Can the Federal Government act without a request from the Province?
Theres only two ways to settle this.
1. Use of force
2. Pay off a pile of money.
Unless we are prepared to see this kind of nonsense go on forever, seems like #1 is the only way

Not reported in the article is the attack on a car containing two seniors.
Their car was swarmed and as a result, the elderly driver was taken to hospital with an apparent heart attack.
CH 11 News (TV) just had his wife interviewed.
Last night, police squads were called out when angry residents gathered and the Hamilton Spectator reports that they 'clashed'.
Report is here.
http://www.hamiltonspectator.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=hamilton/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1149889812268&call_pageid=1020420665036&col=1014656511815

Natives behaving badly.. in Canada...does any one still wonder why they are over represented in our prisons. where is the leadership?

where's the native leadership ??

Where is Fontaine ?? Why isn't native leadership speaking out, denouncing the law breakers.

Seems parallel to the Mulsim leadership - refusing to speak up, to denounce any of "their own"

The OPP watch as criminal activity unfolds.....Dalton is disapointed....Caladonia citizens arrested..... Jamie West is right....There are few words to describe the gutless hypocracy elected officials and those charged with enforcing the rule of law. Although one comes to mind... Candyasses!

Syncro

Ever since Dudley George more kid gloves have been handed out to police and our political "leaders", rederring us helpless to the law-breaking of a motley crew of hooligans on a rampage after a heaping dose of "fire water."

provincial responsibility....feds would be wise to avoid till the province gives up....which they wont.

i am shocked though that the police wouldnt intervene if only to warn off the protesters....they have orders, clearly.

either orders or the police union wont let themc step in...another troubling prospect

question remains, why has the formerly peaceful relationship with the residents changed? what has changed in the six nations leadership?

one of the few times I agree with you ona particular topic. Get the police in there to DO THEIR JOBS. The natives can't have it both ways.

Has anyone seen any opinion polls on what Canadians think should be done? I'm sure they'd be overwhelmingly of the "use force" opinion.

So at what point does the government start listening to the polls and do something? Do they really think this is helping them?

This is complete B.S. These natives attack people, steal vehicles, vandalise property, and impede traffic and all the police will do is stand around or get tough with the citizens of Caledonia?

I think it's time for the ordinary people to by-pass the police and take action to end this.

Who cares what the police, government, judiciary, or scumbag lawyers think. They're all on the side of the natives. It's time to think outside the box (and perhaps ouside the law). >;D

This is unreal but very typical of the liberal government ruling Ont now.

They are doing the opposite of what Mike Harris did to prove how much better they are at handling these issues, and so this result is predictable. Nice eh?

Wonder what the ONT fiberals would do if Ontario was put on the "do not travel to" list by the Americans, like what was issued here about France last fall?

"Dudley" McGuinty hides and sends in David Peterson, he who can negotiate with thugs like Belinda to walk her across Parliamentary floors so that she can have “Honourable” in front of her name …. time for regime change at Queens Park.

Well--that does it--no more American tourists to Ontario--now maybe McLiar will notice that all is not peaceful in Caledonia?
What a bunch of limp-wristed Liberal non-leaders we have in this God forsaken province.

I know the PM would get a rough ride from the media if he were to take control of this situation, but I think he has ordinary Canadians on his side in that respect. I also think he would be respected for applying the law of the land to all Canadians, First Nations or otherwise. Those who live in or near Caledonia, pay taxes, have businesses and depend on the services they pay for, are entitled to be protected. All Canadians should be treated alike when it comes to applying the law and getting the services they pay for.

It is time for First Nations People to start living in the present. They think they have it so bad and yet they are treated pretty well. They are funnelled money, they get a free ride on paying taxes, hunting/fishing and healthcare. It is not our fault that their duly elected Chiefs and band councils mis-handle that money. If they think they don't have to follow the laws the rest of us do, because they are sovereign, then grant them their wish, and cut off the freebies. If they don't want to be Canadians so be it. The rest of us working Canadians have the right to go about our daily business without fear, and the knowledge and security that we will be protected and duly represented in governnance of this land and it's people.

It's time to deal with this beast and settle it once and for all. Maybe we should offer a way out to First Nations residents who live in fear and poverty under their own caste-like system of governance.

Ontario is doing enough to place itself on a do not visit list re americans. Years of bashing the US by Parrish and others, terrorist plots hatched in Ont, releasing suspects back into the community of Hamilton where some of the plotters come from, and giving a passport a known OBL supporter really tells Americans Canada is a safe and loving country to visit. When those US troopers go back home imagine the story they will tell on Larry King, Oprah and the sunday talk shows. The Ont government is working overtime to make toronto the most hated place in Canada. If the 6 nations get off without serious punishment and fines, watch out for them to try this in other provinces. Not only is there going to be a backlash against muslims, natives will really start to get the discrimination they have perceived for years. Careful what you wish for.

On another thread at SDA earlier this morning Scott said about Native Canadians, "We have destroyed their pride and culture, not by residential schools but by kindness and welfare."

I basically agree with Scott, but would like to add that "we" didn't actually destroy anything; how many people know that 80% of Indian Chiefs ASKED the Canadian government to educate their children and, thus, the existence of Residential Schools--which, by the way, church folk were asked by the government to run, for a pittance, BTW, seeing as church folk were alreay on the scene?

These Chiefs understood, like the dunderhead Chiefs today don't, that the only way forward for their people was to learn English, so that they could live and prosper in the vast North American continent, populated by the early 1900s by a majority of English-speakers.

Further, how many people know that the Natives did not, at first, sue any church? They understood, better than most, that the Christian Church in the past couple of centuries had actually been a benevolent agent of support for their families and communities. It's the Chretien government that countersued the churches, to spread the "blame." Cretin.

The great irony is that the first diocese to succumb and go under due to lack of funds (because so much money had to be syphoned off each diocesan budget to pay legal costs) was the Diocese of Cariboo in B.C., a largely Native jurisdiction. So, suing the Church (thanks to Cretin and blood-sucking, money-grabbing lawyers) has had the unintended consequence of afflicting the very population that was, supposedly, to benefit the most.

What is wrong with this picture?

And now we have Caledonia. I've always liked the line *** from Shakespeare, I believe *** that "sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind." Any parent knows this. Sometimes you have to come down hard on your kids when they're clearly doing unacceptable things or pushing the limits to their and your disadvantage. Saying no, setting limits, exacting logical consequences, are all part of successful parenting and to not do these things is to severely limit the ability of your child(ren) to become responsible and accountable members of their community.

Good governments take on a "parenting" role to the extent that they have to enact laws which curb anti-social and unproductive behaviours in the population under their jurisdiction. When a government fails to enforce the laws put in place to the benefit of all citizens and makes a decision to go easy on a certain segment of the population, in this case the Mohawks in Caledonia, they fail in their governing role as law makers and enforcers, to the detriment of all of us. They fail not only non-Natives in this scenario; they also fail the Natives themselves.

