judicial rulings and public naiveté were paralyzing his spies

Ever heard of "covert" intelligence gathering, Jimmy Judd?

If the judiciary and public know what you're doing to the point that they have any effect on the way you operate the intelligence service then you aren't doing it right.

Mr Judd should get a senior federal cabinet appointment for telling the simple truth.

What does Carolyn Parrish think about this?

And then it is held that "military intelligence" is an oxymoran.....

Confusing the bleatings of the media with public opinion is not intelligent.

Bass-akwards yet again, Oz.

Yukon Gold, any details to back up your assertion, potato head?

"specifically lamenting that Canadians were prone to “knee-jerk anti-Americanism” and “paroxysms of moral outrage.”.."

Right.On.The.Money

Right on Yukon!
Speaking of “delusional Canadians, reeking of our moral self-importance” = Oz

“knee-jerk anti-Americanism” and “paroxysms of moral outrage.”

Thank Liberals and their Pierre Elliot Trudeau 'legacy'; the true enemies of the best interests of Canada.

Hey Oz, ix-nay on the covert-nay otherwise Treadstone might put out a sanction on you.

Seeing how CSIS was central to provocateuring (staging) events that provide justification for the passage of this nations most draconian legislation, there is little reason for freedom loving Canadians to support this nest of vipers who frame up targets their master's political needs.

However Judd is correct that 40 plus years of Canadian left media pimping Anti-American soft Marxism has left us with a national psychosis. America, its free society, constitution and populist republic are a model of evolved democracy we should admire. Unfortunately that America was killed off at the turn of the 20th century when America's oligarchy took control of the levers of power from the electorate. It's this finacial-political oligarchy and its corrupt power structure continuity which has undermined the constitution and the republic who we should despise.

Unfortunately Canadians are generally too politically naive or disinformed to distinguish between the two.

An excellent observation by Occam at December 1, 2010 12:12 PM

Remeber the spies are a tool of the ruling class, regardless of their private or unofficial opinion.

The ruling class will fashion the public agenda based on the research and findings if the spies.

Actually Oz is right. The ex-CIA officer the Agency approved, then disapproved of his book stated the CIA doesn't have the bodies to do spy stuff. He states it is a moribund bureaucracy much like the rest of the civil service with the same problems and lack of solutions. Poor selection, high washout rate and a lack of focus but they like spy novels.

Thanks, Speedy.

The ex-CIA officer the Agency approved, then disapproved of his book stated the CIA doesn't have the bodies to do spy stuff.

And to think our spooks at Camp X taught the OSS spycraft in WWII.

"“delusional Canadians, reeking of our moral self-importance”"

Isn't this a quote from the CBC Operating Manual?

Who is this Occam fellow? I like the cut of his gib.

Agreed skip. That's about as accurate and pithy as you can get.

He speaks the truth, the fact is our politicians treat us like retarded children who can't deal with reality.

Canadians were prone to “knee-jerk anti-Americanism” and “paroxysms of moral outrage

watching CBCpravda or Taliban Jack can hardly be considered a diplomatic leak

Speaking truth to power usually refers to telling power what it doesn't want to hear.
Judd is what is known as a "native informant"
He can be found at the Trudeau Foundation

Younger people were obviously not around and don't have a clue about how CSIS got its inception.

CSIS replaced the RCMP Intelligence service in the mid 1980's. Progs demanded a new civilian service because of a couple scandals in the RCMP. They wanted Canada to have "softer more loving" spooks. It's quite hilarious to see Progs today doing with CSIS what they once did with the RCMP: labelling them as as terrible militaristic abusers. Think about that for a moment -- if CSIS are "abusers" then they must be the Left's abusers, because they established the damn thing! There have been more Left MP's serving on the CSIS security and intelligence review commitee than anyone!

I think replacing the RCMP intel service with CSIS was one of the stupidest decisions the Canadian government ever made, especially at that point in history. The RCMP was famous for busting Soviet spies during the Cold War, and at the very apex of the Soviet era we got rid of them to satisfy the cry-baby Left. They disappeared when we needed them the most: the impending collapse of the Soviet Union. It took almost 10 years for CSIS to get up to speed and unfortunately Canada cannot take any credit for "bringing down the wall" -- Ronald Reagan practically accomplished it single-handedly. It's also why Canada's biggest terrorist attack in history was totally botched intelligence-wise -- the Air India attack -- because CSIS was not up to speed.

