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Until this moment I have been forced to listen while media and politicians alike have told me "what Canadians think". In all that time they never once asked.
This is just the voice of an ordinary Canadian yelling back at the radio -
"You don't speak for me."
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F-15E Strike Eagle is an all time outstanding air superiority fighter, so good choice and understandable coming from General Yeager.
The F35 program started in 1996 and aircraft have been produced since 2006. Just kill it. It is bureaucracy run wild. Just rearm with F15s, F16s, F18S and/or F22s and build the Marines a 3rd generation Harrier and start new programs that will actually produce production planes on schedule. Maybe each manufacturer should be funded for competing developments. Putting every wish into one plane seems to mean it will never be finished. Justin the Thick made one good decision – buying new F18s – just not enough.
ROTFLM@O!!!
I like Trump more every day!
If the F35 is cancelled the Royal Navy will have 2 of the biggest white elephants ever concieved on their hands,these 2 carriers have been designed to operate only STOL type aircraft principally the F35B The MOD decided not to fit catapults so no other aircraft apart from harriers of which the British have a grand total of none can take off or land safely,what a monumental cockup 6 billion pounds down the drainoh well at least it kept the Polish economy going for a while.
There are F-35s flying and gradually being integrated into service in U.S. and allied forces now.
Having a 5th generation stealth grade plane is to keep the edge on air superiority.
It’s called Pax Americana.
It is superiority that keeps the peace or can be a peace maker if needed.
It is a necessary part of the adage “Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum”.
Pres-elect Donald J. Trump is pressuring the manufacturer for a better price.
It’s called the Art of the Deal. Getting a better deal for citizens who pay for it.
That also gives the option of more F-35s for the same money, if needed.
Without F-35s, Canada will be shunted to a 2nd class status in NATO w/o them.
Another month of this … and Trump will have predicted my reaction precisely … I will already be soooooooo tired of WINNING all the time. I am getting there right now. And the contrast between Obama golfing on some “exclusive” Oahu course with his “celebrity” rapper buddies provides delicious irony and contrast. The organizer-in-chief has already become irrelevant-in-chief. The vacuum Trump is being sucked into is UUuuuuggeeee … even more UUuuuugge than my Dyson Ball can suck … and that thing sucks the chrome off your trailer hitch !!
Trump negotiates on Twitter: His administration will buy F-35s at a fraction of the price that Bammy paid.
He “liked” one of my tweets a couple weeks. The guy THAT FRIGGIN BROKE THE SOUND BARRIER LIKED ONE OF MY TWEETS!!! My whole life up until then was one giant disappointment. And the that happened. My whole changed. In an instant. Lol
…..my whole “life” changed that is. Heh.
Who are we kidding ourselves, Canada is a 3rd world power. NATO or not we just don’t have the resources.
Just one trip to a US base confirms this. YOu could shove the whole RCAF, planes, people and support items into one base and still have room left over for the Army.
Canada is so top heavy (just visit/work in Ottawa as I have)and you will see that there is almost as much striped shoulders running around as the Canadian Navy servicemen.
Will this change here? If Trudeau holds out on the F35 for F18, at least that is a step in the right direction, but as a poster said, not enough though.
HEck even with the F35 we wouldn’t have enough to protect this country, let alone someone elses…
Military aircraft references 2015
http://www.globalfirepower.com/aircraft-total.asp
Never mind pressuring the manufacturer for a better price, they need pressure to make things work as specified and on schedule.
And I don’t think not having F35s will raise Canada to second class status in NATO.
C’mon Kate.
Only one day left before Christmas and you’ve got the Armchair Air Marshalls all worked up.
I will be interested to see how the Israeli version of the F-35A works out. They intend serious modification. AND they have full control of their F-35s – whereas ours will be programmed over the Internet from a master computer in the US.
This of course means that the RCAF will fly missions that the US approves of, and that we will fight in ways that the Americans think meet.
“programmed over the Internet from a master computer in the US”
So that means Putin is in charge??
I notice that the total number of Russian military aircraft is not much greater than the intended F-35 build. So the Americans can afford to lose a lot of them.
It is not necessarily a good idea to take promotional literature at face value. For instance, the F-35 is “stealthy.” In detail, stealth from the front is good, from the sides not quite so good, and from the rear, not good at all.
Again, the Israeli F-35 may be fine for Israel, which is a small country, but its viability in a large country is unproved.
From my perspective, the F-35 models seem to be suffering from “F-111-itis”. That is not a complete failure – the F-111 was an effective strike bomber.
Thank you Larry. Ordering the Super Hornet would be like buying a modernized DC3 as a replacement for AF1. I hope Trump gets the proper briefings on this aircraft. He appears woefully misinformed at this time.
