But Democrat Patrick Leahy and Republican Arlen Specter clammed up about what they were told by Justice Department officials on Thursday during a meeting that lasted an hour and 40 minutes. (G&M)
Jordan’s version (video at link);
But Democrat Patrick Leahy and Republican Arlen Specter clammed up about what they were told by Justice Department officials on Thursday during a meeting that lasted an hour and 40 minutes. (G&M)
Jordan’s version (video at link);
I never did buy the torture story. Even Arar’s version would be no more than school punishment in my day.
I’m very suspicious of what Arar was up to also, but the US may be sticking to its story because it would be probably far more damaging to admit it made a mistake than to keep on insisting Arar is a terrorist. We’ll know the truth in 50 years once the records pertaining to this incident become declassified (assuming that the “war on terror” has ended by this time).
What is totally mystifying is why Stockwell Day would take on the US over this issue. Who the US decides to let into the country is totally up to them. If Stockwell Day wanted to take on the US about something, he could protest the US attempt to extradite Mark Emery for engaging in an activity that is totally legal in Canada.
Paying Arar $10 million was totally stupid and I can’t believe PHMS made a public apology for something he had no part of. Watching how Arar spends this money is now likely to cost the government millions more in CSIS surveillance expenses over the next few years. I’m curious how Arar managed to finance $1 million in legal expenses.
We happen to be at war with radical islam and in every war there are innocent casualties. Whether Arar fits into this category is simply unknown at this time. I’d be curious how many takers there would be if someone would offer people $10 million for a year-long torture vacation in a Syrian jail (following which one came out of looking as good as Arar). I expect there would be a stampede of applicants.
Dis ease da proof, eat whas all ah spoof!
loki, For answers to the first of your questions read the post re; Impeachment lawyer trying to get rid of President Bush is Arar’s lawyer. She will not be hauled over the coals because the Demos are running the congress and senate now – I think that Stockwell Day is asking the questions so he can have some answers. Remember, it was the Liberanos who got Canada into this – do you think Stockwell will get any answers from the Lie brals? This thing is beginning to unravel…whatever the answers…inquiring Canadian taxpayers want to know. Old big mouth Leahy looked pretty sheepish…IMO something stinks – why would Jordon lie?
We should trust the old windbag Democrats as much as we trust our windbag Liberals.
We paid out a King’s Ransom and humbled the Country with an apology and still do not have all the answers. There are many skeptics in this affair.
Full Leahy/Specter press conference video here:
http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/monitor/2007/02/arar-rendition-press-conference-us.php
These guys – Leahy, in particular – look like they’d seen a ghost after emerging from their top-secret briefing on Arar. The only issue they raised was why Arar was sent to Syria instead of Canada – as if to say, the standard of reasonable suspicion was certainly met, but we’re not sure sending him to Syria was the correct move.
Jema54, here’s the post on Arar’s Impeach-Bush counsel:
http://flaggman.wordpress.com/2007/02/03/maher-arars-lawyer-is-leader-of-bush-impeachment-movement/
How ironic, I was booted off a CTV web forum because i kept asserting that Arar was send to Jordan and not Syria, and i showed the links to CAIR and the NDP which had Arar’s wife run for them in Ottawa which she knew her Husband was Suing Canada for $400’000’000.00 and now settled for 11.5 million .
CAIR has members in prison for their ties to Hamas and Hezbollah along with fund raising for terrorist groups via Islamic charities that CAIR funneled donation to, Arar was a draft-dodger from Syria and once he got his passport in 1997 he went globe trotting while renting a home near the Boston Airport where some of the hijackers took their flights from.
Arar had a address in canada as well and he sold his house and fled to the middle east with his wife and kids, his Palestinian wife had relatives in Tunisia and that’s where they stayed , evidence shows that when Tunisia moved in on Arar to question him he boarded a flight to the USA by himself and left his wife and kids there.
He deplaned at JFK as a Syrian sunni muslim male with a Canadian passport which terrorist love to use and the Khadr’s love to lose and apply for another one , Arar was coached by CAIR to not help Canada stop or expose terror cells that may plot to bomb and kill canadian civilians , so the RCMP gave up on asking for his help .
Arar never reported that he left canada so the RCMP assumed Arar was still in Ottawa and not at JFK airport , he was refused entry to the USA and Tunisia didn’t want him back for fear he wouldn’t leave their Country, Jordan was the only Country that agreed to take him in and he was to meet his family there to fly back to canada directly.
All this evidence is on the Inquiry website and it includes Arar trying to get a gun permit just after the Montreal massacre , he was approved in 1992 but didn’t renew it in 1997 when he was applying for Citizenship and married his wife as well that year .
