Just keep on insulting those working class voters. They'll cling to their guns, bibles and republican presidents.

I watched this on Fox News this morning before work. What got me was the smiles and nodding heads from the brain dead supporters in the back as he was speaking. This just proves that most looney left Dems do hate their own country, and are too stupid to understand that other people are learning english because they want to be able to do business with the most successful country in the world.

Heck, I'm unilingual english from Ontario, but I even throw in a few Y'alls when I travel south to do business with customers in the Carolinas, Kentucky or Texas.

What justifies America's becoming a bilingual nation? America is unlike Canada, which is justifiably bilingual because it is the historical product of two founding nations (I know I'm excluding our aboriginal peoples here.) What happened to the American "melting pot" idea?

This guy just never stops with the platitudes. He makes my head spin.

It gets even worse. Both Senators Hussein Obama and McCain are going to speak before the annual national convention of La Raza, (The Race), this week in San Diego. La Raza is the largest Hispanic lobbying group in the US.

Michelle Malkin has an excellent column about La Raza in today's New York Post, entitled "Race Warriors". An excerpt:

"Here are 15 things you should know about "The Race":
1.It supports driver's licenses for illegal aliens.
2.It demands in-state tuition discounts for illegal-alien students that aren't available to US citizens and legal immigrants.
3.It vehemently opposes cooperative immigration-enforcement efforts between local, state and federal authorities.
4.It opposes a secure fence on the southern border.
5.It joined the American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee in a failed lawsuit to prevent the feds from entering immigration information into a key national crime database - and to prevent local police from accessing the data.
6.It protested common-sense voter-ID provisions as an "absolute disgrace."
7.It has opposed post-9/11 national-security measures at every turn.
8.It opposed Oklahoma's tough immigration-enforcement-first laws, which cut off welfare to illegal aliens, put teeth in employer sanctions and strengthened local-federal cooperation."...

There's much more. I recommend reading this excellent Malkin column.

"Just keep on insulting those working class voters. They'll cling to their guns, bibles and republican presidents."......faltering economy, endless wars, poor academic performance, ineffective healthcare system, and in the case of prominent male conservative leaders...other men/boys.

The "english only" crowd whines about every little chingadera that's the outside their personal bubble. What else is new? These people wouldn't vote for Obama anyway. Another tempest in a teapot for the knuckle draggers.

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dave in pa - thanks for Michelle Malkin's outline of this group.

Obama is after the hispanic vote; that's what it's all about. He's very similar to our own Liberals - power is all that matters and if you have to ignore the well-being of your own nation to bribe people to vote for you..so be it.

As for bilingualism in Canada because of our two 'founding nations' - I strongly disagree. Canada is not and never will be bilingual, and making such a dictum the rule has meant that 80% of Canada's population is barred from effective roles in working for their govt. That goes only to the bilingual; and that is and will always be, only about 20% of the population with most of them from Quebec.

In my view, Canada ought to have two languages; unilingual in each area. Quebec, remember, is already unilingual. It is not bilingual. The only officially bilingual province is NB. So, keep Quebec as it wishes to be - unilingual. And make the rest of Canada as it ought to be: also unilingual. In English.

Don't take power away from the citizens of Canada by insisting that they can only participate in govt if they are bilingual.

The US, by the way, has the same ratio of Spanish speaking citizens as Canada does French speaking citizens. But it most certainly isn't dumb enough to insist that its national govt be bilingual. That would effectively hand over all power to hispanics and exclude the majority of the other US citizens.

Obama's supposed to be charismatic? Is there something I've missed?

I found him sophomor[on]ic and repetitive: barely articulate.

Hmm . . . those adjectives would describe the average publicly educated prole.

"Houston, we have a problem . . . "

This is for any Liberals who don't understand why this is such an obnoxious comment.

In general, people do not spend their time and efforts doing things so they can inpress their old college roommates. They do things for practical reasons.

Europeans learn these other languages because they have a practical application. Europeans can travel for an hour and be in a different country speaking different languages. If Americans and Canadians had the same opportunity they would learn extra languages more often also.

