...Gadzooks! She looks like something out of Star Wars...

And of course how will one know they got a real doctor/nurse and not an imposter?

Reminded me of the spoof on British drivers licences.

I've always wished womeone would invent a hospital gown that didn't leave a person's nether regions flapping in the breeze, but this is ridiculous.
Also, good luck to medical staff trying to get a look underneath this burka.

"And of course how will one know they got a real doctor/nurse and not an imposter?"

What about a suicide bomber with biological/chemical weapons walking around any hospital?

I knew it. Muslims really are a Hazardous MAterial, requiring special biological isolation suits.

Sick Muslims in hospital gowns are very scary.

before anymore of you anti-muslim freaks spew more hatred, it wasn't that long ago, in canada women couldn't vote nor did they have the right to study at universities and become doctors etc...

and our society changed over time without being bombed or invaded by some foreign country who taught our primitive ways needed to change

"before anymore of you anti-muslim freaks spew more hatred, it wasn't that long ago, in canada women couldn't vote nor did they have the right to study at universities and become doctors etc...

and our society changed over time without being bombed or invaded by some foreign country who taught our primitive ways needed to change"

Nice try at relativism! Listen, I am not about to apologize for what my country did to make it great! The foremost being not forcing people to live in the 6th century! So get off your high horse Jacobin!

Jacobin - you're right - it wasn't long ago that women couldn't vote, couldn't go to university to become doctors.

The reason I oppose fundamentalist/radical/conservative Islam is because I don't want to lose my right to vote, to go to university, to become a doctor.

I don't want to become a human set of drapes sitting in the corner waiting for my male relative to escort me outside the house.

The British are taking their rehearsal for becoming an Islamic Republic very seriously - they should be commended for ending a thousand years of England so gently and peacefully, it's very post-modern of them to encourage their own submission rather than put up a messy fight that they don't have the stomach for.

"She looks fine, discharge her, and next patient please!"
"Bu-bye"

jacobin - our society changed because it had permissions in place, the biggest one was the tradition of permitted secularism granted to us by our Judeo-Christian roots. We were permitted to work out our civil arrangements unhindered by a centralized religious authority. Islam can't.

Criticising Islam, fossilized in its 7th century intolerances, is more than fair game. Only a very immature mind can't distingush between "hatred" versus criticism. So, you can take your little indignation snit and run along.

Oh, and, their primitve ways do need changed fast. They are the biggest threat out there to humanity at this time in history.

What the hell's she doing receiving medical treatment in the hospital in the first place? According to the Taliban, who are dedicated Islamic scholars devoted to perfecting Islamic society, women are excluded from medical care. A woman cannot be touched by a male doctor, and females are not allowed to be doctors, therefore it is impossible for a woman to receive any medical care, Allah absolutely forbids it. It sure looks to me like there's some kind of Islamic death penalty offense going on in that photo.

It also suggests that the KKK were ahead of their time. Unisexual and all that, they long ago embraced the fashion for both men and women. Come to think of it, their spiritual beliefs are not dissimilar either...

penny , you are full of shit

the canadian women fought for there rights, because during WW2, they realized after working in the factories when there men went off to war, they could do whatever men could and demanded there right to vote

and it was the christian establishments that labeled women has sub-human in the first place, and stripped them of there G-d given rights

and for you twist this around and potrait islam has being a threat to humanity is bullshit

iraq was a secular muslim nation until the U.S invaded it, and now it's run by fundamentalist

what makes you believe that all muslim women want to be westernized?

Fitting name for Jacobin: The Reign of Terror/The Red Terror/the Islamist fascist Terror: Jacobin. ...-

Jacobin/Jacobins.

The Columbia Encyclopedia, Sixth Edition. 2001-05
After the fall of the Girondists (June, 1793), for which the Jacobins were largely responsible, the Jacobin leaders instituted the Reign of Terror. ..

Wacko jacko,
Women got the vote before world war II didn't they?

You are an ignorant buffoon. Some people don't want to be westernized? Fine. I don't want to be "Easternized"!!!

Why do you dig into ancient history for wrongs? They are far in the past. You sound like an Islamic fanatic complaining about the Crusades hundreds of years ago for crying out loud!

jacobin - I'm not ratcheting this up into a delightful troll game for you. Life's too short. Game someone else.

Nice duds but does it have the obligatory rear ventilation opening?

This is slightly off the topic, but WHAT are the Canadian passort requirements for these people? Are they allowed to have their full face cover on for passport and drivers license photos?

If so what is the point of the photo.

Does anyone have any knowledge of this?
Thanks

the point is

muslim nations are no that different than what canada used to be a 100 years ago

social change sometimes isn't easy, but no country has he right to force it's own culture upon others using bombs and guns no matter how much we disapprove of there culture

what's funny, is that many of you right wingers try to taliban your beliefs onto evry other canadian, by banning gay marriage, abortions and etc

jacobin...

...sooooooo tell me where does one draw the line on protecting the innocent, like say children from pervs?

Wouldn't that line then still be "talibaning your beliefs"?

