Maybe I will send the conservatives fifty bucks. Because I support conservative values. Maybe it's to stick a virtual thumb in Stephane's eye.

If this turns ultra destructive, there is no good to be had anywhere. I would love to see the Libs at two seats, but that doesn't mean they won't come back. That feat is recent history. Seriously, if there is a time for fiscal conservatism to work, it is now. If there is a time to prove conservatives aren't scary to our neighbors, that's now too. Options that keep the wolf from the door include the defensive: extended EI benefits when retraining and targetted infrastructure spending. Leadership would include working with and levering the experience of immigrant groups in a real way to go into new markets for all Canadians, lowering taxes on investment, demolishing inter-provincial trade barriers...

Kicking the ever-living crap out of political opposition, (and I absolutely oppose public financing of political parties) is needlessly distracting. If conservative principals are as good as we say they are, the results will be their own recommendation and a $1.95 per vote will become irrelevant.

Right now it is all about the economy stupid.

I think you'll all enjoy this little something I wrote: http://pelalusa.blogspot.com/2008/11/huffing-and-puffing-in-ottawa-sandbox.html

Call it a "useful analogy"!

Is it just me or does Bob Rae look like Gary Busey?

If the Liberals form a coalition government with the separatists and Taliban Jack they're going to have to wear that in the next election -- i.e. in a couple of months and they know it.

What's revolting about this is the way the opposition parties are all *pretending* that they're outraged about the lack of a stimulus package. They're inveterate liars. They're taking it, and they'll pay for it. It couldn't be more clear that what they're actually outraged about is that the taxpayer tit is being yanked out of their mouths. They evidently consider it to be not possible that one out of every ten Canadians who voted for them might kick in twenty bucks to replace the money. That speaks volumes about the paltry grassroots support for the Liberals in particular.

Adam Radwanski in the G&M promotes that "undemocratic" gay-fakery: "The governing party will be able to cobble enough to spend the limit during a campaign, but nobody else will."

Think about that for a second -- *he* didn't: IF the parties were to remain funded by taxpayers based on the number of votes received, THEN the governing party would have more money. But if the parties are funded by grassroots support -- small donations, by law -- the ruling party would have no guaranteed advantage whatsoever.

Just irrational, fake outrage.

Ah well, watch out, Stephane: "Under the Liberal constitution the party's national executive has...power to appoint an interim successor should the leader resign or die. Ignatieff...would likely become leader if that route were followed..."

Hmm. So if Dion doesn't resign simply because Iggy wants him to...

Boy, you've gotta think that they burning the midnight oil in the Rae and Iggy camps trying to figure out a way to come out on top.

Meanwhile Stephane sleeps the sleep of pious angels. He will only figure out that he is no longer leader when the the his key to the leader of the opposition office door no longer works.

He's baack...

"Governor General, Chretien said to have roles as confidence vote approaches"

http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=3d7fbdf2-1007-480b-899a-d5bbacb1cc4a

"...former prime minister Jean Chretien has been called in to "broker" a quick end to the Liberal leadership race as Ottawa gears up for a confidence vote Monday that could end Prime Minister Stephen Harper's seven-week-old minority government."

A cage match would be a more humane way to do this than what is actually going to take place...

Wow I knew the dippers and lieberals were stupid, but not that stupid.

So they vote against the bill because it does not contain a stimulus package, like thats what the country needs, more government spending!

And then what? They go to the Governor General (the Queens representative who has sworn to uphold the monarchy) with the blocheads in tow and say we want to rule the country, with the blocheads obviously having veto power. Yeah nice one boys, our Governor General is pretty stupid but I don't think she is going to give the blocheads that power.

Or they ask for another general election, so that the Conservatives can endlessly run Boob Rae repeat that NOBODY wants an election especially in the winter. The lieberals go into a campaign with no money, no clear idea who the leader is and will campaign on what in Ontario? we don't want to give up 6 million bucks of money you sent to us when you were employed. Haha HA.

The dippers at least have something to gain, they will play up to the public sector unions and gain a few more seats from the lieberals (played them like suckers).

The bloc will risk their traditional fifty seats, but it does not matter they are all getting pensionable time while achieving nothing.

The conservatives will endlessly play clips of the party spokesmen demanding their $1.95 per vote and the electorate will see them for what they are, Political Welfare Bums(TM David Lewis NDP)

Oh its going to be a very enjoyable Christmas, no gifts for me Santa, I alrerady have everything I want.

If the opposition parties form a coalition and and the GG empowers them then we will see a coup d'etat in Canada similiar to what Germany went through in the Thirties. Canadians have to wake up to the fact that in a global economy Canada is small potatoes, much like our influence on the global warming scene. Anything Harper does for economic stimulus in Canada will have to wait until the other G7 countries come up with a plan globally. If we jump the gun here we could shoot ourselves in the foot. The faux outrage in the HoC today is not over the stimulus package it is over the cutting off of the public funds and to think otherwise is to drink the 'fool-ade'. If the opposition defeat Harper's government on this bill and we don't go for an election then as I've said above we will see a coup d'etat in Canada. If we go for an election then the opposition is going to get their pink slips before the second fiscal report next year.

Kate, I think you're enjoying this just a little too much.

On second thought, nah, it's impossible to enjoy it too much.

In my dream, during the election campaign Harper tells Canadians on even numbered days that any "stimulus" plan beyond what is already budgeted guarantees deficits. On odd numbered days he tells us that the opposition parties defeated the government and put us into an election campaign during Christmas season because they didn't want to lose their taxpayer subsidy.

But, an election will never happen. Neither will an opposition coalition. We'll have to settle for giggling while the opposition foams at the mouth until enough Libranos get sick ensuring the motion will pass.

another part of this proposal should be to demand that the lieberals pay back the adscam money at the same time as the cuts to subsidies.

Wasn't it the Canadian MSM who said Canadian politics were boring ? Something tells me that's not what their thinking after today. Christmas comes early for Canadians! I hope the Conservatives have the strength of conviction to stare down the welfare bums on the left of the house. Watching the seperatist Bloc, Liberal, NDP alliance, along with the wingnuts in the Green party and their comrades in the MSM whining and crying for their welfare is really an astonishing spectacle. We're entitled to our entitlments is their mantra, and who the hell is going to listen to them. The Peoples Temple of Trudeauvia are in a real bind with this one, their belief that Canadians owe them is outrageous. Trying to feign outrage over the fact the Government doesn't have some half baked stimulus package is a classic deflection technique, when we all know the concern of the Bloc, Liberal, NDP alliance is self preservation. Canadians fund the seperatist Bloc to the tune of 86% now that's" as dumb as a bag of hammers". What a pack of self serving parasites, all the while pretending to care about the ecomomy and whats good for Canadians. If the Liberals and their comrades in the Bloc were to dare to form a coalition government they would be risking the very future of the country. Whom would they choose to be the PM Dion ? Layton ? Duceppe ?!? As for the Haitian princess in the GGs office, with her well known seperatist sympathies what can we expect from her ? 290 million dollars has been spent since 2004 on political party welfare, propping up parties that wouldn't know the first thing about raising money to support their ideologies. The MSM have always loved to paint PM Harper as a bully, but it's the MSM along with their comrades in the Bloc, Liberal, NDP alliance that are trying to bully the Canadian electorate into supporting them finacially whether we like it or not. What a disgrace these fat cat welfare socialists are, they simply can't contemplate the concept of paying their own way, or finding enough people who believe in their ideology to support them. Stay on it PM Harper, please don't back down.

[quote]Some MPs said former prime minister Jean Chretien had been approached for advice on how to massage Dion’s early exit. But sources close to Chretien said he has not been contacted and is in no way involved. [/quote]

The New Jersey in me recognizes the HIT man role. Is the party that shallow that they need Chretien (the adult) to tell them how to run the party. What happens if they are elected, does Chretien run the country from a dark table in the infamous Franks Restaurant of Montreal?

The MSM has thier lead Story...Why not ask the question?

If they really want to save bucks, they should forget any sort of convention, and just go straight to Thunderdome.

Three Libs enter - one Lib leaves!

The mental image of Iggy, Rae and Stephanie bouncing around a giant metal hemisphere on bungee cords with running chainsaws in their lily-white mitts is hard to resist, no?

Hey, Cal2: I like the way you think. I hoist a beer in your general direction.

The media are deliberately ignoring the historical fact that Chretien instituted state funding for Canada's political parties purely as a bailout for the Liberal Party.

The Libs had so thoroughly disgusted the electorate by the time he passed that law that no ordinary voter would donate enough for them to run the party. They had to steal it -- which led to Adscam. But Chretien knew the looting was only a temporary solution for his gang, so he put all the parties on welfare.

The media keep going on about the Tories' fabulous high-tech fund-raising machinery. Bull! The fact is that Liberals, as a group, are used to taking what they want, not donating to the general good. Conservatives tend to be more civic-minded, and give.

I like Wuberman's idea of sending the Tories $50 for their party defunding gambit. Let's follow his example.

Dear God, I'm hoping that there's going to be some floor crossing to the CPC to head off the imbeciles that are planning a "coalition government."

Just imagine what a coalition of the entitled Librano$, Dipper$, and Blockhead$ would mean for Canadians. The government and all of their specially chosen "victim" (sic) groups will be on the dole, courtesy of the rest of us. Bye-bye any semblance of sanity, sound judgment, or responsible fiscal policy.

I'm on my knees praying PLEASE keep the CPC in place. Prime Minister Stephen Harper is the only good apple in the bunch; Dion, Ignatieff, Rae, Layton, Duceppe are just a bunch of clowns--you know the kind in the horror films? Jolly on the outside, twisted on the inside ...

"However, Behiels predicted that a coalition 'wouldn’t last more than a month' and the country would be plunged into another election anyway. And he said that’s exactly what Harper wants." He added, “I think this has been engineered. Harper wants his majority so bad before we’re into the depths of a recession.”

Won't happen. There will be no election. The entire political apparatus of this country is controlled by liberals for liberal interests and the GG would not allow an election, instead choosing to allow the Liberals to form a coalition.

The Liberals are broke. Canadians wouldn't want another election. Quebec is in the midst of a provincial election already. Back-to-back-to-back elections? The GG would never allow it.

And if there was any credibility to Behiels' claim that Harper has engineered this then where would the votes come from that would give Harper a majority? Quebec? Why would those in ridings that voted Bloc over Conservatives last October not vote the same way again, especially if it means more for Quebec with the Bloc in a coalition? There is a 0% of another election over this in my opinion. A better chance at a coalition. But even that is unlikely. The situation will be diffused with one side or another backing down.

If I was Harper I'd be putting the army on stand by. This notion of a coalition is nothing more than a coup. Who the fu*k do these leftists think they are? The Conservatives won the election so get over it. You want to vote down the Gov't, fine, but a coup?

Long live the Western Republic. Fu*k the east.

Next up: CBC viewers pay their own way.

The polls are showing that Canadians are pleased to see the "MP Welfare" scam stopped in its tracks. As we know, the CPC, which, in real terms, will lose the most money in this case, basically supports itself. It’s the lefty parties, whom the majority of Canadians apparently vote for, that appear to have no real grassroots—as in donations—support

Like others here, my cheque to the Conservatives will be in the mail today, an outward and visible sign of my support. A surge of donations to the CPC by us little guys will be a FACT the naysayers can't overlook. (Well, as usual, the MSM will probably look the other way, but the facts will get out. Their airtight vessel has sprung a lot of leaks . . .)

Seeing the lefties' distress at being thoroughly hoist on their own petard is sweet.

(If it backfires, the country will be in the hands of our lefty pirates and we'll be in really deep trouble. The up side of that will be that Canadians, who flirt with their lefty parties, attractively packaged by the left's MSM allies, while being totally ignorant of their total incompetence and duplicity, will soon be dancing with these wolves and find out all about their skulduggery. And, in the present financial meltdown, the lefties won't have the money to buy approval the way they used to. It will be very painful, but, if Canadians are willing to allow a coalition of wolves to ravage this country—all of them, cutting off their noses to spite their faces—maybe a dose of REALLY unpleasant reality is what this country needs.)

From Fife just now...'unprecedented' times right now..the Libs/ndp with assist in talks from Chretien and Ed Broadbent will go to GG to topple gov't.Fife states the Bloc want Dion gone,before they will give their blessing..NDP will have seats in Cabinet.OMG! the country is done.

Good. Let them try their little tin-pot coup d'etat. When push comes to shove, the people of this country are very centrist, and their is no way that they will stand for a coalition of the moonbat/dipper/trough wallowing leftards.

There are probably enough centrist libs who would cross the floor out of disgust.

The last thing this country needs right now is political instability. With declining commodity prices, and real estate values barely clinging to their current levels, the best case scenario is PMSH and his economics background running the show.

Keep your powder dry libranos. You can engage in your chicanery once the global economy stablizes.

An NDP, Bloc, Liberal coalition government . . . would be the most hilarious concoction possible.

I'd pay big bucks to be a fly on the wall at the first caucus meeting, let alone the first Leader's meeting to set policy goals.

Like three scorpions locked up in a small bottle/

Globe and Mail poll: “Should the opposition parties support the Conservative government’s economic package?”

Yes: 49%. No: 51%

First off, Chretien had no debate when he decided to force us all to support all political parties to the tune of $1.75. He took full advantage of the fact he had weak opposition, he did whatever he wished, including sending troops to Afghanistan. That was just fine with the media, their party was in power.

Now the media are salivating at the possibility the government will fall. Wonder how they figure we'll do with warring factions trying to steer us through rough economic waters?

It's the politics of the absurd being played out by a gleeful idiotic media with mush for brains.

Imagine the Liberals, who haven't got their own act together, the Dippers who do not see eye to eye with them or anyone else and the Bloc who are only in it for Quebec.
Will we see the first Junta in North America?

Eventually the coalition will fall apart and the Tories will have a full quiver of arrows and a full coffer to fight yet another election. They will also be the only party that hadn't banded with separatists in order to grasp for power.

My sense is most Canadians do not want to rush into more government spending to 'stimulate' the economy. They also recognize that the government has already committed money in that direction anyway. Chretien if he is indeed advising the liberals will probably tell them to return to sitting on their hands.

Iggy seemed cautious on the News last night and is probably already planning urgent family business to take him out of town on Monday.

As I posted elsewhere: What would happen in the markets if such a coalition did grab power?

I think that the fools are doing exactly what Harper's strategists had expected them to do: Destroy themselves.

Of course they are ready to run a government together to save their welfare payments, how unprincipled, how unpatriotic.

Or as the old Nova Scotia election campaign wisdom saying said, "Talk is cheap. It takes money to buy rum".

I think that the fools are doing exactly what Harper's strategists had expected them to do: Destroy themselves.

Of course they are ready to run a government together to save their welfare payments, how unprincipled, how unpatriotic.

Or as the old Nova Scotia election campaign wisdom saying said, "Talk is cheap. It takes money to buy rum".

Poll from CFRA in Ottawa
Should the Conservatives back down on their proposal to cut public subsidies for political parties in order to avoid defeat in Monday night's confidence vote? (Please vote first. To comment, email mornings@cfra.com)
Yes - it looks like a move designed to silence the opposition
22.8%
No - it is a genuine attempt at restraint and a matter of principle
75.3%
Other

I think the opposition parties are contemplating political suicide -- the Canadian people voted 38% for the Conservatives to govern, not a rag-bag coalition of parties, one of which includes a separatist party. The electorate will remember, and with great anger. Triggering an election during an economic downturn will demonstrate how out of touch these politicians are.

Let's keep in mind that Conservatives lost in a few ridings by small margins -- they could win those in another election, giving them the majority they desire. Do the Liberals and Co. really want that?

