As I write this Boob Rae is the guest on the Roy Green show. He is very incoherent in many of his answers. Under the Liberals there is sure to be a Cap-and-trade program. There is your Green Shift. Rae states that in order to stave off "Global Warming" and our dependence on "foreign oil" we must do something to bring down carbon emissions.

Does this idiot not understand that we are NOT dependent on foreign oil - that we are a net oil exporter? Given his low intellectual capacity I'm not at all surprised that he continues to drink the kool-aid from the very discredited well of Global Warming.

Boob Rae needs to understand in no uncertain terms that Western Canada will never allow Central Canada to impose a defacto National Energy Program again.

The Green Shaft lives with the aim of greater control over our lives and money.
GET LOST

So when will the good people of Wascana, now benfitting from O+G exploration and production, finally turn on Ralph Goodale?

Yup, ipod taxes, carbon taxes, and increases in corporate taxes. Same old line from the Liberals, more money into the centre to buy everyone off. Programs the majority dont need, only those who are the apples of the Liberals eye.

Con majority please, lets stick a fork in these guys and turn them over, they are done.

Fastest way to destroy our recovering economy is to sabotage this nation with carbon taxes. We can't afford Iffy as PM, he'll financially ruin us like Macslimy did to Ontario.

I also noticed that very few reporters have mentioned the cap and trade policy. I have no doubt that the CPC will highlight it for voters. Meanwhile, "experts" and the MSM will remind us how stupid and greedy we are for not wanting to pay eco-tithes.

This is a huge find; make sure everyone you know is aware of this.
Tax, tax,tax, the price of everything will go up big-time if the Libs get in.
Just what the economy does not need.

Well I guess we'll have to shut down the Nanticoke coal generating station.

Mark this as the beginning of the Liberal meltdown.

1) The tories will absolutley go to town on this one. There are quites of Iggy disavowing the green shift after the last election. So not only is he resurrecting an unpopular policy he has been all over the map on this one. Bad policy and hypocrisy are never a good combination, usually the last one is the killer

2) The Liberal campaign, despite the good week, is not deep. I suspect this will highlight the thinness of the campaign, like Day 1 answer on the coalition. Except this time there is no easy way out...he will have to wear it

3) Total wedge issue, expect the NDP to come out swinging on the Liberals as well. They differentiated themselves last time on this issue, they will do it again and be consistent with their anti HST messaging. Look for the NDP votes to return home

4) The punditocracy will abandon Michael after the sustained shelling that is about to come. They cant lose future acess to the majority government that the polls will indicate. Especially one that they believe to be more tha capable of being vindictive.....proving again it is better to be feared than respected.

It will be more interesting to see the reaction to the attack and the poll meltdown than the actual policy. They, the Grits, arent ready and this should tie them up in knots for maybe the rest of the election as they try to explain why they got pasted last time on this policy and they brought it back.

This along with 8 Billion in spend. Different priorities indeed!

Didn't the US carbon trading system collapse and close because carbon went from $20 a tonne to

PET Cemetery Report.

Norman: "As I write this Boob Rae is the guest on the Roy Green show. He is very incoherent in many of his answers."

Boob Rae is under sedation for his depression.

Note: Liberal Citoyen Kyoto Dionky has a white dog; Rae has a black dog (of depression).

(BTW, Rae is Mao Stlong, aka Maurice UNaBomber Strong's nephew.)

You may get close up to Bob here:

"Politics
This is actually a fascinating video -- Bob Rae, talking about his own battle with depression and how he feels about life in Ottawa right now. He doesn't connect the two ..."

http://thestar.blogs.com/politics/2010/10/bob-rae-up-close-and-personal.html

The Liberal Party..running on all the rejected policies..again.
So would this be a 'hidden agenda'?

I will buy a beer for the first person who can post the video of the interview that gets referenced in this editorial in the national post in Nov 2008.

"Now Mr. Ignatieff-- who vigorously championed a carbon tax when he campaigned unsuccessfully for the leadership in 2006 -- has told CTV's Mike Duffy there is no chance he will revive the scheme if he replaces Mr. Dion. Meanwhile, Mr. Rae has likened Green Shift to "cod liver oil" and also vowed no redux. No matter who leads the Liberals beginning next year, a carbon tax will be a non-starter"

He really is Iffy again isnt he.

No wonder they are trying to hide this platform.
To see how a 2008 Green Energy initiative might have worked, look no further than Dalton McGuinty's Ont. There are consequences to electing ideological fanatics to power; Ont has the most committed Green advocate in North America, and also about to have the highest energy rates. Quite a feat given ample resources of hydro, plus nuclear power.

