22 Replies to “Hudson Bay oil shipping?”

  1. All smoke and mirrors that will never happen. Too costly, too late, too impractical compared to all of the other more feasible alternatives. It seems the underlying mental model for all of this is that global warming will clear out the Arctic ice. Unfortunately, the Arctic ice is not cooperating with the narrative and continues to persist.

    1. Plus the all the chiefs – whether directly affected, indirectly affected or absolutely unaffected by the route – want their cut of the gross revenue before they’ll “consent”. Tipsy Yabby Kinew declared it thus.

  2. It seems to me that if Canada went to all the time, effort and expense to actually build this, Quebec would then have a sudden change of heart and encourage construction of a pipeline through Quebec.

    Or is that the *real* plan all along?

  3. Building this line would be a money pit. Odds are there’d be suddenly well-funded legal challengers who could delay things while financiers walked away.

    And were it ever built, it’d only be a seasonal venture – maybe four months a year.

    I believe this to be another false-hope time and money waster, though presented as an opportunity, to absorb more energy from those longing to be free, by those who pretend (poorly) to be on our side.

    1. It was only late at night while writing this I realized there is one small glimmer of a hope for an opportunity. If they did convert a gas pipe currently on the Trans Canada mainline to oil service, as had been the Energy East plan, they could a. use it to get oil to southern Ontario should Enbridge’s Line 5 finally get shut down by Michigan, b. build a lateral off it from Cochran north to James Bay for exports. That’s only 300 km of pipe, albeit in incredibly difficult Canadian Shield terrain. And you have James Bay issues for both ice and shallow water. But it is theoretically doable. And it avoids building 1400 km of pipe to Churchill or Port Nelson, or from Kinston to St John through Quebec. There could actually be something to this.
      But you’d need lots of icebreakers.

      1. The reason I don’t seriously entertain this, or any other strategies in getting oil to tidewater is because of what has become my belief in how Canada operates.

        I long ago stopped believing that the Canada we’re sold is the Canada in which we live. We have rights, in theory. We have freedoms, on paper. We have laws, with selective enforcement.

        I believe Canada is a territory run by organized crime, and headed by puppets. Their marching orders aren’t supplied by the electorate, but they must pretend that it is. So every time something isn’t permitted to happen, there has to be a semi-plausible excuse provided. And what better way to do that than to present the “solution” themselves – all the better to steer the project to its inevitable planned failure. Though providing enough glimmers of hope along the way to exhaust the financing, energy, and appetite for future endeavors.

  4. Well first of all, the idiotic laws the Trudeau Liberals put in place need to be completely unwound. And, the myth that provinces or “First Nations” have NO veto to stop interprovincial projects. The Liberals have completely walked away from their constitutional authority to force projects to move ahead. It was done deliberately to provide cover for Herr Trudeau to pretend the hands of the feds were tied….they weren’t. Herr Trudeau et al, simply pretended otherwise. Carney and his babbling is stone soup. He is a putz.

  5. 1 – I think federal liberal, NGO, and civil service support for use of any port on Hudson’s bay is a classic false flag operation because they’re counting on cost (real + 1st nation and environmentalist payola + time ) to stop anything being built while they run around loudly pretending to be doing their best to meet western needs.

    2 – the James bay stuff is an attempt to backdoor access to “ring of fire” mineralization. But.. see 1, above..

    3 – Churchhill is usable – It would only need to adopt a lighter approach with custom built 2E5 barrel tankers keeping the lanes open year round (5 per day, in each direction, will prevent ice buildup) and transferring cargo to full size tankers in Nfld or Labrador ports – but, I’m guessing, nothing like this will be permitted to succeed.

  6. Murph is correct. This is not a viable plan, nor is it intended to be – any more than the ill-fated “ring of fire” project.

    I’m sure the First Nations kleptocracy in the Northern Territories and on the Hudson’s Bay or James Bay coasts would love to have a stranglehold on oil exports from Saskatchewan and Alberta, but it would be madness for anyone to invest in such a project, even if it were feasible.