"the point is

muslim nations are no that different than what canada used to be a 100 years ago

social change sometimes isn't easy, but no country has he right to force it's own culture upon others using bombs and guns no matter how much we disapprove of there culture

what's funny, is that many of you right wingers try to taliban your beliefs onto evry other canadian, by banning gay marriage, abortions and etc
Posted by: jacobin at September 5, 2006 12:28 PM"

That's pretty stupid. I was here nearly a hundred years ago, and Canada wasn't ANYTHING like muslim nations. And you must be pretty young because you are awfully naive. People's have ALWAYS imposed their culture on someone else's if they can get away with it. That's why we have wars. Good luck changing that... "taliban your beliefs..." A new word for the language - implying imposition of beliefs and values - just like the NDP and Liberals do... wow....

tomax7

that's a stupid question

Wouldn't that line then still be "talibaning your beliefs"?

--of course not

let ma ask you this

since the invasion of afghanistan, the opium poppy trade is up 900%, and making it's way into the veins of canadians

whereas when the taliban were in power, the opium fields were almost all wipeout

social change sometimes isn't easy, but no country has he right to force it's own culture upon others using bombs and guns no matter how much we disapprove of there culture

You are absolutely correct!

So when are the Islamic terrorists going to stop trying to force their culture on to us ungodly
non-believers through the use of bombs, guns, suicide bombers etc?
Get a grip. No one invaded Iraq or any other place in recent times because we wanted to change their culture. We are merely trying to protect ours.
Sheesh!! What universe are you living in?

"Talibaning your beliefs.." Thats a good one. I think you've just provided Whacko-jacko aka "the Buffoon" with the purpose of the Afghanistan mission. Nice move, lefty.

skip

you old fart, you were probably one of those archie bunker types that was against women's rights

and you were probably one of those archie bunker types that thought blacks were sub-humans in the 60's

and you probably hate them there drunk indians, that manage to escape there reserve and stubble into the city from time to time, eh skip!

The left is entertainingly stupid.

More please jacobin.

So what happens when one of these patients has, say, a problem with her ear? Or nose? Are infidel doctors permitted to look?

...just makes you wanna scream

"dirkka dirkka jihad!!!"

So Jacobin, you'd be what, 15? I sold all my slaves and whores just after the last Great War. Pearson made me provide too many benefits, and Trudeau wanted me to give them to him. Drunken indians? nah, made too much money sellin'em hooch.
Comin' to fall cross burnin' this weekend? We're gonna roast a pig! Y'all have a nice life, son.

"So when are the Islamic terrorists going to stop trying to force their culture on to us ungodly
non-believers through the use of bombs, guns, suicide bombers etc?"

--tell me who are these Islamic terrorists?

iraq never attacked us
the taliban never attacked us
the palestinians never attacked us
hezbollah never attacked us

on the other hand

the U.S invaded iraq
the U.S invaded afghanistan
israel invaded lebanon

9/11 was orchestrated by osama bin laden
(a saudi), none of the 19 so-called hijackers were iraqis (most were saudis)

palestinians are islamo-fascist ready to take over the world, they are fighting the ILLEGAL israelis occupation

we have destroyed the al cia duh bases in afghganistan

we have toppled the taliban in afghanistan

SO WHO ARE THE ISLAMIC TERRORIST?

It's useless to argue with cultural equivalence twerps, but it's so hard to resist, isn't it?
Can you think of any living thing, be it a plant, animal or human being, that would willingly go through life enclosed in a dark, stifling tent?
Whenever they run their yaps about modesty, I always think of various religous groups, Amish or Mennonite, that preserve the idea of modesty by dressing plainly. But they're not locked away like subjugated animals, so I assume some muslims would regard them as westernized sluts.
People in these costumes are scary. I'm not frightened of the particular person, but I'm concerned about what they represent, and the impact they will have on all of us.

What this represents?
The embodiment of a millenium long festering of twisted ideology.

Interestingly, it is called an "inter-faith" gown but in fact is islamic. Nothing "all encompassing" about it, as "inter-faith" or ecumenical, should be.

Oh, wait, it IS all encompassing.

Gee, Skip, that moonbrush sure does paint a wide swath. I think the only other slur jaco didn't use on you was "yo mama wears army boots".

Kids these days, geeesh!

Really,how can you be ANY STUPIDER than to appease,defend and protect a radical religious group sworn to and intent on murdering you,your family and friends.
Guess it is self-explanatory then as to why these sentiments seem to come solely from the left.

You're too racist for this cat.

Praise be to Allah. What I'd like to know is why is it that it took pressure from the Muslim community to change the standard hospital gown that leaves every other patient walking around with their ass hanging out? Hopefully this will make its way to Canada soon. I'd even convert to Islam just to get one if forced to stay in the hospital.

Wait a minute, that's the regalia of the Romulan Ku Klux Klan!

Surely these immigrants must of known that when they emigrate to a western country that they are to leave behind their old customs.

When they ask for hospital burkhas they should be told, they are not available here and if you insist then go back to wherever you came from...they have them there.