Good post, Bobbi.

If Harper showed half the enthusiasm attacking the HRC's, gun registry, bloated government, MMGW fraud, etc, etc, as he has shown attacking the LPC, he'd again have my support.

Partisanship is choking the life out of our western democracies.

Defence Minister Jack Layton has a nice ring to it!! Fife is starting to look sh*t-scared over this mess.
How long before this is all over CNN/Fox,and how petty are the opposition parties going to look on the world stage in this financial crisis?

Don't worry about this. I'm sure the Toronto Star will manage to rein in the Liberals and their talk of a coalition. I mean, after all, the Star fought the possibility of a Reform-NDP coalition that would have kept the Bloc from becoming Her Majesty's Loyal Opposition. And the Star wrote every time that Reform/CA/CPC voted the same way as the Bloc, that they were un-Canadian by working with the separatists... so there's no way that the Star would support this. Right?

NDP finance critic Judy Washawhatever has a brain skull cramp on Duffy last nite.

Going on about No Money for the Poor, no money to protect mortgages, No money yadda yadda yadda, But Is Unwilling to GIVE UP THEIR POLITICAL WELFARE CHEQUE.
And while this was all going on flashing on the screen $6Billion for Infrastructure.
Ya judy it is a atrocity to democracy When the Socialist/Communist Threaten to OVERTHROW DEMOCRACY.
History Repeats itself! Think about it folks.

*breifly: i had a quick stop after work at my RCl Branch The talk was all about the Political Parties Recieving $30million
I pointed out to the guys That is PER YEAR & the Opposition is threatening to OverThrow the Govt, They were all saying the Same thing Fng Commies, BullSh**. Also that topic was the talk at the Coffee Shop this morning.
Ya Judy, Scott & Our Friend Ted. Canadians are listening & Yes they Agree with the PM.
Maybe not in LaLa Land but in the Real Working World they are.

I'm up for another election, especially one called by the opposition because they won't stand for a budget cut during a financial crisis. I'm not moving this month, and I have time to volunteer (so long as there is no background check eh?)

Of course I'd also welcome an election called by the opposition in support of the 2 billion dollar gun registry or the multi-million dollar section 13 HRC circus.

Why not a bill that kills the registry, section 13 AND the political party pork fest all at one shot?

Bring. It. On.

Wow. Didn't think the Liberals were really this dumb. Doesn't surprise me though.

Chretien and Broadbent involved...hmmm....maybe the Liberals really want an election after they knife Dion.

All the vaunted words of the Liberals about playing footsie with the Bloc, you know how bad it is...as usual means absolutely nothing.

This can be signaling from the opposition as well to make this critically important thing go away. Problem is the GG is part of the "the cabal".

How in the world do you hand power over 2 months after an election in which the conservatives got MORE seats than last time? They really really want power back.

Wow Bob Fife is all worked up over this. It seems that maybe he had some money riding on Harper playing nice this time around or something. If Fife is talking like that I can't imagine what Don Newman will be like.

I don't think the coalition is as likely as he is making it out to be. I don't think the Conservatives will back down either.

vlad the ignatieffer

The whole Liberal plan for a coalition is so poorly thought out and short-sighted that I can't believe they would actually follow through with it.

However, we are talking about the Liberal party here, so maybe.....

Seriously, when Monday rolls around I suspect that a lot of Liberal MPs will catch a cold that day and not show up for the vote.

This whole fiasco typifies what happens when you've got an incompetent, confused leader at the helm of your party. The Liberals are currently singing from about 50 different song sheets. The fact that Dion is also a lame duck leader merely adds to the chaos.

Where are other Lib MP's hiding? I'd love to hear what Rota has to say.Think I'll e-mail him.
Why are they so quiet? Surely they haven't been told to 'toe the line'. That's something the Libs don't like , right?

Maybe the Tories will go away for the weekend and on Monday present the Financial Statement in two parts:

Part 1) The cutting of the political subsidy
Part 2) The rest of it

This would force the parties to vote up or down on the political subsidy. This would leave no room to hide.

Another factor is how do individual MPs feel about returning to their constituents again after only a few weeks. It will be their jobs on the line and they probably haven't paid all their campaign bills yet.

No- I think the talk of election will fizzle. The coalition if it happens will not last long. Bit of a pickle really. Poor Iggy probably wishes he was back at Harvard no that he is involved in a two-front war.

I'm not so sure things will go the Cons way on this. I actually support removing the public support for political parties BUT over an extended timeline of 5 years. Wasn't it just the Conservatives a few weeks ago saying that they would try to get along with the opposition parties? The proof is trying to chop their legs off knowing that the other parties are much more financially shakey.

Harper should do a compromise of reducing funding over 5 years allowing the other parties time to get their financial books in order and getting out there and raising their money. To do otherwise shows that it is purely Machavellian and really is trying to undermine Canadian democracy by putting muzzles on hteir opposition. I'm not so sure the electorate will be angry at the opposition -- I think the anger could point front and centre at the Conservatives if the opposition phrases it as a crisis of democracy.

Since we all pay for the thing anyway, we may as well have our say:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/polls/political-subsidies.html

another poorly disguised way for Ontario and Quebec to run things no matter what the outcome of the election.

FREE THE WEST

I think we should allow that the Liberals do need their subsidies. Donations have dried up and not being in power has prevented them from stealing money. What else can they do?

Anyone here think Harper might give them a way out? As usual, Harper is probably going not to where the puck is, but where the puck is going to be.

Oh so this is the REAL reason why the leftards want to ban guns!

At 8:42 a.m.:

Globe and Mail poll: “Should the opposition parties support the Conservative government’s economic package?”

Yes: 49%. No: 51%

Now:

Yes: 56%. No: 44%

VOTE!

Thousand mile stare at the midget clowns racing around in their little tiny fire truck with buckets of confetti and spotted Chihuahua across the gallery.

Don't speak, don't blink.

Go Prime Minister Steve.

I think that it was stated in Parliament yesterday that short little newfie guy whats his name 'Jimmy that mean man Flaherty' was going to present more ideas on the stim package on Monday.

This is the first idea about how to save Canadians money. Good move PMSH. It shows that we can save some money buy down sizing entitlements, I don't think the ordinary big or small business owners are mad about this. The ordinary Canadian that is making a living would see this as a good productive move on the Governments part of cutting back on unnecessary expenditures.

Makes one wonder of what it's going to take to bye off 'Mr. Wimpy Dion'.
Debt = payed 'check'
Senate appointment = 'check'
Senate appointment for wife = 'check'
Schools across Canada must have new book, 'Mr. Wimpy Dion' trials and tribulation of being bullied by the meanies 'the cons!' at super inflated prices = 'check'

I can't get enough of this. This is absolutely delicious!
BTW Kate, I like your flashing light better than Ezra's.

A minority coalition. Yeah right. Brokered by dinosaurs Chretien and Broadbent. Yeah right. The overriding crisis is - a recession. Yeah right. Political parties seizing power to secure taxpayer entitlement. Yeah right. GG agrees to this and undoubtably triggers constitutional crisis which will surely end up in court. Yeah right. GG refuses to dissolve parliament (happened only once, I understand, in 1922). Yeah right. The West says OK no problem. Yeah right.

This is a bluff by opposition, plain and simple. The "coalition" would have less seats than the governing party. The "prime minister" would be chosen in a secret caucus meeting rather than a public leadership convention or election?

No chance this will happen. Harper will simply get GG to dissolve parliament (and she will agree, you can be sure of that), and opposition parties will have to fight election with no money, whining for their entitlement to taxpayer dollars when Candians are worried about their jobs and savings.

Here's a more probably scenario. Conservatives find the votes they need amongst the other parties (13 right?). Or, Tories "back down" with phase in period for contributions for say, five years (then opposition will throw public sector unions under the bus, relieved at their near miss of political suicide).

This is a bluff and Harper knows it. He has exposed opposition for what they are - whining pigs at the trough, threatening a velvet coup which is utterly unprecedented in Canadian history (no war, no depression, no criminal corruption scandal).

It's good political theatre though. Sorry, Mr Fife, your "breaking story" is nothing but bluff and BS.

Then again, maybe opposition will go for it. I hope they do.

Cheds poll for 2008 11 38 0900hrs
Should the Tory government be replaced over it's economic statement, either by a coalition or through another election?
Yes - They're simply being mean-spirited by taking away taxpayer support for political parties. - 24.3%
No - I think political parties should do their own fund-raising. - 60.7%
Unsure - What would a coalition government look like?. - 15%

Chretian & Broadbent working on a deal

There is going to be Such an Uproar From Canadians seeing the Bolsheveks at the Gates that we may see a Majority afterall.
There are many Centre MP's in the liberal caucas & many that are not Chretian & Broadbent fans that we are about to see an exodus from the liberals to the Govt to prevent this Over Throw of Democracy.
You think your Economy is going into a Tank Now watch the Canadian Markets today & Monday.
And i would not be Surprised at All that this Deal has been in the Works Long before the last Election was even called & they were just waiting for the right moment to Unleash the Coup d'Tant.
Rae, Chretian, Power Corp, NDP/socialist.

If the Liberal - NDP co-alition ever comes about, do the idiots who support this realize, who has the balance of power, and who essentially will guide the course of this country - Bloc Quebecois. I hope the Governor General is acutely aware of this and the imminent danger.
The stain of entitlement rears its' ugly head again as we find all MP's in the Liberal and NDP parties think Canadian Taxpayers should pay the MP's way in good times and bad and the country be damned.
They must think that Canadians are complete fools, since Canadians have been asked by these same MP's for years to jump through all kinds of hoops to defeat the Bloc, and now in one swoop these jerks will hand the reigns of power to the Bloc.
Isn't it strange that some political pundits, suggest that Harper (who won the election) should back down, but don't suggest that the opposition (who lost the election ) should back down.

HARPER BACKS DOWN! CKNW reporting that the Cons have pulled the subsidy from the Fiscal update bill.

Harper's biggest mistake ever? I'm leaning that way.

Depends, rat, when he re-introduces it. Can it be tabled as a stand-alone confidence matter? That'll remove the pretence the opposition leeches have that this is about the stimulus package.

Damn, I wanted my cage match!

the rat: See wnmc above at 10:19.

Make the subsidy a separate issue and have the gravy suckers go on the public record about their entitlement to entitlements. Betcha most of them phone in sick for that vote.

Not at all. Actually the subsidy may have been a head fake. If the Tories withdraw the subsidy and phase it in over time, they keep the high ground while keeping all the footage of the opposition looking silly and get their fiscal update through the house.

Not bad. Actually makes them look like they are trying to get things done.

Maybe, but then it is definitely Harper trying to destroy the Oppositions with no pretense of fiscal prudence. I think either way it's dead.

On the upside, if you're the Liberals going in to an election, taking loans using your future subsidy as collateral, will bankers be as willing to give that loan with the threat that a Harper majority kills it? Maybe that's the end game.

What a stupid leading poll. The "Oh, just in case you didn't know, you see it's bad to take away funding from weak opposition parties, please vote no" predicate is annoying

Then rat, the opposition can defeat a motion that would have support of the vast majority of Canadians. The Conservatives can either then:

1. Refuse the welfare payment and gain the political capital that the provincial PC's in Manitoba are enjoying; or

2. Take the money, and buy lots and lots of commercials showing how the greedy oppo parties voted to keep their hands in taxpayer pockets.

It's win-win.

Brilliant move by Harper. Now everyone knows that the only reason the opposition parties were against the package was because they wanted to retain their "entitlements"....they can no longer pretend it was for more lofty reasons. The Conservative party now has wonderful clips to replay in the next election showing the greed of the opposition re our tax dollars.

Separating the funding out? Well, as others have said - "Harper, you magnificent b*****d"!!

Pure genius

I really should be at work but this is way to fun to watch. As of yet CTV Newsnet has not picked up on the separation ploy.....I can hardly wait to see Craig Oliver and Bob Fife's heads spinning when they realize the implications....Bawahahahahaha!!!!

Syncro

There is another poll over at the Mope and Wail. The question is "Should the opposition parties support the Conservative government’s economic package?"

So far, 54% yes.

Is that a real CBC poll? They can't spell "opposition"?

Prudent move for Tories. They have exposed opposition for what they are, more concerned with their own largesse than helping Canadians through uncertain times. If I were PM, I would re-introduce this bill as standalone, maybe not as confidence measure.

Like I said, Harper has exposed opposition for what they are, money grubbers who can't raise their own funding, pretending to be government in waiting.

The opposition had better pray that the new bill doesn't pass. If it does, it'll provide very clear proof that all the fuss was over "party funding" and had nothing to do with the other measures in the bill...

today's ctv.ca poll
"Should the Liberals form a coalitin with the NDP?"

No 3863 61%
Yes 2448 39%

On the Flip side Floor crossing Negotiations are progressing well across the hall.

I think Harper and the Tories had this planned all along.They knew full well what the opposition parties would do.I think he plays them like a fiddle.

He upped the anti.

I love it. Yesterday, readers here were proclaiming that Deceivin' Stephen was a brilliant chessmaster, had played Ignatieff and the Liberals into a corner, was going to force them to vote for ending the public political funding or force them to go into an election on it, and everyone cheered 'go for it, Harpie'.

Then Steve-o blinked as he realized what a catastrophic political mistake he made.

And now it is assumed here that his chickening out was all part of his brilliant strategy, he's playing the opposition like a fiddle. Oy vey. It took the Liberals and their supporters a decade to get completely out of synch and out of touch with the mood of the nation. It has taken the Conservatives and their supporters only 2 years.

Deceivin' Stephen may be playing chess, but Canadians don't want games. They want leadership.

Cheds poll for 2008 11 28 1030hrs 'AB Time'
Should the Tory government be replaced over it's economic statement, either by a coalition or through another election?
Yes - They're simply being mean-spirited by taking away taxpayer support for political parties. - 16.8%
No - I think political parties should do their own fund-raising. - 72.7%
Unsure - What would a coalition government look like?. - 10.5%

You must not have played chess, Ted. It's not a matter of anticipating your opponent's next move.

It's in anticipating your opponent's next moves, and having a contingency plan for them all, that separates the men from the masters.

Ted. As I said he didn't blink he upped the anti.

Canadians will not soon forget that the Liberals and NDP, were prepared to give the Bloc Quebecois, effective control of the Canadian government for a $1.75.

Isn't it strange that some political pundits, suggest that Harper (who won the election) should back down, but don't suggest that the opposition (who lost the election ) should back down.

Ted you are right....Canadians want leadership and that is something they will never get from the Libs/NDP or separatists. Dion doesn't even know what the question is, Layton thinks the answer to everything is tax "the rich" 500% (that worked well in 1917, didn't it?) and the separatists are nothing more than Marxist parasites that Canada can do without. And the Greens? Well, they are hallucinatory.

Again, you can talk all you want about Harper playing games, Kate. I have no doubt that Harper has more tactical moves and partisan plays up his sleeves. And in doing so he is demonstrating to all exactly why Parliament is "dysfunctional" in his words.

Canadians are sick and tired of it. Doesn't mean they are convinced the opposition has anything better to offer at the moment, but as we saw with the Mulroney/Campbell Progressive Conservatives in 1993, the Rae NDP in Ontario in 1995, the Martin Liberals in 2004 and 2006, the voters will punish the government if it seems more interested in playing games than in governing.

So keep on playing your games all you want. But Canadians want leadership, not political games.

News Talk650 2008 11 28 1153hrs 'SK Time'
How Do You Feel About The Federal Government's Fiscal Update?
The government is taking the right approach in dealing with the economy - 78%
The government isn't doing enough. A stimulus package is needed now - 8%
I'm willing to let the opposition parties form government and have a crack at it - 14%

Harper supporters from a strategic point of view should be in favor of the subsidies. They keep walking dead things like the Greens and the BQ in the game. Do conservatives want the number of leftwing parties in Canada to shrink from 4 to 2?