CAIR was the same Islamic Org that blamed the USA for 9/11 because it had a weak Security and immigration system that let single sunni muslim males into America as the 19 hijackers were , so I think canada should now Sue CAIR for creating Arar’s plight that lead to his alleged torture in Syria where he was a draft-dodger which is a crime in his homeland.
CAIR and Sheema Khan tried to silence David Frumm and another canadian that told the truth about CAIR’s ties to Hamas and the Law-Suit for their links to 9/11 by coaching Muslims to not turn in fellow radical Muslims by the Police.
CAIR is hosting a dinner in Ottawa to celebrate the Arar’s victory and fund raise for a Scholarship to bring Justice and Human rights to canadians , except CAIR supported Sharia-law in canada and Arar’s wife is a orthodox Muslims that is anti-gay marriage and anti-abortion.
So how does CAIR define Justice and Human rights if Sharia-Law Whahabism allows for killing gays and Muslims that leave islam for other faiths.
We were scammed folks and the NDP and CAIR will no doubt get some of Arar’s millions to further their anti-USA crusade and support the Hezbollah in Lebanon as Peggy Nash did last year .
Read the whole transcripts as i did and see how CAIR used Sheema Khan to fabricate Islamophobia claims to Justice O’connor and misled the inquiry about 19 illegals with bogus ID and passports that were legally deported from canada, the 19 were sunni muslim males from Pakistan that lied to get into canada and even had Tarek Fatah defending them as victims of racial-profiling that lead to their rounding up and deporting.
even if it was a calculated move by Arar, and I have never believed that, it points to the smarts in counting on all the intrigue and mistrust at high levels. he took a gamble and won, knowing jordanians might play along and conceal what they did and knew, knowing syria has a reputation for torture and knowing the white house has lied and lied and lied and lied for most of the last century so even if and when they tell the truth, large swaths dont believe what they say.
the big players have only themselves to blame for creating the conditions for the Arar case to unfold this way.
more power to him, if it was staged he knew exactly what to do to get his 10 mill.
There are certainly some interesting theories floating around.
Brilliant.
A Canadian citizen is sent to Syria by Americans on the basis of faulty intelligence. How do his fellow Canadians react?
Well, apparently being a Canadian has no meaning anymore. We dont care how our citizens are treated. However, if Bush’s boys deemed it fit to send him, then they must have been right. Our allegiance lies to the star spangled banner, after all, and not to Canada. I daresay that citizens of other nations would have responded with nothing short of indignation and solidarity with a fellow citizen, but for some people on this board, the Bush administration can do no wrong. Well done.
bollockslogic
1. The U.S. has claimed (and still claims) that Arar has connections to Islamic terrorism.
2. Canada has rejected these claims, declared Arar’s innocence, and paid Arar (the obscene* sum of) $11,500,000.00.
3. It follows that the U.S. is to blame for the Arar settlement.
* By virtue of the SCC trilogy the most that a Canadian who suffers a catastrophic injury (e.g quadraplegia) can recover for non pecuinary General Damages (i.e. pain and suffering) is $300,000.00- yes, three hundred thousand.
That said, I don’t believe for a minute that Arar was sent to Jordan and then chose voluntarily to go to Syria where he was tortured as a deserter. If that were the case these facts would have come out by now and the government wouldn’t have paid him a penny.
pecuniary damnit
What short and inconvenient memories liberals have. Arar was sent during the LIBERAL YEARS, not Harpers. Knowing the liberal leanings of our courts, Harper knew that if this case went to court the judges would award him his full amount. The liberals and terrorist supporters would have demanded it. Arar scammed the cdn government big time. He was paid to get it out of the way. If the libs were still in office he would have got the extra 380 million, so again Harper has saved the cdn taxpayer megatons of money, just like he did with the sld. One thing Harper should hammer on is that with a majority, they did nothing.
Dion blaming Harper for delaying kyoto, the media blaming him for going to Texas to get a deal before he was sworn in, tells me if this is true he is one smart man and should be given an overwhelming majority. Notice the US has filed new murder charges against that paragon of virtue, Khadar. Wonder if Khadar/arar, sounding alike had anything to do with the faulty intel and the sudden charges being filed. Does anyone know if the person talking to the US was french or english, and talked english like dion causing the mixup.
New poll results just announced-81% of cdns agree with bilingualism. Who did they poll, dion and iggy. If that is true why is english outlawed in Quebec. Another reason for Alberta to leave, no french.
In comparison with what awards other victims receive for permanent injuries many times more serious than what this man claims to have suffered this settlement can’t be justified.
