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November 11, 2009

Scratch A Leftist

Find a writhing pit of anti-Semitism.

h/t BCF

Update - Well, true enough.

Posted by Kate at November 11, 2009 12:06 AM
Comments

Bigcitylibs eh? And you'll find them mostly in Canada's 2 biggest cities, Toronto and Montreal. I guess we should stalk these kinds of blogs, but I for one, haven't the stomach.

Posted by: larben at November 10, 2009 11:54 PM

Shoe fits.

Posted by: Ken (Kulak) at November 11, 2009 12:21 AM

Nice echo chamber in the comments section. The same 3 or 4 dim wits throwing poo at each other.
Canadian leftist/liberal blogs are pathetic.

Posted by: daveinguelph at November 11, 2009 12:57 AM

These Jew-hating ECO-Fascists are called Watermelons because they are green on the outside
and RED inside once you scape away the surface.

Posted by: Roger at November 11, 2009 1:01 AM

Just heard Charles Adler with Melanie Phillips as guest. Sure puts a different light on Radical Islam.
Check charlesadler.com and go to the Podcast archives "Attacked from Within 1 & 2 Nov 10" click "get episode" on the right. You need iTunes which you can download from Apple.
But maybe you shouldn't. You'll just hear more Right Wing conspiracies and racism.

Posted by: Gunney99 at November 11, 2009 1:06 AM

Everyone should have a hobby. One of mine is baiting left anti-semites. BCL is sort of a stocked pond of such types.

At this very point BCL is having more hits per minute than he has had per day in months. Sunlight is the best disinfectant.

Posted by: Jay Currie at November 11, 2009 1:49 AM

I don't see the antisemitism in the postings. One can question the commenters' motives, and definitly question some of their conclusions, but the comments as they stand are not obviously antisemitic. Maybe I missed something.

It's actually a reasonably civilized debate, given the cast of characters involved. Well, okay, it deteriorated near the end.

Posted by: rabbit at November 11, 2009 2:26 AM

I don't call that blog BigCesspoolLib for nothing.

When commenter Jerome Bastien tries to be the voice of reason, reminding the assembled Satan-worshipping congregation that "radical islam ... is clearly responsible for loads of atrocities (9/11, bali, london, madrid, somalia ... beslan ...)", he gets called dishonest even though he's obviously telling the complete truth.

And the resident leftist uber-creep responds to a comment of "But the alternative is to pretend there is no threat from radical islam" with "Maybe there isn't. Did you ever entertain that possibility?" In other words, black is white, 9/11 didn't happen, etc. etc. Proof positive that the leftists are out of touch with reality.

It's not so much anti-Semitism as the continued use of radical Islamists by Marxists to disrupt advanced western civilization.

Posted by: nv53 at November 11, 2009 3:10 AM

I don’t think that a ménage à trios in a gopher hole qualifies it as a writhing pit.

Posted by: Cal at November 11, 2009 5:17 AM

rabbit: well, in that case I would like to declare you a member of a terrorist organization and haul your ass before a "Truth Tribunal" and in the process destroy your pathetic life.

How's that for reasonable debate?

Posted by: Doug at November 11, 2009 8:38 AM

Yeah, the comments sucked big time. First time I have seen it, and probably the last. It is written by a foolish gullible idiot for other foolish, gullible idiots.

We KNOW we have a brewing moslem problem. We KNOW that when their numbers grow to a certain point, they will start pulling the same crap here they have in other countries. We KNOW there are good moslems that will cause no problems - but we also KNOW that faith enables and protects the others.

There are many uncomfortable facts about that stupid religion and only idiots will ignore them.

Posted by: Jim at November 11, 2009 8:50 AM

If a single newspaper ad stating various facts is enough to "alienate" the (invisible) "majority of moderate Muslims in Canada" then maybe they aren't sane, stable or smart enough to be allowed to live here.

**** 'em.

Posted by: Kathy Shaidle at November 11, 2009 8:54 AM

I found the faux outrage of Robert "F- the Jews" McClelland in the comments to be particularly amusing.

You think we forget these things rube-ert? Not likely.

Posted by: The Phantom at November 11, 2009 9:14 AM

I just skimmed some of the commentary, and found Jerome Bastien handling the snakes quite well indeed.

Posted by: Woodporter at November 11, 2009 9:26 AM

B'nai Brith should be ashamed of themselves for sanctioning and promoting such a scurrilous advertisement. BB may have to be added to the list of extreme organizations. Just as there are radical Muslims, there are radical Jews. This type of propaganda serves no purpose and I will send a letter to BB and local chapters to convey such.