I am a father of two children, 4 and 2. During the week I get up, take care of the kids(along with my wife) and then head to work for 7-9 hours. Then I come home, spend more time with the kids, eat, get some household chores done, spend quality time with my wife, and then go to bed. Weekends are similar, only with more kid time, and more chore time.

Lately I have been thinking alot about how I need a hobby, something to do for and with myself. High on my list are to; take up amateur electronics, read more, learn a new language, and to learn more about computer programming. I can only do so much though. I have to choose because I have other priorities in my life.

So I would say this to Obama if he said what he just said to me.

"I have better thing to do with my time. If I felt that learning a new language had more practical applications I would do so, regardless of your hectoring. Individuals such as myself make intelligent, practical decisions about what to do with our spare time and we don't need an elitist prick to advise us. Take your snotty attitude and go to hell"

I think there is no harm at all in learning a second language, good for the brain, broadens ones horizons. Did it myself and enjoyed it.

But two points:

1) English is still by far the most flexible and dynamic language in existence, and it is the language of science and technology.

2) Obama's reasons for making the statements he is making are purely politically motivated, and he would quite happily throw English under the bus if that got him votes.

merci beaucoup? what is he after the lousiana vote? everyone knows a cajun is a canadjun with his nads removed. they cuunnt spell acadjan wiff a eye.

I was kinda hopin' he would break into arabic or swahili or indonesian.

Eric said: "Europeans learn these other languages because they have a practical application. Europeans can travel for an hour and be in a different country speaking different languages. If Americans and Canadians had the same opportunity they would learn extra languages more often also."

Eric that's a very noteworthy and interesting argument. I am not sure I entirely agree with you, but your point has merit.

One thing that I have noticed in Canada is that nearly every youngster that goes through French immersion ends up being weak in both French and English as far as writing goes.

Learning to write two or more languages well is extraordinarily difficult. But learning to speak a second language reasonably well is not that hard.

Anyway my point is that first and foremost I want my kids to have a very solid command of spoken and *written* English.

After that I don't mind if they also learn to speak a few languages - although some languages are of course a waste of time to learn.

I once thought I should have my children learn Japanese , they didnt , the system said they should try to become fluent in the language of civil servitude. luckily for me , they are wired as well for a second language as I am , none of them learned French well and none of them are civil servants. 9 years of french didnt sink in this anglosaxon brain as fast as a 2 week conversational german. Ich ein Albertan.

as a second language now I would recommend Mandarin or Spanish , for the future largest trading partners.

Agreed, Eric - that's the reason why Europeans know several languages. My work has put me in collaboration with a lot of Europeans, and they can slip readily between Danish, Dutch, German, English..and some French. That's the majority.
You can get people speaking a set of three: Italian, English and French.
Then, there are others with Russian, German and English.

It's interesting but it's primarily in France where you won't find people able to speak several languages; they speak French. Period. You can see that at Charles De Gaulle airport. It's in French. Tough for you if you can't figure out where and what. Compare with Amsterdam's Schiphol airport...English. And some Dutch.

But as Eric pointed out, you can travel 200 km in Europe and you are in a different country and linguistic zone. Here in N. America - the vastness is one language - English.

I believe that this linguistic flexibility in Europe is derived from practical requirements, and from hearing, using the language. If you don't hear and use the language on the street, in the local shops, on the radio etc, then no amount of slogging over books is going to make you bilingual. You have to hear and use it. We don't.

"We should have every child speaking more than one language."

Or, alternatively, maybe every English speaking child in America should learn how to properly speak and write English first, and then learn Portugese and Greek and Esperanto.

TJ, it is not at all difficult to learn to write two languages (or more). Again, check out Europe for examples. Or check out the educated hispanics in the US.

The language instruction problems in Canada are due to (e.g.):
- Outside of Quebec (and perhaps NB) nobody wants to learn French (many, including me at times, are actively anti-French)
- Not enough non-French second language instruction is offered in school (and always too late)
- A foreign langauge is not mandatory in high school (except French which nobody wants to learn). (When I was in high school in my home country, I studied four languages the first year, and I was in a science program!)