Still am somewhat disappointed Harper backed down. It was getting really interesting.

Should the collection of arrogant Liberals, Separatist Traitors and Raving Marxists actually bring down the lawfully-elected Government and engineer a coup d'etat, serious thought will have to be given to people fighting back. A tax revolt is the most powerful (and probably the only) weapon we citizens have. In the event of Prime Minister Dion/Layton/Duceppe/Ignatieff (Gawd! even Goodale has been bruited about) then, come tax filing time, my guess is there are going to be an awful lot of conscientious objectors around.

"Canadians are sick and tired of it."

Don't presume to speak for "Canadians".

Isn't "Canadians" code for the left...specifically the Libs?

Syncro

"Isn't "Canadians" code for the left...specifically the Libs?"

I believe "Canadians" is code for Toronto.
Those who don't agree with them are not Canadians anymore, they're "neo-cons".

'Don't presume to speak for "Canadians".'

Amen, Kate. I was just about to give Ted the word myself.

Or is it jus Jack! using an alias? After all, Jack! knows all about what Canadians want.

If he backs down then which meme is no longer true, the he is inflexible meme to be replaced by the power hungry meme.....like switching between winter and all season tires, its that easy.

As for Broadbent...well Ed is the genius who opposed Free Trade and said Medicare would be gone in 25 years because of it.....looks like it is still in place and we have 5 years to go.

Chretien...clearly he is "off the bench" as Warren would say. No need to hold back on anything now, please Mr Harper if there is anything on this guy lets see it soon.

I am sure Rae is incredibly ticked by this whole process, since he wasnt the prince that was to be installed. We will see how this plays out.

I've been busy all morning having a septic tank cleaned from excrement, only to come home at lunch to find Her Majesties Loyal Opposition covering themselves in political excrement in order to stay on taxpayer largesse.

Phony bunch of Bastards!

I'm not speakign for Canadians, Kate. I am assessing what I think Canadians are feeling. And Canadians want leadership, they don't want political games. From any of the parties, frankly. It's just that Harper was the first to show that he didn't learn any lesson from the last election.

Harper is smart enough to realize that sentiment which is why he ran away from the issue so quickly with his tail between his legs. Rather than try and work with the opposition, he thought he could plough over them, take advantage of a looming economic crisis for political gain. The Conservatives were stunned to see Ignatieff and the Liberals have some backbone after all, and his MPs were getting all sorts of negative calls from supporters to smarten up. The constituents got it. The backbenchers got it. And then they gave it to Harper, and he backed down.

If this was a matter of principle then you would have thought Harper might have mentioned it once in his platform or the campaign, but no. Canadians can see right through his crass and transparent attempts at using a political crisis for more power.

Like I said yesterday: this is good policy but bad politics. In fact, as we can see from the reaction out there, offensive politics.

Imagine the Liberals & NDP with the Block holing control. That would put the separatists in power for sure; the WESTERN SEPARATISTS! Quebec has held a water pistol to the ROC’s back for a generation, the West sit’s ready & able to go. Do not push to hard lefties.

Ted:

Offensive?

Take it to the Human Rights Commission if you feel offended.

Can't speak for anybody else, much less all Canadians. Personally, I'm enjoying watching the loony left self-destruct.

"I'm not speakign for Canadians, Kate. I am assessing what I think Canadians are feeling."

Ummm...both of those things basically mean the same damn thing. You're still presuming to know how I think and you're presuming to speak for me. Don't.

Ted Ted Ted,

Do you ever get dizzy from all that spinning?

This was a brilliant move on Harper's part. Tail between his legs? Hardly! You suffer from a bad case of cranial-rectal inversion.

Canadians are Being asked to tighten their belts
Why can't the Opposition do the Same?

That Ted is what Canadians are going to be saying & that is going to be the Downfall of the Left.
Be very carefull for what you wish for When you make a deal with the devil.
They(Lib/NDP) may think they are forming a Coalition of some sort with the BQ on the backburner as Backup, But if i was a gambling man Which iam i would say a coalition with the Lib/NDP/BQ is not going to sit lightly with a few centrist lib mp's and a revolt in the caucas could happen & an aisle walk occurs. I have been saying for a very long time & many times on SDA & other's that the Socialist far left have infiltrated the Liberals & their are many liberals that are not going to be happy about a coalition with the ndp. I would also say that this is playing into the BQ's hands, They would like nothing better then to see English Canada fall apart With upheaval in the HOC.

Thanks Kate. Ted ovously never read the side of blog site where these words appear.

Why this blog?
Until this moment
I have been forced
to listen while media
and politicians alike
have told me
"what Canadians think".
In all that time they
never once asked.

This is just the voice
of an ordinary Canadian
yelling back at the radio -
"You don't speak for me."

Well spoken.

I see. The Canadians here prefer our politicians playing games instead of showing leadership and working together.

Harper can keep playing his games and the cheerleaders here can keep cheering him on. The rest of us Canadians want leadership, not games. Maturity, not political pranks. Working together, not taking advantage of an economic crisis for political partisan's gain.

And the Canadians here at SDA disagree. Got it.

What a great way to end the week.

Merle: Kate doesn't speak for Canadians either. Each Canadian speaks for themself. And as for me, I agree with Ted... won't anyone just do what is right for the country? Rather than scrapping around and taking shots at each other during the holiday season, while we are in an extreme slowdown if not yet technically a recession, is showing everyone's true colours.

The Cons are also now going to play the 'oh its just for fiscal restraint' card after growing government 8% in the last year? Its as unbelievable to me as is that the Libs are as outraged only over the lack of infrastructure funding.

I'm speaking for myself, but I wager there's a good number of other Canadians out there too who feel the same way. I want politicians to do what's right for the country and guide us through these tough times -- not fight tooth and nail to be the PM. We decided that recently and nothing came of it. If anyone pushes us back into the election booth, I don't think anyone can know what the outcome will be. More than likely it'll just be another $300 million down the drain for no change. Fiscal restraint indeed.

****Kory Teneycke, Communications director has Just announced the slash to party financing wont be in the bill Monday.

Now some may take this as The PM backed down,
I would take it as The PM just showed to the Taxpayers of Canada that the Oppossition is More Worried About their Funds then Yours!
And just showed their Real Adjenda, "GREED & POWER" & that they are willing to "Over Throw Democracy" & the will of Canadians.

ted, Canadians want leadership. That's what they are getting from Harper.

You don't speak or express what Canadians are thinking. You speak only for one person; yourself. And you don't 'get it'.

Have you seen the polls? The majority are fed up with paying the costs of the political parties from their tax dollars. Let those parties get their support from individual private donors. Not from 'The Government'.

You call screaming that you are 'entitled' to taxpayer dollars a sign of 'backbone' in the Liberal and other parties? No, it's a sign of elitism, of smug insistence on entitlements, of self-definition as the Lords of the Manor, to whom the peasants must pay their tithes.

As for their equal screams about a 'stimulation package' - that's equally elistist. It ignores the infrastructure and focuses only on ensuring stablity by flinging masses of taxpayer dollars at the same infrastructure. The one that is failing. That's bad economics. I know that's The Liberal Way (and the NDP) but the real changes have to be structural. Not just more money to retain the same systems.

The Conservativies are correct in, at the moment, cutting back on costs, setting up a careful budget, with no deficit (unlike your screams, ted, that they are already in deficit)..and waiting to see what the global structural changes are doing. That includes those in the US auto sector and in the global financial networks, and in China/India emerging consumerism.

Again, to simply fling taxpayer money at dysfunctional structures, eg, the union bloated auto industries that are unable to produce cheaper smaller cars because their labour costs are too high...Such a Here's The Money Now Shut Up tactic won't work.

To bad that a person could not throw money on the floor of Parliament. They could actually see that the 'Capital One' pest control on 'bankers coming out every hole' was really disguised politicians.

Jim Flaherty should rattle some change in 'Dion's' pocket and watch him get trampled, just like the shopper in NY when he got trampled to death in 'Walmart'.

The rest of us Canadians want...

Who is this "us" that you claim to speak for Ted? Please name them.

Ted said: "What a great way to end the week"

Translation: Waaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!! Sniff sniff.

Leadership is what Canadians got after they held the last election, Teddy. Leadership in a crisis is realizing that they have to lead by example, and, as Flaherty so eloquently said, "take a haircut".

Leadership, Chairman Ted, is *not* threatening to take voer the government if the government welfare is taken away from political parties. By the way, going to the Governor General to ask to form a ruling coalition on a matter of party financing would be your very definition of playing political games.

You're a hack. Nobody's believing your spin.

Ted: ? Leadership and working together = ADSCAM

Well Ted why don't the oppasition go along with the elected government? From the polls I saw today it looks like "the rest of us Canadians" go along with Harper.

'The rest of us Canadians want leadership, not games.'

So Ted - you now presume to speak for all Canadians outside of SDA ?

"I'm not speakign for Canadians, Kate. I am assessing what I think Canadians are feeling." (sic)
Ted

I'm "feeling" something for you ted.
Right here.

The existing system whereby federal political parties are funded by the taxpayers has to end. Given that the majority of funding for each of the opposition parties comes from the per-vote taxpayer subsidy it has created a perverse incentive for the opposition, not to make parliament work, but to make it fail. After all, under the existing system their biggest money maker is -- elections. As Ghandi pointed out many years ago, any public service organization should be funded strictly by the subscription of its members. Otherwise it becomes a self-serving entity whose major focus becomes fund raising for the perpetuation of its own existence rather than the public service work (if any) to which it is purportedly dedicated.

Ted

were was your "fake outrage" when the opposition was constantly playing gotcha politics for the last two or so years, do you not think the electorate was fed up with constant mud-slinging at the expense of governance. But now the people are out fed up, me thinks the lefties are crying fowl (I never saw a chicken cry in all my farming days) because The Right Honourable Harper is out smarting them. You can't win a fight when you don't know were it's being held:-)))))

I said earlier Watch the canadian markets today

TSX "Down" after 5days of Growth
Canadian Dollar "Down"

Markets are reacting to the News of a Possible Coalition!
Don't believe it Ted, go read it for yourself over at ctv.ca

Okay .. now what happens on the Monday vote?

The Opposition votes to maintain the $1.95 vote subsidy.

The Opposition then votes: (a)against the economic update bill but in insufficient numbers and it passes, or (b)against the bill and defeats the government on a confidence motion.

The Opposition has two options: (1)attempt to form a coalition government acceptable to the GG, or (2)call for a snap election.

Of course the government could ignore the no confidence vote and continue to govern. What would the Opposition do then?

(Can you imagine how violenty devisive an election would become???)

Ted,

"I'm not speakign for Canadians, Kate. I am assessing what I think Canadians are feeling."

I think what your shrink would call it is projection…

If Harper separates the questions but still makes the 30mm funding a confidence vote, the opposition will still have to vote against the rest of the bill to try and pretend they care about more than their own entitlements.

As for Harper, I think he realizes that the GG is as former Quebec separatist whose husband said may kind words about the FLQ - on camera. The idea that she wouldn't actively PUSH a leftard coalition is giving her far too much benefit of a very large doubt.

All I can say, is if the Conservatives loose power, they need a kick in the ass. If they pull one out of the hat and expose the opposition for entitlement thieves that I know they are, well, I'll tip my hat.

Until then, I admittedly worried.

UPDATE - CKNW - The Liberals will propose non-confidence Monday and claim they have a viable alternative government. Wow!

"too much benefit"
Our proudly 1/2 Haitian GG called the separatists "White Ninja's"... or something like that; sorry I'm not "allowed" to say it in our country because my skin colour is wrong.

The Big story of the day that has been the Headline All Day at ctv.ca (Chretian & broadbent) Has disappeared!
What's going on? Talks stalled?, No Deal Unless Jack Is PM?
Their was not Enough Money In it For the Liberals?
Or is it Simply Ctv had to Yank the Story Because they were getting Bombarded on the phones & net comments By Canadians that are Ready to Tar & Feather 3 opposition parties?
*btw todays ctv poll still favoring No to A Lib/NDP coalition.

Just announced
Libs say there is a coalition and gov't will fall Mon. on non-confidence.
CTV

GYM: " do you not think the electorate was fed up with constant mud-slinging at the expense of governance"

Absolutely I do. And Canadians foisted Dion and the Liberals their own green petard, as they did Martin for his interest in playing games instead of governing. And Canadians will do it again to Deceivin' Stephen and Deficit Jim because they obviously don't "get it". They would rather play chess games than govern with the opposition parties and govern for Canadians.

Where's his plan? He has no plan. He has an economic update with nothing but a plan to stick it to unions and the opposition parties, and you think Canadians can't see through that crass politics?

Canadians aren't that dumb, Steve-o. And we don't like arrogant politicians playing crass political games when they should be showing leadership.

with regard to the insistence on adhering to democracy by the Liberals/NDP - they are violating principles of democracy.

First, it is undemocratic to make the taxpayer support the political party; it ought to be up to the individual to donate, if he wishes, rather than being forced to do so via his taxes.

Second, it is undemocratic to defeat a confidence item and supplant it with a 'coalition', one which the people did not elect but which is devised by a cabal of politicians. And, one which has fewer numbers than the govt.

Where is their respect for democracy?

As for their 'solution' to the economy, the left has only one solution. Raise taxes and fling money at the old structures to keep them quiet. But real change to the infrastructure? Never.

That's because the infrastructure is one in which they and theirs get the most benefits, all unionized govt civil service, ...who are upset because Harper's economic package wants them to forgo their huge wage increases down to a more average 1.5% rather than their bloated 4.5%; wants them not to strike..and so on. The civil service and the Liberal/NDP are 'entitled' to their entitlements. And that's all they think about.

I've contributed the max for 2008 but I'll be sending in a post dated cheque for 2009 this weekend.

I think that the $1.95 schmozzle should be pulled completely for now and reintroduced in 18 months time, hopefully when the economy is back running well.

Uh, Ted, now that $30 million party welfare bill is off economic update, will opposition still vote against it? It seems to me they will have to, lest they be exposed as greedy trough pigs they are.

BTW, this minority coalition is pure BS; it will never happen. There is no precedence whatsoever.

Who's playing games again?

The National Post has the Truth

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fullcomment/archive/2008/11/28/kelly-mcparland-long-live-the-junta-liberals-and-ndp-plot-to-seize-power-exhume-trudeau.aspx

The opposition have all agreed to pretend that the battle royal under way in Ottawa is all about the economy, and not about Harper putting a stop to public financing for political parties.

“This is not a stimulus package to kick-start the ailing Canadian economy. It is a failure for Canadians who need immediate and bold action,” NDP leader Jack Layton thundered. “There is nothing in today’s announcement that will create jobs, assist those thrown out of work or bolster consumer confidence.”

Right. And there shouldn’t be. Canada’s economy is a tenth the size of the U.S. A new, free-spending president is crafting a stimulus package in the range of $500-$800 billion, to be delivered immediately after he takes office on Jan. 20. For Ottawa to start throwing billions around without knowing what’s in that package would be irresponsible; $10 billion or $20 billion might be a lot for us, but it could quickly be rendered redundant by whatever Barack Obama unveils. Waiting is the right thing to do. For the opposition to claim otherwise, and defeat the Harper government on that basis, is either dishonest, or inept. I’m betting dishonest on the part of the Liberals, inept on the part of the NDP.

