Both of those articles are hilarious. I particularly loved this:

"I’d heard rumors around the campaign of her photographic memory and, frankly, I watched it in action. She sees. She processes. She questions, and only then, she acts. What is often called her “confidence” is actually a rarity in national politics: I saw a woman who knows exactly who she is."

Genius.

In one year Sarah Palin will be back terrorizing Alaska until she loses her next state election. She'll then try to make a living on the right wing speaking circuit where she will begin to cake on make up to hide her withering youth.

How could Mcain be so stupid??

HOW????

Now were completely screwed because Osama is going to be sitting in the big chair next week all because of this nit wit.

slevin- Love her or hate her, she's a star. She won't be withering away. America won't let her.

No... we're completely screwed because nobody is bothering to look at the nutjob that Biden is... nobody is bothering to ask Obama anything of substance for fear of being labelled as a racist for daring to challenge the almighty.

America is caught up in a cult of personality. Unfortunately when the chips are down this "community organizer" who hasn't run so much as a lemonade stand is gonna fold like a house of cards. And I'll be there to say I told you so.

Yeah she's a real brainiac alright:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07kO9TtHYzQ&feature=bz302

nevermind all the politics, I take exception to the "...throwing together a canned tuna and pea casserole"

omg... even I'm more sophisticated than that and mix a little Kraft dinner into mine. Not the cheap stuff either, the special kind with the foil bags of cheese "product" and larger macaroni.

I'm sure Sarah Palin would, in many ways, rather be back in Alaska where she enjoys approval ratings usually reserved for dictators that murder anyone that dares "disapprove", than on the trail subjected to "down the nose" glares from faux intelligentsia. Her time as VP is going to be so much fun!!

The hatred of Democrats twwards Palin is so utterly charming.

Can't wait for years of triumphal hatred of half of America. It will be such a joy.

Right on, ChrisinMB! Bon appetit!

As Lafferty points out, if they only vote based on her abortion stand, the fems are basically stuck on stupid. And as Jeff points out...watch out Elaine!Just wondering why Lafferty waited until now to fiss the angry fems.

I'm waiting for some bozos to 're-act' to this.

Mr. Goldstein still rocks.

I think it was genius just to find someone with less experience than Obama that would be willing to run.

I have said it before and I will say it again. If McCain loses, the blame lies squarely at Palin's feet. Sure she energized a Republican voter base, but in doing so, she has managed to alienate most of the swing voters.

I agree with Frum, Noonan, Parker and all the other dissenters on this. Her populist nonsense is going to end up alienating the 'urban elite', business or otherwise, who fund the Republican party so that their taxes don't get out of hand. She's doing a hell of a job alienating anyone who isn't far right. That is a dangerous tactic when you rely on the same 'elite' to help you make decisions and get them implemented. People complain about entrenched bureaucrats, but frankly, most bureaucracies and civil services have a vetting process that Palin would never be able to pass through. Competitive exams and interviews are just two of the obstacles she would face. This is a lady who had to go to 4 universities with no entrance requirements to get a bachelors degree in a field that's about as brain-testing as art history. She can't offer a straight answer to a question without resorting to doggonit charm - which may work with the party faithful, but turns off anyone with half a brain. If she was running for the PTA, I would vote for her and her charm. Vice Presidency of the United States. Fuggedaboudit.

Anyone who has even a semblence of respect for that institution should worry about Palin. The President is supposed to be a leader, not a mirror image of Average Joe Six Pack, who, whatever his merits, is not fit to run a country as powerful as the US. Most of the unelected, and quite a few of the elected/appointed highers ups in the US government are Ivy League educated. They are the last hope if Palin ever becomes President. Will she listen to them? She's having a hard time listening to the McCain camp. She is a maverick, alright, but Mavericks come in two categories - good. And bad. And she is very much one of the latter. The change she promises will divide America like never before. She is turning the party into a rural white folks populist party. That will go down well with some of the folk at SDA, who qualify as rural white folk. But how seriously can you take a group that sees nothing wrong with government subsidies to keep them floating, while railing against social welfare-ism?

She is ready to sink McCain's campaign to position herself for a 2012 campaign. Without McCain, she would just be some Alaskan governor, who would probably be out of office after one term - troopergate. Frankly, if she was a man, would she have won the nomination? Probably not. When was the last time you heard of an under-educated Alaskan governor being considered?

Now she stabs McCain in the back. The irony of it all was watching Rove talk about negative personal coming out of the Palin and McCain camps. Rove was responsible for calling McCain the "fag candidate", and charging him with a child out of wedlock - two issues that have turned the hard right against McCain completely. The same hard right he had to cater to by appointing this very average and ordinary person to an extraordinary office.

I don't like Obama. He is too far to the left. McCain is ideal - close to center and fairly pragmatic. But if McCain goes, the country will shift too far to the right. Too much emphasis on rural white folk - it does not bode well for the Republicans in a country that has urban and colored folk. The 'Hussein' issue hasn't alienated just Arabs or Muslims. Its alienated everyone who isn't white.

That's exactly right, cal2.

Have we ever seen such a concerted effort to stomp a person into the ground?

The strangest of all is the fact so many Liberals here in Canada are all excited about Obama of platitudes without a flipping clue beyond optics.
He'll not be a friend to Canada if he acts on all his socialist rhetoric. Free trade anyone?

To a large extent, Sarah Palin brought this misogynistic abuse upon herself. At the Republican Convention she clearly told Washington and the Media she was not interested in their favour or blessing.

A brilliant tactical move. By responding to her challenge and throwing the vilest of personal excrement in her direction, they have demonstrated how incestuous and inbred their own DC lifestyle has become.

If they had stuck to leadership issues,a la the CPC attacks on Dion, they had to admit she had far more executive experience than Obama. So they went after personal and family issues, and only destoyed themselves in the process.

Whoever wins on Nov 4th, Sarah is now the defacto head of the Republican Party.

If she returns to Alaska, she is still the most popular politician in America.

To a large extent, Sarah Palin brought this misogynistic abuse upon herself. At the Republican Convention she clearly told Washington and the Media she was not interested in their favour or blessing.

A brilliant tactical move. By responding to her challenge and throwing the vilest of personal excrement in her direction, they have demonstrated how incestuous and inbred their own DC lifestyle has become.

If they had stuck to leadership issues,a la the CPC attacks on Dion, they had to admit she had far more executive experience than Obama. So they went after personal and family issues, and only destoyed themselves in the process.

Whoever wins on Nov 4th, Sarah is now the defacto head of the Republican Party.

If she returns to Alaska, she is still the most popular politician in America. And on Jan 26th, she will get name Ted Stevens senatorial replacement. Lets see....Todd Palin or Joe the Plumber, LOL.

