan’.

  9. Take a look at the second picture. Given that the bulldozers are 4m high, the Israeli soldier “of normal height” depicted in front of one looks at least 2m tall (six feet seven). Maybe they are giants! That one at least is no shorty.
    Don’t be confused by the cuboid object near the base of the bulldozer’s arm in the first picture. It’s a piece of debris, but because it’s similarly coloured and lit it could make a careless person think it was part of the bulldozer and that the machine extended down further than it does. The blade of the bulldozer is actually on the ground, pushing over the tree. Take a close look and you can see the steep bank the machine is at the top of. The line that slants down from the top left to the neck of the first child is the base of the bank, not the base of the bulldozer.
    Note that the children in the picture also look shorter because they appear to have no feet. That’s because they’re standing on ground slightly lower than the foreground.
    Several of you frothed and sneered but none of you could refute the fact that the bulldozer in the first picture is no larger than the one in the second picture. Both pictures are consistent with a bulldozer 4m high. So if they had photoshopped it they were wasting their time. Sorry to burst your hate-filled, prejudiced little bubbles.
    Any honest person who looks carefully will see that the first picture shows a bulldozer the same size as the ones in the second picture. Naturally I don’t expect either care or honesty on a chauvinist, ethnic supremacist site like this, but at least readers of the page now are less likely to be fooled.
    As for Guff’s defence of the crime of collective punishment, it was pitiable as well as despicable. The “self-loathing” slur is particularly stupid: I don’t have to loathe myself for Israel’s crimes because I am not the Israeli government. Identifying yourself with your regime and its allies (and their crimes) is your pathology, not mine.
    Thank you for reading my contributions and for your responses. My work here is done. Ka kite!

  10. no guff,
    Where do you think the pic came from?
    It did NOT come from ‘International Middle East Media Center’, they are just using it for their propaganda.
    My main point was, can you tell if it has been cropped.

  11. Richard Cheeseman, your observations are astute, but conclusions, uhhh, less so- The second pic is of D9s, the first is neither a D9 nor taken by the IMEMC, nor has anything to do with the story.
    no guff, the ‘provenence’ of the pic is not the IMEMC.
    I do have a ‘clue’ what the ‘guy on the right’ is doing – he is moving out – most likely to get ahead of the tractor (I see this reaction around heavy equipment every day – in fact he may be making eye-contact with the D10 operator to ensure he is seen – safety first), maybe to toss a rock if you are inclined to believe that is what people do around heavy equipment, whatever the story suggests.
    The guy in the middle is disinterested. The guy on the left may have seen a shiny beetle on the ground and is taking a closer look at it.

  12. OH, for crying out loud. Blow the top photo up and examine it. There is ample evidence of photoshopping in the pixelation around the dozer, and the absence of tree branches behind the exhaust stack.
    And that’s just for starters.

  14. One last thing: the specs say that the D9 dozer blade height is six feet four. That soldier walking beside one is in fact very tall.
    Kate calling that soldier a “human being of normal height” is the very kind of falsification using imagery she is supposedly against.

  15. Richard Cheeseman,
    The blades are ‘options’ (go figure) and there are several different types, each of of a different size.
    Soldier is in the foreground and in perspective would be larger.
    Without knowing what the cropping is and not seeing the true horizon I will still suggest that the photographer’s viewpoint was somewhat lower than the normal person’s eye and aiming somewhat upward.

  16. who cares about the pic? a cut and paste. A family was bulldozed with military operations on their street, and a lawsuit was conducted in the US, liability wasn’t established regarding the manufacturer of the machine, but a family died.
    They weren’t Jews, but the children were too young to vote.
    It’s -3 here, and no roadblocks and the power is on.

  18. cheesehead, you are a moron.
    Do a quick scale of the rock-throwers’ heights to the height of the drive shaft at the top of the track, then do the same for the Israeli soldier in the other pic. The actual height appears to be 6ft in the bottom pic, and at least double that in the above, and this, DESPITE the fact that the D9 is in the background.
    Unless of course, the rock throwers are all card-carrying members of the Lollypop Guild, then you could be right.
    mhb23re

  21. Just how in the world did the IDF manage to SNEAK a Caterpillar up on anyone? They are loud beyond loud, and when they rumble arround, they shake everything.
    The people in the photo are not children. look at the body mass. they are adults.
    Also, look carefully at the rubble surrounding the Caterpillar. It is completely out of context with the surroundings.
    The photoshop was good, but its not that good.

