On March 24, a month after Russian tanks rolled across Ukraine’s borders, the Biden White House summoned America’s partners (as its allies are now called) to a civilizational crusade. The administration proclaimed its commitment to those affected by Russia’s recent invasion—“especially vulnerable populations such as women, children, lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender and intersex (LGBTQI+) persons, and persons with disabilities.” At noon that same day, Secretary of State Antony Blinken tweeted about the “massive, unprecedented consequences” American sanctions were wreaking on Russia, and claimed Russia’s economic “collapse” was imminent.
Never has an official non-belligerent been more implicated in a war. Russia and its sympathizers assert that the U.S. attempt to turn Ukraine into an armed anti-Russian camp is what the war is about in the first place. Even those who dismiss this view will agree that the United States has made itself a central player in the conflict. It is pursuing a three-pronged strategy to defeat Russia through every means short of entering the war—which, of course, raises the risk that the United States will enter the war. One prong is the state-of-the-art weaponry it is supplying to Ukraine. Since June, thousands of computer-guided artillery rockets have been wreaking havoc behind Russian lines. A second prong is sanctions. With western European help, Washington has used its control of the choke points of the global marketplace to impoverish Russians, in hopes of punishing Russia. Finally, the U.S. seeks to rally the world’s peoples to a culture war against an enemy whose traditionalism, even if it does not constitute the whole of his evil, is at least a symbol of it.
It would be foolish to bet against the United States, a mighty global hegemon with a military budget 12 times Russia’s. Yet something is going badly off track. Russia’s military tenacity was to be expected—bloodying and defeating more technologically advanced armies has been a hallmark of Russian civilization for 600 years. But the economic sanctions, far from bringing about the collapse Blinken gloated over, have driven up the price of the energy Russia sells, strengthened the ruble, and threatened America’s western European allies with frostbite, shortages, and recession. The culture war has found few proponents outside of the West’s richest latte neighborhoods. Indeed, cultural self-defense may be part of the reason India, China, and other rising countries have conspicuously declined to cut economic ties with the Russians.
There have been signs for years that a new Iron Curtain was about to drop on the European continent. In 2008, the U.S. announced plans to bring certain non-Baltic republics of the former Soviet Union—notably Ukraine and Georgia—into NATO and the American sphere of influence. Should Ukraine prevail in this proxy war the U.S. will have succeeded, in a way. But it will have done so at an almost unspeakable price. It will have undermined the international economic architecture on which rests its control of global markets (and its ability to safely run government deficits). It will have carried out a shotgun wedding of Russia and China, forcing the most natural-resource-rich country on the planet into the arms of the West’s most dangerous adversary. Should Ukraine fail, the Ukraine policy of the Bush, Obama, Trump, and Biden administrations will be counted among the significant foreign policy blunders in American history.
There are at least three reasons for the U.S. to back Ukraine:
1. Russia is a long-time enemy of the U.S., and this is a cheap and easy way (for the U.S.) to decimate Russia’s military.
2. It will make Russia think twice about invading America’s allies. Any illusion Putin has that Russia is a match for NATO, or that NATO will not respond to a Russian incursion, has been shattered.
3. On a minor note, it’s a great way to assess various weapons and tactics in a modern war.
And it is a deterrent to China
That’s funny
Arty
I agree, 2 fools posting about things they have NO klue about!
How about keeping it civil, as the owner of this blog has requested?
The fools are the ones who have nothing to say but yet believe in their own little minds that their stellar reputation on the blog allows them to bash others for no reason and with no justification.
It is probably more correct to say that America was a long-time enemy of the Soviet Union. The American Expeditionary Force fought in Russia against the Soviets from 1918 to 1919. When it was useful to us we allied with them against Germany in WW2. Then went back to being their enemy. After the fall of the Soviet Union that part that was Russia was again befriended so long as they were weak and exploitable. But somehow the Russian people regained their sovereignty and became our enemy again under Hillary Clinton and crew.
The Russians want nothing to do with the West other than to trade. They certainly don’t want to be in charge of running what they see as a cesspool of moral, political, and financial decay. They know they will have their hands full rebuilding the Russian areas of the Ukraine.
