I’m almost positive this isn’t about the Senate audit and trying to distance the soon to be jailed from the “Liberal” trademark. </sarc>
That said, good, but surprises are not good in politics, ever.
I’m almost positive this isn’t about the Senate audit and trying to distance the soon to be jailed from the “Liberal” trademark. </sarc>
That said, good, but surprises are not good in politics, ever.
I smell a major money scandal from a lib or there’s video of a lib senator having his way with an Aardvark..
Like I have said, “unelectable.” He has just pissed off all his Liberal Senators, and his base in Quebec who love the senate. What did he gain? Nothing. Nobody is dumb enough to say this is a realistic plan and it just makes him look like he hasn’t a damn clue about our system of government.
What a moron. I can only wonder how bad the audit is if he was forced to do this.
He can kiss a lot of fundraising good bye now that he has just blown up his Quebec base.
Little Justin has now demonstrated that he’s Big Justin, the guy who’s not afraid to take Big Steps and make Bold Moves that Fix Things.
But what has he really, physically -done- here? Nothing at all, really. He’s making his Senators “sit as independents” in what is really nothing more than a cheap shot at the Prime Minister. The Senators are supposed to be “outside the Liberal caucus” with this move.
Sure. They’re “independent” now. Uh huh.
Even granting that, what would it take to have them back into the caucus again? I’m thinking one phone call would do it. Maybe an email.
Nice gesture though.
The 32 Liberal Senators are now the LINO caucus, Liberals Intentionally Named Other…
“..He’d appoint only independent senators after employing an open, transparent process, with public input, for nominating worthy candidates — much the way recipients of the Order of Canada are chosen.”
“much the way recipients of the Order of Canada are chosen”
You couldn’t make this stupidity up.
I’ll bet no one from the CBC or CTV will pick that one up and run with it.
At the very least, Harper and the Conservative majority in the senate need to play along and take away the budgets and privileges of the former Liberal caucus.
In men’s beer league hockey people commonly say “Age and cunning will always defeat youth and speed.”
I can’t wait to see the age and cunning of all these bushwhacked Liberal senators come back to haunt young, speedy JT when he needs them in an election campaign or fundraising or God forbid a unity referendum.
Nice work, son, nice work.
Like his hero in the great republic to our South, the Shiny Pony has proven insecure and sensitive to criticism. One has to wonder if this is not just a juvenile fit of spite, perhaps because the Liberal “School of Second thought” has had the audacity to point out how shallow the new Sun King’s apparent popularity is, and suggest that he has a lot to learn and even more real grunt work to do if the Liberals under the Shiny Pony are to avoid following the Conservatives to the oblivion first achieved under the blonde bimbo. As unhappy as I am with the free ride Trudeau has been getting, I remain confident that he would wilt like ice in August when the election is called and a serious examination of personalities and positions occurs.
Maybe Justin’s hidden agenda (far be it for the media to harp on the fact that he hasn’t an open one) is to duplicate the vacuum that gave Stephan Harper a platform, and complete his father’s work consolidating all his Marxist fellow travelers in a comfortable amalgamation of “the left” in an NDP home.
For about ten years now I’ve been of the opinion that provincial Lt-Governor’s, one year after retiring from their ceremonial duty, be appointed to the Senate.
my comments from the G&M:
Be wary of short term political gains, for long term political pains.
Trudeau’s maneuver is a significant gamble with potential for positive reaction from Canadians. Kudos to Trudeau for being assertive!
That said, the political risks are high for Trudeau; as unintended political consequences will no doubt arise. My initial instincts are that in the case where Trudeau does becomes Prime Minister, he would be unable to tilt the balance back to Liberal in the Senate; effectively neutering the Liberal government for the long haul. Perhaps, if he was POTUS he could issue an Executive Order (eh?); but I digress. haha
There is absolutely no way the Conservatives will follow suit. I wouldn’t. So, that begs the question “in the future, might Trudeau have to renege on this policy, as the result is a perpetual Tory majority in the Senate?”.
I suspect today, Liberals will be thinking “halleluiah, what a great plan!”; when in fact, they are akin to a starving man(policy wise), celebrating the prospects of some rotten bread(this shortsighted feel-good policy).
