They’re in-laws.
It took but a few days in Calgary for one Jordan Michael Smith to discover a truth about Canadian identity that they don’t teach in Carleton University political science classes – that we are more like Americans than we are one another.*
That, and all orthodontists reside east of Thunder Bay. I figure there’s about a week between now and his first ass-kicking.
I guess this should be a badge of honour, as it is one more thing that proves we have the gift of independent thought. What you find in Eastern Canada is a “cut and paste” culture.
How boring.
Calgarians vacation in Houston? That’s news to me, as a born and raised Albertan.
Maybe, just maybe, he’s starting to “get it”.
Whoopee, he has discovered Canadian regionalism which is a prominent characteristic of the federal model.
I can’t wait for his next profundity!
Signed, DUH
I agree with David. I don’t think I know anyone in Alberta who vacations in Houston, unless they’re the CEO’s of a big oil company, and going home to visit family. Then, yes of course they would.
Most people I know go to Hawaii, or Mexico, if any warm place at all.
This guy works for The Western Standard?!? Just…wow. Gotta give them credit for hiring diverse viewpoints, if nothing else.
Phoenix would have made a lot more sense. Or maybe that’s a Saskatchewan snowbird thing.
*
“The urban nation where 80 per cent of Canadians live, and the rural parts of Canada
which do not have a lot of interaction with immigrants and different cultures.”
Which one are you… sophisticated, urban metro-sexual, or dumb-as-dirt rural racist?
It has to be true… CTV called an expert.
*
Hmmm. I lived in Calgary between 1969 and 1987. Cheap perfume and needing orthodondic work? Either Calgary has been subject of a recent extraordinary influx of “rubes” or…the writer is an idiot.
I give it less than a week for the ass-kicking, Kate.
Lots of us have spent time in Houston. seemed like a vacation 30 years ago with happy hours and strip clubs , but we have them here now.
I didnt realize all easterners had better teeth?going to have to watch closer now on by bi-annual trip to the centre of the known universe.
The article explains why Canada is not a unified country in a cultural sense. Instead, given its enormous ecological differences it is very much regionalized.
Why the surprise that Vancouver has more in common with Seattle than it does with Calgary? Or that financial/media centric Toronto is more like Chicago and New York than Toronto is like Winnipeg or Halifax or certainly Montreal.
It boils down to ecology. Ecology drives the economy and the economy sets the stage for the culture to be developed. Ergo, oil based Calgary is more like Huston than Toronto. But I agree, I don’t think it necessarily follows that a Calgarian would vacation in Huston.
I will make a bit of an appeal for Mr. Smith. Some time ago I sent him an email because I wanted to take him to task for a column he wrote. He wrote back, and the exchange was congenial. More importantly however, he listened to what I said, and considered it carefully. My sense is that he has a pretty good brain in his head, and is willing to hear other points of view.
I think that his caricature of Calgary in this piece is not the real issue, but it is his caricature of Toronto. I guess it all depends on where and with whom you hang out in Tortonto, but I would guess that there are still plenty of old school “hosers” in the Toronto. Lots of cheap perfume too, and more than a few overbites. Perhaps going to work at the Western Standard is for him more of an emergence from the collective rectum of the Toronto based media than it is a move to another part of the country.
Talk to the guy. I think he will hear you. Perhaps we will win a convert.
1. I (like many Albertans) make so much money in Alberta I’ve sent each kid to the orthodontist…hence our better looks than easterners.
2. Houston is a dump, it reminds me of Hamilton (I currently live near Houston)…we Albertans only go there for business. We vacation in Mexico, Arizona and we take the kids to Disneyland.
3. I’ve had to live in other areas over the breadth of my career and I will give this less than astutely observant, and soon to be unemployed, journalist some advice. Never critique the culture you are new to, especially after a few days. Cultural dynamics take years to learn.
I live in Southern Alberta.
People fly the Stars and Bars here because we are indeed rebels against the official culture of Canada.
I think what he meant to say is this:
Easterners are the “blue staters” of Canada becauase they share their values, love of socialism, poilitical correctness, open disdain for Christianity and heterosexual practices (like life-long marriage) they promote the life of a latte and limousine liberal. Westerners on the other hand share the values of the American “red states” belief in individual liberty, responisbiilty, family and religious values, democracy and capitalism.
There, that’s better.
Now you can hold off on the ass-kicking.
Doug, while there is a lot of validity in what you say I think it has to do more with mega cities than an East/West thing.
