As a good Scot (or at least a good part-Scot), I can safely curse those damn limeys for not getting things right in this country (as well as others...)

If those inbread English dukes they let negotiate with the "natives" would have done a better job our "natives" would behave themselves as they would be Canadians instead of a bunch of deadbeats with a bad case of the entitlements.

Why do i get the feeling that the long hot summer is just beginning?

Do any of you feel that this is telling when the message is so mixed and ill informed?

Not to mention the association of disparate other conflicts being somehow relative to their cause?

Do these idiots really want a war?

Of course they want a war. They know that most politicians are pathetic snivelling Neville cowards who would rather sell out their taxpaying citizens than confront thugs and criminals.

*sigh* Just another initiative of "the usual suspects" in the Vancouver area...a bunch of unemployed professional activists that gathers for any left wing cause...meanwhile we're flying in Mexicans to pick fruit because these unwashed bums refuse to get off welfare...

I think it is time for tough love. We made the mistake of isolating them on reservations instead of integrating them into the new mainstream culture.
It is time we closed the reservations and invited them to join us as equals. As long as we support dependence they will not learn how to integrate. The whole reservation system is a crutch that is not holding them up but pushing them down. They have to get on with living in the present in the new world we have helped isolate them from all these years.

they'll get together, do some drugs, revell in their victimization and dance around in their self inflicted filth and squalor in the downtown eastside of Van.

It's always someone else's fault.

They'll conveniently forget about the wars of aggression they fought with each other, the slave trade that made to coastal tribes tons of wealth.

Fair trade - land for technology. These tribes were half a step out of the stone age at first contact. Had no metals, alphabet, anything they now use. Europeans provided the technologies that they never paid for.

So we are square . . . technology for land, booze for tobacco.

Steve d,

That's the first half intelligent post I've ever read from you. Congratulations. There might be a latent Tory in you after all.

Ok Time for some feedback;

1. Over 500 dead and/or Missing Aboriginal Women across Canada;

Aboriginal women have had a hard time of it, however I believe history and statistics have shown they have more to fear from the aboriginal men, then the majority of Canadians.

2. Routine police abuse, racism & violence against Indigenous Peoples;

Sorry no bite here on this one. Our Police forces "For the most part" treat everyone of any race with respect, and only use violence when it has been used against them. Every group has a racist moron in it. The police are not the only group like this (Talk to people at the FSIN sometime.)

3. Indigenous Peoples in Canada have the highest rates of cancer, aids/HIV, tuberculosis, and other diseases;

Well again, I believe statistics and history will show the some diseases come from poor living conditions (Filth, poor eating habits, etc). While others come from poor choices (Drugs, Prostitution, etc) These are all personal choices, again not forced upon Aboriginals by the majority of Canadians.

4. Indigenous peoples have the highest levels of poverty, unemployment, homelessness, and imprisonment;

Yes, True statistic. How to you fix this? With Education of course, which is free to a majority of Treaty Aboriginals in Canada, paid for by the Majority of Canadians. So if they are not getting their free education, is this not their choice, again not forced on them by the majority of Canadians.

5. Indigenous peoples have the highest suicide rates in Canada;

If I was a prostitute, with Aids, Tuberculosis, lived in filth and was uneducated, I think I would be in a pretty depressed state. Suicide would probably be at the top of things to do tomorrow. However there are numerous groups that support, assist, and help anyone in Canada who wants help to change their lives. Again, choice of individual comes into play. I don't any Canadian would want anyone to be thinking of suicide, and I don’t think a majority of Canadians force this on anyone.

6. Indigenous lands & territories remain under attack by government and corporate forces;

Wrong. Land Claims continue to be settled, slowly, but they are being settled. Indian held lands are not being appropriated currently under any gov't. The reverse is true, Gov't are handing over thousands of acres of land nationally to resolve land claims. The Majority of Canadians would not accept appropriation of lands from Aboriginal peoples or any peoples in current day society.

7. Canada is guilty of the attempted genocide of Indigenous peoples;

Wrong. Until you can show me the Canadian gov't doing anything like the Central American, Asian, or Middle Eastern style genocides, Aboriginal peoples have it pretty good here. "Heck they can even riot and burn up things with no action taken against them..."

8. Canada is guilty of the theft of Indigenous lands;

Possibly, in some cases yes. In some cases, Chiefs willingly turned over the land to the Gov't in trade for possessions like guns, liquor and other crap. Sorry not my fault, some chiefs were smart and got free education, health care and such. Others got crap that only lasted a few years. If I spent $100,000 on a car that was worth only $1,000. I don't think the Gov't would come bail my butt out.

9. No Olympics on stolen land (and get the fu*k out of Haiti & Afghanistan).

Maybe no Olympics on occupied or conquered land. I guess if you want to try to take it back. Except I think the numeric odds are against you.

We were invited in Haiti, I guess we cannot even peace keep now. As for Afghanistan, if you are suggesting you support the Taliban, wow I guess a few writers here were correct. Terrorist want to be it is.

Ex-Grand Chief Ex-PM Martin, Jr.: Let me be clear, fundamentally, er, as I said, clearly, to Chief Fill Fontaine;

How much ya want, Phil?

