Noel Sheppard at Newsbusters:

Consider the following e-mail message I received this morning from someone that appears to work for the government of Ontario, Canada:

What are you, retarded?

Global warming = MORE snowfall. Not less.
Meaning snowfall records will be broken.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2008/03/06/climate-propaganda-works-global-warming-equals-more-snowfall

What?
Ice kills fish? Never.
Methinks these DNR people just wanted a free extended fishing season.

Okay, so how come I can go ice fishing and find fish? Why aren't all the fish in our lakes dead then? Are our fish smarter than Minnesota fish?

No, ice does not kill fish. Too much ice and snow cover however will. Shallow lakes are prone to "winter kill". It is quite common in Alberta's rather shallow lakes compared to those that tend to be much deeper out east.

By the way, the winter fish-kill might go up if the total length of time that the lake is frozen over is longer than normal, but the thickness of the ice alone shouldn't matter, except to the extent that it delays open water in the spring. Winter photosynthesis/oxygen production is negligible from what I understand. A lake's oxygen supply comes from the atmosphere, not the plants living in it, even in the summer.

So maybe this planetary fever thing has fried that DNR guy's brain.

Water is the only thing that expands as it freezes, EVERYTHING else contracts.

This little quirk of nature is rather convenient to us all because if water contracted as it froze, there would be no life on this planet.

Winter kill happens all the time on shallow lakes, but I am not so sure you can predict a winter kill on a lake if the fish are still alive?

The Expropriation of my property has ruined my life.

Go to my blog site and see for your self what went on, document that was not disclose until in court on March 2005,

lesson to trial audio of what was said by Judge Russell?

My owned lawyers entering the documents,that are not on the Affidavit of documents list? of the Government.

There was Evidence tacking out By the applicant's Lawyers ,one day before trial and so on? date February 28/2005 ? the Applicant will not know until March 5/2005? the Applicant respond with a letter to his LAWYERS with a letter dated March 5,2005.

i took a heart attact and need soon help to keep a roof over my head look at my blog site: http://govinjustice.blogspot.com

Wild, bewildered, envious (of the independant, successful men/women) craven lefto pretend nature lovers have been 'concerned' about the fish for years. Back in the 1980's the Dipper camp followers in the Yukon shut down all the placer gold miners in the Klondike (they were making waay too much money without gov't 'help') because the fish could not see in the silty water resulting from humans digging in the creeks! Of course anyone who had ever viewed the Yukon River joining the Klondike could see that one was naturally silty because it is glacier fed - the fish had been living very well in that silt for years! The fish all died in Lake Labarge though, because the city of Whitehorse flushed their toilets DIRECTLY into the Yukon River and the Yukon runs down through that lake. Dippers did not want to waste money on a proper treatment plant for their offal (they are Puffin like) so the fish died and the greeenies lied and the miners left.

Now the Yukon gov't apparently feels fine about a Chinese outfit mining in the Yukon with their own imported state owned slave labour from China. The Yukon Nevada mining Co. has a deceptive name - NO AMERICAN investment is permitted!!

'Just as long as no American or Canadian citizen is mining in this territory the pollution thingie is not an issue' is the message I'm hearing. We have several packs of greenies and lots of Dippers up here and I have not heard any squawking from any of them.

Things that make me go hummm?

I'm surprised the greenies weren't asking for the Nat'l Guard to come out and use torches to melt the ice to free the poor fishies! Ice. On lakes. In winter! The horror!!!!

The Climate Charlatans like Gore and Suzuki have moved on to "Climate Change", it got too icy for them. Never mind they've made big bucks on their scam. Gore has become a multi-millionaire, $100 million is estimated so there's money in spewing hot air and traveling the world doing the carbon footprint thingy.

Speaking of Y2Kyoto...One of it's moothpieces is stepping down from the UN throne...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_depth/7283088.stm

Is'nt Louise Harbour a big Kyoto/Climate change fan?

