Ive never actually heard what "torture" Mr. Arar endured. from the descriptions the MSM put out it didnt seem much more than frathouse induction.

can someone tell me?

Cal2:

Would you listen if they did?

I have just heard Paul Palango, (Dispersing the Fog)interviewed on a local radio station. He spent a fair amount of time discussing this exact subject in his book.
If our Government had been a majority, I suspect things with this fellow may have been QUITE DIFFERENT. We really are sheep in this country!

I think the Arar thing was "settled" with cash so as to make the inconvenient bugalaboo go away so that the, ah, agencies of state involved, could get the negative attention paid them to stop.

Of course, we don't expect any state agency of any nation in the whole bloody world to not make some mistakes. The question as to whether the agencies of state did anything wrong is irrelevant, actually, when the question turns onto Arar himself; ie. the evidence against Arar- it hasn't been debunked, plus it was never proven that he was, as he claimed, "tortured" by the Syrians (Why the hell would Syria, an Islamic terrorist state, torture a suspected Islamic terrorist??? It makes no sense!). Yet, despite the fact that "torture" was never proven, the MSM nevertheless treated the question as if it was answered, not using words like "allegedly" or "claimed to have been" before the word "tortured" when mentioning Arar. Contrast this with their treatment of William Sampson, who was obviously tortured, but the MSM nevertheless refused to treat the torture question as if it was obvious that Sampson was tortured by the Saudis, using words like "claimed" and "allegedly" before the word "tortured".

What is wrong with just getting the passport. I have been in the US and have had absolutely no problem with this. If they want info on you all they have to do is type in passport number and bingo your record is exposed. Had this happen several times and been question on certain items. Answer truthfully.

My belief is "if you look and act like a coyote" you will be called on it. Hence the line ups at entering or coming back from place of visiting. If you think people are not watching you in monitors, people are more dumber than I thought.

Arar sure got his pockets well loaded,in fact the amount was obscene.

We better keep watch and yell like hell if the government attempts to pay out money to the other three Muslims who are now claiming torture when they visited their homeland in Syria, Egypt or wherever. How can we trust them? How can we get proof they were tortured? Today they look like well dressed,healthy fat cats.

Canada has to protect her borders and it's citizens from terrorists. If certain names are on a watch list they could get caught. As long as they continue to trek to places like Syria and other Islamic states to visit or seek a "wife" and other excuses, it's their call, not ours.

Canada has no control over other jurisdictions, we do not torture people or condone it. We have no reason to apologize for the actions of others.
We have no reason to pay out obscene amounts of money to them either.

devin maxwell=devo

http://www.blogger.com/profile/03673654244173141798

sometimes a cigar is just a cigar and sometimes its just sux.

you are an embarrassment to us haligonians.

arar?????

who mean the lefties blew it again, just to be politically correct?????

Devin, you shouldn't come in here just when the lefties are taking another hit for being politically WRONG

maybe Arar can make some awkward hand jestures. or foot jestures if he got the midnight express treatment.

http://maxwell-devin.blogspot.com/2008/11/whats-up-with-john-mccains-arms.html#comments

mr Devin at his loser best.

I believe it was the Western Standard, when it was still publishing, that asked the $10 million question re Mr. Arrar: Did anyone ever examine his body to see if there were marks of torture on him? The beatings and whippings he said he suffered in the Syrian dungeon would have left marks of some kind.

Seems to me if you are going to compensate someone for what that person unjustly endured, you would want some verification that the story was true.

In addition to questioning the level of torture that that Mr. Arar endured, I wonder how much Syria paid for committing the act(s)? There are too many unanswered questions on this to have paid him a dime.

mr. Devin provides his expertise on this subject while he is blowing out the cigar smoke. He provides expertise on the environment while sucking in.

canadian sentinel - I agree. Arar never proved that he was tortured; all that we, Canada, had was his own words. Absolutely no proof.

And I agree, the MSM treated the Arar case very differently from the Sampson case.

And no proof that he wasn't involved in terrorist funding.
Therefore, why was he given this massive amount of taxpayer money?

As for the US refusing to allow him in, that's their right.