Phil: Make it $10,000,000,000.00, sucker. ...-

BACKGROUNDER

ABORIGINAL PEOPLE IN CANADA
AND THE FEDERAL BUDGET

The 2000 Budget commits to building a higher quality of life for all Canadians. As Minister Martin has outlined, this budget ...-

Wow Steve, great post. That's about the reality of it. The vast majority of natives would undoubtedly benefit from your suggestions. Much of their leadership, & a portion of the legal industry wouldn't care much for it.

However with the demand for employees as high as it is in some areas, with firms having to hire foreign workers, much of it may be as simple as applying for jobs and then showing up for them. I'd say the "invitation" is already out.

Irwin Daisy
If a socialist sits in front of a computer long enough he will write something intelligent. ;)
Here comes the punch line.\
I wish the same could be said for a conservative. ;)
Note for conservatives: the preceeding was a joke. That is, it was not meant to be taken seriously. No, not even the first part.

I'm not so sure about that Steve, I've been sitting in front of a computer for the majority of my waking hours for over three decades, and I've yet to write anything intelligent.

I think it's time to re-name the Department of Indian Affairs the Department of Enabling.

It always astounds me that all the different native tribes are referred to as First Nations as if they are one homogeneous group. I work with FN, aboriginals, indians (whatever the term) all the time and meet good ones/bad ones/ indifferent ones but the one overpowering fact is that the old fueds still live. The Dene don't like the cree, the mohawks don't like crow, etc. I could go on and on. This is not some group that gets along well and would form a single government if they could, but a bunch of small factions that don't like eachother so don't talk to me about FN's supporting each other in one big happy family.

When you sell a piece of land and sign an agreement, by law the purchaser now owns the land. That is the situation in Caledonia that was upheld by the court. The protestors from the reserve have broken many laws to try and stop a developer from making something of the land they bought from the legal owner. What legal basis do they have to stand on exactly? By treaty the land was native owned and then they sold it. Deal done. You no longer have claim to that land. I do agree that reserves need to be abolished and the residents compensated finacially for land claims in one final payment. Then they are free to earn their own living and contribute to society in a positive manner.

The people breaking the law need to be arrested and put in jail period. I don't care what side they are on or what their skin colour is, the law needs to be the law.

Keeping your culture alive is the responsibility of the person. I'm ukrainian and we keep our culture alive in various ways without help from the government. Why the natives and french can not do the same is beyond me. My people were mistreated in a number of ways even though they built a good portion of the west from bald prarie to usable land through back breaking labour. We don't continuously complain asking for land and money even though we were mistreated by government institutions as well. Interment camps and an attempt to kill our language happened as well. Stop complaining and looking for someone else to solve your problem. Step up to the plate like many of your people are starting to do and fix things yourselves.

The newest university building at the U of R is a perfect example. My fees go to build a building with a sole purpose of educating metis and native peoples. In approximately three years, they have managed to squander the majority of their funding and have lost their accredidation. It was completely run by the FN community and they proceeded to hire a board of family members and steal money. This is despicable and sad. A chance to educate youth and remove them from a cycle of dependance wasted on corruption. Why would self governance be any different?

Now they have the gall to hold an anti canadian rally on our Nation's day. Show some respect if you expect respect to be shown back.

Hey Steve D, howcome when I say maybe we should stop supporting Indians (and everybody else) in their squalor and integrate them into society I'm a Conservative Bad Guy, but when you say it you're a Liberal Good Guy?

Common sense is common sense. You stop the welfare checks and suddenly all these people find jobs, just like magic. The ones that are so fried they can't work, THEM we help.

Wow, I never thought I'd read something from steved that had some thought put to it. Well done Steve!

What's common sense and intelligence got to do with being Tory, Daisy?

Published: Thursday, June 29, 2006
GENEVA -- The new UN Human Rights Council on Thursday overrode Canadian and Russian objections and passed a declaration to protect the rights of native peoples around the world, including an assertion that they have a possible right to restitution for land and resources taken from them.

By 30-2 vote, the body approved the declaration that said indigenous people should be free from discrimination and that they have a right "to consider themselves different and to be respected as such." A dozen countries abstained and three were absent.

A coalition of indigenous people who had been campaigning heavily in favour of passage had complained that Canada, a former supporter of the declaration, had switched sides after the Conservative party ousted the Liberals earlier this year.

They said Canada thus joined the United States, Australia and New Zealand -- all countries with significant native populations -- in opposing the declaration. The U.S., Australia and New Zealand, however, have no vote because they are not members of the 47-nation council, which began its first session last week.

The council replaced the widely discredited 53-country UN Human Rights Commission.

Small point, Phantom, but in large-scale systems such as state bureaucracies nothing happens suddenly. There's often good reason for this, for if the derivative of the acceleration with respect to time is too high it results in shock, which tends to be detrimental to the effect you are pursuing. That said, in general we agree.

Over 500 dead and/or Missing Aboriginal Women across Canada;
Routine police abuse, racism & violence against Indigenous Peoples;
Indigenous Peoples in Canada have the highest rates of cancer, aids/HIV, tuberculosis, and other diseases;
Indigenous peoples have the highest levels of poverty, unemployment, homelessness, and imprisonment;
Indigenous peoples have the highest suicide rates in Canada;
Indigenous lands & territories remain under attack by government and corporate forces;
===================================================

Well, thank heavens for the above. If more of them

lived, stayed healthy and fit we would have a civil war on our hands right now.