Testing weapons in action trains your enemies. They may learn how to fight the Russian military. That would expose the Russians to greater danger.
Well said. You forgot to mention how quickly we went from war with Germany to them being our new best friend.
I wish that were true. And if it were true, I have little doubt that western Europe would embrace Russia. Europe has no interest in reviving the cold war, has a need for Russian natural resources, and would prefer to spend as little on the military as possible.
But Putin has revived Russian Imperialism. He wants more land. He sees himself as the second coming of Peter The Great.
John Joseph Mearsheimer, the distinguished political scientist and historian, has addressed the issue of Putin’s alleged imperialist thinking and ambitions and found nothing to support the claim. I tend to believe him because his understanding in this and other related issues allowed him to predict the current conflict and its nature many many years ago. If you want a non-ideological fact based understanding of the issues it is well to listen to him.
The reason most of the world is siding with the Russians is that the facts are on their side and the history is well known in the international community. Lies told in diplomatic circles are long remembered when those in the public space are forgotten. America is getting a very bad reputation.
Putin himself refutes your arguments:
http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/66181
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jun/10/putin-compares-himself-to-peter-the-great-in-quest-to-take-back-russian-lands
We are keeping it civil. Stop whining.
GYM… “I agree, 2 fools posting about things they have NO klue about!”
Your definition of civil is different than most people’s.
GYM… “I agree, 2 fools posting about things they have NO klue about!”
Your definition of civil is different than most people’s.
GYM… “I agree, 2 fools posting about things they have NO klue about!”
Your definition of civil is different than most people’s.
And who has the Biden files?
You must have forgotten about Afghanistan and now have a Military might that wasn’t planned.
Our politicians have totally slipped a gear and figure just adding money will fix everything.
Time isn’t on the Western Alliances side as logistics takes time which on Russian doorstep, they have logistics on their side. The collapse of many countries from fuel supply starvation isn’t catching up to its usage.
Russia’s ammo dumps are being blown up nearly every day. Their logistics have been a disaster and there is no reason to believe that’s changing.
“Brian Stelter verified it himself! Honest!”
The loss of Russian ammunition depots is well verified from numerous sources, including average citizens. When a depot goes up, it is not subtle.
When a Russian depot goes up, it’s quite likely one of two own-goals:
1) Ammo – Russia made TONS and TONS and TONS of ammo during the Cold War – and did not have western standards of quality control while they were making it. A lot of that ammo is still in depot; all ammo degrades over time, even western ammo and even if stored in strict conditions of climate control, it will slowly become unstable. The West is pretty strict in shooting-off (usually in training) or getting rid of ammo that’s considered to be at or nearing its best-before date; Russia, not so much. So there’s a lot of REALLY old ammo in depot in Russia; and since Russia is barred by its own laws from sending conscripts into battle, and only has its conscripts for a year anymore, they’re not trained in anything specialised as their term would be up before they graduate the course, so they get stuck with all the joe-jobs. Including humping ammo. And since safe handling of old, unstable ammo requires some pretty intense training and supervision, often the conscripts don’t get that training. So gorily pyrotechnic ammo accidents are a lot more common there than they are here.
2) fuel. Did you hear one of the big reasons why the Russian troops who went into Ukraine were so poorly trained? Corruption is endemic in the Russian army, and commanders given fuel for training sell it on the black market, pocket the money and pencil-whip the training forms; the troops get no training. Now imagine you’re commandant of a fuel depot – think of the money you can make flogging your fuel to drivers and farmers! But suddenly there’s a war on – oh sorry – a “special military operation”; bowsers are showing-up at your depot and being sent back empty, and the auditors are coming to find out why. Wouldn’t it be just so awful if those villainous Ukrainians sent-in a spec-ops team or a Bayraktar and set fire to the depot? Including the admin section, of course, so all the fuel paperwork went up in smoke? Tragic, simply tragic – you were SO looking forward to finally helping defend the Rodina; why, you could’ve been awarded the Hero of Socialist Labor!
Far-fetched? Read GRU defector Viktor Suvorov’s book “The Liberators”, and find out what “three Czech terrorists in a Moskvitch” accomplished in a “single drive-by shooting”…
“1) Ammo – Russia made TONS and TONS and TONS of ammo during the Cold War ”
Few points here.
