Maybe I will send the conservatives fifty bucks. Because I support conservative values. Maybe it's to stick a virtual thumb in Stephane's eye.

If this turns ultra destructive, there is no good to be had anywhere. I would love to see the Libs at two seats, but that doesn't mean they won't come back. That feat is recent history. Seriously, if there is a time for fiscal conservatism to work, it is now. If there is a time to prove conservatives aren't scary to our neighbors, that's now too. Options that keep the wolf from the door include the defensive: extended EI benefits when retraining and targetted infrastructure spending. Leadership would include working with and levering the experience of immigrant groups in a real way to go into new markets for all Canadians, lowering taxes on investment, demolishing inter-provincial trade barriers...

Kicking the ever-living crap out of political opposition, (and I absolutely oppose public financing of political parties) is needlessly distracting. If conservative principals are as good as we say they are, the results will be their own recommendation and a $1.95 per vote will become irrelevant.

Right now it is all about the economy stupid.

I think you'll all enjoy this little something I wrote: http://pelalusa.blogspot.com/2008/11/huffing-and-puffing-in-ottawa-sandbox.html

Call it a "useful analogy"!

Is it just me or does Bob Rae look like Gary Busey?

If the Liberals form a coalition government with the separatists and Taliban Jack they're going to have to wear that in the next election -- i.e. in a couple of months and they know it.

What's revolting about this is the way the opposition parties are all *pretending* that they're outraged about the lack of a stimulus package. They're inveterate liars. They're taking it, and they'll pay for it. It couldn't be more clear that what they're actually outraged about is that the taxpayer tit is being yanked out of their mouths. They evidently consider it to be not possible that one out of every ten Canadians who voted for them might kick in twenty bucks to replace the money. That speaks volumes about the paltry grassroots support for the Liberals in particular.

Adam Radwanski in the G&M promotes that "undemocratic" gay-fakery: "The governing party will be able to cobble enough to spend the limit during a campaign, but nobody else will."

Think about that for a second -- *he* didn't: IF the parties were to remain funded by taxpayers based on the number of votes received, THEN the governing party would have more money. But if the parties are funded by grassroots support -- small donations, by law -- the ruling party would have no guaranteed advantage whatsoever.

Just irrational, fake outrage.

Ah well, watch out, Stephane: "Under the Liberal constitution the party's national executive has...power to appoint an interim successor should the leader resign or die. Ignatieff...would likely become leader if that route were followed..."

Hmm. So if Dion doesn't resign simply because Iggy wants him to...

Boy, you've gotta think that they burning the midnight oil in the Rae and Iggy camps trying to figure out a way to come out on top.

Meanwhile Stephane sleeps the sleep of pious angels. He will only figure out that he is no longer leader when the the his key to the leader of the opposition office door no longer works.

He's baack...

"Governor General, Chretien said to have roles as confidence vote approaches"

http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=3d7fbdf2-1007-480b-899a-d5bbacb1cc4a

"...former prime minister Jean Chretien has been called in to "broker" a quick end to the Liberal leadership race as Ottawa gears up for a confidence vote Monday that could end Prime Minister Stephen Harper's seven-week-old minority government."

A cage match would be a more humane way to do this than what is actually going to take place...

Wow I knew the dippers and lieberals were stupid, but not that stupid.

So they vote against the bill because it does not contain a stimulus package, like thats what the country needs, more government spending!

And then what? They go to the Governor General (the Queens representative who has sworn to uphold the monarchy) with the blocheads in tow and say we want to rule the country, with the blocheads obviously having veto power. Yeah nice one boys, our Governor General is pretty stupid but I don't think she is going to give the blocheads that power.

Or they ask for another general election, so that the Conservatives can endlessly run Boob Rae repeat that NOBODY wants an election especially in the winter. The lieberals go into a campaign with no money, no clear idea who the leader is and will campaign on what in Ontario? we don't want to give up 6 million bucks of money you sent to us when you were employed. Haha HA.

The dippers at least have something to gain, they will play up to the public sector unions and gain a few more seats from the lieberals (played them like suckers).

The bloc will risk their traditional fifty seats, but it does not matter they are all getting pensionable time while achieving nothing.

The conservatives will endlessly play clips of the party spokesmen demanding their $1.95 per vote and the electorate will see them for what they are, Political Welfare Bums(TM David Lewis NDP)

Oh its going to be a very enjoyable Christmas, no gifts for me Santa, I alrerady have everything I want.

If the opposition parties form a coalition and and the GG empowers them then we will see a coup d'etat in Canada similiar to what Germany went through in the Thirties. Canadians have to wake up to the fact that in a global economy Canada is small potatoes, much like our influence on the global warming scene. Anything Harper does for economic stimulus in Canada will have to wait until the other G7 countries come up with a plan globally. If we jump the gun here we could shoot ourselves in the foot. The faux outrage in the HoC today is not over the stimulus package it is over the cutting off of the public funds and to think otherwise is to drink the 'fool-ade'. If the opposition defeat Harper's government on this bill and we don't go for an election then as I've said above we will see a coup d'etat in Canada. If we go for an election then the opposition is going to get their pink slips before the second fiscal report next year.

Kate, I think you're enjoying this just a little too much.

On second thought, nah, it's impossible to enjoy it too much.

In my dream, during the election campaign Harper tells Canadians on even numbered days that any "stimulus" plan beyond what is already budgeted guarantees deficits. On odd numbered days he tells us that the opposition parties defeated the government and put us into an election campaign during Christmas season because they didn't want to lose their taxpayer subsidy.

But, an election will never happen. Neither will an opposition coalition. We'll have to settle for giggling while the opposition foams at the mouth until enough Libranos get sick ensuring the motion will pass.

another part of this proposal should be to demand that the lieberals pay back the adscam money at the same time as the cuts to subsidies.

Wasn't it the Canadian MSM who said Canadian politics were boring ? Something tells me that's not what their thinking after today. Christmas comes early for Canadians! I hope the Conservatives have the strength of conviction to stare down the welfare bums on the left of the house. Watching the seperatist Bloc, Liberal, NDP alliance, along with the wingnuts in the Green party and their comrades in the MSM whining and crying for their welfare is really an astonishing spectacle. We're entitled to our entitlments is their mantra, and who the hell is going to listen to them. The Peoples Temple of Trudeauvia are in a real bind with this one, their belief that Canadians owe them is outrageous. Trying to feign outrage over the fact the Government doesn't have some half baked stimulus package is a classic deflection technique, when we all know the concern of the Bloc, Liberal, NDP alliance is self preservation. Canadians fund the seperatist Bloc to the tune of 86% now that's" as dumb as a bag of hammers". What a pack of self serving parasites, all the while pretending to care about the ecomomy and whats good for Canadians. If the Liberals and their comrades in the Bloc were to dare to form a coalition government they would be risking the very future of the country. Whom would they choose to be the PM Dion ? Layton ? Duceppe ?!? As for the Haitian princess in the GGs office, with her well known seperatist sympathies what can we expect from her ? 290 million dollars has been spent since 2004 on political party welfare, propping up parties that wouldn't know the first thing about raising money to support their ideologies. The MSM have always loved to paint PM Harper as a bully, but it's the MSM along with their comrades in the Bloc, Liberal, NDP alliance that are trying to bully the Canadian electorate into supporting them finacially whether we like it or not. What a disgrace these fat cat welfare socialists are, they simply can't contemplate the concept of paying their own way, or finding enough people who believe in their ideology to support them. Stay on it PM Harper, please don't back down.

[quote]Some MPs said former prime minister Jean Chretien had been approached for advice on how to massage Dion’s early exit. But sources close to Chretien said he has not been contacted and is in no way involved. [/quote]

The New Jersey in me recognizes the HIT man role. Is the party that shallow that they need Chretien (the adult) to tell them how to run the party. What happens if they are elected, does Chretien run the country from a dark table in the infamous Franks Restaurant of Montreal?

The MSM has thier lead Story...Why not ask the question?

If they really want to save bucks, they should forget any sort of convention, and just go straight to Thunderdome.

Three Libs enter - one Lib leaves!

The mental image of Iggy, Rae and Stephanie bouncing around a giant metal hemisphere on bungee cords with running chainsaws in their lily-white mitts is hard to resist, no?

Hey, Cal2: I like the way you think. I hoist a beer in your general direction.

The media are deliberately ignoring the historical fact that Chretien instituted state funding for Canada's political parties purely as a bailout for the Liberal Party.

