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July 5, 2009

Blogging From The Streets Of Tegucigalpa

Honduras Abandoned.

Failed return update: Manuel Zelaya's jet denied landing rights - "circles Honduran runway, can't land".

It's hard to believe there's still one remaining government in the Americas with the backbone to stand up against the left.

Posted by Kate at July 5, 2009 6:24 PM
Comments

The pictures of Zelaya's supporters on the blog appear hardly any different from the Ultra-Far Left in our neck of the woods. Commie symbols I saw, many of 'em masked.

Contrast them with the normal folks who participated in the Tea Parties in the States this weekend, and you know what kind of leader Zelaya really is.

Posted by: Canadian Sentinel at July 5, 2009 7:15 PM

I read an article earlier today that said the army in Honduras had removed Zelaya at the direction of the Supreme Court because he was attempting to subvert the Constitution. The Congress then chose a civilian to fill the office of President.
I personally find it more than a little disturbing that President Obama is in agreement with Castro and Chavez.

Posted by: PhilK at July 5, 2009 7:25 PM

"Code Pink was there." Sums it up.

Posted by: John at July 5, 2009 7:27 PM

Sorry, I am new here and I don't understand your remark about "Code Pink was there". Could you please explain?
Thanks

Posted by: PhilK at July 5, 2009 7:44 PM

philk - if you scroll down to July 2nd, you'll find a thorough discussion of the Honduran situation.

Zelaya attempted to subvert the will of Congress and the Supreme Court - which voted to remove him. They replaced him with the VP, who is interim only, with elections to be held in November. It was not and is not, a coup.

All praise goes to the Honduran legitimate government for trying to resist a takeover by Zelaya and his turning Honduras into a dictatorship akin to that of his friend Chavez in Venezuala.

Posted by: ET at July 5, 2009 8:00 PM

ET-- Thank you for the heads-up. I checked it out and it seems I am only about 3 days behind the curve. That's pretty good for me. LOL

Posted by: PhilK at July 5, 2009 8:19 PM

ET... exactly.

Posted by: marc in calgary at July 5, 2009 8:20 PM

In the meddling world of Obama we should never let chaos in a banana republic go to waste when a firm socialist statement can be made.

Honduras may be abandoned of allies, but it will be molested by those same allies in the form of a Latin American incursion force cheered on (and probably funded) by the Obama administration.

But do not meddle in Iran, they will bite back. Like all bullies Obama is a coward, so bitch-slapping Honduras is taking lunch money from the wimps.

Planet earth is a farce.

Posted by: Momar at July 5, 2009 8:26 PM

PhilK wrote:

"I personally find it more than a little disturbing that President Obama is in agreement with Castro and Chavez."

I agree, but I am equally disturbed by the similar position of the Conservative Government of Canada.

http://tinyurl.com/r7apvq

Statement by Minister of State Kent on the Situation in Honduras

June 28, 2009 (11:00 p.m. EDT)

“Canada condemns the coup d'état that took place over the weekend in Honduras, and calls on all parties to show restraint and to seek a peaceful resolution to the present political crisis, which respects democratic norms and the rule of law, including the Honduran Constitution."

The Government of Canada 'condemns' the 'coup d'état' but also wants the Honduran Constitution and the rule of law respected. Is this fence-sitting, or does the Government of Canada think the President should simply have been arrested and detained in Honduras for his refusal to obey the Supreme Court order by attempting to hold an illegal referendum so he could try to be president-for-life?

Further, on July 5, the Organization of American States (including Canada) unanimously voted 33-0 to suspend "Honduras’s membership, opening the way for sanctions".

http://tinyurl.com/ohlyq5

What the heck is going on in Ottawa?

Posted by: aek at July 5, 2009 8:30 PM

Any time the military is required to bring about a change in power it is a bad situation.

Read Ottawa's statement carefully.

1) They call it a political crisis, fair point, which begs why the military was required

BUT

2) ensures it mentions the Honduran constitution...

It is clear that El Buddio to El Chavez was trying to creep up on a vote to claim he could run again, and find a way to fix the election. That much is really clear. Did the military overreact? maybe, I am not there so who knows what the next steps of the plan were. Somehow I suspect that the Zeya was going to go about replaing the senior officers in the military to ensure control.

So that nice military that the US trained, funded and equipped was about to be flipped over to Chavezistas. The Canadian government can and should seek a non military solution. One hopes it buys them some cred to come down, ultimately, on the side of a free and fair Honduran election when the Honduran constitution calls for it. At this stage that likely means a "red loss". But who knows at this stage, if Obama has gone soft and is signalling no influence in the region.

MAybe we shouldnt have joined the OAS afterall. I cant imagine that Harper would enjoy any time with Hugo, nor suffer his rants easily.

Best place for Canada is a call for respect of the Honduran constitution. The military isnt the worst option, but it isnt the best option in this case either. A political crisis needs to be solved poltically. There is something untold here when the courts and the military felt they had no other option.

Posted by: Stephen at July 5, 2009 8:49 PM

So now Nicaragua is stunting along the border.

So much blame all the way round.

1) Hondouran military probably shouldnt have been used, too late now

2) Over reation by Obama now signals a green light to Chavez and Ortega...what is Obama going to say or do now???? Will he defend Hondouran sovereignty after he booted them out of the OAS?

What a freaking mess. Obama went too far trying to show how HE was different from the previous admins....maybe he should understand a bit better why the admins were that way, and more importantly what happens when you make sudden changes on the fly to your foreign policy position.