Last shot at Jacky-boy: Lad, when some foreign whack-job(s) pulls something like 9/11, unlike the left, we don't spend our time just sitting around arguing about what the memorial is going to look like.

I'd even convert to Islam just to get one if forced to stay in the hospital.

I guess the right is smarter than the left - any time I've been in the hospital, I either took my robe with me or asked for a second gown.

But, for some, converting to Islam would be consistent. No thinking is required to be a lefty and it's not allowed in Islam.

I knew a Calgary doctor that worked the emergency department of an Abu Dhabi hospital. They had to build bigger examination cubicles.
If mom came in with a stomach ache, a son, interpreter, nurse, and doctor would have to squeeze in.
Mom told son, who told interpreter, who told doctor. The doctor would try and do an examination through the clothing like a game of blind man’s bluff. Then he would ask a question that was passed on by the 2 other people, like that children’s party game where a statement is passed from person to person down the line and everybody had a laugh how mixed up it is by the end of the line. So on and so on, back and forth.
Six months was enough for him there.

kathryn - nice point. Bring another gown if you don't like the hospital gown. Robert McClelland would be an easy convert to Islam; as you point out, no thinking is required in the Islamic world. Just mindless obedience to the Collective Rules, and that's the case whether in sectarial socialism or Islamic socialism.

I'm sceptical, but I frankly doubt that a UK hospital would actually treat a patient wearing that gown. That's for non-doctoral viewing, and therefore, I don't see the point of making a fuss about it. How would a doctor/nurse be able to check for the broken leg, or the cut or..?

Jacobin, the problem is that the story is showing that the presence of Muslims is moving the culture back to how it was "100 years ago" (in fact I would point out that Muslim culture is more Dark ages than Edwardian, but whatever floats your boat.)

All countries enforce social norms - this is what makes them countries. This is why multiculturalism is such a failure: large numbers of unassimilated people within a country become a hate-filled minority, set on tearing down the conventions which built the country in the first place.

1885 - In Alberta, unmarried women property owners gain the right to vote and hold office in school matters.

1916 - Manitoba becomes the first province to give women the right to vote and hold provincial office.

1916 - Women gain the right to vote and run for office in Saskatchewan provincial elections.

1917 - Women gain the right to vote and run for office in British Columbia provincial elections.

1917 - Women gain the right to vote and run for office in Ontario provincial elections.

1918 - Women gain the right to vote and run for office in Nova Scotia provincial elections.

1918 - The Canada Elections Act gives all women over 21 the federal vote.

1919 - Women gain the right to vote and run for office in New Brunswick provincial elections.

1925 - Women gain the right to vote and run for office in Newfoundland elections.

1940 - Women gain the right to vote and run for office in Quebec provincial elections.

Jacobin AKA Wacko Jacko.....perhaps a little more studying before you spout off what YOU believe to be true. Notce that the ever progressive province of Quebec was the LAST province to give women the vote.

Regarding jacobin's assertions :

before anymore of you anti-muslim freaks spew more hatred, it wasn't that long ago, in canada women couldn't vote nor did they have the right to study at universities and become doctors etc...

the canadian women fought for there rights, because during WW2, they realized after working in the factories when there men went off to war, they could do whatever men could and demanded there right to vote

Women students were allowed in Canadian universities for the first time in 1863 (Mount Allison) - technically before Canada was Canada.

The first female doctor started practising medicine in Toronto in 1867 (she went to medical school in the United States). The Toronto School of Medicine allowed her and a second women to study there in the early 1870's. She finally received her Ontario medical license in 1880.

Canadian women won the full right to vote in 1918 (this started with Manitoba, Alberta and Saskatchewan in 1916).

muslim nations are no that different than what canada used to be a 100 years ago

100 years ago women in Canada could attend school up to and including university, could become doctors, and were within 14 years of being granted the right to vote.

ok4ua said: You're too racist for this cat.

Why is it when people want to discuss another culture or belief that we happen to disagree with, we are all racists? Yet when other cultures trash our beliefs and religious stance, they are expressing their opinion that is guaranteed by the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. News flash for the lefties.....that same Charter of Rights and Freedoms protects my beliefs too. Get over it. Just because I disagree with the Liberalistic point of view, does NOT make me a racist!

now she can walk in her local Gay Pride Parade and nobody will be the wiser as to who she, or he is. Freedom from oppression at last !!

Its such a liberating feeling to have your sexuality coverd up in a robe all the time.

Praise allah

I have the impression that death by breast or uterine cancer would be more acceptable to male dominated Islam than breaking their male imposed taboos.

Now, can anyone point to the chorus of angry western feminists or UN sponsored medical practitioners indignant at how this nonsense impacts women's mortality rates in the ME? Women under the Taliban in Afghanistan were denied medical treatment systematically. How unlucky to be born a girl.

This multi-culti driven rush to accommodate our 7th century interlopers is nauseating. Burqas are an abomination against women. It's about power not piety. Isn't it time in the West to finally take a stand and clearly state that your primative demands are outside of the realm of how we choose to live. Deal with that or leave.

