64 Replies to “A Doug Ford Poll Goes Horribly Wrong”
Just great Doug and good luck to you in cutting the politicians and the endless crap Toronto council wastes staggering amount on. My favourite was the council that wanted to extend the QUEEN ST. SUBWAY to Broadview and wasted 4 months discussing it.
Seriously? Queen St subway has stopped at Broadview since it was built. I guess non of them actually use it.
Umm, the Queen St subway consists of 2 partially completed stations, under Queen & Osgoode stations, and has been since it was cancelled decades ago (which I suspect was David’s point)
The Bloor-Danforth line however does go to Broadview.
Municipal governance exists at the purview of the Province’s. There used to be a time when the cities sent there bylaws and budgets to the local legislature for review.
Not completely surprised that the poll has gone against the conventional wisdom…
will be worth watching how it develops after SDA folks make their statement.
Do the people of Toronto know they pay for their representation by their hourly wage?
Would they like to reduce their taxes? or would they like to raise their taxes?
Something to consider carefully, when there is an other article at the CTV stating the people are cutting expenses in preparation of higher interest rates. They’re well aware that for each additional 1% of interest on a mortgage it will cost about $100. a month.
Taxes are similar. For every Liberal elected, it will cost you $ x / month. “Everyone” knows it.
Keep in mind as well—interest rates are being raised in hopes of engineering a financial crisis and overthrowing Donald Trump. The globalists are behind that too.
I can’t say I’m surprised. Doug Ford knows Toronto just as his brother did. 3:1 support is well beyond a super-majority. That’s why all the whining from politicians and media. They know that the voters are behind this, and that Ford’s electoral support in Toronto in the last provincial election was not an accident.
cgh: You are exactly right when the POLITICIANS and MEDIA whine you know you are the right track. GO FORD GO…GO FORD GO!!!
Very astute move by Ford. Ford 1, media/lefties 0 (actually at this point it is more like 5 to 0)
The first thing I thought when I read that the number of politicians were going to be reduced was the joke : What do you call 100 lawyers at the bottom of the ocean? A good start.
We are over governed, over regulated, over taxed so reducing the size of the political class is a good start. Ford is well within constitutional rights to do this and the biggest argument against is “the timing is unfair to the candidates “. Well, suck it up buttercup. Workers get right-sizing and unexpected shakeups without warning. Taxpayers get suprise tax increases without warning. Businesses get regulatory changes without warning. Why should the political class get immunity or special consideration?
“[The] biggest argument against is ‘the timing is unfair to the candidates’.”
Stop! Stop! I’ve just run out of tiny violins!
Oh, the humanity!
Experts and the media should tell unemployed politicians and their entourages that they should learn to code. If that advice is good for coal miners and manufacturing workers then it’s good for the political class too. /s
It was smart to use federal riding boundaries because it makes it difficult to credibly claim that the representation is unfair gerrymandering or undemocratic.
The only other argument is that the workload will be too much for 25 councillors. I doubt anyone who is employed will buy that argument considering how hard most employees work.
“The only other argument is that the workload will be too much for 25 councillors.”
I tell ya, there’s definitely a province-wide scarcity of teeny-tiny violins looming!
Since every Torontonian will still be represented by one councillor, one MPP and one MP, here’s a tip for the remaining councillors: concern yourself only with municipal issues that are within your purview and let the rest of the work go to the MPP and MP to deal with at the provincial and Federal level.
Of course, it’ll be difficult to give up all those big climate-change, gun-free-Canada, feed-the-world, no-nukes, solidarity-with-the-Palestinians issues that are so appealing yet so outside the municipal mandate to do anything about.
So, it’ll be down to all the routine, boring, unsexy transit, animal control, sewers, parking and by-law enforcement stuff that the councillors are actually elected to deal with.
LC, I agree with you on this. But there’s more. Toronto City Council is simply too large to function effectively. Any decision making body can’t function. The only way that national and provincial bodies and assemblies can work with hundreds in them is by being grouped into political parties and enforcing party discipline. But a group of hundreds with everyone holding their own views on things? Impossible. This is a major reason why the ancient Athenian direct democracy failed. A decision on anything could rarely be reached except after enormous and extended effort.