    There would be constant delays, demands for money, and interruptions during construction, and then periodic attempts to hold the pipeline hostage by threatening to shut it down or by tacitly encouraging sabotage once it was operational.

    But it would never operate. Building anything on muskeg is a Sisyphean undertaking that would present ridiculous challenges, and if you did build a port, it’s almost certain that no one would produce the specialized tankers needed to operate in Arctic waters during the eight months a year you have to deal with ice. There’s plenty of oil to buy in places where you can use your existing fleet.

    I can’t imagine that the people promoting this scheme are unaware of these facts. The only possibilities are that this a bluff, or an attempt at deception.

    I rather suspect this is a childish attempt to distract western voters. After all, this wouldn’t be a good time to openly proclaim that Alberta and Saskatchewan are never going to be given any more access to oil markets than they currently have.

    But that’s the reality.

    1. “Building anything on muskeg is a Sisyphean undertaking that would present ridiculous challenges.”

      I spent a summer building a 12 inch pipeline through muskeg. I don’t think the muskeg part was much slower than the hills. We had to rip-rap the worst wet spots and had to put swamp weights on the pipe but it got to be routine. Had a couple D6s with huge tracks, a Nodwell, and the welders were on Bombardiers. I had the feeling the company had done it once or twice before.

  7. It appears as though Canada is flailing around with their elbows slamming into each others heads. What a ridiculous, environmentally dangerous (inevitable oil spills from ice-locked tankers), expensive, infeasible proposal. Your outstretched elbows are slamming into your fellow Canadians heads. It’s just making you all look stupid. Really, really, stupid.

  8. How’s that railroad to Churchill doing? Dint T2 promise to rebuild it cause ain’t no way to get there and places inbetween?
    Dint Buffett make millions making oil cars and shipping oil by rail?
    Why not use existing ROW’s like railroads and piplines . There’s a ton of abandoned ROW’s across the prairies.
    Why does Carney need two years and another dept to accelerate any developments? Ain’t it quicker to rescind legislation that blocks development?
    Or do the Liberal thing and just ignore it?
    Are east Indians out numbering FN’s? Where’s the vote gone?
    The Quebecers flooded half their land for hydro, but no Fed crisis there eh?
    Smilin Jack couldn’t get the Mackenzie pipeline built cause of the feds.
    TCPL Energy East failed because feds.
    The west is the abused, by you know who.

  9. Remember: if you leave Canada you can have free trade with us. Stay and your oil will pay tariffs coming into U.S. and coming back into Canada.

    1. The only Canadians that think joining the US is a good idea are the ones that arrived in the last couple years. We’ve fought a few wars with the US and are fully prepared to do it again.

        1. “That’s hilarious.”

          It is. Little does he know that most Canadian gun owners would immediately switch sides and help the Americans hunt down people like him… 🙂

      2. I assume that was a joke of some sort. Or perhaps the sentiment of urban Ontario “conservatives”.

        It falls flat in the West. In a war between America and Canada, Albertans would side with the US.

  10. Umm, just bypass the indigenous communities. Much, much more cost effective. This business of people holding projects hostage because nobody wants to offend them is kinda costing us hugely.

    Obviously this will never change, so the wise decision is to just expand our pipeline network with the USA after becoming the 51st state. Side benefit of charging a 25% export tax on all fuel leaving Alberta (and Sask) headed to New Canada. (Northern BC, want in?) Would a 25% border tax be out of line for products crossing through the 51st and 52nd states? Might be a good way of getting back some of the 250 billion dollars that has been taken from us.

    By the way, I would have no problem if Edmonton and Regina wanted to remain in Canada. Small enough area that they could easily be walled off.

    Just sayin’

  11. The Pipe to Nowhere.

    Perhaps Marky Con Carney can hire Kenji’s governor to supervise construction.

Proudly powered by WordPress & Skyrocket Themes

MENU

Navigation