There is something about large cities that kills the frontier, entrepreneurial spirit. Here in Ontario, there is a big difference between the politics in Halliburton County and the Toronto Annex. The people living in the Annex drive Volvos and work at the CBC with an in-basket and an out-basket and a “manuel” that tells them what to do.
The people in Halliburton have 4 jobs, a pick-up truck and the only “manuel” they use is the shift .. they are a very self-sufficient people and proud of it.
So to the extent that Calgary is becoming a big city I’d suggest you learn from our mistakes in Toronto.
“Collective rectum of the Toronto based media”.
That is a keeper.
Mind if I plagarize it?
I thnk my wife will be the one to kick Jordan’s ass for him…with that orthodontist crack. 😉
Well here’s an eastern pinkie who at least sees there is a cultural difference west of Carlton Place…he even tweeks to the populist grass roots political culture in Alberta…but he is still getting over his eastern conditioning of judging people by what they wear…the plaid shrit and trucker cap stereotype is a popular eastern image to associate Albertans with…even though I have seen more of this dress style in northern Ontarion and Quebec than Alberts…shows these Carlton boys don’t get out much 😉
Certainly Jordan hasn’t made it to the plentiful upscale board rooms in DT Calgary as he han’t commented about Calgary having more custom tailors per square mile than Dallas. l-)
Give him time..he’s still aclimatizing and learning the ropes in a new culture…something his eastern conditioning had no idea existed…and that is the crux of western alienation….the fact we have a vibrant and unique culture which is either ignored in eastern thought or marginalized as “redneck”.
So yes Jordan we are a family..a dysfunctional one who live in a large house where the people in the east side don’t get out to the west side of the house that often yet want to run the “family business” from the east side view of the house.
To the extent that this article keeps the metrosexual horde from Ottawa moving to Calgary I am all for it. Keep up the good work Jordan.
But really, VACATION in Houston. NOBODY vacations in Houston. Business, yes. Pass through the airport, yes. Vacation, no.
(I live in Calgary, and spend a lot of time in Houston, so this is NOT speculation on my part).
Yeah Muskoka is just your typical rural Canadian setting, eh.
With private amphibious jets, 3 million dollar second homes, butlers and grounds crews.
Who knew there were all these other people, who didn’t go to Upper Canada College,…..eh?
Easterners are a different breed. Having spent 12 of my 23 years in the military in Ontario and Quebec has opened my eyes to the differences. Eaterners are NOT as tolorent as they profess to be. I have been in many conversations where they have talked in hushed tones about someone of other race. There is a huge racist streak that boils below the surface here. At least out west, if you did not like someone because of their race colour or creed, that was your problem. I found westerners to be way more open to people of different ethnic origins. I frimly believe that the western attitude of “you live your life, and I will live mine” is what leads to a good society. Westerners won’t try to tell you what is good or bad for you. Very much like east coasters.
Asskicking Countdown…..seems to have already reached ZERO at the editorial level!
I’ve never been to Houston. I vacation in Thailand. I avoid places like Bali, which is full of Torontonians who are on the phone everyday checking out the weather in TO.
Born and raised in Alberta, and I’ve run into dozens of Albertans in Thailand.
Nomdenet is correct. It’s more an urban rural thing. We fly the stars and bars here along the St.Lawrence. Always have. Consider Corner Gas, which does not depict rural Saskatchewan but Dog River. Any town in rural Canada right down to the little grey-haired ladies in the kitchen at the back of the community hall. Ever notice them peering out of the serving cut-out with the coffee urns and the date squares. I was pleased to read that Calgary still feels like a small town. It certainly did when I lived there.
richfisher wrote: “Yeah Muskoka is just your typical rural Canadian setting, eh.
With private amphibious jets, 3 million dollar second homes, butlers and grounds crews.”
You are talking about summer folk richfisher. The year round residents are mostly average Joe wage earners and pretty much as nondenet described them.
I emigrated to Canada from the UK 40 years ago. At that time I had job offers in the UK, New Zealand, and Canada (Lakehead). I researched them carefully, and found that Canada had the values and attitudes that I would be most comfortable with. After living in Ontario for 35 years and watching “Canadian Values” be distorted out of all recognition, I’ve been fortunate enough to end up in Calgary. It feels as if, in terms of values, I’ve gone back 40 years. People trust each other; people are friendly in a respectful and meaningful way; people care about their communities; people are generous to charities; people are about as un-race-conscious as it is possible to be. I could go on, of course, but you get the message.
Now, why is this? In the West, independence is a valued commodity; reliance on government is vaguely distaseful; fools are ignored; the CBC is hardly listened to; people appreciate and grab opportunities.