Yes, the ideal number of councillors is not necessarily determined by population. Every city needs a minimum number to be effective but a city 10x as big does not need 10x as many. Economies of scale should kick in. To put it in another context : if a business has 10 board of directors, no one thinks they’ll need 40 if the company grows 4x bigger. Having 40 Directors is not just unneccesary and needlessly expensive but it also makes decisions almost impossible, like you said. The inflated ego and ambition of a politician would amplify the problems of having too big of a group.
Another pet peeve is that city X has Y so we must as well. Keeping up with the Jones’s is as ridiculous for gov’t as it is for families.
When I practiced as a restaurant designer in the early 80’s, I remember presenting to the board of Canterbury Foods which owned a chain of restaurants called “The Round Table” (so long ago, I cannot remember accurately). There were over 40 people seating around the table. When I saw that group, I KNEW that the chain would be out of business within the year (it was). The successful restaurants with whom I worked only had 1 or 2 decision makers at the most. In the restaurant business, you have to be very flexible. EVen 5 (especially if they are members of a family) are way too many.
Yep, it reduces innovation and flexibility in a business. Another problem with large committees is that it diffuses responsibility and accountability. Often forming a committee to address an issue actually results in the committee itself being seen as the solution, positive results alleviating the initial problem is not required.
Agreed in full, BM.
LC, I’ve had a lot of experience running boards of directors over the past 30 years. In my experience, for an effective board, no more than about 15 is needed. Any more and it just becomes cumbersome with more debate but less effectiveness in making decisions. What is essential is that a board has all necessary fields of experience on it. Having more members simply dilutes that experience into background noise.
I’ve been in clubs and some people just can’t shut the Phuuk up. A half hour meeting last hours.
I used to have a sign in my office, it was a question. “Is this meeting necessary?”
It’d be interesting to see The Rebel’s Menzoid interview the Danforth Screamer lady from yesterday’s post on her opinion of how Doug Ford will ruin “her” Toronto.
Doug Ford certainly is ruining “her” Toronto.
And that’s a good thing.
Per NDP hellcat Andrea Horwath, Doug Ford is acting like a dictator. The only question now is whether he will be worse than Hitler.
Looks like Andrea has hired the noted publicist Hy Perbole and his team to deal with this issue.
The more melodramatic caterwauling Horwath comes up with, the more Ontario residents realize what a bullet they’ve just dodged by not electing the NDP.
“Per NDP hellcat Andrea Horwath, Doug Ford is acting like a dictator. …”
She had her heart set on acting that part, and she sincerely believes that she can play it better than anyone else.
Ha, all I can hear from these people is sheep bleating and crying that their right to gorge at the ‘golden taxpayer trough’ is being taken away.
Thank you Doug Ford, and that’s from way over in BC. I didn’t realize how desperate I was for a Canadian political leader that thought anything like me until you won your Premiership. As a Conservative in BC, I understand all too well what it must have been like to be a Conservative in Ontario these past years. Enjoy the ride!
I don’t need 45 leftoid Toronto City Council D-list wannabes lying to me about the causes of the major incidents of mass murder and attempted murder that have occurred in that city in the past four months, or of the major increase in violent crime there this year. Technically, I don’t even need 25, but it’s a start.
I also don’t need the Mayor treating the “asylum-seeker” crisis as simply a matter of appropriate accommodations and social assistance handouts for those arriving. These people need to be turned around and sent back to where they came from — i.e., the United States, which is not a country from which anybody needs “asylum”.
As he goes about muddying the waters on these issues, John Tory, who is a disgrace, parades around like it’s still his grandfather’s Toronto. Message to Hizworship: times have changed, old boy; the “fair-play” rules of the Upper Canada College sports pitch ain’t workin’ for ya’ no more.
I particularly resent the idea that Toronto is essentially somehow independent and on par with the rest of the Province — a veritable 11th province, in the eyes of the extreme left-wing proponents of this view: this canard has been gathering steam since the 1970s or earlier, and reached its full-blooming at the time of the rise in municipal politics of that Jack Layton. These people make it up as they go in support of their allegedly-justified ends: they’re like some of the deep-statist swamp dwellers in Washington who believe that the Justice Department and the FBI are an independent fourth branch of government.
