And while our politicians continue to chase hallucinations, the AGW religion continues to collapse as it so richly deserves.

"The American Physical Society, an organization representing nearly 50,000 physicists, has reversed its stance on climate change and is now proclaiming that many of its members disbelieve in human-induced global warming. The APS is also sponsoring public debate on the validity of global warming science. The leadership of the society had previously called the evidence for global warming “incontrovertible.”

In a posting to the APS forum, editor Jeffrey Marque explains,”There is a considerable presence within the scientific community of people who do not agree with the IPCC conclusion that anthropogenic CO2 emissions are very probably likely to be primarily responsible for global warming that has occurred since the Industrial Revolution.”

Glad to see you mention the Loughheed Roll - where the practitioner rolls onto their belly, while keeping their rear end high to the sky.

For all of his blather and gnashing of teeth, Old Pete arguably did nothing to stem the flow of blood and cash.

I for one strongly support the Green Shaft's immediate implementation combined with a Librano majority on the federal scene.

There will be no faster way to independence and declaration of a Republic for western canada.

Screw the eastern bastards. They've done it to the West for over a century.

If SK actually did take 10mm tones of CO2 out of the air they should join the cap-and-trade fraud.

After all, if some brainless fool is stupid enough to buy your "credits" for real cash, why not sell it to the bloody fool?

And this greenscam will hurt Ontario's manufacturing base, but i suspect mcguinty is wiling to pimp out our economy to boost his idiot pal dion.

The Alberta Oil Sands are the safest, most environmentally friendly energy alternative for North America.

Pipelines, not dirty-oil using tankers polluting harbours, seaways and ocean habitats.

Tax-generating economic activity, not lining gilded pockets of dictators.

It's that, or Suzuki-ing ourselves back to pioneer days of sod huts and eating small, dead animals.

"Environmentalists around the world have for so long castigated U.S. President George W. Bush for his opposition to Kyoto that many have mistakenly concluded that he is somehow responsible for the fact that the emissions of ratifying nations have gone up, not down. Between 2000 and 2005, emissions in Europe - routinely held up as a paragon of ecological virtue - rose twice as fast as America's. Canada's rose five times faster.
"

The legacy of Chretian, Dion, Rae, Iggy and other liberals

"Environmentalists around the world have for so long castigated U.S. President George W. Bush for his opposition to Kyoto "

yes and it was Pres Clinton, who's Vice President was Al Gore, that didn't ratify the treaty.

Clinton & Gore . . . media darlings who killed Kyoto for America.

Go figure eh :)

I would not be able to sit at the table with anyone(premier or not) as they lie through their teeth about how we must lower CO2 emissions. I have already taken to pimp slapping(yes literally) any dudes who spew this AGW BS to me.

Everyone needs to support my "Pimp Slap a Socialist P**sy" movement.

Perhaps we should suggest a special tax on all those 'windfall profits' from the manufacturing industry in Ont & Que, seeing as how THEY USE ENERGY!

It's that, or Suzuki-ing ourselves back to pioneer days of sod huts and eating small, dead animals.

Screw that , I'm going straight to Ted Turner's cannibal phase .
Gore's mine , I got a family to feed .

Morgan swift: "And this greenscam will hurt Ontario's manufacturing base, but i suspect mcguinty is wiling to pimp out our economy to boost his idiot pal dion."

Actually, McSquinty's "green credentials" consist of demanding that the West pay and offering, along with his greenie pal, Charest, to put in some all-for-show cap and trade plan, as long as it doesn't impact the Ontario and Quebec economies. At least he's got the part about not damaging the economy half right. But if he had real "green credentials" he'd stop talking about imaginary pollution and work at reducing or eliminating the real thing - like the OHRC, for example.

Indiana Homez: "Everyone needs to support my "Pimp Slap a Socialist P**sy" movement."