SAtephen - is this the story you're looking for?

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/WinnipegHome/20090215/iggy_west_090215/

I disagree with a previous poster who labels Bob Rae 'et al' ideological zealots' on the carbon tax/Green Shift.

They are front men for a scam that dwarfs Bernie Madoff.

They are in it for the money: you elevate them by claiming it is for 'ideology'.

Different Bob,

Sort of. But I want the video of the interview where Iggy says he wont ressurect Green Shift...this story confirms that was the sentiment. But video makes it crystal clear and knowing Iffy he said it in some sort of over the top definitive way that just makes him look like a fool.

But it is clear from that interview that whatever he said in Winnipeg in 2008 he no longer believes. So back to my earlier comment....get rid of Ralph.

Stephen - Ralph is a big Eastern Liberal who could give a crap about Western Canada. He showed that when he helped engineer the coup of a couple of years ago. The West finally hads a voice and he wanted to silence it.

Just what the hell do the voters in Wascana know that voters in ALL other Saskatchewan ridings don't?

BTW - Iggy said those things in Regina, not Winnipeg - not that it matters. He should have said them in Calgary and Edmonton - if they'd ever allow him in.

When the NEP was in Alberta took the big hit but this time Saskatchewan has alot to lose also. In other words - it won't just be the East against one province next time.

All academic - Harper will ride this horse to the majority many of us so badly want.

To try and understand the immense lack of knowledge in Bob Rae's brain one need only listen to a debate that took place between him and John Ridpath(prof at York) in I believe the early 90's. The topic was Capitalism vs Socialism- which system is more moral. I think it might still be available at the Ayn Rand bookstore.
Rae comes off as a bumbling baffoon incapable of defending his position or any position for that matter. He ends up looking like a fool. It is really quite revealing given the fact that six months following the debate he formed the government in Ontario. Pathetic.

Regina ... please stand up and vote Ralph Goodale out of Parliament. He has done enough damage to western Canada.
Ralph Goodale wants to take all of Saskatchewan's hard earned dollars and give them to Quebec.
Do the right thing and vote him out. Please!!!!

If I'm not mistaken the Conservative party has yet to nominate anyone in Wascana. Maybe hoping the vote splits and the seat goes NDP. I know, I know - doesn't make any sense to me either.

For the longest time Alberta stood to lose the most from Liberal NEP plans. Today, BC and Sask have massive energy reserves that will be hurt by Liberal policies. We can't get much stronger in Alberta and Sask but this could add several BC seats for our tally.

I also heard Lil' Bobby Rae on Roy Green's show. Not a word did the Lieberals peep about a Carbon Tax.

Let's see how Canadians feel about "going it alone without the Americans"! Such a brilliant strategy in very nervous economic times, eh?! Not!!!

Iggy isn't hiding it. It's even on a campaign sign:
http://www.katewerk.com/sign/generator.php?line1=Cap+and+Trade&line2=is+on+PAGE+48&line3=(You+didn't+want+a&line4=job+anyway%2C+did+you%3F&line5=&formsent=true&generate.x=69&generate.y=21

[Sorry for not hot linking; my earlier hot link got a 'comment held' anti-spam thing.]

This is why the argument certain bien pensants trot out, that Harper's government is just the same as Iggy's would be, holds no water.

Between blowing the economy's brains out with the Green Shaft, and busting the budget with even more entitlement programs like universal day care, a Liberal government would have been, and would be, infinitely worse than even the "free-spending" Conservatives are.

Andy beat me to it, but here's my Liberal Campaign Sign!

Anyone who still thinks, after seeing this, there are no connections to BO,Harvard,Jones Sunstein Power Strong Soros etal and the SCAM globall warming with this Iggula fellow, well I have a Peace Bridge in Calgary to sell you. This bridge was foisted upon the good taxpayers of Calgary by another insipid liberal Dave Bronconnier. The liberal never sleeps, he is in constant pickpocket motion. Remember the urgency to elect Paul Martin, he was told from Beiging not to fail, when he did they soon found another stooge, (Dion) to front their heist, when this failed they crowned, (so democratically) King Iggula, and another attempt to debase, with this green theft, one of the only stable countries left on earth, Canada. Save Canada, give Harper a resounding majority, send Igula back to his puppet-masters.

Andy beat me to it, but here's my Liberal Campaign Sign!

This is another NEP that will bankrupt all of the oil producing Provinces. Gasoline will be over $2.00 per litre. Electricity bills will double.