Which comes around to Scott's point. By setting up the system so that Natives have "money for life," whether they work or not, whether they flout every law of the land or not, we do them a great disservice--and they do themselves an even greater disservice by going along with the charade. They're living in a parallel universe that has no connection with reality, no connection with living in a free democracy.

McGuinty needs to get his ass in gear and do something about this lawless standoff/insurrection in Caledonia. He may have to do something cruel *** like move in some kick-ass law enforcement officers to restore law and order and arrest these Mohawk law breakers *** in order, in the end, to be kind: to let these anarchists know that they live in a democracy, where their kind of lawless behaviour won't be tolerated for the good of not just the rest of us but for the protection of their own freedoms and those of their children.

McGuinty had better start taking a long view of what's going on, because allowing this Native insurrection is making a laughing stock of our law and order (come again?) democracy, he supposedly supports and became Ontario's Premier to defend.

Who'd know?

"Caledonia Indian insurrection" .... Quote:

"The Liberals of Ontario under their Liberal Premier, Dalton McGuinty, are in a catatonic state over the Caledonia Indian insurrection;"

http://www.smalldeadanimals.com/archives/004007.html

May 22, 2006.

Dalton McGuinty and the Ontario Provincial Police have lost all legitimacy, and by their inaction have broken the social contract and left innocent citizens to be terrorized. If the Ontario Government continues to defy court orders to end this violent thuggery it may fall to the residents of Caledonia to take matters into their own hands. It seems the Imams were correct, domestic terrorism is not solely an Islamic problem.

Fred asked where the Native leadership is.

I think they are hiding from the Warrior Society, myself. If the OPP has washed their hands of the whole thing, and they have, the Six Nations police force is IT on the reserve. Its a small force.

There's a couple hundred Warrior Society a-holes running around the reserve right now, operating in a complete power vacuum. They seem to be able to come up with back-hoes, dump trucks, welders and all kinds of other whatnot on short notice, I doubt they would have any trouble finding weapons too.

Reality, this situation is completely out of control, and anybody on the reserve who doesn't like the Warrior Society has either left or is very quiet.

More things Dalton has to answer for.

When this mess is finally settled, it will be time for the governments of Ontario & Canada to clean up some untidy trappings of the insurrection.
Specifically an addendum to the Criminal Code of Canada which would read:
PS:- none of this shall apply to Native Canadians.
(It should ,of course, be written on a clean piece of paper to allow for multiple additions.) In addition, fair warning to visitors needs to be given at all border crossings and provincial borders saying, Welcome to Ontario;for your safety, do not travel to [...list to be filled in] ..as the rule of law does not apply in these areas and you will not be protected.
Ontario; is there any place you'd rather be?

"Well Olly (McGuinty), this is another fine mess you've gotten us into".

Parenting 101: If your child does something after you told them not to and you take no corrective action, then don't be surprised when you are not listened to again and again.

The fact that a bunch of renagade natives have gotten away with whatever they want so far then don't expect then to suddenly listen to authority. I am surprised that the vacationing NY state trooper didn't file charges with regards to the carjacking & assault. Arresting the residents was certainly a smooth move that instilled the confidence of all Canadians.

I don't see how those OPP officers can sleep at night realizing that they are not doing their sworn duty (to uphold the law and protect the public).

Just linked to this post.

All this is shocking. Why are we paying taxes people?

Indian Insurrection in Ontario, Canada.

Flag of insurrection raised by Mohawks: Six Nations Confederacy.

See flag here: http://www.nealenews.com/

....

http://www.smalldeadanimals.com/archives/003861.html

April 20, 2006

SheilaG: Shockingly, the latest polls showed McGuinty with an increased approval rating. Maybe they should have done the survey outside the reserves though.

As Custer said "The only good Muslim, Whoops sorry, Indian is a dead one.

I just wrote my MP asking that military rule be imposed before there are more injuries. I also asked how many injuries the federal government intended to allow before they'd intervene?

I'm ashamed to be Canadian. How can we justify having peacemaking/keeping forces overseas to create/protect/restore democratic rule of law when we do not protect/restore the rule of law here in Ontario and protect our citizens?

In another letter, I asked my accountant what the consequences would be of withholding my provincial business taxes since I feel I cannot support a government that will not uphold the law or protect its citizens. Can't withhold my provincial income tax(since it is paid to the feds) but my business taxes are due June 30th.

Yeah, let's withhold our provincial taxes and see how long it takes for McGuinty & Co. to react!!!

As several posters here have already asked,...Where does the finally buck stop?This sadly demonstrates the lack of real leadership we have come to accept throughout this country,especially in Ontario.Harper would be the one many will expect to act,but I wonder if the optics in the hands of the LPC would be too dangerous to consider as myopic Ontarians would see him as a racial bully.This is still only an Ontario problem,at least so far.
This lack of leadership,dereliction of the OPP's duties,and duplicity by media seems business as usual to the average citizen there.It's no g*dd*m wonder so many western conservatives still feel separation will inevitably be the only way to escape the will of these pol.correct sheeple...

Without the rule of law, Canada is a shameful disgrace of a nation.
You can bet the farm that other native groups in other parts of Canada are paying close attention to the events in Caledonia.
Out here in B.C. I have seen large roadside signs claiming support for the Six Nations.
The OPP should be immediately disbanded, bring in the army to keep the peace until a new force is established.
I am writing my local MP, Jim Prentice, and the Prime Minister to voice my disgust with the lack of action.
It may be happening in Ontario for now, but it will soon become a national problem.
If those officers who watched while people were being terrorized by these scum had an ounce of integrity, they would resign. They are collecting their salary to stand by and watch while laws are being broken.

Four American Tourists Attacked

About 90 minutes later, a witness said a group of natives dragged four American tourists from their SUV after they snapped a few photos of the native-occupied land despite remaining on public property.
"Two of them were off-duty New York State troopers," said a resident who lives near the attack site. "Two of them were dragged from their truck and (the natives) drove off and (went) back into their own area."

http://www.torontosun.com/News/Canada/2006/06/10/1624212-sun.html

Take a moment and dash off an email or call the OPP (Ontario Provincial Police) and let them know how proud of the force we are as a nation and individually as well.
email link:
http://www.opp.ca/opp_000693.html
Toll free phone #
1-888-310-1122
Unbelievable! I feel like yelling at a radio or something.
Grandad

CP, aka Communist Press says: "seven people"?

Indians or "non-native residents"? Black people, green people, people people, tall people, obese people, non-people people, Martians ...???? Is Mr. "X" one of the "seven people"? ...

CALEDONIA, Ont. (CP) - Warrants for the arrests of seven people are being sought after several tense clashes at a long-runnng native blockade in southern Ontario.