They have also very liberally expended their ammo in Chechnya, Georgia and Syria. And there is little evidence that they were replenishing their Cold War stockpile so the actual state of their reserves may well be much lower than everyone thinks.
Not all that ammo fits modern weapons. There is a reason they are rumored to be pulling the long now retired 130mm guns out of storage (wonder if 180mm howitzers will be next?).
This is dumb HE ammo. Not guided, not assisted, not airburst. The situation is even worse for rockets, and even worse for missiles, the more advanced the ordnance they worse the supply problem. Hence russia is targeting map squares and Ukraine is targeting individual targets. I am not saying that russian method is ineffective, but that it is wasteful and very expensive.
Now add embargo that makes rebuilding stockpile of modern precision guided ordnance next to impossible and Siberian progress slows down to the crawl and in the long run becomes prohibitively expensive.
Forgot to add: several analysts pointed out that gun barrel wear may well be another bottleneck. Russia is unlikely to be able to manufacture sufficient amount of replacement artillery gun barrels to keep up with demand and production lines for barrels for older systems may well be closed for good.
Russia ain’t our enemy, however a western leadership that is doing all it can to starve, freeze and immobilize its own people are.
Agreed HiHo, It’s all smoke and mirrors for the gullible. The enemy is within!
Two thumbs up. Only the worst ruling class in history could turn many of us against our own governments.
You Tube “Redacted”.. Worth a look..
And sorry – from what I’ve read (which is everything I can get my hands on, and I don’t watch the “WATCH UKRAINIANS BLOW UP RUSSIAN…” yooboob vid’s), we stop ’em here – and here is the best place to stop ’em; it’ll just get harder and more expensive if we let Putin get away with it, and Ukraine is merely the first former SR he intends to denazify.
– Putin, the Russian hierarchy and lots of western fellow-travellers loudly declaim that “This is NATO’s fault, and Russia would have to respond to NATO’s eastern expansion sooner or later!” Maskirovka, tovarishch; Putin could care less about NATO, he’s using NATO as a convenient false-flag. His real goal (which he’s proclaimed – I have the url if you’re curious) is the rebirth of the Russian empire; and he’s shown his detailed method thereto, snatching Abkhazia from Georgia and Transnistria from Moldova. Same methods each time; hand-out Russian passports to anybody who wants one, build-up forces on their borders, manufacture a “crisis” (or “outrage”) with his propaganda forces, then invade and hold a “plebiscite” which Russia always “wins” as justification to recognise their “independence” from their former country and absorb them. Each time he gets-away with it, each time he comes back to the table for more. He’s casting covetous eyes on Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland and East Germany, and Alexander Dugin, his eminence grise (sorta’ like Trofim Lysenko was to Stalin), has declared that Russia should own everything from Dublin to Vladivostok.
– Ukraine is the very best place to stop him because Ukraine is a huge country with a swept-up, technologically advanced population and a large, powerful army that’ve shown a willingness and ability to tie the Russians in knots. The Ukrainians are FIGHTING and will FIGHT; and after Russian atrocities on the road to Kiev (backed-up with satellite photos that showed Ukrainian dead in the streets of Bucha before the Russians left), the Ukrainians have a good idea of what to expect if Russia wins. Anybody read about Chamberlain’s “Peace for Our Time” and particularly, how it turned out? The Czechs had a modern army that was larger than the Wehrmacht in 1938, and a string of mountain forts down their German border; they’d’ve been a tough nut to crack. But we “gave” the Czech Sudetenland to Germany (“gave” because it wasn’t ours to give), and then went to war over Poland, which was indefensible against the German blitzkrieg. And anybody read about the “provocation” Germany engineered to give them an excuse to invade Poland? As Mark Twain put it, “History doesn’t always repeat itself, but it does rhyme a lot.” And now if Russia wins in Ukraine and goes farther west, which they will, they’ll be treading on NATO and there’ll be a nuclear exchange in the offing – one area where Russia has parity with every other nation on Earth.
