Well, that’s the basic mode of the left; they live in a fictional world.
They focus within a fictional utopianism of socialism, which reduces people to serfs living under the government-as-Lord. That’s right; in the socialist ideal, people are similar to the serfs of the medieval era and the gov’t is the Lord of the Manor. The serfs couldn’t be removed from their homes, and the Lord was obliged to protect them. The socialist welfare state is similar; guarenteed housing and services by the state. Of course, they ‘toil’ but in menial, no brain tasks (that’s our civil service and union protected jobs).
That’s why the left is aligned with islamic fascism; it’s also a fictional world, focused on the Original Purity of, also, a medieval era.
Fictions are irrelevant. We have to focus on reality. Israel exists. But so do Palestinians – despite many who deny the name of Palestine, deny that there are ‘any Palestinians..they are really Jordanians’. etc.
Both exist. Both require national states. Israel’s error, I feel, was to first, in 1948, hope that the Palestinians would be absorbed by the other arab states, and, second, occupy the lands and settle them, and third, with regard to the Oslo Accord, to offer them only municipal governance.
The Arab error was basic – first, to refuse to recognize Israel. That’s Arafat’s legacy; he wanted to retain power and he’d lose it in a genuine Palestinian state. And second, to retain tribalism and a peasant economy rather than move into industrialism. Israel was, right from the start, an industrial state and a democracy. It didn’t fit in with the Arab infrastructure – and the Arab infrastructure should have been changed. Their refusal to change it – has led to islamic fascism.
But I don’t think that the current situation is about Israel-Palestine. It’s about Iran. Totally about Iran.
Iran wants to take over the ME. It doesn’t want any democracy in the area and is fighting, along with Al Qaeda, to retain tribalism. Al Qaeda began as a mov’t to retain tribalism in Saudi Arabia, then, morphed into a populist ideology of pathological tribalism – islamic fascism. Iran is using it and is using the Israel-Palestinian situation to destabilize the ME, and try to emerge as the Empire of the ME.
It is having trouble with its agenda of destabilization. It doesn’t want Iraqi democracy and is, with Syria, behind the insurgency there. It’s not working. Iraq is still there, shaky, but getting stronger all the time.
Iran has tried to get the West to attack, re the nuclear taunts, the holocaust taunts. Hasn’t worked.
So, it’s now moved into the Israeli-Palestinian area – to try to get the West to attack.
Bush has just, wisely, said that he supports Israel and is not going to interfere. That is, the US isn’t moving into the area – which is what Iran wants.
This is my speculation – I’m still puzzled by what Iran hopes to get out of a war with the West. That’s what I don’t understand. And, how Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Egypt and Iraq will respond.
imagine.
anthem for the humanists.
things dont look too good at the present time eh?
Read this at LG the other day. Take a minute to stop there: littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog
All I can say is LET THE CRUSADES BEGIN AGAIN!
whether the stick their heads up their individual or collective arse ends or find a hole and use that to bury their heads, they are all pathetically unable or unwilling to accept and handle reality.
They are like kids hanging on to a belief in Santa Claus because the promise is so wonderful. They just can’t handle reality becasue it can be so brutal.
So we’ll have to do it for them.
Go Israel, go. Clean out the puss from the wound, once and for all so you can live in Peace.
Iran wants to be the mover and shaker in the Arab world. Anyone aspiring to be king of the militant Death Cult can only be the most irrational.
Pushing and hoping to snare Israel into a broader war, I think, is their goal. Maybe they are trying to galvinize the Arab street. Never forget that losing a huge segment of their own civilians as a result of this isn’t a moral problem they would hesitate over.
The saner countries like Jordan, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia don’t have the clout to stop this.
Bush is smart to stand back and let Israel do what it needs to do.
‘Imagine’ is no more an anthem for the left than ‘Helter Skelter’ was meant to be background music for mass murderers.