The charges include attempted murder, robbery, intimidation and causing bodily harm..
canoe news

The latest Caledonia posting about the arrest warrants was from Canada Press and in it was a line that was unbelievable:
"Premier Dalton McGuinty says he's angry about the way some people at the blockade are acting."
Banging my head against a wall here.

Kinda morbidly funny in a way.

Natives tear up infrastructure, vandalize power grids and physically assault and intimidate people in plain view of police, and yet the moment the non-native townfolk get into a mere verbal war at a fence who gets carried off by police?... the non-natives.

Where did Lady Justice's blindfold go?

Message to all federal departments that send cheques to natives on reserves. Cut off all cheques to every reserve in Canada. Let them all suffer equally and when they run out of money, maybe they will tell the 6 nations to smarten up. Might also be a good time for Prov money to stop flowing. And all those liberal mps from Ont want us to send troops to sudan to keep peace. Better send them to Ont first. For those complaining Harper is quiet, this is like Naggin and the Govenor on LA during and before Katrina. They did not request feb help, and until they did, first the mayor to the govenor and then to the feds. Same with this. Can you really believe that all those libs in ont would admit they need conservative help. When they finally cry wolf and the feds solve the problem, who will gain in the polls in ont. On top of all this poor dalton has to worry about terrorists in his midst, and finding the right leadership man to support. (yes, I meant man, as no woman is going to win)
Anyone watch any of the debate today. I caught 10 minutes and that was enough. Too bad they don't have a phone number like cdn idol. That would put a lot of them out of their misery fast.

(It's blog/bloggers fault. (LOLLLL) .....)

Something has changed (The "Dalton's Gang")

Commenter' "Bugs":

I think Dalton's gang has decided to go the other way on this. The meme about the racist Caledonians isn't working.

Perhaps what changed is that a member of the media got treated like a citizen of Caledonia (by mistake) and they PR boys down in political marketing decided to cut their losses.

Dalton himself is off, wooing the premiers to the idea that Ontario should give them less money ...

But what new position can the government move to? Do they continue to 'negotiate'? Over what? As an issue in law, the process is clear. As an issue in politics, it isn't, and any movement in any direction is fraught with electoral peril.

It will be interesting to see if there are arrests, and if they lead to an escalation on the native side, with the barriers going up once again.

Comments? ...
http://www.voy.com/178771/2991.html

For those railing at the federal government, Caledonia is NOT a federal issue. This is entirely a provincial matter as it stands. There are no treaty issues here, but rather land deed issues. The blockade and its consequences are provincial jurisdiction until a state of emergency is called that can mobilize federal assistance.

My letter to my MPP:
Mr. Bartolucci, this letter is with regard to the present Liberal government's paralysis in dealing with the Caledonia Indian standoff. Natives defying the law of Ontario, threatening people, assaulting people, attempts of murder, robbery, I could go on and on. All of this while the OPP and the Liberal government of Ontario stand by and watch. Dudley George has caused your government to become paralysed by fear of how to deal with the situation. All of Ontario is becoming sickened by this inaction and indecisiveness. We have laws in this Province which should be adhered to by all residents. Note how the OPP acted so quickly in dealing with the Bandido issue. So what is the difference?? That is the problem with you Liberals. You have forgotten that this is Canada and we have laws that all residents must live by. In your misguided need to be Politically correct and your fear that you will be criticized by your Socialist supporters you have forgotten your responsibilities to all Ontarians. I recognize that this is a difficult and potentially explosive issue however that's why your govt. was elected. To make the tough smart decisions. If your govt. can't do that than kindly step down. Mike Harris's govt may not have made all of the right decisions in the Dudley George issue but at least they had the nuts to take some action.
Next election please note, I will be voting Conservative.

Skip, to me the issue isnt land deeds either.
The issue is lawlessness.

Reading Grandad's comments, I thought of my own dad who was called "Granddad" by my and my siblings' children.

He died eight years ago, and I'm kind of glad he's not around to be witnessing SSM and Caledonia, to name a couple of issues which would have completely floored him.

He lied about his age and went to war at 17, spent time in both Holland and Germany, and saw things which affected him for the rest of his life. He put his life on the line to defend the principles of freedom, nobility, dignity of the human person, law and order, and I know he would be stymied by the government of the day and law enforcement officers' standing by while thugs and miscreants trampled all over citizens' democratic rights to security of person and property.

WHAT IS GOING ON IN THIS PROVINCE/COUNTRY? Very few of our leaders (PMSH excepted) seem to have the courage of their convictions anymore. I rather think that McGuinty, his government members, and the members of the OPP are doing it for the money and the perks, and to Hell with the promises they made when they took the responsibilities of their jobs on, especially now that the going's got tough.

"When the going gets tough, the tough get going."

So, where are the tough guys when you need them?

In one link I followed the prase native Mohawks was used. Native to south of our border I think.

I wonder how long the occupation would last if everybody stopped going to their casinoes. I say we should do it and let their own enforcers "take care of business" because plainly the prov gov won't.

I know I'll get crucified for this...but Mike Harris had the right idea.

Joe: I'm not carrying a hammer and nails...

Re Mike Harris having the right idea: Look at the abuse he's taken ever since for getting tough with rampaging Natives, most of whom, it seems, were drunk. Hey, that woman who grabbed the journalist's camera was acting like she was high on something.

Getting it in the jugular for standing up to eedjit bullies is probably what it takes, and we need some politicians worth their salt to do the tough, and right, thing.

Political correctness is killing us and leaving our young people totally confused. They've got police coming into their classrooms to talk to them about the evils of bullying, they watch videos on bullying till they're blue in the face, and then they watch teachers, principals, policemen, and Liberal politicians completely back off when a bully says "Boo!".

This is the Canadian "niceness" Jonah Goldberg wrote about the other day in the LATimes. Nice, my foot. Short-sighted, lily-livered, no-guts, no-a few other things, as______s, if you ask me.

Kate, thanks for the link to such a well written blog. It's a keeper.

The money quote:

The logic of modernity is that no sin cannot be erased, or at the very least excused, by victimhood. It is absolution of a scope and thoroughness that no Catholic priest could ever deliver or sanction; absolution of everything, even original sin. The base motives of the white man cannot be extrapolated into the soul of the red. Savages they are not, noble they remain.

Yes, decades of the liberal indoctrination of moral equivalencies, pc self-censorship and multi-culti garbage and these thugs probably fueled on alcohol(pc folks, deal with it!)hold a community hostage, commit blatant crimes and responsible whites can't back track out of the liberal absurd and deal with it.

The hard cold non-pc facts are that aboriginals lost in history, a long time ago. They are a conquered people like so many groups throughout human history before them. When you get conquered, you get the spoils, sometimes fairly, sometimes not. Intelligent choices then follow. You assimilate, like so many conquered groups before you. You perish completely, like so many conquered groups before you. You deal realistically with your reduced status, like so many conquered groups before you, or like this group you fossilize into pathetic marginal erratic welfare cases that make your descendants lives harder.