Toronto City Council and Mayor Tory — as well as some of these regional municipalities — got exactly what they deserve, and I am very pleasantly surprised with the new government in general and over this particular bit of comeuppance that it is delivering. A great way to start the weekend!
“I particularly resent the idea that Toronto is essentially somehow independent and on par with the rest of the Province – a veritable 11th province, in the eyes of the extreme left-wing proponents of this view…”
Alas, the proponents of this view are woefully ignorant of their basic Canadian civics on two counts:
1. there are only 10 provinces (duh); and
2. Section 92 (8) of the Constitution Act gives those provinces full power over their municipalities.
Which means the Government of Ontario (i.e., Premier Doug Ford) has complete authority to organize municipalities as it sees fit.
I would very much like to see Toronto become a separate province. That single move would deny them access to taxes from the rest of Ontario and change the whole political balance here.
Well said.
It was a treat seeing (Calgary mayor) Nenshi’s hair on fire when commenting on Ford acting “like a tin-pot dictator”. He was apoplectic! Haven’t seen him so animated since a rookie councillor challenged him on one of his inane pontifications. Bring it on, Mr. Ford!
I suspect Neshi’s response is because he knows that the NDP will be ousted in the spring after the Alberta provincial election. Perhaps Neshi fears Jason Kenney is taking notes and watching voter’s reactions to Ford cutting councillors/saving money in a big city.
I confess I do not know Canadian laws at all. I believe that the U.S. is rather unique in that each jurisdiction is an independent entity, so that the federal government has no say in even how U.S. congressional districts are drawn by each state. And similarly the state government would have no say about city council districts. So I am somewhat mystified by what this is all about.
However, slightly changing the subject, to clarify, there are crimes that fall under federal jurisdiction. One of them is definitely being in the U.S. illegally. All declarations of “sanctuary cities or states” are ipso facto unconstitutional.
Municipalities in Canada are “Creatures of the Provinces”. Theoretically Premier Ford could disband the whole City Council and appoint Faith Goldy as Mayor and Ezra Levant as Council. But let’s not be giving him ideas. Theoretically.
Old Bruin:
I posted this excerpt from the Canadian constitution in an earlier thread on the issue. It might be of help to you:
“[H]ere’s the text of Section 92 (8) of the Constitution Act:
’92. In each Province the Legislature may exclusively make Laws in relation to Matters coming within the Classes of Subjects next hereinafter enumerated; that is to say,
Thank you, David. Christie hits all the key points out of the park. Her example of Facilities Management makes another critical point I missed. A larger, less effective governing body works in the self-interest of the bureaucracy. Which is why decades of corruption and incompetence resulted in nothing more than another audit to follow the audit which raised the issue in the first place. Christie is right; with too large a group, too much of the supposed discussion becomes performance art.
In fact even in the US, with a handful of exceptions, the cities and municipalities are creatures of the state, not independent entities.
The exception is cities that have been granted ‘Home Rule’ by their respective state.
This is good, but superficial compared to the real problem and arguably Harris’s worst blunder: amalgamation. No, it did not result in savings because GOVERNMENT IS NOT LIKE BUSINESS. Be the hero we deserve Premier Ford: reverse amalgamation! Fragmented government leads to better governance. Like in Victoria.
Yes, both the previous Ontario municipal amalgamation and reducing the number of Toronto councillors reflect Section 92 (8) of the Constitution Act.
In other words: the province giveth and the province taketh, as it were.
Correct.
I’d also add, parenthetically, in respect of OldBruin’s comment above, the U.S. constitution enumerates the powers/areas of jurisdiction of the national government, and reserves all other areas to the states, whereas the Constitution Act (British North America Act), 1867 enumerates the powers/areas of jurisdiction of both the national and provincial governments, and reserves all other areas to the national government.
Thank you, David and JJM.
I suspect that is common with most countries, to have a hierarchy of jurisdiction, dating back to when the king was omnipotent. But we never had a king, haha. Well, not unless you count Obama I.
You’re not a part of any “we” here.
No, it’s not superficial, UnMe. No problem with any corporation, government or private, can ever be fixed unless you address the governance issue first. I’ve been involved in several of these problems over the past three decades, and this is universally true. Read the Blatchford article David linked above. It outlines precisely a consequence of bad governance.