All Lennon said was to imagine a world free of religion and war. Once the imagining is done go back to what ever it was you were doing and carry on.
david brown – why bother with imagining if those images are meant to be abandoned and you ‘go back to whatever it was you were doing and carry on’?
Robert..
“anthem for the humanists.”
I am a devout humanis, please don’t lump me in with that group of wing nuts. Humanism is about bettering the lives of the human race without reliance on dogma. secularism != leftism.
Wow!
Imagine western society without tolerant peace-loving, diversity-loving leftist nutcases.
All I can say is LET THE CRUSADES BEGIN AGAIN!
Posted by: Doug
nice. your talents are waisted here. you should be in Afganistan killing women and children. I sure hope you plan on signing up your children to do the fighting. Coward.
Einstein said that imagination was more important than knowledge. Given Einstein’s intellect and life work, in my view he was thinking of using imagination as a tool for thinking differently rather than singing in unison.
Imagine a world without Israel.
Imagine a world without America.
Imagine a world without Canada.
Imagine a world without the DailyKos.
Hey, wait a minute, we just might have something…
ET said:
Well, that’s the basic mode of the left; they live in a fictional world.
A quibble: you have unintentionally insulted fiction. Remember great fiction is often highly concentrated reality, the truth writ large: think of the great truth, for example, in Faulkner’s or Joyce’s fiction.
It would be more accurate to say, “they live in a fairy tale world”. Let’s face it, most functional human beings, at around the age of 6-7, suddenly realize that it’s impossible for a very fat man in a red suit to fly all around the world with a raindeer team and actually get to visit every house in the world over a 24 hour period. The left however never lost its belief in Santa Claus, or for the Tooth Fairy. From an economics points of view, the left really and truly still believes in the tooth fairy. That there is unlimited plentitude but for the greed and avarice of business people.
With apologies to the trolls for my cruelty.
What Kos advocates would result in the murder of Jews and the destruction of the State of Israel, and he knows it. Like so many on the left he hides his anti-semitism and schadenfreude behind some mask of high-mindedness. Truly revolting, and homicidally dishonest. Another good reminder that the Left are more mere opponents in a debate.
More than mere opponents…
Swiingvoter:
Thanks for parrotting typical left wing revisionism, lies, and slander–the only killing of women and children taking place is by murderous terrorists, of which the left are nothing more than useful idiots. Shoe fits? Wear it.
David Brown is sorta right here, but probably unintentionally. The fact is that John Lennon was not sincere, ran a racket, and got himself killed for it. Nasty man he was too. While I remain a great Beatles fan, I consider Imagine to be the worst song in history of pop music, and that includes, Feeeeellllliiiiiinnnnnnggggs, whoa whoa Feeeellllllliiiiiinnnnngggggs. Come to think of it Imagine is just another way of saying feelings. Yeah right: Give Peace a Chance and get yourself killed.
swiingvoter, do you really think, honestly, I mean with reason and logic supported by facts, that people go to Afghanistan to kill women and children? Those are the targets? That’s the agenda?
You’re the perfect example of the silly vs the sincere. You’ve obviously missed entirely the issues and events of the last 24 hours, years really. You can’t converse in a more meaningful way? Offended by what, again?
Imagine—-that we sent all the lefties to the middle east to give the terrorists a good stern talking to——they wouldn’t know what hit em.
One guy posts something on his blog hosted on Daily Kos and he’s suddenly representative of the left?
This didn’t appear on the main page of Daily Kos. You might as well blame Google for something nutty posted on Blogspot.
Liberal: Imagine all the people, living in harmony.
Conservative: Imagine all the people, living in security.
Socialist: Imagine all the people, living in solidarity.
Authoritarian: Imagine all the people, living in tyranny.
Libertarian: Imagine tyranny. Oh the horror, the horror.
Let’s not forget that Lennon’s “Imagine no religion” would get rid of the problem of Islam, as well. Many people including secular humanists may consider that a good deal. Others cling to their own solutions.