I knew I was back where I wanted to be, in terms of values, when a few weeks after arriving in Calgary I suggested a particular experimental scheme, and a government (!) person said: “Sure, we could try that, see how it works in the real world”. This was a scheme I’d spent nearly ten years presenting to various governmental bureaucracies in Ontario, where the answer had been, to paraphrase, “It’s never been done before, so we aren’t going to risk it”.
Yes, there’s a huge divide in this country: freedom, respect, community spirit and charity to the West; small-minded, envious, anti-American, freeloaders to the Centre. East of Ontario a set of values closer to those of the West re-asserts itself.
If he survives the 2 year hazing period. The endless nicknames, plus the political turmoil. He may end up a fanatic Albertan if he keeps up his observations. Particularly during an election.
I can’t wait till he grasps that he is now a second class citizen. That just living here he is now tainted in the Toronto mindset by association. Best yet when he realizes that there is a media blackout from out East & the hate aimed at us from the ROC via the misinformation.
I think he meant Huston as a metaphor for Texas. I know I have been there a few times myself. Always enjoyed the place & people. Most Westerners I find if vacationing in the US. Go to Hawaii or Las Vegas, Phoenix, Denver or pretty much anywhere in the north west.
Frankly he still seems mired in anti-western propaganda.
Yeah he’s in for a butt kicking. I give it a month myself lol. Good Post Kate.
Hey I spent most of my life in Southern Ontario [small city near western NY] but really disliked the last 10 years of it living in Toronto. It seemed the only people I got along with were from the West or the maritimes or when I visited Calgary
So I split the difference, moved to the mid-west of the USA [what they call the heartland!] and can identify with many of the posts of the self-reliant; plenty of folks raised on the farm; the trust [few locked doors and everybody says hi and waves from their cars] and they call me sir at the grocery store.
Oh yeah, they cheer for the Flames or the Oilers, if they don’t care for the Minnesota Wild! Which is great as I was raised to hate the Leafs!
Ah, to betray how stuck up one is by pointing out how stuck up others are. To chide the East for looking down on you while you are looking down at them. Westerners, with their pretentious ramblings about their unpretentious ways are about as pretentious as easterners, it seems.
I agree with josebaloni. Regionalism is a part of this country.
Karl,
“Perhaps we will win a convert.”
A convert to what? Why is this such an “Us v/s Them” game? What is wrong with Canadians? What exactly is the goal of converting him? What will he sound like if hes converted? Will he just join the cause du jour and bash the East and conform with “independent”(unless you think conforming indicaes compromising independence) thinking westerners? In one country, you are so convinced of your cause that you want to pit countryman against countryman?
“People fly the Stars and Bars here because we are indeed rebels against the official culture of Canada.”
Gee, I wonder what the good folk in the deep south would do if you flew a Canadian, or for that matter, any foreign flag there. If these folk are so enamored with the US, why dont they just go immigrate. If not, why dont they pull down the star spangled banner, put up the Maple Leaf and go and duke it out in the political arena. This whole attitude of sitting on the sidelines and doing nothing and flying another country’s flag is nothing short of absurd. Get in there and fight it out. Or stop complaining. This is Canada. If you want ot fly a foreign flag, go down to the US.
Oh, and life long marriage isnt something only blue staters have a problem with. Conservative Christians have an equally high divorce rate. Nice shot. Cheap shot. And bereft of factual evidence.
I ve got to admit that I never thought of Capitalism as a “value”. A system? yes. A value? Hardly.
What I find fascinating about Canadians is the unwillingness to compromise on anything. Why cant you disagree with the East without attacking the nation? Why must you fly a US flag?
I m not going to deny that there are several differneces between East and West, though, if one were to step back and look at the whole world, it would become clear that most of these differences are petty to the point of silliness. But they ve been built up by the politicians and the “independent” thinkers of the west have apparently come to agree. The long and short of it is that Westerners just dont like parting with their money, while Easterners are more resigned to it. Most other differences are, well, paper tigers.
Jeremiah…may I call you Jerry?
We don’t pursue fights with the east…we react to eastern aggression and ignorance because of its horrendous stereotyping and ambivalent views of who we are that some how all of Canada is a suburb of T.O. Laws are developed with T.O. in mind and no attention is paid to our concerns and the suppression of what is our historically rich culture in the west. To fly the stares and bars is not to insult the east as it is to say these are the ideas we value.
As for us not parting with our money…if you lost 118 billion for eastern values of socialism (yes capitalism is a value just as liberal-socialism is a value…the liberals ran a couple campaigns on that theme) you may excuse us for being a little upset. Let me assure you it will never happen again.