I am new to the Blogging Tories and this posting just about put me off coming back to it. During the election I read comments from liberals who wrote nothing but sarcastic remarks about Stephen Harper. On these blogs they were blasted, and righty so, for their vitrol and sarcasm. Kate's posting here is exactly the same, but I guess it is okay to do the same thing we condemn. Come on people, show some class and not dive into the gutter.
Disgusted.

I recently saw an interview between her and a guy named Sean Hannity (sp?) with Fox News backstage at an appearance she was making. She knows exactly where she comes from and what she's doing - she is severely underestimated - and she knows this - which is a big strategic advantage. She has shown the toughness and character to come back from questionable interviews and has shown calmness and clarity in the big 2008 election storm (she did very well in the VP debate and she came across with class on SNL - and probably converted most of the cast).

I've lived the life Sarah Palin lived, to a large extent. I've got news for those big city blowhards -- Sarah Palin can easily step into your shoes, but if you tried to step into hers, you wouldn't last a week.

"How could Mcain be so stupid??"

The pretentiousness of armchair pundits is breathtaking.

The presumption that the citizenry does not grasp that this election is about degrees of freedom, not about specific policies or personalities, is insulting.

"I think it was genius just to find someone with less experience than Obama that would be willing to run."
Less experience? She's run a State. Obama was a "community organizer". If that's a key qualifier then they should have gone with Louis Riel.

Intrepid - did you perchance, click the link provided?

"The hatred of Democrats towards Palin is so utterly charming."

She's an archetype. A shiny object.

The hatred is actually towards half of America. The half that opposes the radical anarchists. The socialists. The feminazis. The seething haters attached to a pen.

She's just drawing the fire.

I think the rest know that the bile is aimed at them all.

And it's being recorded.

Intrepid, I don't think you understood the post. Did you read the original article that was linked?

David Frum has broken down and needs to stand in line at some medical facility in Canada. The problem seems to be that he has Stephen Harper Fever, otherwise known as Milquetoast Conservatism. If you'll take him back, we'll throw in Peggy Noonan.

David Frum has broken down and needs to stand in line at some medical facility in Canada. The problem seems to be that he has Stephen Harper Fever, otherwise known as Milquetoast Conservatism. If you'll take him back, we'll throw in Peggy Noonan.

For the sin of being a Christian personally opposed to abortion, Palin is being pilloried by the inside-the-Beltway Democrat feminist establishment.

I appreciate the honesty that Ms. Lafferty displays with this comment because this is what the real issue is. Had Governor Palin not been a Christian with the corresponding pro-life views, she would not be subjected to the same kind of criticism. Had a woman similar to Governor Palin except in those two areas been the VP nominee, that woman may not have had any more supporters from the leftist MSM, but the vicious, biting edge that accompanies the current criticism would have been gone.

Now, I also have a thought about the intelligence question. I am do not think that Governor Palin is an erudite thinker. However, that level of intelligence is often not necessary (or good) for political office. The level of intelligence required for the job is that of a high level manager of a large company - an executive. It certainly requires an above average level of intelligence - one which can be used to advantage to assemble a qualified policy team. Some members of that team may be more erudite - they belong with policy formation and, perhaps, policy implementation. I have no doubt that Governor Palin is sufficiently qualified for the job as far as intelligence goes. Experience is another matter, but if experience is an issue, there is an even larger problem with Obama.

Listen, honey. Feminism has a job to do. You don’t have to fall in love. Just fall in line.

Finally, one of the biggest contradictions from the link is this comment "Just fall in line." Here we have a woman blasting Palin for supposed lack of intelligence and suggesting that the remedy is to "fall in line". We normally associate intelligence with the ability to probe other ideas and crtique them for their problems and offer an alternative solution. Soooo..... the Governor is criticised for a lack of intelligence and the prescribed remedy is to become a pseudo-robot and then she can properly called intelligent? Hmmmmmmm. And Palin is the one lacking intelligence??

crtique = critique

and then she can properly BE called intelligent?

Intrepid, the page that Kate links to is a humour page. The commentary is halved, at least from what I can tell between real commentary and a sarcastic ripping of the attitude of "progressive" America toward women that hold conservative views.

Well I believe the media when they say "Palin is not very smrt". I mean they told me that Dion was smrt.... Oh wait

Best comment from the link, J Howard says:

"Sadly, I’ve seen my fill of candidate speechifying. Of the four of them, Palin is easily the fastest, most perspectived thinker of the bunch.

This woman is bright. That is why she connects. Well, that and the honesty.

Biden is a loud tape loop of gaffes and DC insider doubletalk. McCain is a terrible debater but gets in the occasional lick (and actually really rocks doing comedy, oddly). Obama is turgid, halting, probably too busy checking his lies file, ala Clinton, to make much sense, although Bill could charm the birds out of the trees.

But Palin gets it, speaks in real time, processes right now, and just doesn’t lose a point. All this talk questioning her mind is the single most bigoted thing in this cycle.

The left hates them some stereotypes — they’re the real-world version of SNL losing it’s ass trying to rap at Palin while she sat right there, smiling, having them on without saying a word.

Brains and class. No real idea what she has in terms of policy, but what’s that got to do with running for the presidency, anyway. Just ask the other side."

J Howard tears off the media blinders with a bolt of lightening.

"Sarahcuda the ImPalinator" will continue to 'rip them all a new suit'.

The clothes budget nonsense was just a detractor from the real issues. The Obama-Nation(tm) may just find itself Biden time.

Cheers

Hans-Christian Georg Rupprecht, Commander in Chief

Frankenstein Battalion
2nd Squadron: Ulanen-(Lancers) Regiment Großherzog Friedrich von Baden(Rheinisches) Nr.7(Saarbrucken)
Knecht Rupprecht Division
Hans Corps
1st Saint Nicolaas Army
Army Group “True North”

The USA has never been so divided. The Republican party has never been so divided. A candidate and their running mate have never been so divided.

If Osama wins, look forward to civil strife like we've not seen since the civil war. The rurals and the WWF-F150 crowd will be hunting a new prey with their Enfeilds. Violence will erupt, there's no question.

If Mcain wins look forward to unimaginable disarray and a breakdown of communication among the political and economic strata of the country. Violence will erupt, there's no question.

Heaven help us.

I just saw Governor Palins speech on energy.
To those who think this person has no smarts, watch this speech, then give yourself a slap.

I meant less experience in time only. I think the chosen one has one more year of experience in gubmint ( thats government in chicago ebonics)

his voting record is only outranked by Borat Dion in terms of running away from issues. voting present instead of yay or nay doesnt qualify him for anything except a way of skirting the issues.

so when it comes to skirt ,I'll pick Palins type over Barry Hussein anyday.

Dim, is that a personal nickname related to the brightness of your bulb?

I'm a lesbian feminist supporting McCain/Palin. One could hardly call me far right wing, yet I am definitely a conservative.

I would take the opinion of a woman who has interacted with Sarah Palin (and one who is an avowed Democrat) as having far greater weight than that of SNL characters or far left members of _The View_.