So now that CSIS is finally up to speed, the Left is playing the same games they played 25 years ago with the RCMP. Don't listen to them this time my fellow Canadian morons! Read a history book!

My empathy towards CSIS will be forever coloured by that organizations criminal actions in regard to Flight 182 (Air India).
There is NO possible justification for their actions prior to and following the bombing(s).

Progs demanded a new civilian service because of a couple scandals in the RCMP. They wanted Canada to have "softer more loving" spooks.
~ricardo

It was done to de-couple policing from the intelligence/security mandate that the RCMP had.
During the FLQ October Crisis, when the War Measures Act was invoked, the RCMP used the War Measures power to arrest/interogate/search large numbers of people that were clearly not FLQ terrorists but suspected garden variety criminals that the RCMP had always wanted to arrest but couldn't for lack of evidence/probable cause.

The War Measures Act allowed the RCMP to hold these people incommunicado for up to 90 days without charge or outside contact, to search homes without warrant, and to ostensibly settle some longstanding scores.

These police actions fogged the intelligence/security thrust that was necessary to locate the FLQ kidnap hostage James Cross.

Some people thought that was abuse of power by the RCMP and arguably it was.

dizzy @ 2:47, Judd complains as per the Wikileaks "judicial rulings and public naiveté were paralyzing his spies". Maybe this is what happens when you hang around too many Liberals and NDPs.

"Canada is a stern daughter of the voice of god who happily assumes moral superiority to Americans while never being responsible for results. Such a posture has a great attraction to Canadian leaders because they can “acquire reputations and honours” while blame and failure goes to those possessed of power and means."

- Dean Acheson US Secretary of State (1965) said to Canadian prime minister Lester Pearson. He was born in Canada.

Oz: "Some people thought that was abuse of power by the RCMP and arguably it was".

I agree in principle (I was around for FLQ too -- almost two decades before the RCMP changes). But I see it all as mostly knee-jerk stuff being resolved by much worse knee-jerk stuff in the opposite direction. The people arrested during FLQ didn't have such a terrible time of it. It was like the people arrested during G20 -- there was abuse but it was short-lived and few came out the worse for wear before it was corrected.

No need to deconstruct an entire system for that. But Canada has the bad habit of destroying institutions to satisfy the crying bleating Left -- another example was our entire Canadian Airborne because of a couple bad apples.

Any future deconstruction in this country needs to happen with the Left, who have practically installed a system of "Bureaucratic Marxism" with their slow but steady occupation culminating in absolute control of many of Canada's bureaucracies, middle-level institutions, and agencies.

Judd also said,in regards to the threat from Islam,"Canadians have their eyes closed in the hope that the enemy will not see them".Or something very close to that,but he nailed it on that one too.

Related:

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/899636--cbc-stereotypes-a-drag-on-canada-u-s-ties-wikileaks?bn=1

No shortage of irony in the comments.

It wasn't just the FLQ Crisis, ricardo.

It was also the infiltration and surveillance of the Waffle movement within the NDP and the surveillance of the Parti' Quebecois.
It was disquieting that the RCMP could fail to distinguish between legitimate political dissent and activity that threatened the democratic state.

Additionally it was the opening of citizen’s mail at Canada Post processing stations by the RCMP and other privacy violations, which came to light during Trudeau's first term.
There were other instances but I don't have time to cite them.
Of course you know about the McDonald Commission.

It became clear that there were conflicts between the policing mandate and the intelligence/security mandate that indicated the growing politicization of the RCMP and a walk toward a Police State because of those conflicts and the powers the RCMP had.

Did you know that the War Measures Act invoked in 1939 wasn't suspended until 1954, 9 years after the end of WWII?

grok's Star link, hilarious.

i.e. "How dare those right-wing evil capitalist American pigs accuse we Canadians and the CBC of stereotyping them? -- we never stereotype the right-wing evil capitalist American pigs!"

Signed, the CBC -- "Canada Lives Here" (and nowhere else).

Oz, like I said I agree generally -- but you're still talking about events 20 years before. The McDonald Commission in the 80's wasn't about the PQ and the Waffles was it?

Plus CSIS still opens people's mail -- the only difference now is they do it with special warrants. They have to show cause. And the RCMP still engages in intelligence gathering, especially where National Security is concerned -- much like the FBI (never heard of RCMP's "D" division?).

But I agree that separating general policing from spooks was necessary. It was just a messy and rather dysfunctional way of going about it for a number of years.