Jeremiah:
The long and short of it is that Westerners just don’t like parting with their money, while Easterners are more resigned to it. Most other differences are, well, paper tigers.
The breadth of your ignorance on the West is so skewed. I could only gape in wonder at your infantile ramblings. This is not an insult as such. Its what I really mean. The sentence you typed says it all.
I will not even begin to answer the charges you present, as their absurd. I will give you some hints at the chasm of cultural difference we hold.
1) We despise bi-lingualism as racist, useless, & not worth the money . In fact its perceived as evil because the civil service is now almost completely French Canadian when their only 20% of the population.
2) You watched broke back Mountain to many times. Frankly we despise gay marriage as cheapening the real thing.
3) Albertans are more for assimilation than multiculturalism. One law for all sort of way.
4) We are not collectivists who believe in group rights. We are staunch individualists that believe in individual liberty, versus group rights by race, gender, or sexual preference. Including the family dog.
5) Westerners are inclined to think of themselves as North Americans not Europeans as Ontarians.
6) We do not like central power or big Government like Easterners.
7) We do not think its a right to rape other Provinces of their wealth for Quebec or Ontario.
8) Really, what has confederation done for us except cause two rebellions by eastern greed aligned with arrogance?
9) We do not belittle Americans except for the few liberals & socialists here.
10) We don’t like transfer payments because it make welfare bums of whole provinces , which is good for Ottawa but bad for the Nation as whole.
11) We don’t like freeloaders. Corporate or Individuals.
12) Welfare is not a generational right to us but a hand up for self reliance in the future.
13) Where a stoic stubborn people who have fought the Trudeau communists out west for over 30 years no matter what.
14) In Alberta we all took a 4% decrease in wages just to make sure our children would have no debts left by us. Can you say the same, or would you even care about the future?
15} We have multiple education encouraged here. From home schooling to charter schools. Including the PSB having charter schools of their own. In Edmonton alone we have 7 Collages & One university.
15) We know who we are & do not define ourselves by saying where not American.
16) A man’s word here is still his or her bond.
17) We think criminals are evil not victims. That society should be protected by a rule of law. Called Justice not tolerance.
17) We keep our nose out of others business & dislike meddlers or big noses in personnel business.
18) We consider we have a destiny. We believe in being able to worship God. Something Federal Ontario has proved its against in every way. Including refugee’s that fled to the States because of false persecution. Based on a government plan to stop spanking. The left abhorrence to religion in all guises as it goes against their own faith in socialism.
19) Unlike the East, we want individual liberty, not being told what to think or act like.
20) We see socialism as one of the world great evils, not the Utopian salvation of mankind the east thinks this failed system achieves.
21) Unlike the Toronto Star & the CBC , we actually truly think freedom of speech is not only desirable but precious to a democracy’s survival. Easterners here are perceived to have a forked tongue. No set values or morality, as its deemed expedient there.
I could go on all day but these are only a few things that separate the West from the East. Paper tigers indeed lol.
Jerry has never been west of Barrie…I can tell because he’s so certain he’s right 😉
Rattfuc: Plagerize away.
jeremiah: Where to start, where to start…..
“A convert to what?”
Perhaps a convert to the notion that Canadian values are not set, changed, and enforced by the chattering classes of Toronto, Ottawa, Montreal, and especially the CBC.
“Why is this such an “Us v/s Them” game?”
Perhaps because “they” have so consistently called “us” unsophisticated un-canadian scary redneck rubes.
“What exactly is the goal of converting him?”
Redemption my boy, redemption. A mind is a terrible thing to waste, and all that.
“What will he sound like if he’s converted?”
He will sound less like a limousine liberal, talking down to the quaint local colour.
“Will he just join the cause du jour and bash the East and conform with “independent”(unless you think conforming indicaes {sic} compromising independence) thinking westerners?”
Now why would he want to bash the East? I grew up in New Brunswick, and we easterners are loveable sorts…. Oh wait, you mean he might start bashing our Upper and Lower Canadian overlords. You see, we real easterners always hated being tarred with that brush. We always caught the wrong end of whatever deal was concocted up on Toronto, Montreal, and Ottawa. In my years living in Saskatchewan and Alberta, I have found that we Maritimers were accepted and welcomed. I also found that we had common historic grievances because of our comparative lack of influence in the political process, and because we have been treated as colonial backwaters, suitable to provide resources, but otherwise to be kept in our place. As to him “conforming with independent thinking westerners” …. Better that than remaining part of that great herd of independent thinking journalists, bleating their self satisfied smug mantra “We are progressive! We are not scary! We are not Americans! We are really more European than American! Our farts don’t stink!”
