Why Is Italy the Hotbed of COVID-19″
Blah blah blah Italians are old.
Blah blah blah Italians are sick.
Blah blah blah Italians have dirty air.
Blah blah blah Italians are bad at numbers.
Or… HELLO.
Prato, the historical capital of Italy’s textile business, has attracted the largest concentration of Chinese-run industry in Europe within less than 20 years.
As many as 50,000 Chinese live and work in the area, making clothes bearing the prized “Made in Italy” label which sets them apart from garments produced in China itself, even at the lower end of the fashion business.
In some ways, the Chinese community of Prato has succeeded where Italian companies have failed. Italy’s economy has barely grown over the past decade and is only just emerging from recession, partly due to the inability of many small manufacturers to keep up with global competition.
And then there’s the fact that their hospitals are so overwhelmed that the elderly are turned away.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/03/italy-joins-china-belt-road-initiative-190321170015949.html
Probably just a coincident.
Are we to assume then that Richmond will repeat the itialian experience?
You would think that would be the case. I imagine that many Chinese ex patriots traveled back to the home country to enjoy New Year celebrations, and then came back to Canada near the end of January or early February. If it was to happen, we should have seen it by now. But it appears not to be the case. Maybe the rich Chinese here in Canada come from the Northern part of China?
That was the source of the Washington State outbreak, returning from Wuhan New Year.
I suspect that is also a source of BCs outbreak, but PRIVACY must be respected………
Hey Ward, are you saying that 50000 + chinese people work in Richmond Virginia and travel back and forth to China? Can you give a link or elaborate on this? Because I think the article has credence. I’ve read it elsewhere that there was 300000 Chinese that lived in the North of Italy, but I took that with a grain of salt. Must have been transmitted quickly from Wuhan to Northern Italy quickly somehow? Italians will want to know how so many of their fellow countrymen died? Chinese Communists and globalists will answer for this either way.
AHH ok, just realized you were talking Richmond B.C. where the average house price is 1.6 mill. I doubt there were many people from a poorer province like Hubei living there. And no textile factories that I’ve ever heard of. Completely different demographics.
So where do all the people getting off the planes from China landing in Vancouver daily go, do you suppose?
Or it could be the same thing happens in Italy regularly.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1201971219303285
Ward!!! This is not the normal flu. Go back behind your wall of toilet paper. The Chinese communists and globalists are clearly at fault for this pandemic…
If I’m a flu denier Mach why would I have a wall of TP?
Agree the Chicoms are responsible and were ground zero.
Flus, it seems, regardless of their strain, kill a lot of Italians with regularity.
Good rule of thumb. Whatever the media pimps on any given day, believe the opposite. You’ll be much closer to the truth.
eye ties are poor at hygienic, I know that from personal experience, and from more than one example, and there in lies mucho the problemo
The talk page on the Wikipedia article … ‘https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:2020_coronavirus_pandemic_in_Italy’ scroll down to section
‘ Two useful articles about COVID-19 in Italy ‘ and read from there. There are links, so you can do your investigating from there and form your own conclusions.
This is very interesting.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/have-many-coronavirus-patients-died-italy/
Yeah, that article is full of may and maybe and total speculation. Bucket of salt. It’s very hard to find good info out there. It’s like a blind man throwing a dart from 50 yards away right now. Nobody really knows WTF is going on. But we know it’s the Wuhan flu!!!
The age of our patients in hospitals is substantially older – the median is 67, while in China it was 46
Yeah … I think “age” is the answer. Based on everything I’ve read.
That and multi-generational households. Just like the East Indians in BC, in Italy, it’s not unusual to have 4 generations in the household. Italians greet each other with a peck on each cheek.
The young, out and about, bring it home and give the present to paPA and maMA.
It seems like several factors have become the Perfect Storm in Italy. There’s a couple stories out there stating that 99% of the Italian deaths, had at least 1 underlying health condition, many of those had 2 conditions. Not a surprise with the elderly, they are highly succeptable to death by pneumonia
Excellent point. I still recall all those stories about grown Italian MEN still living with mommy and daddy … AFTER marriage too. Cultural hazard. But the match was struck by all the Chinese sweatshops in the garment industry … sewing crap knock-offs
It’s not that Italy is any worse than anywhere in the world. It’s just that they are ahead of us by a few weeks.
Also what are the real numbers in China North Korea and Iran?
Not necessarily. There are pockets of places where the virus does not seem to be taking hold. Russia is one such place. Multiple factors are involved — including strategies for dealing with the virus, but I do not think we will see an identical pattern across the planet.
The virus travelled to the US the same time it landed in Italy. A Chinese student brought it to Wisconsin in January.
It spread very quickly in Italy, the concentration of people who had travelled to China coupled with the high density living conditions and hygiene practices? Who knows, but I don’t think you can compare Nor. America to Italy. I don’t know why people think it is a harbinger.
The bottom line is that high density urban areas with sanitation problems provide the greatest risk. Also, nursing homes are like a tinder box when it comes to disease, one worker brings in a nasty bug and all the residents will get it. This is what we are seeing, the largest infection numbers in cities where people are crammed in and large numbers of homeless people makes containment difficult, and deaths in nursing homes where workers had travelled.
