This isn't the gold you're looking for..It's for sale if you want it...you can go about your business...move along!

Hey Kate; what do you think of Ron Paul? Do ya like him? I think he's great, even though he's in favour of the ground zero moskue.

Is it gold or is it gold plated tungsten?

I LOVE RON PAUL. He's a shining light of reason and truth in US politics. The GOP televised debates back in 2008 were amazing with Paul as the odd man out, giving straight forward, yes or no answers followed by his reasoning. He tore apart the other candidates. The first politician I've actually admired and taken seriously. An amazing man.

"even though he's in favour of the ground zero moskue."

Of course he is...he's champions the constitution.

In Lewis v. United States, the United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit stated that: "The Reserve Banks are not federal instrumentalities for purposes of the FTCA [the Federal Tort Claims Act], but are independent, privately owned and locally controlled corporations."

http://bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/c/F2/680/680.F2d.1239.80-5905.html

We wish you much success in getting the clarity you need...

So why would the Fed fess up on gold or any other matter when the 12 Fed Reserve districts are essentially 'private creatures' of statute?

Cheers

Hans-Christian Georg Rupprecht, Commander in Chief

1st Saint Nicolaas Army
Army Group "True North"

Ron Paul is a blowhard and braggart!

He couldn’t pick up Glenn Beck’s socks if they were dumped on his desk. Economist? Ha, he’s a bloody gynecologist, telling any loon that will listen that the US is in financial trouble. He’s racist because he thumbs his nose at Obamba like he’s all uppity white and that a black man doesn’t have the brains to balance a budget. Sheesh………….

Kate:

Personally, I don't doubt there's gold at Ft. Knox and the NY Fed, but I understand Paul's demand for an audit. He's trying to kick open the doors of secrecy that the Fed maintains in so much of its dealings.

The bigger scandal to me is the fact that the custodians of the two precious metal ETF's, GLD and SLV, are HSBC and JP Morgan, respectively. According to the Commodity Futures Trading Corp, these two are, on average, 30% short in the metal whose ETF they maintain. Since GLD is the sixth largest holder of gold bullion in the world, after 5 central banks, if there was a short squeeze on gold, where exactly would HSBC go to get the metal to square its position?

For this reason, a number of gold investment advisers are telling their clients to buy actual coins or bars, rather than "paper" gold, such as GLD.

Crazy times indeed.

Oh, and if I were American, Ron Paul is one of the few guys I'd actually vote for, the opinion of some loons here notwithstanding.

"Oh, and if I were American, Ron Paul is one of the few guys I'd actually vote for"

In a heartbeat.

Even stranger, why no coverage in the Canadian MSM of the fact that Chretien and Martin sold off the last 400 metric tonnes of Canada's Gold Reserve at bargain basement prices. And so far no information of what the money was used for, what did they do with the money. And the MSM in Canada still touts them as economic Genius's.

NO GOLD AT FORT KNOX?

President Bush must have transferred it into Texas.

That 17 trillion in gold- heh.
explains his/their improved economic condition.

President Obama (again) criticizes the economic policies of former President Bush and the current "partisan minority" in Congress-

We have dug an economic hole the last 10 years and poor Bambi can't get out.

Time for another vacation- (Got Golf?)
-
-

If you even care to watch his teleprompter eyes.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2010/08/30/obama_it_took_nearly_a_decade_to_dig_the_hole_that_were_in.html

Kate:
tech question-

How to create a link without copy and paste?

thank you..

FL

Ron Paul is a wingnut. Since he's surrounded in Congress by charlatans, liars, and thieves, some of the things he spouts occasionally make sense, but in general he's off his rocker. No gold at all in Fort Knox? That's the stuff of conspiracy theories.

We have the same problem here in Canada.