Reminds me of a Communist purge. We know JT and his father certainly idolize communist leadership. The most ardent supporters are usually the first ones snuffed.
Wait for Senators to start vanishing in the night.
my second comment @ g&M:
For the Record, Reformers(western Canadians) have been screaming for Senate Reform since the 1980s.
Perhaps, just perhaps, had the Liberal governments of the time had some foresight, and not done exactly what PMSH is accused of(politicking); we might not be in this Constitutional Crisis today.
In reality, this mess is the Liberals to wear; as they have ALWAYS been the ONLY foil to serious reform of the Senate.
It’s just a tactic, but one that will play well to Justin’s supporters.In their minds, Justin “has done something” about all the problems in the Senate,and Harper has done nothing.
Liberals will be in full swoon over this. I agree with above comments that the audits must be going wrong for Liberal Senators, as this move was from out of left field.
Justin has some very good people teaching him to walk, politically speaking. On his own he’d never have come up with an idea like this.
Window dressing for window shoppers.
It does look like a “Hail Mary Pass.” That audit should be hilarious.
True, if you discount NDP Premiers.
You see, it’s up to the Premiers of Canada’s several provinces to have senatorial elections to coincide with regular provincial elections, as Ralph Klein did, in order to advance senate reform and make the senate an elected institution.
Justin Trudeau still wants the power to appoint senators. Why?
Because appointing senators is how the LPC has traditionally rewarded it’s loyal foot soldiers across this nation.
Now if JT wants real senate reform, he’d cut the provincial wings of the Liberal party off from the national party in provinces they rule for failing to advance senate reform through elections.
Ontario comes to mind…
That’s all it would take before the citizens of all provinces would be clamoring for senate elections in their provinces, regardless of which party runs their province.
His very own “Just Watch Me” moment.
The Senate is a Very Good Idea in our constitutional structure, if only because in its current condition it stands as an example of what can become of a Very Good Idea when it is left in the hands of a government.
“Just Watch Me” movement
To my mind this is just putting lipstick on a pig (pun intended)
Personally I’d like to see a Senate appointed much like a jury – i.e., picked at random from the phone book.
And just like a jury to be vetted and accepted by both her Majesty’s government and her Royal opposition to ensure their objectivity. Eligibility, term and representation by population might complicate things, not to mention the constitutional hurdles.
Makes more sense to me than a politically appointed or an elected senate.
If put to a referendum I think this idea might get support.
Or should we just rid ourselves of this anachronism?
What a joke.
Chance of any Liberals being appointed to the Senate as long as the CPC is in power is zero. So what exactly was Turdeau trying to do other than put a democratic twist on things. Commit to an elected Senate by accepting public votes like Alberta.
The Chamber of sober second thought is a joke as well as many are not sober. The Liberal history of appointing hacks far exceeds anything that PMSH could ever think of. Supposedly Harper appointed only those prepared to step down if elected Senates were brought in. Why not a undated resignation letter so that they could be outed.
The power of the Canadian government is in the Commons not the Senate. Cut the number of Senators down to 2 per provinces of consequence. Perhaps on a per capita weighting. 1 per million citizens, 35 Senators. Done!
PM Harper is expected to declare that all Conservative senators will now be called NDP senators.
Justin will be upset because he knows that will not change anything.
Everyone else will just smile.
“Personally I’d like to see a Senate appointed much like a jury – i.e., picked at random from the phone book.
And just like a jury to be vetted and accepted by both her Majesty’s government and her Royal opposition to ensure their objectivity.”
If they’re going to be vetted, what is the point of selecting them at random? Seems like a recipe for a royal clusterf**k and expensive waste of time to me.
But then your real goal is to eliminate the senate, isn’t it?
Albertans want a genuine check on the PMO’s power.
Triple E senate.
“Makes more sense to me than a politically appointed or an elected senate.”
Being elected confers democratic legitimacy on the power which comes with the seat.
I bet you didn’t know that or if you did, democratic legitimacy means little to you.
agreed
it would be nice if someone would remind the folks that a) the liberals have stonewalled all forms of senate reform; and b) liberals demanded deficit spending during coup scam. it is ridiculous, but predictable, that liberals are now considered the party of fiscal prudence and senate reform.
I like the move by the Libs … but giving the ponce credit for it is a joke. No way in this world or the next that empty head came up with the idea.