Just wait until Obama is president, then gets whacked by some nut job and Biden ends up as President. God Bless America?

Biden as prez. cool, one guy where his brain neurons appear to be fired by a random number generator.

I would suggest that SP is smarter than all of the others when it comes to the real issues of normal day Americans. Of the 3 other candidates ever had a life outside of the government, participated in the PTA, had any dealings in running a town as a member or mayor, had a business, had 5 kids to deal with, had a spouse that had to work for a living. This was not handed down from the elite. This kind of life was earned the hard way, where every dollar counted and earned, scrimped, saved and spent for the betterment of their own family, extended family and the lifestyle of their choice. This family did not suceede as they did by not having any brains or work ethic. Look at the other 3 and follow the money.

To the people saying Palin has no experience, I was given this analogy from a friend:

Obama has fewer days logged into the senate than a second grade child is required to have in order to pass into the third grade.
If we count executive experience between Obama and Palin, keeping in mind that we are focusing on a Presidential candidate and a VP candidate (generally the two are not compared, its Pres to Pres and VP to VP), Palin is already in Jr. High to Obama's (midway) through second grade. The easiest way to tell that Palin is in Jr. High and Obama is still stuck in Second grade: Palin is criticized harshly for superficial reasons (her clothes? C'mon, how much has the democrat party spent on their boy's suits?) by the other girls who dont like her being popular, and Obama can still just stand up in front of the class and talk for a few minutes and get applause.

What SP brings out is the very divided nature of society right now. I suspect that the Obamaites would have hated her regardless because of her politics but the views of republicans and media elitist are more interesting.

They willfully avoid objectively looking at any of her positives - energy knowledge, popular governorship, pipeline deal, confronting corruption within her own party and her adherence to conservative principles. They also refuse to deeply examine her popularity by instead claiming it is all about looks and pandering to the masses anti-intellectual biases.

More disturbing is their view that it is not just her biggest problem but the main faults of anyone that is of a similar station. More and more often you hear the upper crust musing about how these darned average people are hurting democracy by voting incorrectly. They increasingly equate the middle class as middle classless - an unenlightened, under-educated, non-conforming threat. It seems that this disdain for Joe Six Pack is turning into contempt. And once you feel contempt for someone, you can treat them horribly without feeling any guilt or shame. Her opponents have surely been displaying this contempt in their articles and attitudes.

Merie Underwood said- would suggest that SP is smarter than all of the others when it comes to the real issues of normal day Americans. Of the 3 other candidates ever had a life outside of the government, participated in the PTA, had any dealings in running a town as a member or mayor, had a business, had 5 kids to deal with, had a spouse that had to work for a living. This was not handed down from the elite. This kind of life was earned the hard way, where every dollar counted and earned, scrimped, saved and spent for the betterment of their own family, extended family and the lifestyle of their choice. This family did not suceede as they did by not having any brains or work ethic. Look at the other 3 and follow the money. "

If you think that Obama had this "handed down from the elite" than you have no knowledge of Obama. Agree with his policies or not, fine, but to say he doesnt know how real people live is just showing you know nothing of the candidate.

Soccmom:

Name-calling and character assassination is what passes for intelligent discourse with the utopian totalitarians.

It's part of the dehumanizing process, designed to sow doubt into an individual's sense of worth.

Not a new tactic, but since most intelligent people are catching on to the tactic, it becomes shriller and shriller.

I take it as a sign of their weakness, not their strength.

Why is it assumed that only males have the brains?
Sarah Palin and a lot of other women are far smarter than any of those old geezers in the Senate.
One guy is 90 and head of a committe and they say that McCain is too old. Give me a break. Between the 2 of them they could very well be the best team that the USA ever elected. Why are the University students from Saskatoon and Regina going to the States to help Obama? Did the Americans come up here and interfere in our elections? Probably the "far left professors" encouraging such behavior.

Dim,

"The change she promises will divide America like never before."

Are you certain about about that? After all George has already set the bar on that issue at a pretty high level. Remember she is only going to be the VP and not the President.

Turden.
That you have made sport of a child born with a disability speaks volumes to your intelligence and morals.

Reading most of the pointless and irrational comments about Sarah Palin from Canadian "liberals" on this site or any other reminds me of just how "unimportant" and "irrelevant" socialist Canada has become.

America remains the worlds superpower and the mentally ill political left is terrified of a female conservative being elected to the position of Vice President.

Get used to it. And don't believe the polls.

Durden

I dont care what your political views are.
I have seen some very stupid comments on this site but you have managed to surpass all of them.

Get used to it. And don't believe the polls.
Posted by: Brad at October 29, 2008 2:09 PM

I hope you're right Brad. I'm not optimistic.

Pissed off? No, who can get pissed off at individual that makes such a statement, seems pretty revealing. Pity for such a person would be a more approriate emotion.

Pissed off? No, who can get pissed off at individual that makes such a statement, seems pretty revealing. Pity for such a person would be a more approriate emotion.

I recall being appalled when someone mentioned Appollonian dispair in the poetry of Sara Teasdale, and Palin simply looked at them with a blank expression on her face.

I asked myself, could Americans possibly thinking of electing this woman as Vice President?

Later I blanched as I watched her order a domestic chablis. It was all I could do to keep from laughing out loud.

Although she apparently had read Keats, she couldn't tell whether one poem was written by Keats or Shelley. My extreme misgivings about her potential to operate as Vice President continued to grow.

I was aghast to discover that she had never read Kant's Critique on Pure Reason and even had the effrontery to mention that she knows how to change a tire.

This whole thing is just absolutely ghastly.

Any remaining confidence I had was thoroughly shattered when I mentioned a real zinger from Remembrance of Things Past by Marcel Proust, and it apparently went completely over her head.

My God. What have we come to?

Pissed off? No, who can get pissed off at individual that makes such a statement, seems pretty revealing. Pity for such a person would be a more approriate emotion.

Pissed off? No, who can get pissed off at individual that makes such a statement, seems pretty revealing. Pity for such a person would be a more approriate emotion.

Exactly soccermom. Palin being normal really does excite and threaten these people.

^^^^
If "normal" matches your expectation for a possible leader of the free world then IMHO you have set the bar way too low

I would never vote for a Republican but I really do like Sarah Palin. She makes all the other rightie and leftie politicians look like a bunch of blathering nitwits.

Time magazine should make her Man of the Year!

Shooting moose from an airplane...it doesn't get any better than that.

[no sarcasm whatsoever]

Sarah Palin is a breath of fresh air. She must be a truly remarkable human being based on one observation: the ankle-biting, frothing at the mouth, hateful, death-worshipping dhimmi leftists all hate her with a passion worthy of Lucifer (Saul Alinksy's dedicatee).

^^^^ ConGris
Then what is she when members of her own party don't like her and find her unqualified?