I have nothing against Russia, but a whole lot against their leaders – and I realized just today that I can say the same thing about Canada. Putin will never be satisfied – he CAN’T be, because stagnation holds the same penalty for him as failure; and I maintain that we stop them in Ukraine now, or we’ll end-up having to stop them somewhere else in the future – and the cost to do so will just keep going up. My 2¢ worth…
And I will not reply to any of the foul-mouthed flamers who’ve so cursed Kate’s site on this topic over the last couple of months.
Did you read the Claremont article? Your cartoonish view of Russian aspirations and how this conflict came about tells me you either didn’t or that you’re buying the American propaganda.
You should pay closer attention to what Putin says and what the Russian propaganda talk shows say.
Yes the translations are verified.
They view Ukraine gaining independence as a tragedy that needs to be reversed.
Did Ukraine GAIN independence or merely declare it?
alla ASS
here’s a read fer yah https://smoothiex12.blogspot.com/2022/08/on-wunderwaffe-thinking-again-and-some.html
“Your cartoonish view of Russian aspirations…”
So, Arty – if these aren’t Russia’s aspirations, why do they keep using the same methods they’ve used time-and-again, to snatch other countries’ territory? And why were the Hague’s findings so universally damning of Russia’s absorption of Abkhazia and Transnistria?
Like Sergei Skripal and his daughter – you can find lots of articles that say no it wasn’t Russia, and no it wasn’t Novichok, and the whole thing was staged by western intelligence to embarrass Russia. But these are precisely the sorta’ things Russia bas done time after time – why would anybody believe they didn’t do it this time? We could ask Aleksandr Litvinenko, but he’s dead.
When I think of Ukraine my mind goes to a place where gigantic kick backs stemming from foreign donations happen and where there’s always a cut for some connected “big guy”(s)…(come on, man!)
I also think of an imbecilic narcissist and corrupt leader who knows that it is futile to fight a superior force that will only leave his country in ruins instead of later resistance to the occupation which would at least save a good chunk of the furniture.
It doesn’t matter that the rubble is strong if you can’t buy anything with it. It is a completely controlled currency untethered to the global economy. It’s value is whatever the Russians say it is.
Also a “strong” rubble means what little oil you can export is overpriced and they have to deep discount it 30% to sell to China and India. India and China cannot even take anymore as their storage is full.
Russia cannot access ports ships or pipelines to export their incremental energy.
Their massive gas and oil fields are starting to fail as they run out of western machinery and equipment and expertise.
Russia is exhausting its foreign reserves. And they cannot get credit to any kind of infrastructure expansion.
The Russians are going to need the EU as much or more than the EU needs Russia.
Russia it’s screwed and it’s getting worse by the week for them.
Let’s say that’s all true. Do you think the Russians are just going to lose and go home?
Yes. They will give it a fancy name and call it a victory. But it will be a big defeat.
HannaH
Emotions turn off the rational area of the brain, so determined by fMRI studies, and you are a prime example of that.
As Sundance pointed out, this is a proxy war that the USA got started, just like they did in Syria, Libya, and they tried in Egypt.
Tho the “Ukes” appear to maybe have some successes , I question if that it is even the Ukes performance. I believe that it is mercs with USA aid. The USA “painted” the Russian war ship that got sunk in the black sea, and the jury is still out as to who pulled the trigger!
USA pols have already admitted they are in a proxy war with Russia, and as to the Rubble, possibly 1/2 the world will recognize it and trade in it, or the Yuan!
Incorrect the US did not invade Ukraine nor did it start the war in Syria, or even the one in Libya. America has no proxies in Libya. Now France OTOH…
GYM, HannaH used reason and facts not emotion in her comments. Try to do the same.
I suspect that Putin will be gone soon due to illness, political coup, or political coup brought on by his illness.
When that happens, the new leader may well back out of Ukraine in order to halt the decimation of the Russian military.
Linda F
I worked at jobs that required I determined fact from fiction, and NO, HannaH like the Colon, is posting from a emotional perspective!
I’m a chemical engineer GYM. I do reason and math.
Or not
And the chinee are going into Russia.. A weakened Russia.. ?.. but at the same time an economically weakened chineee.. Whats going on?..