“In one country, you are so convinced of your cause that you want to pit countryman against countryman?”
Ya got me. That is my cause. To pit countryman against countryman. Goodness knows that with roots on my French side going back to 1670, and on my Danish side going back to 1872, I have no real affection or attachment for Canada. You found me out! I am out to split up the country by regions. Thank goodness I have the stellar example of stalwart devotion to Canadian federalism displayed by easterners (read: Lower Canada) to correct my errant ways.
Cut the guy some slack.We all know that any easterner who has been in town for three days has had adequate time to assess the political and sartorial tastes of the place.
If you had to go to the office every day and see Ezra Levant in his “plaid jacket and trucker cap” you would be complaining too!
Too bad that these amazing powers were not used for some introspection while living at the “centre of the power”.
Well Biff,
Without going into the details of the Liberal policies at the time of the oil shocks, I think an objective reading lends a certain credibility to their action in purely economic terms – I mean there were some issues that had to be addressed. But then again, its not something that is limited to Canada. Other countries have the same issues. There will always be rich states and there will always be poor states, and the Federal government has to look at the larger picture.
Look at it this way. One state goes super rich attracting people from other states. The economic contribution made by these migrants to the new state will not match the contribution they make to their old province because of the influx of people with similar skills. I meant the number of people with that skill set in a certain province will decrease while it will increase many times over in the new rich province, because the new province would be absorbing folk from a number of provinces, not just one other province. The economic thinking behind it is justifiable, even if the politics isnt.
I m not entirely convinced that TO is the only thing in mind. I dont think anyone is under the illusion that the west can be ignored.
Flying the stars and bars is an insult, not to the east, but to this nation. Its an insult to Canada. Try flyhing a Canadian flag in the red states. If you value the “values” of the red states, then you ll understand what a bad idea it is to fly another nations flag. There is simply no excuse for showing loyalty or fealty to another nation over your own.
lots of Maple Leafs flying off the condos in Phoenix and Florida.
Personally I fly the Dominion flag 1957 version not the earlier one. and of course the Alberta Blue.
Having lived in the west and the dreaded toronto, i can truthfully say many westerners are as obnoxious and arrogant as many torontonians. At least Toronto was interesting and I didn’t have to watch the top soil blow by every spring.
As for the asskicking – yeah, really honourable idea. The poor kid’s dumb enough to go there, naive enough to try to understand, and that’s your reaction. I guess i take that personally, having once been young enough to think that approach was worthwhile.
I got over it. I’m sure he will.
”…discover a truth about the Canadian identity that they don’t teach in Carleton University political science classes – that we are more like Americans than we are one another.”
Yet another bit of nonsense regurgitated so the usual suspects can respond with their usual unsubstantiated tripe.
Jerry…
Our world has been migratory since the beginning of human history. People naturally go where they will benefit the most from labor and riches. The idea of resource sharing is anathema to societal evolution. The gov’t needs to stay out of controlling resource have provinces with resource need provinces, and when I say resource I mean natural resources and people resources.
The decimation of past liberal policies has left a deep wound to westerners and once again the liberals want to pick scabs. Their argumentations might gain some support in the east where arguments need a masters degree to massage, but I doubt that even easterners are willing to by liberal neo-NEP arguments with 30% of the TSE based on western resource companies and a very aged Ontario cashing in on RSP’s.
As for the stars and bars flying over Canada…I was at the McAllen International Airport in McAllen Texas this morning where the maple leaf was flying and I sensed a measure of pride. What is lost on eastern liberals is that what makes many of in the west proud to be Canadian is antithetical to liberal polices that have hindered our freedom, culture, strong traditions and the identity of who we are.
You know, I went on a driving trip with my Dad about nine years ago for about 3 weeks- it was a bonding thing. We left from Hamilton. We made it across the American midwest – we saw the Mississipi – we saw the corn in Nebraska and followed the Platte – we made it to Denver – we camped in Yellowstone – we saw the start of the great Missouri River. It was great.
The thing I remember most though was crossing back into Canada from Montana at Sweet Grass after 3 weeks. The Canadian border guard was very friendly unlike the American border guards on the other side. We suddenly felt a burden being lifted off of our shoulders – which we didn’t really know we had. (My Dad being Irish could see the difference right away and so could I. We felt that we were home.)