I personally think Japan is a better model for what might happen here, although their standards of hygiene are better than ours.
Chinese sweat shops … hmmm? … not exactly the VISION of social distancing.
Until relatively recent times, the Jews of Italy were routinely accused of poisoning wells and causing cholera outbreaks—a perfect excuse for a bloody pogrom whenever the local lord or bishop needed a distraction from his own corruption.
The Chinese are everything the Roman clergy ever accused the Jews of being. Clannish, tight-fisted, perverted, contemptuous of Christianity, determined to make debt-slaves of the peoples of Christendom—and, in truth, the source of almost all the world’s modern plagues, including the “Spanish” flu. No western government or important public figure has yet called openly for the expropriation or expulsion of the Overseas Chinese, for fear of being called racist. (Demanding the destruction of Israel is fair game, obviously.)
The Chinese have their own country, and do not have an infestation of Arabs or 2000 years if exile as an excuse not to go home and stay there.
I don’t want a new country. I want the Chinese to give mine back.
So, I imagine, do most Italians.
Mehhh, I’ve got no problem with people of Chinese origin. Mass migration in Canada needs to go down to 50000 max and people with dual Canadian and especially Chinese citizenship need to leave or give up their Chinese citizenship. We still have massive amounts of supposed “Canadians” that are returning to this moment. Roxham Road is the tip of the iceberg. Remember the supposed “Canadians” that had to be flown back from Lebanon years ago 10000, and we paid with tax dollars to fly them here??? What is the bill gonna be this time? And they are still allowing migrant workers to come in, up to 60000. find an effin Canadian to work and plant. like you should have 20 years ago.
In summary:
1. The Chinese Communist Party virus, call it what it is and where the responsibility lies for a pandemic.
2. If you sell your soul to the devil, what you create is a hell in your part of the world.
3.If you sell your soul to a first devil, the E.U. and accept their 30 pieces of silver, the Euro, which is priced way too high compared to the production value added you can manage, unlike the lira, which was matched and could adapt up or down as needed. Then you sooner or later find yourself selling your soul to a second devil(C.C.P.), too(illegal migrant labour/slave like working conditions).
4. This done in order to offset the pact with the first devil creates chaos/unnecessary suffering= Hell on earth.
5. A Vatican/Pope that was Christian rather than Marxist might notice that and demand the renouncing of both (totalitarian) devils and their promised utopia, as part of the process of redemption. Even a secularist Christian society might recall: Two wrongs don’t make a right.
6. The problems of the Euro distorting the less value added economies of the southern Euro-zone e.i. Italy, Portugal, Spain, Greece, in order to benefit the more industrial economies of Germany and France is coming home to roost like the vulture(grim reaper) it is, yet again.
Why did Italy out of all European countries get hit so hard.??
https://www.altnewsmedia.net/news/corona-virus-exclusive-why-italy/
The truth is out there…
https://twitter.com/DVATW/status/1238073137813749762?s=09
Many Italians in Northern Italy sold their leather goods and textiles companies to China. Italy then allowed 100,000 Chinese from Wuhan/Wenzhou to move to Italy to work in these factories, with direct Wuhan flights. Result: Northern Italy is Europe’s hotspot for Wuhan Coronavirus
Why did Italy out of all European countries get hit so hard.??
https://www.altnewsmedia.net/news/corona-virus-exclusive-why-italy/
https://twitter.com/DVATW/status/1238073137813749762?s=09
Many Italians in Northern Italy sold their leather goods and textiles companies to China. Italy then allowed 100,000 Chinese from Wuhan/Wenzhou to move to Italy to work in these factories, with direct Wuhan flights. Result: Northern Italy is Europe’s hotspot for Wuhan Coronavirus
Wuhan/Wenzhou makes as much sense as St. Louis/Atlanta.
Just saying.
Kate got it right. An Italian friend advised recently that the reason Northern Italy was so infested with Coronavirus was because there is such a large concentration of Chinese expats (Wuhan specific he said) living in Northern Italy and until now were travelling back and forth to China. This seems to corroborate what he told us.
The PRC (People’s Republic of Corvid-19), run by the CCP (Chinese Corvid-19 Perverts) will pay. When the world no longer buys the garbage they produce because the world’s economy will be in the toilet, the peasants will get restless. Then it’ll be time for another of China’s periodic violent regime changes.
I’m no fan of the Chinese, but I heard an interview with a doctor in Bergamo. He said there’s a large Chinese population in Lombardy near Milan, but virtually no Chinese in Bergamo — the epicenter of the plague in Italy. Possible Chinese workers introduced it, but it would have spread globally in any case, sooner or later.
Might want to fact-check a bit more deeply.
It doesn’t take much to start the spread, from the Wuhan’s. Once the Wuhan’s introduce it, community spread took over. Story is accurate!
“Might want to fact-check a bit more deeply.”
vs
“…but I heard an interview with a doctor in Bergamo”
Right, you heard an interview so that counts as more deep checking. Ok then.