Why is it that muslims can come to this country and bring their 7th century beliefs and dress and culture with them, and try to force us to comply, yet when we go to their country, we have to embrace their customs. It will soon be Christmas and this year let us all offend a muslim and leftist by using the Nativity Scene, wish everyone a Merry Christmas, and not shop in any store that has happy holiday displayed. The west was recently warned to convert to Islam or face the consequences. The only good thing the PM of Iran has done is purge liberal professors, students and teachers. Can't wait to see all the cbc reporterettes in burquas on the news.
OT. When will John Karr confess to the murders at the pig farm in BC.

You know, I hate to say it, but... that outfit could be a lot of fun if you were, you know, into some kinky role playing.

Wink. Nudge. Say no more.

I wonder if they make them for couples?
Imagine the comments:
"Why does that lady have four feet and a smile?"

...so there I was wearing my burka and suddenly the religious police decended upon...

*blink*

Oh look a shiny thing!

You know, I hate to say it, but... that outfit could be a lot of fun if you were, you know, into some kinky role playing.

Actually, on that front, it kind of reminds me of the red surgical gowns used in the movie "Dead Ringers". Was Cronenberg consulted on this design?

Go to bloody Hell jacobin! Imagine a Muslim woman telling any man that today, yesterday or tomorrow and still have her head! You may also note that many Muslim women are traipsing our streets with exactly that total cover-up, usually in black. It's a tragedy of life for those poor souls, while the freaking men go about in Western garb looking cool in 21st century. Again let me say, go to bloody hell!

Hold the phone!

Look at the eyes in the photo!

And then look at Kate's photo in the sidebar!

Kate -- is that you in the gown?

Or was this a Kate-o-shop entry?

Just wondering.

Funny how mute(except of course the obligatory racist accusation)the left becomes when their self-described claim of being'defenders of the oppressed'is actually put to the test.
Here's the clear message they are sending muslim women who are currently denied equality and even some basic human rights here and across the globe...tough sh*t.

BTW,the young women forced into submission and arranged polygamist marriages in Creston B.C. are far overdue for a rescue.
What do those self-righteous cows at SOW actually do with all that government supplied money?Other than constantly attack the honorable role of mother/wife in this country that is.

reading right wing neonazi posts like yours Liz here at smalldeadanimals is bloody hell

Denis, nitpik all you want, those brave women you listed were all exemptions to the rule, and fought tooth and nail for there accomplishments

and my mistake, i stand corrected "Canadian women won the full right to vote in 1918"

and why was it they couldn't vote in the first place? because the "christian" establishments ruled by men labeled women has "lesser than man" and therefore weren't human enough to vote

and what triggered that social change was the fact that during WW1 women realized they could do whatever men could do, and they fought for there G-d given right, it wasn't simply GIVEN to them

and it's ironic that the harpercrites of canada are very much on par with the taliban, wanting to control and impose there "evangenital christian" beliefs onto other canadians, like being against gay marriage, abortions, against multiculturalism etc...

This lady is such a slut and a whore! I can see her EYES!!!! Where is her veil?! Any man who gazed into this womans eyes would be too tempted to resist her. She should be raped and stoned!!!!! In fact why is she outside her houes? Where is her man escorting her? This liberal loose lusty lolita is no true Muslim!

If you deny Muslims the right to their religion you are an intolerant racist!!!!

By the way, you will all join Islam or you will die by the sword! See, we really are a religion of peace.

Cardstonkid

that was funny :)

but seriously, there are over 1.2 billion muslims in the world, and most are not fundamentlist like the taliban

if fact the U.S is friends with most of them

pakistan
iraq (hehe)
turqey
egypt
libya
saudi arabia
UAE
kuwait
qatar
lebanon
etc

Denis, nitpik all you want, those brave women you listed were all exemptions to the rule, and fought tooth and nail for there accomplishments

You seem to ignore the fact that the society of the day allowed these women to protest and invoke change instead of having them jailed or killed. The ability of western (i.e., post-reformation Christian) culture to tolerate differing opinions and change when faced with compelling reason is one of its strengths (and at the same time maybe its great weakness?). Has western, Christian society always been perfect? No - but it has produced the best results so far.

I would also remind you that it has been the Christians of past years that have helped effect some of the great social changes, not exclusively (or even predominantly) the secularists.

Jacobin,

WWI had bugger all to do with women's voting rights. The Woman's Christian Temperance Union started to campaign for women's voting rights in 1902. Notice that this was both a Conservative and Christian group.

"The woman suffrage movement in Canada had its beginning in 1878 under the leadership of Dr. Emily Howard Stowe, who was one of the founders and the first president of the Dominion Women's Enfranchisement Association."

Women didn't just come to the realization they were equal to men all of a sudden. They'd been fighting for equality for millennia.

Here are the first western nations to extend full voting rights for women:

1893 New Zealand
1902 Australia
1906 Finland
1913 Norway
1915 Denmark, Iceland

Notice that this trend pre-dates both world wars...

Notice also that the countries that were first to allow women to vote are all countries that enjoy the fruits of the Christian heritage. In other words, Christianity was not a hindrance to women's rights and was in fact, the value system that gave it a catalyst. Women (and every other group you can name) have more rights in the countries with Christian heritage than any other place. Period.