The Libs had so thoroughly disgusted the electorate by the time he passed that law that no ordinary voter would donate enough for them to run the party. They had to steal it -- which led to Adscam. But Chretien knew the looting was only a temporary solution for his gang, so he put all the parties on welfare.

The media keep going on about the Tories' fabulous high-tech fund-raising machinery. Bull! The fact is that Liberals, as a group, are used to taking what they want, not donating to the general good. Conservatives tend to be more civic-minded, and give.

I like Wuberman's idea of sending the Tories $50 for their party defunding gambit. Let's follow his example.

Dear God, I'm hoping that there's going to be some floor crossing to the CPC to head off the imbeciles that are planning a "coalition government."

Just imagine what a coalition of the entitled Librano$, Dipper$, and Blockhead$ would mean for Canadians. The government and all of their specially chosen "victim" (sic) groups will be on the dole, courtesy of the rest of us. Bye-bye any semblance of sanity, sound judgment, or responsible fiscal policy.

I'm on my knees praying PLEASE keep the CPC in place. Prime Minister Stephen Harper is the only good apple in the bunch; Dion, Ignatieff, Rae, Layton, Duceppe are just a bunch of clowns--you know the kind in the horror films? Jolly on the outside, twisted on the inside ...

"However, Behiels predicted that a coalition 'wouldn’t last more than a month' and the country would be plunged into another election anyway. And he said that’s exactly what Harper wants." He added, “I think this has been engineered. Harper wants his majority so bad before we’re into the depths of a recession.”

Won't happen. There will be no election. The entire political apparatus of this country is controlled by liberals for liberal interests and the GG would not allow an election, instead choosing to allow the Liberals to form a coalition.

The Liberals are broke. Canadians wouldn't want another election. Quebec is in the midst of a provincial election already. Back-to-back-to-back elections? The GG would never allow it.

And if there was any credibility to Behiels' claim that Harper has engineered this then where would the votes come from that would give Harper a majority? Quebec? Why would those in ridings that voted Bloc over Conservatives last October not vote the same way again, especially if it means more for Quebec with the Bloc in a coalition? There is a 0% of another election over this in my opinion. A better chance at a coalition. But even that is unlikely. The situation will be diffused with one side or another backing down.

If I was Harper I'd be putting the army on stand by. This notion of a coalition is nothing more than a coup. Who the fu*k do these leftists think they are? The Conservatives won the election so get over it. You want to vote down the Gov't, fine, but a coup?

Long live the Western Republic. Fu*k the east.

Next up: CBC viewers pay their own way.

The polls are showing that Canadians are pleased to see the "MP Welfare" scam stopped in its tracks. As we know, the CPC, which, in real terms, will lose the most money in this case, basically supports itself. It’s the lefty parties, whom the majority of Canadians apparently vote for, that appear to have no real grassroots—as in donations—support

Like others here, my cheque to the Conservatives will be in the mail today, an outward and visible sign of my support. A surge of donations to the CPC by us little guys will be a FACT the naysayers can't overlook. (Well, as usual, the MSM will probably look the other way, but the facts will get out. Their airtight vessel has sprung a lot of leaks . . .)

Seeing the lefties' distress at being thoroughly hoist on their own petard is sweet.

(If it backfires, the country will be in the hands of our lefty pirates and we'll be in really deep trouble. The up side of that will be that Canadians, who flirt with their lefty parties, attractively packaged by the left's MSM allies, while being totally ignorant of their total incompetence and duplicity, will soon be dancing with these wolves and find out all about their skulduggery. And, in the present financial meltdown, the lefties won't have the money to buy approval the way they used to. It will be very painful, but, if Canadians are willing to allow a coalition of wolves to ravage this country—all of them, cutting off their noses to spite their faces—maybe a dose of REALLY unpleasant reality is what this country needs.)

From Fife just now...'unprecedented' times right now..the Libs/ndp with assist in talks from Chretien and Ed Broadbent will go to GG to topple gov't.Fife states the Bloc want Dion gone,before they will give their blessing..NDP will have seats in Cabinet.OMG! the country is done.

Good. Let them try their little tin-pot coup d'etat. When push comes to shove, the people of this country are very centrist, and their is no way that they will stand for a coalition of the moonbat/dipper/trough wallowing leftards.

There are probably enough centrist libs who would cross the floor out of disgust.

The last thing this country needs right now is political instability. With declining commodity prices, and real estate values barely clinging to their current levels, the best case scenario is PMSH and his economics background running the show.

Keep your powder dry libranos. You can engage in your chicanery once the global economy stablizes.

An NDP, Bloc, Liberal coalition government . . . would be the most hilarious concoction possible.

I'd pay big bucks to be a fly on the wall at the first caucus meeting, let alone the first Leader's meeting to set policy goals.

Like three scorpions locked up in a small bottle/

Globe and Mail poll: “Should the opposition parties support the Conservative government’s economic package?”

Yes: 49%. No: 51%

First off, Chretien had no debate when he decided to force us all to support all political parties to the tune of $1.75. He took full advantage of the fact he had weak opposition, he did whatever he wished, including sending troops to Afghanistan. That was just fine with the media, their party was in power.

Now the media are salivating at the possibility the government will fall. Wonder how they figure we'll do with warring factions trying to steer us through rough economic waters?

It's the politics of the absurd being played out by a gleeful idiotic media with mush for brains.

Imagine the Liberals, who haven't got their own act together, the Dippers who do not see eye to eye with them or anyone else and the Bloc who are only in it for Quebec.
Will we see the first Junta in North America?

Eventually the coalition will fall apart and the Tories will have a full quiver of arrows and a full coffer to fight yet another election. They will also be the only party that hadn't banded with separatists in order to grasp for power.

My sense is most Canadians do not want to rush into more government spending to 'stimulate' the economy. They also recognize that the government has already committed money in that direction anyway. Chretien if he is indeed advising the liberals will probably tell them to return to sitting on their hands.

Iggy seemed cautious on the News last night and is probably already planning urgent family business to take him out of town on Monday.

As I posted elsewhere: What would happen in the markets if such a coalition did grab power?

I think that the fools are doing exactly what Harper's strategists had expected them to do: Destroy themselves.

Of course they are ready to run a government together to save their welfare payments, how unprincipled, how unpatriotic.

Or as the old Nova Scotia election campaign wisdom saying said, "Talk is cheap. It takes money to buy rum".

I think that the fools are doing exactly what Harper's strategists had expected them to do: Destroy themselves.

Of course they are ready to run a government together to save their welfare payments, how unprincipled, how unpatriotic.

Or as the old Nova Scotia election campaign wisdom saying said, "Talk is cheap. It takes money to buy rum".

Poll from CFRA in Ottawa
Should the Conservatives back down on their proposal to cut public subsidies for political parties in order to avoid defeat in Monday night's confidence vote? (Please vote first. To comment, email mornings@cfra.com)
Yes - it looks like a move designed to silence the opposition
22.8%
No - it is a genuine attempt at restraint and a matter of principle
75.3%
Other

I think the opposition parties are contemplating political suicide -- the Canadian people voted 38% for the Conservatives to govern, not a rag-bag coalition of parties, one of which includes a separatist party. The electorate will remember, and with great anger. Triggering an election during an economic downturn will demonstrate how out of touch these politicians are.

Let's keep in mind that Conservatives lost in a few ridings by small margins -- they could win those in another election, giving them the majority they desire. Do the Liberals and Co. really want that?

Good post, Bobbi.

If Harper showed half the enthusiasm attacking the HRC's, gun registry, bloated government, MMGW fraud, etc, etc, as he has shown attacking the LPC, he'd again have my support.

Partisanship is choking the life out of our western democracies.

Defence Minister Jack Layton has a nice ring to it!! Fife is starting to look sh*t-scared over this mess.
How long before this is all over CNN/Fox,and how petty are the opposition parties going to look on the world stage in this financial crisis?

Don't worry about this. I'm sure the Toronto Star will manage to rein in the Liberals and their talk of a coalition. I mean, after all, the Star fought the possibility of a Reform-NDP coalition that would have kept the Bloc from becoming Her Majesty's Loyal Opposition. And the Star wrote every time that Reform/CA/CPC voted the same way as the Bloc, that they were un-Canadian by working with the separatists... so there's no way that the Star would support this. Right?

NDP finance critic Judy Washawhatever has a brain skull cramp on Duffy last nite.