It's strange that so many Canadians are so shrill in their anti-Americanism and yet, they expect this same America to give them preferential border treatment (no passports, no screening), preferential economic and trade treatment, preferential international protection and so on.

read mr devos blog spot, he doesnt really believe the effects of real torture , aka having your arms chained above your head for a few years.

I think it would be safe to say mr arar can participate in most anything he wants as long as he doesnt go stateside.

Arar got more money than if he had been beaten up by Canadian police. Preposterous.

The evidence of torture was pathetically weak. For that amount of money they can "torture" me; where can I apply?

See, how the governments are duping us into surrendering our freedoms and privacy, how simple is that!

The US did not need any information about the Canadians up to the point, when the Trudopian liberals imported millions of unchecked and unchallenged immigrants and refugees into this country from all over the world. Suddenly, it makes a lot of sense that Canada has to share clandestine - pay attention, dudes! - clandestine information on the Canadians regardless of colour and nationality. No indictment, no conviction, just information. Where do you think they expect this information to come from? From surveillance!!!

Why don't we do it right way instead - deport all those, whose presence is raising flags at US State Dept? Why the f4ck does Canada is hell bent on bringing over and keeping the muslims with terrorist ties, LTTE members, Russian mafia, Albanian mafia, Hezbollah, Hamas, PLO, somalian pirates, triads and other exemplar members of the general category 'scum of the Earth'? I guess, it actually serves somebody's goals of obtaining information on all of us.

Maybe Arar hasn't been cleared, and he may have some involvement. I don't know. But his rights were clearly violated and the RCMP did not do their job. Don't think about giving the government a free pass.

He is a Canadian citizen. There are not two classes of citizenship. If the state had sufficent evidence to point that he was involved with Al Qaeda, then they needed to charge him in Canada, not deport him to Syria.

The compensation amount is large, but the state did violate this man's rights.

I had followed the case of Mr Arar carefully. I tend to be very empathetic with persons abused. I had read of a 10X8x6 foot cell. He may have been ten months in that cell. I have not got time to check, could have been eight months.

It was filthy. Mice droppings and dirty water oozing down into the cell. He was repeatedly beaten and solidly.

I have seen pictures in the Toronto Star. This of some poor devil who had spent the winter in Toronto sleeping out. He did not wish the kind ministrations of Seaton House. He looked simply awful.

A week later, Mr Arar was looking quite trim. It would be unkind to simply use that as a complete picture. I do not know, but the proper procedure would have been to get two independent medical doctors. Each could have used all known devices- without interfering with Mr Arar's dignity. Perhaps this was done.

I felt that Arar should have been in a wheel chair on return to Canada. If not that, very, very fragile.

Alas, we as Canadian taxpayers will never know really what happened to Arar.

Peter, if you get information from Toronto Star, you've got a problem.

I gather that there is a UN protocol for determining whether a person has been tortured, because while torture is unfortunately common, so are false accusations of torture. I also gather that that protocol was not applied to Arar.

Sheer incompetence on the part of the examining judge.

I certainly agree with your statement Aaron. It was however the photograph of the unfortunate homeless person in the Star. The man looked like "death warmed up". Well, I suppose the Star could have got him at his worst.

Yesterday's Sunday Star absolutely went to the final limit. It pounded and pushed a certain candidate for the U.S. Presidency. It carried article after article on his side. It made but few comments on his rival and certainly snide including the "W" colouring book about the departing President. It horselaughed ( My biased view) about the two wackos from Quebec and their phone calls to the lady running mate.

I have got it stored in my attic for posterity. One day, someone may unearth it. I paid for a massive promo of a political candidate- good for a great laugh however.

Cal2:

I'll take that as a 'no'.

"It was filthy. Mice droppings and dirty water oozing down into the cell"

could be a hotel room in Syria.

hey devin , hold your arms above your head for two hours. take them down, make a hand jesture and then insert and rotate on it.

no, there isnt much that I believe in our left wing propaganda media such as CBCpravda.

I wish Devin "What's with arms" Maxwell had taken Mahar's case.

"the"

It's about time the Americans started to put these goof balls in Ottawa in their place. We spend our time poking them in the eye with a stick and then want preferential treatment. I'm playing hockey in Montana this weekend and I'm going to tell my American buddies to keep up the good work.
p.s. I'm taking my passport and whatever else they want to see at the border.