🙂 🙂 at least then the F-35s would be used vigorously against ISIS etc.!
At least the DC-3 WORKS! And as the F-35 seems to be intended to rely on its electronics countermeasures, maybe a DC-3 with modern engines and a modern full electronics suite might be a better solution. 🙂 :- ) I hope.
hey shammy, the F35 has a huuuge limitation as to Canada’s need, it is limited in it’s missle carrying capacity, if it carries a load the size the 18 can carry, stealth is out the window, it’s range is 2/3 of the 18, and with the buddy setup, even less. With what Canada’s needs stealth is not as important as the number of aircraft. Canada should have 250 to 300 air craft to be properly “equipped” for our defense, we have about 88 in service at the moment. Also the 18 carries stand off weapons, good for about 350 miles, so proper approach, and they could still surprise the enemy, without stealth. Stealth is almost a must for a country like Israel, but not Canada.
Yeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaah BABAY!
The public has no access to full info on the F-35, especially technological aspects and capabilities.
Therefore it is kinda foolish to play “armchair” procurement…
Canada, for instance should go ahead with those 18 (30 would be better IMHO) super Hornet BUT should get 12 super advance types which is a gen 4.5 (with some stealth) and 6 others pre-plugged for Growler variant (EW). We should also go ahead with the F-35 however with 36 or so. Canada probably does not need a full stealth aircraft. Why? Stealth implies to fly deep into enemy territory w/o being seen on radar. I can’t recall why Canada needs to be the invader…
Great. I bought some Lockheed Martin a little while ago, figuring defence+U.S. economy should stand me in good stead.
What a difference a tweet can make! Ah well, I have faith that in the longer term it will still be a good decision!
So no collective defense, no international operations; no killing terrorist scumbags there instead of hem killing us here. Please no more bilge about shooting down bombers coming over the horizon. No stealth doesn’t just mean incursions, it also means operating in robust, even stealthy air defense environments, it means blasting Super Hornet clones out of the sky who don’t even know it’s there, it means dealing with and staying ahead of Russian and Chinese stealth development. You drop it now, they go ahead.
They seem quite interested in the technology, given, especially the Chinese who are building a cheap copy of the F35.
Imply all you want about our future operation may or may not involve, isn’t our job equipping our military with the best equipment possible, given the wide array of tasks that will be required and the long time we must operate these systems? Why would we buy them horse and buggy technology, unable to communicate with our allies, virtually all of them with F35s?
Maybe this will help in the deliberations.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/f-35.htm
BTW WRT costs, maybe if Lockheed and the US government, along with ours, hadn’t swallowed the early estimates of costs, which were ridiculously low, given the life cycle cost of a Super Horner and similar 4th gen aircraft is about $300m a copy. The F35 is not perfect by any means, but it is by far the best bang for the buck right now. No 4th generation aircraft comes close, comparatively or tactically.
What is it you think fighters actually do these days? Shoot down Bears? Dogfight? No for the most part they drop bombs and missiles on things and people. Anyway, if we don’t buy the F35, there’s still no sense whatsoever in buying an another obsolete airframe, as with the Cyclone marine helicopter.
This kind of help the government is giving our military is a big part of what gets them killed.
You are absolutely right but please recognize who you are arguing against. I tried to point out to him shortcomings of the SuperStopgap (which USN never wanted in the first place and which exists only because what USN wanted got canceled), but you may aw well argue with a not particularly bright brick wall.
Coincidently, I think a second look at Typhoon might be in order. Also at the very least, F-15E does everything SuperStopgap does, but better.
Without F-35s, Canada will be shunted to a 2nd class status in NATO w/o them.
2nd would be a huge improvement from Canada’s current position of number 5 or 6.
I am arguing against the idea of buying any new 4th gen fighter for any reason, as a stop gap, as a 1st line fighter, as anything but a giant waste of money on obsolete incapability going forth. Any 4th gen aircraft is prohibitively expensive, even compared to the F35. The Typhoon is no different in that regard.
If there is some way to buy used 4th gen fighters, without the sub disaster (Chretien let them sit in salt water for 18 months while he dithered), it would still be a waste of money but might leave the door open for a subsequent 5th gen purchase, which would be obviated by the Super Hornet purchase.
This government created the capability gap they claim needs closing; wasting our money and our military’s capability, again, for their own political ends.
As Jack Granatstein correctly opined in his fine book “Who Killed the Canadian Military?,” we all did; politicians of all stripes, a moronic media and an ignorant public, the latter now thankfully seeing value from the fine work and tremendous challenges our military undertakes in our name.
Rent, don’t buy.
Negotiation is what I was going to mention also. You should not take Trump literally. He is often taking a strong position (sometimes seen as unreasonable) that will help him gain the upper hand in a negotiation.