Well we will see who is screwed this winter. I doubt it will be the Russians.
It’ll be Russian soldiers, mostly.
I tend to agree with you but it’s not the good thing you think it is.
A couple of points though. Russia has been blocked from using American currency as a reserve currency among those abiding by the sanctions and Russian oil will find it way to world markets through third countries such as China and India. Just because your reserves are full it doesn’t mean you can’t resell the oil to a resource hungry world at a mark up.
Ruble. Rubb!e is what’s appearing in Ukraine.
I’ve long thought that the American Oligarchs don’t make any money when the US isn’t at war and the Russian Oligarchs don’t make any money when Russia is.
So it’s US Oligarchs 1, Russia Oligarchs 0
“the economic sanctions, far from bringing about the collapse Blinken gloated over, have driven up the price of the energy Russia sells, strengthened the ruble”
LOL another dope who doesn’t understand how currency and capital markets work. Go long those Rubles Caldwell, show us how it’s done. Tell us what happens when you try to convert at the official rate. Try buying a smartphone their. Oh and the price of America’s victory in Ukraine is infinitesimal. The dollar price of the gear shipped to Ukraine pales in comparison to a single navy aircraft carrier.
He also apparently doesn’t understand what caused Europa’s energy problems and the high price of oil ie it ain’t Russia. It’s the green energy agenda and the monetary policy, respectively. Leave it up to conservaderps to drop actual valid weapons of policy in favor of the latest reactionary spasm.
No it is not the Ukraine policy of the post-Cold War presidents that has failed it is their Russia policy. Vindman (PBUH) released a great article about the need to end deference to Moscow. Certainly beats allowing Russia to be increasingly insane. Let China have them.
Only 16 computer guided rocket systems….8 of them either destroyed or sold to the Russians by corrupt Ukraine officials. They might be getting more ordinance but 8 Hymar do not a summer make.
The Russian artillery fires 90 000 rounds per day…every day.
The beginning of Kursk was the Russians firing 19 000 artillery pieces. The Russians (as Churchill did) like their cannon.
I hope they hang Zelensky when this shambles is over.
No idea where you get the idea that 8 of the computer guided rocket systems are lost.
“The Russian artillery fires 90 000 rounds per day…every day.”
And they fail to advance, every day. You can’t just artillery blast your way through war, the cannons can only take so many firings.
Wagner recently said that zero HIMARs have been sold or destroyed. The only proof the Russian MoD offers is a video from a cruise missile hitting the 2nd story of a building.
If Russia is firing anything over 20,000 shells and advancing that little, there is a serious problem.
There’s a hell of a lot more fires and flashes coming from the Russian side. Total opposite of May or June. Check NASA FIRMS yourself. There’s also a Twitter bot that tracks flashes. You can tell when Russia launches their cruise missiles.
Indeed, why are we in Ukraine.
Let me give you some reasons. First let us observe that we are not in Ukraine – our weapons are in Ukraine. They are there to help Ukraine resist the encroachments of an Imperial state that has not yet accepted that the days of empire are over. A state that is showing every intent to reclaim its old glories. A state that will use those old glories to fight against the advancement of Western values and the improvement of the human condition that generally accompanies that. And preserving the upward trajectory of Western civilization is worth expending some economic and military capital to achieve.
Second, let us observe that the Europeans are experiencing first hand the dire consequences of their zero carbon climate change policy that is also destined to lead to the decline of western civilization. As more and more Europeans face energy shortages and energy poverty – they are more apt to come to their senses about what really makes the world go round and withdraw from the insane self destructive climate death.
Third, we observe that there is little room in a country at war for debating the next addition to the theoretical intersectional hierarchy of grievances. Real suffering is being meted out by the exercise of real power. Even the most ardent of the social justice warrior crowd are starting to realize that.
Why are we in Ukraine?
Because it is an existential moment for western civilization, and we need to be there to reverse the rot and preserve the west.
Your post is contradictory. Working back from your conclusion “Why are we in Ukraine? Because it is an existential moment for western civilization”. I don’t believe that myself but ok, I’m starting with the benefit of the doubt.