Jacobin, you are an ignorant, foolish and stupid person. Your rants here only make yourself look bad. You should do more to educate yourself before you open your mouth. To equate the Taliban with any group of Canadians save the small number of Islamofascists in our midst it supreme rhetorical excess. These sorts of slurs don't reflect badly on their target. They reflect badly on you.

"and it's ironic that the harpercrites of canada are very much on par with the taliban, wanting to control and impose there "evangenital christian" beliefs onto other canadians, like being against gay marriage, abortions, against multiculturalism etc..."

Some secular humanists also believe in these values; they are not restricted to Christians.
You do not require religious belief to champion traditional marriage or the right of the unborn.
Multiculturalism has been and will be a failed policy in perpetuity.

And yes, since I don't support multicultarilism, that brands me a racist. But at least I am a racist who hates everyone equally.

The fastest way to get rid of a troll, and a stupid one at that, is to cut off their oxygen supply. No response, I know, it's so tempting, but, after a few more death rattle posts, they are dead. Gone. As zombies of their former life on this site they leave to find some other conservative site to play with. It's the natural cycle of things in cyberspace.

I thought I'd mention it. And the fact that like all of the women posting here, including Kate, and all of the women that went before me in my family, we'd have been out of burqas a long time ago if that was our initial immigration outfit. I have a cousin who's a nun, retired after 30 years of teaching, she's got a really nice wardrobe. She gets her hair done on a regular schedule. She travels. Her mind is open and accepting. She's a wiz at finances. The difference between a cult and a religion is its ability to adapt with dignity. That pathetic creature in her cloth coffin has zero chance of Islam freeing her.

"but no country has he right to force it's own culture upon others using bombs and guns no matter how much we disapprove of there culture"

- That's right. During WWII we should have let Hitler do what he wanted in Europe and Africa. After all it was their European culture to kill Jews, disabled people and homosexuals right? And todays places like the Congo, Somolia, Sudan, those places don't matter we should ignore them too because they're black people and killing each other is what they're culture is all about right?

History is full of people having to fight to get personal freedom. If you think European cultures just changed without any wars then you need to read some history.

As to the unfortunate women who have to wear bags on their heads and are treated worse than dairy cattle when it comes to their health. It amazes me to no end that liberals are so quick to condemn discrimination in our so called western cultures - yet are so quick to allow discrimination in other cultures in Canada just because of their skin color. Its just amazing.

Jacobin,
Go to the left's blog sites such as Rabble or Babble. You may notice that no-where on the site is a Conservative allowed to give their opinion without being bounced from the site.
The right allows discourse from the left without censorship. The left wing blogs do not.
Think about that for a while and see if settles into any area of your brain.

jaco, let me make a few suggestions:

"it's own culture" - you mean "its"
"there culture" - you mean "their"

Now, finish your carrots and you can have pie.

ok

i was wrong about the timing of "The woman suffrage movement in Canada" still it points to a time not to long ago that wasn't too kind towards women right here in canada

however, no one seems to be able to answer this simple question

WHO ARE THESE ISLAMIC TERRORIST?

it's ironic that the harpercrites of canada are very much on par with the taliban, wanting to control and impose there "evangenital christian" beliefs onto other canadians, like being against gay marriage, abortions, against multiculturalism etc...

Hoo boy. Yeah, that's a very Talibanesque agenda indeed.

But anyway: since you're apparently in favour of the slow encroachment of sharia, what the heck do you care, anyway? Harper not fashionably ethnic enough to get away with such a hellish (and caricaturized) agenda? Or is Harper just not extreme enough? I mean, for ex., being opposed to gay marriage - but in favour of a "civil union" option - is so pussy compared to the Muslim preference for jailing or killing gays outright...

hey dudley

if muslims are so evil, why is the bush administration so buddy-buddy with saudi arabia, pakistan etc...?

and my mistake, i stand corrected "Canadian women won the full right to vote in 1918"

i was wrong about the timing of "The woman suffrage movement in Canada"

Jacobin, you deserve points for admitting when you're wrong. However, you lose them and a few more for posting such easily disprovable statements in the first place.

Do you ever wonder what else you're wrong about? You should.

I thought it was a Casper Cartoon.

jacobin: We appear to have struck a nerve here. That's very telling. Neo-Nazi? Don't think so fella. Neo-Nazi's are a socialist movement, not a fit with the "Right" side of things. Get a grip and come back later, much later.

harpercrites "alliance party" are very much aligned with fascism
------------------------------------------------

"Do you ever wonder what else you're wrong about? You should"

--i have no problems admitting when i'm wrong, and i learn from it, however not one of you harpercrites can do the same, and that will be your downfall come next election

--and i was wrong by a decade, (big fucking deal)
the fact remains, women in canada not that long ago were treated like second class citizens (my bad) they weren't citizens because they couuldn't vote

--and 100 years ago, isn't ancient history!

i sat with my 3 daughters, trying to explain to them how a religion can treat women so bad(understand, they are 12, 15 and 19 and could not care less what happened 100 yrs ago)...and i could not do it...the words were not there...they just stared at that picture in amazement...my daughters now understand why we are in afghanistan...