Sounds appealing, as long as we can find enough slappers to be able to deal with the never ending stream of deserving "slappees".

grok

"Perhaps we should suggest a special tax on all those 'windfall profits' from the manufacturing industry in Ont & Que, seeing as how THEY USE ENERGY!"

Not after McShifty puts them all out of business. Perhaps that's his game. Close down the economy and sell carbon credits to pay the welfare.

At any rate, Ontario will be hurt badly by any of these schemes both directly and through higher costs passed on by the energy companies in Alberta (it's always the end-user who pays.)

Why has Dion abandoned the Kyoto Agreement with his Green Shaft Plan? Rather a strange turnabout don't you think? Hypocrisy anyone??

Why has Dion abandoned the Kyoto Agreement with his Green Shaft Plan? Rather a strange turnabout don't you think? Hypocrisy anyone??

Bill D. Cat: "Screw that , I'm going straight to Ted Turner's cannibal phase . Gore's mine , I got a family to feed."

Sounds like you have a whole village to feed!

McGuinty's 'so-called' green credentials are very similar to Dion's 'so-called' green credentials when he was the environment minister in our previous federal government. Bunch of noise, blather and talking point but zero progress. Liberals are a funny lot. All they have to do is say something and it's seen as progress while a conservative has to deliver the goods.

fc , Gore's kinda like the AGW thing. Once you trim away the fat there's not much of use left .

Ah the media buddies are in full sales mode. They continue to operate as though they have dominion over the information space.

Wake up, MSM, look at your bottom line. Do you still own the information space like you once did?

Careful what you wish for MSM, with your carbon footprint, you make a very large target...

Heres a full article on John Luft above post:

Looks like a lot of physicists have a problem with AGW

http://www.dailytech.com/Myth+of+Consensus+Explodes+APS+Opens+Global+Warming+Debate/article12403.htm

John Cross: Consensus??

Willing to fight! We're not going to fight, we're just going to leave the country. (signed, a Saskatchewan resident who loves Montana.) Go to hell Dion!

"Green Credentials" are awarded by the media. How many trees died for the Toronto Star today I wonder? How many tons of diesel were burned delivering the Toronto Star today I wonder? How much CO2 did that put in the air? How much CO2 did the trees that died for the Star not collect today?

The climate emergency is so dire, we need to find alternative news sources!

Oh wait...

Those idiots do not have a clue as to what they are doing. Loss of jobs in Germany appears to be a big problem with emission permits. The companies will end up moving to other jurisdictions, leading to lost local jobs and the benefit to the environment is zip.
http://www.spiegel.de/international/business/0,1518,566441,00.html

PS: Hats of to Mr. Stelmach and Mr. Wall who oppose the Eastern heathens. And by the way Dion, who filled your fuel tank before you left to fly back and forth to the stampede! Get lost!

"Gawd, I love Ottawa "journalism."

The Ottawa Press Gallery ridden with Liberal lickspittle journalists for decades.

How else could have the corruption and Liberal government malfeasance continue for more than a decade?

Continue to enable the corruption and end up either as press agents for MP's or be given Senate appointments!

"Gawd, I love Ottawa "journalism."

Indeed !!

I wonder if Ontario and Quebec would consider paying an annual penalty for the "carbon capture" that is lost for each year that forests remain flooded by their hydro electric projects and then another penalty for each liter of carbon based fuel that is burned and released into the atmosphere?
To demonstrate their sincere commitment to the process, I propose that Ontario and Quebec immediately open the dams, allow the water to drain out and restore those reservoirs to their natural state. Alberta, after all, restores the areas mined for tar sands. It's about time Ontario and Quebec restore the areas flooded for dams.

What is still puzzling is how few of both Liberals and MSM have actually read Dion's Green Shaft program - They don't seem to realize that there's nothing in it about the environment. Nothing.

