The recent election of Hamas in Palestine has shown the world that democratic elections don’t always work out quite the way the western world might like. This article shows a similar issue with Afghanistan. Note also that this AP article is in Jamaican papers… I wonder why the Globe doesn’t see fit to include it as news? The Canadian papers I found carrying this were the Toronto Star (which is surprising me daily with Afganistan stories) and the Ottawa Citizen, behind a subscriber wall.
“AN AFGHAN man is being prosecuted in a Kabul court and could be sentenced to death after being charged with converting from Islam to Christianity, a crime under this country’s Islamic Shari’a laws, a judge said yesterday.
The trial is believed to be the first of its kind in Afghanistan and highlights a struggle between religious conservatives and reformists over what shape Islam will take here four years after the ouster of the Islamic fundamentalist Taliban regime.”
So what can or should the Canadian government or military try to do about this? As the article points out, if the man is put to death it will be seen as a real win for the Taliban. However, according to the Afghan constitution, they follow Shari’a law which does NOT allow for conversion from Islam (although I find it interesting that if he re-converted back to Islam, all would be forgiven, and he has refused to do that).
h/t to molarmauler for finding this gem while posting on the media’s remarks around PMSH’s “cone of silence.” As MM points out, the media make decisions daily on what they think is worth reporting, yet get their knickers in a knot when the PMO does the same thing. Go figure.
UPDATE: Apparently the Globe DID carry this, but it didn’t appear in my online search, so maybe it’s just in the dead-tree version? *Here’s a link* (behind a subscription wall)
UPPERDATE: It has been suggested that an email campaign to the Afghan Ambassador might be in order. I’d recommend you also cc your MP and Peter MacKay. Following is contact info (I hope the Ambassador’s hotmail account is up to this):
Embassy of Afghanistan in Ottawa
246 Queen Street, Suite 400
Ottawa Ontario KIP 5E4
Email: contact@afghanemb-canada.net
Ambassador: H E Mr Abdul Jalil JAMILI
Peter MacKay
Minister of Foreign Affairs
E-Mail: Mackay.P@parl.gc.ca
UPUPDATE: Corrected email address for the Afghan Ambassador to Canada
You have to wonder where the screaming-meemies of the UN/NDP/ALCU are hiding when a basic fundamental human right such as choice of religion is being denied.
Can you just imagine if the tables were reversed . . say the State of Texas charges christians who convert to Islam.
The whackjob Moonbatties would be apoplectic . .
but then a double standard is just fine . . .
Go Figure
This article appeared today in the Globe and Mail (March 20/06).
Another example of religion advocating death for those that don’t follow their beliefs. It will be interesting to see if their is any fall out from the (mostly Christian) countries currently working to support the rule of law in Afghanistan. I don’t think this is the kind of law we were thinking of.
Glad you picked this up Candace. This realy bugs me. I know that Afghanistan is a backwater, and has been forever. But, now that NATO and the UN pulled it out of the sludge, the least they could do is do away with all Taliban/Islamist extreme legal code. Canada has incredible leverage in this case, and should exercise it to the fullest.
Women are still little above animals in Afghanistan, and now this trial. Our men and women are serving there, to make a positive difference and bring some “light” to what is a “dark ages” culture. I know that things like this take incredible patience and time; I’m hoping Harper and Co. are up to it.
Karzi wants to visit Canada to tell us how much his country needs us… well, he can start by doing away with laws that kill infidels.
And, let’s not forget that Pakistan and more and more African countries are dealing with this level of extremism in their legal code.
Islamism belongs to history, and needs to be pushed back using all means necessary, violence being the last resort.
And yes, where are all the international multi-culti-hug-a-terrorist groups. At least Bono could put in a showing.
Alan, was it in their online? I did a search & found nothing.
Cjunk, this is a tough one – Can we say “change your constitution or we bail on you”? And would that be appropriate? Peter Mackay & whoever else is involved have their work cut out for them on this one.
Strong, steady, diplomatic pressure… how about the UN “progressives”?????
What is the point of freeing Afghanistan from the Taliban if sharia law remains the law of the land? This is outrageous. Canada must speak up for that Christian convert and insist that human rights include freedom to worship, otherwise what in the world are we doing there?
Don’t forget Ontario was flirting with allowing Shari’a Law being allowed to be practiced. How can anyone suggest that this murder of a Christian should be stopped–we all know our country only protects those who are not Christians–Christianity is the one under attack and this killing will fit in nicely with Liberal ‘Canadian Values’!
BTW–I like the naming of paper media the ‘dead tree’ version–how fitting.
Candace – I don’t read the online version. I read this in the front section this morning. I was shocked. Had me thinking about it on my way to work.
thanks for highlighting it.
Now is the time to lay down the gauntlet and show that support is conditional. I’m totally fed up with this idealistic fantacy of “unconditional love” that seems increasingly pervasive in our western democracies. Totally out of touch with the real world. If all they want is for us to educate their children, build hospitals and give them money—forget it. For everything there is a price.