This is about party funding. Harper started the whole thing, softening up the opposition by publicly pleading for their co-operation in saving the economy, than ambushing them with his plan to shut off their access to millions of dollars in taxpayer funding. Now the opposition has joined enthusiastically in the fray. Nothing galvanizes politicians like a threat to their own interests, and while the Liberals might have grumbled a bit and approved Mr. Flaherty’s plans for the economy, they’re willing to throw the country into chaos to preserve their access to the public purse.

The National Post has the Truth

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fullcomment/archive/2008/11/28/kelly-mcparland-long-live-the-junta-liberals-and-ndp-plot-to-seize-power-exhume-trudeau.aspx

The opposition have all agreed to pretend that the battle royal under way in Ottawa is all about the economy, and not about Harper putting a stop to public financing for political parties.

“This is not a stimulus package to kick-start the ailing Canadian economy. It is a failure for Canadians who need immediate and bold action,” NDP leader Jack Layton thundered. “There is nothing in today’s announcement that will create jobs, assist those thrown out of work or bolster consumer confidence.”

Right. And there shouldn’t be. Canada’s economy is a tenth the size of the U.S. A new, free-spending president is crafting a stimulus package in the range of $500-$800 billion, to be delivered immediately after he takes office on Jan. 20. For Ottawa to start throwing billions around without knowing what’s in that package would be irresponsible; $10 billion or $20 billion might be a lot for us, but it could quickly be rendered redundant by whatever Barack Obama unveils. Waiting is the right thing to do. For the opposition to claim otherwise, and defeat the Harper government on that basis, is either dishonest, or inept. I’m betting dishonest on the part of the Liberals, inept on the part of the NDP.

This is about party funding. Harper started the whole thing, softening up the opposition by publicly pleading for their co-operation in saving the economy, than ambushing them with his plan to shut off their access to millions of dollars in taxpayer funding. Now the opposition has joined enthusiastically in the fray. Nothing galvanizes politicians like a threat to their own interests, and while the Liberals might have grumbled a bit and approved Mr. Flaherty’s plans for the economy, they’re willing to throw the country into chaos to preserve their access to the public purse.

I hope Harper announces on Monday that he will let the "Three Stooges" fight over Central and Eastern Canada, and that he will leave the House to lead Western Separation.

This couldn't be led by a better man, and it cannot happen soon enough.

And, the Quebec parasites can leech off someone else!

If the coalition would like to topple the government and run on a platform of higher taxes for everybody (that's what stimulating the economy will lead to), then put it to a vote of the public.

Will it be just one party running against the Conservatives then, with the Bloc allied with the Liberals and NDP.

It's too funny.

The Pigs at the Trough are Uncorking the Champagne Bottles as we apeak.

CBC news announced the Government will fall Monday & Dion will be PM.

*Democracy is Falling & the Bolcheveks are very close to Seizing Power Against the Will of the People.

It's being announced http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Politics/2008/11/28/7569861-cp.html that the liberals will bring down the government and Stephane will become PM. Excellent!

It's not fair that the Liberals aren't the government, so we'll kick and scream until our government is given back to us. And Taliban Jack and Traitor Duceppes will be holding them to account!!!

Stay, Stephane, Stay!!

Bitterly disappointed to have just read that it looks like Harper has backed off.

I really don't see how they can go to the GG and have her have tell them to form a governemnt. That could only be done if the BQ were involved; how could the GG do that?? Rhetorical question of course. She will reveal whether she is really a covert separatist socialist.

Because that's what she would be to accept such a deal.

\Liberals are undemocratic chimpanzees.

Are we seeing a classic case of stupidty?

I never saw Dion as Chavez until today.

It is precisely for this kind of event that the governor general should be a constitutional expert and not a CBC reporter. Lord help us all.

With Kate's permission perhaps it is time to speculate on a name for the coalition.

Perhaps the Traitors, Commies and Clueless party?

I am sure you can do better.

Let me offer another thought:

There is a coalition formed.
The govt loses a confidence vote.
Harper goes to GG.
GG refuses resignation and tells PM to keep governing.

Now what happens?

Perhaps the whole matter of turning everything into Confidence votes is now a dead issue. This could affect the future functioning of our system of government. Remember that a lot of what we do is based upon "tradition" and you won't find these things as part of the written law.

I am afraid that there might be some unintended consquences of the PM's actions here. Nobody can claim that their answer is more valid than anyone elses, as even "scholars" only give learned opinions on matters.

I think the PM is really doing a great job of sticking it to the opposition, but I much prefer a disorganized opposition fighting amongst themselves - than them all to gather together to have a common foe.

I call bull*&%$ on the Liberals and the MSM on this whole idea of a coalition.

There are just too many unanswered questions to accept that this is anything but a carefully crafted rumour designed to see if the Tories frighten easily.

Will Dion lead the Liberals, or Iggy? If it's Dion, they're going to have to drop the leadership convention and go with a leader that has almost no respect with the rank-and-file. If it's Iggy, will the rank-and-file (or Bob Rae) accept a leader that they haven't formally approved? If Iggy intends to run for the leadership, when will they hold the convention? In the middle of the next election?

What would the Bloc's price be for upholding the deal? I can't seriously believe it would end at just getting Dion removed and trotting out an ill-defined "stimulus" package.

The opposition have precisely two days to cobble together a credible plan to form a government, which requires the intense cooperation of three very different parties to do so. If they fail in this task, the GG will be obligated to call an election over any non-confidence motion, an election which the Liberals most certainly do not want.

Unless and until I see Gilles, Jack and Stephan (or Iggy) on a podium together announcing a list of cabinet picks, I'll treat this issue with the skepticism it deserves.

You folks just don't get it.

This is not about Harper and his political games. It is not about a small $30 million subsidy. It is about leadership in troubled times.

The Liberal motion, which has the approval of the NDP and Bloc Quebecois, reads:

"In light of the government's failure to recognize the seriousness of Canada's economic situation and its failure in particular to present any credible plan to stimulate the Canadian economy and to help workers and businesses in hard-pressed sectors such as manufacturing, the automotive industry and forestry, this House has lost confidence in this government and is of the opinion that a viable alternative government can be formed within the present House of Commons."

" combative Finance Minister Jim Flaherty said Friday the government won't back down on a single measure, despite the opposition threats.

"We're staying on track," Flaherty said in Toronto.

"This is the financial plan of the government of Canada. This is a matter of confidence."

But the Tories were clearly scrambling to avert a self-induced political catastrophe. An unprecedented flurry of Conservative media briefings and interviews Friday

In our Canadian democracy, the government must have the confidence of the House. It can't just do whatever the hell it wants. Harper's arrogance and "chessmaster" (cough cough) skills have outdone themselves this time and they will outdo his own government.

So, Deceivin' Stephen and Deficit Jim don't like how Canadian democracy works and want to continue to try and sabotage it? Well they are reeeeally not going to like how it works now.

So some pretty nice $$$ perks for the coalitioners
NDPers apparently with cabinet positions supposedly Finance and the Environment.These new cabinet members I am sure will be up to speed and ruining the country in no time.
There is a reason the NDP have never been in power.

Ted,

Are you so daft you believe that horsesh** or do you think we are?

You and I both know every word you just wrote is a lie. This is first, second, and last about the opposition so scared of losing their pork they'd throw democracy under the bus.

The election was held. Your party lost. Now they're trying to steal power with the help of the separatists. Good luck with that.

So, Ted, with a straight face, you're trying to spin that this non-confidence motion would have been tabled even if there was no vote tax removal?

If so, bullpit. To adapt a well-known adage, I can tell you're lying because you're touching your keyboard.

Ted,

Honestly, do you believe the drivel you serve up daily? If the Conservatives were attempting the opposite, you would be the first to comment here on how they are Nazi-like, that they are fascists, and that they believe '1984' to be an instructional manual, not just a novel.

You're so disingenuous -- the opposition should be proposing alternatives, not attempting a coup of a duly elected PM. Stephane Dion as the leader, a man who lost 20+ seats in the recent election?

I herewith determine to call Ted (since he likes to call PM Harper "Deceivin Stephen) Tinpot Ted, in light of his support for the overthrow of a duly-elected government and in its place a coalition, with separatists as the cement that holds it together.

How about it guys? Tinpot Ted!!

Fife just stated with a Grimace "Not Sure How This is Going to Sit with Canadians"
He knows how it is going to sit! there will be an Uprising that will shake this land.
He (fife) is also saying NDP Enviroment Minister & Finance is apparently the deal trying to be Brokered.

The PM has just Exposed these Opposition Parties for What they are "Greedy Pigs At The Trough" all under the Guise of Standing for the People.

Too bad too there are some real honest & caring members of the Liberal Party still That iam really surprised they will tolerate a coalition with the Socialist/Communist Or maybe they wont and any luck they will cross the floor to stop this in its track by creating a Majority.

Actually, Richard, I don't think Harper is a fascist or Nazi-like and admonish Liberals who call him that. I got fed up with Martin's empty "Canadian values" rhetoric back then too.

I do think though he is a petty partisan with no plan and no clue in dangerous economic times who will do whatever it takes to get and keep power, including completely ignoring the fundamentals of Canadian Parliamentary democracy.

As he has shown us time and time again.

Tinpot Ted it is !!

Unelected Liberals with socialists and traitors in a coalition government. Excellent video for the next election. Not to mention the common cause that brought them together - tax theft.

Ted enjoys his smarty pants little nickname for Harper.

On the other hand, 'Ted the Liar' may not rhyme, but it's true.

I just made a contribution to the Conservative Party and took out a 1 year membership.

I encourage all SANE - NOT TINPOT - believers of fiscal conservatism to heed the call and open your wallet.

BTW Tim - I guess Germany must be idiots too since their gov't refuses to do the VERY THING that got us into this trouble to begin with - which was SPENDING MORE THAN WHAT WE HAVE.

Ted,

" including completely ignoring the fundamentals of Canadian Parliamentary democracy."

So, prior to 2003 we were not a parliamentary democracy then?

Sad really. Gripping so tightly to your "entitlements" that you believe, what exactly? Without a fully subsidized liberal party democracy dies?

I'm curious, with all the talk of the libs and ndp'ers and bloc to be destroyed, do you all want'one' party in this country? The conservatives, and no others? Just one party's decisions/plans/ideas? Does that seem like Democracy? Or a dictatorship .... ahh, I see what you all want. Sure sounds like it anyways.

Anyone notice what the markets did this week?
gained every day.

A Question:

Is it possible, that the GG would rule that she will neither dissolve Parliament, nor establish a coalition Government, but would force the parliamentarians to establish a workable/agreeable arrangement, or, is she constitutionally bound to either dissolve or establish a coalition Government?

There is a potential for a constitutional crisis here. Suppose the Liberals do introduce a no-confidence motion on Monday and win it. Harper goes to the GG and informs her he has lost the confidence of Parliament, and recommends that she dissolve the House and call new elections. Harper does not resign as Prime Minister by doing this.

The GG is not supposed to act contrary to the advice of the Prime Minister. She would actually have to FIRE Harper and invite Dion to form a government to continue this sitting of Parliament. I don't know the political consequences after this - legally the Conservatives would have no recourse - but the backlash from those who do not support the Liberals could be phenomenal.

Hey did you see the latest - Flaherty states that political funding NOT part of economic package to be voted on Monday.

ROFLMAO - can't wait for the coalition - headed up by the separatist party - to vote against this one!!!!!!!!

Cretien- ties to Power Corp.
Dion- ties to Power Corp.
Rae- ties to Power corp.

Power corp. the only place to get enough money to pay off Dion's debts legally.

ergo, Rae gets the leadership job.

Iggy and six fellow travelers cross the floor, majority.

First, it is undemocratic to make the taxpayer support the political party; it ought to be up to the individual to donate, if he wishes, rather than being forced to do so via his taxes.

Yet it is democratic to make the taxpayer support freeloading, conservative voting farmers. Should it not be up to the individual to donate, if he or she wishes, rather than be forced to via his taxes??
My, my, my, ET. And you're in academia, are you not? How sad.

Lee: i made a comment on this earlier in the day about growth all week

However: The TSX is down today & also the Dollar is down, All because of the Threat to Over-Throw the Government and form a Coalition of the Socialist Left & Separtist BQ.

Didn't Canadians just soundly reject Stephane Dion in a $300 Million election? And now Monsieur Chretien is back behind the scenes. Are we about to witness our own version of a "Coup d'etat"? Hey, if you can't get elected by the people, just seize power anyway you can! (That'll make for a great Liberal Party fundraising slogan!)

And yet ... through it all, their friends in the liberal media are mostly only condemning the Conservatives through all of this. If it so transpires. watch the Sheeple of Canuckistan stand by and say not a thing. :-(

Ummm, does Harper fill the Senate appointments this weekend, just in case? Or does Dion fill them as soon as he's in office? And if the latter, does the NDP get 33% of those seats? I wonder how that will work?

Only in Canada, a government elected with ten seats short of Majority with a plot being cobbled up in various quarters to have them taken down by a jealous pack of rogues who are missing their entitlements.

Dion and Layton shacking up with Duceppes whoring when it's of interest to Quebec. Beautiful stuff.

If a non confidence motion passes, it's the PM who goes to the governor general to say the government has lost the confidence of the house and then asks the GG to dissolve parliament and call an election. The GG can ask the opposition if they can form a government, but seeing that the combined Lib/NDP is 114 seats versus the Conservatives 142 seats this will not happen. So without the Bloq being a formal member of said coalition there would be an election.

If this is truly about the 'stimulus package', what is it that the coalition plans to do? All I have heard from them the Conservatives aren't doing enough....but aren't saying what their plans are? Is it a $100 billion bailout to failing industries and huge unions? Is it cross the board (including high income) tax cuts? Please coalition, before you dare to bring down an elected government, give us the details and let the people decide...oh wait, that was what the election last month was for!!

Now would be the time for 12 blue Liberals to cross the floor, claiming they could never let separatists control the federal government.

Any one want to start a pool?

Top of my list:
1 Kieth Martin - just because
2 Irwin Cotler - a Canada first guy
3 Sukh Dhaliwal - surrounded by a sea of blue in Vancouver suburbs
4 Larry Bagnell - Yukon
5 Anthony Rota - Northern Ontario
6 Marc Garneau - Montreal Federalist
7 Francis Scarpaleggia - Montreal Federalist
8 Massimo Pacetti - Montreal Federalist
9 Scott Andrews - Newfoundland newbie, knows he will lose the next election as a Liberal
10 Scott Simms - Newfoundland MP going for the cabinet post
11 Lawrence MacAulay - PEI senses a change in the political winds on the island
12 Rodger Cuzner - Nova Scotia

This seems like the weekend that anything can happen....

Ted: "I'm not speakign for Canadians, Kate. I am assessing what I think Canadians are feeling. And Canadians want leadership, they don't want political games."

What a pile of crap, and so like a Liberal. "I'm assessing what I THINK [my emphasis] Canadians are feeling." So presumptuous, not based in reality. Librano$ put words in Canadians' mouths, thoughts in their heads and, funny thing, what Canadians apparently think is exactly what the Librano$ think. Viscious circle.

"Canadians want leadership, not political games"?

Do tell, Ted. We've had over 30 years of Librano political games and THAT'S what Canadians are heartily sick and tired of. Canadians are also fed up with the political games of their lapdogs in the MSM and the MSM's, especially the CBC's, propaganda for the Liberals (all Liberal, all the time).

OFF THE WIRES: Harper clinging to power for another week. Does what he said was anti-democratic three years ago and cancels/postpones Liberals opposition day.

So,if successful the Liberal lead coalition would be headed by either:
Dion the least popular LPC leader.... ever
Iggy the untested academic from the US
Rae the Ontario premier that messed up Ontario economy during a recession
or
Layton the socialist

None of them have any legitimate claim to govern. Dion was soundly rejected by voters and other two LPCers do not even have the approval of their own party let alone Canadian voters. Layton and the NDP are no more than a federal fringe party. Then add that the CPC just won the election less than 2 months ago. If the GG agrees to such a coalition then the GG office also needs to be reformed.