The best thing that ever happened to the Candian Indians is the moder society of the white man coming along to provide the means for a happy, productive, healthy life ... unfortunately, The Indians appear to be too stupid to take advantage of this and prefer to be the scum of earth with neverending whining.

They are just like the socialists who pretend to bleed for their cause.

Canada is a f**king joke. I will celebrate fourth of July instead.

Indians are victims of their own
ALL LIFESTYLE CHOICES! as are we all.

Missing from this mythical victim missive is the fact that Native Americans always had inter-tribal wars going on before Europeans came and they weren't always the best environmentalists. Herding an entire herd of buffalo over cliffs for a few steaks has turned up in more than a few places by archaeologists.

Name an ethnic group that at some point in their history hasn't had to submit to another group? DNA supports that most of us have roots to a conqueror somewhere in our lineage. When do we get to end the Columbus guilt and tax thing?

If these people really are so principled, then they shouldn't accept one penny fron the filthy and evil Canadian government.

"tough love" from steve d. Reasoned. Wow. Most likely a head fake.

Well, if you do a little critical thinking there Mary Jane you might answer your own question. Failing that, read any topic here and then consider the comments. Failing that,I guess you're a lost cause.

'Scum of the earth,' huh John?

Is that all native people, or just the whiny ones?

But really, you had me at thanking heavens for death and disease.

If Canada is a 'f**king joke' then you are the punchline.

It's not funny, it's sick.

Happy 4th of July.

Penny has made the point. What makes the so-called North American aboriginal any different from any other racial group? The Saxons had their Normans, the Scots had their English, everybody had the Romans, the Muslims had their Mongols, hell, the Spanish had their Muslims - before the Aztecs and Incas had their Spanish.

I guess, the Injuns have their punk-ass Liberals, who haven't allowed them to join the current era and benefit from it.

I've read many a topic here, Daisy. That's why I posed the question.

Anti-Canada Day Rally?

I’m with that!

I’ll be celebrating Dominion Day on the 1st.

It coincides with what is jokingly referred to down at the band office as, Dumbindian Day.

Over 500 dead and/or Missing Aboriginal Women across Canada; maybe if they found a career that was more safe then peddling they're ass on the street corner for nickles and dimes they wouldn't be dead. im not saying prostitutes deserve to be killed but if they got an education and applied themselves they wouldn't have to resort to those kinds of jobs.

Routine police abuse, racism & violence against Indigenous Peoples; there will always be some crooked cop who abuses people, unfortunatly the odds are against aboriginals in this case because there are more aboriginals comitting crimes so they tend to be abused more(again not saying this is right)

Indigenous Peoples in Canada have the highest rates of cancer, aids/HIV, tuberculosis, and other diseases; stop sharing needles and having unprotected sex and you'll discover some of these diseases won't spread. you're children get paid to go to school, why not take advantage of this and kick their ass if they don't learn something.

Indigenous peoples have the highest levels of poverty, unemployment, homelessness, and imprisonment; i don't understand how they have the highest rate of homelessness when every status family gets a free house on their reserve.

Indigenous peoples have the highest suicide rates in Canada; they shouldn't want to kill themselves, if they stopped feeling sorry for themselves for giving away their lands centuries ago they might realize they have more opportunities than anyone else in this country in regards to education and employment.

Indigenous lands & territories remain under attack by government and corporate forces; maybe there still are some lands and territoris that weren't covered in treaties but those that were in the treaties aren't under attack. they are either native lands(reservations) or they aren't(everything else).

Canada is guilty of the attempted genocide of Indigenous peoples; sorry but they are doing that themselves, if they are so worried about their native identity they shouldn't have started breeding with the white man. in fact i was told that under the current definition of a status indian within 80 years there wont' be one left. they have no one to blame but themselves.

Canada is guilty of the theft of Indigenous lands; if anyone is guilty of stealing indigenous lands it is britain. there was no canada way back when, we were still under the thumb of england, take it up with them.

No Olympics on stolen land (and get the fu*k out of Haiti & Afghanistan). if they don't want the olympics on land they claim as theirs, any native that shares that view shouldn't be allowed to participate in the olympics.

Note to B.C. Just check with Dalton on how to handle this.

Dear Steve. Many years ago I lived in the wonderful city of Saskatoon. The wonderful N.D.P. of the day bought homes in middle class neighborhoods and moved in aboriginal people.
They believed that by integrating these folks all our problems would be over. Well it didnt work out unfortunately. Many ideas of the N.D.P. sound so good. They just don;t take the time to think them through well enough. If Militants can get thier followers to buy into
expectations that can't be met. Then trouble happens. If you empower militants, militants are empowered.

melwilde
At least they had an idea. That's one more than any other government ever had.
This tough love idea would be no cake walk but then nothing would. You just have to let them know that there is no going back. The womb is over. Yes, there will be moaning and nashing of teeth but in the end, when there is no other choice, they will get along like everybody else. Often it takes until the third generation to completely integrate a family from another culture into our own. It has to be understood that this will be a fifty year transition before it is complete. It has to be done.