Posted by: T at November 11, 2009 9:38 AM

I think the ad was a mistake - not in its comparison of radical Islam with Nazism - which I feel is a correct comparison, but in its presentation of this argument.

It was an emotional argument if one may call such a presentation an 'argument'. As such, it evades rational discussion and such a comparison does call for rational discussion.

Furthermore, it incorrectly places the focus of radical Islam on Jews and Israel, where the real focus of radical Islam is any and all who are not Islamic, regardless of religion, ethnicity, nationality, etc.

So, as an 'argument', I think that ad is wrong.

As for the discussion - the only reasoning going on was by Jerome Bastien. People like Ti-Guy are just robotic voices; he has no argument. Same, to a lesser extent, with Robert McClelland and BCL. Their comments are always unsubstantiated opinions.

But the analogy between radical Islam and Nazism is strong. Both are farleft, socialist and 'cleansing' agendas, devoted to a monolithic and essentially theocratic notion of the political and social structure.

Both are openly violent, both express this devotion to violence as an inherent part of the ideology. And both focus this violence on 'Others', i.e., any who are not members of the tribe, so to speak. Both see this agenda in a military idiom, seeing their actions as a 'just war' against evil.

Both opt for a homogeneity of the population, with no individualism allowed. Both are primarily emotional constructs, requiring and operating within deep emotional and adrenalin-inducing near-hysteric bondings.

Posted by: ET at November 11, 2009 9:41 AM

Yes T, because -nobody- should be able to say what they really think, even if its an historical fact. With pictures and video, even.

Especially white people, those bastiges!

Posted by: The Phantom at November 11, 2009 9:43 AM

Just as there are radical Muslims, there are radical Jews.

Alright! Andrea Calver is in the house!

Posted by: Mississauga Matt at November 11, 2009 10:04 AM

I directed a psychologist friend of mine to the commentary on that posting and his reaction was none too flattering to the emotional and intellectual maturity of the commenters. His primary observation was that almost all were deeply insecure.

Posted by: Bill at November 11, 2009 10:14 AM

This ad informs accurately the simple fact that the problem is not arabs or muslims...but rather the Muslim Brotherhood which allied with the Nazis(historical fact) and has spun off Hezbollah, Hamas and Al Qaida.
It is like identifying the KKK as the focus of american racism.....and then the usual suspects denouncing that revelation as an attack upon Southern baptists and evangelicals.

Posted by: sasquatch at November 11, 2009 10:27 AM

Doug:

I'm good with it. Haul away.

As I said, it was a civilized debate considering the cast of characters. Ti-guy, for example, is seldom so restrained.

Posted by: rabbit at November 11, 2009 10:29 AM

bill - a great many people feel insecure; that doesn't mean that they have to be stupid as well.

The triad on BCL's blog, of Ti-Guy, BCL and Robert McClelland are, in my view, definable merely as stupid. I'm not interested in whether they feel secure or not.

Posted by: ET at November 11, 2009 10:29 AM

ET "So, as an 'argument', I think that ad is wrong."
__
The purpose of the ad is to get an emotional response, and in this I think it is successful. Who expects ads to present "rational discussion" -- the "rational discussion" follows the emotional reaction (both for and against the ad's emotional content.) I think it is a good ad from the point of view of focussing people's attention on this issue. Most lose site of the lessons of history and this is a reminder to pay attention. As you point out, "the analogy between radical Islam and Nazism is strong" -- good for BB getting people to think about that.

Posted by: LindaL at November 11, 2009 10:36 AM

lindal- yes, I see your point. My concern is that the emotional emphasis of the ad will preclude any rational understanding of the comparison, and will even inhibit any acceptance of the valid comparison of the two ideologies.

I admit that a 'rational ad' wouldn't grab attention; I wonder if a less narrow ad would do the trick. By 'narrow' I mean that I disagree with its focus on Jews/Israel. Radical Islam has a global agenda and frankly, would exist even if Israel didn't exist.

I think that a comparison of, let's say, three similar totalitarian socialist ideologies: radical Islam, Nazism, and Communism - which are all very similar - might, possibly might, be more acceptable than the BB one.

You could set up a chart: list their agendas of total control, rejection of freedom, mass murder, etc...List their 'texts' (Qu'ran-hadiths, Mein Kampf, Mao's Red Book/Stalin's agenda..)