There are no strategies for reducing emissions or even cleaning up pollution in the environment. Instead, it focuses on emissions; it needs emissions, because it taxes them and bribe the poor. That's all the plan is. A Canadian version of Kyotoism. That's why Dion named his dog 'Kyoto'. He hasn't abandoned Kyotoism; his Green Shaft is an In-Canada version - taking from the wealthy to bribe the poor.

As for cap-and-trade, kudos to the Ministers for rejecting this. Again, it's just a money transference program. Nothing to do with the envt. Heck, thieves will try to sell you anything; if they don't have any refurbished stolen cars, they'll sell you air..

This rejection, hopefully, is yet another kick at Dion's Green Shaft.

McGumpy is described as having "green credentials" in spite of his broken promises on closing Ontario's coal-fire generating stations. In fact he has broken it several times. The first time a few years back when he promised they'd all be closed by 2007. Then it was 2009. After breaking his second "promise", he now has the date for closing them at 2014. The interesting thing about that date is that we have fixed elections here in Ontario. The next election will be 2011. So the only way we can see if he's kept his promise -- the same he's broken not once but twice before -- is to elect him to a third consecutive majority gov't. And it would be only at the end of that third mandate if we see if he's kept his promise.

WayToGo Kate! Yet another fine example of wit, wisdom, sarcasm and perception that makes SDA my favourite blog (and home page)

The thing that bothers me most is how an interjurisdictional cap and trade system rewards shrinking economies and penalizes growing economies.

A reduction in GDP per capita should not be rewarded. Cap and trade has all the trappings of another interprovincial welfare program.

Paging Ms. Elizabeth May!

Premiers Ed and Brad, pack your bags, come home and secure our borders.

I support what the premiers said, but I have a horrible feeling of seeing a repeat of NEP in that when push comes to shove they will fold. I wonder what exactly it will take for the West to opt for independence as opposed to being the milk cow for Ontario and Quebec.

It bears repeating, that Alberta oil is the best thing that ever happened to Newfoundland.

The training and employment of Newfoundlanders in the offshore oil patch (helicopter pilots, marine engineers etc. etc.) has been good, but there are not very many such jobs to go around.

The same could be said about work on the lakers.

Newfoundland's own offshore oil has been beneficial, but it mainly to the public sector (somewhat dubious but it does employ a lot of people).

The Alberta oil patch has provided well-paying jobs for countless ordinary Newfoundlanders, and is the best thing which has happened here in the last century.

NEP did nothing for Nfld. A repeat would be a disaster.

McGuinty has green credentials because he has given GM $300 million to produce the technological marvel the Camaro. It sports such cutting edge technology as rear wheel drive.
I wonder if that was what Dion meant when he said the West would be home of all sorts of technological breakthroughs after he destroys our economy.

I've got an idea.
If this green shaft tax plan is so good for the West's economy, why not spread it around?
Why should the West get all the benefit of the marvelous economic stimulus of the Shaft?
To be fair, he should really impose the same tax on Ontario's auto industry and transfer the money to the west.
I mean, why should us in the West get all the good things?
They claim the Green Shaft tax plan will be a boon for Western Canada, it seems unfair to not let the rest of the country be taxed the same by this wonderful new plan.
So Dion and Garth, be fair, spread the wealth.
Tax Ontario's auto industry at the same rate you will tax the West's oil industry so they too can enjoy the same kind of economic benefits you promise will magically appear in the West.
If that fails, you can always take the milk cow to market and trade it for some magic green beans.

I did like the bit about "shoring up" Mcguinty's "green credentials". The suggestion is of something decrepit, rotten, falling down. The reporter was more accurate than he intended to be, methinks.

No mention in the article that the Territorial leaders are also against it.

I would suggest that anything .... anything at all left in the care of the Ontario Premier is in very dire care.

Now explain why people would think that he can fix the environment.....!!!

Bill D. Cat: Are you telling us that manbearpig fat is so much inferior to black bear fat that it's not worth saving to help keep us warm during the long cold winters of Suzuki pioneer days?