Does this make her even more remarkable?

If I was to discuss and issue with someone and my only rebuttal is that someone is "stupid", I'm pretty sure my argument would be considered juvenile by most.

This "stupid" argument has been used on GWB for 8 yrs, so it should be no surprise that this tactic is being employed again. Calling someone else "stupid" appeals to many people who feel their income doesn't compensate them adequately for their investment in education. There is a segment in society who feel that "education" should be the measure for income, regardless of the actual value the market dictates for their contribution. (The best advice I received in manager training is to put the resumes of University students and grads to the back of the pile)

So as I said, there shouldn't be any surprise that this haughty group of people default to this tactic.

"My God. What have we come to?" Greg in Dallas, Teasdale, Keats and Kant? I thought y'all only read Louis L'Amour and Zane Grey. (us ex-Houstonians can say that about Dallas)

Seriously, I have never seen such a vile slag of someone in my life. The pure hatred that is coming out you'd think Gov Palin was the anti-Christ or something. The rants coming out are more in keeping with a Venezuela dictator. It looks like lefties can't imagine a woman who is a true conservitive and Republicans can't imagine someone running that isn't part of the inner Washington sanctum. There seems to be a different set of standards used here. Everyone is busy comparing Palin to Obama when she should be compared to Botox Biden.

georgemchimpybush had higher marks than John Kerry, a fact seldomly reported in the MSM.

but closer to home, Borat Dion , Iggy , and Boob Rae are all academics spending their formative years in the seclusion of the ivory towers, looking down and feeling great sympathy and hoping to give direction to the unwashed hoipolloi.

RofC

What you leftards (get it?) fail to understand is that the rest of us do not prescribe to your definition of who is "smart" or "qualified" ect. Anyone who went to University in a credible subject understands that when they get out of school the learning begins. University is a means to an end, and that end is to be successful. There are many paths to success, and success is the criteria that most people to measure someone's qualifications or smarts.

(When a woman asks me if I know what sexy is, I say "no, but I bet I can count the up the change in your purse really fast.")
Kanye West (The College Drop-out)

To add to my other comment, does anyone else see the irony of MSM journalists and actors accusing anyone of being "stupid". Next we'll have dwarfs calling SP short-sighted.

Yeah, it sure is fun watching and listening to these yapping tire biting left wing idiots repeat themselves time and time again, must have gotten their teeth caught in one of the tires.

There are many paths to success, and success is the criteria that most people *use* to measure someone's qualifications or smarts.

fixed

Well Indiana

I do not agree with your views of what post secondary education is. I see it as a sign that one has the ability to learn and also the ability to sacrifice for a time period to achieve something that will bring a delayed gratification. I also value real world experience but Mrs. palin shows a poor depth of knowledge I dont think I would use the words stupid to describe her but if I can use a term the right is using "she is just like ordinary people"

Do you feel that other Republcans that agree with me are "leftards" too?

I put resumes with degrees at the top of my pile if you want to put them on the bottom feel free.

Yeah right, West Candian the Republibots have never repeated themselves time and time again.

Watch Faux news and play the Republibots talking point drinking game. You will need a new liver.

Glass houses my friend glass houses.

"Dim, is that a personal nickname related to the brightness of your bulb?"

A lot of people here classify feminists, usually leftist feminists, as being angry and malicious. The above statement lends credibility to these allegations.

A lot of feminists are supporting Palin ONLY because she is a woman. All is fair in love and politics. I don't have any objection to Palin in the context of the message she sends to feminists. Lynn de Rothschild is supporting her too, despite being a lifelong Democrat. And I am as aware as anyone that women employed by the Obama camp get only 83% of what men doing the same job make. This alone would make me vote for Palin, particularly if I were a feminist. Of course, it is hard to believe that she would have been a veep candidate if she were a man with the same qualifications and credentials.

My objection to her rests primarily on her usage of decidedly leftist tactics - all this populist Joe Six Pack small town values nonsense. Only 20% of Americans live in Small towns. The whole 'Hussein' issue was a new low. Powell put it best, I think,

"Is there something wrong with being a Muslim in this country? The answer's no, that's not America," Powell said. "Is there something wrong with some 7-year-old Muslim-American kid believing that he or she could be president?""

That is not what the hard right Palin brand of Republican Party-ism is about. Division and populism - preying on people's fears and prejudices. That is what they are about. All their hard-right supporters on this board will tell you that there is something wrong with some 7-year-old Muslim-American kid believing that he or she could be president.

Then there are the rest of us. The moderate right who believe America is the Land of the Opportunity for everyone.

"Are you certain about about that? After all George has already set the bar on that issue at a pretty high level."

Dubya divided it between North and South (more or less). Palin is dividing it between 'elite' and average. The latter is exploited by the former. Sound like the communist manifesto yet? For all his flaws, Dubya did go to an Ivy League school. Those schools have many flaws, but they do impart an important training in leadership and responsibility. Being a leader, and behaving like one is ingrained as a part of being in one of those institutions. This is an element of going to Ivy League schools that is often overlooked. It is vetting and learning process- it is why Ivy Leaguers succeed after graduating and leaving the ivory towers for the real world. Palin hasn't been through this, quite possibly because she never tried. The schools she attended have no entrance standards. She could have made an effort to go to a good non-ivy league school - and there are many of those in the US - the NYU's, the Southern Methodist Us, etc. She didn't. The other candidates always made the effort to prepare themselves for office before running. She hasn't.

We don't know if she respects her advisors. She certainly doesn't respect McCain's advisors. In fact, shes ready to stab him in the back for her own agenda. What if she fills the cabinet with under-educated folksy folk like herself? Do you want the world's most powerful country run by average Joes?

cal2, you forgot Harper. He did a masters degree, too.

Indiana:

There may be hope after all.

ROC just allowed you to prioritize applications in any way you see fit.

Don't you feel priviledged?

BTW, the school of hard knocks is a much better teacher than any pinhead lefty university professor, who couldn't get a job anywhere in the real world.

ChrisinM siad: "nevermind all the politics, I take exception to the "...throwing together a canned tuna and pea casserole. omg... even I'm more sophisticated than that and mix a little Kraft dinner into mine. Not the cheap stuff either, the special kind with the foil bags of cheese "product" and larger macaroni. "

You betcha, and down heya in North Louisi-Yana we normally add French-Cut String Beans and a can of that there Campbell's Cream of Asparagus, and in an emergency you can substitute baked dolphin, or chicken parts for the canned tuna.

Back to the Topic, the Democrats and the Media don't give a Ratt's arse who was appointed to the VP slot they were instructed to Search out and Destroy,and the link Kate provided proves my point.

I put resumes with degrees in the middle of the pile. I've had good and bad experiences. Personally I look for high 'I' numbers on resumes. That's a person who has a very strong sense of personal identity.

Set You free

I am so glad that you are accepting my opinion it means soooo much to me.