  22. Last thought, if indeed those folks really were killed by armored bulldozers, they should at the very least receive Darwin awards for their efforts.

  23. …my what big dozers you have grandma…
    Well spoken in reverse psychology – the wolf in this case is little RED riding hood.

  24. Even taking into account that the dozer is on a hilly patch, it still appears to be the size of a 3-storey house. Whatsmore, the Palestinians in the photo are closer to the camera. In spite of this, however, they still appear to be small by comparison. Had we had images of the driver getting out, we would get the truth: he being 15 feet tall. Either that or the Palestinians in the photo are the size of gnomes and lawn jockeys. Take your pick.
    The back of the dozer gives a better view and overall a better context to its actual size:
    http://www.vegatransports.com.au/starwars/OTC/sandcrawler_arrives.jpg

  28. Reminds me of the kids show my kids used to watch. “Mighty Machines”
    The theme song was “Mighty Machines. Big and Mighty Machines” which unfortunately we heard as “Mighty Machines, Friggin’ Mighty Machines.”
    Not accurate but more fun to sing. At least for the kids…and the 12 year old boy in me.
    MT

  29. Looks to me that the offending seb site http://www.imemc.org/article/51074 got the caption wrong. This dozer looks very much like a Caterpiller D11 of some version. (See for example http://www.mlsinc.com/v3/heavyequipment/sale/caterpillar/d11/) The D11s are larger than the D9s. Maybe they got it wrong on purpose – I don’t know.
    Pretty dumb suing the maker of the dozer for this though. I work in the traffic safety field and it bugs me to read that so and so was killed by a white van etc., etc. It should read that so and so was killed by the *driver* of a white van etc., etc. The *van* (and the dozer) do nothing without a driver.
    (p.s. sometimes motor vehicle crashes are not the driver’s fault, but they are never the vehicle’s fault.)

  30. Would, that the photographer responsible for the first picture take a few snaps next time I go fishing.
    It would make my fish stories so much more believable.

  31. Al, That’s what I thought. But if you examine photos of D11s, the one in Kate’s pic looks nothing like them:
    http://www.machinerytrader.com/listings/detail.aspx?OHID=6213521&guid=A3D2E9C9515B426C822B40C66152DFD7
    http://www.machinerytrader.com/listings/detail.aspx?OHID=6018618&guid=A3D2E9C9515B426C822B40C66152DFD7
    It DOES look like a D9:
    http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/vehicles/engineer_vehicles/bulldozers/D9_D10.html
    Only the scale is wrong.

  32. The other strange thing is the lack of exhaust, this is not clean diesel technology we are talking here, just a straight stack. Notice that the flap is straight up on the stack but nothing is coming out! As they found with the photoshopping of bomb damage – smoke is very hard to fake so they didn’t even try here. This D9 appears big enough to have a nuclear power plant though so maybe they are only venting hot air, much like Cam and Cheeseman.
    It is hard to imagine that they would actually believe this but I guess they not only drank the Kool-Aid but asked for more. I guess there is one born every minute, nice to see that Mr Barnum was right (Actually Mr Hannum is supposed to have said it).

  33. Cheeseman – your pathetic hand-wringing attempt to assert that the top photograph in any way represents reality is just embarassing.
    This statement “Any honest person who looks carefully will see that the first picture shows a bulldozer the same size as the ones in the second picture.” demonstrates beyond all doubt that you are either an unabashed liar or incredibly stupid. For the sake of argument, let us assume that both of these labels fit.
    In fact, NO honest person looking at those 2 photos would assume that the bulldozer in the top photo is the same size as the other one pictured. Even if we assume for the sake of argument that the photo was *not* doctored, it is nonetheless misleading in the extreme. Much like Hamas’s magical midnight at noon the photographer in question made a conscious decision to be complicit in a lie.
    “Naturally I don’t expect either care or honesty on a chauvinist, ethnic supremacist site like this, but at least readers of the page now are less likely to be fooled.”
    Projection perhaps? You certainly offer neither ‘care’ nor honesty in your one-sided whining rants. But take heart, I sincerely doubt readers of this page will be ‘fooled’ by your crocodile tears.

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