Fer cryin’ out loud it was pop song by a rock’n’roll singer. You’re giving it more importance than a moonbat does! I say that gay anthem, Strangers in the Night, started all this crap. Damn that Sinatra!
there is no truth to the rumor frankie sinata was buried in a coffin filled with cement.
none whatsoever.
LOL !!!
Hmm…
If it’s politically correct to “imagine the world without Israel”…
It should also be politically correct to imagine the world without Islam.
Imagine…
swingvoter, anyone not knowing the difference between waisted and wasted should refrain from criticizing others.
“Imagine western society without tolerant peace-loving, diversity-loving leftist nutcases.” Tolerant only to those who agree with them. By the way is tolerant Castro dead yet?
“no hell below us above us only sky”, imagine the outcry from the ‘it’s the destination not the journey’ crowd. y’know about the virgins and all
The Protocols of the Daily Kos, Part 3
The first sentence of this diary entry at Daily Kos is all you need to read, as the antisemites among the progressives continue revealing themselves: Daily Kos: Israel’s Unjust and Unnecessary Response. (Hat tip: Sarge_62.)
Israel is showing the entire world why the Iranian President was absolutely right to suggest that Israel cease being a sovereign state as is.
UPDATE at 7/14/06 6:45:41 pm:
Someone at Daily Kos is trying to hide this post. The first sentence now reads:
Israel is showing the entire world why its critics are absolutely right in suggesting that they have become a destabilizing force in the region.
UPDATE at 7/14/06 6:49:07 pm:
Here’s the screenshot: more
LGF
Once again, we get one whacko’s diatribe put on display and it’s somehow supposed to be representative of the “left”.
If any of you bothered to read the comments (of which the vast majority come from people who identify themselves with the left), you’d be hard-pressed to find a single one that wishes for what the author imagined to come true. I identify myself as left of centre, and I’m a strong supporter of Israel. Sometimes there are no clear delineations between left and right. I realize that we like to have fun out here in the blogosphere and trade jabs, but at times I get tired of hearing about how some self-described leftist’s ranting about Israel proves that all of my own “leftist” thoughts and ideas about economics and social issues at home are bunk.
Tony Blair is Labour, Neville Chamberlain was Conservative. People are complicated.
I read quite a few of the comments and found most, not all, ignorant of history, ignorant of the facts and quite a few just plain stupid. Israel is here to stay. It’s not going to relocate to Germany, New Jersey or some distant Isle in the Caribbees. Deal with it. The left isn’t complicated at all. Simple, just plain simple.
The high priests of the left wear the robes of righteousness, but whenever Israel is violated they can’t help themselves: their pink lust just pops right out of their garment.
Let’s see, the Iranian President calls repeatedly for Israel, a tiny country of Jews in a sea of Arabs, to be wiped off the face of the earth; Kos, the most popular lefty blog in the US writes “…the Iranian President was absolutely right to suggest that Israel cease being a sovereign state…”
Drago? My sincere apologies to you and others like you on the left. I’m glad you’re standing on the right side when it comes to Israel, but it has to be said that in doing so you are going against most of your fellow travellers. And BTW, check out Kate’s July 15 update to this thread: Kos is the most popular left blog in the US; it’s not just “one whacko’s diatribe”.
EBD,
This post was not by Markos, but by “qrswave” who, by my search, has only posted that single diary entry. With comments from regular readers like “I am just ashamed that you are a part of the DailyKos community”, I don’t think you can say that the elimination of Israel is a mainstream progressive position. The same is true of the diary referenced in the July 15 update. If you read the comments, you see the vast majority oppose the sentiment.
Is there a vocal faction of the left that is anti-Israel? Absolutely, and it disgusts me. But I don’t associate the nuts with my way of thinking, nor do I associate them with legitimate criticism of Israeli actions. I never looked at issues of war and peace as being left and right, but rather right and wrong. There’s no correlation between supporting public health insurance and opposing wars. Most liberals aren’t pacifists. All I’m saying is that you can’t blindly label people and assume their positions on everything.
The Kos Kidz: them’s the spokesmen for the Dems.