It happens all the time in N. Alberta & N. Saskatchewan and N. British Columbia. Last year there was a massive winter kill on all the lakes. When you get as much snow and cold from October to March, like we did last year, you get winter kill. They are doing the right thing, catch as many as you can, the rest of the live ones will populate the lakes over time.

Last winter the Fish and Wildlife called in every commercial fishermen that was available and netted the lakes. The fish that they were after were the Whitefish and Tulabi. They eat the eggs of other fish. looked down at bottom of several lakes and you could see floor littered with dead fish.

I hope they do not think this is a new precedent in there Global Warming issue. It happens all the time. Maybe they are depending on the headlines again to scare a few more of us unbelievers into their religion. I am quite sure it has happened in Minnesota before and will happen again. Merle Underwood.

The coming several harsh winters caused bu reduced sunspot activity will put an end to this sillyness....the overlords of green feudalism will have to find another scare to propel their global resource regulating agenda...say global cooling?? Been done huh?

Don't you have to cut holes in the ice to catch any fish? Wouldn't that tend to help the ones you don't catch by letting in some oxygen? Presumably the hole wouldn't let in any sunlight if it's inside one of those ice-fishing cabins I've only seen on TV, but every little hole helps, right? Or do they freeze right over as soon as you've done fishing? Curious minds from warmer climes want to know.

"Consider the following e-mail message I received this morning from someone that appears to work for the government of Ontario, Canada:

What are you, retarded?

Global warming = MORE snowfall. Not less.
Meaning snowfall records will be broken."

And this Ontario Government employee will no doubt be enjoying another 30 - 50cm of Global warming this weekend.

Couldn't happen to nicer folks.

I thought we were getting droughts.

More extreme weather...it really isn't a hard concept...try to keep up.

Global warming = warmer, wetter, more food grown, less disease, civilization advances.

Global cooling = colder, drier, harder to grow food, populations starve, disease, death, etc.

Nature is fine in any scenario; it's us that used to have to worry. Now, we don't.

CBC News reporting on a Government of Canada report predicting more extreme weather as a result of Global Warming...more of everything. More droughts, more rain, more storms, more snow, warmer summers, etc. (and colder winters, no doubt).

They've got all the bases covered.

When we have warm, snowless winters, the "experts" say this is due to global warming...and when we have colder winters with more snowfall (like this winter), that is due to global warming. Riiight!

Oh goody. Moonbat, the leftarded dipper offers his two cents worth. Just admit it Sean, AGW is a crock of s@#$. All of you panic buttons were wrong. Let's put our energy in dealing with real environmental issues....say.....like....oh....maybe....COMMIE CHINA!!!!!!!!

jerk off!

"More extreme weather...it really isn't a hard concept..."

Sean, could you give us a comparison between this year's weather and that of, say, 1173? Or 386?

Or how about 1971?

Global warming: it causes the sun to set!

the beeb gets it backwards.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_depth/629/629/7278084.stm

lets put a timescale to these, say about 4 million generations.

Eventually most people will just throw up their hands and say WTF. The AGW crowd is running out of BS and what they say one day is contradicted by themselves often within days. You can fool most of the people.....

First it was "Global Warming" then "Climate Change" and for those of you, not keeping up to date, now it's "Global Climate Distortion."
It's and old trick, when things aren't going the way the alarmists predict, spin a new name.

All this money wasted on a scam when there could be affordable housing built and schools hospitals, this is so crazy. The sun regulates the heat here on earth Sean, yea same as you turning up your thermostat when you are cold in your house, should I repeat for a leftie. What have we come to when people are this stupid they believe the likes of Suzuki and Gore.

Global warming causes cold, global warming causes hot. Before long even the dumbest figure out it's a scam.

I say let's set those computer models up as if 1960 is present day and run them to predict 2008. That ought to sink the scam.

bill-tb: They have done exactly that, and surprise surprise, they have to run the model many many times with many many "fudge factors" to get anything even close to what the current reality is. Alas, it doesn't thereby replicate reality in, say, 1990, though. Funny, that. What are the odds that the models, with these same fudge factors, will replicate 2020 properly?