Going on about No Money for the Poor, no money to protect mortgages, No money yadda yadda yadda, But Is Unwilling to GIVE UP THEIR POLITICAL WELFARE CHEQUE.
And while this was all going on flashing on the screen $6Billion for Infrastructure.
Ya judy it is a atrocity to democracy When the Socialist/Communist Threaten to OVERTHROW DEMOCRACY.
History Repeats itself! Think about it folks.

*breifly: i had a quick stop after work at my RCl Branch The talk was all about the Political Parties Recieving $30million
I pointed out to the guys That is PER YEAR & the Opposition is threatening to OverThrow the Govt, They were all saying the Same thing Fng Commies, BullSh**. Also that topic was the talk at the Coffee Shop this morning.
Ya Judy, Scott & Our Friend Ted. Canadians are listening & Yes they Agree with the PM.
Maybe not in LaLa Land but in the Real Working World they are.

I'm up for another election, especially one called by the opposition because they won't stand for a budget cut during a financial crisis. I'm not moving this month, and I have time to volunteer (so long as there is no background check eh?)

Of course I'd also welcome an election called by the opposition in support of the 2 billion dollar gun registry or the multi-million dollar section 13 HRC circus.

Why not a bill that kills the registry, section 13 AND the political party pork fest all at one shot?

Bring. It. On.

Wow. Didn't think the Liberals were really this dumb. Doesn't surprise me though.

Chretien and Broadbent involved...hmmm....maybe the Liberals really want an election after they knife Dion.

All the vaunted words of the Liberals about playing footsie with the Bloc, you know how bad it is...as usual means absolutely nothing.

This can be signaling from the opposition as well to make this critically important thing go away. Problem is the GG is part of the "the cabal".

How in the world do you hand power over 2 months after an election in which the conservatives got MORE seats than last time? They really really want power back.

Wow Bob Fife is all worked up over this. It seems that maybe he had some money riding on Harper playing nice this time around or something. If Fife is talking like that I can't imagine what Don Newman will be like.

I don't think the coalition is as likely as he is making it out to be. I don't think the Conservatives will back down either.

vlad the ignatieffer

The whole Liberal plan for a coalition is so poorly thought out and short-sighted that I can't believe they would actually follow through with it.

However, we are talking about the Liberal party here, so maybe.....

Seriously, when Monday rolls around I suspect that a lot of Liberal MPs will catch a cold that day and not show up for the vote.

This whole fiasco typifies what happens when you've got an incompetent, confused leader at the helm of your party. The Liberals are currently singing from about 50 different song sheets. The fact that Dion is also a lame duck leader merely adds to the chaos.

Where are other Lib MP's hiding? I'd love to hear what Rota has to say.Think I'll e-mail him.
Why are they so quiet? Surely they haven't been told to 'toe the line'. That's something the Libs don't like , right?

Maybe the Tories will go away for the weekend and on Monday present the Financial Statement in two parts:

Part 1) The cutting of the political subsidy
Part 2) The rest of it

This would force the parties to vote up or down on the political subsidy. This would leave no room to hide.

Another factor is how do individual MPs feel about returning to their constituents again after only a few weeks. It will be their jobs on the line and they probably haven't paid all their campaign bills yet.

No- I think the talk of election will fizzle. The coalition if it happens will not last long. Bit of a pickle really. Poor Iggy probably wishes he was back at Harvard no that he is involved in a two-front war.

I'm not so sure things will go the Cons way on this. I actually support removing the public support for political parties BUT over an extended timeline of 5 years. Wasn't it just the Conservatives a few weeks ago saying that they would try to get along with the opposition parties? The proof is trying to chop their legs off knowing that the other parties are much more financially shakey.

Harper should do a compromise of reducing funding over 5 years allowing the other parties time to get their financial books in order and getting out there and raising their money. To do otherwise shows that it is purely Machavellian and really is trying to undermine Canadian democracy by putting muzzles on hteir opposition. I'm not so sure the electorate will be angry at the opposition -- I think the anger could point front and centre at the Conservatives if the opposition phrases it as a crisis of democracy.

Since we all pay for the thing anyway, we may as well have our say:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/polls/political-subsidies.html

another poorly disguised way for Ontario and Quebec to run things no matter what the outcome of the election.

FREE THE WEST

I think we should allow that the Liberals do need their subsidies. Donations have dried up and not being in power has prevented them from stealing money. What else can they do?

Anyone here think Harper might give them a way out? As usual, Harper is probably going not to where the puck is, but where the puck is going to be.

Oh so this is the REAL reason why the leftards want to ban guns!

At 8:42 a.m.:

Globe and Mail poll: “Should the opposition parties support the Conservative government’s economic package?”

Yes: 49%. No: 51%

Now:

Yes: 56%. No: 44%

VOTE!

Thousand mile stare at the midget clowns racing around in their little tiny fire truck with buckets of confetti and spotted Chihuahua across the gallery.

Don't speak, don't blink.

Go Prime Minister Steve.

I think that it was stated in Parliament yesterday that short little newfie guy whats his name 'Jimmy that mean man Flaherty' was going to present more ideas on the stim package on Monday.

This is the first idea about how to save Canadians money. Good move PMSH. It shows that we can save some money buy down sizing entitlements, I don't think the ordinary big or small business owners are mad about this. The ordinary Canadian that is making a living would see this as a good productive move on the Governments part of cutting back on unnecessary expenditures.

Makes one wonder of what it's going to take to bye off 'Mr. Wimpy Dion'.
Debt = payed 'check'
Senate appointment = 'check'
Senate appointment for wife = 'check'
Schools across Canada must have new book, 'Mr. Wimpy Dion' trials and tribulation of being bullied by the meanies 'the cons!' at super inflated prices = 'check'

I can't get enough of this. This is absolutely delicious!
BTW Kate, I like your flashing light better than Ezra's.

A minority coalition. Yeah right. Brokered by dinosaurs Chretien and Broadbent. Yeah right. The overriding crisis is - a recession. Yeah right. Political parties seizing power to secure taxpayer entitlement. Yeah right. GG agrees to this and undoubtably triggers constitutional crisis which will surely end up in court. Yeah right. GG refuses to dissolve parliament (happened only once, I understand, in 1922). Yeah right. The West says OK no problem. Yeah right.

This is a bluff by opposition, plain and simple. The "coalition" would have less seats than the governing party. The "prime minister" would be chosen in a secret caucus meeting rather than a public leadership convention or election?

No chance this will happen. Harper will simply get GG to dissolve parliament (and she will agree, you can be sure of that), and opposition parties will have to fight election with no money, whining for their entitlement to taxpayer dollars when Candians are worried about their jobs and savings.

Here's a more probably scenario. Conservatives find the votes they need amongst the other parties (13 right?). Or, Tories "back down" with phase in period for contributions for say, five years (then opposition will throw public sector unions under the bus, relieved at their near miss of political suicide).

This is a bluff and Harper knows it. He has exposed opposition for what they are - whining pigs at the trough, threatening a velvet coup which is utterly unprecedented in Canadian history (no war, no depression, no criminal corruption scandal).

It's good political theatre though. Sorry, Mr Fife, your "breaking story" is nothing but bluff and BS.

Then again, maybe opposition will go for it. I hope they do.

Cheds poll for 2008 11 38 0900hrs
Should the Tory government be replaced over it's economic statement, either by a coalition or through another election?
Yes - They're simply being mean-spirited by taking away taxpayer support for political parties. - 24.3%
No - I think political parties should do their own fund-raising. - 60.7%
Unsure - What would a coalition government look like?. - 15%

Chretian & Broadbent working on a deal

There is going to be Such an Uproar From Canadians seeing the Bolsheveks at the Gates that we may see a Majority afterall.
There are many Centre MP's in the liberal caucas & many that are not Chretian & Broadbent fans that we are about to see an exodus from the liberals to the Govt to prevent this Over Throw of Democracy.
You think your Economy is going into a Tank Now watch the Canadian Markets today & Monday.
And i would not be Surprised at All that this Deal has been in the Works Long before the last Election was even called & they were just waiting for the right moment to Unleash the Coup d'Tant.
Rae, Chretian, Power Corp, NDP/socialist.