It should have gone to trial. Even allowing for the hyperinflating effect of political correctness he wouldn’t have gotten 2 million.
The settlement is unfathomable.
well mr gain, if you cared to read the post and not inject your spin, the logic of the situation is if *IF* Arar is the bad guy after all and is laughing all the way to the bank, more power to him because it means he played the power boys as the patsy in all this; a calculated move depending on occupants of all the capitals to follow their true and proven nature, ie, lie lie lie and cover up and lie some more and cover up some more.
it means the truth even if it does emerge is so polluted by the intrigue the hapless ‘victim’ be it Arar or cdn taxpayers footing the bill or any other individual REAL victim has nothing left but go for a cash settlement.
the imbalance in this settlement compared to accident vicxtims is also the result of the boys in power covering their asses; lobbyists call for limits on court ordered settlements to protect the interests of their business owning client and succeed.
however, how mant times does a cdn citizen get trussed up and dispatched to a syrian prison??
it just goes on and on.
bottom line is if *IF* Arar planned it this way he got luck big time and go for him; I tend towards the less sinsiter thing and believe that the american authorites are paranoid and chose to and continue to believe the misinformation they got from the arse c m pee. why? it suits their purposes thats why.
who knows. gubbamint aint gonna fess up and MSM is only interested in the sensationalism.
Oh gosh, so now kooks are saying Arar was sent to Jordan? That’s even more twisted for the Americans to do, since he wasn’t a citizen of there.
Leahy is almost a hero for the way he confronted Gonzalez. Compared to the limpwristed Republicans it floored me how forceful he was with a spineless torture junkie like the Attorney General.
The Americans messed up big time, and are obviously hiding something they shouldn’t be still. They are supposed to be cooperating with Canada on security, and if they can’t tell us why they are watching Arar, that means they don’t trust us. More likely than that theory, is that they are just making crap up, to smear Arar so he won’t win the lawsuit against the Americans, like he rightfully did in Canada against the government here.
“A Canadian citizen is sent to Syria by Americans on the basis of faulty intelligence. How do his fellow Canadians react?”
You mean a hyphenated Syrian-‘Canadian of convenience’ who just got away with bilking unhyphenated Canadians for $11.5 million? Taxpaying Canadian citizens who didn’t send him anywhere? The same Arar who is in bed with the proven terrorist front organisation, CAIR?
This Arar who knew the cornerstone emotional ploy of his case was to claim that he was tortured, but provided absolutely no evidence, or corroboration?
Unhyphenated Canadians have every right to question this case and not accept the kid glove, overly apologetic judicial process, or the outcome.
This Canadian will wait and see.
Saskboy, where to begin? First of all, the speculation about Jordan is that he chose to fly there because it is the only way to get to Syria from the USA. Second, Leahy looked like a demagogue, not a hero – and after his top-secret briefing the other day, he came out looking a lot less sure of himself. Third, he did not win any law suit up here! He never wanted a law suit here, he wanted an inquiry, because at an inquiry he would never be subjected to cross-examination and would not have to testify under oath.
Enough lies from the likes of Saskboy…let’s just get the truth, that’s all that matters.
re: Jordans’ version, video link
I’ve been watching this over a day now….and the msm’s silence is deafening.
Terry Gain: You must remember the Left of the spectrum in this Land had a love-in with Arar almost from the beginning.
Do you know how much “comp” David Milgard received for wrongful conviction and the best part of his life in prison?
We have no way of knowing what constitutes torture in any one person’s mind. Most think of torture as physical pain, that is the grabber for most and what most think happens in ME countries where beheading a person or threatening to, is a common sub-human act.
If ever a case cried out for answers from many corners it’s the Arar case.
“You mean a hyphenated Syrian-‘Canadian of convenience’ who just got away with bilking unhyphenated Canadians for $11.5 million? ”
What is so wrong with being a hyphenated Canadian if you pay your taxes? Arar lived in Canada and paid his taxes. He was as much a citizen as anyone else. Sure he had Syrian citizenship, but any hyphenated Canadian living in Canada will tell you that the benefits of dual citizenship are such that they dont in any way infringe upon his allegiance to either nation. As a Syrian citizen he is entitled to retain property (owned or as inheritance – a major issue for many immigrants who arent keen on losing valuable property – property that, incidentally, is factored into immigration applications as an indicator of capital).
He also gets to go to Syria without having to go running around bureaucratic channels to get a visa – and visas arent free. COnsidering that he has ties to the nation and is likely to go there to visit family if nothing else, the savings from not having to purchase a visa every single time, not to mention the hassle of dealing with bureaucratic apparatus, makes it easier for him to travel. Theres really nothing wrong with it. Its a matter of pragmatism.