Channeling Hitler. Repulsive.
Well, that’s the basic mode of the left; they live in a fictional world.
They focus within a fictional utopianism of socialism, which reduces people to serfs living under the government-as-Lord. That’s right; in the socialist ideal, people are similar to the serfs of the medieval era and the gov’t is the Lord of the Manor. The serfs couldn’t be removed from their homes, and the Lord was obliged to protect them. The socialist welfare state is similar; guarenteed housing and services by the state. Of course, they ‘toil’ but in menial, no brain tasks (that’s our civil service and union protected jobs).
That’s why the left is aligned with islamic fascism; it’s also a fictional world, focused on the Original Purity of, also, a medieval era.
Fictions are irrelevant. We have to focus on reality. Israel exists. But so do Palestinians – despite many who deny the name of Palestine, deny that there are ‘any Palestinians..they are really Jordanians’. etc.
Both exist. Both require national states. Israel’s error, I feel, was to first, in 1948, hope that the Palestinians would be absorbed by the other arab states, and, second, occupy the lands and settle them, and third, with regard to the Oslo Accord, to offer them only municipal governance.
The Arab error was basic – first, to refuse to recognize Israel. That’s Arafat’s legacy; he wanted to retain power and he’d lose it in a genuine Palestinian state. And second, to retain tribalism and a peasant economy rather than move into industrialism. Israel was, right from the start, an industrial state and a democracy. It didn’t fit in with the Arab infrastructure – and the Arab infrastructure should have been changed. Their refusal to change it – has led to islamic fascism.
But I don’t think that the current situation is about Israel-Palestine. It’s about Iran. Totally about Iran.
Iran wants to take over the ME. It doesn’t want any democracy in the area and is fighting, along with Al Qaeda, to retain tribalism. Al Qaeda began as a mov’t to retain tribalism in Saudi Arabia, then, morphed into a populist ideology of pathological tribalism – islamic fascism. Iran is using it and is using the Israel-Palestinian situation to destabilize the ME, and try to emerge as the Empire of the ME.
It is having trouble with its agenda of destabilization. It doesn’t want Iraqi democracy and is, with Syria, behind the insurgency there. It’s not working. Iraq is still there, shaky, but getting stronger all the time.
Iran has tried to get the West to attack, re the nuclear taunts, the holocaust taunts. Hasn’t worked.
So, it’s now moved into the Israeli-Palestinian area – to try to get the West to attack.
Bush has just, wisely, said that he supports Israel and is not going to interfere. That is, the US isn’t moving into the area – which is what Iran wants.
This is my speculation – I’m still puzzled by what Iran hopes to get out of a war with the West. That’s what I don’t understand. And, how Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Egypt and Iraq will respond.
imagine.
anthem for the humanists.
things dont look too good at the present time eh?
Read this at LG the other day. Take a minute to stop there: littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog
All I can say is LET THE CRUSADES BEGIN AGAIN!
whether the stick their heads up their individual or collective arse ends or find a hole and use that to bury their heads, they are all pathetically unable or unwilling to accept and handle reality.
They are like kids hanging on to a belief in Santa Claus because the promise is so wonderful. They just can’t handle reality becasue it can be so brutal.
So we’ll have to do it for them.
Go Israel, go. Clean out the puss from the wound, once and for all so you can live in Peace.
Iran wants to be the mover and shaker in the Arab world. Anyone aspiring to be king of the militant Death Cult can only be the most irrational.
Pushing and hoping to snare Israel into a broader war, I think, is their goal. Maybe they are trying to galvinize the Arab street. Never forget that losing a huge segment of their own civilians as a result of this isn’t a moral problem they would hesitate over.
The saner countries like Jordan, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia don’t have the clout to stop this.
Bush is smart to stand back and let Israel do what it needs to do.
‘Imagine’ is no more an anthem for the left than ‘Helter Skelter’ was meant to be background music for mass murderers.