Maybe fewer councilors will make for better governance, but I doubt it. It’s less silly than firing the Hydro One board. That was completely pointless.
The abusive, self- serving Hydro One board was a disaster and needed to go. Getting rid of them was the right thing to do.
“It’s less silly than firing the Hydro One board. That was completely pointless.”
Well, he didn’t end up firing them, though he achieved the same effect.
Hardly pointless. A calculated political act. Like Jean Chrétien cancelling the CORMORANT helicopter, it was meant to send a message to the base.
And it did. At far less expense to the taxpayer than Chrétien’s action.
IOW, it was stupid and pointless. No ‘messages’ need to be sent at massive taxpayer cost. Just repeal the Green Energy Act and go.
IOW, as a hapless Ontario taxpayer and Hydro One “customer” myself, it works for me!
Somewhere out there, Mike Harris is smiling..
Government exists for itself. It will continually make itself bigger at the expense of the citizenry while telling them its for their own good. And one of the safest electable jobs there is – incumbent city councillor.
Hope Ford plays wack-phuck to Ottawa next. Bloated, money-burning, road-narrowing madness here.
Imagine that! Another supermajority rebuke of leftist policies. There just might be HOPE for Canadian CHANGE after all
Hmmmm? I went to vote on the survey and CTV tells me I already voted. Really? I haven’t been on SDA for a few days and this is the first I saw of their poll. Is CTV trying to limit the damage? That will take a while as the support for Ford was at about 92%
That’s okay. I voted twice.
Municipal councils work primarily only for the established national political parties, they are training grounds for activists on their way to Ottawa (the NDP being the major beneficiary). Any serious work is done by the municipal staff.
Mr Fords actions are therefore very welcome, to the over-burdened municipal taxpayers, and a major blow to the NDP. A two-fer-one.
“GLASNOST” 12:55 pm ………You swung for the fence and knocked it outta the park…..Next trudope the idiot …………………………..
This is a very good idea. A council of nearly 50 people each fighting for their own riding is totally unwieldy. They need a professional city management team, a modest 25 member council to set priorities city-wide and pass things as recommended by the management team. There are far better ways to govern than the existing. Ford reducing the size of council is a step in the right direction.
The tinpot dictator of Calgary accueses the Premier of Ontario as being a tinpot. Why does he need to look so far? How about his Precious Premier?
Yes, since when is there this cross contamination? What happened to sticking to one’s own knitting?
Yes, you might think that Nenshi – doubtlessly aware that his own city council is constitutionally subordinate to the Government of Alberta in exactly the same way as Toronto is to the Government of Ontario – would have clammed up and avoided drawing too much attention. Particularly with a looming provincial election that might return conservatives to power.
But no.
Further to my original post above, at 11:42 a.m., I’d refer readers to Rex Murphy’s devastating column of yesterday, July 27, 2018:
Mr. Murphy points directly to the behaviour of the Mayor, the Chief of Police (which organization he leads reports to, and is overseen by Toronto City Council) and Council itself.
My question is pretty simple: why did Mr. Ford decide to act precipitously on restructuring Toronto City Council, on the very eve of the start of a municipal election campaign period? I believe that the behaviour described by Mr. Murphy, along with Mr. Tory’s disturbingly maladroit and naive speech about guns, seemingly denying that there are very bad people, who don’t share our values, doing very bad things in Toronto (hence, my comment about “his grandfather’s Toronto”; heck, there was another incident last night in Etobicoke) were the deciding factors. I believe that Mr. Ford reached the breaking point on something he planned to do at a later date anyway.
I’d note also Mr. Murphy’s discussion of some of the mental health concerns, or as I would call it, the “psychiatrization” of criminal behaviour. This is a very big problem, at least in Ontario, now, and Mr. Ford’s government needs to drain that swamp, as well.
Anybody have a link to this poll? I’m not seeing it anywhere.
Just great Doug and good luck to you in cutting the politicians and the endless crap Toronto council wastes staggering amount on. My favourite was the council that wanted to extend the QUEEN ST. SUBWAY to Broadview and wasted 4 months discussing it.