By the way, wasn't the term "climate injustice" tossed around a few months ago?

Remember though, it's not "global warming" anymore. It's "climate change". So even if it's starts getting colder. That's our fault too.

DNR have been installing airators which pump oxygen into the water to prevent or reduce the winter kill of fish for decades in some Manitoba lakes. This is NOT a new phenomena by any stretch of the imagination. To use this decades old conservation method as an example of yet another urgent requirement to stave off a pending ecological disaster caused by global warming is just another bold faced lie by the hysterical dooms day crowd on the left.

bill-tb, wot johnn said, they can't even preedickt yesterday's climate, so how the H can they predict 50 years into the future???

I'v said before (as has another poster whom works in the computer industry) the programs they use are totally inadiquate. They use modified (for simplification) statistical programs, and these do NOT allow for feed back lops, thus garbage in, BS out!!

and to further, just read that prince charles thinks deniers are MAD, someone should tell the fool to STFU, and just be a royal twit

HEY GREENPESTS WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT THOSE FREEZING FISH WHILE FLAPPING YOUR BIG FAT ASTUPID PIEHOLE ABOUT THIS GLOBAL WARMING POPPYCOCK BULL KAKA

Heh.

Every blog needs a Spurwing Plover...

C02 is causing climate change!! Whether it is warming or cooling big oil, not small oil, is causing the change. Drive your car less and the winters will get colder.

I'm driving my big American pushrod V8s as much as possible and yet continue to freeze from the draft emanating from your general direction. Clearly, someone's not doing their part north of the 49th. Catch up before I catch my death.

I bet the fish would agree --- The founder of The Weather Channel calls for Al Gore to be sued for fraud.

Kate sure knows how to show her true colors.

She nevers posts the gaffes of Harper. Where is NAFTA-gate and Cad-Scam.

She filled this blog full of criticism when the ad scandal plagued the liberals but not once does she mention the flubs of Harper.

This blog doesn't speak for fair and open dialogue I suppose - its just another part of the extreme right wing propoganda machinery.

Sean S. You are a GW advocate and a member of the NDP, gee-wiz Imagine my suprise.

A warmer climate will increase the evaporation of the oceans, leading to more snowfall, leading to thickening of glaciers and at the poles, which will all contribute to a DECREASE in sea level.

Or am I getting mixed up?

beardyscree --Try one of the left wing blogs,they cover all sides with fairness and equality.....Sheesh....

warm cool up down land increases land decreases, these screwy maps about say it all. all in a time frame of only 160 million years. remember new york is flooded in only 8 more years.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_depth/629/629/7278084.stm

Remember: it is one of the main tenets of Gaia that anything which supports AGW is "evidence"; anything which does not is an "anomaly".

So if it snows more or less than it's supposed to, well, there's your proof; and if it doesn't, well, that's an anomaly, pay no attention.

the other half of the balance is covered by the lefty MSM - CBCpravda , CTV(tass) , CNN. the beeb.

I live on Baffin Island, Nunavut (Eastern Arctic)and have been up here for the past 20 years. I am also an avid outdoorsman hunting, fishing, prospecting etc.

Each winter (that's Oct to June for us!), we have to drill 4-7 feet thorough ice to fish for Arctic Char. It's bunk that thick ice kills fish because if that were true, then we'd not have any fish up here in one of the most hostile winter climates on earth.

BTW, you can tell Al Gore for me, that his global warming scam is just that, a scam. Inuit elders will tell you that weather goes in cycles. This year has been one of the coldest that I have seen in 20 years. Lots of sea ice and sorry, our Polar Bear population is healthy and thriving thank you very much!!!

Freezin my ass off in Canada's frozen North!

.....beadryscree, we cover factual goings on, not phantom ones cooked up to take away from Liberal failings like hiding behind curtains for HOC votes.
Some courage, some Official Opposition.