I would also guess you have never sat in front of a lefty prof to make this opinion.

Education trains you to not generalize on baseless opinion and use facts. I fail to see that from you.

@ Texas Canuck with "Botox Biden" LOL! I thought only John McCain was getting the ageism jokes.

Jimmy Kimmel Live!

● Sen. Robert Byrd was in Charleston, W.Va., at a rally for Joe Biden. He got a little confused about which office Biden is running for when he introduced him as “the next president — Joe Biden!” Somebody slipped some gin in Grandpa’s cod liver oil.

Cheers

ROC:

Which one of those accusations are you hoping will stick?

Try again.

BTW, my remarks were addressed to Indiana, so shut the f**k up.

Indiana-"This "stupid" argument has been used on GWB for 8 yrs, so it should be no surprise that this tactic is being employed again"

It is a connect the dots campaign. The dems have been saying "GWB is stupid and look at the results now they are saying Palin is too. Do you want more of the same (hidden meaning for stupid)?". That is the question they are asking voters.

The message is working no matter what "real" americans think.

If there was a real world experienced economist with a proven track record I would probably vote for them but I dont see one on the ballot.
Personally I would put my faith in Romney with an economic crisis.

Squeel squeel squeel r of c

RoC

We agree "I see it as a sign that one has the ability to learn and also the ability to sacrifice for a time period to achieve something that will bring a delayed gratification." but that gratification doesn't necessarily mean $$. The market will decide what value someone has in the workforce. If you've played "The Game of Life" board game you'd know that you have a choice to go to college or go straight to work. There is often " delayed gratification" if the chosen field is in high demand, but sometimes the "graduate" CHOOSES a field that isn't in demand, and they get paid accordingly.

WRT resumes, your statement leads me to believe you don't speak from experience. It goes without saying that if a jobs prerequisite is a degree, then you will require a degree; but, in the case where the degree isn't required, it is common anecdotal thought that an employee with a degree will be less loyal and have a haughty attitude toward work that they feel is beneath them.

Once again you ass.u.me. that if someone didn't attend an institution that YOU feel is suitable, then they are less intelligent or "normal". A University degree is not a sign of intelligence, it is recognition of a completed task, a task that has no tangible value on its own.( I have a degree)

"an employee with a degree will be less loyal and have a haughty attitude toward work that they feel is beneath them."

This statement magnifies the difference of philosophy between "normal people" and "elites". Normal people of all economic stations respect and value the work done by all: including janitors, handy-men, plumbers, entrepreneurs, engineers ect; whereas, elites feel that the aforementioned jobs are necessary, but are to be done by less educated or stupid people. These elites also feel that there is injustice in a world where a janitor makes way more money than a social worker, after all "he's only a janitor" and I'm educated.

The ultimate failure of elite people is their denial of the fact that the system they support is UNSUSTAINABLE, but in the spirit of liberalism F'ck everyone else, even those not born yet, as long as I get what I want, you can go to h*ll.

Is this what Set You Free brings to the conversation. He tells people to "shut the F up"

Thanks for making my point,of you not having an educational background easier. If you dont have a degree how can you compare real world to a left prof?

I know you are known for always having the last word so I am sure this isnt the last I will hear from your opinion based on no life experience on the subject.

Indiana-well said I agree with a lot of your previous post

"It goes without saying that if a jobs prerequisite is a degree,"

should say:

It goes without saying that if a *job's* prerequisite is a degree,

"...Dubya did go to an Ivy League school. Those schools have many flaws, but they do impart an important training in leadership and responsibility..."

Where, pray tell, did Ronald Reagan go to school? Eureka College..NOT an Ivy League school! Damn, he must have been a terrible president!

Dim, indeed. And a "classist" or "elitist", too.

I think that there is a much greater chance that O will be assasinated in office than McCain dies and then we get Biden as president. Now, to me is way scarier than O as president.

Kinda makes the "Palin is a heartbeat away from the presidency" argument pale in comparison.

Horny Toad

I take substantial exception to comments about higher education. College is important and certainly a resume filter these days. So, one must attend. On the other hand, I have a similar college record to Sarah because of career-related relocations and because it was necessary to go to work right out of high school. That education is sufficient to manage a billion dollar budget, hundreds of thousands of assets daily while also envisioning and implementing strategies for my industry as a whole. Plus, being a woman of Scots-Irish descent, NASCAR is a genetic imperative. Do NOT underestimate Americans, no matter their education, economic situation or sports preferences. The only thing that holds us back is the ease of life in this country which leads some to abject complacency.

The Ivy League is over-rated. It is a well known fact that admission is not merit based. Legacy and minority status play a much larger role than SAT's or being a valedictorian. The Ivy League degree is merely a status symbol of the well-to-do and well-connected and not proof positive of merit or higher intelligence. They graduates may be better than average but not necessarily. People must still need to be judged on their actions and not simply on their education or family pedigree.

http://www.reason.com/news/show/123910.html

Beyond that, the elitists concept of who is acceptable gets narrower and narrower. Candidates must now have the right degree, from the right university, live in the proper locales and know the right people.....In the end they seem to be seeking to define this in a way that will exclude the majority of Americans and ignoring the other roles and actions that show leadership potential. Those with on-the-job and real life success need not apply. In the elitists world, Powell's "Is there something wrong with some 7-year-old Muslim-American kid believing that he or she could be president?" becomes pointless since the elitist attitude would have already excluded him with their growing lists of must-have's.

RoC and Dim: I disagree that an 'Ivy League' school imparts any specific abilities of critical thought, or any specific abilities in leadership or responsibility. Those who succeed from these schools are often successes because of their networked alliances, via their parents, in Washington and New York. In many cases, they would never have made it on the basis of their own merit.

I also disagree that going to university means that the individual has the ability to 'sacrifice for a time period' and learn 'delayed gratification'. To the contrary, it often means four to seven more years of non-participation in the rigours and problems of the work force.

By this I mean the rigours of having to be at work rather than skipping classes; of having to achieve accountable work results rather than handing in sloppy and 'half-assed' work; of having to save every penny rather than living off your parents or the govt loans.

I totally disagree that a university education provides any abilities to be a leader, to be a president. Oh, I have four degrees..

Oh, and if someone's resume is filled with the pronoun 'I', then I'm concerned that this individual's self-absorption might tend to narcissism. We have our own example in Jean Chretien, whose narcissism and constant selfpraise is famous. Obama is another example, having already written two autobiographies.

What makes a good leader of a nation? Three areas might be focused on. First is the individual's innate capacity to think in a critical and logical manner, which enables one to see past the immediate and to see the infrastructure. Then, the knowledge base, which includes a knowledge of history and economics, which most certainly need not come from university and is a continuous learning process. And psychologically, a deep sense of humility, or, lack of arrogance and self-absorption.

I don't see what any of these three characteristics have to do with a university education.