Is this the same Layton that was running to be PM recently? - the guy that came in, NOT quite PM, not the first looser, nor the second looser, but who actually came in fourth? The same one?

Wow, he came in last, and still wants to be part of the leadership of the country. One way or another!

Again, WOW.

CRB

Hmm... lets see: Le petit gars from Shawinigan introduces a political party funding methodology specifically designed to torpedo Paul Martins chances of challenging his record as a Liberal leader.... then when PMSH contemplates cancelling this arrangement, the zombie arises from the dead to arrange a coalition of trough snufflers....

Trudeau: not dead enough.
Chretien: not prosecuted enough...

So PMSH has stalled the opposition day to Dec 8th..Plenty of time for the Coalition of the Left to clearly define the terms and cost of their economic stimulus plan (as if they had a plan).

Besides the lack of plan, the next week should be fun to watch given the dynamics of this polygamous marriage made in piggery.

The three (or four) stooges fighting for the helm of the LPC...Wacko Jacko demanding Finance and or Industry and the ever charming Gilles Duceppe demanding concessions for Quebec at the expense of the rest of the country.

Add to that the optics of tired hacks like Cretien and Broadbent engineering a palace coup over the issue of taxpayer dollars for political parties and I can't see this thing holding together.

You might as well try to herd feral tom cats than keep this cutthroat collection of political vermin running the same direction.

This should be freakin awesome!

Syncro

Interesting historical factoid: Winston Churchill was never elected Prime Minister until after the war.

The present idiotic rantings and ravings of the selfish demented morons in the NDP and the Crooked Liberal party is a perfect example of why voters should not be forced to subsidize any political party.

And any GG that would allow a coalition govt to take over just weeks after a $300 million election was held could kiss any respect for that position to be shot as well.
She better realize that the GG position would be ABOLISHED as quickly as possible, should she be that stupid.

Canadians did not vote for the creep in a creeps clothing, or the video professor to run the country.

manny, you aren't very knowledgeable or logical.

First, to have the taxpayer give (got that, give?) money to a political party without their permission is undemocratic. The reason is because a political party is not part of the economy but is a political perspective. No taxpayer should support a political perspective without their permission.

Second, farmers - and my goodness, you do hate farmers, don't you. I wonder why. But, farmers - can justifiably be subsidized by the taxpayer because they are an integral part of the economic infrastructure of any nation. I know that you live on pure air, manny, but you are, heh, unique.

The subsidies to farmers are not 'gifts'; they ae not 'donations' but low cost loans, reduction or waiver of various taxes, a low cost loan of a percentage of the cost of new equipment, trade agreements, reduction in transfer, capital gains taxes and so on, etc. What do you have against this?

This strengthens this sector of the economy to enable it to compete against the farm produce from other countries - which might be much cheaper in costs, due to low land costs, labour, and their own govt subsidies.

With your illogical perspective, you'll next be declaring that govts shouldn't fund the building of roads, or hospitals, or schools; it should all be done by private donation.

So, your attempt, manny, to set up a comparison between political parties and farmers is an invalid analogy. The first is a political association and not part of the infrastructure of a nation; the second is an economic system, not an association, and an integral party of an economy. So, manny - Try again. This time, use facts. And logic.

If I'm Harper, I meet with the lieberal's and Jacko. I give them there one time stimulus package and then I add back the cutting off of the $1.95. Then if they vote it down you know their true intentions and whip them in an election. If they pass it you have a one time expense to cut them off at the knees by bankrupting them.

A farmer once told me in elections its cheaper to keep a fat pig fat rather than fatten up a skinny pig. Might be some truth to that.

The arogance of these people should not be surprising. The Gliberals and Kneedeepers, when another election is called, will be punished by the voters.

Harry

"OFF THE WIRES: Harper clinging to power for another week. Does what he said was anti-democratic three years ago and cancels/postpones Liberals opposition day."

Well, Ted, it's better than using a baseball bat to knock some sense into them. But then, maybe a baseball bat is the only thing that'll work with these brainless, anti-democratic, avaricious swine.

A coalition? With who as leader? None of them were elected. They do not have a mandate from the voters. They do not have a plan.

And they can only form their coalition with a treasonous party whose sole reason for being is to destroy Canada.

How well do you think that'll go over, Ted?

And no, you don't speak for Canadians. Check the opinion polls. They're certainly more accurate on this issue than your singularly retarded opinion.

The Gormley link leads to news 650 homepage. Can you find the specific link?

"To the Liberal/NDP supporters whining that the CPC is exploiting the opposition's financial vulnerability to play "partisan games", I offer this advice - get out your checkbooks and shut the hell up."

AMEN!
Get your damn hands out of MY pockets!
I do NOT want to see one red cent of mine go to the lieberals or the DPs or the traitors from Quebec or to pay for a cross-country junket on a private train for that whining, shrieking, disgusting slob lizzie may!

Is Canada going to turn to the NDP at this time to implement their ideas and plans for the economy?
Is the business community going to buy into this hare brained plan?
Do Canadians want Stephane Dion as Prime Minister?
Liberals themselves have already told Canadians they don't want Dion as Prime Minister - Canadians certainly don't want a carbon tax.
Are we going to give the Bloc Quebecois a golden oppportunity to really blackmail Canadians?
Where is the disconnect in all this?

How many Liberal MPs won their seat by less than 2.5% of the popular vote? How many of those do you think will want to be seen partnering up with Socialists and Separatists in an effort to preserve their party's ill gotten entitlements at a time of worldwide economic crisis?

Being that the Conservatives only need 22 opposition MPs to abstain from the vote, or 11 opposition MPs to vote for the fiscal update (perhaps at the expense of becoming an independent MP or crossing the floor) what is the likelihood that the Conservatives will be defeated?

Realistically, even the Bloc has to be a little skeptical about joining a coalition with the Liberals and NDP ... It is very easy to be a critic of the government and get a lot of support from the people, but when you're facing a lot of tough decisions yourself you will (likely) make different choices which are easily attacked. Would you really want to have to answer for the decisions made by the Liberal's or NDP?

It will be interesting to see what happens ... I personally would keep my eye on "experienced" Liberal and Bloc members who will (probably) not be seeking re-election and are (relatively-speaking) more conservative (or at least "Anti-NDP"). We could be facing a Parliament where the balance of power is held by individuals rather than parties in the very near future.

I just recieved this letter from Scott Brison.The liberals are shameless.Harper is the 'butcher of democracy' yet trying to gain control of the gov't through the back door is quite alright with Scotty.Maybe Scotty is sick to his stomach because of something else,think Rod Stewart.

The Harper Way

I asked for this chance to write to our Party’s key supporters – because late yesterday, Stephen Harper acted so disreputably as to make any decent person feel sick to the stomach. We need your help to raise the money to stop this little man. In the face of the worst economic problems since the Great Depression, Harper’s very first measure in the new Parliament is legislation to destroy the Liberal Party financially.

We must put money in the bank to deal with Harper’s disingenuous operations.

Around the world, governments and opposition parties are rallying together to face the economic crisis. Barack Obama and George Bush can work together, but that’s not the Harper way.

Harper vowed there would be no deficit on his watch – never. And now, he has brought Canada a huge deficit. Harper said there would be no recession. And now, we have entered the worst recession in living memory. Harper is either an economic fool or a morally deficient cynic, but either way, thousands of Canadians are losing their jobs every day, home prices are falling, retirement savings are evaporating and Christmas is looking so sad for many Canadians.

Rather than acting forcefully on the economic crisis, Harper prefers to move to ensure his fundraising advantage from his core of extreme right wing contributors – and to hell with democracy.

We need to demonstrate that the Liberal Party can and will compete financially. We need donations now to stop Stephen Harper and his desire to be the butcher of democracy.

Sincerely,

Scott Brison
Finance Critic
Liberal Party of Canada

Authorized by the Federal Liberal Agency of Canada, registered agent for the Liberal Party of Canada


To unsubscribe to these emails, click here.

Manny - Criticize farmers if you want to - Just don't do it with your mouth full

Hey, PMSH postpones opposition day to Eid al-Adha.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eid_al-Adha

So I wonder which sons will be sacrificed, I mean sheep slaughtered, in remembrance of Abraham's obedience to God, by readying the sacrifice of Isaac or Ishmael.

What a sporting touch for the season of peace and good will.

Cheers

Hans-Christian Georg Rupprecht, Commander in Chief

Frankenstein Battalion
2nd Squadron: Ulanen-(Lancers) Regiment Großherzog Friedrich von Baden(Rheinisches) Nr.7(Saarbrucken)
Knecht Rupprecht Division
Hans Corps
1st Saint Nicolaas Army
Army Group “True North”

Just checked out the CBC poll and found this comment:

"If 30M dollars is going to avert an economic crisis the conservatives can stop fighting elections canada on adscam and just refund the country the millions they took from public coffers there."

Unbelievable.
If that person voted in the last election we are in trouble.

That was truly pathetic, even for you ET. A little early for imbibing, no. Oh well, it's happy hour somewhere.
Let me get this straight. You are in favor of subsidizing anything that is "part of the economic infrastructure of any nation."
My, what a quaint exercise in conservative logic.

Manny - Criticize farmers if you want to - Just don't do it with your mouth full

If food was free, farmer, I might agree will you. Barring that, have you no shame, living off of the avails of other peoples' hard work?

Gotta love it....Harper just delivered a one..two..three and then pulled the biggest rug out from under the biggest bunch of hypocrites I have ever seen. I AM in AWE.

Lets see,do I hear this right.Stop govt funding of political parties is an attack on democracy.Which other countries fund political parties with govt funding would be the next question.DOes any other democracy do it?All communist countries do it I know that.Whats the next step in govt funded political parties?The complete elimination of private funding with the first step being companys and other influential organizations.O,pardon me,thats been done.I heard this morning on a talk show where someone thought that people funding wasnt fair so the next step is eliminate it.Its odd what some call progressive democratic legislation.

From the "Bourquester"

Would you support a Lib Ndp Bloc coalition government ?
Yes (996) 30%
No (2293) 69%
Not sure (47) 1%

The coalition idea is going over like a lead balloon or should I say lead Zeppelin.

"Oh the humanity!"

Cheers

Hans-Christian Georg Rupprecht, Commander in Chief

Frankenstein Battalion
2nd Squadron: Ulanen-(Lancers) Regiment Großherzog Friedrich von Baden(Rheinisches) Nr.7(Saarbrucken)
Knecht Rupprecht Division
Hans Corps
1st Saint Nicolaas Army
Army Group “True North”

Prime Minister Dion ? ......Quick get the important action alert to Cherniak !

All this talk of left coalition is fun political sport, it isn't going to happen. Think about it:

- when in Canadian history has there been a coalition government that in itself was a minority government?

- is Duceppe going to go along with this, IOW, sign an agreement for sharing power, without receiving bigtime favours in return, such as cabinet positions and largesse for Quebec?

- why would GG get involved in this? Answer: she wouldn't. She will quietly seek advice that she will trigger a constitutional and legal crisis if she did.

- anything remotely close to this has resulted in perpetrators getting creamed in next election, which happened almost immediately.

- isn't it more likely some members will vote against their party, or simply stay home and not vote. Isn't is more likely there will be floor crossings over this, like Keith Martin for instance?

- if this actually happened, isn't the overwhelming likelihood GG will grant PM's request to dissolve parliament and trigger election, with Grits broke, Dippers having nonsensical leader the Bloc able to gain nothing, but lose plenty?

- straw polls overwhelmingly show Canadians will not be happy with this and will punish the opposition in inevitable election that would result almost immediately or before end of 09.

- where is the crisis that demands this action? In 1922 GG refused request of PM to dissolve parliamen? There was a scandal at the time, and Mackenzie King returned to power soon after, when minority collapsed?

- will opposition risk election on this basis? IMO, no way, unless they are sure they can be sure of forming government (highly unlikely) and have opportunity to vote themselves necessary funding to fight election soon afterward?

- what kind of "plan" can LPC/NDP cobble together that will give GG confidence they can govern, when she knows they need Bloc, when she knows combined coalition party seats less than Tories?

Sorry, folks, anybody who believes coalition will happen is doing really bad drugs.

I have a question for history buffs. Has there ever been a minority coalition, where their combined seats are less than rebuffed government?

Like I said, nice political theatre, but that's about all. Libs and Dippers have smell of power in their nostrils, but will come crashing back to reality very soon, when they realize the best they can do is trigger another election, where, IMO they will get pummelled by the voters.

What would the socialist / communist Liberal/ / ND/ Blockhead coalition look like?

PM - Green shift Dion, Finance Minister - closet communist Bob Rae, Foreign Affairs Minister - Taliban Jack Layton, Defense Minister - Gilles Duceppe just a few of the biggies.

And on the basis a two year pact without holding another election?

That would be the end of Canada as it exists at present.
I would move to Alberta to join the sepaaration.

The media in Canada are lovin it!

Fresh off an election with the pink slips have already been sent and CTV were all cackles and giggles over the "drama" that's about to occur. PM Harper, ever gracious, than goes and gives the media a full week of relevance once again by delaying opposition days until when the GG is back in the county.

I agree with other posters here about possibility of getting enough votes from opposition, especially libs, maybe even a floor crossing. I don't think Ignatief is too happy about Prime Minister Dion. How's that suppose to work? LOL

I would love for the CPC to come out and say they will decline their share of the $1.95 per vote to do their part. I would send them a couple hun for sure on that, especially since they said they will move on eliminating section 13. That would be real conservatism I could get behind.

Oh Ted. I guess you missed the socialist ringmaster Rae the day this was announced blow a gasket over the funding issue. No, he didn't mention a socialist stimulus package. Yes, he cried about democracy, political parties and funding. The left want power. Period. All the spin and feigned anger of a stimulus package will never hide that.

Canada is going to have to ride the wave created when America falls deeper to govt intervention and socialism and releases their plan.

Anyhow..unlike Libs...I am going to whip out my sustaining donor card and fire of some funds to the CPC

manny,you are either a dolt or cant read. I have told you before,BUY A FARM!Get in on the gravy train,live the good life on easy street.Just remember to keep your bankers phone number on speed dial and your wife with a good enough job to buy groceries.

no, manny. In logic, you have to learn the different between ALL and SOME. That's an important part of predicate logic.

So, when I say that I understand why and how farmers are subsidized, (and you don't) that doesn't mean that ALL (anything) systems that are part of the economic structure ought to be subsidized. Get to work, manny; learn the difference between All and Some. And learn about different levels of the economy.

Your statement about 'living off the avails' of other people's hard work also doesn't make sense. All products used by man are created by human work; even the gathering of apples. So, are you seriously implying that one ought not to use the results of work? Why not?

You are one of the most illogical people I've ever met; you toss out unfocused random opinions without evidence, without logic - and toss in a few personal insults as colour. Why?

bluetech - yes, there's all kinds, including people who think that Adscam was carried out by the Conservatives rather than the Liberals. And there are still people who claim that Big Corporations fund the Conservatives, ignoring that such was the hallmark of the Liberals until Chretien stopped it in his agenda of destroying the Liberal post-Chretian era.

Manny - You have no clue. Farmers have been producing food for you for years either at or below the cost of production. Farmers typicly receive about 15 % of the price you pay for food. In Canada you have access to the cheapest food supply anywhere in the world. Don't need to eat Manny? Then let your farmers go down the drain. Turn your food supply over to someone off shore. China perhaps.

ET, maybe you should sleep it off.