All Lennon said was to imagine a world free of religion and war. Once the imagining is done go back to what ever it was you were doing and carry on.
david brown – why bother with imagining if those images are meant to be abandoned and you ‘go back to whatever it was you were doing and carry on’?
Robert..
“anthem for the humanists.”
I am a devout humanis, please don’t lump me in with that group of wing nuts. Humanism is about bettering the lives of the human race without reliance on dogma. secularism != leftism.
Wow!
Imagine western society without tolerant peace-loving, diversity-loving leftist nutcases.
All I can say is LET THE CRUSADES BEGIN AGAIN!
Posted by: Doug
nice. your talents are waisted here. you should be in Afganistan killing women and children. I sure hope you plan on signing up your children to do the fighting. Coward.
Einstein said that imagination was more important than knowledge. Given Einstein’s intellect and life work, in my view he was thinking of using imagination as a tool for thinking differently rather than singing in unison.
Imagine a world without Israel.
Imagine a world without America.
Imagine a world without Canada.
Imagine a world without the DailyKos.
Hey, wait a minute, we just might have something…
ET said:
Well, that’s the basic mode of the left; they live in a fictional world.
A quibble: you have unintentionally insulted fiction. Remember great fiction is often highly concentrated reality, the truth writ large: think of the great truth, for example, in Faulkner’s or Joyce’s fiction.
It would be more accurate to say, “they live in a fairy tale world”. Let’s face it, most functional human beings, at around the age of 6-7, suddenly realize that it’s impossible for a very fat man in a red suit to fly all around the world with a raindeer team and actually get to visit every house in the world over a 24 hour period. The left however never lost its belief in Santa Claus, or for the Tooth Fairy. From an economics points of view, the left really and truly still believes in the tooth fairy. That there is unlimited plentitude but for the greed and avarice of business people.
With apologies to the trolls for my cruelty.
What Kos advocates would result in the murder of Jews and the destruction of the State of Israel, and he knows it. Like so many on the left he hides his anti-semitism and schadenfreude behind some mask of high-mindedness. Truly revolting, and homicidally dishonest. Another good reminder that the Left are more mere opponents in a debate.
More than mere opponents…
Swiingvoter:
Thanks for parrotting typical left wing revisionism, lies, and slander–the only killing of women and children taking place is by murderous terrorists, of which the left are nothing more than useful idiots. Shoe fits? Wear it.
David Brown is sorta right here, but probably unintentionally. The fact is that John Lennon was not sincere, ran a racket, and got himself killed for it. Nasty man he was too. While I remain a great Beatles fan, I consider Imagine to be the worst song in history of pop music, and that includes, Feeeeellllliiiiiinnnnnnggggs, whoa whoa Feeeellllllliiiiiinnnnngggggs. Come to think of it Imagine is just another way of saying feelings. Yeah right: Give Peace a Chance and get yourself killed.
swiingvoter, do you really think, honestly, I mean with reason and logic supported by facts, that people go to Afghanistan to kill women and children? Those are the targets? That’s the agenda?
You’re the perfect example of the silly vs the sincere. You’ve obviously missed entirely the issues and events of the last 24 hours, years really. You can’t converse in a more meaningful way? Offended by what, again?
Imagine—-that we sent all the lefties to the middle east to give the terrorists a good stern talking to——they wouldn’t know what hit em.
One guy posts something on his blog hosted on Daily Kos and he’s suddenly representative of the left?
This didn’t appear on the main page of Daily Kos. You might as well blame Google for something nutty posted on Blogspot.
Liberal: Imagine all the people, living in harmony.
Conservative: Imagine all the people, living in security.
Socialist: Imagine all the people, living in solidarity.
Authoritarian: Imagine all the people, living in tyranny.
Libertarian: Imagine tyranny. Oh the horror, the horror.
Let’s not forget that Lennon’s “Imagine no religion” would get rid of the problem of Islam, as well. Many people including secular humanists may consider that a good deal. Others cling to their own solutions.