As I said, I think it's an error to set up Islamic fascism as focused on Jews/Israel. That, in a way, leads anti-semites to say, 'great, leave them to it'; and others to say, 'it's their battle'. And both to get uninvolved.

We ought to be involved with Islamic fascism. We must realize that Islamic fascism is against all of us who are free; against democracy, against individualism, against reason, against science....and that We are Involved. We can't just turn our backs and say..(as Obama is trying to)..it's between the Jews and the Muslims. It isn't...that kind of indifference leads to Ft Hood, it leads to 9/11...neither of which had anything to do with Jews/Israel.

Posted by: ET at November 11, 2009 10:55 AM

let us start by considering some questions about some Arabs

Posted by: Jake at November 11, 2009 10:57 AM

The reason you didn't find any anti-semitism there rabbit, was, well, because there isn't any anti-semitism.

It's one of the defining characteristics of the Hate and Death Cult to say that Israel of all countries must never be criticized in any way - and anyone who disagrees with this is an anti-semite.

It isn't a rational position anymore than saying that jettisoning the values of Western civilization and adopting actual toture techniques used by the Nazis, is by virtue of its very barbarism somehow a strike against terrorism.

So the try to outdo each other in their lust for blood and violence - a Hate and Death Cult.

Their braying about supposed anti-semitism is merely a chance for them to play out more of this 'theatre' of moral exhibitionism - they're also compensating for the fact that it's their side who's been responsible for the horrible anti-semitic crimes of the past.

But the important thing to remember: they're in love with cruelty, violence and death (Did you see how they ridiculed the woman who was mauled to death by coyotes out East last week?) They're a a Hate and Death Cult.

Posted by: bleet at November 11, 2009 11:59 AM

Funny, but reading that pap and the comments over there my minds voice sounded like THIS

Posted by: Largs at November 11, 2009 12:19 PM

"they're also compensating for the fact that it's their side who's been responsible for the horrible anti-semitic crimes of the past."

I don't know who "they" are. Are you saying conservatives are on the same "side" as Nazis?

First, there was a great deal of the Third Reich that came straight out of the communist playbook. Indeed, libertarianism (which is one of the main themes of modern conservatism) is the polar opposite of fascism.

Second, it makes no more sense to associate moderate conservatives with Nazis then it does to associate moderate liberals with communists. One may as well equate jaywalkers with serial killers.

Third, the far left has a deep and ugly association with antisemitism. Any idea that racism is exclusively tied to far-right ideology is utterly bogus.

Posted by: rabbit at November 11, 2009 12:25 PM

Scratch O's no-photos: find an anti-semite.
...-

"Obama refuses public photo ops with Netanyahu

JERUSALEM – The White House has not released any official photos of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's meeting this week with President Obama – just one of several signs indicating a rift between the two leaders.

Netanyahu arrived in the U.S. last weekend to address a convention of Jewish leaders. The prime minister's office had for weeks attempted to schedule a meeting with Obama, but no meeting was officially confirmed until Netanyahu was already on a plane on his way to Washington, sources in Netanyahu's office said.

The only photos available to the media so far have been pictures of Netanyahu entering and exiting the White House. Any official photos taken of Obama and Netanyahu have not been released.

Neither Netanyahu nor Obama's team had scheduled any press conferences after the meeting, contrary to usual custom. Sources close to Netanyahu told WND the Israeli team canceled media briefings at the request of the U.S. administration."
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2383955/posts

Posted by: maz2 at November 11, 2009 12:36 PM

Last week CBS announced that the Obama White House has banned Fox News from their grounds. I found it appalling that a viable news agency was being denied access to the President. Where was our first Amendment? It was a radical move even for Obama. Now I see why:
-
This Sunday Fox news, is going to air a very important documentary about Barack Obama, Sunday night at 9 PM Eastern. 6 PM Pacific.

The report will go back to Obama's earlier days, showing even then his close ties to radical Marxist professors, friends, spiritual advisers, etc. It will also reveal detail his ties to Rev. Wright for 20+ yrs. How he was participating with this man, and not for the reasons he states!

The report has uncovered more of Obama's radical past and we will see things that no one in the media is willing to put out there. It will be a segment to remember.

Mark your calendar and pass this on to everyone you know: Sunday night, 8 PM. CT; 6 PM PT. Democrat or Republican, this report will open your eyes to how YOUR country is being sold down the road to Totalitarian Socialism.. If you care about the direction of our country, pass this notice on to everyone you know

Posted by: Jake at November 11, 2009 12:49 PM

What's lost on the philboys of the world is that the Berlin Wall was a symbol of the enslavement of his fellow human beings under the Big Government system he so loves.