RFB - You nail it when you talk about expensive gasoline and electrical bills. In fact many, if not most, electrical utilities have infrastructure that is badly in need of repair and upgrading. This alone will cause your electricity bill to increase substantially.

If the Lieberals are allowed to bring in their Carbon Taxes consumers will be stretched financially beyond their worse nightmares.

I'm thinking that Harper has been handed the "Majority" generating issue on a silver platter.

G-L-O-R-I-A!

You know, I'm sitting here wondering "what could they possibly be thinking to resurrect this green shift crap after what happened in the last election??" The only logical answer is that the Libs think they can win without the West.........just go with the Mon-To-Van coalition, who may buy this green sham..........that's the only thing that makes any sense here. We're back to "screw the West, we'll take the rest". I just can't see it working any better this time. How disconnected from the country are these people??

LC Bennett wrote: "Meanwhile, 'experts' and the MSM will remind us how stupid and greedy we are for not wanting to pay eco-tithes."

..."eco-tithes" says it all.

On the McLaughlin Group today:

00:00:01 This week the north atlantic treaty organization, nato, took over command, a canadian will head the mission.
00:00:10 Lieutenant general charles bouchard.
00:00:12 Canada and seven additional nations will now contribute air and or naval support.
00:00:20 Canada, seven c f-18 bombers.
00:00:23 Denmark, six f-16 fighter jets.
00:00:26 Greece, one frigate ship, four military bases.
00:00:30 Italy, 12 warplanes.
00:00:31 Norway, six f-16's, romania, one frigate.
00:00:36 Turkey, five warships, one submarine.
00:00:38 , eight warships, three submarines, two guided missile destroyers, plus f-15 and f-16 fighter jets.
00:00:49 Non-nato nations also have offered jets.
00:00:54 Qatar, the united arab emirates, and sweden.
00:00:58 When nato took control this week an official pled to the u.k.
00:01:03 Gaddafi's foreign secretary aka his secretary of state, moussa koussa.
00:01:10 British foreign secretary william hague confirmed it thursday.
00:01:14 >> The libyan foreign minister moussa koussa arrived at airport yesterday from that area.
00:01:24 His resignation shows gaddafi's regime which has seen significant reductions is fragmented, under pressure and crumbling from within.

http://www.livedash.com/transcript/mclaughlin_group/9/KQED/Sunday_April_3_2011/578972/

NATO fighter jets require FUEL, and those who ostensibly SUPPORT the mission should understand this.

Taxes are a government mechanism whereby money is taken (confiscated) from one group or person and given to another.

The lpc can call it cap and trade or whatever else they want to, but it is a tax. It is the largest new tax since the GST.

Canadians need to be apprised of this new tax.

http://www.katewerk.com/sign/generator.php?line1=The+Green+Shit&line2=is+back!&line3=(And+no%2C+that's+&line4=not+a+typo.)&line5=&formsent=true&generate.x=96&generate.y=22

I was reviewing old Ignatieff interviews looking for his "no carbon tax" statement but I didn't find it. In fact, MI was quite consistent about sustainable energy development - I hate that word. One video that might be interesting is this one where he proclaims his allegiance to Alberta and the oilsands. Then again, so does every Liberal leader until they get desperate for urban NDP and Quebec votes.

I was reviewing old Ignatieff interviews looking for his "no carbon tax" statement but I didn't find it. In fact, MI was quite consistent about sustainable energy development - I hate that word. One video that might be interesting is this one where he proclaims his allegiance to Alberta and the its dirty but misunderstood oil economy. Then again, so does every Liberal leader until they get desperate for urban NDP and Quebec votes.

LC....if it exists it is referenced for Nov 2008 on Mike Duffy.

Referencing the coalition though....this stick cn be used to beat the NDP with it as well. The NDP opposed the Green Shift in the last election. I dont think their positiion has changed.

Pull a Jack Layton and ask Jack Layton a Jack Layton style question....so which is it Mr Layton, do you support a carbon tax or are you just a liar?

I did happen upon a Mike Duffy interview but I didn't watch it because I was looking for a 2009 press conference. Maybe I'll retrace my tracks.

BTW, here is the link I forgot to reference last post (my first attempt got caught in the filter):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Vm3yj5hByw&feature=related

As to Layton, his actions from last weak lead me to conclude he will say no to carbon pricing in English and oui to the same question in French and the media won't notice. Jack certainly has gotten slimier in the past couple of years.

http://www.albertalocalnews.com/reddeeradvocate/news/national/Ignatieff_favours_cap-and-trade_75389922.html?period=W&mpStartDate=02-13-2011&period=W&period=W&period=W&period=W&

"He joked that even the oil industry is ahead of the Harper government on the need for a green economy.