Fer cryin’ out loud it was pop song by a rock’n’roll singer. You’re giving it more importance than a moonbat does! I say that gay anthem, Strangers in the Night, started all this crap. Damn that Sinatra!
there is no truth to the rumor frankie sinata was buried in a coffin filled with cement.
none whatsoever.
LOL !!!
Hmm…
If it’s politically correct to “imagine the world without Israel”…
It should also be politically correct to imagine the world without Islam.
Imagine…
swingvoter, anyone not knowing the difference between waisted and wasted should refrain from criticizing others.
“Imagine western society without tolerant peace-loving, diversity-loving leftist nutcases.” Tolerant only to those who agree with them. By the way is tolerant Castro dead yet?
“no hell below us above us only sky”, imagine the outcry from the ‘it’s the destination not the journey’ crowd. y’know about the virgins and all
The Protocols of the Daily Kos, Part 3
The first sentence of this diary entry at Daily Kos is all you need to read, as the antisemites among the progressives continue revealing themselves: Daily Kos: Israel’s Unjust and Unnecessary Response. (Hat tip: Sarge_62.)
Israel is showing the entire world why the Iranian President was absolutely right to suggest that Israel cease being a sovereign state as is.
UPDATE at 7/14/06 6:45:41 pm:
Someone at Daily Kos is trying to hide this post. The first sentence now reads:
Israel is showing the entire world why its critics are absolutely right in suggesting that they have become a destabilizing force in the region.
UPDATE at 7/14/06 6:49:07 pm:
Here’s the screenshot: more
LGF
Once again, we get one whacko’s diatribe put on display and it’s somehow supposed to be representative of the “left”.
If any of you bothered to read the comments (of which the vast majority come from people who identify themselves with the left), you’d be hard-pressed to find a single one that wishes for what the author imagined to come true. I identify myself as left of centre, and I’m a strong supporter of Israel. Sometimes there are no clear delineations between left and right. I realize that we like to have fun out here in the blogosphere and trade jabs, but at times I get tired of hearing about how some self-described leftist’s ranting about Israel proves that all of my own “leftist” thoughts and ideas about economics and social issues at home are bunk.
Tony Blair is Labour, Neville Chamberlain was Conservative. People are complicated.
I read quite a few of the comments and found most, not all, ignorant of history, ignorant of the facts and quite a few just plain stupid. Israel is here to stay. It’s not going to relocate to Germany, New Jersey or some distant Isle in the Caribbees. Deal with it. The left isn’t complicated at all. Simple, just plain simple.
The high priests of the left wear the robes of righteousness, but whenever Israel is violated they can’t help themselves: their pink lust just pops right out of their garment.
Let’s see, the Iranian President calls repeatedly for Israel, a tiny country of Jews in a sea of Arabs, to be wiped off the face of the earth; Kos, the most popular lefty blog in the US writes “…the Iranian President was absolutely right to suggest that Israel cease being a sovereign state…”
Drago? My sincere apologies to you and others like you on the left. I’m glad you’re standing on the right side when it comes to Israel, but it has to be said that in doing so you are going against most of your fellow travellers. And BTW, check out Kate’s July 15 update to this thread: Kos is the most popular left blog in the US; it’s not just “one whacko’s diatribe”.
EBD,
This post was not by Markos, but by “qrswave” who, by my search, has only posted that single diary entry. With comments from regular readers like “I am just ashamed that you are a part of the DailyKos community”, I don’t think you can say that the elimination of Israel is a mainstream progressive position. The same is true of the diary referenced in the July 15 update. If you read the comments, you see the vast majority oppose the sentiment.
Is there a vocal faction of the left that is anti-Israel? Absolutely, and it disgusts me. But I don’t associate the nuts with my way of thinking, nor do I associate them with legitimate criticism of Israeli actions. I never looked at issues of war and peace as being left and right, but rather right and wrong. There’s no correlation between supporting public health insurance and opposing wars. Most liberals aren’t pacifists. All I’m saying is that you can’t blindly label people and assume their positions on everything.