Ha! Penny's confused by my stand on this issue. She doesn't know what to think. What? An exception to a stereotype? I love it! It may take her years to integrate this little curveball to her fixed ideas about the Left. Ha!

my,my what anger and intolerance(I don't get it,life is to short,to awesome),backed up by so much historical inaccuracy,and;based on a few headlines,or what others have said...
how about just stopping and actually hearing what First Nations Peoples are saying...
how about a little more of this:
http://www.honorsixnations.com/about.htm
while keeping in mind ,"judge not least you be judged"

Hey Dirk, you mean stuff like this?

"All my heros killed cowboys."

Bumper sticker on a First Nations minivan I saw in Hamilton today. Tolerant, mmm hmm.

Keep in mind Dirk, what goes around, comes around.

LIKE I SAID,how about a bit more of this;
http://www.honorsixnations.com/about.htm
get it, its about both sides coming together to try and understand the other.

Dirk
The website was not too helpful. They want full title to some land that is theirs. If it is theirs why don't they have full title already?
You see the problem? If they want peace and understanding they could begin at their website and with the people of Caledonia. Their side is not explained. If they want understanding tell me what I have to understand.

There is an old National Filmboard short I have seen. It was done perhaps 40 years ago. The natives brought up Saul Alinsky, a fabled union negotiator, to try to help them work through some issues.
In the end, Alinsky was frustrated that the natives couldn't come down clearly on one side or the other. The issue was that they wanted independence but didn't want to be independent. They were stuck. It looks like they are still stuck. But then I don't really know because their communication is truncated.

I see that honorsixnations.com says that: "Our coalition currently has representation and participation from [...] members of CAW 707, CAW 555, CAW 88, CUPE 3903, CUPE 3906, CUPE 5167, USWA 1005, USWA 1998, the CUPE National Aboriginal Council, the McMaster Indigenous Studies Program, the Six Nations youth group “Spirit of the Youth”, the Niagara and District Labour Council, and the McMaster University Community."

It does seem to me to quite a well rounded collection of professional ambulance chasers, indeed.

I wonder if this might one of the reasons for poverty on some of the reserves. 360 band members and four of the leaders make over $400,000.00 per year. How much does the mayor of your city make?
Thank you Jack Layton for ensuring that the Auditor General won't be allowed to audit these bands. That will sure help the plight of the average native. What a dope. Perhaps if they were audited, the chief would allocate more than $2340.00 for daycare.

http://www.taxpayer.com/main/news.php?news_id=368

Quote "Consider a recent news story out of Alberta. According to information leaked to the Edmonton Journal the chief and councillors of the 360-member Horse Lake Indian band in Alberta make superstar salaries. The chief took home $439,425 in tax-free salary last year (the equivalent of a $700,000 fully-taxable income). Two other councillors were paid just slightly less at $414,500, while the band's Director of Special Projects pocketed $435,000.

To put it in perspective, the Premier of Alberta earned a taxable salary of $121,000 last year and the Prime Minister of our country earned a 'mere' $144,000. Unlike the salaries paid to federal or provincial public servants, the total amount of compensation paid to native politicians and administrators is largely secret. The federal government does now require each band to file an annual listing of salaries paid to chiefs and band councillors. But it is important to note that this reporting process only accounts for monies paid to bands from federal coffers. Many Indian leaders, however, also receive salary, per diems, and other compensation from band enterprises, resource revenue and cash flow from casinos.

The Horse Lake band government is relatively well-off collecting $3.3 million courtesy the federal government and another $6 million from oil and gas revenues. But with so much money consumed by administrative and political salaries, less is available for other needs leaving many reserve residents living in poverty and squalor. In contrast to the big pay cheques for politicians, last year the band spent a measly $2,340 for daycare services, $300 for a prenatal nutrition program, and cut its solvent abuse program. Compare this to the $23,932 the band found to run a golf tournament and $7,019 for a demolition derby!" Unquote

this just in: for all you pierre turdeau fans out there:
http://www.freealberta.com/trudeau.html

and the connection? cretien. used to be indian affairs in the turdeau cabinet.

I told you once Stevie boy, I cant collect on that bet you mentioned, but with your posts today youre edging closer to the fold.

Dirk:

I don't see whats to understand myself?

Most people I know(even a couple natives) get up every morning, if they like it or not and go out the door to work, they suffer their own injustices, and illness.

Most of time even after three levels of government meddle with their lives while "mugging" them frequently they still manage to put a smile on their faces and be useful for something without being a nuisance.

My father has had in the last seven years a heart attack, C.C.L(form of leukemia), colon cancer, and just a day ago found out their is a mysterious lump on his liver and he needs a cat scan. Through it all he hasn't missed much work and jokes even more it seems, the way he carries on you forget hes slowly fading away, and I haven't heard one complaint yet.

Life tinkles on all of us,(whiny) natives can make their own damn umbrella.