Spike 1, oldfarmer- you can't make it as a ploughjockey/leech...go get a real job. I hear PCS is hiring.

manny,
So what kind of "stimulus" package do you propose and/or support?
It wouldn't be some kind of *gasp* "subsidy" for a particular business sector would it?

Manny has used up all his logic. He's into the personal attack mode now

ET, really, sleep it off, then tomorrow reread the inane drivel you have been posting, see if it passes the smell test of even your rather twisted sense of "logic" and call me in the morning.

I recieved a letter this morning at 10:30 from Scott Brison,liberal finance critic,explaining that the 'butcher of democracy'(guess who)is trying to ruin the liberal party financially. He also mentions the economic crisis,but clearly the libs are worried about their gravy train being derailed.He goes on to say that if this happens the conservatives will survive because of their'extreme right wing' backers, That is me and you,no not you Ted,or Manny. So what they are saying on the news and what they are sending out to their loyal supporters don't exactly jive. I tried to post the letter in it's glorious entirety but it got caught up in some filter.

Come on Manny........Not gonna play any more? Or did you go and have supper?

"Trudeau: not dead enough.
Chretien: not prosecuted enough..."

Dion: not smart enough
Iggy: not Canadian enough
Rae: not socialist enough

As an American, I'm proud to support the wine industry in Canada.

oh, what a weekend for some! they'll get to sit around and decide who should be p.m. (i have to get my tires changed and go for groceries.) easier than winning an election, i suppose

It's so entertaining to see Harper crapping in his pants and moaning about the opposition planning a coup d’etat. Hahaha. He forgets that he has a MINORITY and can only govern with the support of the opposition. Coming soon: Stephen Harper...not a leader.

Manny's on the wrong thread. He thinks the discussion here is about Farmers.

Let twits sit and rot. Don't enter into discourse with them.

The old saw comes to mind, 'Argue with an idiot and they'll pull you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

Manny, as usual with the inept, grazing type, is an irrelevant blob.

No irwin, the subject is, in part, the value of expending taxpayer dollars, which of course leads one to the base conservative hypocrisy of supporting subsidies they like and screaming bloody murder decrying those they don't all the while professing a conservative free market "principle" of not supporting subsidies at all.

Oh, and now look what crawled out from under a rock. The butcher of Siberia. The world's worst serial rapist.

Or is he just a fan?

Manny, (I)beria and Ted.

You should start a comedy show. For prison inmates.

April 18th 2005
On Monday, Valeri said he would cancel a Conservative opposition day motion because setting opposition days is the responsibility of the government, not the opposition parties.
That provoked outrage from Conservative Leader Stephen Harper who met with reporters Monday evening on Parliament Hill to denounce Valeri and the Liberal government.
"I think they are just signing their own death warrant," Harper said. "This is the kind of behaviour a government does when it is scared to death of the electorate.
"It is not up to the government in our system to decide whether an opposition motion is order or not. It's up to the Clerk and the Speaker. Our motion was in order. We don't have to get the approval of the government to express dissent.
"When a government starts trying to cancel dissent or avoid assent is frankly when it's rapidly losing its moral authority to govern."

About an hour ago:
Prime Minister Stephen Harper has delayed for a week a confidence motion vote that could bring down his government.

April 18th 2005
On Monday, Valeri said he would cancel a Conservative opposition day motion because setting opposition days is the responsibility of the government, not the opposition parties.
That provoked outrage from Conservative Leader Stephen Harper who met with reporters Monday evening on Parliament Hill to denounce Valeri and the Liberal government.
"I think they are just signing their own death warrant," Harper said. "This is the kind of behaviour a government does when it is scared to death of the electorate.
"It is not up to the government in our system to decide whether an opposition motion is order or not. It's up to the Clerk and the Speaker. Our motion was in order. We don't have to get the approval of the government to express dissent.
"When a government starts trying to cancel dissent or avoid assent is frankly when it's rapidly losing its moral authority to govern."

About an hour ago:
Prime Minister Stephen Harper has delayed for a week a confidence motion vote that could bring down his government.

So, will the BQ get the Heritage Ministry portfolio?

I can't wait to hear the whines of Kate McMillian et al. if this happens. I expect something that embodies 'this is undemocratic' aka:

"This is not fair!!!"

Oh sweet poetic justice.

April 18th 2005
On Monday, Valeri said he would cancel a Conservative opposition day motion because setting opposition days is the responsibility of the government, not the opposition parties.
That provoked outrage from Conservative Leader Stephen Harper who met with reporters Monday evening on Parliament Hill to denounce Valeri and the Liberal government.
"I think they are just signing their own death warrant," Harper said. "This is the kind of behaviour a government does when it is scared to death of the electorate.
"It is not up to the government in our system to decide whether an opposition motion is order or not. It's up to the Clerk and the Speaker. Our motion was in order. We don't have to get the approval of the government to express dissent.
"When a government starts trying to cancel dissent or avoid assent is frankly when it's rapidly losing its moral authority to govern."

November 28, 2008, about 5:45pm
Prime Minister Stephen Harper has delayed for a week a confidence motion vote that could bring down his government.

And Crouton said he'd cancel the GST.

Comedy Central might just have a slot, Ted. I understand they're now narrowcasting in prisons.

You should work out a deal with Manny and Iberia.

Ted - you stole that from Calgary Grit. Isn't that plagiarism?

CTV Newsnet has just told Canadians, that as recent as September on Mike Duffy Live, Stephane Dion told Canadians emphatically, that the Liberals "could not have a co-alition with the NDP - a party that would be damaging to the economy period"
Are the self-serving Liberals telling Canadians now, that they aren't acting in their own self interests and lust for power, because obviously they know and have admitted ,a co-alition with the NDP would be damaging to the economy.
If AdScam didn't give reason for Canadians to question the honesty and integrity of the Liberals, the shenanigans of the last few days has alerted Canadians to the devious ways of the Liberal party. The Liberals would now ask Canadians and business in this country to embrace NDP policies, in these challenging economic times, and these same Liberals, who for years were warning us that the Bloc was a grave danger to this country and our values, now give the Bloc the balance of power and effective control of parliament.

Something not talked about from the fiscal outlook report that no doubt has all of the professional talking heads from the polling companies seething mad about THEIR entitlements - Flaherty said that there will be strict cutbacks on government polling, focus groups and outside consultants.
Did anyone happen to see Allen Gregg on CBC's At Issue panel last night????? He was nearly foaming at the mouth about , ummmm, the lack of stimulus package.

The media have these usual bozos all lined up to lambast the conservatives over the , um, lack of stiumulus package without even once exploring the fact that it is THEIR entitlements these professional "consultants" are really upset about.

Special interest groups that rule our country indeed.

Quotes then and now: Harper, Flaherty
Canwest News Service
Published: Wednesday, November 26, 2008

Then and now quotes comparing what Prime Minister Stephen Harper and Finance Minister Jim Flaherty said during and after the campaign for the Oct. 14 election about recession and a deficit.

"This country will not go into recession next year and will lead the G7 countries."
- Prime Minister Stephen Harper (Oct. 10)

"If you don't want a carbon tax and tax increases and a deficit and recession, the only way to ensure that is the case is to vote for the Conservative party."
- Prime Minister Stephen Harper (Oct. 12)

"We may well be in a technical recession."
- Finance Minister Jim Flaherty (Nov. 23)

"The most recent private-sector forecasts suggest the strong possibility of a technical recession at the end of this year and beginning of next."
- Prime Minister Stephen Harper (Nov. 23)

"I know economists will say well, we could run a small deficit but the problem is that once you cross that line as we see in the United States, nothing stops deficits from getting larger and larger and spiralling out of control."
- Prime Minister Stephen Harper (Oct. 6)

"We will not run a deficit."
- Finance Minister Jim Flaherty (Oct. 9)

"If we do short-term deficit spending as a deliberate policy we will have to be able to demonstrate to Canadians that those deficits will genuinely be short term."
- Prime Minister Stephen Harper (Nov. 15)

"The government of Canada today is not planning a deficit. But if the government of Canada decides . . . that we do have to engage in fiscal stimulus, that government spending is essential not just to shore up economic activity but investment markets, that would be the occasion we would go into what would be called a cyclic or a short-term deficit."
- Prime Minister Stephen Harper (Nov. 23)

Stephen Harper...not a leader!

This attempt to wrest power from the elected Conservatives' PM Harper and hand it to Dion, a leader the country obviously DOES NOT WANT, is despicable. It's only two months since we voted and already the opposition AND MEDIA are playing partisan games.

The day after Harper's gov't was re-elected with a bigger mandate CTV asked at what point will Harper step down?

It's pretty clear that certain media reps. think they control the nation.

Do you all notice how the trolls won't touch the Adscam money issue with a barge-pole?

The lying, hypocritical, power-hungry thieves stole Canadian taxpayer's money, our money, and have made no effort to return a penny of it - now that is da izzy money.

Party of Thieves. Period. Wish it make it izzy on us and just evaporate.

I'm appalled that Ed Broadbent would be a part of this power grab. I thought so much more highly of him than that.

I think manny must have got a butt full of rocksalt for raiding some farmers carrot patch.
No other explanation for his irrational hate of farmers. Food is suppose to be free?

Entitled to your entitlements or what?

I think manny must have got a butt full of rocksalt for raiding some farmers carrot patch.
No other explanation for his irrational hate of farmers. Food is suppose to be free?

Entitled to your entitlements or what?

Iberia, watch and read the news. Events change on a daily basis, making adjustments necessary.

Read financial sites! Canada is held in very high esteem by investors around the world. We're NUMBER ONE.

Harpers sent the chicken hawks into the chicken coop on this one. The sneaky SOB. One can only admire his mastery at subjecting his political foes to ridicule, by their own pomposity with greed leaden hands out stretched. What a guy. He's three moves ahead of em all. I get cranky sometimes at him, or disagree with some policies. That’s normal considering I am a small l libertarian. I admire not only his cunning but real world based rationality. Of course I share the same loathing of Socialism. He ain’t perfect, but a Giant among the regular political Ottawa Pigmy. But know one can say this personage hasn’t the brains of ten fox's. This whole event is like a free Christmas. Trimmins added & all lit up pretty.
The liberals fear him , more than the Egyptians Moses.

There must be an editorial cartoon showing up somewhere with Harper leaning back watching "Curly, Larry, and Moe" doing their best routine.

Don't keep it to yourself (as if anyone would).

30 mill is a buck a person. Simplest math ever.
I pledge to give a donation to the Conservatives of 10000% on my own free volition, just as long as they simply sit back, relax, and let this all play out to the logical conclusion of leftist political suicide...

RANT WARNING

Party of Thieves. Yes, so true. Party of Power Whores too. To the point that they will put the seperatists in government!!! The Bloc has now accepted that Dijon will be PM; but how will they themselves be able to swear an oath of allegience to the Queen to get their cabinet position? Mind you, a French Proptestant king fameously said: "The throne of France is worth a mass".

Mind you again, how can the GG, the Queen's representative, possibly accept separatists into Her government?

And what will be the reaction in the West to this effective coup-d'etat?

And the Liberals are doing all this whoring simply so they can again stuff Canadian tax money into their pockets. Party of Thieves and Whores indeed.

I say, go for it! But you need an election on this plan for legitimacy. And you will stuff it, Dijon, as you have stuffed everything.

I see Conservative majority coming :-)

Food is suppose to be free?

No, but education is, orvict. Too bad the system failed you in reading comprehension. Or maybe you just never got that far.

Just to make sure I'm awake, leftists across Canada are actually forming a coalition to topple Harper based on the notion that taxpayers MUST fund the Bloc and failing industries IMMIDIATELY???

Pantload Stevo can do no wrong. All is for the best in this best of all Conservative worlds.

manny

leason in logic

industry lives of the "production" of it's employees

you live of the production of a farmers hard work

industry dies, and a new one will arise

if the farmer dies, so will you, but I won't

guess why!!!

Here is Dion and his statement about NDP being bad for the economy and he would not have a co-alition with them.
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=4o0IEq_1kto

guess why!!! GYM

Uh...cause you're an idiot?

ps Is there nothing Harpo can't do???

Cascadian: "With Kate's permission perhaps it is time to speculate on a name for the coalition."

How about Dion, Layton, Duceppe - the axis of banal?

So who is lurking in the shadows of this non-military coup d'e-tat---Chretian & Broadbent. Dona J.

Dion will have the liberals over a barrel, they will have to pay off his leadership debts for him now to get rid of him.

"With Kate's permission perhaps it is time to speculate on a name for the coalition."

How about "Dippers Full of Sh*t From Hell"

So, what does this mean, if anything?

Earlier today, I wrote a letter to my NDP MP (@parl.gc.ca) to say no to a coalition government with my reasons why.

When I clicked on my SENT file to re-read the letter a few minutes ago, this is the message I got, a message I have NEVER got when I've clicked on a SENT e-mail:

Internet Explorer cannot display the webpage

Most likely causes:
You are not connected to the Internet.
The website is encountering problems.
There might be a typing error in the address.

OKAY. Does this mean there's something wrong at this MPs site? Could it mean this MP has shut down the receipt of incoming e-mails? I'm a computer Luddite, so I have no idea, but as I said before, I've never had this response when I've clicked SENT to re-read an e-mail.

Can anyone enlighten me? Is the Opposition playing even more games with our participatory democracy, i.e., not allowing us to register our opinions?

Sadly, I wouldn't put it past them.

If there's anything that can make the absurd coalition even more hilarious, it's the idea of broadbent and chretien leaving their mausoleums to "broker" the deal. In other words, the leaders of these parties aren't trusted to do it themselves, grandaddy has to be called in to call the shots.

"I'm ENTITLED to my ENTITLEMENTS.."

Dingwall.. I could kiss you!
LOL!

I looked into my crystal ball and saw:
"using this recession as an excuse to justify these budget cuts"
All I can say is just savor the pure joy of hearing this when it happens...

Fife, on ctv, describes Dion as "the accidental leader who wants to be the accidental Prime Minister". Good for you Bob.

"If the opposition parties form a coalition and and the GG empowers them then we will see a coup d'etat in Canada similiar to what Germany went through in the Thirties."

No we won't. That's just stupid.

It would be an unstable government. It would fall within the normal course of things. And Harper's Conservatives would kick their asses.

Ergo, they won't do it.

I have to say I'm enjoying this immensely. Once again Harper has provoked the opposition into a reaction of hideous stupidity. I sense the hand of Dion behind this coalition proposal. But to really get the gist of the driving force behind this take this quote from Ujal this evening on CTV:

"...the Harper government has been insensitive to the angst, pain and fear of the Canadian people..."

Now substitute Liberal Party of Canada financial planners for Canadian people.

Regards, BRK

"Who the fu*k do these leftists think they are? The Conservatives won the election so get over it. You want to vote down the Gov't, fine, but a coup?"

Get a grip, people. That isn't a coup. It's how the Canadian constitution works.

However, it would be politically stupid and the Canadian voters would remember the already damaged Liberal party as the one that united with the socialist NDP and separatist Bloc to take power away from the party they'd sent back to Ottawa with an increase in seats.

When this unholy coalition fell -- and it would -- the voters would punish them large.

But it's not a coup. Drop that nonsensical thinking from your mind.

Besides... have you noticed Canada is the second largest country on Earth with a tiny military? How, prey tell, would one keep control of the country against the constitutional government with it?

Aside from the fact much of the military is Liberal anyhow. It's more left than the U.S. military.

"I have to say I'm enjoying this immensely. Once again Harper has provoked the opposition into a reaction of hideous stupidity."

Now that is correct thinking!

Awesome .... 245 comments on this post.

I have just this to say about the Leftards:

It's Jeopardy Time!