Hey, thanks for the mention Candace. I heard the story on 630 CHED when I woke up but could not find it on their web-site. After that I had to go on quite a hunting trip to find the story on-line.
I’ve updated my site with the news that the story was in the print version.
I’d like to see the guy on trial get a free trip to Canada myself. I hope he makes it.
Here’s the URL for the G&M piece: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20060320.WORLDREPORT20GTA-2/TPStory/TPInternational/
It’s not merely the NATO teams that should be protesting this – it’s Muslims, moderate Muslims. It’s not about Christianity. It’s about the merger of state and religion; and above all, the nature of religion within our modern world.
The Muslim nations want to set up political systems that are linked to one religion – Islam. OK. After all, Israel has its political system linked to one religion.
But-this then brings up other factors – How do you deal with other religions in your country, if you consider that religion is not private but is public? If you, as they do in Saudi Arabia, consider that there is only one religion allowed – and consider it a crime punishable by death if you choose either atheism or another religion – then, are you actually fit to function within the diversity and the separation between private and public, of the modern global world?
The Saskatoon Star Phenoix ran a similar (tho turnacated) story…. on D8… the last page of the last section.
I’m confused – why do elections in the Middle East need to work out the way western countries want. These are democracies right? Hence, they need to work out the way the electorate want them too. You can’t have your cake and eat it too people.
Fred, excellent point! The UN, NDP, ACLU and their ilk are only interested in America-hatred, Bush-hatred, capitalism-hatred, liberal democracy-hatred (small l), etc.
As in the Danish cartoon controversy that became a freedom of Speech and Freedom of Press crisis, all those hypocritical cowards and appeasers will be notable by their absence.
In Theory Islam(like Christianity) is supposed to be tolerant of other faiths.
Christianity in the middle ages had the Inquisition. The problem of persecution arises when a particular religion dominates a culture. It is then that the moral base becomes narrowly focused and intolerant. That is why the American Constitution separates Religion from the State.
Islam is unique in that it ties the State and the Religion together.
Place Islam as the only religion(virtually) in Afganistan in the middle of a backwater with simple, illiterate, fundamentalist people and there is nothing else to be expected.
It will take decades, painful decades, to moderate these belief systems. It will be done with money invested in education, infrastructure and a developing modern economy. In other words, nothing is going to change anytime soon.
I wonder if we can email the Afghanistan Embassy to let them know how we feel? Nothing nasty, just let them know that perhaps while they are building a nation into a democracy they should consider looking at some of the archaic laws they still have. I am sure they would pass this along to their PM. Or is that President there?
Peter McKay should indeed make some sort of statement even if it is delicate. Since Canadians are involved with the humanitarian aspect of this mission isn’t it humane to speak up on behalf of this man? Perhaps he may initiate a private call or other communication?
One can only imagine what would happen if this fellow had converted to the jewish faith while still living there – what comes after death, a really BAD one?
Peter D: Killing someone for being of a religious faith other than Muslim is completely counter to democratic principles. This is a basic humanrights issue; and one that goes to heart of whether a democracy can be preserved or whether it will fail. Afghanistan is a dark ages backwater, and only pressure to reform, from an overwhelming number of international organizations, is what will change or keep fanatics in line. And, the court in this case, as in Kenya and Pakistan, must feel international pressure.
Many of the Taliban simply melted back into Afghani society… procecutors like the one asking for the death penalty in this case, likely traded his black and white Taliban robes for traditional robes and are now trying to re-insert Islamist Utopian legal code. Just because Afghanistan had an “election” doesn’t mean it is free of the forces that once enslaved it. Oposition to democracy does not take place just on the battle field, it takes place at every level of society, and if Afghanistan is not to sink back into its sewer, it will need to be guided, assertively, into the 21st century.
Hamas should take a few weeks off; go into seclusion with Yassir & the Tyrkman & read up on Allah’s free offer. Read 3 times, though. +
Turkmen president offers a place in heaven to his readers (Loony Tunes)
Yahoo/AFP Via Fark ^ | 03/20/06
Posted on 03/20/2006 12:34:06 PM PST by LesbianThespianGymnasticMidget
ASHGABAT (AFP) – Turkmenistan’s president-for-life Saparmurat Niyazov announced on state television that anyone reading his philosophical work three times would be assured a place in heaven.
“Anyone who reads the Rukhnama three times will find spiritual wealth, will become more intelligent, will recognise the divine being and will go straight to heaven,” Niyazov said Monday.
The Turkmen leader said he had “called on Allah” while working on the two-volume book to ensure that enthusiastic readers would be given quicker access to heaven.
Niyazov, known as Turkmenbashi (Leader of the Turkmen Peoples), has set up a bizarre personality cult, including erecting gold statues of himself and his deceased parents in strategic spots across his largely-desert country.
The Rukhnama, a collection of philosophical and religious writings, is compulsory reading for schoolchildren and government officials across the former Soviet republic in Central Asian +
Commenter: Who does he think he is, L. Ron Hubbard?