Harper needs to stop this nonsense soon.

The PC sickness that permeates the left all boils down to one simple concept. RESPONSIBILITY.

Be it Caledonia, the native situation overall, multi-culturalism, free heroin clinics in Vancover's lower east side, national childcare or any other lefty cause or response the theme is always the same.

RIGHTS----- but no corresponding RESPONSIBILITIES.

Immigrants have the RIGHT to become Canadian citizens but are not required to accept the personal RESPONSIBILITY to adapt to our tolerant secular society.

Natives have the RIGHT to protest injustices either percieved or real but are not held RESPONSIBLE to obey the rule of law in said protests.

First nations have the RIGHT to be supported financially by the Canadian taxpayer but are not held RESPONSIBLE for the billions they recieve.

Addicts have the RIGHT to recieve free drugs but are not held personally RESPONSIBLE for their own health and recovery.

Parents have the RIGHT to have children but expect the state to assume the RESPONSIBILITY for a good portion of the care of these same children.

In the twisted world of the left it is all about RIGHTS.

Hell, even governments are granted the RIGHT to rule through the democratic process and now abdicate the RESPONSIBILITY to enforce the rule of law.

Dalton is disapointed?? I'm disgusted!!!

Syncro

The frequent references to rule of law are as tiresome as they are ironic. The whole reason this land is in dispute is because the law was selectively applied AGAINST the natives. The Canadian government refused to formally recognize native ownership of land as part of the Haldimand Tract. However, it conveniently chose to recognize native sales of that land to European settlers, and refused to reverse the transaction out of convenience. Of course no one here is complaining about that - the law only needs to be applied to "keep the natives quiet" so we can all keep fishin' and huntin'

Responses like the ones above are the exact reason the natives don't use the system to make their point.

Cynapse:
How come there were no protests until the land became more valuable - through development.
So your saying if natives can ignore the law, i guess its ok for the rest of us to ignore it too?
How does the supposed land claims isue move forward by terrorizing people who have no dog in the fight- American tourists, elderly people?
Sorry, but your wrong on this. This is all about a bunch or sorry-assed scum relishing their power over innocent people while the cops watch.
There is no rationalizing this.

Oh oh, look out. Dalton's angry now.

The Ontario Provincial Police are in open revolt/mutiny against the Liberal Premier of Ontario and McGuinty's Liberal regime.

It's McGuinty's "Ipperwash"; McGuinty's nightmare.

Nemesis bites hard on Pinocchio McGuinty's nose.

McGuinty must resign.

McGuinty has created a crisis of confidence in the governance of Ontario.

McGuinty! Resign, now.

Your dithering/actions/non-actions are damning.

You have imperilled the life, limb, and property of the citizens of Ontario, Canada.

Resign, now. +

Caledonia officers say safety is at risk(McGuinty creates crisis,Canada)
The Toronto Star ^ | Jun. 8, 2006. | SUSAN CLAIRMONT

Posted on 06/10/2006 4:47:39 PM PDT by fanfan

HAMILTON

OPP officers assigned to the native standoff in Caledonia say their bosses have put their public image ahead of officer safety and law and order.

Talking for the first time since the volatile land occupation began 100 days ago, the president of the Ontario Provincial Police Association said a meeting is being held tonight in Caledonia so the association can hear the concerns of officers who have been told not to wear riot gear or tactical uniforms when dealing with native protestors, are being sent out without proper back-up and are left wondering if commanding officers and the courts will back them up when they try to enforce the law.

"Due to the political pressures and optics involved with this, the OPP seems to be bending their own rules while sacrificing officer safety," Karl Walsh said. "Optics don't have any place on the front lines at Caledonia."

The OPP have had a fluctuating presence at the protest ever since natives began occupying a housing development they claim is being built on their land. At some points, it's been nothing more than a single OPP officer watching from a parked cruiser. At other times, officers have physically stood between natives and Caledonia residents as tempers flared.

Front-line officers feel they haven't had a strong enough presence at the barricades.

The "deviation from the usual training and standards" of the OPP "has been an underlying concern from the get-go" in Caledonia, said Walsh.

So far, 13 officers have been injured while assigned to the stand-off. Some injuries could have been avoided if officers had been allowed to follow their usual procedures, officers say.

`It's okay to have an officer walking around in tactical uniform at Wasaga Beach on a long weekend, but it's not okay in Caledonia'

Karl Walsh, president of Ontario Provincial Police Association

For instance, the highly trained and heavily armed members of the OPP tactical team have not been allowed to wear their tactical uniforms. ... more
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1647002/posts

Things have taken an interesting turn; the Toronto Star reports as follows.

Toronto subject to land claim
Indians say 1787 land surrender was invalid
Government will bail us out with our own money
Jun. 10, 2006. 01:00 AM
BOB AARON

So you think you have good title to your home in Toronto?
Think again.
When I wrote about the legal implications of the Caledonia native land dispute in this column two weeks ago, I wondered in print "what would have happened if the Haldimand grant had been for an area of 10 km on each side of Toronto's Don River instead of the Grand River, and if a group of protestors blockaded the Don Valley Parkway in violation of a court order?"

It turns out that a huge portion of the City of Toronto is in fact subject to a valid native land claim, which affects the title to millions of Toronto properties. I was reminded of this claim when I received an email from Stanley Dantowitz, a law clerk at Borden Ladner Gervais LLP in Toronto.
Full story in the Star.

Lee, the point is you HAVE been ignoring the law. The law only seems to be an issue when someone ELSE is ignoring it. This is why so many of the "angry Canadian" rants ring hollow to those who don't have any vested interest in either side.

Again, I doubt any of you knew nor cared about the topic when the natives were using words. Judging by the responses, it seems that few have even tried to discover the history behind the grievances now that there is a conflict. Instead, people seem to gravitate towards the few extreme acts of violence, tar the whole group as "savages" can campaign for the police to storm troop the protesters so "normal Canadians" can get on with their happy little lives - broken deals be damned.

Terrorism is what happens when words don't work. North Americans have been very tolerant of domestic terrorism at the hands of environmentalists, anti-abortionists and white supremacists. To suddenly fly off the handle at some natives who blockade a piece of land for which they have a very strong claim is more indicative of Canadians being inconvenienced, rather than some brave stand against terrorism.

This situation isn't going to move forward until the government admits direct responsibility for their situation. The residents of Caledonia may feel slighted, but have yet to prove that their rights are more important than anyone else's. Blame your government (including Terminator Harris and Mr Dithers), not the natives.

To finish the post above, the article says the a government statement at the time announced that the current ownership of that land is not in question and is not at issue in the claim.
Also- Since 2003, negotiators have been trying to agree on what constitutes fair cash compensation for the losses to the First Nation as a result of the 1805 Toronto Purchase.
Finally-Now it seems that those of us who own property in Toronto don't really have good title to it, but the government is going to bail us out with our own money.