Alberta is unique (as are all provinces and states even) but it is not American – it is Canadian. Half the people I meet in Calgary come from eastern Canada. And btw, Alberta completely dominates all of the bordering and close to bordering US States (both economically and population wise). What is great is that Calgarians and Albertans have self-confidence and that will allow them to do things their way – and not neccessarily the American way.
For a long time Toronto tried to be a pretend American City – because they felt inferior. It is now the 3rd biggest city in North America (surpassing Chicago). Cities this size have their own sub-cultures (and it is not at all like rural Ontario). Toronto is Canada’s ‘Big Apple’ and all Canadians should be proud of that – just like Americans are proud of the original ‘Big Apple’ – New York City.
jeremiah:
If you value the “values” of the red states, then you ll understand what a bad idea it is to fly another nations flag.
Just a small point here, but who’s flag?
We had one before it was bastardized. The liberals dumped it for one showing only their party colors with a maple leaf that only grows in Central Canada. Like all they do, it was forced on us. With no real output but by the left leaning centralists.
To add insult to injury they refused to even have two small bands of blue at each end to represent The Atlantic to the Pacific. Why? Because since it has been revealed in biographies that the liberals did not want any reminder of conservative blue.
The whole flag business was a charade for propaganda purposes, & of course to further liberal power mongering. We had this thing dumped on us without even a referendum.
Frankly Alberta’s Flag means more to me. It has history, the new liberal Canadian one founded by the Person liberals. Is a committee flag & looks the part to a T. A phony flag for what’s become under the lefties, a snake oil Nation.
I have seen plenty of Canadian flags in the States. Like here, they just ask that the American National one is higher than the rest.
By the way it was those self same Liberals that broke the Constitution they themselves wrote. When they looted Alberta’s provincial resources illegally. Thus nullifying the very Confederation this Nation was based on.
I would agree that there is a different culture in the west. However, you must also realize that Vancouver is more like Toronto than like Calgary in some ways – I would say that the culture in Vancouver is western but the politics are very similar to what you find in Toronto or even Halifax. The politics in Calgary are completely different from those in Halifax.
That being said, you must also keep in mind that there are many in the east whose hearts and minds are more similar to Calgarians than their next-door neighbours. So it is all about proportion – much like in the States, where the population typically shifts from 40% republican democrat in blue states to 60% in red states, and rarely lies outside this range anywhere.
In democracy, the majority always gets the government it wants, and so the divide is exaggerated. Additionally, it takes a long time for these percentages to change, because many people never change their political allegiances over the course of their lifetimes, and a lifetime is a long time these days.
Whoa,haha
Got quite a few fingers wagging now, havent I?
Anyway, I might as well get down to it.
“1) We despise …only 20% of the population.”
Government recruiting allows for people who do not speak French to apply. You are then taught by specialists. There is nothing stopping a unilingual from applying, other than an unwillingness to learn another language. Its hardly asking for too mcuh.
“2) You watched ..cheapening the real thing.”
Havent seen it. Not going to either. Note that he said life long marriages, not straight marriages. Life long marriages are destroyed by divorce not gay marriage. And the divorce rates are similar.
“3) Albertans .. One law for all sort of way.’
Well, I dont see the problem there. As I recall Canada has only one set of laws that apply to all and sundry.
“4) We are not collectivists … family dog.”
I think it would be very severe exxageration to say that you are denied most individual liberties in Canada.
“5) Westerners are inclined to think of themselves as North Americans not Europeans as Ontarians.”
Ontarians like to think they re Europeans? Really? They watch American TV, are exposed to American media and think they re Europeans? When has an Ontarian ever said he thinks he European? You re bashing Easterners for being presumptouous, but arent you being equally presumptuous with statements liek this.
“6) We do not like central power or big Government like Easterners.”
Boils down to money doesnt it. Big government = higher taxes. You dont want to part with it. Easterners are more resigned. For what its worth, I m not a big fan of big government either, but that doesnt make me a westerner, does it?
“7) We do not think its a right to rape other Provinces of their wealth for Quebec or Ontario.”
In that case, would you rather have Quebecers and Ontarions coming and settling down in Alberta? Because if that money isnt transferred there, they re going to follow it. Causing chaos for the federation. And for Alberta.
“8) Really, what has confederation done for us except cause two rebellions by eastern greed aligned with arrogance?”
I know you want to believe that Alberta built itself out of nothing, but there was a time when there was precious little in Alberta and most of the crucial infrastructure on which Alberta was built and has thrived, was funded by the, you guessed it, big government in the east. Money has been transferred in both directions. In more recent times more has gone away than has come in. But you compain all the same.
“9) We do not belittle Americans except for the few liberals & socialists here.”