But your opening salvo “They [our weapons] are there to help Ukraine resist the encroachments of an Imperial state that has not yet accepted that the days of empire are over.” suggests you believe that Russia is finished as a world power. If so, then the war is not an existential moment as much as it is a waste of human life. And “A state that is showing every intent to reclaim its old glories. A state that will use those old glories to fight against [not our values]” could easily explain the actions of America.
What if … we just ignored Russia and Ukraine going back to 2007? What if we didn’t try and put our weapons up against Russia’s back door? What if we left Sweden and Finland out of NATO? Do we need to conquer the entire world?
Because we are losing China, India, much of South America, much of Africa. We are turning into the Borg.
Steve from Rockwood: “What if we left Sweden and Finland out of NATO? Do we need to conquer the entire world?”
Sweden and Finland are sovereign states which, recognizing a serious demonstrated external threat in Russia, have petitioned to join the defensive NATO military alliance. This is merely exercising the virtue of prudence. This is not conquering anything, much less the entire world.
Not to be disagreeable but the people of Serbia might quibble with your assertation that NATO is a ‘defensive’ alliance
It defended serbs from Croatian patriots in Operation Storm, pity it did.
“Sweden and Finland are sovereign states which, recognizing a serious demonstrated external threat in Russia, have petitioned to join the defensive NATO military alliance.”
At least those two nations could actually qualify for membership. Ukraine would need to initiate a MASSIVE crackdown on corruption and restore the rule of law (under the watch eyes of third-party observers) before they could even begin to be considered qualified.
“What if we didn’t try and put our weapons up against Russia’s back door?”
Those countries joined NATO because of Russian expansionism. Russia is the problem, always has been. And its expansionism will indeed cause an existential disaster for the west even if it does not directly constitute it. Thanks partly to the aid of trivial cost sent over, Russia’s days of being a respected power are finished.
^^^^ This is actually 100% correct,
The ROT is not in Russia. It’s right here at home. If you pulled your head out of your ass you might notice.
Anon
Exactly, and this Uke war is just a distraction to keep stupid people from figuring out , that the water is slowly coming to a boil, and soon they will be boiled frog.
The west is being devoured by China. They have been at it for the 20 years and the west has been entirely too stupid to understand it. This is an existential moment for western civilization…..but it ain’t because of Russia, but rather China which is eating our lunch.
No, China is selling us stuff. They are not ‘devouring’ anybody outside of Hong Kong and Taiwan-which is bad but no need to exaggerate. In any event, sounds like they are in some serious trouble with their property market.
China has sucked up Venezuela, is sucking up large amounts of property and businesses in Africa….it is buying up farmland in the U.S. by leaps and bounds (and Canada too). For more than a decade, China has been stealthily buying up European companies in strategic sectors, particularly in technology and energy. According to Datenna, a Dutch company that monitors Chinese investments in Europe. A staggering 40% out of 650 Chinese investments in Europe in the years 2010-2020, according to Datenna, had “high or moderate involvement by state-owned or state-controlled companies, including some in advanced technologies”.
You apparently are incapable of understanding the game that China has been playing for decades. The “climate change” fraud is also designed to benefit one country and one country only…..and that is China. The west gets sucked into buying “green energy” machines and China gets the dough.
You better open your eyes, Comrade
It’s funny people think Russia or more descriptively, Communism is losing. Have you seen America today?
Or Canada? The West is gone. You’re all living in the past man!
I think what we have going on in the west is more accurately described as corporate stateism. Sort of like communism but more efficient.
Well that’s also the definition of fascism….the State uses business to achieve its goals. We certainly saw lots of that from corporate vaccine mandates.
Art
In the west we have the MIC controlling the governments to achieve their goals, not the other way around. Many pols are bought and paid for by corporate $$$$
Well I’m sure that is what a lot of companies in Nazi Germany initially thought as well.
Either definition works. But we are clearly not what we were in 1989. We won for a reason and that’s been deliberately denigrated the last 30+ years. I think we will get back to individual freedom, but the longer this nonsense continues the uglier it will be.
Why are we in Ukraine?
Many reasons…
but one of those reasons – which many dismiss – is not silly at all ; Ukraine is where many corrupt people make money trough shady deals.