If the Liberal - NDP co-alition ever comes about, do the idiots who support this realize, who has the balance of power, and who essentially will guide the course of this country - Bloc Quebecois. I hope the Governor General is acutely aware of this and the imminent danger.
The stain of entitlement rears its' ugly head again as we find all MP's in the Liberal and NDP parties think Canadian Taxpayers should pay the MP's way in good times and bad and the country be damned.
They must think that Canadians are complete fools, since Canadians have been asked by these same MP's for years to jump through all kinds of hoops to defeat the Bloc, and now in one swoop these jerks will hand the reigns of power to the Bloc.
Isn't it strange that some political pundits, suggest that Harper (who won the election) should back down, but don't suggest that the opposition (who lost the election ) should back down.

HARPER BACKS DOWN! CKNW reporting that the Cons have pulled the subsidy from the Fiscal update bill.

Harper's biggest mistake ever? I'm leaning that way.

Depends, rat, when he re-introduces it. Can it be tabled as a stand-alone confidence matter? That'll remove the pretence the opposition leeches have that this is about the stimulus package.

Damn, I wanted my cage match!

the rat: See wnmc above at 10:19.

Make the subsidy a separate issue and have the gravy suckers go on the public record about their entitlement to entitlements. Betcha most of them phone in sick for that vote.

Not at all. Actually the subsidy may have been a head fake. If the Tories withdraw the subsidy and phase it in over time, they keep the high ground while keeping all the footage of the opposition looking silly and get their fiscal update through the house.

Not bad. Actually makes them look like they are trying to get things done.

Maybe, but then it is definitely Harper trying to destroy the Oppositions with no pretense of fiscal prudence. I think either way it's dead.

On the upside, if you're the Liberals going in to an election, taking loans using your future subsidy as collateral, will bankers be as willing to give that loan with the threat that a Harper majority kills it? Maybe that's the end game.

What a stupid leading poll. The "Oh, just in case you didn't know, you see it's bad to take away funding from weak opposition parties, please vote no" predicate is annoying

Then rat, the opposition can defeat a motion that would have support of the vast majority of Canadians. The Conservatives can either then:

1. Refuse the welfare payment and gain the political capital that the provincial PC's in Manitoba are enjoying; or

2. Take the money, and buy lots and lots of commercials showing how the greedy oppo parties voted to keep their hands in taxpayer pockets.

It's win-win.

Brilliant move by Harper. Now everyone knows that the only reason the opposition parties were against the package was because they wanted to retain their "entitlements"....they can no longer pretend it was for more lofty reasons. The Conservative party now has wonderful clips to replay in the next election showing the greed of the opposition re our tax dollars.

Separating the funding out? Well, as others have said - "Harper, you magnificent b*****d"!!

Pure genius

I really should be at work but this is way to fun to watch. As of yet CTV Newsnet has not picked up on the separation ploy.....I can hardly wait to see Craig Oliver and Bob Fife's heads spinning when they realize the implications....Bawahahahahaha!!!!

Syncro

There is another poll over at the Mope and Wail. The question is "Should the opposition parties support the Conservative government’s economic package?"

So far, 54% yes.

Is that a real CBC poll? They can't spell "opposition"?

Prudent move for Tories. They have exposed opposition for what they are, more concerned with their own largesse than helping Canadians through uncertain times. If I were PM, I would re-introduce this bill as standalone, maybe not as confidence measure.

Like I said, Harper has exposed opposition for what they are, money grubbers who can't raise their own funding, pretending to be government in waiting.

The opposition had better pray that the new bill doesn't pass. If it does, it'll provide very clear proof that all the fuss was over "party funding" and had nothing to do with the other measures in the bill...

today's ctv.ca poll
"Should the Liberals form a coalitin with the NDP?"

No 3863 61%
Yes 2448 39%

On the Flip side Floor crossing Negotiations are progressing well across the hall.

I think Harper and the Tories had this planned all along.They knew full well what the opposition parties would do.I think he plays them like a fiddle.

He upped the anti.

I love it. Yesterday, readers here were proclaiming that Deceivin' Stephen was a brilliant chessmaster, had played Ignatieff and the Liberals into a corner, was going to force them to vote for ending the public political funding or force them to go into an election on it, and everyone cheered 'go for it, Harpie'.

Then Steve-o blinked as he realized what a catastrophic political mistake he made.

And now it is assumed here that his chickening out was all part of his brilliant strategy, he's playing the opposition like a fiddle. Oy vey. It took the Liberals and their supporters a decade to get completely out of synch and out of touch with the mood of the nation. It has taken the Conservatives and their supporters only 2 years.

Deceivin' Stephen may be playing chess, but Canadians don't want games. They want leadership.

Cheds poll for 2008 11 28 1030hrs 'AB Time'
Should the Tory government be replaced over it's economic statement, either by a coalition or through another election?
Yes - They're simply being mean-spirited by taking away taxpayer support for political parties. - 16.8%
No - I think political parties should do their own fund-raising. - 72.7%
Unsure - What would a coalition government look like?. - 10.5%

You must not have played chess, Ted. It's not a matter of anticipating your opponent's next move.

It's in anticipating your opponent's next moves, and having a contingency plan for them all, that separates the men from the masters.

Ted. As I said he didn't blink he upped the anti.

Canadians will not soon forget that the Liberals and NDP, were prepared to give the Bloc Quebecois, effective control of the Canadian government for a $1.75.

Isn't it strange that some political pundits, suggest that Harper (who won the election) should back down, but don't suggest that the opposition (who lost the election ) should back down.

Ted you are right....Canadians want leadership and that is something they will never get from the Libs/NDP or separatists. Dion doesn't even know what the question is, Layton thinks the answer to everything is tax "the rich" 500% (that worked well in 1917, didn't it?) and the separatists are nothing more than Marxist parasites that Canada can do without. And the Greens? Well, they are hallucinatory.

Again, you can talk all you want about Harper playing games, Kate. I have no doubt that Harper has more tactical moves and partisan plays up his sleeves. And in doing so he is demonstrating to all exactly why Parliament is "dysfunctional" in his words.

Canadians are sick and tired of it. Doesn't mean they are convinced the opposition has anything better to offer at the moment, but as we saw with the Mulroney/Campbell Progressive Conservatives in 1993, the Rae NDP in Ontario in 1995, the Martin Liberals in 2004 and 2006, the voters will punish the government if it seems more interested in playing games than in governing.

So keep on playing your games all you want. But Canadians want leadership, not political games.

News Talk650 2008 11 28 1153hrs 'SK Time'
How Do You Feel About The Federal Government's Fiscal Update?
The government is taking the right approach in dealing with the economy - 78%
The government isn't doing enough. A stimulus package is needed now - 8%
I'm willing to let the opposition parties form government and have a crack at it - 14%

Harper supporters from a strategic point of view should be in favor of the subsidies. They keep walking dead things like the Greens and the BQ in the game. Do conservatives want the number of leftwing parties in Canada to shrink from 4 to 2?

Still am somewhat disappointed Harper backed down. It was getting really interesting.

Should the collection of arrogant Liberals, Separatist Traitors and Raving Marxists actually bring down the lawfully-elected Government and engineer a coup d'etat, serious thought will have to be given to people fighting back. A tax revolt is the most powerful (and probably the only) weapon we citizens have. In the event of Prime Minister Dion/Layton/Duceppe/Ignatieff (Gawd! even Goodale has been bruited about) then, come tax filing time, my guess is there are going to be an awful lot of conscientious objectors around.

"Canadians are sick and tired of it."

Don't presume to speak for "Canadians".

Isn't "Canadians" code for the left...specifically the Libs?

Syncro

"Isn't "Canadians" code for the left...specifically the Libs?"

I believe "Canadians" is code for Toronto.
Those who don't agree with them are not Canadians anymore, they're "neo-cons".

'Don't presume to speak for "Canadians".'

Amen, Kate. I was just about to give Ted the word myself.

Or is it jus Jack! using an alias? After all, Jack! knows all about what Canadians want.

If he backs down then which meme is no longer true, the he is inflexible meme to be replaced by the power hungry meme.....like switching between winter and all season tires, its that easy.

As for Broadbent...well Ed is the genius who opposed Free Trade and said Medicare would be gone in 25 years because of it.....looks like it is still in place and we have 5 years to go.

Chretien...clearly he is "off the bench" as Warren would say. No need to hold back on anything now, please Mr Harper if there is anything on this guy lets see it soon.

I am sure Rae is incredibly ticked by this whole process, since he wasnt the prince that was to be installed. We will see how this plays out.

I've been busy all morning having a septic tank cleaned from excrement, only to come home at lunch to find Her Majesties Loyal Opposition covering themselves in political excrement in order to stay on taxpayer largesse.