It's a more than a bit ironic that the Six Nations (Iroqois) exist on land that was granted to them by the British Crown after they were kicked out of their actual native ground (upstate New York) by vengeful Americans after the American Revolution. Most Iroqois had stayed loyal to Britain, due primarily to the legacy of Sir William Johnson, and made war against the new USA. Two tribes, the Oneida and the Tuscarora sided with the fledgling Great Satan. The land the Six Nations now occupy in Ontario was more Huron than Iroqois.

You folks should give them the "General Sullivan Treatment".

I believe that this part of the country was settled by Europeans long before the "six nations" came here from the USA.

Assuming you mean General John Sullivan, Jeff, and not General Gordon Sullivan, I doubt we'll have to go that far. Of course, I've been wrong before.

ann said;"I believe that this part of the country was settled by Europeans long before the "six nations" came here from the USA."
...dirk:wow,you don't really believe this,or are just quoting what you heard?Again get your facts straight,this is not an insult just a bit of friendly advice.
I will also draw your attention to this letter from the "CAC Review"which is a plea for understanding,in the hopes tempers might calm just a bit to at least get your info correct....
http://cacreview.blogspot.com/2006/06/breaking-bread.html

It just does not matter who came first, who was here first or came after. That water is long ago under the bridge.
The Caledonia disgrace is an example of what happens when governments divide by attempts at 'appeasement' . It does not work in families and it sure doesn't work in countries.
We are either one nation, no matter how our parts became a whole, or we are not.
If we stand by and do nothing about this endless gimme from the indian bands ( they are NOT nations, first or otherwise)we will soon have nothing left to give. They will have it all and "Caledonia Hijacking" will be the order of the day all across the country. They have proven beyond doubt they can manage absolutely nothing.
They are a conquered people, yet our politicians seem to think that they are owed something. IF certain tribes have been granted lands and they choose to sell that land it is no longer theirs.
Dalton McGuinty and the Ontario government have ensured their own political suicide. And in the process may have ensured our decline.
We had better make sure those who succeed this bunch of idiots have at least half a brain among them before they start speaking for us again.
The only victims are those who owned the land and intended to develop it and the citizens of Caledonia. And now all Ontario taxpayers pay for McGuinty to buy the land. What purpose does that serve? Give it back to the rightful owner and kick off the thungs and criminals. How simple is that? Upholding the rule of law must not be that damn difficult. If it is we will have anarchy all across the country.
There can be no divisions in a successful country, one that lasts for many hundreds of years. For in our divisions of French and Indian ( all the other of our citizens with the exception perhaps of the muslims) have integrated into our society and we have to do this to survive.
The business at Caledonia is so outrageously unfair to the citizens of Caledonia and by extension every one of us who expect our police and government to uphold the law.
Wonder what the judge had to say today!

Was there any particular part of that referenced link you were interested in, Dirk, or should we just conclude that your general sentiments lie in the area of the statement to the effect that, if I may quote, "I find it appalling that protesters from Caledonia were singing 'Oh Canada'"?

I did indeed refer to General John Sullivan. Sullivan County, New York is named for him. Today, there are small reservations in New York where Oneida, Onondaga and Seneca live. There's also the St. Regis Reservation that straddles the US-Canada border near Malone, New York. This reservation is occupied by Mohawks that split with the British favoring Mohawks of the Mohawk Valley. This happened before the French and Indian War, when this group of Mohawks decided to side with the French and moved closer to all the heavy-jumbo cool stuff in Quebec. It's also an area that was populated with here-to-fore Iroqois enemies, the long-time French allied Algonquin tribes (e.g. Abanaki Tribe). Not too long ago some not-so-Indian-looking folks who described themselves as Abanakis tried to lay claim to all of Vermont. They said it was their ancestral homeland and they would appreciate an enormous chunk of money to pay for them disappearing. They didn't get dime one.

I hope they are pretty careful at Oppenheimer Park -- I have played in a couple of charity softball games there, and we always walked the field prior to in search of needles, and invariably came up with some. This was back in the 80's. I have not been there for a long time, but I think it is still a fairly derelect part of Vancouver. At least it is on the weekend, and they are not blocking the Stanley Park causeway, so they have that going for them. I read it here previously, but agree with "it has been 200 years -- get with the program". I have also said this previously, my present house is sitting on land that was sold by the local band in the 1930's. I will be the guy blockaded in my house with the rifles and boxes of ammo if they think they are taking it back.

My prediction is that nothing happens.

Britain colonized India for 200 years, and was finally ejected when Ghandi led a nonviolent people's revolt, bringing manufacturing, shipping and the economy to a halt. Ghandi won.

European/Canadian settlers and governments stole aboriginal lands 200 years ago, and attempted to destroy the aboriginal people. Children were forcibly sent to abusive residential schools in Canada for over 150 years

They have survived. Many elders of First Nations today are survivors of government abuse. They want their land and traditional ways back now, according to Canada's legal agreements with them, and according to the Constitution. They will negotiate reasonably, as they want to continue a partnership with Canada. However, they do not want to be Canadians, never did, and Canada agreed.

Accept the inevitable. Land reclaimed, land compensated, and aboriginal self governance.

This is a worldwide movement. More of Canada's violence simply won't work, never has. They're still here and now they're recovering from the holocaust called Canada, and they REALLY want their land and rights.