I'll take BANANA REPUBLICS and third world shitholes for $2000 Alex.

Answer: Ecuador ..... Mexico.... Venezuela ..... Zimbabwe... Canada?

The Question: What is the inevitable result of allowing leftards to run for office.

I think we should all e-mail every Opposition MP and tell them not to defeat the government or risk facing the wrath of the Canadian people...Also, to provide the details of their stimulus package because they obviously don't have one//

This is one of the busiest threads I've ever seen on SDA. I can't possibly read all the previous entries before I forget what I want to say.

This whole situation is stupendous. I can't say whether good or bad; but certainly monumentous. It will go down in history.

I do not know how things will transpire.

I hope the Liberal coalition with the Bloc (notice in press reports, the Bloc is rarely mentionmed. It's all talk of a liberal-NDP coalition - can't form a government with that) is rejected by teh GG on the grounds that (1) it wasn't the subject of the previous election 2 months ago and (2) no one openly demanding the destruction of Canada can be part of Canadian government (see laws of treason).

Write to you local newspapers.

This is one of the busiest threads I've ever seen on SDA. I can't possibly read all the previous entries before I forget what I want to say.

This whole situation is stupendous. I can't say whether good or bad; but certainly monumentous. It will go down in history.

I do not know how things will transpire.

I hope the Liberal coalition with the Bloc (notice in press reports, the Bloc is rarely mentionmed. It's all talk of a liberal-NDP coalition - can't form a government with that) is rejected by teh GG on the grounds that (1) it wasn't the subject of the previous election 2 months ago and (2) no one openly demanding the destruction of Canada can be part of Canadian government (see laws of treason).

Write to you local newspapers. Write the GG.

"With Kate's permission perhaps it is time to speculate on a name for the coalition."

2 choices:

(1) Four Weddings and A Funeral

(2) UAE - United Arab Emirates

Experts doubtful a coalition gov't would work
Updated Fri. Nov. 28 2008 8:55 PM ET

By Parminder Parmar, CTV.ca News

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20081128/coalitions_past_081128/20081128?hub=TopStories

Barry Cooper, a political science professor at the University of Calgary, ... says the NDP and Liberals are just too far apart on issues for their MPs to agree on a working alignment.

Cooper says it doesn't matter that party elders are behind the coalition talk. ...

"The Governor General has to be convinced that this coalition is real," he said, noting the party's MPs won't necessarily listen to Broadbent or Chretien. ...

... "If she thinks it's [a Liberal/NDP/Bloc coalition] doable, she is in deep doo doo."

Liberal + NDP + Bloc = Green Shift

How about the Three Stooges!

The Three Amigos starring Steve Martin, Chevy Chase and Martin Short. Steve looks like Duceppe.

We also need a movie with a dog in it, preferably a metrosexual one to play the role of Kyoto. On second though, maybe a cat will do.

Garfield?

This whole scenario is getting crazier by the minute, but I'll speculate that Dion may be orchestrating this because it's essentially his last and only chance to be Prime Minister of Canada.

As we saw during the election, he's not averse to the idea of forming alliances with other parties.

I'm gathering that Iggy isn't too keen on the idea, since he believes he has a better chance to form a government when he is the leader. Look for him to dump cold water on this move in the coming days.

I still think it's a Hail Mary move no matter who's in charge, with little chance of actual success. If the opposition parties do actually press on with this tactic, Harper's best bet is to ask the GG to call an election.

Essentially, Harper must tell the Liberals that if they insist on bringing down the government, they should be forced to go to the voters and try to make a case that firstly, there's an advantage to having a coalition with the NDP and the Bloc, and secondly that the coalition has a chance of surviving more than a few months. I doubt that they voting public will be too keen on endorsing that, and I think that for that reason the Liberals will have a number of "sick" MPs on December 8th.

Tom @7:45 AM, but the GG cannot possibly allow a separaist [party, wanting the destruction of Canada, into the Canadian government.

Watched the National tonight and noticed a glaring underplay of the BQ factor in all this and how separatists would be in government under such a scenario. "Informally" or "on an issue by issue basis" as the CBC is trying its best to spin it is just semantics. The BQ would de facto be in government since the LPC and NDP don't have enough seats combined to form a gov't. Harper may not have a majority, but he doesn't need the votes of the BQ to pass legislation. It can be done with any combination of the other two parties. Under the coalition scenario, if every Opposition Conservative MP voted against "government" legislation the Liberals would need the support of the BQ, making the separatists an "integral" part of the coalition government, even as the CBC attempts to minimize that party's role in their slanted reporting. "Liberal-NDP coalition"... "Liberal-NDP coalition" we hear in MSM, over and over again and again, in spite of the BQ having to join too for it to work.

And funny that the term "separatist" wasn't used on the National because when Martin accused the Conservatives of being in bed with separatists to topple his government, it got plenty of play by CBC. Harper accuses the Liberals now of the same, but his comments in that regard are expunged from tonight's reporting on The National. And it was quite a lengthy series of reports devoted exclusively to this "crisis"... 9 minutes worth in fact. 9 minutes of reporting and nowhere are the Bloc mentioned as separatists by either the PM himself or any reporter and the pundits, analyst, etc., that were interviewed. Such a pejorative descriptor such as "separatists" need only be used when the Conservatives work with the BQ, I guess. Besides, if you're the CBC you don't want to scare Canadians by telling them separatists will be in government. And not the ones that were in the Mulroney government the CBC always likes to criticize... you know, those who at least ran under a PC federalist banner? No, these are a crop who are CURRENTLY separatists in parliament, in a separatist party whose sole mandate they acknowledge is to break up the country. THESE are the ones given a free pass by the CBC this go around. Anything it takes to restore the "natural governing party" to power, I guess.

The liberals are so desperate,and desperate times call for desperate measures,resurrecting Chretien is a fine example. They know that if their public funding is pulled they will cease to exist as a legitimate option with-in a year or two. Actually I doubt if they will make it far past their 'leadership' convention. They are a cornered rat,just not as dangerous. The greens will be drooping ,the Bloc is french toast,and the NDP will be dipping for change in fountains, their base will feed their families before they feed Layton's. If the 'coalition of the wilting' actually pulls it off they will last until the first opposition day. Then the conservatives will table a confidence motion that calls for the public funding to be pulled. They will have to vote for their lifeline,or it lights out, and I don't think Canadians will stand for this blatant greed. This is the beginning of the end for this edition of the left side of Canadian politics. They will pop up again,as they should,but it will be a decade or more before they will be a force.

The NDP are going to hop into bed with the separatists and Chretien, Dion, and the Adscam liberals?
Bad move Jack.

From the Toronto Star comments:
"Why is it when Obama was successful at grassroots fundraising it was good but when the Conservatives do it it is bad? Why can't the Liberals do what Obama did?"

Bring it on, Mr. Harper. Don't back down. Canada does not need these desperate clowns heading anything, let alone a coalition governement: It would be a coalition of whining, entitled brats intent only on further feathering their nests at the usual expense of the rest of us plebs.

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.

If PMSH goes down, I want him to go down fighting all the way.

Today on the news bloody Broadbent in his fur hat looked just like a puffed up Russian Commie --concerned, of course, only for the working class, never mind that the working class is being asked to heavily subsidize Canadian political parties whether or not they vote for them or agree with them.

Like Ignatieff and Rae, Broadbent attended tony Trinity College. 'Nothing wrong with that, it's a good college, BUT these guys with silver spoons in their mouths and plenty of money in the bank are just a tad out of touch with the "working class" they keep saying they care about.

I'm sick of their posturing and lies. Totally sick of them.

I think the "name the coalition" needs a thread of its own.

Then, after a few good suggestions, we narrow it down to about 4-5.

Then do the official "SDA name the coalition" poll.

Posted by: morgan at November 28, 2008 11:10 PM -

"THESE are the ones given a free pass by the CBC this go around. Anything it takes to restore the "natural governing party" to power, I guess."

The Media bias is palpable in this story.
Duceppe's Separatists governing in Canada in an unholy leftist alliance.
Where is MSM outrage?
They are as corrupt as the proposed trough sucking coalition.

"Trinity College"

Andrew Coyne and Adrienne Clarkson went there as well. And Michael Ignatieff.

Just what Canada needs to fight the global slow down is Dion as Prime Minister and able to tell Canadians what he will do when asked.

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=p5hoSfvIFFE

How about we just call them the Axis of Evil.

Where's the mention of the Green Shift in all this? Didn't Dion say if he was elected PM he would implement the Green Shift right away in spite of the downturn in the economy? Didn't he say the Green Shift was good for the economy, that a struggling economy needs the Green Shift, that the Green Shift would create jobs? If he truly believes this, will he tell Canadians up until Dec. 8 to expect it if the junta he'll lead seizes power? Was he lying to Canadians? Or is he against creating jobs? Which is it?

"Broadbent in his fur hat"

That means Ed was wearing a Small Dead Animal on his head.

Put somethin' in the tip jar, Ed.

How about we just call them the Axis of Evil.

...and the axis of the terminally stupid.

Idiot savants they are.

Ed Broadbent...he's like a turd that won't flush! Cretin too...why isn't he in prison?

If anyone thinks the West will just take this suffocating Junta sitting down, their dreaming in a cloud of opium.
The West will want out. How will Dion deal with another North West rebellion, or even greater separatist movement in the West?
The East has no idea how enraged people here would be, no idea at all. It would be the unpardonable Political sin. We actually believe in Democracy. Putting Federal Separatists in power is folly. There only goal is this Countries break up. This is the greediest, most disgraceful thing I have lived to see. Canada is no more a Democracy. Can BC grow bananas?

Harper will just eat them up if this goes ahead. I say call another election on this issue post haste. No compromise.
The alternative could get ugly & no sane person wants that. The other three parties clear betrayal of democratic principles with a cushy money grab, by elitists in a phony cause. Will erupt into a firestorm. Whets next’s machine guns in the street? With the NDP anything is possible.
Just look at the despicable characters behind the plot. Its inconsolable. The evil legion of hosts regurgitating their rot from liberal past crooks are that are back again to rob us of even our right to elect. The Liberals are demented with power worshiping insatiability. Money with privilege have become their god. The people they swore to protect there rights have become Marks to these thieves.

It may be legal to do this, but the spirit of Liberty has been lost to the Entitlements of would be aristocratic tyrants.

"...the Harper government has been insensitive to the angst, pain and fear of the Canadian people..."

As opposed to the, uh, loyal opposition parties, who want to INSTILL "angst, pain and fear" into the Canadian people until they get their way. Petulant, shameful, hypocritical childish behaviour.

Is there no possibility whatsoever that Bob Rae supporters and Michael Ignatieff supporters could stage a mini-coup of their own and vote with the CPC, keeping the government afloat and further discrediting Stephane Dion, a.k.a. the Failure?

More.

In America, if you want to see the mindset of the Radical Left you go to the DailyKos.com. In Canada you just go to the CBC News website. Read the comments on what's going on in Ottawa these days. Here's the comment that I just left there:

I am deeply ashamed by so many of the comments I'm reading on here.

Let's remove the spin and ascertain two facts remain crystal clear:

1. The ONLY reason why the Liberals, NDP, and Bloc Quebecois are considering this takedown of a democratically elected government is because the taxpayer-funded $1.95 per vote going towards ALL parties may be eliminated.

2. If this occurs, it may very well be constitutionally legal but is nothing other than a Coup d'Etat.

Don't insult us by pretending anything else.

The fact that so many of you are so willing to, not just to let this happen, but to actually encourage it, is a clear sign of the deeply undemocratic mindset so pervasive in Canada these days, especially those on the Radical Left side of the political spectrum.

The Conservatives were elected as a minority government just 45 days ago. Back then many of you were saying, "I'm glad that Harper only got a minority. It's what Canadians want. They'll all be forced to work together."

Now, at the very first chance, your politicians in Ottawa are saying, "Ahhh, we didn't really mean that. We're going to seize power instead." And you all are cheering them on.

What absolute hypocrisy! Ashamed you should be, but too arrogant to realize it in fact you are. You must truly all be mad to think that the best course of action for Canada is to have Stephane "Defeated" Dion as its figurehead PM but the real reins of power clearly in the hands of the Bloc Quebecois.

Just remember that for every action there is a reaction. If you think the people of Western Canada are going to see their duly elected government thrown out of office, you truly are dreaming. Should this occur, I expect permanent negative repercussions to affect Canada for the next 50 years ... and that is if Canada even remains together should this disaster unfold as you're hoping.

Revnant Dream wrote: "Will erupt into a firestorm. Whets next’s machine guns in the street? With the NDP anything is possible."

Perhaps the opposition can turn in their limousines for Somali-style Toyota landrunners complete with a gun mount in the back

Diplibloc

Re the "missing stimulus package". If we look to the south, we see that they are throwing hundreds of billions of dollars (maybe trillions) at the problems down there. And it has not helped. I'm very glad Harper has been much more prudent, considering we are nowhere near the dire straits of the U.S.

If this Coalition of the Entitled comes to pass, in a year's time we'll be broke as hell, be paying a carbon tax, higher GST, have no military, free childcare/homecare/welfare for any who want it, and a French citizen for PM. Yippeee. And the rest of the world will laugh at what we squandered.

Free Western Canada!

Hi All.
Hi Kate.
First time posting. Love the site. Hope I make you proud...
This stuff here is heroine to a political junkie like me. And my suggestion for this creepy collection of goons...

The Coalition of the Swilling.

Thanks,
Sam

Though I hope SH has things well in hand I worry he does not.

While on the face of it letting the opposition run things for a while looks to be a way of showing Canadians that these guys are as inept at running the country as the penguins in Madagascar 2 were at flying an airplane, I am concerned that they may fluke their way into a successful coalition that not only helps repair their current situation(s) but also allows them to do serious long-term damage to things should the Conservatives manage to get back into power.

I'm thinking here about the ability for them to reload the Senate with 18 new anti-conservative appointees, creating an even worse legislative log-jam than we have now.

Second:

Stephen Harper's opponents have always made the mistake of underestimating his political abilities (same goes for GWB). We would be wise to not underestimate the abilities of Jean Chretien and his minions to manange this coalition should they get a hold of the reins of power. Granted, Jean Chretien's reputation for genius is largely supported by evidence of how well he did during a time when his traditional conservative opponents lay in pieces on the floor. But do we really want to give this guy any chance to get his hands on the tiller again?

I and a lot of other conservatives hope that Stephen has a end game mapped out - that he so far is seeing everything going as (he) planned.

....

And is it possible that the opposition was planning to bring down the government in any event? I have commented in the past that many Liberals consider the removal of Joe Clark as one of their greatest acheivements and they would love nothing better than to do the same to Stephen Harper. Just wondering if SH did what he did as a pre-emptive strike...

@ EBD at November 28, 2008 1:49 AM

No, they'll have to wear it within days. Even the Liberals and NDP combined don't have enough seats to defend against an immediate no-confidence vote brought by the 143 Tories.

So, an election would happen no matter what.

The whole thing is so simple really (but not to Stéphane "I Am A Retard" Dion): if a party cannot sell its ideas to members and supporters, and thus generate revenue from donations, as Barack Obama has done so expertly, it loses its legitimacy and does not deserve to be kept alive at the expense of taxpayers.

Jeffrey Simpson isn't so bright either, because in a total lapse of judgment and suspension of logic, he argues that the subsidy is an important incentive for Canadians to donate to political parties. Quite the opposite is true: when voters know that their tax dollars are used to prop up (f)ailing parties, they will feel no obligation whatsoever to send their hard-earned cash to them.