Scotia bank or more precisely ScotiaMocatta is the gold "holder/trader" for Canada,
but I recently found out that they do NOT have to prove how much gold they claim to have in reserve...

the article I read said they only have 1/5 of what they claim they have,

so if times get ugly ( war, famine, economic meltdown etc...) your gold certificate will be worth nothing.

Sorry I have no links or excerpts.

If I kept everything I read I'd have more documents than the library of congress...

If gold is your thing, get the real thing, not a certificate.

Here is something for those who have doubt,

...Continuing on the trail of exposing what is rapidly becoming one of the largest frauds in commodity markets history is the most recent interview by Eric King with GATA’s Adrian Douglas, Harvey Orgen (who recently testified before the CFTC hearing) and his son, Lenny, in which the two discuss their visit to the only bullion bank vault in Canada, that of ScotiaMocatta, located at 40 King Street West in Toronto, and find the vault is practically empty...

http://cryptogon.com/?p=14679

Obama approved of selling 403 metric tons of gold to the IMF,

watch this video,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5IkIvxWYTM

Someone inform Ron Paul that the US has been off the gold standard for 40 years, so how much gold it has is pretty much irrelevant.

Ron Paul is a hero to the internet pro-pot crowd, frankly he'd be one poor choice as leader.

"Ron Paul is a wingnut"

I don't care if Popeye is backing the legislation. Without audits, there can be no confidence in an institution.

Not sure why being a Constitutional Libertarian would qualify one as a "wing-nut", unless the authors of the Constitution were wing-nuts themselves which would suggest that your inherent right to manage your own life is a crazy idea.

As for the audit of the Reserve, it may be a stepping stone to eliminating the Reserve altogether. Ron Paul follows the Austrian school of economics which claims that central banks are largely responsible for the boom and bust cycles.

The last audit of Fort Knox gold was in the 1960s, if I remember properly. How can there be any confidence in their holdings.

By the way, I understand the gold in question is the US treasury's gold, not the fed's.

Ok time to roll up the trap-line and stow away the troll bait. It was circling and sniffing but too skittish to bite.

Ron Paul is a pretty stand up guy. Unfortunately his ideas aren’t inline with what it takes given the size of the US Empire today and the global issues it's currently embroiled in.

He is placed best where he currently is, as a watchdog on the Federal Reserve and the banking system. Drat’s, I didn't want to have to break cover like this.

Ron Paul is a hero to the internet pro-pot crowd, frankly he'd be one poor choice as leader.
Posted by: rose at August 31, 2010 9:42 AM

Rose, he is a Libertarian to the core, but not the pot smoking kind which you seem to have focused in on. He is a man with solid and deep convictions that we are born a free people and have our freedoms given to us by God, which is exactly what the US Constitution quite explicitly says.

He is no more in favour of a Mosque at Ground Zero than building an Aztec Temple on Rodeo Drive. But, if the people want to, they have the right to do that, the Constitution gives them the right. It is incredibly arrogant, in bad taste and totally against the spirit of the law which gives them that right, but that is the nature of Islam. To dominate and force submission. They are absolutely true to their faith and religion.

It scares the willies out of the American electorate to have somebody who is a strict constitutionalists at the helm. He allows the heart of the people to be exposed, showing off their prejudices and vices and moral bankruptcy which America has spiraled down into.

By auditing the Fed, this is just another way of opening one of the closet doors in a good house sweeping, one which has been long in coming and desperately needed. The start reality of a bankrupt nation is necessary to rebuilding it.

First you have to take the garbage out and disinfect before you restock the pantry.

""Oh, and if I were American, Ron Paul is one of the few guys I'd actually vote for"

In a heartbeat.
Posted by: BTJ at August 31, 2010 5:11 AM"

What happened to you BTJ, did you finally see the light? You actually said something intelligent and coherent!!!

Assuming the gold is there, its value would be a 300 or 400 billions at most. Compare with the US debt of anywhere for 13 too 100 trillion, depending on who you ask.