What's also lost on them on Remembrance Day is that the free world fought ideologies of the National Socialist Party and Japanese Imperialism, both which dehumanized his fellow human beings.

Oh, well. They've still got Gaia and global warming, and can use fear tactics to enslave their fellow human being next month in Copenhagen.

Death to the control freaks (literally, of course)!

Posted by: set you free at November 11, 2009 12:49 PM

With regard to Israel and Palestine, and I may be very wrong, but my supposition is that Obama will drop both of them.

My view of Obama is that his only interest is in who/what He controls. He has no interest in any situation or any peoples ..as that situation, or as those people. He's only focused on whether or not he controls the situation, the people.

He can't control Israel-Palestine. So, for Obama anything that he can't control, no longer exists. Actually, literally, no longer exists.

I predict he'll throw them both off.

He's not interested; he has no capacity to be involved in anything that is not About Him.

Remember his indifference to the Iranian peoples demonstrating for democracy; his indifference to the Honduran adherence to their constitution; his constant insults to other world leaders who he has to denigrate as irrelevant.

His insults to the American people, to their Congress, to their Tea Parties, to their Town Halls. For Obama, he either controls you, by his charm and his winks, ...or...you don't exist.

Posted by: ET at November 11, 2009 1:06 PM

"I don’t think that a ménage à trios in a gopher hole qualifies it as a writhing pit. Cal"

OMG, too funny!

Posted by: sf at November 11, 2009 1:33 PM

Michelle Malkin has a great column against the scourge of political correctness.

http://michellemalkin.com/

Posted by: ET at November 11, 2009 1:40 PM

Can you say, "Grand Mufti of Jerusalem"? The
contacts between Naziism and radical Islam are
well known and well documented.

Posted by: John Lewis at November 11, 2009 1:59 PM

ET hit on a vital point which most often is ignored. This is not a case of a struggle between fundamentalist/radical Islam and Israel and Jews. It is fundamentalist and radical Islam against all who do not agree or who do not submit. The danger will not disappear even if every Jew and Israel ceased to exist. By concentrating on such a narrow focus, the world ignores the danger at its peril. I should point out that it is just as big a danger and threat to Muslims who reject the Islamic ideology, so people who think themselves safe because they are not Jews make a deadly mistake.

Posted by: Alain at November 11, 2009 2:01 PM

*
"rabbit says... Maybe I missed something."

you mean the unfortunate "jew experiment"
comment that dawg almost instantly deleted?

yeah... that one.

*

Posted by: neo at November 11, 2009 2:03 PM

I can't wait for the barrage of sophistry explaining that Neo.

Posted by: Blazingcatfur at November 11, 2009 2:08 PM

Neo:

Yeah, that clarifies things. I admire anyone who can refer to a posting entitled "Fuck the Jews" as a think-experiment. Perhaps we should refer to David Duke's writings as "experiments in alternate perspectives". Duke doesn't really mean it - he's just testing the waters, so to speak.

But to give Dawg some credit, he had the sense to delete the post.

Posted by: rabbit at November 11, 2009 2:33 PM

Jake @ 10:57, that map you link to is misleading, or at least the heading of "Arab" is. Slightly more than half of the countries shown are not Arab countries. Aside from Israel, all of the countries are Muslim, but only 12 are ethnic Arab, some albeit with significant ethic (non-Arab) and/or religious minorities, such as Christians.

Posted by: Louise at November 11, 2009 2:35 PM

Oops. Make that 13. I forgot Lebanon.

Posted by: Louise at November 11, 2009 2:37 PM

So the ad intended to have some appeal to the emotions, instead of being "purely rational". That would put it in the company of practically every ad that was ever displayed.

Good for you, B'nai Brith! It's time someone started saying the obvious in big bold letters with colour pictures, because there seem to be a lot of people out there for whom it isn't yet obvious.

Posted by: felis corpulentis at November 11, 2009 2:47 PM

Hey, T:

If someone had posted a similar ad in 1938, warning the world of the dangers of Nazism and Hirohito, would you have just yawned and/or denounced it?

Oh, that's right - your ilk did. And today of all days, we remember exactly what a terrible price had to be paid for policies of "appeasement" and "can't we all get along?".

When they come for you, buddy, don't expect me to save your ass.

Posted by: KevinB at November 11, 2009 3:01 PM

What does one expect to see? The Nazis tried to kill the Jews and now Islamists. As far as I can see, there's a link.