What the libs did here is typical socialist slash and burn. Right out of Marx, Lenin, Stalin, Mao, and all the rest. A sure indicator of what they would like to do to everyone who gives them grief. Now they won’t have to listen to any of the old gasbags in policy meetings (in theory). I’ll bet that there will be long knives coming out that will find there way into the exposed back of the LPC.
PM Harper need do nothing but wait out the audits and boot any Conservative Senators who get busted.
Shiny Pony just proved that while you “can walk like a duck, talk like a duck and look like a duck” but if I say that you’re not a duck then you’re not a duck.
A lot of senators were party bagmen, with financially lucrative contacts in the business community. Where are the bags of money supposed to come from now? Trudeau is unbelievably stupid.
I read the Lying Jackal so you don’t have to: he’s against it.
Which means, of course, that its probably a good idea…
You do realize that Papa Jean Cretin outlawed bagmen and contributions from corporations, don’t you? So those Lieberal bagmen in the Senate have no useful function any longer. JT can afford to piss them off.
He’s still an idiot, though.
I’m not convinced that the flaws of majoritarian democracy can be resolved with “more democracy”. We need to think more about an alternative. The founding fathers (USA) sort of had it right.
They envisaged a constitutional republic which would establish the rule of law. They never intended the rule of the majority.
Perhaps a constitutional republic with limited government is not possible to maintain because of the inexorable pressure to increase the size and scope of government. We have seen in the US how quickly the constitution which sought to establish the rule of law has been eviscerated to become a self-serving “tyranny of the articulate” and their sycophants.
You confuse the ‘Rule of the Majority’ with ‘Rule by Consent’.
How is the consent of the ruled sought if not by election, eh?
Your first idea, picking at random and then vetting is asinine.
Then you state that your asinine idea is more sensible than appointment or election.
Now you assert that somehow picking at random is better even than ‘Rule of the Majority’.
I don’t think you understand even what ‘Rule of the Majority’ means and how it differs from an election.
By the way, Switzerland has the closest system to ‘Rule of the Majority’ and they have a far more successful nation than the U.S.A. which I have never held in as much esteem as many Americans have.
“The founding fathers (USA) sort of had it right.”
They sort of had it wrong, too.
Biggest flaw in the American system is the ability of Presidents and Governors to completely pardon criminals who have been convicted by a jury of their peers in a court of law.
Few Kings have ever had that kind of raw unbridled power and it undermines the Rule of Law and the Constitution itself.
Nah you all misunderstand this move.
Just-in shrank the Libtard caucus to its all time smallest size(next a pair of chairs?)
Not to avoid any connection to the nest of professional parasites at the Senate, that is too logical.
He actually shrank the caucus cause he can only bear to listen to views identical to his own.
His ultimate caucus is a caucus of one.
He’s so pretty vacant.
Nothing has changed. The ex-liberal senators will still vote as a block and act as liberal functionaries. As Pierre Polievre quipped, the only thing different is that the Liberal senators will not have to get up early for the weekly Liberal caucus meeting.
Harper is the only PM to appoint elected senators. He is also the only PM to look to the supreme court to find a way around the ridiculous amending formulas we are stuck with thanks to Justin’s daddy.
I hope I am wrong but I think this another ‘look a squirrel’ moment from Justin along the lines of his comments about pot. The media will give him multiple tongue baths and low information voters will think he has done something substantive. As I have said before, Junior has great handlers but they may have jumped the shark here.
If some of ex-liberal senators come out of the upcoming audit looking a little crooked, this could very well be seen as a very cynical move. Secondly, Harper could move to act more strongly on an elected senate and outflank Junior on this issue. Along the way he will be sure to point out that Junior voted down a bill that Mulchair proposed last fall and still wants to appoint senators. So now instead of having an elected PM appointing senators, we will have a star chamber appointing and vetting senators. What could go wrong?
Justin and company seem to forget they’re the third party in the HOC. Actually the media maggots also forget that little detail.
