I don’t know the truth about Epstein but I will say this. Anyone who thinks “transparency” is easy does not understand the system. Every legal matter in this country is a thicket of barriers to disclosure: confidentially agreements, attorney/client privilege, non-disclosure and non-disparagement agreements, and classified information in cases like this the disclosure of which involves criminal penalties.
The result is an unfathomably large underworld of legal machinations about which the public knows nothing. And never will. This is true in every sector, to say nothing of the classified sector. Transparency is a slogan, something easy to expect and demand, but the reality is impenetrably complicated and fraught with grave consequences all around.
Every bit of litigation means burying facts deep within this substructure of public life, everything mediated by lawyers and judges and settlements with infinitely complicated terms that are valid in perpetuity. The long case of Epstein must face a thicket more complicated than any in human history.
oh then there are gag orders for any existing litigation!This is why whenever Bondi speaks about this, she chooses her words extremely carefully and looks rattled and nervous. Of course she is hiding information, not because she is guilty but because she is coached by dozens of lawyers. This is probably why Trump is sick of it.
The list mentioned above leaves out one important factor; this was a government sponsored intelligence operation.
No way does the CIA want more information made public.
I still back President Trump, I hired, voted for him, to be a wrecking ball & he doing rather well at that, all things considered.
However the non-handling of the non-information on Epstein’s non-files is non-acceptable.
Agreed. It seems Trump has decided that he has more advantage over Epstein’s clients if he doesn’t release the list than if he does. And if that’s the case, that’s fine; that’s his call to make. But if so, he should just say so. Lying about this is just plain stupid. It’s a self inflicted wound, and it’s not a small one. Everyone knows it’s a lie, Bongino & Patel are ready to quit over it (and good for them), and he’s alienating a lot of supporters.
If Trump were truly sick of the hiding of information, he would demand that it be made public, not play along with the obfuscation. To play along would be completely out of character for him, and there’s no upside to that. Face it: his name is likely on the list, and if not his, then many others within his administration are on it anyway.
This is not going to age well for MAGA, nor is the issue going to go away.
“the list” …
Seriously … do you simpletons even hear yourselves talk?
If there were no clients, why was Ghislaine Maxwell convicted of child sex trafficking?
She trafficked children to nobody?
They were masseuses … aka sex workers … who likely had fake ID’s. And when they realized they could get $$BIG paydays … they turned State’s witness.
Have you read about Virginia Giuffre’s life? Sexually abused by family members … turning tricks on the street at age 14 … working as a masseuse at age 16 …
Sorry … but she knew what she was doing with her sex. Yes, even at a shocking underage. I apologize for “blaming the victim” … but … truth must be told and considered when judging the veracity of sexual “abuse”.
PS … female school teachers who have sex and get pregnant by 14yo boys get less, if any, prison time than Ghislane.
So you’re saying she was falsely convicted?
And there were no clients?
So … where are the Johns? Don’t give me a “list” … give me indictments … with EVIDENCE.
I have NO IDEA whether Ghislane was properly convicted … I couldn’t SEE or READ any of the EVIDENCE that the government didn’t carefully meter out. If you’re all demanding transparency NOW … then DEMAND it retroactively for Maxwell’s trial.
Stop living in the slimy world of accusations and innuendo … and start living in the land of FACTS
Do you understand they’re directly quoting Bondi?
If Donald Trump’s name or any member of his family were on this “list” it would have been “leaked” by the unscrupulous officials of the last administration – take your pick Garland, Wray, Brennan and even Maurene Comey come to mind. The Epstein files from the 2007-8 prosecution in Democrat controlled Palm Beach Co., FL are a better bet. A better bet because pre-conviction of Epstein on charges of sex with a minor, Epstein’s pedophile and sex trafficking friends felt secure running in Epstein’s elite circle.
As I said … if the Federal Government released a “client list” of Epstein’s underage sex tourists … and my name appeared on that “list” ? My team of attorneys would be suing the government for defamation to the tune of $750 B.