The more I hear from Brad Wall, the better I like him. Having to rely on Special Ed to uphold my province's interests makes me reach for the pepto but Brad seems to have it all. I fully agree with others here that the green shaft is nothing but a wealth transfer - not necessarily to central Canada but certainly to the demographic most likely to vote liberal and in a shameless attempt to steal NDP votes (putting Layton in a deliciously awkward situation). Acknowledging that the green shaft has nothing to do with the environment and everything to do with giving the money to low income earners ('fighting' poverty) how can Dion not come clean on this? If it is indeed a 'green tax' then isn't there a vested interest in seeing the amount collected diminish over time? On the other hand, distributing the amount collected to the various liberal voters specified in the green shaft means keeping it at least at current levels to keep the gravy train running. In fact, more likely, seeing the total collected grow exponentially in future. How else to keep buying off his voters?

In the meantime, could McGuinty be a more blatant accomplice?

In case you've missed it, I'll repost the opening paragraph of a July 10 posting (since removed, I have craftily printed off a hard copy) on the website of Thunder Bay MP Ken Boschcoff.

“The Liberal Party's Green Shift, announced on June 19th marked the most aggressive anti-poverty program in 40 years. The ‘shift' ill transfer wealth from the rich to the poor, from the oil patch to the rest of the country, and from the coffers of big business to the pockets of low-income Canadians."

I could post more, but trust me when I say nothing is mentioned about how the environment will be helped.

This is nothing short of a marxist-inspired wealth-redistribution program which Alberta premier Ed Stelmach rightfully rejects with his quote about equalization.

And, in case any of you had also missed this fact ... CO2 is NOT a pollutant. On SDA about a week ago, a German scientist (pity the taxpayers) released the results of his study that concluded plants grew faster in an increased atmosphere of CO2.

Nature has a way of taking care of itself.

Looking forward to living in the Republic of Western Canada. Go Dion!!!

I recently talked to my CPC MP and it was quite interesting to hear what he had to say.

If the leftard Liberals get elected even in a minority government, they will bring in the Green Shaft with the support of the PQ and the Dippers.

There will be an automatic crossing of the floor of the western CPC MPs to a new Western Separatist Party. There will be a referendum called by Sask. and Alta. Premiers with in 6 months of the implementation of the Green Shaft with a simple question.

Do you want your Province to separate from the country of Canada? Yes No

Do you want to form a new Country of Western Canada with those Provinces and Territories that hold a similar referendum? Yes No

A fifty percent plus one vote will result in an immediate negotiation with the Country once called Canada.

Cheers

Viva Le Western Canada

All this talk about an independant West. I really don't see why it isn't embraced more fully by more of us out here.

Just look at the differences in politics and apparent ideologies between the two regions....if a married couple had the same difference in ideology between them, I don't think it would be likely that they would remain married.

Maybe it is time for a divorce.

And if it were to happen, it's not like we still couldn't have an amicable relationship. I still think there is potential to see significant trade between the two new countries.

What would be unfortunate for the ROC would be the equalization payment situation. I know that it would be the wish of many to stick to them and shut it off cold turkey, but maybe it would be better to wean them over a number of years.

Czechoslovakia did just fine after it split up.
Canada should seriously look at how it worked out for them.

"Swill 1984"

Liberal troll. Beware.

Stan:

I agree....it really is the model for how two regions of a country can split into two new countries and eventually both become the better for it...although I understand that it was a little more difficult for Slovakia for a period of time after the split.

I suggest the Western Block Party of Canada. http://www.westernblockparty.com/
"The primary objective of the Western Block Party is to create Western Canada as a free and independent nation"
It seems to be an offshoot of the Western Canada Concept, in fact the WCC links to it. The WCC is at http://www.westcan.org/

I've bought a Block membership, everyone should, it's only $10. The word Block in the name is a subtle reminder that we need to be treated with the same kid gloves as Quebec.