If you'd take all the gold of the world that has been mined to date, it would make a cube with an edge of about 63 feet. At 1,200$ an ounce the total value would be about 5.5 trillion $.

That goes to say gold is undervalued. Not a bad idea to own some.

Let's not forget that the Fed has pegged gold at $34 PER OUNCE!!!

That is all that they have it at "on the BOOKS". So the numbers which which we buy and sell at in the markets are the trading numbers.

Not sure how the Fed and IMF calculate and show it on their books, but that is the "official" number.

Ron Paul is out pandering the the wingnut constituency again. At the linked article, all I see is Paul claiming to want to draft legislation compelling auditing of US gold reserves. This in response to "rumors" attributed to absolutely no one, that there may be no gold.

This is more of the same pattern of Ron "911 truther" Paul.

"Someone inform Ron Paul that the US has been off the gold standard for 40 years, so how much gold it has is pretty much irrelevant."
Waterhouse

True enough but if there is a world economic meltdown...(BTW, WHATS THE STATUS OF THE RUMOR THAT THE CHINESE FINANCE MINISTER JUMPED SHIP OUT OF CHINA ON THE WEEKEND?.SOMETHING ABOUT LOOSING OVER 1/2 TRILLION US?)...Would'nt you want to know where you stand?

Ron Paul has always been right in calling out the Federal Reserve and thats the essence of Kate's post here. It is just common sense.

BTJ is technically right that Ron Paul respects the Constitution. But insisting on building what is perceived in essence a victory mosque so close to ground zero and refusing negotiations in good faith to relocate it away so to appease the MAJORITY of American citizens is pure provocation and intolerance.
The vast majority of the free press the world over gave in to the sensibilities of Islam by avoiding to publish or even write about the Mohammed cartoon a few years ago. The FREE press of the world gave in...Time for Islam to show their sensibility towards others beliefs.

Common sense is still not a BTJ attribute though.

bob c, Ron Paul has more integrity in his left small toe nail than all of the Democratic Party and Liberal party of Canada.

He is asking because he sits on the boards and has more inside knowledge of the Fed than most in the US.

Do you think you know more about the Fed than he does? Do you even have an inkling as to what he is even talking about or why he would stick his neck out to the media with a comment like that if he wasn't at least 99% sure he could win that argument before the electorate.

He is trying to get re-elected.

Loosen you tie man, let the oxygen in!!

Regarding the ownership of the gold in question, further investigation om my part seems to reveal it is the fed's gold, held in trust in the US treasury's repository of Fort Knox.

Glacierman;

"why he would stick his neck out to the media with a comment like that if he wasn't at least 99% sure he could win that argument before the electorate."

He did the same thing when the 911 truthers claimed Bush and the CIA took down the WTC. Do you really think that he is "99% sure he could win that argument before the electorate". If so then why hasn't he done so.

He's either a nut or is willing to pander to the nutters for votes by saying, "I think it is a possibility" to whatever conspiracies they dream up.

Just for the record, you're not a 911 truther yourself, are you.

Woodporter @ 10:17 is correct. The Treasury Department is responsible for the gold, NOT the Fed. Treasury is part of the executive and thus reports to firstly Obama and then via him to Congress.

[quote]Ron Paul is a pretty stand up guy. Unfortunately his ideas aren’t inline with what it takes given the size of the US Empire today and the global issues it's currently embroiled in.[/quote] Knight 99

That is the best summary of Ron Paul...He speaks street, but he lacks a functional vision....

Bob,

Here is what Ron Paul has said about the 911 Truthers during the '08 election debates:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGyhlNY0y1k

Any other foolish statements you would like to make?

Are you an atheist?

Would'nt you want to know where you stand?

The point is that how much gold the US is in possession of has zero bearing on where its currency stands.

The "mountain of gold" has dwindled to an ant hill of gold as the reserves were sold off by the private banking entities who own seats on the fed needed the profit to underwrite their external business losses.