How about your gnome Steffi, he gets served legal papers and ignores them. Being in denial is one thing but ignoring a legal demand is just plain dumb.

We get lots of lakes it happens to in MB, I think the ice can get to be 10 feet thick which means on lake MB you have to go out a mile for the water to be that deep.

Drive your SUV to save the earth eh.

So if it snows more or less than it's supposed to, well, there's your proof; and if it doesn't, well, that's an anomaly, pay no attention. Posted by: Darrell

Darrell, our daytime highs in Winnipeg have been about 20 below normal if the highs were a mere 10 above normal, that will be because of global warming but 20 below is just normal weather.

Meanwhile in Antarctica the ice is melting.

The term Global warming didn't work for Leftist eco nuts because one would actually have to see the globe warm for it to make sense.
They then coined the the term "climate change" so the ignorant could be led to believe that the combination of warming and cooling could still happen if the planet warmed up.
This term is failing because the climate change trend is leaning heavily towards cooling of the planet.
So if I may I will be the first coin the next term the leftists will use to obfuscate their socialist agenda.
Bi-polar regional effective disorder or BRED for short.

Sean S.: "More extreme weather" -- no this makes no sense at all if included in the "extremes" is extreme cold. How can global warming be causing more extreme weather if to date we really don't seem to have any warming (apart from the scarcely noticable 0.7 degree or whatever and no warming for the past 8 years?) I have lost all hope that the powers that be, media and general public will ever escape from this global warming nonsense and I am now trying to figure out what psychological dynamic can explain large numbers of people behaving in a completely irrational way.

In our area of Manitoba we have a local lake that while it covers 2 or 3 sq. miles is only about 5-8 ft. deep on average. It is fed from a shoreside spring. While the lake freezes over in winter the immediate area where the spring water trickles into the lake never does. Back in the 60's and 70's it was quite common for residents to come down to the springs with grain shovels and pitch forks and wade into the boiling mass of northern pike, suckers, etc. and simply shovel them out onto the ice. The reason given was that they were starving for oxygen and it was a curious thing to see. This phenomenon usually occurred in early winter say late Nov. early Dec. and after that time all that was left were millions of dead fingerlings and hammer handles. Also a fragrant aroma.

none of us will live long enough, but the earth will become a cold, dead, dry rock. all the science and all the bullshit will not change that.

OK folks, the reason for the fish die off is low oxygen levels in the water. There has to be sufficient oxygen in the water to support the population of fish. Some very deep lakes with relatively low populations of fish can withstand deep snow and ice cover without problems. Shallow lakes with no means to produce extra oxygen are susceptible to fish die off during periods of thick ice and/or snow cover. Allowing extra harvesting of fish in affected lakes is actually helpful in allowing the remaining fish a better chance of survival.

While we have a hard winter in much of North America, other places hardly have any winter at all:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,334876,00.html

Probably like most of you, I'm tired of this cold and snowy winter. Can't we get some of that warming here too? Why should the Swedes get it, and not us? They already have the hot blonde girls. Not fair!

"A warmer climate will increase the evaporation of the oceans, leading to more snowfall, leading to thickening of glaciers and at the poles, which will all contribute to a DECREASE in sea level.

Or am I getting mixed up?"

Any ice at the north pole is a wash because it is floating. It will displace the water it floats on which will be the same mass of water that it takes to make the ice.

"She nevers posts the gaffes of Harper. Where is NAFTA-gate and Cad-Scam." beardyscree at March 7, 2008 12:29 PM

YOUR OWN STATEMENT SHOWS YOUR PARTIASNSHIP. WRT CAD-SCAM THE PERSON WHO WAS ALEGEDLY BRIBED SAID HE WAS NEVER BRIBED, AND HIS WIFE THE ACCUSER SAID THAT THE P.M. HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. I APPLUAD KATE FOR NOT POSTING THIS REDORIC.

WRT NAFTAGATE ONCE AGAIN THE IS NO STORY. BILLERY WAS LEADING IN OHIO REGARDLESS AND WAS GOING TO WIN, THIS DOESN'T EVEN MAKE THE AMERICAN NEWS CYCLE.