Sorry … but MAGA nation can’t be stupid enough to wet theirselves over SLOGANS such as “client list” and “transparency”. It’s all nonsense.
The only thing that matters is EVIDENCE … PROOF … and *ahem* … “due process”. So … either bring detailed indictments to individually named defendants… or just STFU about “Epsteingate”
The Feds already have the evidence, the proof of who the bad actors are.
Trump knows who they are, so do Kash Patel and Pam Bondi.
They’re just not prepared to release that info, for perhaps a good reason, perhaps not.
As I’ve said before, the notion that there is a written-down list is irrelevant.
The FBI *had* the evidence, what are the odds it was destroyed before the new administration could get hold of it?
Well, the internet is forever and, similarly, perhaps there are hidden nooks and crannies where that evidence can be found deep within the FBI’s secret vaults.
I believe Kash Patel recently disclosed that a hidden cache of FBI docs relating to James Comey was discovered.
The thing about the Epstein mess is a lot of people don’t know how far back it goes and some of the shady dealings.
If you click on the link at bottom and scroll down to The Jeffrey Epstein Case you will find these nuggets, amongst others:
“In March 2005, the Palm Beach Police Department began a 13-month undercover investigation of Epstein, including a search of his home, based on reports that he was involved with sex trafficking of minors. Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) investigation resulted in a 53-page indictment in June 2007.”
“Acosta, then the U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of Florida, agreed to a plea deal, to grant immunity from all federal criminal charges to Epstein, along with four named co-conspirators and any unnamed “potential co-conspirators”. That agreement “essentially shut down an ongoing FBI probe into whether there were more victims and other powerful people who took part in Epstein’s sex crimes”. At the time, this halted the investigation and sealed the indictment.”
Later the Miami Herald investigated:
“The Miami Herald article stated that certain aspects of Acosta’s non-prosecution agreement violated federal law. “As part of the arrangement, Acosta agreed, despite a federal law to the contrary, that the deal would be kept from the victims. As a result, the non-prosecution agreement was sealed until after it was approved by the judge, thereby averting any chance that the girls — or anyone else — might show up in court and try to derail it.” Victims, former prosecutors, and the retired Palm Beach police chief were among those quoted criticizing the agreement and Acosta’s role in it.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Acosta
We’ve all heard stories of hidden cameras and a vault full of video tapes used to blackmail visitors to Epstein Island. But are the stories true, and if so, what happened to the tapes? If they still exist who has them? (Sorry, rhetorical questions, I know.)
If you’re not prepared to release the info, for good reasons or bad, you’re destroying your credibility.
“If you’re not prepared to release the info, for good reasons or bad, you’re destroying your credibility.”
IF there is actually any new info to release.
On what grounds would you sue the government for releasing a list of clients upon which your name appears? It’s an entirely different matter if that came with an unfounded accusation of child abuse or some other criminal wrongdoing, but no one on any list is being accused of that. If there’s a legal reason why the list is not being released, that’s not being clearly articulated by Trump’s staff.
I’m all for criminal indictments, but that does not appear to be in the works at all. The message from the current White House is clear: Epstein is not worth discussing, much less investigating. What exactly happened to bring about that abrupt turn of events?
What PROOF do we have of Epstein’s evil deeds? Victims? All I’ve ever seen is Virginia Giuffre make multiple wild claims about sex trafficking. She tried to claim Alan Dershowitz raped her multiple times when she was 16 yo … after MULTIPLE lawsuits, counter suits, and disclosure stipulations … Giuffre finally admitted she may have “misidentified” Dershowitz as the man who multi-raped her. Yeah … he must have done her doggy-style and she didn’t get a good look at his face? Puhleeze.
Sheesh. And not to blame the victim, but long before Epstein ever encountered Giuffre … she was turning tricks on the street as a 14yo runaway. She was abused by her own dysfunctional family … and ended up a sex worker as an underage girl, err … “massage therapist”
Where are all the other underage witnesses?