"Who are the Islamic Terrorist(s)?"

Well some of the dead ones were in those planes that flew into the Twin Towers, others are those who planned to smuggle bomb making materials on to passenger flights, probably most of those attending training schools in Pakistan, Hezbollah,...

Oh right, those are just Mossad agents impersonating Islamic Terrorists.

my daughters now understand why we are in afghanistan...

oh for fuck sakes kingstonlad, things won't change in afghanistan because of our bullets and bombs

and after afghanistan, should we attack saudi arabia?

and why is it for pakistan to mistreat it's women? bush has no problem with pakistan

1...do u kiss your mother with that mouth?

2...if a woman wants to wear that crap...fine, if forced to do so, under threats of death, etc., as an ex canadian soldier i feel it is our duty to protect that innocent person

if u do not have what it takes to stand on the line, shut up and leave the real work to the ones that have the courage to stand up for their convictions

STOP FEEDING THE TROLLS

sorry

"2...if a woman wants to wear that crap...fine, if forced to do so, under threats of death, etc., as an ex canadian soldier i feel it is our duty to protect that innocent person"

--right, so why not attack saudi arabia kingstonlad?

"shut up and leave the real work to the ones that have the courage to stand up for their convictions"

--will your daughter that is 19 join the canadian armed forces and go to afghhanistan?

Well even if you don't believe in guns and bombs, Jocobin, when was the last time you at least rallied in front of the Iranian [..insert communist/islamic fundamentalist islamic state here...] embassy against their treatment of women and civil rights? Hmmm? Never? I thought so.

The left is hypocritical. You can get hundreds of morons out to protest against GW Bush, but its as quiet as a frigging night in northern baffin island whenever anyone decides to protest the mistreatment of women by the fascists in [...insert fundamentalist islamic state here...].

the thing is lang

there are human rights abuses done by almost every country on the planet

the difference is, now that all the reasons for which 'W' has gone to war for, have been exposed as lies

first it was WMD'S
then it was Iraq-Al Qaeda Connections
after it was regime change

then only thing left now is human rights abuses

so i ask again, is pakistan next?
what about china? saudi arabia? pick a country any country

stop feeding?

a good move...he's making them look like cowards.

"...he's making them look like cowards"

--i don't see your ass in afghanistan, put your money where your mouth is

Served militia, long time ago, I'm almost 60 now.

But I wouldn't serve in this bullshit war.

dave m

are you a bush supporter?

The first and best method of subjugating a persons will and self-worth is by removing their identity. In fact the Muslims that subscribe to the Islamic principles of covering up their women have mastered this form of abuse. Mentally and physically these woman have been brainwashed into this subjugation. It is most unlikely and a bit naive to think that they have 'a choice' in the selection of there clothing. I guess there choice would be a beating or wear the outfit, not much of a choice.

Jacob

Your ridiculous attempts at equating our civilization and history with the Arabs is laughable. I am afraid like many left-wingers you are of the view that all civilizations are equal. This is not in fact the case. Some civilizations are just more equal and better then others. Also comparing a woman’s struggle for equality to an Arab woman’s is at best disingenuous and at worst, an insult to Arab women. Even before Western woman could vote, etc here they were certainly not slaves, stoned to death or mutilated by there partners.

I see that your jumps in logic are becoming more and more disjointed as the post goes on. Perhaps you should sit back and ask yourself this question along with your last post:

What came first: Jihad or the Western worlds foreign policy?

Bush?
No.
He's the worst thing to happen to the world in 50 years.
And I could never vote for a slimy dishonest punk kid like harper.

I just thought you were making the other commenters look like fearful cowards. As in:

"Oh my god. Oh my god. culturally sensitive hospital gowns. they're going to kill us. we're all going to die>"

"Your ridiculous attempts at equating our civilization and history with the Arabs is laughable"

--not at all, i don't approve of the taliban form of government, however to equate them with all other arab countries is a lie

--first, the taliban to my knowledge are not arabs

secondly, many other muslim countries are very much secular, women in iraq under saddam for example, were allowed to vote, become educated etc.. you could even buy playboy magazines in bagdad

egypt, lebanon, turqey the list goes on

Jacobin, you bet he is a Bush supporter, as are we all here.

And we eat people like you as an hours d'oeuvre.

now, are you going to behead us, a la jacobins did during the terror in France two hundred plus years ago?

WImpy

the only beheading i do is force feeding you truth via the keyboard until your head explodes

david m

my apologies

It's a terrible thing what's happened to this country...lots of people...the people who talk here for example...who are afraid of the world.

And yet they put on tough guy masks in the hopes that the mask will eventually remake the man. These guys are weenies.

If kingstonlad was my neighbour and gave me that crap he spouts here, I'd throw his ass off my property. Wouldn't count on him for back up in a fight either.

Dave M

i couldn't agree with you more!