So of course that golden goose has to be protected at almost any cost, since the cost, in money and in lives, is not paid by those who make money trough Ukraine.
And what we know, such as ; the son of the President of the most powerful nation on the planet was being paid millions by a Ukraine company to accomplish nothing and he then spent that money ( minus the fee to his father ) on crack and prostitutes and he had access codes to the pentagon s computers…is only the tip of the iceberg.
But the corrupt nation of Ukraine is also a good place to hide research on biological weapons that you promised the United Nations you would never ever do!
It is a verified fact that the US owns a large number of bio labs in Ukraine.
It is a verified fact that some of those labs were built by companies in which the Bidens are financially involved.
Why do you think the FBI tried to hide the Hunter laptop for years? It was more than just the 2020 election, it is because dozens or thousands of politicians and other rich people ( connected to politicians, mainly democrat ones ) are involved in shady, criminal deals in Ukraine, some of them connected to the Pentagon ( such as the bio labs)
There are many reasons for that war, it is a multiple factor situation, but don t be too quick to dismiss the fact Ukraine is a golden goose for a large numbers of very powerfull yet very corrupt people.
“… According to Transparency International’s 2021 Corruption Perceptions Index, Ukraine ranked 122nd out of 180 countries, near countries such as Zambia, Gabon and Mexico, while nations like Denmark and Finland ranked first. …”
yep!
“I will not be satisfied until me and my butt buddy Zelenksyyyyy are drinking the blood of freshly exterminated Russian infants from a cup made of the skulls of little seven year old Russian girls!”
Just thought I’d get that out there before he says the same thing in 2,000 words complete with links to CNN, BBC and CBC.
On the odd chance that this post will not be deleted (the post above will for sure stay).
Why we should be in Ukraine, not why we are (we are not), but why we should be.
Because it is the right thing to do. Because people from Finland to Georgia deserve the right to be once and for all free from the threat of russian imperialism. That is why Finland and Sweden has joined NATO, that is why Baltics or Poland are helping more per GDP than anyone else, that is why foreign volunteers from any country bordering Russia have flocked to Ukraine. That is why you have Japanese and Koreans fighting side by with Georgians and Poles. They all understand the basic fact that russia needs to be neutered once and for all. They know that if Ukraine fails they will be next.
When people here say that russians just want to trade with the west, they ignore what Russian state TV is saying about Russia dominating all of Europe, “storming Berlin” was a phrase used yesterday on state TV. When people talk about the West they better be specific, West to them means “west of Oder”. Be honest, you’re willing to condemn more than a hundred million people to ethnic cleansing and genocide for “peace of our time”.
When people here say that russians just want to trade with the west, they ignore the real trauma, average on the streets russians, have been experiencing in the 90s, in the decade they were freer than ever in their history, the trauma best summarized by the words “none is fearing us anymore.” Subjugation of russia’s neighbors is what russian people, not just their government want. Well, people in Europe east of Oder have clearly said NO to this. Choose your sides, it is not going away, you will be drawn into sooner or later.
^^^^ Well it is there, for now at least.
If I it looks like I am not responding to your responses it is because my responses have been consistently deleted by one of the admins who don’t like to have his narrative contradicted.
COLON
Your BULL must know how to type with it’s rear end!
I was under the impression that there weren’t that many Polish volunteers fighting, but that may be outdate info.
Otherwise, a pretty much perfect post. All the good Russians left Russia. That entity is itself a kind of WMD that requires dismantling.
None really knows how many Polish volunteers are in Ukraine and how many among them are decedents of ethnic Ukrainians (net search: Akcja Wisla) and how many of them are not. Those who are not decedents of ethnic Ukrainians, often are ex military with past experience of training Ukrainian forces. So both categories speak at least passable Ukrainian. As a result Poles rarely end up in the Foreign Legion and tend to integrate into Ukrainian army regular units.
As one aside, then there are all those Ukrainians (about two millions of them by some calculations) who immigrated to Poland in recent decades (most after 2014) who answered the call. They are not counted among Poles though. They are among the finest of Ukrainian generations. Being of similar cultural background to Poles, they have integrated flawlessly, many travelled back and forth. Them who have seen the life in the West, refused to let their country slide back to Siberian standards. They were the driving force of the very organic changes in Ukrainian consciousness that created the nation of Braveharts.