Posted by: Osumashi Kinyobe at November 11, 2009 4:00 PM

Ditto what Alain said at 2:01.

Posted by: Louise at November 11, 2009 4:02 PM

Here is a good read from Yale U about the Nazis and the Mufti of Jerusalem

Two peas in a pod they were, and if Hitler had gotten control of Jerusalem the Mufti had his own Holocaust plans for the Jews.

http://www.yale.edu/yiisa/jeffreyherfpaper2509.pdf

Posted by: Rick at November 11, 2009 4:34 PM

we should see more of these ads

Posted by: Gordon MacDonald at November 11, 2009 5:16 PM

Good for BB, we have the Hamas loving leftist/Islamists on the run in Canada, spreading their thinly veiled hatred via unions and Muslim/Leftist student unions is going to become a whole lot harder in future.

Only on a leftist blog could you read the Hamas Charter.

Posted by: Rose at November 11, 2009 7:57 PM

Osumashi Kinyobe, I never disputed the similarity between the Nazis and the Islamists, nor their objective to exterminate all Jews. I am aware of the documented evidence of the Islamists being allies of the Nazis during WW II, but I hope to point out the danger of only focusing on this aspect. The Islamists are a serious threat to anyone who rejects their ideology and refuses to submit to it no matter what their ethnic group is or what their religion, or lack of, is. They like all totalitarian fascists are deadly enemies of freedom.

Posted by: Alain at November 11, 2009 7:58 PM

rabbit:

Surely you are aware that one of Hitler's reasosn for persecuting Jews was that he conflated them with communism, even stating that communism was a logical outgrowth of Judaism. Hitler was a right-wing fascist who saw himself in a battle with communism.

I hope that you are not about to disgrace yourself with the latest right-wing whackjob canard of saying the Nazis were socialists, i.e., left-wing, because their name had the word 'socialist' in it. It was a party Hitler took over and used for its own purposes and was no more 'socialist' than the People's Republic of China is Republican. But any student of history knows this.

Finally, if you consider someone who states "Scratch a leftist, find an anti-semite" to be a moderate conservative, I'd like to know what you consider to be extreme. You yourself said you found no anti-semitism in the link provided. My point is that these people aren't conservatives of any kind but members of a Hate and Death Cult.

"The left has a deep and ugly association with anti-semitism" does it? Comparable to the actions of right-wing fascist Hitler?

Posted by: bleet at November 12, 2009 12:47 AM

bleet, you too are out of touch with reality. A political philosophy either advocates coercion and the monolithic state or it does not. Communism and fascism both do, and the rivers of blood underscoring both are proof. The differences between the two are marginal; that one was racist and the other wasn't is a non-essential point.

It's no canard: the Nazis were socialists. And socialism is the real Hate and Death Cult on this planet. You know this; you just won't admit it.

Posted by: nv53 at November 12, 2009 2:03 AM

Is Robert McLelland a professional blawger, who does nothing else, but posts on the other people's blogs? He's literally EVERYWHERE with his carefully weighted and crafted opinions. God, if one counted his posts, he is supposed to be typing almost non-stop 24*7!d

Posted by: Aaron at November 12, 2009 8:49 AM

bleet - fascism IS leftism; it's socialism, i.e., it advocates a collectivist agenda and downgrades and rejects individual freedom.

Who cares about the name of the Nazi party; it's their policies that inform us that they were socialist.

Hitler was against communism, another style of socialism, because he wanted HIS socialism in power. His socialism was a nationalistic one, focused on a 'past purity' of utopian lifestyle..whereas the communist is future oriented, focused on a future utopia.
But both are socialist.

And students of history are well aware of the fact that fascism is socialist. Both are against democratic freedom which focuses on the rights and actions of the individual.

Posted by: ET at November 12, 2009 10:22 AM

Bleet:

Yep, in Germany the communists hated the fascists and the fascists hated the communists - but only because they were so closely related. The biggest difference is that the Nazis weren't as keen on the socialization of the means of production, and the fascists were nationally rather than internationally oriented.

Mussolini, on the other hand, started off as a communist, and was recognized by communist Russia as a kindred spirit.


Posted by: rabbit at November 12, 2009 11:55 AM

Alain, I was speaking generally and not trying to goad anyone. There are links, true. I believe these should be pointed out, even for the purposes of the ad that ran in the National Post.

Posted by: Osumashi Kinyobe at November 12, 2009 2:09 PM

rabbit, ET:

The proof for your arguments seems to be: 'because we say so', or 'words mean whatever we want them to mean'.