Even if Arar was tortured, which I have some doubt about and even if he was innocent which I have some serious doubt about, I could find 100 Canadians who would voluntarily go through what Arar went through for the mere chance to win $1,000,000.00 let alone ten million. No one watches reality T.V.?

I DID follow the Arar case and the MSM refused to report the bad things Arar did .
First off he fled to canada as a Draft-Dodger from Syria to avoid Military service, but oddly enough he quickly applied for a Gun Permit just after the 14 Murders by Gamil Ghrabi who claimed he was on a mission for Allah.
The RCMp raided Arar's home and found data Disks and HardDrives hidden in the walls and attic , the MSM also failed to report Arar's attempt to smuggle a lapTop into canada which he then refused to give the Password to Customs for checking the content of the hard Drive .
Arar claimed he suffered the hardship and pain of being away from his family , but he himself rushed into a Marriage and quickly pumped out canadian babies to assure his Citizenship because canada always keeps people who come here just to have kids and claim their child is canadian,and oddly enough he left that family in canada and rented a second home near the Boston Airport which is the same Airport used for the 9/11 attack by Muslim Hijacker terror cells.
But Arar's own Website still posts his Lawsuit claim against JORDAN because that's where he was kidnapped by Arabs and tortured befor the bounty hunters drove him to Syria for a Military Trial as a Deserter and Draft-Dodger .

Here's the smoking gun , Arar claimed he was denied employment at an Islamic Charity in the USA because his name was smeared , and even Dr.Sheema Khan gave evidence of that during the Inquiry.
BUT , Dr.Khan tried to Sue 2 canadians that exposed CAIR's ties to Hamas and Hezballah via a bogus Islamic Charity in the USA .
The same Charity that Arar claimed he was supposed to get a job at , and Arar's second home
was also near a alleged Militant Mosque being watched by the FBI.
Mr.Nihad Awad was on a CTV interview to praise Arar for getting the $12 million for his Racial-profiling and Islamophobic treatment in canada.

So what's the connections?

Dr.Sheema Khan and Nihad Awad both work for the Saudi-Funded pro-Whahabi Sharia-law Charity wing in North America called CAIR/CAIR-canada.
CAIR was the group that helped Arar launch his $400'000'000.00 Lawsuit against canadians for what he asserted that Jordan caused , plus...many witnesses for Arar were linked to CAIR and it was CAIR that held the "Victory Dinner" for the Arar's which also had Mohammad Elmasry and the NDP MP's in the crowd .

Maher Arar was NOT deported to Syria , that is the big lie because the news archives show his original press meeting in Public on TV where this tortured man read a 15 minute detailed Script of every moment of his ordeal .
This was based on his assumption that he could Sue Jordan and Syria, but in late 2003 his cased was tossed out because the Judge was too smart to fall for the scam where Arar's Lawyer tried to apply canada's Charter Of Rights on Jordanian soil.
So in early 2004 that's when CAIR launched the $400 million dollar Suit against Canada , and the NDP jumped right in and even used Arar's Orthodox Pro-Sharia Law wife to run for them in Ottawa to win the Anti-USA/Israel district with a high Muslim population.

Basically , the weasel got caught during his Globe-trotting on a canadian passport and when he fled canada for Tunisia with his family he then had to flee Tunisia by himself , so he caught a flight to the JFK Airport near one of CAIR's offices but he was Flagged during the deplane stage and legally refused entry because of his Boston Mosque ties and Gun permit and because he flew by himself as a young/sunni/male/Syrian with a canadian passport.

If Arar was a true victim of Torture caused by canada, then he's pretty stupid to ask for $400 million in damages and then tell his lawyers to take the $10.0 million just as the O'Connor report comes out and exposes his ties to CAIR, Hamas,Hezballah,Bogus Charity,Border smuggling,Gun permit,Boston home,Militant Mosque , and the big issue where he refused to help canada expose Momin Khawaji who attended that smae Ottaw Mosque as the Arar's.