Well, Cynapse, you got me there. I am overwhelmed by your "logic", lol.
Hope they come for me soon and make me pay for my crimes, lol. This life of crime is just too hard on the nerves.

I don't have a dog in this fight other than my liking for Canadians, but I have to make this observation: When the Government has the only legitmate right to use force, society is stable. But if other groups can use force, then the society begins to fall apart. This is the warlord scenario.

Cynapse

So following your logic:

A land dispute rooted in the Haldimand Proclomation of 1784, a surrender of land rights in 1843, an expansion of designated reserve land in 1847 followed by subsequent surrender of acreage from 55,000 acres to the current 44,900 acres is the justification for non-observance of criminal law in 2006.

So if I understand you correctly a CONTRACT law dispute based on a 216 year old proclomation and last dealt with 159 years ago absolves current "native protesters" from personal RESPONSIBILITY for their CRIMINAL behavior.

Thanks for making my previous point.

Syncro

Cynaps, following your logic, I'd say the folks in Manhatten had better watch out because the first nations people today have the option of determining if their ancestors were capable of making deals with the evil whiteman.

The natives in Caledonia are nothing more than opportunists, waving that race card in order to get something for nothing. BTW: I looked up several articles on the land in question so unless you have any proof (as in documentation) to back up your claims...

Actually Syncro, I said nothing about whether the criminal actions (attack on media, tourists) should be punished. Tactically they're terrible moves since these native protests tend to work better when public sympathy is high. Unprovoked attacks on tourists and the mainstream media -two groups generally sympathetic to native land claims- will achieve the opposite.

My main point is "angry Canadians" suddenly worrying about respecting the law is grating. It's insincere, all politics aside, and shows that pimping victimization is hardly limited to native protesters.

Texas Canuck:
Deep roots in land claims
That's all the proof you should need, and by reading it you'll be far ahead of most of the Indian-bashers. The situation is far more complex than people are giving it credit for.

Cynapse: Go suck a lemon and re-read Helen's post, just above yours. Oh yeah, and get real.

The Natives in Canada should feel fortunate that they lost the battle to British forces rather than, say, Spanish ones, because British victors didn't wipe them out, which they easily could have done. In most other countries, the conquering armies massacred, enslaved, or drove out the Native populations. This scenario is called "reality," Cynapse, or non-reductionist history. You don't have to like it, but it's what has happened, nine times out of ten, throughout history.

The groups with the technological know-how to build weaponry and boats, sail those boats, feed their crews, and stay alive until sighting a new land have always had it over the people they then encountered who didn't have the technological know-how to withstand the assaults of the new kids on the block. That's life, folks, "salada" as the Spanish put it.

Left to the vagaries of history, had the British conquerors been blood-thirsty despots, Canadian Natives wouldn't be protesting their "property rights" today; they wouldn't be in Caledonia, period. Put into context, Canadian Natives have it far better than in most countries. Nine billion dollars a year from the Canadian taxpayer isn't insignificant compensation for real or imagined past transgressions. But how long can Canadians continue to pay compensation for "the (so-called) sins of our fathers"?

In Costa Rica, for instance, the indigenous people received their "citizenship" in 1991, and when the major 7.4 on the Richter scale earthquake hit the Atlantic coast a few months later, reducing their jungle villages to rubble, with their children dying from opportunistic diseases because all the roads were out and they had no medicines, being citizens meant squat. They received next to nothing from the government of the day, despite the international aid pouring into the country for earthquake relief.

I think it's time Native Canadians put their reality glasses on and stopped complaining about imagined or trumped up issues. It's time they understood the need to respect, and obey, laws put in place for all Ontarians. It's time for their own leaders to take responsibility for the mismanagement of billions of dollars paid to them every year and the corruption at the centre of their own band Councils.

It seems to me that there is massive denial and projection going on in many Native communities: "We're dissatisified, our homes and families are in a mess, we're sick, too many of us are alcoholics and drug addicts, [some starting at the age of eight or nine], etc. Now who can we blame for problems of our own making, for the mismanagement of our resources, because we will not assume responsibility for our own mistakes, for our own corruption?

As a Native saying goes, "A journey of a thousand miles begins with the first step." The first step here is for the Native population of Ontario to take some responsibility for the state many of their people are in and then do something proactive about it. That doesn't include blockading land they allege belongs to them. That doesn't include vandalizing, terrorizing, robbery, thuggery, flaunting Ontario laws, taking things into their own hands and to H___ with everyone else.

The Caledonia standoff has set back the Native cause a long way and has exposed the soft underbelly of our elected reprsentatives, who'd better step up to the plate if they want Ontario to not descend into lawless anarchy. Who's going to be the next group to take things into their own hands, using the Native blockade in Caledonia as their inspiration?

Dalton McGuinty and company: the clock's ticking. DO SOMETHING. DO WHAT YOU WERE ELECTED TO DO, AND UPHOLD THE LAWS OF OUR PROVINCE TO PROTECT THE SECURITY OF ITS CITIZENS. MOBILIZE THE OPP TO DO THEIR JOB, TOO.

My previous post was held for approval. It contains the link you all need to read.

As for the rest of the responses:
"Natives should be thankful for what we did to them"
"But if we let them take Caledonia, they'll take everything"
"It happened a long time ago; who cares?"

There is no logical response for any of those sentiements, since they are all born of emotion and bias. But at least admit what you are - anti-native and only interested in enforcing the law when it suits your political purposes. Talking about deficiencies in the native protests (which are obvious for all to see) does not excuse the events that led to the protest. And again, none of you have admitted or refuted that the inconvenience caused by the protest is the only reason you are even concerned.

Oh come on, Cynapse. Natives in Ontario don't own Ontario, and they never did.

No one has said Natives should be thankful for what "we" did to them; they should be thankful for what "we" didn't do to them. They should be thankful for the nine billion dollars their communities receive every year as compensation for the land we "stole" from them (give me a break). That works out to roughly $50,000 per household, IF their own leaders were equitably distributing these funds. We know that's not anywhere near happening.

Time marches on. I'm sure I could find all sorts of injustices done to me and my family somewhere in the past; I can sure think of a lot of present-day ones. But I can't take the law into my own hands and demand, by blockading the wrongdoer's property, what I claim is mine.

I'm not anti-Native. I actually have Mohawk blood from my maternal great-grandmother who grew up in Buffalo. I just don't believe in the very messy situation we have in Canada concerning Natives and their existing in some kind of parallel universe, parallel government, where the laws the rest of us live by and are bound to obey don't apply to them. This is a recipe for disaster.

If Natives insist on seeing themselves as victims, instead of being proactive in their own emancipation--and by that I mean they'd better be looking at some kind of assimilation into North American society because there's no "going back" to their way of life a hundred years ago--they're never going to rise above the squalor that exists in too many of their reserves. Natives have got to take responsibility for their own situation and stop blaming everyone else for their problems.