First, in the matter of nosocomial sartorial style, I've often advocated a hospital "poncho" i.e. a blanket with a slit in the centre to poke one's head through along with a simple belt. It could serve as a warm, modest cover while allowing access for examination/procedures and do double service as, well, a blanket. For one thing, the hospitals I've worked in are so freakin' cold and the standard hospital gowns so flimsy that hypothermia becomes a real concern.
As for accommodating the cultural sensitivities of everyone who comes through the door, I say "stuff it". We don't have the time and the system doesn't have the resources to waste on burdensome cultural whims. We can, and do accomodate within reason, but there's a limit. You got off at this country, we didn't get off at yours. As for the outfit displayed, it's a joke. While purporting to be for patients undergoing medical procedures, I'm hard pressed to imagine what medical procedure could be performed on someone wearing such an outfit -- an ultrasound? an electrocardiogram? a transthoracic echo? a central line? Heck, I'd be hard pressed to examine or start a large bore IV on this person let alone prep them for a thoracotomy. So spare me the nonsense. Singapore demands that all persons, including muslims, show their faces, have facial photographs on their ID, and remove sunglasses when entering a bank. And guess what -- the muslims comply because Singapore won't put up with their BS. It's about time we did the same.

Jacobin,

Judeo-Christian society has been evolving nicely for 2000 years. How many years ago were men granted the right to vote? Not that long before women - it's been a long, slow process - interrupted by the odd war, revolution, civil war, etc., but it works.

If the US is on "good terms" with Pakistan, Saudi Arabia et al, it's out of necessity. It's called "realpolitic".

You've obviously picked up a smattering of English since you've been here (I loved your"exemption to the rule"), but no understanding of our culture.

I suggest you consider one of two options, since it seems that you're hell bent on imposing sharia law on the rest of us:

1. Go back where you came from
2. Go fuck yourself

how about?

3. you explain to me, how afghanistan is different than pakistan and saudi arabia when it comes to women's right?

See 1. and 2. above.

Also note classic post above from Sooz:

"I don't want to become a human set of drapes sitting in the corner waiting for my male relative to escort me outside the house."

3. Nuances...jacobin. If, militarily, I could sit behind computers..distort history..blather profanely..look over at the mirror and puff my chest out...then I could take them all on at once...or one at a time...rather like you..here..eh??? But in the real world. People die. And the answers to your questions, my friend, are out there. Do not wait for them here. Someone with as much anger at the stupidity of others for not sharing your particular point of view, deserves to get out of his chair and get those answers..first hand. Be sure to come back here on your return from asia and share those answers with the good people here.

You ducked my question jacobin. Which proves my point. Hypocrit.

DrD: I am also a medical professional. That burqa suit she's wearing is useless. The whole point of a medical exam is the exam.

Its amazing how liberals will decry even the slightest mistreatment of women (ie: this so called equal pay for work of equal value is the latest in issue seeking), yet they'll support the mistreatment of women if they have an offwhite skin tone.

lang

"You ducked my question jacobin"

--what question?

people duck my questions all thge time here at SDA, guess that makes them harpercrites

Trolls are so droll

Afghanistan’s opium harvest at record levels. "W" you’re doing a heckuva job

and

Haven For Peace: Pakistan just loves the Taliban

The surprising announcement comes as Pakistani army officials announced they were pulling their troops out of the North Waziristan region as part of a "peace deal" with the Taliban.

If he is in Pakistan, bin Laden "would not be taken into custody," Major General Shaukat Sultan Khan told ABC News in a telephone interview, "as long as one is being like a peaceful citizen."
– ABC News, Sept. 5, 2006.

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2006/09/05/breaking-haven-for-peace-pakistan-just-loves-the-taliban/

should we invade pakistan now?

The plan is to stay the course and don't talk to anyone on the other side until it's over in 2050.

the LONG WAR

who are these islamofascist ready to take over the world and make us wear parkas

In the eight months ending last May, Justice attorneys declined to prosecute more than nine out of every 10 terrorism cases sent to them by the FBI, Immigration and Customs Enforcement and other federal agencies. Nearly 4 in 10 of the rejected cases were scrapped because prosecutors found weak or insufficient evidence, no evidence of criminal intent or no evident federal crime.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2006/09/03/america/NA_GEN_US_Terrorism_Prosecutions.php

but if someone were to listen to FAUX news, the apocalypse is just around th corner

Does 13th century medical care go with the outfit?

Should do!

Jacobin said:

"--not at all, I don't approve of the Taliban form of government, however to equate them with all other Arab countries is a lie."

I realize you are debating several people at once here but I think you are playing a little fast and loose with history and the truth.

Egypt, Turkey and Iraq are far from being secular societies. They all have suffered and continue to suffer to varying degrees under the same despicable societal rules as the Taliban endorsed. I do not believe that any one of those societies even comes remotely close to being equal to our Western culture or comparable to woman’s fight for equality in the West. Can I assume you are playing Devils advocate here or do you truly believe that these quasi democracies are equal to us.

To this day Egypt and Turkey still recognize women as property, Iraq, under Sadam had his death squads, rape/torture rooms and butchered women for sport. Lebanon may be close, but it also contains a large proportion of 'Christian' Lebanese who have been a moderating factor there. But women's rights basically do not exist even there.