Now....tell me that if you were the Customs agaent in NY just after the 9/11 slaughter by Muslims that entered the USA by themselves as young/male/Muslims , what would you have done knowing that Arar only claimed he was to catch a Plane from JFK to get back to canada.
What would have happened if a terror cell was to meet on that Flight to canada but intended to Hijack it to return and hit another US target, or fly it into Toronto's Office towers once it was Hijacked over lake Ontario.

Muslims on suicide missions don't leave very much behind to arrest and bring into a Courtroom for a trial , and this is how Jihad gets away with it by crying "Innocent" when caught and alleging Torture while held.
Then if the mission is completed we hear groups like CAIR denounce these killers as not being true Muslims because they Hijacked their peaceful faith.

But they never actually denounce the Muslims doing the slaughters,only the acts of terrorism on Innocent Civilians.
In the Quran it was Muhammad who declared all non-Muslims as the enemies of Allah and ergo...not Innocent Civilians .

BTW, Sheema Khan dropped her lawsuits when a Judge was about to open her file to prove that CAIR canada DID sent 70% of their Donations to the USA CAIR that was funding Hamas and Hezballah based bogus Charities .
Khan insisted it was a lie until a Document surfaced that clearly showed he name a Signature on the Charity Status form as a Chapter of the USA's CAIR in Washingtion DC.

Arar never wanted a Court Trial because he would have to give evidence and we would see all the evidence, so the $400 million was just to scare canadians into giving him $10 million to shut him up and save millions more on a real trial that he would have lost.

Arar never subnmitted evidence of torture; although I am quite willing to believe the Syrian government does it. But it's business as usual in the middle east.

He certainly did win the lottery ticket. And I know personally that he was a millitant islamist; hated women; wouldn't eat in the cafateria because they were there. Look at his familly: women encloaked.

The precedent has been set. How can we possibly refuse to pay this new trio? This settlement made me physically ill, so I need to stop thinking about it. It's enough to make a person vote liberal, or Rhinoceros.

Its simple . We got buffaloed by a barbarian. With the help of a compromised Police Force. With legions of bleeding dhimmi lawyers, all trying to prove who was the most Liberal of them all. In the end of the tale, it was the tax payer who paid this Islamist with propaganda value added, to allow the ego's their moment in the socialist sun of the warm fuzzes.

Roger very much enjoyed your post THANKS!!

When Canada gets humped this badly by the first family of terrorism the least they could do is take us out for dinner and dancing.

"Ive never actually heard what "torture" Mr. Arar endured"

Endless episodes of CTV's The Pig and Whistle alternated with bloviating turdmeister Craig Oliver pontificating on all things Trudeaupian.

Anyone would crack under that regimen.

Cal2:

...and you called me an embarrassment.

Thanks Roger for your information. I am sure that you put quite a bit of effort into this.
I, as a Canadian citizen and immigrant feel only sadness. I cannot quite get angry enough and it would do little good.

Through this runs a thread. A certain sickness afoot in this good land. The seemingly perverse exagerated concern over "foolish gullible young men". The vagaries and twists and turn of the law. The stumbling and bumbling with technicalities.

Show them how nice we are etc. They must be laughing up their sleeves.

I think we're dealing with two separate issues here. The Arar case has a strong malodourous smell to it. No question. I have no problem with the U.S. applying the full extent of the law to him and anyone else they deem (un)fit.

But: at a time when the citizens of Germany can freely travel and work in France (one example among all the other European ones) - Germany and France being two countries that have fought many wars over the centuries - I don't understand why access is not getting easier rather than harder for the citizens of two friendly countries that share a continent. This has baffled me ever since I came to Canada 28 years ago and I still don't get it! Perhaps someone here can comment on it

devin.

you call yourself a lawyer.

and I call you an embarrassment.

seems we do speak the same language. even as Haligonians.

Roger at Nov. 3 07:31 PM. Can you give references for your info please? I have always suspected there was a rat in the corner but have never heard anything substantial before. Just went on gut feeling and healthy appearance of Arar as compared to W. Sampson after "torture".
Wasn't there a story of Arar meeting with a known suspect outdoors in the rain to avoid eves dropping?