I generally scroll past ET's comments since they are composed of pseudo-academic bafflegab designed to mystify. She gets off in fooling those who don't know any better into believing she has an intellect; and she believes it is a virtue to utilize her vocabulary to muddy the waters in service to her partisan hackery.

But let's look at this:


Dr. Lawrence Britt has examined the fascist regimes of Hitler (Germany), Mussolini (Italy), Franco (Spain), Suharto (Indonesia) and several Latin American regimes. Britt found 14 defining characteristics common to each:

1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism - Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays.

This was seen handily in Hitler's Germany as well as in Bush's America with its talk of the "Homeland".

2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights - Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of "need." The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of prisoners, etc.

This was certainly see in Hitler's Germany, as well as in Bush's America - the ghouls of this site routinely cheer on the use of techniques actually perfected by the Nazis.

3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause - The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial , ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc.

Again, it's obvious. The correlations between the Nazi viewpoint and that of the Hate and Death Cult as seen on this site is astounding.

Yeah, the Nazis were socialists! They were so socialist that they persecuted and killed socialists!

4. Supremacy of the Military - Even when there are widespread
domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized.

Does anything really need to be said here?

5. Rampant Sexism - The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Divorce, abortion and homosexuality are suppressed and the state is represented as the ultimate guardian of the family institution.

Hey, remember when Bush tried to have homophobia written into the Constitution? Ever hear Shaidle say women shouldn't be allowed to vote?

6. Controlled Mass Media - Sometimes to media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in war time, is very common.

Fox News.

7. Obsession with National Security - Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses.

Hey, remember when Tom Ridge admitted he was told to raise the Terror Alert Level for political reasons?

8. Religion and Government are Intertwined - Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government's policies or actions.

Born-again Bush!

9. Corporate Power is Protected - The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite.

10. Labor Power is Suppressed - Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely, or are severely suppressed.

11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts - Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education, and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts and letters is openly attacked.

12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment - Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations.

13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption - Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders.

14. Fraudulent Elections - Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections.

***cough**cough*** Supreme Court****cough***Bush Vs Gore****cough*cough***

But thanks, rabbit and ET for showing us that although the Nazis killed socialists, they were socialists, because they killed communists, they were communists, thought they stood against everything left-wing ideology stands for THEY were left-wing.

While the fear-mongering, torture-loving, gay-bashing, Right have nothing in common with fascists at all, no sir!

Good to see you defend Kate in calling all leftists anti-semites, rabbit.

Posted by: bleet at November 12, 2009 8:39 PM

Almost every one of those 14 points describes the situation in communist states! The second one, disdain for human rights, is the most essential. Only the eighth, about religion, doesn't apply narrowly (but does broadly).

1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism
4. Supremacy of the Military

All the May Day marches and parading of missiles through Red Square, etc. They still do it in Pyongyang.

2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights

I hardly need to say anything here. One hundred milion dead under communism/socialism by some estimates. Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, etc.

3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause

Kulaks and cossacks in Russia, landlords in Red China, anyone wearing glasses in "Kampuchea" ...

And businessmen in the case of today's leftists.

6. Controlled Mass Media

Absolutely standard in communist states.

7. Obsession with National Security

North Korea. The Soviet Union in its heyday. Etc.

10. Labor Power is Suppressed

As in communist nations. Solidarity in Poland is a good example, but communists destroy unions for the sake of their own power.

11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts - Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education, and academia.

Pol Pot's Cambodia too. Not to mention the jailing of Solzhenitsyn and others for pointing out the crimes of the Soviet regime. Same situation under Mao. I will say that the Soviets respected science to some extent, but Americans were always far and away in advance of them.

12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment - Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws.

As opposed to communist nations?? Don't make us laugh.

13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption

All the comments apply to communist/socialist nations.

14. Fraudulent Elections

Phony 99.8% re-election numbers in communist nations have always been the rule.

... and the others ...

8. Religion and Government are Intertwined

Communist nations are atheist, so this one ccan't really apply. But the socialist ideology replaces God with society, and is a form of mysticism similar to religion.

9. Corporate Power is Protected

State "corporations", like those presently in China, are a going concern.

5. Rampant Sexism - The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated

The governments of most nations, including non-communist ones, tend to be male-dominated. That's probably more human nature than sexism in most cases.

bleet: great list, you've proved our points! Run along and deprogram yourself now ...

Posted by: nv53 at November 13, 2009 12:49 AM
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