The year is 2006; the ME has had the same time and opportunities to get it right as we have. They have failed miserably and let us face the facts, it’s their religion that is the problem, not the West, or the boogy-man, it is there religious ideology period.

Link

missing link

that was in response to

"Your ridiculous attempts at equating our civilization and history with the Arabs is laughable"

--which i replied

"--not at all, I don't approve of the Taliban form of government, however to equate them with all other Arab countries is a lie."

--and no i do not believe that these quasi democracies are equal to us, nor are they equal to the taliban

--however, people are trying to create a climate of fear, that all muslim nations are terrorist states with no human rights, and that is false

'Have been away and have had time to read only a about three-quarters of the posts here.

But a few things come to mind:

1) How do you know who's under this thing? 'Could be a female, but could also be a male, who could have "things," meaning concealed weapons, under it.

2) Vis a vis # 1), isn't this get-up a threat to the security of a hospital? I don't think I'd like the wo/man(?) in the bed next to me, or across the hall, wearing this thing.

3) Is this a joke? Nothing in Kate's post indicates that it is, but I can't help laughing when I see this photo. It's RIDICULOUS! Can it be for real?

4) Has Britain totally lost its collective mind? Until recently, this would HAVE to have been a joke. It could ONLY have been a joke.

Jacobin

I don't believe they are trying to create a climate of fear. More like being prudent. When day after day 99% of the terrorist activity in the world(with the exception of South America)is caused by Muslims people become concerned, and rightly so. Inherently your argument that these ME & other countries have human rights is false. They are not real democracies, but instead theocratic governments who use ignorance, fear and religious ideology to supress there populations and that includes Turkey(reason why they are not part of the EU)

In any event the poor bastards living in these third-world dungeons, have by any Western definition no rights, human or otherwise.

...meanwhile, joe looks at his belly button link...

What was this thread about?....Damn....oh, yeah, the eye-slit bhurka thing in hospitals. On that topic, I truly don't mind and don't care about anyone else's particular cultural markers, BUT a draping head-to-toe covering garment that leaves only eye-slits is in real terms a sort of threat.

To not be able to know whether the person underneath is a woman or a man, or if they are who they represent themselves to be is an unacceptable break in the bond of social trust.

If Islamic women wish to remain in a curtained-off area where they are free to show their faces to staff, that's fine too.

This thing is outrageously pandering to a minority. Who know what is under this gown? A guy? A bomber?
Does it come with it's own gadget pouch on the inside?

Can any old minority group get special hospital wear designed, or just those that blow up subway trains, buses, airplanes, night clubs and tall buildings?

Not only is this absolutely ridiculous, surrender-monkey-Muslim burqa (forget this "inter-faith" nonsense, unless this hospital begins to allow Christians to wear robes with large crosses on the back and front, preferably red) a security risk, it's also a health risk.

How is anything supposed to heal under a heavy, humid "tent." Tents need airing, and how is this going to happen with this germ-infested burqa?

How is it that when it comes to Muslims, and a few other political issues I can think of, we park our brains at the door? What would be TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE in any other population--as I mentioned earlier, how about an inter-faith gown with crosses on it?--is somehow just fine when it comes to followers of Islam: more appeasement of a segment of the population which has been wreaking havoc on our democracies in the West.

It just doesn't make any sense, and I'm totally sick and tired of our collective bending over backwards to accommodate a group which has consistently, since 9/11, unleashed clearly unacceptable, destructive, and ruinous havoc on our many populations.

No more burqas in hospitals, please. They are public places, whose security and standard of health would be put at serious risk. If Muslim women must wear them in the privacy of their own homes, that is their right, but it is not their right to wear them in public places where by doing so they put others' security, safety, health and wellbeing at risk.

ENOUGH ALREADY.

--and i was wrong by a decade, (big fucking deal)

Jacobin, putting that awesome leftwing education of his to use.

Well done lad!

Jack will love this outfit, as it means unionized hospital laundry workers can strike for more pay due to the increased workload of washing this outfit. Or do the women/men/bomber have to bring their own. I was once in a labor room with a hutterite woman, and she was horrified that she would have to undress and remove her panties to deliver her baby. That was 48 yrs ago.

Trying to talk politics with jacobin is like trying to teach astrophysics to a retard. You get nowhere and end up just frustrating yourself.

It ain't worth your time trying. Jacobin isn't even useful by troll standards.

Like a few others on this thread, I've been trying to figure out who (or what) Jacobin is. My guess, based mostly on his Anglophobia, is that he is neither muslim nor leftist, but a true blue descendent of those loveable Quebecois folks who cheered for the Nazis before (and even during) WWII. This would also explain his difficulties with English spelling and grammar.

He is obviously very young, brainwashed and extremely agitated, so be thankful that he is venting his spleen on SDA and not busy placing bombs or setting fire to Jewish schools.

Seems that noew folks are getting wise to Jacobin...
Good week already!

Huh. Makes me wonder what an inter-faith proctoscope looks like.