The stalling on a federal gold audit is obvious. When it is general knowledge of exactly how little reserve backs the amount of US dollars in circulation, the greenback will collapse as international trade currency. The fractional reserve currency ratio is so far out of trim, any leak of the truth would spell economic disaster.

Close the fed and go back to mint issued script backed by hard assets and productivity.

I'm not quite sure what to say about that. It;s the Alamo all over again!!

There must be a logical reason for this; mustn't there?

OT during last election cycle I was convinced the R.Paul was unelectable, and off track on many issues. That said, I do admire his convictions and his truthfulness.

"Would'nt you want to know where you stand?

The point is that how much gold the US is in possession of has zero bearing on where its currency stands"
Waterhouse

I am no expert by any means but if fiat currencies collapsed the world over, would'nt we need a "base" to be used for commercial exchanges? If world treasuries in each government still holds gold, would'nt that be the logical "base" to restart from scratch with?
(A "Plus ca change..." moment)

Or is going to be fossil fuels (Oil,gas,coal) and uranium?
(In this case Canada could be the richest country on earth with the smallest army on earth to protect it all...Yikes!!!)

After all, having DEPENDABLE and EFFICIENT (Not to be confused with windmills and solar panels) energy is the difference between living a decent life or just surviving like in the stone age.

Glacierman;

Your link to the comments Paul made at the election debates ignores all of the other stuff he said in the months leading up to that. He did much to fan the flames of the 911 truther movement on radio shows, to 911 truther groups at universities and so on. Here's a couple of links in case you've forgotten.

http://michellemalkin.com/2007/05/19/trutheriness-and-ron-paul/

http://ace.mu.nu/archives/225943.php

Oh, and by the way, you didn't answer my very simple and straightforward question. Are you a 911 truther.

@waterhouse,

If gold were irrelevant, why are the China, India and Russia filling their reserves with it?

I suspect you need to educate yourself about money - what it is and is not!

Here is the end run by the money changers:

http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/archives/bancor-the-name-of-the-global-currency-a-shocking-imf-report-urges-the-world-to-adopt

bob c:

The answer to your question is that I love the Truth and seek it with all my heart. Does that answer your question?

Now, please answer my question!

See 'Money Mischief' by Milton Friedman

The world's currencies were unpeged long ago. This enabled the Ruling Class to make an end run around gov't fiscal responsibility. It also allowed the Ruling Class to steal some of your money by devaluing it. (aka inflation)

In response to a clear, unambiguous question, are you a 911 truther, Glacierman responds by saying, "The answer to your question is that I love the Truth and seek it with all my heart."

Spoken like a true Ron Paul devotee.

ron!

Right on! Wealth confiscation is the "horder's" end game. It's mine...it's all mine....preciousssssssss!!!!

Enjoying the cloud cover? Looking forward to mid to high 20's later this week, still time for some more beach weather!

Debating on the sanity of Ron Paul is missing Kate's point COMPLETELY.

Sometimes I wonder why I bother posting useful information.

and I'd bet money Kate feels the same way.

Another comment for you to ignore dear readers,

Banks charge you a storage fee for gold that does not exist,

They keep the storage fee as a net profit and give you a nice little certificate.

But keep arguing how many slices of bacon Ron Paul had for breakfast.

The gold market is a HUGE SCAM.

bob c, how does that effect the economic policies of Ron Paul?

(you have not yet answered my question)

There are things about the 911 attack which have not yet been answered. If you have spent any time around politicians, you would agree with Ron Paul, that you should question everything which come from the government. Not that all that they say is truthful or a lie, just don't believe everything that they say.

To answer your question directly, I am not a "Truther" in the media sense of the word. They are controlling the definition right now according to the 911 story. To lump me in with that crowd would be a misrepresentation of what I believe to be true.