Denigrating and dismissing are not solutions.
Be part of the solution.
Get the facts.
http://sisis.nativeweb.org/actionalert/

It looks like extreme left "(and get the fu*k out of Haiti & Afghanistan)" is taking over the naitive people cause.

saga... It is OUR land now. Get the over it. 99% of Canadians don't give a sh@t about stupid indians and what they think is their right. The land NOW BELONGS TO IT'S RIGHTFULL OWNERS!

saga: You're barking up the wrong tree, knocking at the wrong door, wading into the wrong stream: You're defending Natives who don't want to be Canadians? You're defending a two-Nations within one country? 'Won't work. 'Can't work.

There's one solution if Natives don't want to live in Canadato or be Canadians. They can get out of Canada. If they live here, they have an obligation, just like the rest of us, to live by Canadian laws and to live with, and like, the rest of us.

A house divided is a recipe for disaster: It can't stand; there's no way that Canada can accommodate two "nations" living together in one country. Our lily-livered, wimpy, girlie-men Ontario government members had better get this straight, and say "NO!" once and for all to this retrograde and nonsensical idea.

Short-term pain for long-term gain is the phrase I'm looking for. Parents have to do it with their kids, say "NO!" for their kids own good. The kids, in their teens especially, don't like it, but I'll wager it's protected and/or saved many a kid's life.

The wheels are falling off the present "two Nations within one" contraption, and it's time to construct a new vehicle. And that would be ONE CANADA, where Natives learn to live with the rest of the population, the way we all live--or get out. They'll not be treated any better in any other country and, IMO, they'll be treated much worse.

Get with the program, saga, or vamanoose, amigo.

The Indians sure don't want to be Canadian's but they sure like living off of our hard earned tax dollars! All I can say is they better be carefull of what they ask for! Read the Nisga challenge, not all Indians want to loss their citizenship. Look at the extent that Cheif Mountain has gone to (5 years of legal/political rangling,) just to fight for his right to protect his Canadian citizenship.

Steve D. The way you have commented on the issue just reinforces the fact that you are a "Troll" who will do anything to create some controvery about yourself. Go back to La-la land.

I thought it was "DumbIndian Day" the day the giveaway was sealed. Methinks the official name for the big pink bit at the top of the map may still be "Dominion of Canada"

then the Trudeudopias changed it to "Canada Day" instead of "Canadian Day" as they francophoned the language. no more Department of Revenue , it was Revenue Canada, no more National Parks, it was Parks Canada, and finally not even Unemployment Insurance , it was glamourized as Employment Insurance. Call it "Speak Canada" where there are no adjectives just nouns.

PS saga: "Stealing Native land" is another way of saying that the Natives were conquered by a more highly technologized people: That's called the way it is and has been from time immemorial.

The Natives in Canada, as has been said on this blog many times before, are fortunate that their conquerors were "civilized" Brits, who made far more concessions to the Native population than most winners of wars in other countries did.

The Canadian Native Problem is that they don't know how fortunate they are, while all the time insisting on regarding very generous monetary largesse from the Canadian taxpayer as "not enough." My hope is that our politicians will finally realize the fool's game in all of this and will make a ONCE-AND-FOR-ALL payout to Native Canadians, after which they will be expected, like the rest of us "immigrants' (me: Irish, Scottish, British: Yorkshire) to get a life and start living it.

Native ghettoes (aka reservations) are obscene "holding tanks" for Natives and it seems that any self-respecting person with Native blood has fled them, as from a plague, in order to be successful. All you have to do is drive through a reservation to see dereliction on a scale not usually seen even in inner cities anymore: shacks in need of repair, unkempt yards, loads of junk, and often a brand new vehicle of some kind. Children living on these reservations suffer far more diseases and hardships, including academic deficits and drug and alcohol abuse, than in the rest of the Canadian population. And the sad thing is, from my observation of Native children in the classroom, is not that they're not smart--many of the Native students I've taught are smarter than the average--it's that they lack discipline and ambition and play off the "race card," making them Hell on Wheels to deal with. The system backs off every time, thus perpetuating the "poor me," "I can get away with anything because I'm an Indian" mentality, which just digs the hole deeper for any Aboriginal person wanting to escape the ever downward spiral of the lifestyle of money-for-life sponsored by the Canadian taxpayer of far too many of them.

To everything there is a season: And now is the season for the Aboriginal People of Canada to stop whining, to put their native smarts to work, and to get with the program: which is assimilation into North American life, where we all live by the same laws and standards of behaviour. Any other way is doomed to failure, which should be clear to anyone with eyes to see with and ears to hear with.

If they are separate nations why do they want me to buy them houses?

When Canada negotiated nafta as a country we didn't say the USA had to build us houses....

They whole thing is a joke and the reserves need to be made into municipalities.

I agree that what is happening in Caledonia is a complete nightmare for the citizens of Caledonia and us Canadians in general. The question is how do we fix it so that there is no liberal govt next time? I have no idea myself.

Keep in mind the next provincial election is a long way off. The general population has a very short memory. Then throw in some empty promises and excuses for any screw ups, and you have another liberal govt. The promises in the last election were so obviously a lie, but people voted for McStinky anyways.