Maybe Trump remembers what blank cks issued to the defense bureaucracy produce.
Remember those infamous 10.00 hammers that quickly found a new cost level at 100.00.
Chuck Yeager is 93 years old and a living legend. How many nonagenarians have Twitter accounts?
I qÂÂÂuiÂÂÂÂÂet mÂÂÂy oÂÂÂfÂÂÂfÂÂÂiÂÂÂcÂÂÂe jÂÂoÂÂb aÂÂnÂÂd nÂÂoÂÂw I aÂÂm gÂÂeÂÂtÂÂtÂÂiÂÂnÂÂg pÂÂÂaÂÂiÂÂd 126 DÂÂoÂÂlÂÂlÂÂaÂÂrÂÂs hÂÂoÂÂuÂÂrÂÂlÂÂyÂ. HÂoÂÂwÂÂ? I ÂwÂÂoÂÂrÂÂk-oÂÂÂÂvÂÂÂeÂÂÂr ÂÂiÂÂnÂÂtÂÂÂeÂÂrÂÂnÂÂetÂÂ! ÂÂMÂÂy oÂÂlÂÂd wÂÂoÂÂrÂÂk ÂÂwÂÂaÂÂs mÂÂaÂÂkiÂÂng ÂÂmÂÂe mÂÂiserÂÂableÂ,ÂÂÂsÂÂo I ÂÂwÂÂaÂÂs fÂÂoÂÂrÂÂcÂÂeÂÂÂd tÂÂo tÂrÂy-sÂoÂmÂÂeÂtÂhÂiÂÂnÂg dÂÂiÂfÂfÂeÂÂrÂeÂnÂÂtÂ. Â4 ÂyÂeÂaÂÂrÂs aÂfÂÂtÂeÂr. Â.Â.I ÂcÂaÂn ÂsÂaÂy ÂmÂy ÂlÂiÂfÂe ÂiÂs ÂcÂhÂÂaÂnÂgÂeÂÂd ÂcÂoÂmÂpÂÂlÂeÂtÂeÂÂlÂy ÂfÂoÂÂr tÂhÂe bÂeÂÂtÂtÂeÂÂrÂ! CÂhÂeÂÂcÂk iÂÂt ÂoÂuÂt ÂwÂhÂÂaÂt ÂÂi dÂÂo..
GOOD LUCK…………… http://tiny.cc/y0a9ey
the Canadian military has become a bloated bureaucracy just like every other government department. Fort Drum in upstate NY has more military resources than the entire Canadian military.
shammy, and COLON, context is always you lefties shortfall. Canada’s chance of encountering Russian or Chinese stealth here at home are about zero to fuckall. As to over the horizon, more bullshit, as it is the same scenario for any defensive air interdiction. Do you think that china or Russian will use bombers to tow fighters over here, kinda like putting the race car on a trailer. Gawd people like you and COLON are stupid. the proper defense for over the cap (northpole) are missiles, and the USA has that covered. Because of Canada’s size, the number of competent air craft is the more important factor. If you haven’t got the planes in the right locations, their capabilities are a mute point, and that is the fact. Glad they don’t have assholes like you as annalysts.
BTW, Khadafy learned this lesson when he sent his tanks into Sudan
You can make a valid argument for or against any combat aircraft.
The question that decides on what to buy is what are you going to use it for?
The caveat is when the term “multi purpose” is used. Thats the red flag to indicate nobody that will actually be involved in the use of said aircraft had any input on the decision.
For Canada’s need, I would want something that is useful in a close air support role to keep the guys on the ground protected and keep the bad guys looking over their shoulder.
We should go the way of New Zealand, just get rid of any combat capability.
Surrender now.
That is the policy of the Liberal party.
And after a couple more years of their fine fiscal management, we will be happy to surrender to anyone who will have us.
Joseph: “For Canada’s need, I would want something that is useful in a close air support (CAS) role to keep the guys on the ground protected and keep the bad guys looking over their shoulder.”
Agreed. Helicopters and C130 gunships do a fine job of that. The Americans used B52s for CAS, loitering nearby, on call to deliver precision armaments.
Many aircraft can do that valuable mission, including btw the CF35. Fighters don’t need to get nearly as close as in the past to protect ground troops.
No I don’t work for Lockheed, I just want the military to get the best equipment available instead of being saddled with expensive, obsolete crap.
You call others lefties when you clearly haven’t a clue what you’re talking about, which your blathering about the roles of fighters demonstrates clearly.
What an asshole you are, along with your Jooo hating bigotry. WTF does Libya have to do with F35s?
Didn’t you pull this similar non sequitur stupidity last Christmas?
Go have a drink, or not have a drink, depending on what causes your ignorant and bigoted outbursts.
Merry Christmas you idiot.
See? Told you.