ON TOP OF THAT, BILLERY ALSO HAS SPOKEN OUT AGAINST NAFTA, THEREFORE IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO WINS THE DEM NOMINATION.

ON TOP OF THAT, YOU LEFTIES ARE FOOLING YOURSELVES IF YOU THINK THE NEXT PRESIDENT ISN'T GOING TO BE AN "OLD WHITE GUY", I KNOW IT MAKES YOU RACISTS SICK TO THE STOMACH, BUT "OH WELL."

FIND ONE SIGNIFICANT GAFF FROM THE PM AND THEN POST. THEN WE CAN HAVE A LEGITIMATE CONVERSATION ABOUT REAL ISSUES.

Beadyscree

The fact is this.

The Liberal have agreed to giving a "virtual majority" to the Conservatives. If the Liberals disagree with the current government they are welcome to vote against it. You Liberals have nothing but accusations, where is the beef? When you have a legitimate issue with the government, bring them down. If; and this is a big if, the Liberals are on the right side of an issue they will have nothing to fear at the polls.

It is YOU who voted for these Liberal jokers, and it is YOU who are reflected by your elected representatives. Tell me how does it feel to look in the mirror and see S.Dion. No substance, No intellectual honesty, No limit to how far or low you will go to push you anti-western, anti-capitalistic, anti-Christian, anti-woman agenda.

Ouch! Jon - my eyeballs hurt...

Playing billy-goat gruff with beardyscree the troll isn't worth it. There's 5 cm of bone protecting that last remaining brain cell.

BTW, and OT: I really think we need to take out ads in American papers that say: "Kill NAFTA so we can raise our oil prices."

Waddya say, beardyscree? How about imposing a 20% environmental levy on the oil we send to the Americans. After all, it's a carbon tax! Anyone suggest the idea to Dion yet?

Posted by: beardyscree at March 7, 2008 12:29 PM

"She filled this blog full of criticism when the ad scandal plagued the liberals but not once does she mention the flubs of Harper."

Whoa!!! I take a day off and miss a whole lot. Are you telling me Harper snuck across the border into Minnesota and froze some fish!?! Then flubed up and got caught! Damed porous borders!

Right on, Tenebris. And raise our iron ore price, copper, nickel, lumber, pulp and paper, beef,coal, gas...hey, its for Gaia right?

Of course there's this one tiny problem that we do 80%+ of our export biz with the Yanks, but we count for less than 20% of their imports. The US economy farts and a force 10 hurricane decimates Ontario.

Have a look at the TSE this week Lefties.

Good one Tenebris. Laffing at that one. Taliban Jack most likely will grab that idea before Dion.

Next head line for the leftards

"KILL NAFTA 'CAUSE IT CAUSES GHG. THOSE DAMN AMERICANS ARE CAUSING THIS." THEY SHOULD PAY FOR THEIR FREEDOM OF CHOICE.

Just f'en incredible. Someone in the gubmint actually had the foresight to allow the fisherman(fishers for dippers) to enjoy fishing . Damn the regulations,full speed ahead. I like this common sense approach.

I look at this way. Bring on the next mini ice-age! The sooner the better. You see,once our crops are cut back by 75%,no more evil oil being pumped out of the ground,very little electricity,etc,the first ones to die off will be the leftards/socialists who rely on the gubbermint to support them. See. The gubbermint will be to busy looking out for themselves to worry about a few leftards/Dippers.
Meanwhile,us knuckledragging,Neanderthal,mouth breathing conservatives will know the skills to survive in an ice age scenario. So the leftards/Dippers/AGW Kultisits get massively reduced in numbers. Who says Mother Nature (Gaia) doesn't know what she is doing? Don't f**k around with women!!

none of us will live long enough, but the earth will become a cold, dead, dry rock.