It is correct that English speakers, especially in NA, are not really exposed to foreign languages, which is a pity. Note that virtually everyone who has done some traveling regrets that they did not learn more languages in school.

Every group of people in a democracy deserves who they choose to elect. One would have thought that they had hit rock bottom electing Jimmy Carter. But that was 28 years ago, long before many of today's American voters were ever born.

So perhaps they need a vivid reminder of what electing a socialist will do to their country!

Not to dispute ET's points about the relative ease of learning languages in Europe, and I don't doubt that there are many more multilingual people in Europe than here, but still it's not in fact normal for Europeans to have more than two languages. Just about every country in Europe makes it a point to teach every schoolkid English, and so most Europeans (by no means all) are bilingual - they speak their own national language, and English. They deal with all foreigners in English. It's unusual in Europe to learn any third language. It's more common than it is here, but it's not the norm. And of course, Britain is part of Europe, and they're not much better at learning foreign languages than we are, because they already speak English.

The more serious point is that a language doesn't have an intrinsic value. There is no point in learning a language that you're not going to use. Anybody can learn to speak French, but just about nobody in Canada has any use for it - and those few who move to Quebec and find they'll be able to use it, learn it fast. In Europe you can expect to find a use for any neighbouring language you might take an interest in. In Canada, if you learn French in school, you'll normally have forgotten all of it ten years after graduating, since you will never have used it.

Sensible people who travel realize that there are far too many languages out there for anyone to be able to learn them all, and are glad that they got a good grasp on one or two of the useful ones.

Johan I disagree. I know several highly educated Swiss for example who all eventually gave up trying to master writing more than one language, and ended up focusing on one, in all cases English.

That doesn't mean they are not reasonably good at writing the others, but they don't have a really solid command of the grammar, spellings, and so forth.

This is what they have told me, and this is also what I have observed when I see English written by students who are in French immersion.

When it comes to speaking other languages my Swiss colleagues are generally very talented, and several of them can speak and understand four languages.

I agree with Eric but would point out this:
In America, the number of Spanish speaking people is spread throughout the country rather than concentrated in one state. From Florida, to New York, to Chicago, to California and back across Arizona, New Mexico and Texas you will find large numbers of Spanish speaking people. Not ALL states have a lot of Spanish speaking residents but Many do - especially the larger cities. So to that effect, IF an American were to learn another language, Spanish is the logical choice because just about any where you live in the US, you're bound to come into contact with Spanish.

That being said, English is the unifying language of the country and all residents - native born and immigrant (legal/illegal) should be fully fluent in English.

Let's see now Obama doesn't think we ought to worry about illegal aliens learning English because we ought to speak Spanish.

He thinks we should have forced servitude for high school and college students.

He thinks we shouldn't be able to warm or cool our homes as we see fit nor eat what we wish.

Is he trying out for president or Fuhrer?

Let's see now Obama doesn't think we ought to worry about illegal aliens learning English because we ought to speak Spanish.

He thinks we should have forced servitude for high school and college students.

He thinks we shouldn't be able to warm or cool our homes as we see fit nor eat what we wish.

Is he trying out for president or Fuhrer?

Let's see now Obama doesn't think we ought to worry about illegal aliens learning English because we ought to speak Spanish.

He thinks we should have forced servitude for high school and college students.

He thinks we shouldn't be able to warm or cool our homes as we see fit nor eat what we wish.

Is he trying out for president or Fuhrer?

Well, other than English, I am (or at least have been) proficient in fifteen languages (in alphabetical order): Algol, APL, awk, Basic, C, C++, Cobol, Fortran, Lisp, Pascal, Perl, PL/I, Scheme, sh, and Tk/Tcl; and that's not counting the Burroughs L-series, Intel 8080, PDP 8, IBM 1800, and IBM 370 assembly languages, and of course, the languages of geometry, predicate logic, algebra, and calculus.

Obamuhhh, with his "all we's can say is..." might want to try some remedial English.

No, when we go to Europe we should learn how to say "Allah Akbar" - right Barakish oBSama!

That was the cheapest campaign shtick I've seen ... from a contendor for position of World Leader.