If the US will not defend its interest in Central America, why the heck would they defend their interest anywhere else......

So is O going to call Chavez and Ortega and get them to back down? What is the stick, offering carrots is easy.

I still think the Hondourans have to work this out themselves, but that measn O has to tell the Chavez and Ortga and the other regional Reds to cool their heels or Yanqui will be there.

As Kate would say, nice move rookie.

Posted by: Stephen at July 5, 2009 8:59 PM

Obama July 5th 2009 in the Examiner.com

"Now, Obama, who knows nothing about Honduran law, is ignorantly claiming that Zelaya's removal was "illegal," and demanding that Zelaya be reinstated as president."

Joe Biden Vice President July 5th 2009 Yahoo News

"Look, Israel can determine for itself — it's a sovereign nation — what's in their interest and what they decide to do relative to Iran and anyone else,"
[...]
"Look, we cannot dictate to another sovereign nation what they can and cannot do," he said.

I smell hypocrisy, incompetence, stupidity, arrogance and DANGER. The world is in that hands of idiot.

Posted by: Momar at July 5, 2009 10:38 PM

stephen

"They call it a political crisis, fair point, which begs why the military was required"


try reading up on the event before you comment


the military act at the "orders" of the hondurian supreme court, that is why the military was required

Posted by: GYM at July 5, 2009 10:51 PM

The scuttlebutt is that BamBam fears that precedent is being set.....hypothetically he could be impeached (birth certificate???)and refuse to leave office........
Who would then hypothetically evict him....the Secret Service???BATF???? the FBI????US Marshalls????the US Marines????
Who would put him on the next jet to Kenya????

Posted by: sasquatch at July 5, 2009 10:56 PM

For the first time in ages, I watched CTV News tonight (I wanted the update on the Barrie shooting and the garbage strike). They led with a report on Honduras. From their report, you would think that Zelaya is a complete innocent who was ousted by a bunch of military thugs. The report was complete with pictures of rioters, with a lurid voice over of "soldiers firing bullets into the air.... there was at least one death". No mention of the much larger, peaceful rally downtown in the capital where the people chanted "No Mel" (Zelaya's nickname). The vast majority of Hondurans are sick of Zelaya; he only has the support of the extreme poor, the trade unions, and the ultra-leftists. Oh, no wonder the MSM love him.

I left a long note of disgust on CTV's feedback page. I don't expect to receive a reply.

Posted by: KevinB at July 6, 2009 12:02 AM

GYM,

I did read up on the event. I even thought about it for a bit.

This is a political fight between two groups. It has been escalating for some time. The point, that the Canadian Government appears to be making is that this is a domestic political dispute, a serious one, but political nonetheless. Which raises the question of why a democratic government needs to involve the military in civilian matters.

Now, the military do appear to be acting on judicial orders, this may be how Hondouran constitutional matters are set up...I dont know....this is somewhat preferable to them acting without judicial orders, a full blown coup de etat. But this is hardly normal. One would not have expected to see the military involved in Canada during the coalition incident.

The dispute is political. It is extraordinary in almost any democracy I am aware of to have military or even the police brought in to settle a normal political matter. So my point here is there has been an extraordinary escalation by one side.....it may be legal and constitutional, but so would the GG taking over and not calling Parliament back. that doesnt necessarily make it appropriate.

That it has happened, well thats another matter. It is largely a Honduran matter, that it was done at the behest of the judicial branch helps, this assumes the judiciary arent seen as apppointments of the previous administration. If there is broad legitimacy of the judiciary then this may be seen as a necessary final step.

But ultimately democracies are supposed to choose by election not military force or judicuak fiat. It is dangerous ground.

But as I said, there is lots to this story, there was clear intent on zelya's part to circumvent the consitution and the courts. He was clearly using outside powers to assist. These are all bad things.

The Canadian Government is reflecting the complexity of the situation and, take heart, emphasizing the Honduran Constitution, which is more than I believe Obama has done.

Obama's eagerness to show he wasnt your everyday Yanqui took him too far, in my opinion, and this has left him no room to be consistent and prevent meddling from Ortega and Chavez.

The Canadian response is appropriate and flexible, leaving Canada in a position to be consistent against Chavez and Ortega.

The Chileans are going to be the most interesting out of all of this. I wonder what their position is

Posted by: Stephen at July 6, 2009 2:02 AM

The support from Canada and Obama and the rest has nothing to do with democracy or constitutions. It's about the primal fear of all government leaders of being removed from office by force, something they can't manipulate or broker against.

Through alliances and allegiances and the presumed control of the force of the state, government leaders feel secure in their authority when they can manage a situation by manipulating the players.

Both the US and Canada remain untested in modern times as to what would happen if the leader of the government acted unilaterally in defiance of the constitution and the Supreme Court. It is questionable if the police would act on a court order against a PM or president if the crown agents refused to act or would not issue the direction to. It is under those circumstance that the army might. both here and in the US.

The more compact geography plus the political allegiances that occur in Latin America, make the army the logical actor - in most of these countries the army is the police force, even if there is a local constabulary.

Posted by: Skip at July 6, 2009 5:38 AM

Zelaya reminds me just a little of Laytoon...

Coalition government for Canada?

Sure.... the commies always want us to be more of a banana republic.

Posted by: OMMAG at July 6, 2009 7:50 PM

You're unfamiliar with Code Pink? Sometimes a picture really is worth a thousand words. Click here and check it out.

Posted by: CJ at July 7, 2009 2:06 AM
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