It is at times like this that people have a chance to see the real nature and character of their politicians. When the Liberals are willing to thrust the country into a political and economic crisis of immense instability – and this would trigger not only a recession, but a full-blown depression in Canada – over a lousy $1.95, voters realize that there is a reason why the Liberals have been unable to raise funds to stay afloat: because they are a joke and really have no place in the political landscape any longer.

BTW;

I read somewhere that doer in MB is considering scrapping goverment grants to parties too.

Don't presume to speak for "Canadians".
Posted by: Kate at November 28, 2008 1:07 PM

---

Sure thing. Just as soon as you stop claiming to speak for the people of Saskatchewan. Or wait, that's no longer the tag line on your blog. Did it have something to do with the Sask party throwing you under the bus?

Gord Tulk: "I read somewhere that doer in MB is considering scrapping goverment grants to parties too."

No rumour -- it's true. The Cons here are roasting him over it and seem to be gaining a little traction.

"The province's opposition leader wants Manitobans to decide where money from a political subsidy his party has declined should be spent.

Hugh McFadyen has renewed his call this week for Premier Gary Doer to scrap a new law that gives political parties $1.25 per vote, similar to what is happening in Ottawa.

McFadyen, who has said he won't accept the 800 thousand dollars the law will provide for his party, believes a public contest should be held on how to spend the funds."

http://www.cjob.com/News/Local/Story.aspx?ID=1042878

But [Steve@November 29, 2008 12:47 AM], Saskatchewan DID elect a conservative government, didn't it.

So the voters spoke and apparently agreed with Kate, tossing out the Lefties.

I realize how difficult this may be to understand for you, this concept of those smelly, icky voters making decisions you don't like. How dare they! It's offensive!

It might be the scotch talking but IanV gets my vote.

Brilliant!

Diplibloc.

Revnant Dream at midnight. I agree. The conservatives have a huge power base in Ab. and Sask. If we lose the man we voted for to a sleazy band of highwaymen, there will be many that will be very upset,to put it mildly.The western seperation movement will not be a posture to obtain favours from the ROC like the Quebec gang. We are the money.The 'coalition of the wilting'can paste together a composite of Obama,Mother Theresa,and Gretzky,and it will not matter.We will have been bent over for the last time. I don't think that the opposition have thought their ploy out all that well.

If these a$$#oles get their coalition in can they load the senate vacancies with their puppets?????

Herb said: "I'm curious, with all the talk of the libs and ndp'ers and bloc to be destroyed, do you all want'one' party in this country?"

Oh please, Herb. Are you actually suggesting that the only way the other parties can survive is with monies grabbed from other Canadians? If they can't convince their own supporters to pony up, what does that say about their positions or platform.

If the Conservatives can do so, why not any other party? I'm not interested in 'destroying' another political party, but why should I be forced into supporting them against my wishes?

Manny wrote: "Yet it is democratic to make the taxpayer support freeloading, conservative voting farmers."

Manny, shame on you. You have no evidence regarding how any given farmer votes. Besides, Saskatchewan probably has more farmers than just about anywhere, and it went NDP for how many decades? So much for your theory.

Manny also wrote: Food is suppose to be free? "No, but education is, orvict."

What a freaking fool. Yeah, education is free, just like health care, Manny. I just checked and noted that 'school tax' was 62% of my property tax bill. When I read your postings I realize that even if education were free, you still didn't get your moneys worth.

Wallyj. BC voted heartily for PM Harper's Conservatives. My riding went Conservative two months ago and my MP is in cabinet. I can guarantee that if Dion or some other Liberal is forced on us as Prime Minister when Canada elected the Conservatives, many here in the West WILL talk separation. It will be THE hottest topic on online radio shows. I find it ludicrous that the ones really pushing this are not even in Parliament. Jean Chretien and Ed Broadbent.

As the seizure of power by the Separatist/Liberal/Communist alliance continues, and Dion, Layton, and their ideological comrade Duceppe go into hiding, who slithers out of the bile but the two cockroaches of nightmares past, king criminal Chretien and the commie overlord Broadbent. That explains a lot about the stench coming out of the cess pool back in Ottawa. Two old dictators brought back to explain the complexities and machinations of running a dictatorship...nice. I heard Bob Fife yapping about the coup currently under way, and when asked if the coup will succeed he said "We're not there yet" We ?

First,I want to congratulate Stephen Harper for offering to give up $10 million tax dollars in these tough economic times.

Second, shame on those in the media who consider 30 million tax dollars as 'small potatoes' not worthy of a fiscal plan. Give me another nine of these small sacrifices and we have saved $300 million. Give me another twenty modest reductions, well, see it adds up.

Third, if you are you one of those who thinks that we could never find thirty $30 million reductions in all of Ottawa, Then you probably need to dig out a dictionary and look up the word 'sacrifice'. Because we will all have to make them and very few of them will be painless.

Finally, when you are unable to make your own sacrifices, don't expect that anyone else is willing either. Of all the current leadership wannabes, I would trust that Bob Rae appreciates that concept better than any.

As the Christmas Season approaches, I would suggest that all of our political mentors remind themselves of that old adage "'tis better to give than receive".

Ted your right.

I had hoped Mr. Harper would LEAD this country into these tough times.
Instead he is playing games. His lack of respect for the people and their opinions shows
he is lacking in character. He called an election against his own law in the hope he would have
a majority government. This looks a whole bunch like the old saying about power corrupting.

Here is hoping that responsible individuals take control of our government and protect our democracy against
these dark economic times.

Went down and talked to my MP,Linda Dalton,NDP,and she said she would let her leader decide what to do. Ah,Linda.Just another teat sucking,socialist scum! You can't make up your own mind??

Here is hoping that responsible take control of our government and protect our democracy against
these dark economic times.

That may well be the funniest sentence ever written.
Let me give you a hint. When "responsible individuals" "take control" of "democracy" they tend not to give it back and democracy dies. Who are these responsible people? Dion? Layton? They won less seats than Harper but what does that matter? This is about being responsible and protecting democracy!
Democracy does NOT need protecting against "dark economic times." It DOES need protection against those that would use them as cover for naked ambition

I've just made another donation in support of Steven Harper and let my MP know that I'm in agreement with removing this ridiculous subsidy. When times are tough, the "little" unnecessary things should be the first to go! The opposing parties are only worried about their empty pockets and how they'll soon be even emptier. Their concern about our economy has nothing to do with this proposed coalition. I'd like to think Canadians are smart enough to see though that.

Duhwhite, my poor misguided creature, this attempted coup will not come to be. In spite of the support of the propagandists, of cbc and ctv, there is no future in this venture. Socialist dogma will not seize power. Sanity will prevail. It surely is fascinating how the totalitarians in this country are trying to justify treason. That Cretin and Bentbroadly are being idolized by the media as statesman with a plan is tragically hysterical. I only wish Mr. Flaherty would also dispose of the pensions that taxpayers have to gift these two treasonist members of the bright red nose, big floppy shoe guild.

Is Canada a democracy?

Does Canada actually operate by a system that says that every time a financial bill comes up, it allows the Opposition Parties the opportunity to coalesce and topple the legitimately elected government - and they'll do this not by analytic reasons against the Financial Bill but because it allows them the opening for one Agenda. Getting Power.

They'll get power by promises of financial and power rewards (promises of cabinet positions, promises of pet bills passed, other perks)?

And they'll do this with the aid of a rogue party, the Bloc, which has no interest in the well-being of Canadians, which rejects Canada and Canadians but lives off the Canadian tax dollar?

Is Canada a democracy?

If this so called coalition comes to fruition, and the sociallists from the Center of the Universe, along with the Quebeccers, over throw the duly elected CPC. Then i would first like to welcome Joe M to the west to participate in freeing the west from the lefty lunacy. Bring it on. Lets see how Quebec does with their social programs when the west is no longer paying the tab.

I read your comment Robert W on the CBC site and greatly appreciated it. I wish that I could express myself as eloquently.

(A fellow Lotuslander)

How about a list of opposition MPs who may be inclined to cross the isle ?

I suspect they are waiting for a little push.

"Here is hoping that responsible individuals take control of our government and protect our democracy against these dark economic times."

Duh. Like who? Bankrupt Bob?

ET, you're right. "Is Canada a democracy?"

This may very well end up being the unravelling of Canada.

How can these deranged imbeciles think that Canada, outside of Toronto, Ottawa and Quebec, will acquiesce to this?

Although, I'd wager the likely outcome will be the death blow to the Liberal party of Canada.

In the following election, how will they ever recover any federalist credibility after teaming up with the Treasonous Bastard Party of Canada?

How will they ever recover the political centre after teaming up with The Socialist Party of Canada?

They're dead, dead, dead.

Which, according to Tom Flanagan, is the Conservative end game.

Fools played like a minaret.

Below is a copy of my email to the pm, Dion, Layton, Rae, Ignatieff and at least half of the MPs. I urge others to write also, and write to the Press. It's an appalling blatant grab for power outside of the democratic process:

"I am appalled and disgusted at the Liberal-NDP blatant grab for power. How dare they so abuse our system and the electorate for their own agenda of Power.

Is Canada a democracy? How dare the Liberals and NDP attempt to gain power without an election.

The democratic process is that any change of government MUST be one that is the act of the electorate. Not an act of a few political parties coalescing on their own with the agenda only of grabbing power.

1) If a financial bill is rejected by our legislature, this rejection MUST BE BASED on constructive analysis and legitimate reasons. The Liberals-NDP haven't provided this, for their superficial words of 'no stimulus package' are inadequate to the realities of the economic crisis, which requires - not flinging tax dollars at industries - but restructuring the actual industrial system.
The Liberals-NDP haven't sat down with the government and worked on such a restructuring plan - one which can't be developed in a week, but requires months and above all, it requires careful networking with the policies of the international world. The Liberals-NDP aren't interested in such an approach; their only tactic is to 'fling money' to maintain the Old Economic Mode - a mode whose structure is outdated and crumbling.

2) The next step is an election. NOT an undemocratic grab for power by several opposition parties coalescing, rewarding such 'collaboration' with promises of benefits, cabinet positions and other promises. This is a disgrace.
AND - aligning themselves with a rogue party, the Bloc, a party that is utterly indifferent to Canada and Canadians and exists only to live off the Canadian taxpayer.

Again - this is a disgrace; it is an outright rejection of democracy. How dare you - Mr. Dion, Layton, Ignatieff, Rae, Duceppe - how dare you treat the parliament and the electorate with such contempt. How dare you so abuse our system to gain power.

Is Canada a democracy? Not to the Liberals, NDP and Bloc.

How dare you, Mr. Dion, Rae, Ignatieff, Layton - how dare you destroy Canada as a democracy. How dare you use a fiscal bill as a blatant grab for power. How dare you ignore the electorate."

This is an Historic thread being played out here Kate. Hope it goes into your best list.

Here Here Et well said

I too have sent my disgust at this sham and if they do succeed they will be the ones responsible for the breakup of this country & should be held responsible for acts of treason to our constitution & queen.

Pigs at the Trough thats all these opposition leaders are. I pray there are some decent MP's in the liberal party that are not willing to form an alliance with the Devil, that will act responsively and think of the people that elected them & they represent By Not making a decision based on Greed & Power & they decide to cross the floor to save this country.

A possible solution that I posted on a G&M thread [of course, this wouldn't happen in a week, but still poses an interesting scenario]:

" If Sarah Palin was to bring Alaska into Canadian Confederation, that could give the Conservatives a majority, and perhaps we could enjoy her as Vice-Presdent, er: Vice Premier, or whatever. Think of the endless advantages. Wow! "

Note: Sorry Kate, you were my first choice, but can you bring Alaska into Confederation?

but can you bring Alaska into Confederation?

If you can select a former CBC reporter to be head of the Canadian military then I would say you can bring 3 lunar craters into Confederation.

Anything goes in the Demented Dominion. Have oil, will travel.

The citizen subsidized CBC and the rest of the media are IGNORING the fact that the Dippers and Liberanos are willing to merge with 44 traitors! The media are traitors too. Starve them, harass them, heap your disgust on them, and NEVER, EVER trust them. A person can watch them (stalk them, they are traitors!) demand defunding, ruin them by constant criticism and no purchases of ads or newspapers but never, ever believe anything the press gang spew - it is treason by virtue of their 'pals'.

I like your comment about the two sleazy old buzzards- Broadbent and Cretian - uuass. Those two creepy, craven vultures have stolen millions from the coffers of Canada to line their own pest holes. We should put them in jail as traitors and retroactivly recoup all money ever paid to them by the tax payers of Canada. It is payback time, this time. The opposition has opened a Pandora's box - the demands for payback will not end when this day's work is done; the taxpayers are on a roll and we have a Prime Minister to back us up - a Prime Minister on the same side as taxpayers!! Our outrage will not stop - the train has left the station.

Scott Brison is yapping on CTV right now, he certainly has a 'thing' for Obamma. Does Scotties 'wife manikin' know about this obsession? Is there more to this obsession than meets the eye? I'm thinking that the 'hero worship' for the American President - elect could be a dangerous and unhealthy thing in an elected politician from Canada. Who elected Scott Brison?

Thanks for sharing your letter to MP's ET. I heard both Bob Rae and Libby Davies on the Roy Green show today and they both claimed that the letters of support they are getting run 9:1. I think they're both lying through their teeth, but let's all shift that ratio.

Here's the letter I've sent to ALL Members of Parliament.

Dear Liberal, NDP and Bloc Members of Parliament;

Few issues have aroused as much anger amongst Canadians as the proposed 'coalition' of Liberaland NDP parties who are demanding to form a government along with avowed separatists, the Bloc Quebecois. We had an election just six weeks ago and the people made their decision. If as Liberal, NDP or Bloc member, you wish to dissolve Parliament, then I call on you to again take the issue before the electorate through another election - not weasel your way into power through a decision by the Governor General.

If, as Liberal, NDP or Bloc member, you wish us to believe that you are acting out of concern for Canadians and the current economic climate, then immediately show us your plans. Not in generalities, but as specifics. What taxes will you raise? What spending will you cut or increase? What programs will you initiate or trim? Who will receive subsidies and how much? How big a deficit are you prepared to incur?

You claim the government has no plan (the stated basis for which you intend to subvert the will of the people as expressed just six weeks ago) so in fairness, show us your own well thought out and agreed upon coalition plan. Liberals have no leader, so who will be the Prime Minister and on whose authority? And because neither the NDP nor the Liberals have sufficient numbers to form a coalition government, it is clear that Giles Duceppe and the Bloc will be the puppet masters within the coalition. Nothing can be done withour their express approval and the Bloc has no interest in the rest of the nation.

This is attempt to subvert the expressed will of voters is shameful and a travesty of democracy. It is a naked grab for power and at it's heart, a desperate attempt to hold on to public funding. You are not entitled to your entitlements. If your platform is sound and your arguments reasoned, you should have no difficulty in attracting independent financial support from voters. If you cannot, you need to ask why your policies are not resonating and what modifications to your policies you need to make in order to convince them to do so.

The anger amongst we 'ordinary people' is incalcuable and you shall reap what you have sown. Be careful what you wish for

"Is Canada a democracy?

"Does Canada actually operate by a system that says that every time a financial bill comes up, it allows the Opposition Parties the opportunity to coalesce and topple the legitimately elected government..."

Damn, people, I'm on your side, but think.

The opposition MPs were elected democratically too, remember? In a "representative democracy" they have a role. If a majority of duly elected MPs lack confidence in the minority government, it can fall. And then we have... elections.

Christoph....It's not an election that the coalition want,they would lose even more votes for having another election,they know this.This is why they plan on forming a coalition government through the GG,no election required.

Je propose comme nom de coalition:
"la carpe et le lapin".

Je propose comme nom de coalition:
"la carpe et le lapin".
========================

Chef-less pizza parliament

Chef-less pizza parliament