No. You belittle Easterners instead. The scorn is the same even if the target is different.
“10) We don’t …Nation as whole.”
Fair enough, but thats a problem with democracy, not Easterners. I believe they call it pork barelling south of the border. And believe it or not, the nation you so admire, has as many problems with patronage as this one. Its the system, not the Easterner.
“11) We don’t like freeloaders. Corporate or Individuals.”
Nobody does. But some people genuinely need welfare. Again, its more about parting with your money than any real.. issue.
“12) Welfare is not a …future.”
Not sure what you mean there.
“13) Where a …no matter what.”
Right. You had political differences with the guy so you insult the country of giving him a majority. Nicely done. What about the apparent lack of a candidate you would support, to match him?
“14) In Alberta we all took a 4% decrease in wages… about the future?”
Hey your neighbors down south – the ones whose values so want to adopt would be positively repulsive to you if what you say here has any relevance to the so-called East West rivalry.
“15} We have … university.”
Toronto has 3 Universities, Montreal has 4. And numerous colleges. And all kinds of schools. I m not sure what you re trying to point out here.
“15) We know who we are & do not define ourselves by saying where not American.”
Who are you? And why do people who think like you feel the need to define themselves by flying the star-spangled banner? What do you define yourself as? A Westerner? Cos by definition, it seems a Westerner is defined as someone who is not “Eastern”.
“16) A man’s word here is still his or her bond.”
Ontario and Quebec are full of liars. Apparently. This kind of false bravado is a bit passe. You sound like the Victorian English who went about colonising folk. I m willing to bet that there are as many liars in Alberta as anywhere else in Canada, or indeed the world.
“17) We think … Called Justice not tolerance.”
On the one hand you re religious. On the other hadn you want to be god. Go back to Augustine. Treat a criminal well and let him repent. It is for God, not man, to decide what his punishment will be. Thrashing him around isnt going to help. Looking into the causes might help in stopping it in the future. Tell me, what would you do to Jean Valjean in Les Miserables?
“17) We keep .. business.”
And “we” cry bloody murder when Trudeau says that the government has no place in peoples bedrooms. Besides, what makes you think everyone in the East is involved in other peopls business. Built an imaginary pulpit for yourself, have you?
“18) We consider …faith in socialism.”
You want to spank your child, but the government said no, so you bash the country. Tell me, who comes first, God or country?
“19) Unlike the East, …think or act like.”
Oh god. I cant type. I didnt get permission to think about what I wanted to type. You make the East sound like communist enclave. It hardly is. You re free to do just about anything, and act in any way – with only one caveat – that you dont deliberately try to attack or offend someone. If you want to go to Nazi Rallies, go down to the US. Such things will not be tolerated in Canada, even if it means being told how to think and act.
“20) We see socialism ..failed system achieves.”
And Capitalism as a value apparently. Though I do agree with you on this point. Mostly because the choice of consumer goods in this country really really pales in comparison to the stuff available south of the border. It would be nice if they scrapped that 750 dollar limit, too…BTW, I dont htink I m the only one up east who is against socialism.
“21) Unlike the Toronto Star & the CBC , No set values or morality, as its deemed expedient there.”
The greivances agains the CBC, I understand. The grievances against the Star, I dont. Its a private newspaper and it has an ideology. On the one hand you profess faith in freedom of speech, but then you go on to demonize a private newspaper that i guess does not reflect your views.
So tell me, anything of substance in there? Or just rehashed grievances? It sounds like you re parroting all the views of the politicians you support. Being told how to act and behave by the government, or by politicians or indeed by teachers in high school – its all the same. Most of your grievances sound like they were invented for you. The Ontarions and Quebeckers are liars one is one that especially stand sout .
WLMKR
“Jerry has never been west of Barrie…I can tell because he’s so certain he’s right ;-)”
Nah, I dont think I m right. But I do see some merit to being assertive. Keeps the name throwers out of the game, if you know what I mean. All the same, me has been to Calgary and Vancouver.
Karl,
Eh. Interesting response. Much appreciated.
Biff,
Well, yes, I do see what you re getting at. I m no Liberal party stalwart, but I hate the way a number of people on this board all but declare their allegiance to the US.
Revnant,
Fly the Albertan flag. Why the American? In the US, well, I doubt any American citizens fly the Canadian flag. I m sure the flag is there at airports and offices and the like, but you are more likely to see an Albertan fly an American flag than you are an American citizen flying a Canadian flag. And there are many people in America who do support the Canadian system (the north East Blue states for example) but I daresay we will enver see them fly a Maple leaf.