Again, they don't OWN Ontario. They never did.

New Kid on the Block:

Time to hit the books -

1) The Spanish didn't wipe out the natives. Been to Mexico lately? How about South America? The Spanish killed far more natives through disease than violence, malicious as Columbus et al may have been
2) Your claim about the British ... at least speaks to your state of mind (you have heard of scalping, right?). See the passages below:

"In 1848, before the gold rush in California, that state's native population is estimated to have been 150,000. In 1870, after the gold rush, only about 31,000 were still alive. 'Over 60 percent of these indigenous people died from disease introduced by hundreds of thousands of so-called 49ers. However, local tribes were also systematically chased off their lands, marched to missions and reservations, enslaved and brutally massacred.'"--"Gold, Greed & Genocide," Project Underground

" Extermination of all of the surviving natives was urged by the Governor of California officially in 1851. 4 An editorial from the Rocky Mountain News in Denver, CO in 1863; and from the Santa Fe New Mexican in 1863 expressed the same sentiment. 6 In 1867, General William Tecumseh Sherman said, 'We must act with vindictive earnestness against the Sioux [Lakotas] even to their extermination: men, women and children.'" --Ward Churchill, "A Little Matter of Genocide: Holocaust and Denial in the Americas, 1492 to the Present," City Lights Books, (1998)

What kind of school did you go to? It was easy enough to research this before making such bold claims.

NKOTB, try to refrain from attributing comments that were never said to me. No one has claimed the natives owned all of Ontario.

Assimilation is only an answer when the majority population are willing to accept the assimilation of said groups as equals. Canada and America have both proven time and time again that only certain groups will be treated as equals. Those that aren't now "strangely" engage in land claims, separatist movements, etc. Simply telling natives to assimilate without acknowledging that work has to be done on the white side (as evidenced by the attitudes in this thread) is just another way of saying "native be quiet"

Bottom Line: the messy situation in Canada needs to be addressed by looking at the legal issues, not by shooting/arresting a few protesters. it's not going to be the quick-fix solution you are pining for and indeed there will be land/money losses for the Canadian majority, since much of those resources were ill-gotten during peacetime. Let's stop messing around and just deal with it.

Canada and America have both proven time and time again that only certain groups will be treated as equals

I challenge that.

The Spectator/Newbigging interpretation of the history of the Haldimand Tract is a little suspect, and perhaps somewhat disingenuous. A review of the historical documents presented on the Citizens of Caledonia site (and previously presented here by Kate) tell the land story somewhat differently, albeit with some interpretive difficulty. The land apparently was purchased from the Mississauga Ojibway and deeded to the six nations tribal cluster. There are apparently varying opinions as to what happened to the land after the bands took title of it, although there seems to be little dispute over the fact that the bands sold large pieces of it. One version asserts that the crown took back stewardship of the remainder on behalf of the bands, since they were believed to be being swindled by settlers undervaluing the purchases.
In any case, the generic native claims to ownership "just because" is poppycock. The six nations were immigrants to this area, just as most of the rest of us. Go back far enough and you're going to have to deal with the new line of archeological evidence that strongly hints that indians of the eastern seaboard and the northeast were of ancestry originating in... oops, southern France and the Iberian peninsula.

"RIGHTS----- but no corresponding RESPONSIBILITIES."

Synchro, that's it in a nutshell! Very insightful.

The culture of entitlement is so ingrained in society that we don't even see it as abnormal anymore.

We need property rights.
No more emotion/guilt based policies.
We are all learning that tribalism does not work in the modern world. Do we move backwards?
How long can we artificially support cultures that don't/won't/can't work?
When do we say enough is enough? 8b a year? For how many years?
Why are the tax paying, honest citizens of Caledonia being used as pawns by both sides? Arrests based on melatonin?

Un-effing-believable. Now we have the other chiefs agreeing that this is a good time for more protests. These (and 'those') people need to learn that we don't owe them anything. They owe us. We didn't build this country to have it taken away from us.

I read a comment from a Canadian on another board (American) who basically told these guys not to worry, last time we had problems (FLQ), we turned quickly into a bunch of nasty bastards and quashed it quick. I wonder if we still have it in us...

NKOTB, I always enjoy your posts.

Kate, thank you for having this forum. I believe you're right to keep wide and varied opinions. Nobody is served by an echo chamber.

Kant was (not mostly)wrong.

I pray for my kids future.

Steve

Just went down to the Frontier (Caledonia) this Saturday night. Just blew my mind what I found out. We are led to believe this about a land clam dating back to the 1841’s. Wrong!!
The Hennings (Henco) obtained the land before a another man, who also wanted it. This man is called Hill, he runs the tobacco plant on the reserve and was caught in the early 90’s, smuggling cigarettes from the US. He wanted that land to build a casino on it.
That’s right, this dispute is about a casino!!
Since Hill did not get the land, he is going to steal it. He brought up two women from the NY reserve, one being Jameson , these two started this protest. Then, Hill brought in Mohawk Warriors from the US, some with Army experience, the leader is (you are not going to believe this) an ex-navy Seal!! At the present, this ex navy Seal is fortifying the land, conducting weapons training with automatic guns (gun registry??) building Bailey Bridges over the RR tracks, cutting trails in the woods for quick escape by atv. Chainsaws are going all night cutting roads in the woods. Gunfire in the daytime. These thugs have gone to some of the residents telling them to leave their houses. These thugs are paid by Hill.
Now, why are the OPP not doing anything?
This going to stun you, Gwen Boniface who is the head of the OPP in Barrie Ont. is a full blood ‘Mohawk’ distantly related to Hill. Yep, that’s why nothing is happening about that injunction issued by Judge Marshal.
I talked to the woman who handled the handkerchief to the wounded CH camera man, she said he was in very bad shape. The OPP did nothing, despite screams from her and others.
Further, the OPP officer who was run over, was in very bad shape, the native who hit him aimed the car directly at him to kill. Rumour has it, the US Mohawks are quickly leaving for the US to escape murder charges.

I ask all blogers who read this, to ask your readers to demand the protestors being removed from the site, and McQuinty to ask Gwen Boniface to step down, as she has a very serious conflict of interest here!!!
Spread this from Newfoundland to BC and email the OPP, Ontario Govt., plus the CBC, CTV, CFRB 1010, CHML 900, and other TV and radio stations and any other you can think of like MP’s, Ont MPP.
Do this for Monday morning and flood thier e-mails, demand this be looked into

This land thief for a casino!!

Check out Finger Lakes Times online Tues, May 16,2006 [" The petition for writ of certiorari is denied." With that eight-word statement, the U.S. Supreme Court Monday dealt a death blow to the 26-year-old Cayuga Indian land claim by refusing to hear the Nation's appeal of a lower court's dismissal of the case.] www.fltimes.com/Main.asp?SectionID=38&SubSectionID=121&ArticleID=11873

No doubt as to the origin of the radicals behind the protest. ie; Jamie Jaiemeson.