George G:"I don't understand why access is not getting easier rather than harder for the citizens of two friendly countries"... The reason for this began with PM Diefenbaker who bashed the Americans to gain political support among the Left. It went on with Trudeau, who wasn't trusted by the American authorities because of his Nazi/Marxist beliefs and antics. Now anti-Americanism is part of the Liberal/Left value set.
It's only reasonable that the Americans do not expect us to be trustworthy.

Interesting post Roger.

The size and speed of the $10 million payoff, clearly indicates that not all the crooks are outside of the Cdn govt.

The leftist chickens are coming home to roost and crapping all over us.

As a taxpayer, I still feel victimized by the Arar settlement.

Cal2:

You seem to like trolling around the internet looking up things about people, maybe someday you'll have the balls to post your backward ideas under your real name...

Gunney99 - what you say makes a lot of sense. It's really sad. I'm a musician and the hoops I must go through to perform in the U.S. are incredible. I envy my European colleagues the freedom to move and work between countries (though I envy them very little else :-)

It’s about time the US woke up and started shutting down the Can/ US border. The liberal socialist society of Canada has no qualms about who enters this country and then exports to the US. Canada believes like all retarded liberals do that if you appease terrorists and individuals that hate you to the very core they will somehow “change” and learn to love you. The biggest ideology of these sick traitors to Canada is that they believe leaving Canada a free zone or safe haven for the terrorist, that they will not sh*t in their own backyard thus leaving Canada and Canadians alone while killing our friends to the south. Ah the liberal mind at work………..

On the other hand we don’t need the millions upon millions of third world illegal immigration that’s been flooding the American economy and society to continue filtering its way up here. By god we need to be vigilant and prevent the gettoization of Canada further, or we will indeed look like a south central LA slum in years to come. It’s already well underway. CLOSE THE BORDER!!!!!

Thanks for the thumbs-up responses , I followed the Hearings and read the Transcripts on the Government website where all the Dirt on the Arar's is printed on the record.

But as for CAIR, check out this website which also posts the articles for the 2 Canadians and a Radio Station that Sheema Khan tried to silence with a Lawsuit.
Take note of the Hamas ties for CAIR and the several members now in federal prisons for Terrorism funding via a Bogus Charity , and as for the Maher Arar Lawsuit against Jordan I will post it below as well so you can read it for yourself from Arar's own Website not mine.

http://www.anti-cair-net.org/

Arar's original claim that Jordan was at fault.

http://www.maherarar.ca/documentation.php

Just click on the Nov 2003 Document for Jordan , also scroll down to see how CAIR was right in there to get standing at the Inquiry .

BTW

here's the CAIR posting for the Arar's " Victory Dinner" sponsored by CAIR themselves , note how Harper had the brain to stay away from the Dinner since the guest included Mohammad Elmasry and Dr.Sheema Khan who both crusaded for Sharia law in canada.

*************************************************

Arar-Mazigh Dinner on Parliament Hill a Resounding Success
Tuesday, February 20, 2007 12:09 pm

(Ottawa, Canada – Feb 20, 2007) The February 14 Parliament Hill dinner in honour of Maher Arar and Monia Mazigh, organized by the Canadian Muslim Network and sponsored by CAIR-CAN, amongst other groups, was a resounding success. Despite the heavy snow fall, nearly every seat was occupied at the sold-out event, with participants arriving from as far as British Colombia.

The dinner was attended by over 40 MPs and senators from Canada’s four major political parties; including, most notably, party leaders Stéphane Dion, of the Liberals, Gilles Duceppe, of the Bloc, and *Jack Layton* , of the NDP.

The event also marked the launch of the Canadian Muslim Network Arar-Mazigh Scholarship, to be awarded to students making significant contributions in the fields of human rights and civil liberties. The scholarship will be offered and administered through the University of Ottawa, Faculty of Law. A total of $30, 000 was raised for the scholarship; the amount will also be matched by the government of Ontario.

A handful of individuals who were instrumental helping Maher and Monia throughout their ordeal were also acknowledged at the event. Some of those recognized included, Kerry Pither of the Maher Arar Support Committee, Alex Neve, Secretary General of Amnesty International Canada, CAIR-CAN’s Vice-chair Faisal Kutty, former CAIR-CAN Chair Dr. Sheema Khan and CAIR-CAN’s past Executive Director Riad Saloojee.