How does he qualify for a Canadian of convenience when he a)lives in Canada, b)works in Canada, and c)Pays taxes in Canada. I take it, as far as you re concerned, immigrants should abandon their former homes and never once visit it again?
Of course the real Canadians of convenience are the ones who sit in Canada (by the accidental virtue of being born here), denigrate it, and refuse to stand up for its citizens. Indeed there are some who actively support other nations, to the extent that htey would rather give the other nation the benefit of doubt than a fellow citizen. Far be it from me to suggest it might have anything to do with his ethnicity.
“What is so wrong with being a hyphenated Canadian if you pay your taxes?”
Nothing, if comliant taxpaying is the only criterion of good citizenship. It wasn’t his tax status that sent his sorry ass to Syria. It was his hubris and stupidity as a guy with a terrorist suspect RCMP file, landing on US soil.
You’ve got to wonder what the Syrians had on him too. After all, he is a native son and citizen. They had choices in how they received him.
Looks like his story is unraveling. You’d be wise to shut up, jeremiah, until all of the facts fall where they may.
Whoa penny,
I think its clear that the government knows more than it can say – confidential information cant be revealed.
In light of this I find it hard to believe that any sane government would willingly set a precedent of this magnitude by handing over a million dollar settlement to a man who is a terrorist.
I wouldnt hold my breath for all the facts to reveal themselves. I doubt investigative bloggers have access to confidential information. THis game of amateurish connect the dots is bereft of important information and any facts that do fall will be incomplete at best. Drawing conclusions from this kind of ambivalent publically available information is wonderful pastime but has no merit. You may, of course, continue to maintain your silence.
“Of course the real Canadians of convenience are the ones who sit in Canada (by the accidental virtue of being born here),”
Are you describing yourself, socialist nanny boy? The rest of us work for a living, some, like myself are business owners and contribute taxes that have built this country.
“…denigrate it, and refuse to stand up for its citizens”
I’ll stand up for real citizens. Did you standup for Sampson, a born Canadian, who was imprisoned and tortured by the Saudi’s?
As far as “denigrating,” it’s your brain-dead socialist ilk that is destroying this country.
“I’ll stand up for real citizens. Did you standup for Sampson, a born Canadian, who was imprisoned and tortured by the Saudi’s?”
Exactly, Irwin daisy. Why didn’t we go after Syria about this? Where were the huge protests and demonstrations and burning their leaders in effigy? Same with Iran and the Kezemi woman? Where the hell were all of the protestors for that poor soul who was tortured, raped and killed? It’s always easier to yell and scream at the U.S. isn’t it?
Irwin
“I’ll stand up for real citizens. Did you standup for Sampson, a born Canadian, who was imprisoned and tortured by the Saudi’s?”
Yes Daisy, I did stand up for Samson. And you know why? Because he is a CANADIAN.
William Sampson was born in GLASGOW, in the UNITED KINGDOM. He also happens to be a DUAL CITIZEN, holding BRITISH citizenship alongwith Canadian citizenship.
Like I asked earlier, Arar’s ethnicity wouldnt happen to be his greatest fault, would it?
“It’s always easier to yell and scream at the U.S. isn’t it?”
If you missed the outrage that was directed at the Iranian government in particular, and there were protest movements on the streets, then perhaps you werent paying attention. There most certainly was public outrage over the Kazemi case. However, the protestors werent prone to burining in effigy.
Now, lets take adifferent approach. Suppose an American were deported from Canada to Syria. How exactly do you think the Americans would have reacted? Do you think they would have taken the “guilty until proven innocent” approach?
No.
They would have given us hell. If there is one difference between America and Canada, it is that those who hate America (as some of the people call Democrats) would stand up as much for every single American citizen as the pro-USA crew. That cannot be said of Canada, where Canadians are willing to believe a foreign government over the word of one of their own citizens. I think people have to be reminded time and again that as CANADIANS, our allegiance lies to CANADA and CANADIANS, and not to the star spangled banner.
“Like I asked earlier, Arar’s ethnicity wouldnt happen to be his greatest fault, would it?”
Actually, no. However, the fact that there is still an open dossier on his ties to terrorism, the fact that he provided no evidence or corroboration for his claims, and his coziness with the terrorist front organisation, CAIR, would give any intelligent person pause for thought.
Yes, and in spite of this, a Conservative government would see it fit to set perhaps the most astonishing precedent ever – handing over 11 million dollars to a man with an open on his ties to terrorism, blah blah blah.