Seriously? Queen St subway has stopped at Broadview since it was built. I guess non of them actually use it.
Umm, the Queen St subway consists of 2 partially completed stations, under Queen & Osgoode stations, and has been since it was cancelled decades ago (which I suspect was David’s point)
The Bloor-Danforth line however does go to Broadview.
Municipal governance exists at the purview of the Province’s. There used to be a time when the cities sent there bylaws and budgets to the local legislature for review.
Not completely surprised that the poll has gone against the conventional wisdom…
will be worth watching how it develops after SDA folks make their statement.
Do the people of Toronto know they pay for their representation by their hourly wage?
Would they like to reduce their taxes? or would they like to raise their taxes?
Something to consider carefully, when there is an other article at the CTV stating the people are cutting expenses in preparation of higher interest rates. They’re well aware that for each additional 1% of interest on a mortgage it will cost about $100. a month.
Taxes are similar. For every Liberal elected, it will cost you $ x / month. “Everyone” knows it.
Keep in mind as well—interest rates are being raised in hopes of engineering a financial crisis and overthrowing Donald Trump. The globalists are behind that too.
I can’t say I’m surprised. Doug Ford knows Toronto just as his brother did. 3:1 support is well beyond a super-majority. That’s why all the whining from politicians and media. They know that the voters are behind this, and that Ford’s electoral support in Toronto in the last provincial election was not an accident.
cgh: You are exactly right when the POLITICIANS and MEDIA whine you know you are the right track. GO FORD GO…GO FORD GO!!!
Very astute move by Ford. Ford 1, media/lefties 0 (actually at this point it is more like 5 to 0)
The first thing I thought when I read that the number of politicians were going to be reduced was the joke : What do you call 100 lawyers at the bottom of the ocean? A good start.
We are over governed, over regulated, over taxed so reducing the size of the political class is a good start. Ford is well within constitutional rights to do this and the biggest argument against is “the timing is unfair to the candidates “. Well, suck it up buttercup. Workers get right-sizing and unexpected shakeups without warning. Taxpayers get suprise tax increases without warning. Businesses get regulatory changes without warning. Why should the political class get immunity or special consideration?
“[The] biggest argument against is ‘the timing is unfair to the candidates’.”
Stop! Stop! I’ve just run out of tiny violins!
Oh, the humanity!
Experts and the media should tell unemployed politicians and their entourages that they should learn to code. If that advice is good for coal miners and manufacturing workers then it’s good for the political class too. /s
It was smart to use federal riding boundaries because it makes it difficult to credibly claim that the representation is unfair gerrymandering or undemocratic.
The only other argument is that the workload will be too much for 25 councillors. I doubt anyone who is employed will buy that argument considering how hard most employees work.
“The only other argument is that the workload will be too much for 25 councillors.”
I tell ya, there’s definitely a province-wide scarcity of teeny-tiny violins looming!
Since every Torontonian will still be represented by one councillor, one MPP and one MP, here’s a tip for the remaining councillors: concern yourself only with municipal issues that are within your purview and let the rest of the work go to the MPP and MP to deal with at the provincial and Federal level.
Of course, it’ll be difficult to give up all those big climate-change, gun-free-Canada, feed-the-world, no-nukes, solidarity-with-the-Palestinians issues that are so appealing yet so outside the municipal mandate to do anything about.
So, it’ll be down to all the routine, boring, unsexy transit, animal control, sewers, parking and by-law enforcement stuff that the councillors are actually elected to deal with.
LC, I agree with you on this. But there’s more. Toronto City Council is simply too large to function effectively. Any decision making body can’t function. The only way that national and provincial bodies and assemblies can work with hundreds in them is by being grouped into political parties and enforcing party discipline. But a group of hundreds with everyone holding their own views on things? Impossible. This is a major reason why the ancient Athenian direct democracy failed. A decision on anything could rarely be reached except after enormous and extended effort.
Yes, the ideal number of councillors is not necessarily determined by population. Every city needs a minimum number to be effective but a city 10x as big does not need 10x as many. Economies of scale should kick in. To put it in another context : if a business has 10 board of directors, no one thinks they’ll need 40 if the company grows 4x bigger. Having 40 Directors is not just unneccesary and needlessly expensive but it also makes decisions almost impossible, like you said. The inflated ego and ambition of a politician would amplify the problems of having too big of a group.