A good account of the history of the us gold reserve and previous attempt at an audit.

http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig11/weber-c1.1.1.html

Saxbe moved quickly to try to placate Durell, and barely six weeks later, on September 23, 1974 Mary Brooks, the Director of the US Mint, led six Congressmen and one Senator on a tour of Ft Knox. It was the first time since Franklin Roosevelt visited on April 28, 1943 that anyone except Mint and Treasury officials had been allowed inside of Ft Knox. Too my knowledge, no outsider has been inside ever since.

It was not an audit or inventory of the gold supply; but simply a tour. But there was more of a carnival atmosphere than anything else. While it seemed to placate the few elected representatives at the time, upon reflection several of them publicly pronounced themselves unsatisfied....

The shocking admission Ft Knox holds very little good delivery gold was made to Mr. Durell by the chief official of the General Accounting Office (GAO).

This happened a few months after the September 1974 tour. During that event, which lasted less than four hours, the visitors were shown only what the Treasury officials conducting the tour intended these elected (non-expert) representatives to see. Only one of the 13 compartments supposed to contain gold was actually opened to the visitors. As the cameras flashed, a few bars were weighed by the Congressmen. None of them were assayed.

But even worse than this was the fact that these eyewitnesses were shown bars that were strangely orangish in hue. This is a sign that they are far from pure gold.

This should come as little surprise, however. Remember that the gold confiscated from Americans had usually come in the form of gold coins. Pure gold coins are considered too soft and copper is usually added to strengthen them. US coins before 1933 contained about 10% copper and 90% gold. Thus, the bars made from melting them often contained the same proportion. Some of the new bars had the copper removed: these were good delivery bars that went out the gold window before 1971.

mmmm maybe Fort Knox is empty because they know the bubble is about to burst, heh.

We all seem to agree that things are not great with the world's economies - but then they are never great! There is always chaos in varying degrees.

The big question is what! does a person do to protect themselves going forward. That! is usually where the big disagreement is.

Gold? Equities? Property? Cash? Debt? Mattress? Green tech? Oil? Spend it? Durables?

Anything can be good. Anything can be bad. It all depends on the timing. Trying to time any market will always, eventually lead to grief - so don't even try. Diversify!!

Like a broken clock, Ron Paul can be right twice a day but overall his ideas are out to lunch. That is almost as bad as hope & change guy that promises the world but cannot give any details of how it can be done.
As far as accounting for the gold (or lack thereof) where is John McClane when you need him?

Librano$ Stashed the Gold.

"Even stranger, why no coverage in the Canadian MSM of the fact that Chretien and Martin sold off the last 400 metric tonnes of Canada's Gold Reserve at bargain basement prices. And so far no information of what the money was used for, what did they do with the money. And the MSM in Canada still touts them as economic Genius's.
Posted by: RFB at August 31, 2010 7:01 AM"

RFB: It's in the PET Cemetery, here: "15 private foundations".

It's the Librano$ stash/loot set up by Liberals Ad$Scam Chretien/MartinJr/Citoyen Dionky, et al.

"Auditor general questions foundation funding

Last Updated: Tuesday, February 15, 2005 | 2:53 PM ET
CBC News

The federal government is unable to hold 15 private foundations accountable for the more than $9 billion it has given them since 1997, Canada's auditor general said Tuesday.

Sheila Fraser also said about $7.7 billion of the money, which otherwise would have made Ottawa's substantial budget surpluses even bigger, is still sitting unspent in the foundations' bank accounts, gathering interest.

"Given the significant sums involved, I am concerned about the lack of adequate accountability to Parliament," she wrote. "Important gaps remain in the external audit regime and ministerial oversight."

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2005/02/15/foundations-auditor-report050215.html

Glacierman;

Ron Paul is a guy who, while America was at war, entertained and was supportive of the suggestions of people who were accusing the US government and the Commander in Chief of having committed the mass murder of US citizens in order to start it.