Sheesh … didn’t Gloria Allred claim 17 women were sexually abused by Trump? How are THOSE court cases coming along. Yeah … let’s make more claims about Epstein.
Give it a rest Kenji.
“Ghislaine Maxwell Sentenced To 20 Years In Prison For Conspiring With Jeffrey Epstein To Sexually Abuse Minors.”
Minors, plural, got that. With Jeffrey Epstein.
From:
https://www.justice.gov/usao-sdny/pr/ghislaine-maxwell-sentenced-20-years-prison-conspiring-jeffrey-epstein-sexually-abuse
By the way, five underage witnesses testified at the trial.
Underage witnesses … mostly unseen and unheard … and no more compelling testimony than “she said – she said”.
I need to see; travel records, expense accounts, tapes, and most of all … contemporaneous filing of police reports stating statutory rape and assorted sexual abuse.
Ohhhhhh … but they were “too scared” to report their rapes … blah, blah, blah. Boys have pennisses and girls have baginas … and guess what, sports fans? They BOTH … USE .. them. As tools to get what they want. Yeah, even 14yo’s with fake ID’s.
What Kenji said.
The majority of people who visited Epstein are probably not guilty of screwing kids. They displayed poor judgment, but I do that all day long.
But in this political climate, releasing that “list” of people is automatically going to come off as releasing the list of the guilty. You’d be tarring a lot of otherwise innocent people with one of our most hated crimes. Absent actual evidence against them, that’s defamation.
This “crisis” has been manufactured by anti-Trump Dems and Repubs, and if you’re helping them, you’ve chosen your side.
Thank you.
And for the record … Epstein comes off as extremely creepy. I don’t like his apparent “no visible means of support” that accounts for his massive $$$ wealth. And I lean toward believing Q-Anon stories of rampant underage sex crimes committed by powerful and $$$ rich people.
but …
Until I get a fully transparent trial … with ALL the evidence on display … just like the OJ trial … I’m not jumping to any GUILTY conclusion. And no, I will not “nullify” any obvious crimes.
The big issue is two judges in Manhattan that have placed a “gag” order on releasing information. Dershowitz pointed that out just about an hour ago.
On a related note, what’s the Dead Pool guess on Ghislaine Maxwell. She’s offering to testify before Congress.
https://www.smalldeadanimals.com/2025/07/15/july-15-2025-reader-tips/#comment-2040184
Pam Bondi shouldn’t have promise anything. She kept saying “I have the file on my desk” + promising some big reveal. She shouldn’t have said anything, she’s a top lawyer, she must know how these things go.
Yes, that utterance was a mistake. Which explains exactly why she has clammed-up just about now. She knows she should have never made that flip remark to a reporter.
Why shouldn’t she have said anything? Would the list have been an embarrassment to the current administration? That’s not a valid reason to with hold it.
“Why shouldn’t she have said anything? Would the list have been an embarrassment to the current administration? That’s not a valid reason to with hold it.”
Personally, I just applied common sense to the problem of Bondi’s statement:
When asked, she responded: “It’s sitting on my desk right now to review.”
TO REVIEW. Meaning to be looked at LATER. She hadn’t done it yet. Obviously.
The fact that that evidence, when examined, did not contain any such ‘list’ is not her fault, and certainly not proof of her “lying” about it.
(and I’m not a big Bondi fan after the Zimmerman debacle)
Fair comment Kate.
Jeffrey is a smart cookie. It’s an interruption and distraction, there are more important injustices and crimes I’m more concerned about. Close to pretty much dropping a few conservative ‘influencers’ for some of the over-the-top stupid comments.
I am sure there are; however, this one ranks pretty high for me. The imprisonment and sexual assualt/expoitation of countless minors, by rich persons who operate above the ionsphere is pretty big in my book.
In no way am I downplaying the crimes committed. Epstein’s dead. Maxwell’s in prison. What do you want?
By the sounds of it every John that paid a prostitute should be in jail, and I’d be O.K. with that, but good luck with that.
The US government won’t prosecute the johns. Why? Because the johns could reveal too much government hanky panky.