As another aide, I find it amusing how Poland was a hero of so many here, as recently as during the Freedom Convoy protests, and or how you in the past have tried to ostracize Poland for not being progressive enough.
colon
I’v been to Finland a few times, and tho the USSR annexed about 11% of eastern Finland, the Fins living near the Russian border are quite pro-Russian. The people living near the western coast tend to be pro-Sweeden, so your uninform statement holds little water. The Fins do not necessarily feel threatened by the Russians
Suuuure, that is why they have joined NATO when Siberian Mongols invaded Ukraine.
Encouraging the burning race hatred of the Ukrainians towards the Russians will work out great.
“Stengthened the Ruble”
The writer clearly isn’t paying attention. The Russian central bank pegs the exchange rate.
From what I see, the Ukrainians aren’t the only ones being led down that path. Between the escalating scale of the arms shipments, both in quantity and in the types of equipment being delivered, the propaganda effort in the legacy media, and the revelations about the nature of the collaboration between the various western intelligence agencies, it is clear that the Americans want to be directly involved. And that the public is being conditioned to accept that. The fools who lead us want a war, one that would distract from their many failures. And they believe that it would be consequence-free for them.
“Should Ukraine fail, the Ukraine policy of the Bush, Obama, Trump, and Biden administrations…”
I don’t think Ukraine will fail in the sense it will cease to exist, it will just be smaller geographically, economically, and demographically. If one good thing comes out of this war it will be the repudiation of the cult of neoconservatism in the western world.
perhaps it would be wise to remember the doddering fool in the White House told Putin a ‘small invasion’ was okay. What kind of strategy is that?
Why, because from the right we’re ruled by people either stupid or evil. From the left we’re ruled by people either corrupt or naïve.
I’m a Gen Xer, so remember how the USSR was viewed with contempt, fear, but also respect. You didn’t push unnecessarily. When we did we came really close to burning everything down. It was a grand chess game. When they collapsed, Russia became a mocked, “gas station masquerading as a country”. That may have been true for 5 minutes; nobody says that now. They’re back, and they’ve got a lot of the world on their side.
Victoria Nuland was right, btw. The EU is about to be f*cked.
My bet is that nukes get used before Russia concedes defeat and goes home in shame.
I think so too. This is an existential war for Russia, and a lark for the US.
Davis
I think that also, but will it escalate? Many of those pushing this war are chickenshits, and don’t want to lose it all.
Glad to see so many “Canadians” willing to fight Russia to the last Ukrainian. What are Canada’s strategic interests in Ukraine? There are none. Canada has no business in Ukraine and no business taking sides. The only rational stance is neutrality, NATO and the 4th Reich…er, EU be damned. While we’re at it, time to quit NATO.
And if we did you would be saying “Canada is only helping Ukraine because of….”
Nice non-answer, dimwit. Try again.
“… bloodying and defeating more technologically advanced armies has been a hallmark of Russian civilization for 600 years.”
Yes… except when it isn’t. Russia has lost a LOT of historical wars in that period.
Make broad sweeping claims, get broad sweeping comebacks.
What Russia does have going for it is it is big and it has had for a long time a vast pool of lower class type to throw into uniform.
Take the Russian-Japanese War in 1904-05. Russia lost nearly ever single battle. They lost Port Arthur. They lost the Pacific Fleet. They sent a Second Pacific Fleet and lost that in one of the most decisive naval battles in history. If aircraft were mature as a weapon they would have probably had most of them shot down as well. Yet come the peace talks they managed to avoid having to give Japan a scrap more than they had already lost and, to some extents, won the peace talks. Sure there were riots back in Russia but basically Russia shrugged off the losses and by 1914 was again considered one of THE top powers in the world.
This however does not work forever. How did Russia become the Soviet Union for example? Something to do with the working class deciding the Tsar Class (for want of a term) were not acting in their best interests and simply sending them to die at the front?
History of Russia and the people who lived in ‘Russia’ is much more complex than a simple broad statement.