McPathologicalLiar is shoring up the only things he has left, of a ruined failure of his tenure, and those are the fantasys of commie enviro green stuff.

John, just from memory, it was kinda the same thing too, wasn't it? One region of Czechoslovakia wanted socialism and the other one didn't?

They are right about one thing. We will fight. Do they really think all those guns where registered lol. That’s what a friend from work said the other day. He was not alone in his prognostication. Hardly his anger, including a few bosses as well. This is an issue that transcends class of any sort.

This time they either get of the pot or piss because we have had it with the out right thievery, stupidity, insults, compounded in hypocrisy with a thousand other things the East have abused us with ,in the west since the inception of this Confederation.

Its over Ontario stand on your own . NEP means GFB. Try us? We really we want you to!

Keep your busybody noses out of here & your paws off of our work!!! You want to have some money, come here to work like the rest of us.

Maz2

No Liberano Troll here my friend.

Worked on my first election when I was 12 for Dick Calver, leader of the Sask. Conservatives back in the 70's. Jumped to the Reform in 88 and was against the formation of the Alliance and ultimately the CPC. Too many red tories for my liking. Love SH and I feel he would make an excellent President of the Republic of Western Canada. I would love to see the Sask Party move a little more to the right, too many former Liberals in the fold though. It will take some time to weed them out.

Cheers

simple.

green credentials = greenbacks for ontario.

Mr. Stelmach and Saskatchewan Premier Brad Wall scuttled any hope of a unified cap-and-trade program

I should hope so. They would be stupid to do otherwise.

There is no AGW; there isn't even, unfortunately, any global warming at present.

Swill @8.34

There are far too many liberals in Canaa. We cannot launch a progrom agains them. e must just demostrate that libralism = death and rightnes is, well, right.

Seriously, the Canadian establishment elite is "liberal" and we need to stick with what little we have to slowly undermine it.

I think that anyone, or organization, that extracts CO2 from the atmosphere should be hauled up before some UN court for crimes against nature.

CO2 is a fertilizer.

People at the time of Turdeau and Lougheed didn't do their homework and see that Pink Peter and Pinker Peeair were "educated by the exact same commies at Harvard and London school of "Economics" They were both screaming lefties and Lougheed left us here in Alberta a big debt and handed us a braindead quarterback who Rae-ed Charest=ed and Maginty-ed us into massive debt. It took an uneducated pisstank to realize you can't keep drinking when your wallet is empty. Some legacy for higher education when Ralph knew more than the enlightened ones. If these theiving Lieberals and useless eastern Premiers think we will be the town bike again they could find a different reception, I will NOT return to the eighties again.

From other discussions where a Western separatist reaction to NEP 2 has arisen I have noted that eastern and liberal reaction has generally be derisive of the idea, angry that it is even considered and consistently contemptuous of Western discontent with being the object of a cash raid to benefit the "National Purposes" of the eastern liberal compact.

Given that attitude, I expect that if M. Dion does become PM and actually follows through with a platform (a rare occurrence for a Liberal)the shock and horror at referendums om separation being strongly endorsed will be something to behold.

I have little doubt that such a referendum in those circumstances would pass and given the fact that we cannot afford not to separate would astound the arrogant and the blind. Most people that I have discussed this very issue with in my part of Saskatchewan are not willing to see our economy ravaged to sustain the economies in the east and buy liberal votes. Separation, and separation quickly, are usually seen as the only legitemate response in those circumstances.

Before they are over the shock the deed would be done and Canada would be history. The rapid dissolution of the ties that feed Ontario and Quebec would be accomplished before there manufacturing economy can even think about having to compete on world markets to sell any of their goods into the west without the protections that have created and enforced for themselves within Canada.

The simple truth of the matter is that the east has nothing that can not be obtained elsewhere is necessary and sometimes at significantly better prices. The West doesn't need the east.