Either you give yourself too much credit or you give the government too little. Open dossiers or not, confidential information is not going to reveal itself to you in the near future, and the government, the only one with access to this confidential information, has seen it fit to compensate him. There might just be some logic behind it.
But by all means, continue to accept what every blogger says. Manipulating publicly available information does not facilitate finding the truth. This thread serves very little purpose, other than to question Arar, and that, frankly, is sad, because I cant think of any other nation whose citizens would rather support a foreign government over their own citizens.
What would the Americans have done if the roles were reversed?
“I cant think of any other nation whose citizens would rather support a foreign government over their own citizens.”
Whose own citizen?
Culturally, I have more in common with U.S. liberty, freedom and democracy than Islamic terrorism, imperialism and supremacy. Until the so-called ‘vast majority of moderate Muslims’ living here are willing to publicly declare their support for western ideals and democracy, above sharia, and publicly rise up against terrorism, I will remain unapologetically suspicious and guarded.
Wow, Daisy, wow.
Not a single answer from you. You ve picked one statement and taken it on by declaring your own predisposition towards stereotyping.
Tell me, Daisy, do you support Sampson now that you know that he was born in the UK and holds dual citizenship? Or has your enthusiasm evaporated?
Tell me, Daisy, is Arar a terrorist? What proof do you have? Do you know something the government doesnt? Or are you simply much smarter than the government you elected into office (in which case why did you elect them)?
Tell me, Daisy, why did the government compensate Arar? Is it because they know something you dont (ie confidential material)? Or is it because they are prone to setting error ridden precedents? Do you honestly believe that publically available information trumps the confidential information that is being witheld by the government?
Tell me, Daisy, do you believe that all muslims are terrorists?
Tell me, Daisy, how the Americans would have reacted if Canada sent a dual US-Syrian citizen to Syria? How would you have reacted?
Tell me, Daisy, will you stand up for Canadian citizens or for foreign governments.
Drop the “more in common with US” pretense. We both know that the US treats its own muslims with far more suspect than you would, and that that respect stems from the three ideals you quote – liberty, freedom, and democracy. If you actually believed in those, then you would behave like the Americans, who have managed to avoid stereotyping all muslims as terrorists, instead of dismissing the “vast majoirity of moderate muslims” as non existent because you cant see them.
I am a Canadian. I am a Canadian nationalist. I am proud of Canada. I am proud of being Canadian. I am proud of Canada for what it is, not for what it has in common with the US. I do not believe that Canada has to prove itself to anything or anyone. I do believe that we are priviliged to be Canadian. I am proud of Canada’s history. I am proud of Canada’s immigrants. There is much that we take for granted here. Chief amongst them is a quality of life that other nations can only dream of.
I am a Canadian. I may not speak for all Canadians (especially those on this board), but I do believe I speak for the majoriy of Canadians when I say that, if you arent willing to stand up for Canada and Canadians, get the hell out of my country.
Muslims admitedly have a nation and allegiance that supercedes all other nations, you might have heard of it, it’s called the Ummah. Outside of Islamic states, the Ummah is in fact a foreign government with it’s own laws and values.
As I said before, until the so-called ‘vast majority of moderate’ Muslims publicly stand-up for their adopted country and it’s laws, over the Ummah and sharia – I will remain steadfastly suspicious.
Even more suspicious given their religious privilege and warfare tactic called taqiyya.
“if you arent willing to stand up for Canada and Canadians, get the hell out of my country.”
I couldn’t have said it better.
Thats a pretty meek attempt at a recovery, Daisy. In fact, I wouldnt even call it a recovery.
Muslims, such as Arar, have taken a pledge of Allegiance to Canada. They are Canadians. To disqualify his Canadian citizenship on the basis of a theological issues such as the Ummah, which in many senses boils down to an issue regarding loyalty to religion over loyalty to state, is a bit simplistic and very misguided. There are many Christian Canadians who could be disqualified on the same basis – that their loyalty to their religion is greater than their loyalty to Canada. Think carefully before you make blanket statements of this sort.
But the simple fact is that there are Canadians who happen to be muslim. Who live by Canada’s laws. Who are subject to Canada’s laws. Who accept Canada’s laws. There are muslims who serve in the Canadian Forces. This is not a question of either Canada or Islam. There is such a thing as a Canadian Muslim.
Muslims live in many non-Muslim states. Take the US for example. You, sitting in Canada, are willing to deny Muslims rights available to them as Canadian citizens. The US has refused to do that despite the fact that it, and not you or your household, was the victim of that despicable act. The US recognized that its muslims were and are good citizens.