#1 in entertainment value though…
lol!!! What a dope! Tiny brained nauseatingly arrogant Justy waves his magic wand and presto Liberal Senators are no longer Liberal Senators… why, how… because Justy says so, thats why. This cynical stunt is nothing more than getting out in front of the AG’s audit which will be damning for the Liberals, plain and simple. Who leaked the AG’s report to the Liberal backroom boys? How will the Justine media spin this ridiculously useless stunt so as to blame Liberal corruption and Justine’s stupidity on “Harper”? Pathetic! Maybe little Justy can wave his magic wand and declare the Adscam Liberals are now “independent” Adscammers not to be referred to as Liberals anymore. The Justine media have their work cut out for them… spin boys spin. LOL!!!
There’s a chance the dauphin realized how many years of a CPC-dominated senate he’d be facing even if he got in tomorrow and decided to try and blow it up instead. Or he realizes the government is waiting for the Supreme Court reference and wants to look like he was ahead of the changes that will happen then.
I say, Holmes. There are no longer Liberals in the Senate. There is now a group of freshmen, the Independent Not Liberals, the INL party you might say. They are all Liberals, and have voted to maintain the same organization. Holmes, do you not think this might have something to do with the Auditor’s Report?
Ah yes, Watson, the Mysterious Case of the Disappearing Liberals.
No reason to re-invent the wheel here. The Americans set up their Senate to have representation FROM the Several States TO the Federal Government, a voice from fly-over country as it were and one with veto power over the excesses of the House. The 13th Amendment appealed to the urge to be democratic however ugly the (unintended) consequences but shifted the role of the Senate, to one of a Federal impetus, no longer representing the States interests. As attractive as an elected Senate is, to truly defend the best interests of the Provinces in Confederation, Senators appointed by the Several Legislatures would be a powerful voice from outside the Ottawa-Toronto corridor. Adding a provision that the person selected by the elected Members of the Legislatures must have been re-elected at least once in the Province they would represent, be it Hamlet, Village, Town, City, or Rural Municipality, or even the Legislatures themselves, would see only previously-voter-approved politicians ascend to the Red Chamber.
justin said the senate keeps his Quebec in power and he wants that
What do you get when you choose a wannabea actor (aka part time failed drama teacher) to lead your political party? Drama! After all everyone knows drama sells better than policy.
Or his “Your time is up!” moment. This has to be ticking some Liberals off.
This little trick has to be about a hand in the cookie jar moment. Nothing else makes sense.
I think this business is a recognition on the part of the Liberals that Mr. Trudeau, Jr. is running for next time: you can’t really beat Stephen Harper’s strategy, whatever you do, of throwing it over to the SCOC for an opinion, in much the same way Mr. Harper forced the issue, in advance, on the Clarity Act.
Mr. Trudeau, Jr. is a case study, at this point: if he opens his mouth, he loses; if he closes his mouth, he loses. Everybody knows that.
Well, now that the Liberal senators are now ex-Liberal senators, that means they will be free to vote their conscience, which means that at least some of them should vote with the Conservatives on each issue, right?
I kid, I kid.
This smacks of a young man’s arrogance and haste. I suspect Justin’s brother, Sasha, talked him into this. Justin will repent at leisure while his brother indulges in even more bizarre utopian fantasies at taxpayer expense.
A newly independent senator is still a Liberal senator. If this transparent move doesn’t raise the red flags about a party that won’t reform or abolish the Senate or punish its wayward senators, that rewards its crony friends (ie- AdScam) or continues running a senator who is noncompos mentis, then I just don’t know.
David, are suggesting that Justin is a loser? 😉
Why would the (ex-)Liberal Senators be ticked at Justin? They’re still Senators, still collecting the same paycheque, still accruing the same pension, still members of the Liberal Party, still have the same connections they ever had — but now they no longer have to attend Liberal caucus meetings and listen to boneheads like Carolyn Bennett or Hedy Fry or Ruby Dhalla or Justin. Why would they be miffed? In fact, how do we know this isn’t originally their idea even?
I do acknowledge that this indicates there probably is some juicy stuff in that audit.
Is this any way to make a quasi-constitutional decision? I can see arguments in favor of having senators caucus separately from MPs. Let’s assume it is the finest and most flawless idea ever in Canadian history. Even then, how can it be good practice to implement the policy in the same speech as you introduce the idea.
Are there no adults left in the Liberal party?
” In fact, how do we know this isn’t originally their idea even?”
Could they possibly be that sneaky ???
I think that a royal commission parliamentary public inquiry should be convened immediately.