[quote]No mention in the article that the Territorial leaders are also against it.[/quote]

Stan,
You picked up on the Wild card! If the west goes so does the North... Re-draw that Map & the US Congress will welcome the New States...The North needs a US commitment & investment...

JMO

"Viva Le Western Canada"

Republic of Western Canada. Has a nice ring to it! And just think, no more:

Canadian Human Rights Commission
Peter Pansbridge and Kneel MacDonald
Judge made law from the bad santa suits
Canadian Wheat Board
Order of Canada
Justin Turd-o
Jack Layton
Lizzie May
The McSquinty Brothers: Dullton and Doughhead
Ryerson University
Mama Khadr and the toxic spawn
Gilles Duceppe
Steffi Dion and the Green Shi*t

Unfortunately there's still the Suzuki Foundation, Ralph Goodale and the provincial HRCs but we can get working on those.

One would hope that if the liberals got in and implemented this, the first people to be laid off by the Alberta oil patch companies would be those from the east.
That would leave fewer non Albertans around to vote in any referendum.

Oh my Kate - now look at what you started.

heh.

That kind of journalism really is weak. Lots of weasel words.

"they consider the policy a thinly disguised attempt to share"

Sharing must be initiated by the giver. When the receiver forces the event, the proper word is "steal" or "seize".

The author needs a dictionary.

Give the West a real voice, support the PQ. After they go West is easy.

Notwithstanding the cheering crowd for Alberta (and SK) Independence, I am somewhat skeptical about the idea happening. Although I am in favour of the concept and the practice of Independence, I am not convinced that NEP2 will be a strong enough incentive for a sufficient majority of Albertans to decide to form a country.

Whereas I would prefer to be proven wrong in my conclusion, here are a few reasons to support the "thesis".

Although I believe That Mr. Manning would have made a better PM that Mr. Harper, I do not mind saying that I am more than just a little pleased with the overall performance of the current PM - even when considering some of his less-than-wise decisions. The "scary" and "hidden" agenda has failed to materialize; he really is quite tame as a PM. The members of the CPC provide a rather strong bench compared to the opposition(s). I also feel that the current CPC has slightly more in common with the Mulroney PC's (while acknowledging differences) than with the Manning Reformers.

Yet in spite of the very mild nature of the current CPC, they are often referred to as "hard right" by their detractors. The public has had over 2 years to examine the government and to discover the "hidden" agenda and yet the perception continues. When one further considers the leadership capabilities of Harper vs. Dion one would expect a significant gap between the support for each of the two parties, one would only expect the current support levels if the CPC had a mediocre leader of if the Liberals had a Leader that could excite the Liberal base.

When one further considers the character and efforts of Mr. Manning to explain proposed consitutional changes to the "East" that "the West wants in" and the effect that his efforts had, one is left with the obvious conclusion that the inequalities in the country caused by a not-well-thought-out Constitution are, nonetheless, desired by many in Canada.

Equalization. Let us suppose how Equalization might work if Canada were operated as a democracy of equal state actors and Alberta decided that it
wanted to continue the same amounts. A comparison could be made to the IMF. When a country that has followed poor economic policies needs help from another state, the giving state(s) attach conditions to the monies that are donated. If Equalization were to operate in an even remotely similar fashion, Alberta should have the economic and legal clout to demand that some of the unwise policies other provinces are currently following be recinded. When one further considers the amounts that the IMF helps out a troubled nation and compares it to the amount the Alberta contributes to Equalization, one must conclude the the receiving provinces are in more economic trouble than some of the poorest countries in the world and that Alberta is even more generous that a collection of several countries all-inclusive. Surely the provinces are not in such a state, yet Albertans continue to participate in Equalization without a complaint and without a demand that it be operated as an Alberta Monetary Fund with all the conditions that she should have to attach to said monies.

If these collective circumstances yield the level of support for Independence at its current levels, it is difficult to guarantee that NEP2 will increase the support level to a sufficient amount to enable its execution.