In any case, where are the answers to my questions.
Apart from the rather bizzare declaration that Muslims are not to be treated as equal citizens.
And let me add, if a Canadian is ever in trouble, I expect all Canadians to stand up for him REGARDLESS of his Race or Religion. If a Canadian shows up asking for help, I expect Canadians to assist him, not ask him what his religion is. I shudder to think that people like you, on hearing about the death of a Canadian are less upset if the Canadian happens to be Muslim.
Maher Arar is a Canadian. He has the rights of a Canadian. And I for one, believe our government has done the right thing, regardless of all the publically available information Kate tries to spin to paint him out as a terrorist.
People here would rather support the US government over a Canadian citizen. Perhaps it is time that they make that support legal. After all, the US isnt that far away. Why dont you lead them, Daisy? Canada is for Canadians, not American nationalists who hold Canadian passports and reside in Canada.
Oh gawd, dipshit jeremiah and his one trick pony, US bad, Canaduh good.
You move idiot, many people here don’t want your moonbat type in Canada anyways.
Oh gawd, dipshit multirec and his one trick pony,Canaduh bad, US good.
You move idiot, many people here dont want your traitorous type in Canada anyways.
“You move idiot, many people here dont want your traitorous type in Canada anyways.”
Off ya go limey, don’t let the door hit ya on the way out.
BTW, hows that islam multi culti feel good mush working out in your home pussified country, England?
“BTW, hows that islam multi culti feel good mush working out in your home pussified country, England?”
Why dont you ask the Governor General, who can forward your question to the Queen. You know, that lady on all your coins.
“Why dont you ask the Governor General, who can forward your question to the Queen. You know, that lady on all your coins.”
Whaaa…Who cares.
I don’t need the queen to tell me how your ex-home country is in tatters when it comes to islam.
Reconstruction in prisons so the bowl doesn’t face mecca, a muslim bobby who won’t shake the chief’s hand, undercover videos of muslims saying some pretty vile things in the mosque, trying to kidnap a british soldier so they can behead him on the internet, etc, etc.
So tell me mate, aside from your goofy comment about the queen, hows your pussified England doing with it’s muslim integration?
In case you havent noticed, I am a Canadian citizen. Yes, I am an immigrant. Like ALL of your ancestors.
The state of Islam in England is for the English people to deal with. I am more concerned with pseudo-Canadians such as yourself who are keen to undo Canada’s independence. English soldiers fought to keep Canada from becoming the 51st state. Now jokers such as yourself are out to undo it. And I will not stand for it. I am a Canadian. You apparently are an American by any other name…
“English soldiers fought to keep Canada from becoming the 51st state. Now jokers such as yourself are out to undo it. And I will not stand for it. I am a Canadian. You apparently are an American by any other name…”
I personally don’t give a shite what you won’t stand for, who the hell are you twit, captain canaduh?
Bawk,bawk,bawk…
I’m canadian just as much as you ahole, and I’m not going anywhere. I choose to fight for my canada, not your canaduh. People like you do as much damage to this country as do islamic extremists.
I’m soo tired of moonbats like you, and if you think that I’m being rude well guess what..I am. You can’t deal with idiots like you any other way. That’s my new motto, I meet moonbats and I’ll tell them right to their face, “don’t be an idiot”.
Grow up.
You first dimwit.
Jeremiah,
thanks for your ridiculous comments once again. There is such an abundance. Here’s one:
“Muslims live in many non-Muslim states. Take the US for example.”
Ok. Lets take Dearborn for example – front page of the NY Times on the weekend, commenting on a growing concern over sectarian violence (you know the usual, Shia vs. Sunni), compared the area to Baghdad.
Or this:
“There are many Christian Canadians who could be disqualified on the same basis – that their loyalty to their religion is greater than their loyalty to Canada. Think carefully before you make blanket statements of this sort.”
Christianity is not an imperialist political ideology. “Give unto Caesar…” Was the basis for our modern idea of separation between Church and state. Idiot. Christianity does not have a savage 7th century set of laws that it is diligently striving to foist on the world. Double Idiot.
“Apart from the rather bizzare declaration that Muslims are not to be treated as equal citizens.”
Where exactly did I say that? Lying again huh?
“Canada is for Canadians, not American nationalists who hold Canadian passports and reside in Canada.”
And,
“get the hell out of my country.”
The very thing you’re accusing me of, is obviously all right for you to use against me, right? Hypocrite and Liar.
And a horribly obtuse debater.