Did he do this because he really believed it. Probably not, but most likely because he was pandering to that crowd in order to get their votes. It is precisely why the moderator of the debate you provided a link to felt the need to ask him. He'd been going around the States for months doing precisely that as everyone knows and you can see from the links I provided in case you're one of the few who didn't.

What do I think of Paul's economic policies. Nothing at all because I don't listen to the views of people who have debased themselves as Paul did.

In answer to your previous question, I am neither atheist nor theist. Neither position is provable to my satisfaction.

IF we tried to do this as Private citizens . We would have become someones bitch, in jail years ago. Being a Politician makes you immune from plundering or thieving on a mega scale. Just ask Chretien?
JMO

If there is a question, there should be an audit. Even if there is no question, there should be an audit. Yeesh! Democracy to kakistocracy, one election at a time.

Ron Paul is a libertarian.
Good.
Ron Paul has a yeoman's understanding of Austrian economics.
Good.
Ron Paul is a crackpot.
Not good.
Ron Paul has troll BTJ's approval.
Very not good. Very, very, very not good.
I have a "friend" who hates Israel, was for the Gaza flotilla, supported Ron Paul AND Barack Obama in the same election cycle, and at the same time. One very confused and/or disingenuous cat like our pest BTJ.
Ron Paul is against earmarks.
Good.
Ron Paul goes for earmarks like all other congressmen.
Not good.

Not unlike Noam Chomsky Ron Paul blames America for anti-west islamic terrorism. Not unlike Noam Chomsky, he's an anti-semite and a Israel-hater.

He's guilty of some of the looniest counter-factual historial revisionism you'll ever encouter: e.g. Linclon shudda bought all the slaves and thereby prevented the civil war. No, really. He did. Read that sentence again and ask yourself if he deserves any credibility whatsoever. Lincoln shudda bought the slaves!

He's supporting the Muslim Brotherhood civilizational jihad.

He's not just a crakpot.
He's a sanctimonious shit.

The US Currency has been fiat money for many years. Meaning the Fed prints whatever money it or the government wants. That means that the value of the currency in relation to the actual gold reserves has been compromised many thousands of times over. IF they check the vaults the jig is up and there will be complete economic collapse. What is needed is the end to the Fed Reserve and the IMF and the World Bank. Fiat money is the key to complete collapse and it will happen. It always has throughout history and we are well on our way.
The US Currency has been so compromised it isn't even fractional money anymore... The gold is somewhere and it might be at Fort Knox. But it is NOT at the Fed or any of their outlets or at the World Bank or the IMF. They print US currency whenever they like and governments use it like a drunk on a binge. Until that changes we are headed over Niagra Falls without a barrel. After that happens we might acutally return to 'honest banking'.
Any of those folks from the fed instill any confidence ? Timmy Geitner, tax cheat extraordinaire. Ben Bernake? Alan Greenspan? ANYBODY from the Bank of Canada?
Nuff said.

Me No Dhimmi;

I thought you must have been kidding when you said Ron Paul thinks the civil war could have been avoided by buying all the slaves, but I googled it and found lots of references to him saying precisely that.

What say you to that bit of Paulian brilliance Glacierman.

Shut up! Shut up! SHUT UP!

What Ron Paul said.

From John Hawkins’ interview with Rep.

HAWKINS: Getting down to the last two questions here…. Most people consider Abe Lincoln to be one of our greatest presidents, if not the greatest president we’ve ever had. Would you agree with that sentiment and why or why not?

PAUL: No, I don’t think he was one of our greatest presidents. I mean, he was determined to fight a bloody civil war, which many have argued could have been avoided. For 1/100 the cost of the war, plus 600 thousand lives, enough money would have been available to buy up all the slaves and free them. So, I don’t see that is a good part of our history. Besides, the Civil War was to prove that we had a very, very strong centralized federal government and that’s what it did. It rejected the notion that states were a sovereign nation.