...anyway, relevance: "Throwing out the clean baby with the dirty bath water" is what I'm trying to say. And now the Progs want to do it again with CSIS. I think that's the significance of Judd's comments...

much like the FBI (never heard of RCMP's "D" division?).

Yes, and for all intents they are now a subunit of the FBI.

I don't like the Left or their ideas but I wouldn't want a policing structure in place that can ignore due process if a truly charismatic someone bad were to get into power in Canada with an unassailable majority.
Good post, ricardo.

Some of the lefts paroxysms and ongoing fears/paranoia have a sound basis in scattered real events.
I was a persona non grata(troll) for years on lots of left sites.

The Welfare society. The rationed opium of the people. Looking at it real time.
Just the opposite of what Marx babbled.
JMO

//Judd complains as per the Wikileaks "judicial rulings and public naiveté were paralyzing his spies". //

Right. The Legal System & the People interfering with a Bureaucrat at War.
As the poet said "the People have failed the government, dissolve the people & elect another"
It's touch running an empire

@ricardo

I think you make some good points, however I would emphasize that separating the RCMP from intel gathering was very necessary. Policing and intel gathering are about completely different goals. Police try to collect evidence to get a conviction, spies do not care about a conviction. A key difference.

Also note that the RCMP, being a police organization, how do you think police officers not on a standard police career path were treated? Do you think the spy side of the RCMP might have been a dumping ground for officers who could not police? It's a pretty standard thing in organizations to put the less qualified into departments considered out of the core functions. Some of the problems with spying in Canada can be seen in this light.

Also note that CSIS has more safeguards/hoops to jump through than any other Western intelligence agency in the world.

Uh, uh

Dizzy and Occam, your comments are so "liberal" that I wonder if perhaps I went back in time to the era of Soviet Union.... I think I can hear some echoes of Pravda.

ella

Sorry about that. And watch those echoes.

Anti -Americanism has been used by the "progressive", "Liberal" movement for decades and was turned into an art form under Turdo. It's the same narrative used by Separatists in Quebec, except in Quebec, it's an anti-Canadian narrative. The Anti-American narrative is a tool of manipulation, and has been used to great effect, by the "Progressive", "Liberal" movement. "Lobsters in the trap", divide and conquer, hate and fear. It isn't just CSIS who is hamstrung by the turd that is Pierre Trudeaus country (cult) it is the country itself.

I love the hissy fit that the CBC is throwing today at all these "revelations" -- most of which are standard beliefs of conservatives in any case -- but what I don't like so much is how Tom Flanagan was subjected to a Maoist style forced public recantation of his views about Ass-wipe-ange.

He was right the first time, and should have told Evan Solomon to go stick his head in a blender when forced to recant today. What a shabby little banana republic this country has become.

Sean M @ 8:28

Well said!

But not all of us have swallowed the poison...begad! Some of the peasants have these interwebs in their houses, and faulty information is available to the serfs.

Call in the CRTC!

Peter O'Donnell: "I love the hissy fit that the CBC is throwing today at all these 'revelations'... but what I don't like so much is how Tom Flanagan was subjected to a Maoist style forced public recantation of his views about Ass-wipe-ange."

The CBC "hissy fit" and the "recantation" simply prove just how spot-on Jim Judd was with his “paroxysms of moral outrage” remark.

Though I doubt the folks at Mother Corp are aware enough to even realize this!

But the Canadian left are doing what they always do and that is aping everything they see the American left do and say.

No one beats the American Leftists for being Anti-American!

Go ahead and ask yourself, if some American leftard like Al Gore, Michael Moore or any one of the Hollywood freaks commanded the Canadian leftist chimps to destroy the Canadian economy through one policy or another, do you really think they wouldn't obey?

And what about the multitudes of leftist Toronto media collaborators? No one is ever going to mistake them for trend setters now are they; a herd of tag-a-longs is more like it. The NY Times is their ideological advisor.

The point is that the Canadian left and the Toronto media are nothing more than wholly controlled subsidiaries of the American leftists.

This is why they always accuse Conservatives of following the American right, it’s because they themselves are such blatant stooges that they need to blame others of what they are especially guilty of. This is done to deflect the truth away from themselves. They use this sleigh of hand all the time, like when they accuse others of being racist, sexist, and corrupt or a liar.

Like they say: “Ain’t no bigot like a Leftist bigot”.

CSIS exists because Turdo was looking to hand the RCMP some payback for being very effective at documenting Turdo's foreign and domestic activities with "fellow travellers".