Another pet peeve is that city X has Y so we must as well. Keeping up with the Jones’s is as ridiculous for gov’t as it is for families.
When I practiced as a restaurant designer in the early 80’s, I remember presenting to the board of Canterbury Foods which owned a chain of restaurants called “The Round Table” (so long ago, I cannot remember accurately). There were over 40 people seating around the table. When I saw that group, I KNEW that the chain would be out of business within the year (it was). The successful restaurants with whom I worked only had 1 or 2 decision makers at the most. In the restaurant business, you have to be very flexible. EVen 5 (especially if they are members of a family) are way too many.
Yep, it reduces innovation and flexibility in a business. Another problem with large committees is that it diffuses responsibility and accountability. Often forming a committee to address an issue actually results in the committee itself being seen as the solution, positive results alleviating the initial problem is not required.
Agreed in full, BM.
LC, I’ve had a lot of experience running boards of directors over the past 30 years. In my experience, for an effective board, no more than about 15 is needed. Any more and it just becomes cumbersome with more debate but less effectiveness in making decisions. What is essential is that a board has all necessary fields of experience on it. Having more members simply dilutes that experience into background noise.
I’ve been in clubs and some people just can’t shut the Phuuk up. A half hour meeting last hours.
I used to have a sign in my office, it was a question. “Is this meeting necessary?”
It’d be interesting to see The Rebel’s Menzoid interview the Danforth Screamer lady from yesterday’s post on her opinion of how Doug Ford will ruin “her” Toronto.
Doug Ford certainly is ruining “her” Toronto.
And that’s a good thing.
Per NDP hellcat Andrea Horwath, Doug Ford is acting like a dictator. The only question now is whether he will be worse than Hitler.
Looks like Andrea has hired the noted publicist Hy Perbole and his team to deal with this issue.
The more melodramatic caterwauling Horwath comes up with, the more Ontario residents realize what a bullet they’ve just dodged by not electing the NDP.
“Per NDP hellcat Andrea Horwath, Doug Ford is acting like a dictator. …”
She had her heart set on acting that part, and she sincerely believes that she can play it better than anyone else.
Ha, all I can hear from these people is sheep bleating and crying that their right to gorge at the ‘golden taxpayer trough’ is being taken away.
Thank you Doug Ford, and that’s from way over in BC. I didn’t realize how desperate I was for a Canadian political leader that thought anything like me until you won your Premiership. As a Conservative in BC, I understand all too well what it must have been like to be a Conservative in Ontario these past years. Enjoy the ride!
I don’t need 45 leftoid Toronto City Council D-list wannabes lying to me about the causes of the major incidents of mass murder and attempted murder that have occurred in that city in the past four months, or of the major increase in violent crime there this year. Technically, I don’t even need 25, but it’s a start.
I also don’t need the Mayor treating the “asylum-seeker” crisis as simply a matter of appropriate accommodations and social assistance handouts for those arriving. These people need to be turned around and sent back to where they came from — i.e., the United States, which is not a country from which anybody needs “asylum”.
As he goes about muddying the waters on these issues, John Tory, who is a disgrace, parades around like it’s still his grandfather’s Toronto. Message to Hizworship: times have changed, old boy; the “fair-play” rules of the Upper Canada College sports pitch ain’t workin’ for ya’ no more.
I particularly resent the idea that Toronto is essentially somehow independent and on par with the rest of the Province — a veritable 11th province, in the eyes of the extreme left-wing proponents of this view: this canard has been gathering steam since the 1970s or earlier, and reached its full-blooming at the time of the rise in municipal politics of that Jack Layton. These people make it up as they go in support of their allegedly-justified ends: they’re like some of the deep-statist swamp dwellers in Washington who believe that the Justice Department and the FBI are an independent fourth branch of government.
Toronto City Council and Mayor Tory — as well as some of these regional municipalities — got exactly what they deserve, and I am very pleasantly surprised with the new government in general and over this particular bit of comeuppance that it is delivering. A great way to start the weekend!