Phony bunch of Bastards!

I'm not speakign for Canadians, Kate. I am assessing what I think Canadians are feeling. And Canadians want leadership, they don't want political games. From any of the parties, frankly. It's just that Harper was the first to show that he didn't learn any lesson from the last election.

Harper is smart enough to realize that sentiment which is why he ran away from the issue so quickly with his tail between his legs. Rather than try and work with the opposition, he thought he could plough over them, take advantage of a looming economic crisis for political gain. The Conservatives were stunned to see Ignatieff and the Liberals have some backbone after all, and his MPs were getting all sorts of negative calls from supporters to smarten up. The constituents got it. The backbenchers got it. And then they gave it to Harper, and he backed down.

If this was a matter of principle then you would have thought Harper might have mentioned it once in his platform or the campaign, but no. Canadians can see right through his crass and transparent attempts at using a political crisis for more power.

Like I said yesterday: this is good policy but bad politics. In fact, as we can see from the reaction out there, offensive politics.

Imagine the Liberals & NDP with the Block holing control. That would put the separatists in power for sure; the WESTERN SEPARATISTS! Quebec has held a water pistol to the ROC’s back for a generation, the West sit’s ready & able to go. Do not push to hard lefties.

Ted:

Offensive?

Take it to the Human Rights Commission if you feel offended.

Can't speak for anybody else, much less all Canadians. Personally, I'm enjoying watching the loony left self-destruct.

"I'm not speakign for Canadians, Kate. I am assessing what I think Canadians are feeling."

Ummm...both of those things basically mean the same damn thing. You're still presuming to know how I think and you're presuming to speak for me. Don't.

Ted Ted Ted,

Do you ever get dizzy from all that spinning?

This was a brilliant move on Harper's part. Tail between his legs? Hardly! You suffer from a bad case of cranial-rectal inversion.

Canadians are Being asked to tighten their belts
Why can't the Opposition do the Same?

That Ted is what Canadians are going to be saying & that is going to be the Downfall of the Left.
Be very carefull for what you wish for When you make a deal with the devil.
They(Lib/NDP) may think they are forming a Coalition of some sort with the BQ on the backburner as Backup, But if i was a gambling man Which iam i would say a coalition with the Lib/NDP/BQ is not going to sit lightly with a few centrist lib mp's and a revolt in the caucas could happen & an aisle walk occurs. I have been saying for a very long time & many times on SDA & other's that the Socialist far left have infiltrated the Liberals & their are many liberals that are not going to be happy about a coalition with the ndp. I would also say that this is playing into the BQ's hands, They would like nothing better then to see English Canada fall apart With upheaval in the HOC.

Thanks Kate. Ted ovously never read the side of blog site where these words appear.

Why this blog?
Until this moment
I have been forced
to listen while media
and politicians alike
have told me
"what Canadians think".
In all that time they
never once asked.

This is just the voice
of an ordinary Canadian
yelling back at the radio -
"You don't speak for me."

Well spoken.

I see. The Canadians here prefer our politicians playing games instead of showing leadership and working together.

Harper can keep playing his games and the cheerleaders here can keep cheering him on. The rest of us Canadians want leadership, not games. Maturity, not political pranks. Working together, not taking advantage of an economic crisis for political partisan's gain.

And the Canadians here at SDA disagree. Got it.

What a great way to end the week.

Merle: Kate doesn't speak for Canadians either. Each Canadian speaks for themself. And as for me, I agree with Ted... won't anyone just do what is right for the country? Rather than scrapping around and taking shots at each other during the holiday season, while we are in an extreme slowdown if not yet technically a recession, is showing everyone's true colours.

The Cons are also now going to play the 'oh its just for fiscal restraint' card after growing government 8% in the last year? Its as unbelievable to me as is that the Libs are as outraged only over the lack of infrastructure funding.

I'm speaking for myself, but I wager there's a good number of other Canadians out there too who feel the same way. I want politicians to do what's right for the country and guide us through these tough times -- not fight tooth and nail to be the PM. We decided that recently and nothing came of it. If anyone pushes us back into the election booth, I don't think anyone can know what the outcome will be. More than likely it'll just be another $300 million down the drain for no change. Fiscal restraint indeed.

****Kory Teneycke, Communications director has Just announced the slash to party financing wont be in the bill Monday.

Now some may take this as The PM backed down,
I would take it as The PM just showed to the Taxpayers of Canada that the Oppossition is More Worried About their Funds then Yours!
And just showed their Real Adjenda, "GREED & POWER" & that they are willing to "Over Throw Democracy" & the will of Canadians.

ted, Canadians want leadership. That's what they are getting from Harper.

You don't speak or express what Canadians are thinking. You speak only for one person; yourself. And you don't 'get it'.

Have you seen the polls? The majority are fed up with paying the costs of the political parties from their tax dollars. Let those parties get their support from individual private donors. Not from 'The Government'.

You call screaming that you are 'entitled' to taxpayer dollars a sign of 'backbone' in the Liberal and other parties? No, it's a sign of elitism, of smug insistence on entitlements, of self-definition as the Lords of the Manor, to whom the peasants must pay their tithes.

As for their equal screams about a 'stimulation package' - that's equally elistist. It ignores the infrastructure and focuses only on ensuring stablity by flinging masses of taxpayer dollars at the same infrastructure. The one that is failing. That's bad economics. I know that's The Liberal Way (and the NDP) but the real changes have to be structural. Not just more money to retain the same systems.

The Conservativies are correct in, at the moment, cutting back on costs, setting up a careful budget, with no deficit (unlike your screams, ted, that they are already in deficit)..and waiting to see what the global structural changes are doing. That includes those in the US auto sector and in the global financial networks, and in China/India emerging consumerism.

Again, to simply fling taxpayer money at dysfunctional structures, eg, the union bloated auto industries that are unable to produce cheaper smaller cars because their labour costs are too high...Such a Here's The Money Now Shut Up tactic won't work.

To bad that a person could not throw money on the floor of Parliament. They could actually see that the 'Capital One' pest control on 'bankers coming out every hole' was really disguised politicians.

Jim Flaherty should rattle some change in 'Dion's' pocket and watch him get trampled, just like the shopper in NY when he got trampled to death in 'Walmart'.

The rest of us Canadians want...

Who is this "us" that you claim to speak for Ted? Please name them.

Ted said: "What a great way to end the week"

Translation: Waaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!! Sniff sniff.

Leadership is what Canadians got after they held the last election, Teddy. Leadership in a crisis is realizing that they have to lead by example, and, as Flaherty so eloquently said, "take a haircut".

Leadership, Chairman Ted, is *not* threatening to take voer the government if the government welfare is taken away from political parties. By the way, going to the Governor General to ask to form a ruling coalition on a matter of party financing would be your very definition of playing political games.

You're a hack. Nobody's believing your spin.

Ted: ? Leadership and working together = ADSCAM

Well Ted why don't the oppasition go along with the elected government? From the polls I saw today it looks like "the rest of us Canadians" go along with Harper.

'The rest of us Canadians want leadership, not games.'

So Ted - you now presume to speak for all Canadians outside of SDA ?

"I'm not speakign for Canadians, Kate. I am assessing what I think Canadians are feeling." (sic)
Ted

I'm "feeling" something for you ted.
Right here.

The existing system whereby federal political parties are funded by the taxpayers has to end. Given that the majority of funding for each of the opposition parties comes from the per-vote taxpayer subsidy it has created a perverse incentive for the opposition, not to make parliament work, but to make it fail. After all, under the existing system their biggest money maker is -- elections. As Ghandi pointed out many years ago, any public service organization should be funded strictly by the subscription of its members. Otherwise it becomes a self-serving entity whose major focus becomes fund raising for the perpetuation of its own existence rather than the public service work (if any) to which it is purportedly dedicated.

Ted

were was your "fake outrage" when the opposition was constantly playing gotcha politics for the last two or so years, do you not think the electorate was fed up with constant mud-slinging at the expense of governance. But now the people are out fed up, me thinks the lefties are crying fowl (I never saw a chicken cry in all my farming days) because The Right Honourable Harper is out smarting them. You can't win a fight when you don't know were it's being held:-)))))

I said earlier Watch the canadian markets today

TSX "Down" after 5days of Growth
Canadian Dollar "Down"

Markets are reacting to the News of a Possible Coalition!
Don't believe it Ted, go read it for yourself over at ctv.ca

Okay .. now what happens on the Monday vote?