Most importantly, the Parliament Hill event marked a coming together of people, in recognition of Maher and Monia’s struggle - and their success.

SCHOLARSHIP DETAILS

Anyone wishing to contribute to the Arar-Mazigh Scholarship can make checks out to "University of Ottawa, Arar-Mazigh Scholarship." Checks can be mailed to:

Dr. Tyseer Aboulnasr
School of Information Technology and Engineering
University of Ottawa
800 King Edward Avenue
Ottawa, Ontario, K1N 6N5
*************************************************

How odd that the same Ottawa University that supplied many of the Inquiry witnesses for Arar's "Alleged" torture is the same University
that now benefits from the Settlement money......things that make you go ..hmmmmmmmm?.
Arar's wife worked for and Ran for the NDP in Ottawa under the reign of Jack Layton and Alexa McDonough , and that's why I not surprised at a Pro-hamas rally in Ottawa where the group boasted that Mazigh and NDP McDonough were in attendance .
Mazigh is of Palestinian background and a Orthodox Muslim that was anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage , this I found strange because the NDP almost had her sitting in Ottawa while her Husband was Suing canada for $400'000'000.00 and she would have had to vote for it in the Budget along with the whole NDP MP's .

What a scam that would have been for Layton and the NDP.

Oh... and here's CAIR's endorsement for Alexa McDonough and take note of the Antisemetic Canadian Islamic Congress Dr.Elmasry's group that defended him after he declared all israelis over 18 as valid targets for murder by suicide-bombers.
*************************************************

Canadian Muslim organizations salute Alexa McDonough for her contributions
Tuesday, June 03, 2008 5:24 pm

----FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE----

Canadian Muslim organizations salute Alexa McDonough for her contributions

(Ottawa, Canada – June 3, 2008) – The Canadian Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR-CAN) in partnership with the Canadian Muslim Network – a coordinating network of Muslim groups from across Canada – today paid tribute to the distinguished public service career of Alexa McDonough, MP for Halifax, for her tireless efforts on behalf of all Canadians.

As Member of Parliament since June 1997 and leader of the New Democratic Party from 1995-2003, McDonough has many ‘firsts’ to her name including being the first woman to lead a recognized political party in Canada, the first woman to win four consecutive federal terms in Nova Scotia and the only woman elected from among 32 MP’s in Atlantic Canada in the 39th federal election. With a history of activism stretching back to her early years, McDonough has supported and participated in dozens of advocacy and social action groups, human rights organizations, and professional associations.

“Alexa McDonough is an extraordinary Canadian whose tireless work on behalf of many noble causes, including her active and early involvement in the case of Maher Arar before it became fashionable, speaks volumes about her commitment to the universal principles of justice and equality for all,” said Abdul-Basit Khan, CAIR-CAN Chairman. He added that “McDonough is a shining example of individual commitment to Canadian values including respect for others, human rights, courage and perseverance to which all Canadians should aspire and we wish her continued success.”

“Canadians, especially those most vulnerable amongst us, owe Alexa McDonough an enormous debt of gratitude for helping make Canada a place where all people, irrespective of their political affiliation, race, ethnicity or faith traditions are afforded the same rights and obligations. Her numerous awards and accolades are a testament to her efforts to re-establish Canada as a civil liberties and human rights leader on the international stage – she will be sorely missed,” said Dr. Tyseer Aboulnasr, spokesperson for the Canadian Muslim Network.

Some organizations involved in the Canadian Muslim Network include:

Canadian Council of Imams
Canadian Council on American Islamic Relations (CAIR-CAN)

*Canadian Islamic Congress* (CIC)

Canadian Muslim Civil Liberties Association (CMCLA)
Canadian Muslim Forum (CMF)
Federation of Muslim Women
Islamic Society of Kingston
Islamic Society of Toronto
Islamic Supreme Council of Canada
Muslim Council of Montreal (MCM)
Ottawa Muslim Association
Young Muslims Canada

*************************************************

Arar never got a settlement for the guilt of what happened , it was his legal team that demanded $400 million and accepted the Out-Of-Court $10.0 Million to go away and save us Taxpayers another Air-India trial for $50 million+ with no one being blamed or convicted.