The Ubermessiah is clearly an empty suite that the traditional democratic party ruling elite are pushing forward. It will be interesting to watch the deteriation of the man under the pressure of World Leadership while he is told by Chicago union bosses and the Kennedies what to do.

This "man" is nothing and will collapse in office.

If I am wrong, I will eat something appropriate, perhaps my words.

ET @200 pm, you enunciate the same policy that the PQ and BQ demand.

Forget bilingualism: Frnech in Quebec, English in the ROC. They dismiss, even cast off, the french outside of Quebec. Coming from estern Ontario, I can say this is wrong. Also, it is wrong everywhere.

Things is, in border regions, bilingualism is the norm.

First off, I am anti-French so my opinions may seem biased.

There should be French in Quebec. Everywhere else should English. They are a minority and that minority makeup should be reflected in all levels of the federal public service. Period. (Not that my kids would have anything to do with government jobs…they’re all doing quite well in professional fields in Alberta.)

After over 30 years in the military, I have seen the incompetence of those military personnel and public servants who are in leadership/managerial positions simply because they are bilingual. Go research how many language points are assigned for NCM and officers to realize the impact. ‘Nuff said on that….

Fully concur with the inadequacies of French immersion. Had a kid in one, took him out and needed extra work to bring him up to his peers in the English only stream. That isn’t going to happen with my grandchildren.

Eric: If you choose to learn a language to occupy some free time, may I suggest Spanish. I detested every day in school where I had to take French but threw myself full bore into Spanish when I was pushing 50 years old. After ten weeks, I could read a newspaper and pretty well understand the news on TV. My interest in Spanish extends to the trips we take to Mexico every year. There’s nothing like saying a few words in Spanish to an elderly lady or a young child and get a smile in return…that’s never happened in Quebec if I tried a bit of French.

Vitruvius, we clearly speak the same languages! Do you Al Gol? Ah, I see yes, and even you Lisp!!

heay Brother...

I live in Eastern Ontario. I am a Cockney expat. I have learnt French and can speak it easily.

Here in E. Ontario, people slip between the two languages without even thinkling about it. This is not a political choice; this is the result of the majority of people being brought up in famillies where both languages are lingua franca. And the P_Q and BQ want to sacrifice these E.Ontario Francophones. You can understand, then, that the Ontario Francophones are the most loyal Canadians.

Do not criticize franco-Ontarians for the sins of the Quebec seratistes.

Yes, yet alas, RW, we are not proficient in the
same languages, for I am proficient in English.

Vit:

I've always wondered when programmers would be considered bi-lingual. I considered programming but after one class my subroutine kicked in and aborted that idea.

Actually, RW, I don't 'enunciate' or more correctly, promote the same policy as the PQ and the Bloc.

Both of them are separatiste parties; they aren't interested in a federation that includes Quebec with the Rest of Canada.

Therefore, they are indifferent to the fact that the rest of N. America speaks English. They, and their francophone brothers in other nations across the various seas..speak French. And that's their focus.

I am saying that in a federation that includes Quebec, this federation should not be bilingual but unilingual, with each area speaking one dominant language. Bilingualism would not be a requirement for any govt position.

As for the French in other parts of Canada, what about the Chinese, Ukrainians, Germans, and various native languages?

Now, now, vitruvius, predicate logic (and propositional logic as well) are not languages but symbolic expressions of logical interactions and relations. So there. Same with algebra and calculus.

For those attempting to speak the French learned in Canadian or other schools in Quebec, and being met with stubborn stares - it can indeed be the indifference of 'les quebecois' to the ROC, and it can also be that Quebecois, as a language, is totally different from that French you learned. I can't tell you how many colleagues of mine, from France or Belgium, fluent in that European French, can't understand a word of 'quebecois'.

Obama is even willing to sacrifice America the Great Melting Pot at the altar of his presidential ambition.

The man has no scruples oly naked ambition.