The Opposition votes to maintain the $1.95 vote subsidy.

The Opposition then votes: (a)against the economic update bill but in insufficient numbers and it passes, or (b)against the bill and defeats the government on a confidence motion.

The Opposition has two options: (1)attempt to form a coalition government acceptable to the GG, or (2)call for a snap election.

Of course the government could ignore the no confidence vote and continue to govern. What would the Opposition do then?

(Can you imagine how violenty devisive an election would become???)

Ted,

"I'm not speakign for Canadians, Kate. I am assessing what I think Canadians are feeling."

I think what your shrink would call it is projection…

If Harper separates the questions but still makes the 30mm funding a confidence vote, the opposition will still have to vote against the rest of the bill to try and pretend they care about more than their own entitlements.

As for Harper, I think he realizes that the GG is as former Quebec separatist whose husband said may kind words about the FLQ - on camera. The idea that she wouldn't actively PUSH a leftard coalition is giving her far too much benefit of a very large doubt.

All I can say, is if the Conservatives loose power, they need a kick in the ass. If they pull one out of the hat and expose the opposition for entitlement thieves that I know they are, well, I'll tip my hat.

Until then, I admittedly worried.

UPDATE - CKNW - The Liberals will propose non-confidence Monday and claim they have a viable alternative government. Wow!

"too much benefit"
Our proudly 1/2 Haitian GG called the separatists "White Ninja's"... or something like that; sorry I'm not "allowed" to say it in our country because my skin colour is wrong.

The Big story of the day that has been the Headline All Day at ctv.ca (Chretian & broadbent) Has disappeared!
What's going on? Talks stalled?, No Deal Unless Jack Is PM?
Their was not Enough Money In it For the Liberals?
Or is it Simply Ctv had to Yank the Story Because they were getting Bombarded on the phones & net comments By Canadians that are Ready to Tar & Feather 3 opposition parties?
*btw todays ctv poll still favoring No to A Lib/NDP coalition.

Just announced
Libs say there is a coalition and gov't will fall Mon. on non-confidence.
CTV

GYM: " do you not think the electorate was fed up with constant mud-slinging at the expense of governance"

Absolutely I do. And Canadians foisted Dion and the Liberals their own green petard, as they did Martin for his interest in playing games instead of governing. And Canadians will do it again to Deceivin' Stephen and Deficit Jim because they obviously don't "get it". They would rather play chess games than govern with the opposition parties and govern for Canadians.

Where's his plan? He has no plan. He has an economic update with nothing but a plan to stick it to unions and the opposition parties, and you think Canadians can't see through that crass politics?

Canadians aren't that dumb, Steve-o. And we don't like arrogant politicians playing crass political games when they should be showing leadership.

with regard to the insistence on adhering to democracy by the Liberals/NDP - they are violating principles of democracy.

First, it is undemocratic to make the taxpayer support the political party; it ought to be up to the individual to donate, if he wishes, rather than being forced to do so via his taxes.

Second, it is undemocratic to defeat a confidence item and supplant it with a 'coalition', one which the people did not elect but which is devised by a cabal of politicians. And, one which has fewer numbers than the govt.

Where is their respect for democracy?

As for their 'solution' to the economy, the left has only one solution. Raise taxes and fling money at the old structures to keep them quiet. But real change to the infrastructure? Never.

That's because the infrastructure is one in which they and theirs get the most benefits, all unionized govt civil service, ...who are upset because Harper's economic package wants them to forgo their huge wage increases down to a more average 1.5% rather than their bloated 4.5%; wants them not to strike..and so on. The civil service and the Liberal/NDP are 'entitled' to their entitlements. And that's all they think about.

I've contributed the max for 2008 but I'll be sending in a post dated cheque for 2009 this weekend.

I think that the $1.95 schmozzle should be pulled completely for now and reintroduced in 18 months time, hopefully when the economy is back running well.

Uh, Ted, now that $30 million party welfare bill is off economic update, will opposition still vote against it? It seems to me they will have to, lest they be exposed as greedy trough pigs they are.

BTW, this minority coalition is pure BS; it will never happen. There is no precedence whatsoever.

Who's playing games again?

The National Post has the Truth

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fullcomment/archive/2008/11/28/kelly-mcparland-long-live-the-junta-liberals-and-ndp-plot-to-seize-power-exhume-trudeau.aspx

The opposition have all agreed to pretend that the battle royal under way in Ottawa is all about the economy, and not about Harper putting a stop to public financing for political parties.

“This is not a stimulus package to kick-start the ailing Canadian economy. It is a failure for Canadians who need immediate and bold action,” NDP leader Jack Layton thundered. “There is nothing in today’s announcement that will create jobs, assist those thrown out of work or bolster consumer confidence.”

Right. And there shouldn’t be. Canada’s economy is a tenth the size of the U.S. A new, free-spending president is crafting a stimulus package in the range of $500-$800 billion, to be delivered immediately after he takes office on Jan. 20. For Ottawa to start throwing billions around without knowing what’s in that package would be irresponsible; $10 billion or $20 billion might be a lot for us, but it could quickly be rendered redundant by whatever Barack Obama unveils. Waiting is the right thing to do. For the opposition to claim otherwise, and defeat the Harper government on that basis, is either dishonest, or inept. I’m betting dishonest on the part of the Liberals, inept on the part of the NDP.

This is about party funding. Harper started the whole thing, softening up the opposition by publicly pleading for their co-operation in saving the economy, than ambushing them with his plan to shut off their access to millions of dollars in taxpayer funding. Now the opposition has joined enthusiastically in the fray. Nothing galvanizes politicians like a threat to their own interests, and while the Liberals might have grumbled a bit and approved Mr. Flaherty’s plans for the economy, they’re willing to throw the country into chaos to preserve their access to the public purse.

The National Post has the Truth

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fullcomment/archive/2008/11/28/kelly-mcparland-long-live-the-junta-liberals-and-ndp-plot-to-seize-power-exhume-trudeau.aspx

The opposition have all agreed to pretend that the battle royal under way in Ottawa is all about the economy, and not about Harper putting a stop to public financing for political parties.

“This is not a stimulus package to kick-start the ailing Canadian economy. It is a failure for Canadians who need immediate and bold action,” NDP leader Jack Layton thundered. “There is nothing in today’s announcement that will create jobs, assist those thrown out of work or bolster consumer confidence.”

Right. And there shouldn’t be. Canada’s economy is a tenth the size of the U.S. A new, free-spending president is crafting a stimulus package in the range of $500-$800 billion, to be delivered immediately after he takes office on Jan. 20. For Ottawa to start throwing billions around without knowing what’s in that package would be irresponsible; $10 billion or $20 billion might be a lot for us, but it could quickly be rendered redundant by whatever Barack Obama unveils. Waiting is the right thing to do. For the opposition to claim otherwise, and defeat the Harper government on that basis, is either dishonest, or inept. I’m betting dishonest on the part of the Liberals, inept on the part of the NDP.

This is about party funding. Harper started the whole thing, softening up the opposition by publicly pleading for their co-operation in saving the economy, than ambushing them with his plan to shut off their access to millions of dollars in taxpayer funding. Now the opposition has joined enthusiastically in the fray. Nothing galvanizes politicians like a threat to their own interests, and while the Liberals might have grumbled a bit and approved Mr. Flaherty’s plans for the economy, they’re willing to throw the country into chaos to preserve their access to the public purse.

I hope Harper announces on Monday that he will let the "Three Stooges" fight over Central and Eastern Canada, and that he will leave the House to lead Western Separation.

This couldn't be led by a better man, and it cannot happen soon enough.

And, the Quebec parasites can leech off someone else!

If the coalition would like to topple the government and run on a platform of higher taxes for everybody (that's what stimulating the economy will lead to), then put it to a vote of the public.

Will it be just one party running against the Conservatives then, with the Bloc allied with the Liberals and NDP.

It's too funny.

The Pigs at the Trough are Uncorking the Champagne Bottles as we apeak.

CBC news announced the Government will fall Monday & Dion will be PM.

*Democracy is Falling & the Bolcheveks are very close to Seizing Power Against the Will of the People.

It's being announced http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Politics/2008/11/28/7569861-cp.html that the liberals will bring down the government and Stephane will become PM. Excellent!

It's not fair that the Liberals aren't the government, so we'll kick and scream until our government is given back to us. And Taliban Jack and Traitor Duceppes will be holding them to account!!!