As with the FLQ sixties the situation will get worse before it gets better due to the bleeding hearts and McSquinty. Justice Marshall for Premier

Interesting development. The violent reactions the barricade renegades have had to being;
A) photographed and B) Identified, is an indication that they fear "reprisals" ( as they say) from autorities.

It is well known that the first nations export muscle ( violent/criminal thugs from a so-called international warrior mafia) to the scenes of conflicts. This cross border criminal cartel supports itself by running contriband through reserves and has been monitored by the FBI and to a lesser degree the RCMP.

My take on the "off duty" State troopers getting gooned by renegades for a camera is that they probably were sent in (plain clothes) to identify some well known native mafia trouble makers from the US warriors cult.... international criminals entering the coutry to a civil uprising ...that makes this a federal matter and the RCMP could take charge..when that happens criminal code charges and immigration violations are certain to come and criminal detention of the non resident renegade warriors will commence. No wionder they fear being ID'd by US authorities.

At first I thought this Calidonia claim was lawfully justified because the land in question has been in legal dispute via filed court documents for decades. When I see how six nations is escallating the confrontation with imported muscle (much of it with criminal records), I'm at a point where I think the tanks should roll to the barracades and the round up and criminal trials begin.

The resolution of this situation is not rocket science. The Native's land claims have not been upheld in courts of law. The Natives are illegally occupying the work site, as well as blocking public roads, committing acts of vandalism, physical assault, and vehicle theft.

There is NO other protesting group in this country that could get away with the crap that the protesters doing. The police authorities should be allowed to do their job, to arrest and imprison any who continue the illegal occupation.

Cynapse: Surprisingly, you make my case with these quotes (FYI, General William Tecumseh Sherman was an American, born in Ohio):

"local tribes were also systematically chased off their lands, marched to missions and reservations, enslaved and brutally massacred."

"General William Tecumseh Sherman said, 'We must act with vindictive earnestness against the Sioux [Lakotas] even to their extermination: men, women and children.'"

'Just what I said.

Sure, there are indigenous people left in Mexico and Central and South America, many of them in quite remote regions of the country (Costa Rica is a case in point). Are they getting billions of dollars from their governments as payment for lands acquired over 100 years ago? I think if you do your research you will find out that, no, they don't.

As for your statement "you have heard of scalping, right?" Yes, I have. Did you know, Cynapse, that Natives scalped not only the British and French but also members of other tribes? There was a lot of inter-tribal warfare going on 200 years ago, so all of the Natives' problems back then cannot be solely attributed to the marauding newcomers from the Old World. In fact, certain tribes collaberated with the British and French to win wars against hostile tribes, a fact that is left out of history books. Not all history texts are reliable in this regard.

And, BTW, I didn't say that YOU had said the Natives own Ontario. That's a statement I'm happy to attribute to myself, based on observations and their actions, many of which seem to assert this claim.

In the same way today, Natives in Canada/Ontario need to take a good look at their own culpability in these disputes and their negotiations, and the fact that a small but significant minority are flaunting provincial laws thereby doing irreparable damage to the negotiation process, not to mention being a disastrous PR move.

Personally, I hate the fact that appearances are so important in our image-conscious society, but it doesn't do one's side any good to be seen hauling innocent people out of their cars, taking those cars, stealing personal property (cameras, film), and threatening the safety of those who were taking photos.

It's a fool's game to try and re-write and re-negoitiate issues that took place over 200 years ago. Too many variables have changed, too many details remain simply matters of speculation and supposition, and there is often just no proof that is reliable 200 years later. Good God in Heaven. If every group in Canada that had a grievance started to play this game, we'd be a bubbling cauldron of upheaval and disorder.

Cheap shot, Cynapse, to ask what kind of schools I went to: Suffice it to say I have a university degree and a post-grad. degree, not that that means a whole lot. More important, to my mind, is that I'm not a knee-jerk political correctnik who buys into the "victim" mentality which has become so prevalent in Canada over the last 30 years. Victimhood has become an industry in our nation, and it's like a noose around the necks of those who subscribe to it. It is strangling personal initiative and the pursuit of excellence. Mediocrity and worse is the outcome of this mentality. In fact, ghettoes of so-called "have nots" have grown up around victimhood. In former times if you wanted something you didn't have, you worked hard for it. You scrimped, you saved, you got up early and worked hard for your living, looking for opportunities to improve your situation. That's the story of all immigrant communities who, when first arriving in Canada, had little or no status in their new land. Native Canadians have had countless legs-up, from monies paid to Native bands every year, government housing, free medical and medication plans, tax breaks, university fees paid, etc., etc. and yet they still complain that they're not treated well by Canadians.

If the land in Caledonia is in dispute, they had best hire a lawyer, or a squadron of lawyers if necessary, and pay for their salaries from the nine billion they are given yearly. This is the way the rest of Ontarians have to settle land disputes, because if the rest of us tried using the tactics this band of thugs has used, we'd most assuredly be in jail.

Ironic turn on Friday night (CTV news): A resident of Caledonia was arrested for fighting with a policeman (not a good thing to do) while none of the Mohawks throwing stones at a group of 300 residents and taunting them was arrested. The OPP now say they are working with Mohawk "officers" to identify the troublemakers so they can make arrests, but say that it may be difficult because many of them are from out of the area.

from CTV news:

"Ontario Provincial Police have issued warrants for the arrest of seven people who face charges of attempted murder and robbery in connection with several clashes in the ongoing Caledonia land dispute.

"Deputy OPP commissioner Maurice Pilon said police are working with Six Nations officers to find the suspects.

"'I must point out that some of these people that we're seeking warrants for are not from this area and I don't know if they're still in the area,' Pilon told reporters Saturday.

"The suspects also face charges of assault causing bodily harm and intimidation."

Mark said: "The resolution of this situation is not rocket science. The Native's land claims have not been upheld in courts of law. The Natives are illegally occupying the work site, as well as blocking public roads, committing acts of vandalism, physical assault, and vehicle theft."

Untrue Mark....the claim has yet to be reviewed by a court and no decision has been rendered to date. However this does not excuse the criminal actions and lawlessness of the Six nations occupation force nor their importing warrior mafia muscle to intimidate and assault citizens.

My offered solution was to get the feds involved via the ID of cross border known criminals showing up in this uprising, quell the violence and lawlessness decisively, apprehend and jail law breakers and restore order to Caledonia FIRST...before any negotiating is done.....I would make this a condition of proceeding in court on the claim....if responsible six nations want to cooperate by rendering up the criminal elements at work in this lawless revolt, the faster that process will come.

Now is the time to step in for Harper.

WLM said: Untrue Mark....the claim has yet to be reviewed by a court and no decision has been rendered to date.

OK, if this is the case, why are they out there causing all this civil unrest? Presumably, going through the courts would be the rational thing to do.