Ignatieff said the centrepiece of his environmental plan would be a cap-and-trade system — where companies must buy credits if they pass a certain emissions level while greener companies collect credits for under-polluting.

“The Canadian system must be equitable across all regions of the country,” said the prepared text of Ignatieff’s speech.

“It must not penalize those who have already taken the lead. It must cover all of Canada’s industries, with no exceptions."

Interesting article:

http://www.albertalocalnews.com/reddeeradvocate/news/national/Ignatieff_favours_cap-and-trade_75389922.html?period=W&mpStartDate=02-13-2011&period=W&period=W&period=W&period=W&

Iggy is the federal version of Dalton McGuinty. A lying, incompetent, sleazy, two faced, pompous, arrogant, know-it-all buffoon. What McScumbag did to Ontario Iggy will do to the rest of Canada. Why should the people of Ontario be the only ones freezing in the dark. We need company. Vote Liberal !

Natural gas is A sustainable energy source for about the next three hundred years. Why are we even talking About solar And wind?

I'm just so disgusted with the Liberals. They won't be happy until they steal all of our money and take away all of our freedoms.
I pray that Harper wins a majority!!!

The sad thing is, though we can point these things out, the Conservative "war room" will NOT do anything about this. I wonder what they are getting paid for. Now is the time to focus on policy and point out their errors.

I am talking to a lot of first time voters to get out and vote - for whatever party [yet suggest strongly to vote for the Cons.]

I would blame two things on not getting a majourity this time [at the present]:

1. voter turn out is low

2. the War Room, who have been given a number of useless policies and statements, like this discussed here, that can be shot down - yet appear to do nothing.

Canadians need information on policies mentioned on this, and other great Con blogs, and the lack of information out there. Us political junkies are up-to-date on this stuff, yet the average voter knows little. I wish I knew the answer, yet the War Room seems to neglect policies - I really hope they read blogs and listen to our comments.

Before everyone jumps on poor ol'Iffy for keeping his silly globull warming mediation plans hidden, how about we expose the Conservatves for their equally foolish promises to cut our CO2 emmissions. This is precisely why I cut off any donations to these lying hypocrites. The Cons have my vote only because there is no other serious consideration. More CO2 is good!

I do agree with you Clown Party. The CPC needs more SDA. SDA gets results - just ask 'forlorn Lorne' (Calvert), he and his Dippers were flushed down some pothole in Sask. in the last Provincial election and have been chamber pot echos ever since. Lorne didn't speak for the people of Sask.; he found out who did speak for the people of Sask.: resounding thud.

Simmy;

I suppose you still believe the Global Warming/Climatte Change lie - Like the LIEberals. Sorry, you are on the wrong site to promopte anything to do with those lies.

Yes Carbon is good - polution is bad.

The Cons did not keep promises on many things, yet better than the promises of the Red Book - as far as I know not TWO promise kept in their 13 years of dictatroship. [I do not know of even one, but giving you the benifet of doubt.]

Your vote for the Cons is appreciated - yet if you relly find no support for LIEberals, Black-mail Party [in case you live in Quebec,] or the Non-Democradic Party, you can always vote for an independant.

Nanos overnight polling shows the Conservative lead over the Liberals has stretched to 14 points. The cons are clearly in majority territory.

Gotta love it - every time Ignatieff opens his mouth Harper surges ahead.

Looked at CTV and CBC websites this morning and found absolutely nothing on the Green Shift/Cap-and-Trade plank in the Lib platform. Figures.

If you want video confirmation of the mindset of the Libel elite then refer back to the hidden camera video of the NPR debacle. I honestly think that the thought process isn't that different. Substitute the Libel backroom boys with the NPR fundraisers.

Clown Party wrote"

Simmy;

I suppose you still believe the Global Warming/Climatte Change lie - Like the LIEberals. Sorry, you are on the wrong site to promopte anything to do with those lies.
Yes Carbon is good - polution is bad.
The Cons did not keep promises on many things, yet better than the promises of the Red Book - as far as I know not TWO promise kept in their 13 years of dictatroship. [I do not know of even one, but giving you the benifet of doubt.]

Your vote for the Cons is appreciated - yet if you relly find no support for LIEberals, Black-mail Party [in case you live in Quebec,] or the Non-Democradic Party, you can always vote for an independant."