Stay, Stephane, Stay!!

Bitterly disappointed to have just read that it looks like Harper has backed off.

I really don't see how they can go to the GG and have her have tell them to form a governemnt. That could only be done if the BQ were involved; how could the GG do that?? Rhetorical question of course. She will reveal whether she is really a covert separatist socialist.

Because that's what she would be to accept such a deal.

\Liberals are undemocratic chimpanzees.

Are we seeing a classic case of stupidty?

I never saw Dion as Chavez until today.

It is precisely for this kind of event that the governor general should be a constitutional expert and not a CBC reporter. Lord help us all.

With Kate's permission perhaps it is time to speculate on a name for the coalition.

Perhaps the Traitors, Commies and Clueless party?

I am sure you can do better.

Let me offer another thought:

There is a coalition formed.
The govt loses a confidence vote.
Harper goes to GG.
GG refuses resignation and tells PM to keep governing.

Now what happens?

Perhaps the whole matter of turning everything into Confidence votes is now a dead issue. This could affect the future functioning of our system of government. Remember that a lot of what we do is based upon "tradition" and you won't find these things as part of the written law.

I am afraid that there might be some unintended consquences of the PM's actions here. Nobody can claim that their answer is more valid than anyone elses, as even "scholars" only give learned opinions on matters.

I think the PM is really doing a great job of sticking it to the opposition, but I much prefer a disorganized opposition fighting amongst themselves - than them all to gather together to have a common foe.

I call bull*&%$ on the Liberals and the MSM on this whole idea of a coalition.

There are just too many unanswered questions to accept that this is anything but a carefully crafted rumour designed to see if the Tories frighten easily.

Will Dion lead the Liberals, or Iggy? If it's Dion, they're going to have to drop the leadership convention and go with a leader that has almost no respect with the rank-and-file. If it's Iggy, will the rank-and-file (or Bob Rae) accept a leader that they haven't formally approved? If Iggy intends to run for the leadership, when will they hold the convention? In the middle of the next election?

What would the Bloc's price be for upholding the deal? I can't seriously believe it would end at just getting Dion removed and trotting out an ill-defined "stimulus" package.

The opposition have precisely two days to cobble together a credible plan to form a government, which requires the intense cooperation of three very different parties to do so. If they fail in this task, the GG will be obligated to call an election over any non-confidence motion, an election which the Liberals most certainly do not want.

Unless and until I see Gilles, Jack and Stephan (or Iggy) on a podium together announcing a list of cabinet picks, I'll treat this issue with the skepticism it deserves.

You folks just don't get it.

This is not about Harper and his political games. It is not about a small $30 million subsidy. It is about leadership in troubled times.

The Liberal motion, which has the approval of the NDP and Bloc Quebecois, reads:

"In light of the government's failure to recognize the seriousness of Canada's economic situation and its failure in particular to present any credible plan to stimulate the Canadian economy and to help workers and businesses in hard-pressed sectors such as manufacturing, the automotive industry and forestry, this House has lost confidence in this government and is of the opinion that a viable alternative government can be formed within the present House of Commons."

" combative Finance Minister Jim Flaherty said Friday the government won't back down on a single measure, despite the opposition threats.

"We're staying on track," Flaherty said in Toronto.

"This is the financial plan of the government of Canada. This is a matter of confidence."

But the Tories were clearly scrambling to avert a self-induced political catastrophe. An unprecedented flurry of Conservative media briefings and interviews Friday

In our Canadian democracy, the government must have the confidence of the House. It can't just do whatever the hell it wants. Harper's arrogance and "chessmaster" (cough cough) skills have outdone themselves this time and they will outdo his own government.

So, Deceivin' Stephen and Deficit Jim don't like how Canadian democracy works and want to continue to try and sabotage it? Well they are reeeeally not going to like how it works now.

So some pretty nice $$$ perks for the coalitioners
NDPers apparently with cabinet positions supposedly Finance and the Environment.These new cabinet members I am sure will be up to speed and ruining the country in no time.
There is a reason the NDP have never been in power.

Ted,

Are you so daft you believe that horsesh** or do you think we are?

You and I both know every word you just wrote is a lie. This is first, second, and last about the opposition so scared of losing their pork they'd throw democracy under the bus.

The election was held. Your party lost. Now they're trying to steal power with the help of the separatists. Good luck with that.

So, Ted, with a straight face, you're trying to spin that this non-confidence motion would have been tabled even if there was no vote tax removal?

If so, bullpit. To adapt a well-known adage, I can tell you're lying because you're touching your keyboard.

Ted,

Honestly, do you believe the drivel you serve up daily? If the Conservatives were attempting the opposite, you would be the first to comment here on how they are Nazi-like, that they are fascists, and that they believe '1984' to be an instructional manual, not just a novel.

You're so disingenuous -- the opposition should be proposing alternatives, not attempting a coup of a duly elected PM. Stephane Dion as the leader, a man who lost 20+ seats in the recent election?

I herewith determine to call Ted (since he likes to call PM Harper "Deceivin Stephen) Tinpot Ted, in light of his support for the overthrow of a duly-elected government and in its place a coalition, with separatists as the cement that holds it together.

How about it guys? Tinpot Ted!!

Fife just stated with a Grimace "Not Sure How This is Going to Sit with Canadians"
He knows how it is going to sit! there will be an Uprising that will shake this land.
He (fife) is also saying NDP Enviroment Minister & Finance is apparently the deal trying to be Brokered.

The PM has just Exposed these Opposition Parties for What they are "Greedy Pigs At The Trough" all under the Guise of Standing for the People.

Too bad too there are some real honest & caring members of the Liberal Party still That iam really surprised they will tolerate a coalition with the Socialist/Communist Or maybe they wont and any luck they will cross the floor to stop this in its track by creating a Majority.

Actually, Richard, I don't think Harper is a fascist or Nazi-like and admonish Liberals who call him that. I got fed up with Martin's empty "Canadian values" rhetoric back then too.

I do think though he is a petty partisan with no plan and no clue in dangerous economic times who will do whatever it takes to get and keep power, including completely ignoring the fundamentals of Canadian Parliamentary democracy.

As he has shown us time and time again.

Tinpot Ted it is !!

Unelected Liberals with socialists and traitors in a coalition government. Excellent video for the next election. Not to mention the common cause that brought them together - tax theft.

Ted enjoys his smarty pants little nickname for Harper.

On the other hand, 'Ted the Liar' may not rhyme, but it's true.

I just made a contribution to the Conservative Party and took out a 1 year membership.

I encourage all SANE - NOT TINPOT - believers of fiscal conservatism to heed the call and open your wallet.

BTW Tim - I guess Germany must be idiots too since their gov't refuses to do the VERY THING that got us into this trouble to begin with - which was SPENDING MORE THAN WHAT WE HAVE.

Ted,

" including completely ignoring the fundamentals of Canadian Parliamentary democracy."

So, prior to 2003 we were not a parliamentary democracy then?

Sad really. Gripping so tightly to your "entitlements" that you believe, what exactly? Without a fully subsidized liberal party democracy dies?

I'm curious, with all the talk of the libs and ndp'ers and bloc to be destroyed, do you all want'one' party in this country? The conservatives, and no others? Just one party's decisions/plans/ideas? Does that seem like Democracy? Or a dictatorship .... ahh, I see what you all want. Sure sounds like it anyways.

Anyone notice what the markets did this week?
gained every day.

A Question:

Is it possible, that the GG would rule that she will neither dissolve Parliament, nor establish a coalition Government, but would force the parliamentarians to establish a workable/agreeable arrangement, or, is she constitutionally bound to either dissolve or establish a coalition Government?

There is a potential for a constitutional crisis here. Suppose the Liberals do introduce a no-confidence motion on Monday and win it. Harper goes to the GG and informs her he has lost the confidence of Parliament, and recommends that she dissolve the House and call new elections. Harper does not resign as Prime Minister by doing this.

The GG is not supposed to act contrary to the advice of the Prime Minister. She would actually have to FIRE Harper and invite Dion to form a government to continue this sitting of Parliament. I don't know the political consequences after this - legally the Conservatives would have no recourse - but the backlash from those who do not support the Liberals could be phenomenal.

Hey did you see the latest - Flaherty states that political funding NOT part of economic package to be voted on Monday.

ROFLMAO - can't wait for the coalition - headed up by the separatist party - to vote against this one!!!!!!!!