We can complain till we are blue in the face but the general population has no clue what is going on. They do not look at alternative media. Instead they listen and believe sheepishly to the mainstream news which is not really covering what is happening in Caledonia. Some people I have spoken to do not even know about Caledonia. Even people that are aware, have been brainwashed into the Natives are victims mantra. Most have no clue what the possible long term reprecussions of this are. They have a "at least it is not in my backyard" type attitude, not realizing the Natives could easily want their backyard next.

So how does this change?

"Indigenous Peoples in Canada have the highest rates of cancer, aids/HIV, tuberculosis, and other diseases;"

Well i don't know if the cancer is true but if you don't want hiv try monogamy, and if you don't want diabetes eat less, isn't tb acaused be a lack of cleanliness?

"Indigenous peoples have the highest levels of poverty, unemployment, homelessness, and imprisonment; "
but no matter what they don't want to change the system.

"Indigenous peoples have the highest suicide rates in Canada; "
Well lets keep doing what worked so well the last few hundred years....

I came upon this website by accident, and took it for what it claims to be - a forum to discuss the deception of the media.

Quickly I learned that in fact it was not an open discussion, but one limited to the trumpeting of right wing ideals. That's fine by me. Not my politics, but I was interested to read the viewpoints of the majority of the people here with an open mind.

What I can't believe is that anyone who disagrees with the majority here is automatically a troll, an idiot, a bleeding heart, etc., while people can freely express their wish to see a whole race of human beings extinct and nobody says a word.

There's something very wrong there.

So anyway, I'll leave you all to your party, especially Mr. Happy blockaded in his house with rifles and ammo.

'Good riddance' is implied so don't trip over yourselves.

If they really are a seperate nation then why are they using our money? Why don't they have their own banks and money? If these Indians really believe what they are saying then they should immediatly renounce using Canadian currency and give back any they are currently holding. Problem is they might have a tough time eating tonight.

Saga,

Indians have no choice over the long term but to bow to the inevitable. It isn't 1492 any more. Times change. Indians have to get with the times.

No one lost any land today. No one alive today was around when the Brits and Frogs came over the pond to join the party. No one alive today lost anything. No one alive today is any more "native" than anyone else born here.

I'm native to the place I was born. You can find it easily on a map under the heading "CANADA." Provided you can read of course.

If you think you have a moral right to anything more than what the rest of us have you're not only the fool but the racist.

The racist policies of 300 year old laws needs to be changed. The only thing it has accomplished is to keep Indians in a perpetual state of loser/victimhood and has resulted in generations of losers with chips on their shoulders whining about their entitlements while living on welfare.

The Indians with merit, skills and self-respect have moved on to the real world and have found success when they joined society. The reserves are filled with the dregs too pathetic to grow up and offer something useful for society and themselves.

Anyone who thinks they are owed a living for nothing is a loser, a child, and is unworthy of help.

Hey Guys & Gals Taking a break in the action & just going to say one thing!!
...HAPPY CANADA DAY TO EVERYONE...
Get out & celebrate the best country in the world's birthday on saturday, have a couple of brews, relax & take part in your local festivities with your family & don't miss the fireworks!!
bryanr

Steve D, I was pleasantly surprised at your firt comment here... five down from top.

I noticed others made note of your logic as well.

Then you commented again around 8:15 or so and there your logic seemed solid as well.

What a refreshing surprise.

Angry great white north suggests that Caledonia will be explosive tomorrow. I hope not.

That is a serious can of worms and should have been diffused by an alert Ontario government.

Alas, they are anything but *alert*. TG

Residential schools for 150 years???
Unbelievable that someone actually wrote this!
ROFLMAO!

For others who want to see microfiche records of life in Canada in the 17 and 18 centuries, have a peruse through Acadian history on-line, very interesting. Numerations were conducted albeit sporadically, by both England and France.
Life was brutal and cruel for everyone (except the richest) and with France and England getting control alternately about every 11 years or so by invading established settlements and farms and killing or starving whomever were being invaded at that point.

Oh and saga, Native children were sent to residential school only starting in the 30's and 40's...
You do understand that access to these areas didn't really open up until planes, specifically float planes were able to get into these remote areas?

Oh and saga, one more time: Did you know that the reason for residential schools is that 80% of the Native chiefs back then ASKED THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT TO TEACH THEIR CHILDREN ENGLISH. They were not dummies.

"We" are the dummies, years later, for taking the blame for the non-abuses that took place in those schools. For the 3% who did abuse Native children the book should be, rightfully, thrown at them. But for the other 97% of the teachers, mostly from Christian Churches because the Feds ASKED the churches to take on the job, who lived sacrificial lives and were paid a pittance to educate Native children so they could live in the North America of evolving technologies, there should have been, and there should be, NO PAYOUTS.

The Native School payouts were initiated by activist lawyers, wanting to make big bucks themselves. And they have. Who will rid Canada of these meddlesome legal vultures?

One of the great ironies in all of this is that the only diocese, so far, to have gone bankrupt because of the costly payouts is the Diocese of Cariboo, a largely Native diocese. Now there is no Anglican Church in that region of BC to give social assistance to a people they had been supporting for many years.