Trump, I believe, is caught on the horns of a dilemma. On the one horn is his promise to expose and break the ‘deep’ state on the other a promise to bring back prosperity to America. Now a little supposition here, just suppose that by fully investigating the Epstein case, racket, file, whatever you want to call it, the investigation turns-up the unsavoury facts that many members of the House, Senate, bureaucracy, and leaders in finance and industry are involved in illicit corruption and crime. This has been transpiring for years with the benefit of the protection of a select group within the DOJ, the FBI the CIA. (Anyone remember Edgar?) By ivestigating the case it could result in a massive loss of faith in the political and financial areas of American society which would in turn result in an economic collapse. So what is Trump to do? Open an investigation and possibly expose the corruption that has been prevalent for the last fifty years causing a financial nightmare the likes of which we have never seen or try and keep a lid on it for the ‘common good’. Morally it is incumbent on Trump to start an investigation to expose the corruption that has poisoned America and deal with the fallout that results. To allow it to be swept under the rug and hidden is to ensure the ultimate failure of the American idea.
Trump clearly picked a lane on this issue months if not years ago and needed to stick with it. Deciding to switch lanes at the last moment is destroying his credibility.
I’d be happy if Trump simply MOEFA. Make Our Elections Fair Again.
“I’d be happy if Trump simply MOEFA. Make Our Elections Fair Again.”
I’m curious as to when we can expect to see Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss testifying under oath as to how they got their fellow ballot counters to leave, then immediately pulled more ballots out from underneath a table and started quickly counting them. Love to hear a plausible explanation for that.
This is much bigger than Epstein. I believe it’s an international espionage and blackmail operation. Evidently Bibi Netanyahu is someone keenly interested in keeping this quiet.
I don’t buy “such an important matter that the people can’t be told the truth.”
I also dislike Trump equivocating that asking to see the evidence means I’m someone that wants to see c_hild pron.
“Of course she is hiding information, not because she is guilty but because she is coached by dozens of lawyers. This is probably why Trump is sick of it.”
Heh. I can think of other reasons.
I.M.H.O.
Suddenly Ghislaine Maxwell wants to testify.
Why? Probably to live. She’s the new Steele dossier. She’ll testify Trump was a client. Then one of the former working girls, victims, whatever, will pop up. She’ll testify she was brought to Trump to “entertain” him. She will then testify that he “grabbed me by my pussy”.
Game. Set. Match.
“She’s the new Steele dossier. ”
Maybe. Maybe not. Might be some substance to it.
Dear TDS … remember the 17 women Gloria Allred assembled who claimed Trump violated them in every sexual manner imaginable?
Yeah … either do I.
Someone on the radio this morning: “All the people on the list are either A) no longer in office or B) dead. We’re now Not going to bring forth charges in order to protect the Victims”.
What?
If a victim does not want to press charges, the police just let it drop?
Didn’t think it worked that way
Some good comments here by people who are able to discern facts from the speculation flogged by influencers. Here’s another speculative monkey wrench. Many people assume Epstein was a front man for other darker or more powerful interests. I can even understand the suspicion directed at the CIA, Deep State, Mossad, or MI6. Just a gentle caution, however, Epstein may have had more than one master, or there are any number of third parties in on the act: rival foreign governments; domestic, foreign, or international criminal organizations; powerful domestic or international ideological organization (think WEF); domestic or multinational commercial and financial interests such as the Military Industrial Complex or a wealthy megalomaniac.
If Bondi releases the list, none of the clients can be prosecuted. Releasing the list practically guarantees that jurors will be biased, so any prosecution would be tainted and DOA.
If Bondi States that indictments are forthcoming, some clients will do the Roman Polanski Shuffle and flee the country.
If there isn’t prosecution, or if the list isn’t released, it makes everyone look bad.
I think Bondi said too much, too soon. She got out ahead of her skis.
The DoJ needs to launch indictments over the worst of the clients, maybe 30-50 people. Then they need to get the list out there and let the public punish everybody else.