Bergamo is where old rich Italians go to die. My personal take on the high deaths in Italy has to do with skewing normal old age deaths to coronavirus to make it easier to beg the EU for more money. Same for Spain. It has nothing to do with Chinese workers. JMHO.
There’s nowhere that I’ve seen that breaks down the Italian cases by ethnicity (because, of course, that would be racist!). However, let’s say you have a very high infection rate (not necessarily deaths) within this Chinese community. They are younger (say under 50 years old), so by triage (and I think this is a very key point Kate is making), take up a disportionate number of the limited no. of hospital beds to the (fatal) exclusion of the more vulnerable, elderly ethnic Italian victims.
Would be curious to know how many of these elderly ethnic Italians are dying without ever getting to see the inside of a hospital? Anyway, also not seeing anywhere close to the level of insight on this anywhere in MSM as SDA. Thanks Kate!
It’s one thing to say that Chinese migrants brought the virus to Northern Italy where it percolated under the radar until it exploded,
but quite another to claim it’s what makes the outbreak in Italy so severe. I dont think it is any one factor, but a synergy of little factors that combined, each one amplifying the others, leading to a perfect storm. Not very dramatic, I know, but a better explanation than whats been proposed here.
It makes a difference whether a virus with R0 of 2-3 is introduced by 2 people — or 200 people.
Yes, it certainly does, but it doesn’t explain the death rate compared to other countries. The population of Lombardy is 10M; 11 % are foreign born, mostly from N Africa and the Balkans. The Chinese population is .006%
Italy is the first civilized country that failed to contain the initial outbreak and got to the point when the healthcare system got overloaded. What happens in Italy will happen everywhere else they fail to contain the bug on a similar scale… which may well be everywhere else in Europe and North America. It happened in China and Iran but they censored the data. The next country you are going to see results similar to Italy is Spain. As a matter of fact you already see it in Spain. France, UK and Canada are not far behind. Nor are US and Germany.
Having been following the data very closely for months it appears the virus is very easy to treat given optimal medical resources. But once you run of the optimal modern options you may as well start praying and doing voodoo. You see it everywhere the disease has been present for a while. The initial death rates are very low, below 1%. But while they are kept at low level because first patients get the best possible care the virus spreads and spreads and every day a larger and large number of people get treated… and then the levy breaks and the system can no longer care for all the patients and death rates skyrocket.
Sorry the number of foreign born Chinese in Lombardy is 6/10 of 1 percent.
By way of explanation, i only know these stats because I’ve already had this arguement with my sister. Being half Canadian, we read this blog. Hope, Kate, that you are doing okay.
Yes and in February right before fat tuesday and lent they had “show you aren’t racist and hug Chinese people” movement. Really. This is not a joke. https://legalinsurrection.com/2020/03/italian-virologist-fear-of-being-falsely-called-racist-led-to-italys-wuhan-coronavirus-crisis/#more-312473
Ward at 1:32 a.m. :
Or it could be the same thing happens in Italy regularly.
He gave a link that was the report of a study over a four year period of “excessive deaths due to flu” in Italy, 2013/2014 to 2016/2017. The average was 17000, with the last season studied being the worst, at 25,000. The “season” generally lasts from week 42 to week 17. For comparison, the U.S. experienced one of the worst flu seasons in that same 2016/2017 season, when 80.000 died. The Italian per capita rate that year was 1.7 times the U.S. rate.
That still does not answer the question of why Italy. The data from that study ought to eliminate Chinese nationals being vectors over a long period of time for different types of flu. Two of the more credible conjectures are:
1. Italy has an older population. I read where it has the second oldest population, but I cannot find independent verification of that. Nevertheless, it does have an older population in any case. For instance, its population has had a negative growth rate for at least a decade.
2. An advisor for the Italian Department of Health said that Italy is very “liberal” in putting down the cause of death. What he said was specific to coronavirus. He said if a patient enters the hospital with coronavirus and subsequently dies, the cause of death is put down as coronavirus without further verification. This is very questionable practice, since it is known that 99% of the patients who died have at least another life threatening disease, and two thirds have at least two. And the same practice may have led to elevated numbers in the quoted study.
Hygiene may or may not be a factor. I have no specific knowledge of the Italians, but the Japanese and Nordic countries are known to be fastidiously clean. And yet Japan, Norway, Sweden, Denmark, and the Netherlands are all infected. One could say, however, that the Italians are very affectionate and tactile, with hugs and kisses being the norm for greeting.
An up-to-date trajectory comparison between different countries (last update yesterday) show Italy’s coronavirus death stands at 5476. We shall see how it progresses.
Has Italy ever run out of beds before this virus? By the way Italy, France, and Spain have an equivalent number of critical care beds per capita. Germany has 2.5 times as many, the USA has 3 times as many as Italy. The UK has half the critical care beds as Italy, so they have a lot of work ahead of them. Sorry, didn’t see Canada. Stats are from Statista.
Canada looks to be equivalent to Italy in ICU capacity, per capita.
Italy is the Chinese tourist’s 3rd most popular destination after Asia, and the USA.