“I particularly resent the idea that Toronto is essentially somehow independent and on par with the rest of the Province – a veritable 11th province, in the eyes of the extreme left-wing proponents of this view…”
Alas, the proponents of this view are woefully ignorant of their basic Canadian civics on two counts:
1. there are only 10 provinces (duh); and
2. Section 92 (8) of the Constitution Act gives those provinces full power over their municipalities.
Which means the Government of Ontario (i.e., Premier Doug Ford) has complete authority to organize municipalities as it sees fit.
I would very much like to see Toronto become a separate province. That single move would deny them access to taxes from the rest of Ontario and change the whole political balance here.
Well said.
It was a treat seeing (Calgary mayor) Nenshi’s hair on fire when commenting on Ford acting “like a tin-pot dictator”. He was apoplectic! Haven’t seen him so animated since a rookie councillor challenged him on one of his inane pontifications. Bring it on, Mr. Ford!
I suspect Neshi’s response is because he knows that the NDP will be ousted in the spring after the Alberta provincial election. Perhaps Neshi fears Jason Kenney is taking notes and watching voter’s reactions to Ford cutting councillors/saving money in a big city.
I confess I do not know Canadian laws at all. I believe that the U.S. is rather unique in that each jurisdiction is an independent entity, so that the federal government has no say in even how U.S. congressional districts are drawn by each state. And similarly the state government would have no say about city council districts. So I am somewhat mystified by what this is all about.
However, slightly changing the subject, to clarify, there are crimes that fall under federal jurisdiction. One of them is definitely being in the U.S. illegally. All declarations of “sanctuary cities or states” are ipso facto unconstitutional.
Municipalities in Canada are “Creatures of the Provinces”. Theoretically Premier Ford could disband the whole City Council and appoint Faith Goldy as Mayor and Ezra Levant as Council. But let’s not be giving him ideas. Theoretically.
Old Bruin:
I posted this excerpt from the Canadian constitution in an earlier thread on the issue. It might be of help to you:
“[H]ere’s the text of Section 92 (8) of the Constitution Act:
’92. In each Province the Legislature may exclusively make Laws in relation to Matters coming within the Classes of Subjects next hereinafter enumerated; that is to say,
8. Municipal Institutions in the Province.'”
For what this is all about, please see:
https://nationalpost.com/opinion/christie-blatchford-cutting-toronto-city-council-down-to-size-is-a-much-needed-jolt-to-democracy
This amplifies the argument cgh makes above.
Thank you, David. Christie hits all the key points out of the park. Her example of Facilities Management makes another critical point I missed. A larger, less effective governing body works in the self-interest of the bureaucracy. Which is why decades of corruption and incompetence resulted in nothing more than another audit to follow the audit which raised the issue in the first place. Christie is right; with too large a group, too much of the supposed discussion becomes performance art.
In fact even in the US, with a handful of exceptions, the cities and municipalities are creatures of the state, not independent entities.
The exception is cities that have been granted ‘Home Rule’ by their respective state.
This is good, but superficial compared to the real problem and arguably Harris’s worst blunder: amalgamation. No, it did not result in savings because GOVERNMENT IS NOT LIKE BUSINESS. Be the hero we deserve Premier Ford: reverse amalgamation! Fragmented government leads to better governance. Like in Victoria.
Yes, both the previous Ontario municipal amalgamation and reducing the number of Toronto councillors reflect Section 92 (8) of the Constitution Act.
In other words: the province giveth and the province taketh, as it were.
Correct.
I’d also add, parenthetically, in respect of OldBruin’s comment above, the U.S. constitution enumerates the powers/areas of jurisdiction of the national government, and reserves all other areas to the states, whereas the Constitution Act (British North America Act), 1867 enumerates the powers/areas of jurisdiction of both the national and provincial governments, and reserves all other areas to the national government.
Thank you, David and JJM.
I suspect that is common with most countries, to have a hierarchy of jurisdiction, dating back to when the king was omnipotent. But we never had a king, haha. Well, not unless you count Obama I.
You’re not a part of any “we” here.
No, it’s not superficial, UnMe. No problem with any corporation, government or private, can ever be fixed unless you address the governance issue first. I’ve been involved in several of these problems over the past three decades, and this is universally true. Read the Blatchford article David linked above. It outlines precisely a consequence of bad governance.