I further add that the Liberals are probably aware of most or all of this and are preparing their policies knowing full well that the policies will cause an increase in resentment in the West but not much else. I would like to be wrong, but I think the Liberals will try this given the opportunity.

If a Liberal government tried to slap Alberta and Saskatchewan with carbon taxes ala the "Green Shaft" or some variant, and both of them didn't tell the rest of Canada to get stuffed, they would either be the most altruistic decent Canadians ever born or stupid beyond all comprehension.

Bob in Toronto

Bob summarizes my post.....

Brent, you are wrong, and Stelmach is not f...ing around when he says what he said to the teat sucking easterners. I happen to know that this time around if the eastern inbred liberal voters are the victors, it will be swift and decisive when NEP2 is implemented. Maybe for you younger ones who think Dion is groovy with his limp wrist and pantywaist ideas to rob my hard work again like Turd-O, you think it is no big deal, well talk to someone older than 45 and find out what no work and a huge mortgage is like, remember motgage is from the latin term meaning death grip, wait till you have a 350,000 one with no work. Thank god these idiot lieberals are not in power, but if Ontario wants failure and votes these theives in remember , all the steel for pipelines, all the trucks all the machinery all the tires etc come from Ontario, vote lieberal at your own peril.

I believe I said that I would like to be wrong. However, NEP1 caused a 35%-45% drop in Calgary real estate betweeen 1981 and 1985. Many foreclosures. Oil industry employment went from ~160,000 to ~70,000 in the province over the next decade - this was only partly a cause of NEP1 as the 1986 $34-> $10 per barrel was a big cause of the employment shift.

There were many people in Alberta who hated NEP1 at the time; there was some support for Independence at the time - just not enough. Perhaps this time there will be enough; yet it is also possible that the main outcome of a NEP2 will cause Albertans to shout at Liberals a decade later: just wait till NEP3 - we'll really mean it next time.

As someone said earlier on this blog, the the real question is, why have we stayed so long?

It's the numbers, electoral numbers, that are against any meaning full change that would see the West as an equal partner in Confederation. These numbers dictate that we will always be subservient to our eastern electoral masters. You can put all the money and head offices you want in Calgary and we will still be controlled by the east. If anyone thinks that anything reasonable is going to happen that will shift the balance of power, or even give equal power to the West, give your head a shake. Remember one thing, POWER IS TAKEN NOT GIVEN. There is no way in hell the east, Ont/Que, will ever relinquish their control. No way.

What is still puzzling is how few of both Liberals and MSM have actually read Dion's Green Shaft program - They don't seem to realize that there's nothing in it about the environment. Nothing.

ET, you keep repeating that and sound like a broken record.

Keep repeating it until it sinks in.

PiperPaul

Lots of weasel words

That's the point of the concept: how subtle, but meaningful words/adjectives (which are often un-noticed as slanting to one side) get quietly entered into a story.

I agree with an earlier post. We in the West have over stayed our welcome. Time to leave. As long as we stay in Confederation we will always be dictated to by Ontario and Quebec. Personally, I've seen enough Quebec Prime Ministers to last me a life time. I've listened to enough eastern politicians to last me a life time. Canada was an experiment that never worked. Well, not for the west anyway.

Long live The Western Republic.

What I find absolutely hilarious about the eastern guys getting upset about Western Canada blowing this popstand of Crooked Liberal bureaucracy called Ottawa, is that our very good friends in Quebec have succeeded in getting the specific legitimate process of withdrawing from Canada laid out in law.

Its called the Clarity Act.

There aren't many older Canadians around, outside of Quebec and Ontario, who did not believe that the arrogant Mr Trudeau would cause the eventual breakup of Canada.

But most wrongly thought it would be Quebec that left.

Don't ya just love surprise endings?

It has come down to emotional responses in this post. Western Separatist's are looking at very short term solutions.

1] - When the West separates, which provinces are going to vote. AB, Sask, NWT, Yukon, Man, and BC.