"Then what is she when members of her own party don't like her and find her unqualified?

You mean like, Puma?

Why has neither Harvard or Columbia released Obama's records? If a guy is applying for a job, shouldn't the employer have his CV?

More and more subterfuge. This guy is basking in the dark.

Horney Toad

I think that talk of the O being assassinated has always been poor satire thanks to Eddie Murphy. It ain't going to happen.

I do think that Sarah Palin is a much more likely candidate for an assassination attempt if she becomes veep(or not). Too many people have too much to lose if she is successful(world wide).JMO

NOTICE

If you people cannot figure out how not to respond to troll comments, I swear to God I will turn them off for good.

I hope the bold print isn't directed at me. If so, please have mercy if I am unwittingly feeding trolls, I didn't attend an Ivy league school, so I may not have the smarts to discriminate the difference between feeding trolls and engaging in constructive convo.

RoC

WRT "stupid" GWB & SP I have noticed an inconsistency in this analysis. It seems to me that people who think GWB is stupid, are the same people who think GWB is some kind of Evil Doctor who has freak'n sharks with freak'n lasers on their heads.

lynnh

"In the elitists world, Powell's "Is there something wrong with some 7-year-old Muslim-American kid believing that he or she could be president?" becomes pointless since the elitist attitude would have already excluded him with their growing lists of must-have's."

ditto

ET

"I also disagree that going to university means that the individual has the ability to 'sacrifice for a time period' and learn 'delayed gratification'. To the contrary, it often means four to seven more years of non-participation in the rigours and problems of the work force."

Good point. In school I had one instructor in a graphics class that marked assignments with a "check" or a "r" for re-do. A check got 100% and the re-do got 50% after it was brought up to standard. If the re-do wasn't fixed properly then a zero followed. This may seem harsh, but his reasoning was that no client will accept work that is only 70% accurate. It's 100% or nothing, that's life.

Indiana:

Dubya has an IQ of 132 or thereabouts.

That's a fact.

I'm sure that's higher than 99% of his critics.

On the other hand, I agree with you that there is a difference in being intelligent and being smart.

I luv me some Bush.

Probably the truth of the matter is, she is more or less a normal person in a world of politics dominated by over-achieving lawyers and career politicians whose main survival instinct is to stay ahead of the curve of public opinion a little faster than Joe Q. Public. Politics is not generally the domain of global thinkers who see a general problem and conceive a general solution to that problem (as with Palin's track record of cutting through layers of expensive orthodoxy in the politics of her state).

America would be lucky to have the chance to see this kind of change, but it seems like the other kind (revolution) is now the preferred option of the majority, so unleash the whirlwind. And lead the huskies back to their kennels.

On second thought, I hope I'm not the troll.

I have seldom seen anyone treated so badly and viciously by the media as Governor Palin. I've been trying to figure out what this reveals about us. Surely, it would have sufficed to criticize her views and actions? But her appearance? Her husband? Her daughter? Her wardrobe? Her glasses. If she was such a dimwit, why was it necessary to vilify her on such points? What was her sin? She was authentic. She was attractive and she was female--not a male version of a woman which seems to be the disguise that women striving for public office tend to adopt. (Hillary almost wept on TV. Quelle horreur! Immediate disqualification for the nomination.) I have some doubts about Palin's suitability for VP but I don't think she has deserved the horrible treatment meted out to her by the press. This reveals something pretty sick at the bottom of society.

what the hell is wrong with a normal person running for office?

No Homez, you're just wasting my bandwidth with off topic crap. The troll comment I refer to was a vicious "joke" based on Sarah Palin's Down Syndrome baby. But more irritating are those who have to chime in afterwards, thereby creating six times as much work to clean up the thread as there would have been had the stupidity been ignored.

If you are a feminist, you are a Marxist. And if you are a Marxist, you are not a conservative.

Feminism does not and cannot exist outside the hothouse of Marxism. Speaking of which, I am *loving* how Obamamania has had the pleasant side effect of mainstreaming the epithet "Marxist", a shoe that fits not a few these days and it's time we called them on it.

Ladies. I know what you're thinking. "Im'onna ride out this war on white males thing for a bit, see if I can get me some of the spoils." What happened to Hillary and what is happening to Palin should make you rethink the wisdom of that game plan.

Texas Canuck,
sometimes when I'm feeling cosmopolitan, I read Mickey Spillane. ;-)

Being a Houstonian is like being a member of the Marine Corps. You're never an ex; you're always a Houstonian. You're always welcome.

Well, naturally it is obvious that this insistence on ivy league credentials is simply about status and social class. I presume that once one has gone to the trouble to acquire one of these degrees, one's self-esteem could be reduced if they thought a graduate from a mere state university could rival them in intelligence.

It's all utter nonsense, of course, and I see through it just as so many commentators on this thread do. It appears that the old British class system of seeing a well-to-do aristocracy with elite educations being the natural holders of high office has a foothold among the so-called egalitarian left.

One of the things I think this is about is that on the left people realize that if Palin goes into office she will become the face of feminism. Most of the NOW gang would choke on that. Imagine a new face of feminist that's about individual achievement, capacity, and aptitude rather than contempt and suspicion about men. A feminist with 5 children and a macho husband. I think a lot of people at Radcliffe would be upset by that idea.

Eeyore,

List Reagan's advisors. Top notch people, all. Not Average Joes. Peggy Noonan was one of his speech writers. I think you know where she stands on Palin.

ET,

I disagree. Networked alliances only get you so far. There is a difference between growing up being ingrained with the belief that you are going to lead, and growing up just looking for a comfortable life. Indeed that is the basis for the top military schools - USMA West Point, USNA Annapolis, US Command College, Newport RI.

I believe that there is a difference between old money and the Nouveau Riche. The latter are discernible by their questionable mannerisms, particularly their treatment of money and their treatment of power. There is merit to the term, otherwise why would the nouveau riche be classified as such?

"I also disagree that going to university means that the individual has the ability to 'sacrifice for a time period' and learn 'delayed gratification'."

Palin spent what 5-6 years n 4 different colleges to get one degree. Why did she bother? What does that say about her judgement? I am not saying that college is the be all and end all of life. There is, however, merit to a college education. Try getting a non-administrative job without one. That said, I would rarely council anyone to get more than a masters - after that it is a highway to nowhere.

We can agree or disagree to no end on this, as many have, but what we do know in this context is that Sarah Palin felt the need to put in some effort - to get a degree. Just not from a good school.

"And psychologically, a deep sense of humility, or, lack of arrogance and self-absorption"

Going to a 'good' university is a grounding experience for most high-school overachievers. It often breaks students, and in most cases forces them to reinvent themselves. Over 4 degrees, you have, no doubt, witnessed that? Who would be less humble, more arrogant and more self absorbed: - a high school basketball captain who never went to university? Or a high school nerd who has been forced to reinvent herself to succeed in university? And crucially, what is the difference between self-confidence and arrogance. Ever heard of Cristiano Ronaldo - arrogant as hell - but he can afford to be - he is quite simply one of the best at what he does.