Other comment: Is there a Coles Notes version? +
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1599799/posts
“I’m confused – why do elections in the Middle East need to work out the way western countries want. These are democracies right? Hence, they need to work out the way the electorate want them too. You can’t have your cake and eat it too people.”
Peter, I wasn’t saying that there was something wrong with the election in Palestine, just that the west wasn’t thrilled with the results. As CJunk pointed out, death sentences based on religious beliefs don’t fit in with basic democratic principles, whether it’s a group of people, like Hamas, wanting to wipe Israel off the map, or the prosecutor in this case wanting a man to die for his religion.
I agree that we can’t have our cake and eat it too – this is a classic example.
I like the idea of emailing the Afghanistan ambassador – cc Mackay & your MP at the same time. I’ll post the email addresses.
Russ, that link is behind a subscription wall
This situation presents a real dilemma and points out some important distinctions between democracy, tolerance and pluralism. They’re not synonymous although we’ve usually understood them to go hand in hand. A country can be democratic (governed according to and answering to the will of the majority) without being pluralistic (welcoming of diversity) e.g. Japan; or democratic without being tolerant (pickpockets were hanged in 19th century England and Catholics could not hold public office); or pluralistic without being either democratic or tolerant (the Austro-Hungarian Empire). The great strength of democracy lies in its ability to provide a non-violent mechanism to change, evolve and hopefully to dissent. And yes, let’s e-mail the Afghan ambassador.
Damn, that email address for the Ambassador bounced back. Good thing I also cc’d the Cdn Ambassador in Kabul. I’ll do some more digging.
“Damn, that email address for the Ambassador bounced back.”
Is that for real? A country’s ambassador with a hotmail address???
That’s what I thought too Aliendated, HOTMAIL?? I suppose there may be reasons for this we are missing?
In my email to Peter MacKay I did ask if he had an email for this guy but I suspect that it is going to be “snail mail” for this one.
Thanks for providing the information Candace, I am sure it will be useful to many.
His Xes life stinks. +
It’s Hard Out Here
for an Iraqi
The story of “Pimp Daddy,” an Iraqi detainee at Guant�namo.
by Thomas Joscelyn
03/27/2006, Volume 011, Issue 26
FOR MORE THAN FOUR YEARS NOW, critics of the Bush administration have warned that the U.S. detention facility at Guant�namo Bay, Cuba, is fueling the Muslim street’s hatred of America. The purportedly unwarranted detention of hundreds of Muslims, coupled with the allegedly unjustified invasion of Iraq, these critics argue, will only add to the rage that leads to terrorist attacks.
Following this line of thinking, you might suppose that an Iraqi national at Gitmo would be especially angry. And thanks to the March 3 release of more than 5,000 pages of documents from Gitmo, we can now hear the story of one such Iraqi detainee. His name is Ali Abdul Motalib Hassan al-Tayeea. Or, if you prefer, “Pimp Daddy”–a nickname Gitmo’s guards gave him, for reasons that become obvious from the transcript.
Ali was brought before the military tribunal that is determining whether he and the several hundred other Guant�namo detainees should continue to be held as enemy combatants. At the outset of his hearing, Ali thanked America for getting rid of Saddam’s “cruel regime,” which he said killed one of his uncles. Ali claimed he had escaped service in Saddam’s Republican Guard and decried the Butcher of Baghdad’s poor treatment of his fellow citizens. He even professed a desire to become an “American person.”
So far so good. But then, something odd happened. Ali launched into an obscenity-laden rant that takes up much of the 24-page record of his tribunal proceeding.
He is clearly a very angry man. But why? Is it the occupation
of his native Baghdad? His detention at Gitmo?
No. Ali explains: +
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/011/981hbpar.asp
via freerepublic.com
I wonder if Sunnis think Shiites are Muslims? or are they regarded as Sunnis who converted to Shiism? I guess thats why they want to kill so many
I e-mailed the Hon. P MacKay about this situation – saying that I was 100% behind our military being in that country. I will definitely have a change of heart if the gentleman in quesion is put to death because of his convictions. That will tell me that absolutely nothing we do to help that country will change their barbaric ways and mindset. Not another drop of Canadian blood should be shed for these kinds if that man is given the death sentence. We are the infidels, our soldiers are the infidels, so then, why should infidels fight for these people who are bound and bent to eliminate us.
Warning: Satire. Jeancula & Skinny Arper ( in his surrection). ###
More “democratic fecifit” … there oughta be a law against it
… & Harper is ample girff tooo, so let Paul Who respomd to that & Jeancula, too
jesus chriss is a canadian
http://www.lecornichon.qc.ca/journal/journal.html
voyez jeanchretien as passion chriss
you tink arpere is harassed, eh
what you say, Jean?
Tories Will Allow free Vote on Bill to Prevent MPs from Switching Parties
The Conservative government is willing to allow a free vote on any potential law to block floor-crossing by parliamentarians, says a Tory MP. +
via nealenews
Give this afgan christian canadian citizenship, not the brother of guy killed because his taxi didn’t stop. Tell bardot and paul that this is not a man about to be killed, but a baby seal and watch the protests. And, Ontario wanted this law for themselves.