Cretien- ties to Power Corp.
Dion- ties to Power Corp.
Rae- ties to Power corp.

Power corp. the only place to get enough money to pay off Dion's debts legally.

ergo, Rae gets the leadership job.

Iggy and six fellow travelers cross the floor, majority.

First, it is undemocratic to make the taxpayer support the political party; it ought to be up to the individual to donate, if he wishes, rather than being forced to do so via his taxes.

Yet it is democratic to make the taxpayer support freeloading, conservative voting farmers. Should it not be up to the individual to donate, if he or she wishes, rather than be forced to via his taxes??
My, my, my, ET. And you're in academia, are you not? How sad.

Lee: i made a comment on this earlier in the day about growth all week

However: The TSX is down today & also the Dollar is down, All because of the Threat to Over-Throw the Government and form a Coalition of the Socialist Left & Separtist BQ.

Didn't Canadians just soundly reject Stephane Dion in a $300 Million election? And now Monsieur Chretien is back behind the scenes. Are we about to witness our own version of a "Coup d'etat"? Hey, if you can't get elected by the people, just seize power anyway you can! (That'll make for a great Liberal Party fundraising slogan!)

And yet ... through it all, their friends in the liberal media are mostly only condemning the Conservatives through all of this. If it so transpires. watch the Sheeple of Canuckistan stand by and say not a thing. :-(

Ummm, does Harper fill the Senate appointments this weekend, just in case? Or does Dion fill them as soon as he's in office? And if the latter, does the NDP get 33% of those seats? I wonder how that will work?

Only in Canada, a government elected with ten seats short of Majority with a plot being cobbled up in various quarters to have them taken down by a jealous pack of rogues who are missing their entitlements.

Dion and Layton shacking up with Duceppes whoring when it's of interest to Quebec. Beautiful stuff.

If a non confidence motion passes, it's the PM who goes to the governor general to say the government has lost the confidence of the house and then asks the GG to dissolve parliament and call an election. The GG can ask the opposition if they can form a government, but seeing that the combined Lib/NDP is 114 seats versus the Conservatives 142 seats this will not happen. So without the Bloq being a formal member of said coalition there would be an election.

If this is truly about the 'stimulus package', what is it that the coalition plans to do? All I have heard from them the Conservatives aren't doing enough....but aren't saying what their plans are? Is it a $100 billion bailout to failing industries and huge unions? Is it cross the board (including high income) tax cuts? Please coalition, before you dare to bring down an elected government, give us the details and let the people decide...oh wait, that was what the election last month was for!!

Now would be the time for 12 blue Liberals to cross the floor, claiming they could never let separatists control the federal government.

Any one want to start a pool?

Top of my list:
1 Kieth Martin - just because
2 Irwin Cotler - a Canada first guy
3 Sukh Dhaliwal - surrounded by a sea of blue in Vancouver suburbs
4 Larry Bagnell - Yukon
5 Anthony Rota - Northern Ontario
6 Marc Garneau - Montreal Federalist
7 Francis Scarpaleggia - Montreal Federalist
8 Massimo Pacetti - Montreal Federalist
9 Scott Andrews - Newfoundland newbie, knows he will lose the next election as a Liberal
10 Scott Simms - Newfoundland MP going for the cabinet post
11 Lawrence MacAulay - PEI senses a change in the political winds on the island
12 Rodger Cuzner - Nova Scotia

This seems like the weekend that anything can happen....

Ted: "I'm not speakign for Canadians, Kate. I am assessing what I think Canadians are feeling. And Canadians want leadership, they don't want political games."

What a pile of crap, and so like a Liberal. "I'm assessing what I THINK [my emphasis] Canadians are feeling." So presumptuous, not based in reality. Librano$ put words in Canadians' mouths, thoughts in their heads and, funny thing, what Canadians apparently think is exactly what the Librano$ think. Viscious circle.

"Canadians want leadership, not political games"?

Do tell, Ted. We've had over 30 years of Librano political games and THAT'S what Canadians are heartily sick and tired of. Canadians are also fed up with the political games of their lapdogs in the MSM and the MSM's, especially the CBC's, propaganda for the Liberals (all Liberal, all the time).

OFF THE WIRES: Harper clinging to power for another week. Does what he said was anti-democratic three years ago and cancels/postpones Liberals opposition day.

So,if successful the Liberal lead coalition would be headed by either:
Dion the least popular LPC leader.... ever
Iggy the untested academic from the US
Rae the Ontario premier that messed up Ontario economy during a recession
or
Layton the socialist

None of them have any legitimate claim to govern. Dion was soundly rejected by voters and other two LPCers do not even have the approval of their own party let alone Canadian voters. Layton and the NDP are no more than a federal fringe party. Then add that the CPC just won the election less than 2 months ago. If the GG agrees to such a coalition then the GG office also needs to be reformed.

Is this the same Layton that was running to be PM recently? - the guy that came in, NOT quite PM, not the first looser, nor the second looser, but who actually came in fourth? The same one?

Wow, he came in last, and still wants to be part of the leadership of the country. One way or another!

Again, WOW.

CRB

Hmm... lets see: Le petit gars from Shawinigan introduces a political party funding methodology specifically designed to torpedo Paul Martins chances of challenging his record as a Liberal leader.... then when PMSH contemplates cancelling this arrangement, the zombie arises from the dead to arrange a coalition of trough snufflers....

Trudeau: not dead enough.
Chretien: not prosecuted enough...

So PMSH has stalled the opposition day to Dec 8th..Plenty of time for the Coalition of the Left to clearly define the terms and cost of their economic stimulus plan (as if they had a plan).

Besides the lack of plan, the next week should be fun to watch given the dynamics of this polygamous marriage made in piggery.

The three (or four) stooges fighting for the helm of the LPC...Wacko Jacko demanding Finance and or Industry and the ever charming Gilles Duceppe demanding concessions for Quebec at the expense of the rest of the country.

Add to that the optics of tired hacks like Cretien and Broadbent engineering a palace coup over the issue of taxpayer dollars for political parties and I can't see this thing holding together.

You might as well try to herd feral tom cats than keep this cutthroat collection of political vermin running the same direction.

This should be freakin awesome!

Syncro

Interesting historical factoid: Winston Churchill was never elected Prime Minister until after the war.

The present idiotic rantings and ravings of the selfish demented morons in the NDP and the Crooked Liberal party is a perfect example of why voters should not be forced to subsidize any political party.

And any GG that would allow a coalition govt to take over just weeks after a $300 million election was held could kiss any respect for that position to be shot as well.
She better realize that the GG position would be ABOLISHED as quickly as possible, should she be that stupid.

Canadians did not vote for the creep in a creeps clothing, or the video professor to run the country.

manny, you aren't very knowledgeable or logical.

First, to have the taxpayer give (got that, give?) money to a political party without their permission is undemocratic. The reason is because a political party is not part of the economy but is a political perspective. No taxpayer should support a political perspective without their permission.

Second, farmers - and my goodness, you do hate farmers, don't you. I wonder why. But, farmers - can justifiably be subsidized by the taxpayer because they are an integral part of the economic infrastructure of any nation. I know that you live on pure air, manny, but you are, heh, unique.

The subsidies to farmers are not 'gifts'; they ae not 'donations' but low cost loans, reduction or waiver of various taxes, a low cost loan of a percentage of the cost of new equipment, trade agreements, reduction in transfer, capital gains taxes and so on, etc. What do you have against this?

This strengthens this sector of the economy to enable it to compete against the farm produce from other countries - which might be much cheaper in costs, due to low land costs, labour, and their own govt subsidies.

With your illogical perspective, you'll next be declaring that govts shouldn't fund the building of roads, or hospitals, or schools; it should all be done by private donation.

So, your attempt, manny, to set up a comparison between political parties and farmers is an invalid analogy. The first is a political association and not part of the infrastructure of a nation; the second is an economic system, not an association, and an integral party of an economy. So, manny - Try again. This time, use facts. And logic.

If I'm Harper, I meet with the lieberal's and Jacko. I give them there one time stimulus package and then I add back the cutting off of the $1.95. Then if they vote it down you know their true intentions and whip them in an election. If they pass it you have a one time expense to cut them off at the knees by bankrupting them.

A farmer once told me in elections its cheaper to keep a fat pig fat rather than fatten up a skinny pig. Might be some truth to that.

The arogance of these people should not be surprising. The Gliberals and Kneedeepers, when another election is cal