I have also often posted on western Muslims who are fighting the good war against Islamists and for reform. Ie: Hirsi Ali, etc. However, I won’t bother reiterating what I said here originally, regarding general Muslim transnational allegiance, due to their imperialist 7th century political ideology masquerading as religion.
Nah, you’ve proven yourself to be far too mentally challenged to understand.
“In case you havent noticed, I am a Canadian citizen. Yes, I am an immigrant. Like ALL of your ancestors.”
Didn’t know that you’re a hyphenated Canadian. Must be why you’re feeling a little threatened?
I and many others are so sick of you recent arrivals, especially pompous limey pricks, telling us what a Canadian is. Our ancestors built this country and paid for it. We hold the mortgage. Get used to it, newbie.
Daisy,
“Ok. Lets take Dearborn for example – front page of the NY Times on the weekend, commenting on a growing concern over sectarian violence (you know the usual, Shia vs. Sunni), compared the area to Baghdad.”
Yes. Lets take Dearborn for example. How representative is it of the entire muslim population of the US? Taking one case study and applying it to an entire segment of society is absurd. Perhaps we should be wary of Southern Baptists because Pat Robertson is calling for the execution of the leaders of other nations. And then there was Louis Riel.
“Christianity is not an imperialist political ideology. “Give unto Caesar…” Was the basis for our modern idea of separation between Church and state. Idiot.”
Someone needs to take history lessons apparently. Bringing civilization and salvation to the backward peoples is one often ignored in favor of an economic argument, but it is a crucial part of colonialism all the same. I would recommend Dalrymple’s “The Last Mughal” if you are actually interested in opening your eyes to the manner in which Christian leaders propagated the spread of colonialism.
Also, your willingness to stand up for a UK born dual citizen but your immediate hostility to a Syrian born one make it absolutely clear that you arent interested in treating Muslim citizens as equals. Are you guarded and suspicious towards all Canadian citizens, or only Muslim ones? Yeah, I thought so.
Given your refusal to treat all Canadians as equal (ie Sampson > Arar), I see no reason why not to tell you to leave the country. Given your loyalty to the US government over a citizen of Canada, I think you are well suited for the US. Not for Canada anyway. Canada is, after all, for those who believe that all Canadians are equal, regardless of color or religion, a test you have failed miserably.
As for your “facts”, any sane person would wonder how you can question anybody elses, after having declared that William Sampson is a Canadian born Canadian citizen. Your credibility is at an all time low. I know you wanted Sampson to be Canadian born, but sadly that is not the case. I would recommend going over all your facts, and distinguishing between what you want things to be, and what they really are.
“Our ancestors built this country and paid for it.”
Ah, the pride of being born in Canada. And one day, I will be the ancestor of a Canadian. My Canadianness is as questionable as your ancestor’s Canadian-ness, no less and no more. If I am not a real Canadian, then neither is your ancestor.
“I and many others are so sick of you recent arrivals, especially pompous limey pricks, telling us what a Canadian is.”
Define recent. And I am sick of you pathetic jokes, who think you know what a Canadian is by virtue of being born here. Your birth in Canada was not by choice. It was accidental. My presence in Canada is by choice. A choice I have made because of my apparently deeper understanding of what being a Canadian means, a question you ve never dealt with.
“Idiot. Double Idiot.”
Pure class.
“I and many others are so sick of you recent arrivals, especially pompous limey pricks, telling us what a Canadian is. Our ancestors built this country and paid for it. We hold the mortgage. Get used to it, newbie.”
Limey or not, the joke is on you for selecting a limey queen as your head of state. I guess Daisy’s cant be pricks, so you re just going to have to settle for pansy.
For someone who thinks Glasgow is in Canada, I think you would do well to avoid bashing my immigration status, since, with your geography skills, I m probably a Canadian born Canadian too. That apart, the simple truth is that this country is built on immigration. Some immigrated earlier than others, but all are equal once they become Canadian citizens.
Irwin, don’t bother with the fool, he doesn’t know spit. Look how quick he ran away when I confronted him with England’s islamic problem.
He’s a Canadian now so England is not his problem.
What an answer! I do enjoy cutting him up though.
“Given your refusal to treat all Canadians as equal (ie Sampson > Arar), I see no reason why not to tell you to leave the country.”
Oh, you don’t say, you pompous ass. Tell me, what gives you – a landed immigrant with no equity in Canada and having contributed not a damn thing other than your alien leftist opinion – the right to tell any Canadian, especially unhyphenated, multi-generational Canadians “to leave the country?”
I’d stomp your ass and throw you out of the country myself if you ever said that to my face.