My main on-line hobby is reading all about the AGW hoax. I am convinced it is a hoax. I am convinced Harper knows it is a hoax. But he has powerful puppet masters and I do not for a minute think they will not impose drastic taxes and smoke and mirror trading schemes on Canadians if given a chance. As soon as they promise not to impose carbon pricing I will resume my donations. Until then I will keep it in a kitty to pay my tax increases.

It's not Green Shift, it's a Cap & Trade. Green Shift was what is now often now called Fee & Dividend.
Fee and dividend vs. cap and trade
Perhaps this is not being made more of by the CP because it would draw attention to their plan.

Dizzy,

Which would mean talking about intesity targets.

The politics of this are cap and trade, fee and dividend both rely on raising the price for carbon because it is deemed to be an externality that needs to be captured, like pollution.

One way or another it raises money and it is a tax.

Intesity targets are bare knuckled regulation. Not that I am fan of that either.

But everything starts from an assumption that carbon is bad. If the first rule of the uncertain environemnt is do no harm it means that cap and trade or even a carbon tax is relatively light and small, barley covering the infrastructure cost of "making the market". As an opening gambit regulation and instesity targets make more sense till we well and truly determine the problem.

I will at least give them credit that they dont want to be buying credits from Russia and Zimabawe anymore....apparently......

But the issue just isnt there anymmore, and by the way look forward to Iggy wading into the weeds to explain why fee and dividend is different from Cap and Trade.....one that most people will take as a distinction without a difference.

Dizzy,

Which would mean talking about intesity targets.

The politics of this are cap and trade, fee and dividend both rely on raising the price for carbon because it is deemed to be an externality that needs to be captured, like pollution.

One way or another it raises money and it is a tax.

Intesity targets are bare knuckled regulation. Not that I am fan of that either.

But everything starts from an assumption that carbon is bad. If the first rule of the uncertain environemnt is do no harm it means that cap and trade or even a carbon tax is relatively light and small, barley covering the infrastructure cost of "making the market". As an opening gambit regulation and instesity targets make more sense till we well and truly determine the problem.

I will at least give them credit that they dont want to be buying credits from Russia and Zimabawe anymore....apparently......

But the issue just isnt there anymmore, and by the way look forward to Iggy wading into the weeds to explain why fee and dividend is different from Cap and Trade.....one that most people will take as a distinction without a difference.

Srephen
Intensity reductions have meant that oil usage has increased at slower rates than the usual predictions.
But, as you say, the view is that carbon used actually has to decrease, not just rise more slowly.
Compared with Cap & Trade, Fee & Dividend can be relatively simple to run, not requiring an international trading market with its iinevitable corruption & profit-taking.. [The ozone trade, simple by comparison with only a few firms involved, still had a chinese factory producing CFs so that they could be traded for cash & destroyed.]
The fee would made carbon-sourced products more expensive, which would lead to individuals [corporate & real] devising ways to lower consumption.
If the dividend were handled well- it would also add incentive to lower consumption. The simplest would be to just distribute the money equally to all, so all would have some incentive.
For gas, at the high end people might make buying decisions that "lower the intensity" of the price increases, at the lower end the guy who rides his bike everywhere would be able to buy a new bike every few years with his dividend.
[I think B.C. has payroll tax reductions in mind. Australia wants to supplement pensions & lower taxes.]

Oh, but how can this be? Everyone knows that the liberals are 'strongly opposed' to carbon taxes, according to the cbc vote compass.

"My main on-line hobby is reading all about the AGW hoax. I am convinced it is a hoax. I am convinced Harper knows it is a hoax. But he has powerful puppet masters and I do not for a minute think they will not impose drastic taxes and smoke and mirror trading schemes on Canadians if given a chance. As soon as they promise not to impose carbon pricing I will resume my donations. Until then I will keep it in a kitty to pay my tax increases.

Posted by: Simmy at April 4, 2011 1:03 PM "

I agree with you. The Cons have not said they believe that Global Warming/Climate Change is a lie ... in fact they used the term already in this election. I think the Cons have no backbone to stand up to this lie and particularly the enviroMENTALISTS. There in lies the danger; they do not deny it, so there is a very slim chance they might implimant something - though there is no indication. Thai is also a weakness I see annd when they deny this lie, I will feel more comfortable - like you.

Simmy - thank you for clearing up my mistaken opinion, you are right on.

The most horrendous part of cap and trade is the government imposing it would be selling dispensation to do something they deem offensive (without proof) if you pay for your penance.
Those that can't or won't pay, just what would the government do exactly?
Iggy says they would force the payment, how exactly?
Perhaps there's a question our intrepid media could ask the professor.
I know what Mark Holland would say.
"We'll shut them down".