The people who disagree want to turn around and say, “Oh, yes, those guys just wanted to protect slavery.” But that’s just a cop-out if you look at this whole idea of what happened in our country because Lincoln really believed in the centralized state. He was a Hamiltonian type and objected to everything Jefferson wanted.

Lincoln ruined the spirit of America. He was not against slavery, but he used it as a wedge issue to subdue the South.

That is but one reason why Ron Paul would make this statement.

Liberty was killed with the firing of the first civil war bullet being fired.

But then again, Liberty is a very scary and ethereal concept which we have not lived under since that day. No wonder Ron Paul is so misunderstood and misquoted. Too much group think and relativism, right bob c?

" some of the things he spouts occasionally make sense, but in general he's off his rocker."

Any examples?

"Ron Paul is a hero to the internet pro-pot crowd, frankly he'd be one poor choice as leader."

Why? Care to expand on that statement?

"What happened to you BTJ, did you finally see the light? You actually said something intelligent and coherent!!!"

I've always been in the light...I've always liked Paul. My opinion of the Mosque issue matches Paul's, same with my stance on US foreign policy, same with my stance on the war on drugs, same with my stance on private property, same with my stance on the Constitution, same with my stance on the unconservativeness of the current Republican party, same with my stance on the similarities between both US parties.

"Rose, he is a Libertarian to the core, but not the pot smoking kind which you seem to have focused in on. He is a man with solid and deep convictions that we are born a free people and have our freedoms given to us by God, which is exactly what the US Constitution quite explicitly says."

Well said.

"so to appease the MAJORITY of American citizens is pure provocation and intolerance."

Terry, are you in favour of bowing to the demands of the collective majority?

"Ron Paul has troll BTJ's approval.
Very not good. Very, very, very not good."

So my opinion of someone influences your opinion of that person, despite the fact that I have nothing to do with the INDIVIDUAL person named Ron Paul, nothing to do with his actions and his values. Think for yourself.

Kevin:
"The people who disagree want to turn around and say, “Oh, yes, those guys just wanted to protect slavery.” But that’s just a cop-out if you look at this whole idea of what happened in our country because Lincoln really believed in the centralized state. He was a Hamiltonian type and objected to everything Jefferson wanted."

Great response. The detail surrounding the Civil War and deeper discussions of the factors seems to be glossed over...not surprisingly, considering it's something most would like to believe it was for some great good and civil wars aren't exactly great moments in a countries history.

Vid imitates life;

State of the Union 2010

Via Debbie Schlussel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5zAAASsuyk&feature=player_embedded

It certainly does.

If there is no gold there, the fallout would be catastrophic. Most people I talk to (unless they've taken, and passed, some economics courses) actually think money is backed by gold right now, CAD, USD, GBP, CHF, you name it, they think it's backed by gold. I actually had to explain this to my parents and a few uncles. They were mortified.

So most people are totally unaware that money is not backed by gold. Hence if the news hits that there is no gold, well that would just be kinda sh!tty.

BTJ>

What's your issue with slavery? Would you rather all the blacks in America today still be in Africa starving and being sold off by black slavers?

I'd say they were liberated. Some of them know it others don't. For a guy that claims to be all about liberty you sho do sell the Negro short boss!

Glacierman;

"Liberty was killed with the firing of the first civil war bullet being fired."

While no blacks nor 95% of whites would agree with that line, you'd sure have them whooping and hollering at a klan rally. Do us a favour and make sure to point out you're a Ron Paul supporter whenever you use it.

"What's your issue with slavery? Would you rather all the blacks in America today still be in Africa starving and being sold off by black slavers?

I'd say they were liberated. Some of them know it others don't. For a guy that claims to be all about liberty you sho do sell the Negro short boss!"

I have no idea how you could have interpreted my post that way you did, other than by having some preconceived notion as to how you would respond. Sounds like you just tried to make the claim that The ancestors of slaves as a collective are better off because of the slave trade, than they would have been without it.

The civil war wasn't over slavery...that was my point.