Do you really believe that Palin is humble, or lacks arrogance? Allow me to quote a McCain loyalist:

"She is a diva."

"She takes no advice from anyone. Also, she is playing for her own future and sees herself as the next leader of the party."

McCain is getting stabbed in the back. Quite literally. I suppose you choose not to notice it.

lynnh, Thank you for proving my point. The world is now elite vs non-elite, is it? How Maoist. It is not about going to all the right schools and knowing the right people. But it does help. You know who to turn to when "Putin rears his head". Who would you turn to - Joe SixPack, or an elitist Russia expert like Condi Rice. Yeah. Heres the problem for you - experts make up a huge chunk of what you call the elites. Average Joe's aren't experts, probably because they don't try. That is why they aren't a part of the elite. The problem with Palin's approach is that she is vilifying elites to make herself look good. That is my central point of contention - that she is trying to discredit the elite. Who is she going to replace them with?

Daisy, it pains me to say this, but I agree with you. Obamas marks should be in the public domain.

Dim,

"Dubya divided it between ...."

You start off well in replying to my comment but then you get sidetracked on the issue of GWB's education and intelligence. I don't know if this is an unconscious act or an intentional one on your part. I am neither interested in debating GWB's educational background nor his IQ which is what the majiority of your reply to my comment deals with. But to steer you back on to the point I was trying to make I suggest you do a Google search using the terms George Bush Most Devisive President. Having just done that I came up with 515,000 hits. I am sure there are many of the hits are repeats but still it is a pretty big number. The second hit was to the following link: http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/News/PoliticsNation/Americas_most_divisive_figure_says_Bob_Woodward_/articleshow/3448806.cms. I don't know how highly you hold Bob Woodward's opinion but I am certain it would carry greater weight with more people than mine ever possibly could.

So I'll rephrase my question to you. Do you honestly believe that Sarah Palin as VP will be more divisive than GWB as President?

And just as an aside I am aware that US presidential elections are rough and tumble events with the candidates and their supporters attacking the credentials and character of their opponents. But this one does seem particularly nasty and I wonder if it may have something to do with the divisive leadership of the past 8 years.

Cheers,

redneck

It never seems to fail that the folks who are the first to determine a public figure lacks intelligence are the most hard pressed to demonstrate any of their own.

Well, Dm would that be the same experts and advisers that have done such a bang up job creating and solving this financial mess.

BTW, having worked with graduates from BSc to Engineers with Masters degrees to PhD chemists, I can tell you that there is great variability in quality. In the end it all comes down to the person not the education. "Expert" is a poorly defined term and rarely encompasses expertise in more than one narrow area. They also tend not to be big picture people and are often useless at making good decisions at the critical times, preferring committee based decisions.

As for elitism vs. non elitism, it is those who self identify as elite that have proved the point. Their attacks on Palin were not grounded in policy and politics but sneering, innuendo, rumors and condescension. This is merely my observation based on available material. Your opinion may differ but in the absence of proof, it is no more valid than mine.

dm - well, we'll have to continue to disagree. I think you have transformed your opinions into 'truths'. However, I think they remain just your opinions.

Networked alliances are the basis of human societies, even in our modern era of the middle class and the notion of achievement by merit. These networks are found in all areas, from gangs, taxi drivers, blue collar workers, academics, the legal, medical professions and the political realm.

I've seen too many appointments made on the basis of 'maybe some merit' but 'more networks' and 'the potentiality to be part of the network' to discount networking.

Your binarisms of 'growing up with the ingrained belief that you are going to lead' vs 'just living a comfortable life' has nothing to do with monied or 'old family' background. Or education. Growing up with the belief that you are going to lead doesn't mean that you have any such capacities.

I don't know what you mean by the 'questionable mannerisms' of the 'nouveau riche'. Heh. You sound rather like Lady Whoever of the 18th c, who considered that it was beneath her dignity to take tea with the daughters of a wealthy tradesman. Nouveau riche means what it says: newly rich, and doesn't imply any less capacity in any way than 'old money'.

Indeed, the industrial revolution wouldn't have gotten anywhere if it had relied on the sons of the old money to do the thinking of that revolution.

The fact that now, just about all jobs 'require' a college education doesn't mean that those jobs require any of the so-called skills supposedly learned in college. Except for trades colleges, most jobs don't require anything learned in college. I don't agree that a college education does anything that an intelligent and curious individual can't achieve on their own.

As for getting such a degree from a 'good school' that's nonsense. There's no evidence that any of the 'ivy league' schools offer a better grounding than any non-elitist college. Not only that, but not everyone can afford to leave and go to those places. Are you seriously suggesting that the only people to be allowed to be President or VP or other top positions, must be graduates of this set of colleges? So much for the 'all men are created free and equal'.

Heh - I've seen plenty of academics who are utter and total snobs, lacking all humility, arrogant, self-absorbed..and also quite frankly, ignorant.

Your example of a 'high school nerd who has been forced to reinvent herself' is specious. The nerd can remain a nerd all through university. (hmm, why do you use the feminine rather than the neutral pronoun of 'him, himself? Are you trapped in the 'affirmative action' mentality?)

Do I think Palin has humility and lacks arrogance? Yes, very much so. Just from watching how she interacts with others, how she talks about others and herself.

I don't know what you mean by McCain getting stabbed in the back. By whom? I also find it rather arrogant of you that you claim to know what I am thinking and can tell me that I 'choose to ignore it'.

By the way, the notion of a class-based society is hardly Maoist. It's a basic infrastructure of no-growth societies that keep most of the capital and wealth in the hands of a small elite, and view the others (who don't go to the 'right schools') as peasants.

You are quite wrong when you say that 'average joes' aren't experts because they don't try. What an arrogant thing to say. They can be experts in their fields. You see, when the plane breaks down, I don't go to a lawyer, I go to an engineer.

The 'elite' are not made up of experts, and to be an expert doesn't mean that you are automatically part of the elite. That's your basic erroneous assumption.

You seem to think that the 'elite' are some kind of genetic clan, 'old money', who are somehow born with a 'noblesse oblige', and who go to the 'right schools' which further educate them in this 'noblesse oblige'. This is totally false. This is actually a very tribal way of thinking. Tribalism assumes that some clans/tribes have a hereditary right to rule over others who are just peasants so to speak.

What you are ignoring, for some odd reason, is the development of the middle class, a class that rejects the tribal view of 'old money' and 'old power' and instead assumes that all humans have the capacity to think. Some can be more critical and logical than others; these are leaders. They move up the ladder by their own merits, by hard work. Not by being 'born to the task' and going to the 'right schools'.