Now, now, ET, you don't have the same brain
structure as me. For me, they are languages.
I can speak truths in them, ergo hoc pro foo ;-)

OOOh lookout he is thinking it would be a great goal that people learn to speak a second language.
Talk about a horrible idea what kinda person is this?
You guys are grasping at straws give it a rest already. He is going to win like it or not.

IH at July 9, 2008 10:41 PM: I considered programming but after one class my subroutine kicked in and aborted that idea.

Sounds like a lot of lefties; at some point when presented with reality they usually experience kernel panic and lock up. Then it's reset button time.

Sorry, that was perhaps too vague and techhy, so:

While technically often the operating system could continue operation, after memory violations have occurred the system is in an unstable state. Rather than risk security breaches and data corruption, the operating system stops to prevent further damage and facilitate diagnosis of the error.

I was in France and Germany and guess what...they all don't speak English...in fact the vast majority speak one language....their own.....what is Obama saying that Europe speaks two languages.

1) To learn another language is indeed intrinsically valuble.
- It makes you more intelligent.
- It expands your mind culturally, socially, and historically.
- It keep another small fraction of your braincells active.

2) It also is "extrinsically" (what is actual word?) valuable.
- It enhances your value on the job market.
- It makes your travel & vacations more rewarding.
- It makes it possible for you to find a foreign spouse and thus raise more bi/multi-lingual people.
- It makes a country as a whole more competitive in the increasingly global marketplace.

3) All society or region I know has only one de facto official language. In cases several languages are officially recognized by the central government, this is basically never the actual case among the people/regions. (Cmp Switzerland, Belgium, Canada, Finland, ...). Thus it is a complete folly to prescribe bilingualism from the top (like PET did), it has to come from choice (e.g. based on intelligent advise from people like me).

4) If Europeans indeed only can read and write in one other language, it means Europeans can read and writetwo languages, i.e. their own and English. (In fact, many are also reasonably fluent in three or four.) So why don't we accomplish something similar here? Imagine if all Canadians were indeed reasonably bilingual (or multi-lingual) (of course with a strong first langauge):
- In ROC, English with French/Spanish/German/Italian/Chinese/Hindi/Russian/whatever.
- In Quebec, French with English/Spanish/German/Italian/Chinese/Hindi/Russian/whatever.
Wouldn't that be wonderful, not only for the individuals themselves, but for our competitiveness as a country?

5) One way of accomplishing this could be to make at least three years of high school studies in one (perhaps two) foreign language mandatory for university admittance. (And then of course also offer a variaty of languages in high school, i.e. other than French.)
(I would also recommend more history and philosophy to be mandatory high school subjects for university admittance. But that's another discussion.)

No, johan, there's no inherent value in learning a language. The only value a language has is its utility - what you call "extrinsic" value. The idea that learning a useless language is worth doing because it's "good for the brain" or "it makes you smarter" is based on the assumption that otherwise you'd do nothing with your brain. And that's plainly not necessarily so, or even likely. If you took the time you wasted on your useless language and spent it learning to play a musical instrument, or learning math, or just in reading decent books or watching some worthwhile TV, you'd be in every respect better off.

It would be easy to find all sorts of languages a knowledge of which would be precisely worthless in terms of increasing one's job prospects or quality of life. The reason we don't produce large numbers of bilingual people in this country is indeed that in the circumstances that prevail for most people in this country, there is no benefit to be had from being bilingual that in any way justifies the effort, and the opportunity cost of learning the useless language rather than a useful skill.

By the way, this learning four and five languages is more than a bit deceptive, since all languages are not equally foreign to one another. There aren't any languages that are very close to English, and those that are close (like Dutch and German) are more complex than English, so there are no foreign languages than an English-speaker finds easy to learn. But there are several groups of European languages that are so similar that if you speak one, it's very easy to learn all the others. Someone who claims to speak four languages - French, Spanish, Italian and Portuguese - is actually speaking four different idioms of a single language. And the effort and difficulty of learning them is fraction of what it would take an English-speaker to learn three other languages.

It's easy to imagine if all Canadians were required to be reasonably bilingual by the time they graduated from school. We would have exactly the same number of functioning bilingual adults as we have today, with a much higher number of people who once knew another language and then forgot it because it was useless.