Maybe fewer councilors will make for better governance, but I doubt it. It’s less silly than firing the Hydro One board. That was completely pointless.
The abusive, self- serving Hydro One board was a disaster and needed to go. Getting rid of them was the right thing to do.
“It’s less silly than firing the Hydro One board. That was completely pointless.”
Well, he didn’t end up firing them, though he achieved the same effect.
Hardly pointless. A calculated political act. Like Jean Chrétien cancelling the CORMORANT helicopter, it was meant to send a message to the base.
And it did. At far less expense to the taxpayer than Chrétien’s action.
IOW, it was stupid and pointless. No ‘messages’ need to be sent at massive taxpayer cost. Just repeal the Green Energy Act and go.
IOW, as a hapless Ontario taxpayer and Hydro One “customer” myself, it works for me!
Somewhere out there, Mike Harris is smiling..
Government exists for itself. It will continually make itself bigger at the expense of the citizenry while telling them its for their own good. And one of the safest electable jobs there is – incumbent city councillor.
Hope Ford plays wack-phuck to Ottawa next. Bloated, money-burning, road-narrowing madness here.
Imagine that! Another supermajority rebuke of leftist policies. There just might be HOPE for Canadian CHANGE after all
Hmmmm? I went to vote on the survey and CTV tells me I already voted. Really? I haven’t been on SDA for a few days and this is the first I saw of their poll. Is CTV trying to limit the damage? That will take a while as the support for Ford was at about 92%
That’s okay. I voted twice.
Municipal councils work primarily only for the established national political parties, they are training grounds for activists on their way to Ottawa (the NDP being the major beneficiary). Any serious work is done by the municipal staff.
Mr Fords actions are therefore very welcome, to the over-burdened municipal taxpayers, and a major blow to the NDP. A two-fer-one.
“GLASNOST” 12:55 pm ………You swung for the fence and knocked it outta the park…..Next trudope the idiot …………………………..
This is a very good idea. A council of nearly 50 people each fighting for their own riding is totally unwieldy. They need a professional city management team, a modest 25 member council to set priorities city-wide and pass things as recommended by the management team. There are far better ways to govern than the existing. Ford reducing the size of council is a step in the right direction.
The tinpot dictator of Calgary accueses the Premier of Ontario as being a tinpot. Why does he need to look so far? How about his Precious Premier?
Yes, since when is there this cross contamination? What happened to sticking to one’s own knitting?
Yes, you might think that Nenshi – doubtlessly aware that his own city council is constitutionally subordinate to the Government of Alberta in exactly the same way as Toronto is to the Government of Ontario – would have clammed up and avoided drawing too much attention. Particularly with a looming provincial election that might return conservatives to power.
But no.
Further to my original post above, at 11:42 a.m., I’d refer readers to Rex Murphy’s devastating column of yesterday, July 27, 2018:
https://nationalpost.com/opinion/rex-murphy-tough-questions-need-answering-about-the-response-to-the-danforth-slaughter
Mr. Murphy points directly to the behaviour of the Mayor, the Chief of Police (which organization he leads reports to, and is overseen by Toronto City Council) and Council itself.
My question is pretty simple: why did Mr. Ford decide to act precipitously on restructuring Toronto City Council, on the very eve of the start of a municipal election campaign period? I believe that the behaviour described by Mr. Murphy, along with Mr. Tory’s disturbingly maladroit and naive speech about guns, seemingly denying that there are very bad people, who don’t share our values, doing very bad things in Toronto (hence, my comment about “his grandfather’s Toronto”; heck, there was another incident last night in Etobicoke) were the deciding factors. I believe that Mr. Ford reached the breaking point on something he planned to do at a later date anyway.
I’d note also Mr. Murphy’s discussion of some of the mental health concerns, or as I would call it, the “psychiatrization” of criminal behaviour. This is a very big problem, at least in Ontario, now, and Mr. Ford’s government needs to drain that swamp, as well.
Anybody have a link to this poll? I’m not seeing it anywhere.
the link:
https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/more/poll-results
6 to one in favour of Doug Ford.
hubba hubba.