2] - Lets take these as a set for the vote.

3]
a]- AB. Mostly straight up, hard working with an attitude.
b]- Sask. Mostly straight up, hard working and gaining an attitude with every day that Wall leads them.
c]- NWT. Mostly hard working with support from Southern provinces. Strictly run by Federal services. Northern Indians and Inuit hold a resource income that is controlled from Federal levels. See very small percentage with attitude, more with socialist attitude wanting there world handed to them on a plate and very little work.
d]- Yukon. Same as NWT.
e]- Man. Small percentage with attitude. Used to be a leading province in farming, same as Sask until the NDP were elected time and time again. They seems to be a small percentage of population supporting and paying for a much large populations problems.
f] BC. Small percentage with attitude, much larger population in SW corner of BC that are feeding off the rest of provinces resources to be a just socialite's society.

4] Now lets vote. We win in the West. Now lets get all our people together and set this deal out.
a]- Debt: last time I payed attention to it, was over 640 Billion dollars.
b]- Police Force: Unknown?
c]- Medicare: Keep throwing money at it so it keeps absorbing over 40% of our resource money.
d]- Government services: are these people the only ones with their guaranteed pensions, because as it is they are.
e]- Armed Forces: Should we outfit a new one or keep running the poorly funded forces as the are. When we get attacked from another source, can we send people in to be defending our new country with maybe guns, ammo, tanks, transporting equipment, ships, subs just to name a few from tinker toy land.
f]- Ports: [2] Vancouver or Churchill. Both run by the dreaded union. Still controlling shipping and making sure that the farming and industrial sectors pay these extraordinary wages, benefit's and social workers, because their job is just to stressful.
g]- Trains: are we going to cut the train tracks off at the last province facing the East?
h]- Immigration?????

These are just to name a few. If the West separates, where is the plan to look after these few basic services. I have lived in AB all my life, worked in the Northern BC and NWT areas. Traveled to US and Mexico. My political view is very limited.
Since 1964 the rest of Canada has been catering to Ontario's and Quebec's major population and now Vancouver. I really think that it is about time it stopped. If they want to be the center of attention; F*cking Great, Cool, Right on people.

Canada should have a vote from all provinces with one question. DO YOU WANT THESE PEOPLE IN CANADA. I bet their would be a vast majority that would vote no.

On the upside... nobody in the New GREAT Republic of Western Canada will give a flying f**k what anyone east of the Manitoba border thinks, no matter what language they think (or don't) in. French will be reduced to the dying language that it is, the CHRC will be sometihing that Ontario and Quebec will have to live with, and Carbon Tax will be something that is paid to OIL PRODUCERS (sk mb ab) by OIL CONSUMERS(on,qc,nb,ns,pei,nl.)
Live long and prosper......
cool man....

Before I start...Merle Underwood is an Eastern Canadian IDIOT! No reply, no defence, his.her whole argument is BULL SH*T.

NOW, for this crap!

"I further add that the Liberals are probably aware of most or all of this and are preparing their policies knowing full well that the policies will cause an increase in resentment in the West but not much else. I would like to be wrong, but I think the Liberals will try this given the opportunity."

All of the above in quotes may be true, please someone call Ralph Goodale and confirm. His website is still going on about "conservative lies". Ralph knows he's about to retire, he just hasn't realized that he doesn't have a choice. I recommend that all of you do what I have done, send Ralph a "congratulations on your retirement" card. His constituency office is readilly available, sorry I don't have it at hand. This is a GREAT message to send though...

Posted by: Bart at July 18, 2008 6:53 PM
Before I start...Merle Underwood is an Eastern Canadian IDIOT! No reply, no defence, his.her whole argument is BULL SH*T.

Well Bart, I have been called many things but never an Eastern Canadian Idiot. I was born in AB and have lived there my entire life.

I think that I created a scenerio for people at least to think about instead of screaming [we should seperate] and telling the rest of them to F-themselves.