These lawyers don't want to help Natives. They want to bleed everyone in sight to make themselves rich. Blood suckers, pure and simple.

Kate, if I may be indulged, please.

O/T but still in the anti-Canada Day vein to me: Here is the info for Just a Laugh Comedy Festival... I have written and called in my disgust at these people for having a self-loathing Jew, bashing Jews as entertainment this week and next.

http://www.northernlife.com/justforlaughs.html
#
Customer Service and Corporate Sales
Sylvia O'Hayon
Director of Customer Service
Phone: 514-845-2083
E-mail: sohayon@hahaha.com

Call and let them know what you think of them hiring this anti-Semitic comedian to give comfort to our enemies - you know, just for laughs...

http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=6b500b60-a4b8-4d27-9ca8-b8472b5a7ff1

I hear all this crying about past and present injustices,but no answers for the future...Just what do native supporters have planned to solve the innumerable problems they face?
Apart from never-ending bitching about the evil whiteman and then demanding billions more from him,what are natives actively doing to change their future?...I submit they are doing NOTHING,exactly what they are famous for doing...yet,I would be very pleased if someone here could prove me wrong!
BTW,don't try to tell me blockades and demonstrations are anything more than another way to bitch at the whiteman and demand money.

Hey, Dirk, ----follow your own advice----"while keeping in mind ,"judge not least you be judged"

Something interesting I just came across. This is from the CDC US govt website. It is the estimated number of persons living with AIDS by race/ethinicity.

I am not sure what the ratios are Healthy native population vs. AIDS infected natives, and Healthy others vs. AIDS others, but it seems to me that the natives are just above the zero line. The ratio could be high for the natives, but they are definitely not the only ones living with this disease.

http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/topics/surveillance/resources/slides/epidemiology/slides/EPI-AIDS_5.pdf

"The story of the Caledonia lands began when the British were beaten in the American War of Independence in 1783 and Six Nations natives who supported the Brits were kicked out of the United States." http://sisis.nativeweb.org/actionalert/updates/060421cp-b.html
The area of present day Southern Ontario first came under European control as part of New France. It passed from French control into British control with the Treaty of Paris (1763).

L'Anse aux Meadows is the only authenticated Viking site in North America. It was established 1000 years ago by the explorer Leif Eiriksson during his adventures in eastern North America - 500 years before Columbus' exploits in the "New World".(maybe we should try giving it all back to the "vikings")!!!

Or maybe we should all just live in the PRESENT, not in the PAST

new kid on the block :

As usual you caught the flavor of this plot by lawyers in conjunction with Native groups looking for another hand out. So far in Alberta natives who made supercilious claims, have been still paid out.

It was proved they didn’t even attend a school!!! Let alone a one of these type.

As for abuse, lol who hasn’t been treated cruel in grade, junior, or high school? I used to get my knuckles rapped by a ruler for saying ain’t!!!

As for sexual abuse. well let me just say we had pederasts long before the Natives where abused in there schools. I had one male teacher who walked about putting there hands in young males pockets & moving about there genitals. Should I or those who it happened too sue as well? This was the early sixties.

Its another con by the blue eyed faux Natives, with there drooling lawyers in tow. The rest just march in lock step for a little free cash at your expense & mine.

To bad the money is running out with most Canadians patience, for bums on a mission of “ You owe me a living “ fill in the blank for victim status.

HAPPY CANADA DAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

HAPPY DOMINION DAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

All Canada needs to be the best nation on earth is deport her liberal assholes to Cuba but many of these sphincter culture claim to be indigenous.

"All Canada needs to be the best nation on earth ..." is for a small, rabid "conservative" minority with a monstrous inferiority complex to grow up.

(Sgd.) "Commie-ass-pansy-pinko-idiot-scumbag"

Damn you guys gotta be the Dumbist things on earth.
What winners As I recall it was the cowardly brits that would run from the nasty Americans leaving the Indians to win the day and save their sorry souls.

What was this War you Won?

You signed a Treaty because you were to scared to figth. Lying, stealing and murdering people in the dark was the English way.

Most Canadians, when they did meet the Half-Breeds on the field, ran like Custers men did at Little Big Horn.

You guys give the Canadian Educational system a Bad Name!

"Over 500 dead and/or Missing Aboriginal Women across Canada;
Routine police abuse, racism & violence against Indigenous Peoples;
Indigenous Peoples in Canada have the highest rates of cancer, aids/HIV, tuberculosis, and other diseases;
Indigenous peoples have the highest levels of poverty, unemployment, homelessness, and imprisonment;
Indigenous peoples have the highest suicide rates in Canada;
Indigenous lands & territories remain under attack by government and corporate forces;
===================================================

Well, thank heavens for the above. If more of them

lived, stayed healthy and fit we would have a civil war on our hands right now."

This is very offensive.
Bloggers are not above the laws and conventions of Canada. Decency take a bit of effort, but it's what allows us to live together.

However, the final statement is not far from the truth: If Canada doesn't soon abide by the laws and address aboriginal land claims and self governance reasonably instead of by deceit and delay, we will have a war of commerce on our hands: Aboriginals can shut down the economy of Canada in one day.

Nasty rhetoric like on this site does not contribute to healthy solutions.