That's after it gets burnt to a crisp when the sun goes nova, in about 10 billion years. Now THERE is some global warming worth worrying about.

it's happenning

in america

shoot all the fish.. EH!!

Water is the only thing that expands as it freezes, EVERYTHING else contracts.

Then why do ice cubes get smaller the longer they're left in the freezer? What causes ice cube spikes?

You deniers-who-deserve-to-be-in-jail cannot pull the wool over our eyes, water *shrinks* when it freezes based on anecdotal evidence from millions of people!

I mean, like, fer chrissakes I can witness this happening in my own fridge! Are you deniers blind?

PiperPaul, you should apply for a grant to study your theory. lol. You may be onto something. Or like the AGW folks, not so much.

More extreme weather...it really isn't a hard concept...try to keep up.
Posted by: Sean S. at March 7, 2008 9:06 AM

But, Sean S, my dear airhead the weather is nor "more extreme". It just isn't doing what your perfect little computer model said. That's because it's weather. Jumping up and down and insisting that the earth is warming, doesn't make it so. AGW is just that. Since the climate is exposing the charlatans for what they are, now they want to call it Climate Change. Otherwise , well, to paraphrase another believer, no proof is no proof is no proof, and if you have no proof, well, there is your proof. Just because the global temp varies from the mean temperature of the last 100 years, doesn't mean anything is happening outside the norm. Averges are just that. Look up the definition Sean S. It will help you sleep better and ease your hysteria.

In our area of Manitoba we have a local lake that while it covers 2 or 3 sq. miles is only about 5-8 ft. deep on average. It is fed from a shoreside spring.
Posted by: Free Thinker at March 7, 2008 2:26 PM

Hmmm. We may live in the same place.

PiperPaul, you should apply for a grant to study your theory. lol. You may be onto something. Or like the AGW folks, not so much.

More extreme weather...it really isn't a hard concept...try to keep up.
Posted by: Sean S. at March 7, 2008 9:06 AM

But, Sean S, my dear airhead the weather is nor "more extreme". It just isn't doing what your perfect little computer model said. That's because it's weather. Jumping up and down and insisting that the earth is warming, doesn't make it so. AGW is just that. Since the climate is exposing the charlatans for what they are, now they want to call it Climate Change. Otherwise , well, to paraphrase another believer, no proof is no proof is no proof, and if you have no proof, well, there is your proof. Just because the global temp varies from the mean temperature of the last 100 years, doesn't mean anything is happening outside the norm. Averges are just that. Look up the definition Sean S. It will help you sleep better and ease your hysteria.

In our area of Manitoba we have a local lake that while it covers 2 or 3 sq. miles is only about 5-8 ft. deep on average. It is fed from a shoreside spring.
Posted by: Free Thinker at March 7, 2008 2:26 PM

Hmmm. We may live in the same place.

PiperPaul, I do hope you are Joking.

Look up 'Sublimation.'

Very basic science.

And if you are joking... well some jokes go like that.

Note to sean: If this is 'extreme' weather, how is it that we had even MORE 'extreme' weather before the faux age even got started? How is it we are breaking records set as long as 150 years ago, if this weather is more 'extreme' than anything we've ever seen?

I agree with previous poster who say that there should be MORE global warming. The Great Lakes have remains of coral reefs from when it was tropical. That's the way to go: make Thunder Bay the new Cancún!

PiperPaul: "Then why do ice cubes get smaller the longer they're left in the freezer? What causes ice cube spikes?

You deniers-who-deserve-to-be-in-jail cannot pull the wool over our eyes, water *shrinks* when it freezes based on anecdotal evidence from millions of people!

I mean, like, fer chrissakes I can witness this happening in my own fridge! Are you deniers blind?"

You utter twit. Ice cubes shrink in freezers because of sublimation. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the behaviour of floating ice or landbound glaciers in the natural environment.

Uh, cgh. PiperPaul was using sarcasm. Hard to recognize in print perhaps, but I'm quite certain it was indeed sarcasm.

And I apologize for my double post earlier. Wracken fracken technology!