Now, for the rest of your brain-dead drivel:
“Yes. Lets take Dearborn for example. How representative is it of the entire muslim population of the US?”
It’s the largest Muslim colony in the country. And the NY Times and HNN are taking it very seriously. Who cares if you do. Your opinion isn’t just meaningless, it’s irrelevant.
Christianity and colonialism is a false argument. Unlike the Quran, the NT is not an instruction manual for politically colonizing the planet and enslaving it with abhorant 7th century laws, for that matter, unlike Mohammad, neither is Christ’s life an example to colonists Christian or otherwise – regardless of what the colonial British, French and Spanish did. Furthermore, the west brought indigenous peoples into the future, not the stone age. That fact alone, far outweighs harms done, and cannot be equaled by Islamic savagery.
“Also, your willingness to stand up for a UK born dual citizen but your immediate hostility to a Syrian born one make it absolutely clear that you arent interested in treating Muslim citizens as equals. Are you guarded and suspicious towards all Canadian citizens, or only Muslim ones? Yeah, I thought so.”
It has nothing to do with where anybody was born, it has everything to do with political allegiance to a toxic ideology at odds with our nation and laws. But then I’m getting deja vu, I think I said this over and over again. I must be talking to brick.
“…a test you have failed miserably.”
A test, from who? Oh, a pompous limey prick who recently arrived on our shore and is testing Canadians about their Canadian-ness?
“Define recent. And I am sick of you pathetic jokes, who think you know what a Canadian is by virtue of being born here. Your birth in Canada was not by choice. It was accidental. My presence in Canada is by choice. A choice I have made because of my apparently deeper understanding of what being a Canadian means, a question you ve never dealt with.”
Once again, you, a newbie, defining what Canada and Canadians are is laughable. Not only that, but then somehow defining yourself as more of a Canadian because you chose to come here, perfectly displays your twisted logic and bankrupt faculty for reason. What colour is the sky in your world?
“For someone who thinks Glasgow is in Canada,”
Huh? I didn’t realize I was talking with an escapee from Bedlam.
“Some immigrated earlier than others, but all are equal once they become Canadian citizens.”
Not according to yourself, apparently:
“because of my apparently deeper understanding of what being a Canadian means”
It’s getting boring debating a moron. I’m retiring from this thread.
“Irwin, don’t bother with the fool, he doesn’t know spit. Look how quick he ran away when I confronted him with England’s islamic problem.
He’s a Canadian now so England is not his problem.
What an answer! I do enjoy cutting him up though.”
I agree Multirec. I also think it’s fun watching him destroy himself with his own pretzel logic. Great example for fence sitters to move far right of this type of leftoid as well.
I hate revealing personal things about myself, especially on blogs, but let me put it this way. Son of a Canadian diplomat. Born in Asia (posting). Multi-generational Canadian, as you put it. Well established. Ancestor was a british officer who decided to settle down here.
Canadian diplomat married english woman.
Children sent to boarding school in England – for stability in education – diplomats move around a lot.
Son joined Royal Navy. Quit navy and joined merchant navy. Son moves to Canada to take over family estates.
Oddly enough, I m a full Canadian citizen, complete with Canadian passport (Document used to leave country – for those of us who have had the opportunity to travel)
“It’s the largest Muslim colony in the country.”
Dearborn has 30,000 Arab-Americans. America has close to 2,000,000. Thats 0.015%. A very representative sample indeed.
“Christianity and colonialism is a false argument. ”
Christianity has played a role in the drive behind colonialism. Read the history books, then talk.
“A test, from who? Oh, a pompous limey prick who recently arrived on our shore and is testing Canadians about their Canadian-ness?’
Like I said, define recent. As for being Canadian, I can guarantee your grasp of Canada is far more limited than mine.
“”…a test you have failed miserably.”‘
Yes, you have. I throw my loyalty behind Canadians. You dont.
The rest is an interesting but meaningless play on words. My understanding of being Canadian is in fact deeper than yours because you seem to have forgotten that:
a) Canada is a nation built on immigration
b) Your entire basis for being Canadian is based on being born here.
Now I was born in a hospital, not in the diplomatic residence, which means I wasnt, theoretically, born on Canadian soil, but I think that is a matter of semantics.
What I dont care for is this notion that being Canadian is based on being born in Canada. For those of us who ve watched our parents represent their country, it is especially annoying watching people like you throw your loyalty behind a foreign government.
Go join multirec in the playground where you belong.
Great! The greatest canadian ever is back. I love how patriotic you are to your ancestor’s country.
That’s their problem, what an answer. Is that how patriotic you’re going to be to Canada if you move?
Now shut up and go away you old fool.