I dont think there are any inherent differences between Canadians in the East and the West, none that arent to some extent motivated by political considerations anyway.
With regard to the maple leaf, legitimate though your grievances are, the flag has been adopted and is recognised internationally as a Canadian symbol and should be treated as such. Howver I do not object at all to your flying an Alberta flag.
jeremiah :
The Ontarians and Quebeckers are liars one is one that especially stand sout .
Only the ones with the collectivist mentality. I actually feel sorry for anyone one who is not one of these new Canadians steeped in socialism & self esteem. With no real idea or the history of this Country. It must be conservative hell.
As for the grievances you have no idea. It comes with Mothers milk here. You forget we don’t look up to politicians or government . So why should we believe them? This is a 100 years of domination talking. As well as life long observations.
Like the Maritimes being stripped for Quebec ship building. The NEP to destroy Alberta’s economy. These are not the actions of a true Nation. Morse like spoiled contemptible thieves who want it all.
What are we you ask? Free People beholden to know one. People who think there rights are more important than criminals, drug addicts, indigents or socialists.
Individuals who respect difference without conformity. In other words its an attitude. You ask yourselves out East. The Americans are doing this or that. We here in the West say. The Americans are doing what we are. The difference is subtle but in action, is light years in ones sense of difference with purpose.
I am a North American , than Albertan, than a Westerner, than Canadian. Get it now. You on the other hand think your a European. Now a dying species. Like the Panda they don’t breed anymore.
To busy worshipping their unholy trinity of self. I myself & Me.
By the way which version of Canada do you ascribe too that the liberals have foisted on this polity? The great white north, the Multicultural paradise, the socialist (disaster) miracle, the best America haters, Trying to be euro-trash, the beer commercial, a country without an army ? Hard to know the libs change it every ten years & like good sheep the lefty’s begin to accept hook line & sinker anything their party say’s as true.
I might commend a series of books about Alberta & the Wests history by the Byfields & other Albertans. Even Harper helped.
Any way, off to the horses go I.
Happy trails
jeremiah:
“Well, I dont see the problem there. As I recall Canada has only one set of laws that apply to all and sundry.”
Try telling that to a praire farmer that wants to sell me a bushel of wheat. Or conversly, tell a farmer in Ontario that he will be fined and/or jailed if he tries to sell his wheat himself.
and this piece of brilliance:
“I know you want to believe that Alberta built itself out of nothing, but there was a time when there was precious little in Alberta and most of the crucial infrastructure on which Alberta was built and has thrived, was funded by the, you guessed it, big government in the east.”
Oooohh, I get it now. The silk hats and robber barons built the railroads from the purely altruistic motivation of trying to build up the west. It just shows how wrong I had it. Up until now, I thought they built the railroads in order to make great stinking piles of money selling the millions of acres of land granted to them by the Government as incentive to build the railroad, and then to make even larger piles of money shipping freight to the farmers they sold the land to, and then making even more money shipping the grain the farmers produced, and then making even more money after successfully lobbying for subsidies so that it was cheaper to grind that grain at their mills in eastern Canada, or to feed it to western cattle in eastern feedlots. Thank goodness there has never been any graft and kickbacks involved in this scheme, or else I might get downright cynical.
I’ve lived in Calgary for almost 30 years – a Toronto/Montreal transplant. This city has the “Toronto” disease, now. Just listen to the control freaks down at city hall. Ban this, ban that, can’t do this or can’t do that. They’ve taken on tasks outside of a city’s purview. They should just stick to picking up garbage, fixing roads and running transit. Leave the social engineering to the province.
joebloni wrote:
My first thought was nearly the same – “He’s discovered federalism.” However, I’m puzzled by his reference to southern US cities. I suspect he’d find a much better match to the people in Des Moines, Iowa, or Kansas City, Mo.
rather than what I would consider an Southern city like Atlanta, Ga.
And for the record, I have spent almost my entire life in the Baltimore-Washington corridor, but I feel like an open plains type of guy.
The insufferable little upstart writes:
“the women wear cheap perfume and need orthodontic work” AND “the view that out-of-touch bigwigs in Ottawa don’t know anything about the west” On the first count, he should get out a little more before letting his mouth run off because I don’t like his chances of getting a date in Calgary. On the second count he merely proves the point (except for the big-wig part…cause clearly no big wig would be sent to Calgary) No need to kick his ass (if you could find it)he’ll be on the first plane outta town.
I spent some time in Minden with friends of mine a few years back. People there drive their lawn tractor to the LCBO.
Should ask him, what do you expect for 5.00.