Your view, which rejects the very essence of what made America great, ie, that freedom to advance, freedom to become anything, freedom to be 'the best you can be' - is a very, very sad view of America and a total rejection of the human spirit.

what the hell is wrong with a normal person running for office?

Posted by: old white guy

I'm with him. Wasn’t America founded on the principal that every Man or Women can make a difference to there Nation as well as themselves?
It why Europe hates America . They have never forgiven the fact common men created a free Republic of Humans beings. Europe is still in thrall to Monarchial impulses (As is most of the Planet) with an Elitist class structure. Something America broke. They will never forgive them for beating there so called betters.

I would trust Joe the Plummer any day over either candidate. He at least lives in the real world of mortgages, bills .He actually sounds like a human being. Sarah Palin has proven her credentials already as a governor. Obama has just spent tax payer money towards Marxist organizations. That she is a "Normal", American ought to make North Americans proud. I am tired of the "Champagne Journalists" with their incestuous ties with power. The snobbery fortified in venial condensation. It boils down to the feminists scared spitless over the fact she is becoming an icon to young females while there Legacy of Marxist feminism dies. We have seen enough "beer & Popcorn” put down comments towards the average public in Canada, to know these weasels for what they are. Autocrats.

Palin will be the 2012 POTUS.

Cal2, she has MORE experience than teh Ubermessiah. The Ubermessiah has done nothing, absolutely zilch. Even his action-packled biography was ghost-written.

Palin is a Joke you wrong wingers are fools to think that she is valid candidate. Just ask Powell.

Her and Mcain were setup by the repugs to take one for the team this time. they are gonna get an ass whipping

It will be President Obama live with it.

Ask what you can do for your country, not what your country can do for you.
– Democratic president John Fitzgerald Kennedy

The US Constitution is a negative document, about what the government cannot do to you. It says nothing about what the government can do for you.
–Barrack Hussein Obama, Public Radio interview, 2001.

Ask what you can do for your contry, not what your country can do for you.
– Democratic president John Fitzgerald Kennedy

Country first
– Republican election motto, 2008

Which candidate best carries out the spirit of JFK?

Who are these 2008 Democrats and what have they done to the JFK's vision of 40 years ago?

expert = some one who is more than 50 feet from their own front door

George Bush is often called stupid.... and the things cited to prove this are those things caused by his dyslexia

college degrees and buttwipe have a lot in common

I can't believe anyone still believes McCain will lose because of Palin, if anything she makes the this race much closer than it should have been. This was pretty much always the Democrats election. The Republicans wrote it off during the primaries, there wasn't a credible candidate in the bunch ... WHY ... because the GWB will go down in History as the worst president EVER ... and is reviled by everything but the religious right, who incidently were against McCain until Palin was brought on board.

Love her or hate her, she brings the religious right back to the table and McCain's reasons for bringing her on board were sound. She's a neophyte when up against the big boys ... but this is definately not the last we've seen of her. She won't be a heart beat away from the presidency, but she's not done ...

ET, I am not transforming my opinions into truths. Certainly no more than you are.

Networked alliances exist, no doubt, but they only get you so far. After a certain point, it is all merit. You cannot become a CEO of any large firm based purely on networked alliances. It helps to know the right people, but I think you know as well as I do, that when you excel in a certain field, people will want to get to know you. That has been my experience anyway.

The term nouveau riche means different things to different people I suppose. It is often used as a derogatory term for an upstart. Nothing wrong with being an upstart mind you, but their judgement on certain issues is always questionable. Purely in the context of money, the nouveau riche are known for their flashiness, poor judgment on how to use money, and some kind of bizzare inferiority complex that forces them to match car for car, if you will, those who are rich. Flashy imitators who lack substance, much like Ms Palin. Is she experienced? Sure. Will she listen to elites around her? No idea.

Elites- we differ on the definition. Yours seems to be grounded in a blueblooded super rich vein. I see the elite as the best in their fields. Literally what the term elite means. There are elite plumbers and carwashers too. Palin is driving a wedge in the context of politics insofar as she wants to remove the elite from the process - which is okay if she knows everything inside out, but she doesn't. Becoming a member of the elite isn't that hard. If you make the effort and do your job well, people will seek you out, find out who you are, and solicit your advice. If you are not, you can continue to wallow in comfortable mediocrity.

I am not limiting myself to Ivy league colleges. There are only a handful of those. There are tonnes of good schools -College of William and Mary, Babson etc. These schools have entrance requirements. The schools Ms Palin chose, don't. She has got a degree for a degree's sake. So that she can say she has a degree. Yes I am suggesting that a college with a compettitive entrance policy is better than one without these.

All men are created equal. Some just make more of an effort. If you really want to go to an Ivy league school, and don't have the money, you will find a way. I have seen people do it. In fact, if I am not mistaken, Obama has done it. No that is not an endorsement - merely a pertinent example. You severely underestimate willpower, ET. If Palin really wanted to go to an Ivy League school, nothing in the world could have stopped her. Loans, scholarships - there is plenty of opportunity in the land of opportunity. The point is that she didn't.

"Just from watching how she interacts with others, how she talks about others and herself."

She says what you want to hear and you lap it up. The McCain camp has turned on her and called her a Diva who doesn't listen to anyone. They work with her. They don' rely on the few tv snippets you have seen.

"I don't know what you mean by McCain getting stabbed in the back. By whom?"

By Palin. The McCain camp has said so itself. And its gotten plenty of coverage - I found out about it from Karl Rove on Fox News Sunday. I erred in assuming that you knew about this and chose to ignore it. Apparently you didn't. Life must be fun in Palin's platonic cave.

"You are quite wrong when you say that 'average joes' aren't experts because they don't try. What an arrogant thing to say. They can be experts in their fields.'

Then they are the elite. Experts in a field are the elite - everyoen will know them. Everyone will seek their advice. Money has precious little to do with it. My big beef with Palin is her apparent disdain for the political elite in particular, and other sets of elite involved in the political sphere - academics, think tanks etc.

"By the way, the notion of a class-based society is hardly Maoist."

Class-based? Elite vs Average is not entirely class-based. Besides, who did Mao go after during his cultural revolution? Who did he demonize? The elite - in virtually every sphere of life. Not just the political or academic elite. Palins limitign herself to the latter two, but the line of argument is the same.

I have no clue where you conjured the rest of your argument from. My words ostensibly, but I never said or implied any of that. Far too many liberties on your part. What I am saying is that Palin says it is okay to be average and not strive to be elite. My definition of elite has nothing to do with money and everything to do with expertise. Palin is against them because they "complicate" things, and don't use "common sense". I disagree. If there is a plumber who is good. his services are sought by everyone from the super-rich to the super-power. He would then be a part of the elite.

Palin wants to take the experts out of politics - might work for one or two things, but it would be a nightmare in foreign policy etc.

If she acts like an idiot and talks like an idiot then geuss what she's probably an idiot.