Yep, nothing like leaving your police force out on the line during a storm to hang and dry.

Caledonia officers say safety is at risk

Caledonia `optics' come under fire Police lament riot gear rules

Jun. 8, 2006. 05:45 AM
SUSAN CLAIRMONT
TORSTAR NEWS SERVICE

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&call_pageid=971358637177&c=Article&cid=1149717019670

HAMILTON—OPP officers assigned to the native standoff in Caledonia say their bosses have put their public image ahead of officer safety and law and order.

"Due to the political pressures and optics involved with this, the OPP seems to be bending their own rules while sacrificing officer safety," Karl Walsh said. "Optics don't have any place on the front lines at Caledonia."

The "deviation from the usual training and standards" of the OPP "has been an underlying concern from the get-go" in Caledonia, said Walsh.

So far, 13 officers have been injured while assigned to the stand-off. Some injuries could have been avoided if officers had been allowed to follow their usual procedures, officers say.`It's okay to have an officer walking around in tactical uniform at Wasaga Beach on a long weekend, but it's not okay in Caledonia'- Karl Walsh, president of Ontario Provincial Police Association

The standard practice for OPP officers dealing with an unruly crowd — as both the protestors and the townsfolk have sometimes been during the past months — is to dress in riot gear, with helmets, visors and shields. "But these officers were ordered not to wear them for optical purposes," said Walsh. The OPP doesn't want to give the media, the protestors or residents the idea "there's an increased level of aggressiveness" in what they consistently have called a "peaceful" operation.

Ontario police seek arrest warrants after violence at aboriginal blockade

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2006/03/22/1500487-cp.html

CALEDONIA, Ont. (CP) - Police are looking for seven people who face several charges, including attempted murder, assault and forcible confinement, after a string of violent clashes at the scene of a long-standing aboriginal blockade in southern Ontario. An Ontario Provincial Police officer suffered serious injuries Friday after angry aboriginal protesters surrounded a U.S. Border Patrol vehicle and dragged out its three occupants.The injured officer was pulled out of the path of the stolen vehicle as it was driven deliberately at him, OPP Const. Doug Graham said Saturday.

Yep, something is seriously amiss in Caledonia.

skyclad;

"This going to stun you, Gwen Boniface who is the head of the OPP in Barrie Ont. is a full blood ‘Mohawk’ distantly related to Hill. Yep, that’s why nothing is happening about that injunction issued by Judge Marshal."

Thanks for that info, and rest. I looked at citizensofcaledonia.ca to see if they had any such info. So far don't see any. I will send them a copy of your post.

Sounds like they're hunkering down for a long, nasty one.

"'I must point out that some of these people that we're seeking warrants for are not from this area and I don't know if they're still in the area,' Pilon told reporters Saturday.
Convenient that there was widespread coverage of the warrants and no action has been taken.
Probably enough time has passed that those who are wanted have slipped back across the border.
A bit too convenient I believe.
I think the OPP do not want to make any arrests and the whole warrant business was a staged affair with predictable results as it was designed to placate those outside the area.
Foil hat now off.

No need for the foil hat, Rich. I think the warrant bs was just talk - sounds serious to be issuing warrants but it's the enforcement that counts. And Pilon is already talkking about how he can't do it.

Thanks for your comments, I posted more at Dustmybroom, Itis in the latest Caledonia Blog at that site, cople stories below the fish,

Really need help on this, new at this blogging stuff, if you spread this as far as you can.

I have relatives in the area...as I mentioned at 'dustmybroom', more on the site reporting.

7 Caledonia suspects may be on reserve

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2006/06/11/caledonia-police.html

I guess 6 of the 7 protesters being sought are area locals and not imports from the States, the seventh is from Victoria. These are the ones being sought on attempted murder, assault, forcible confinement, motor vehicle theft, robbery, intimidation and assault causing bodily harm.

The seven — who were mostly local aboriginal protesters but included a woman from Victoria — have left a native-led occupation at a housing development near Caledonia, CBC reporter John Northcott said from the site.

The Six Nations leaders reaction -

'The Haudenosaunee are a people of peace and do not condone violence of any form.'-Six Nations Confederacy

"The individuals who were involved in these incidents have been removed from the reclamation site [in Caledonia] until our investigation is complete."

Hmmm.., Seeing as no OPP are allowed to police Native lands, this explains why they have not been apprehended. The Native security forces, who should have handed these violent criminals over to the OPP, instead punished them very, very harshly, by asking them to leave the construction site. If you asked my opinion, I'd say its more like they have told them to disappear into the woodwork.

In response to an earlier post regarding Canadian laws be revised to reflect criminality provisions no longer apply to aboriginals:

The Criminal Code already has specific preambles relating to the treatment of aboriginal offenders.

It's already written in. Ridiculous huh?

I did write to most mp's regarding this 6 weeks ago. But I think it is now time for a mass email hit to the Vic Toews, Minister of Justice and Stockwell Day, Minister of Public Safety. There is no justice for the people of Caledonia and there sure is no public safety either.

Day.S@parl.gc.ca

Toews.V@parl.gc.ca

The question should be asked: Where is the justice and public safety for the Citizens of Caledonia?

Once again, I will send my emails, we should fill their boxes!

McChicken has lost all control of his province, the feds need to step in.

The time for talk is long since over.

It's time for the Caledonia citizenry to get that class action to court.

big time liability. big time remedy.

The natives were conquered by us hundereds of years ago. The only reason they are even still here is we were nice enough to let them live and even gave them land to live on. They have no right to anything, only what we have been genorous enough to let them have. The sad truth of it is, we won, they lost, we get to make the rules now. If they aren't Canadian citizens then they are a foriegn country and in Caladonia they have declared war on Canada. If we wanted to we could declare war back and use the full force of the military to force them to surrender and then confiscate all land they have now in the name of Canada. Is that what they want? I know this sounds really racist but it's the real truth when you get down to it. If they want to start taking back parts of Canada from us then they better have a bigger and stronger army than Canada has and be prepared to fight the entire nation of Canada for every spec of land they seize.

Thank-you for the information on the 'connection' skydad. NKOTB, thank-you for the thoughtful, insightful, in good plain English, posts.
Cynapse, like the majority of Canadian kids who went to (s)tupidopia school after the Liberanos took over governing the nation back in the 60s has not studied world history. He/She would not know the big differece between Spanish, Russian, French, or Zulu conquests verses British conquests because after Turdo got into the governing business with his red minnions, History was presented as 'Socialism Studies' and the interesting analitical study of History was then terminated. Real knowledge was reduced to brainwashing with a boring emotional respose doctorine; maily using GB as the whipping boy for all the ills of the world.

Anyone who has studied History Knows that Britain was the only non totalitarian state back in the 'bad old days' colonial days. The government of GB was not 'naturally good' but the government of GB was responsible to the PEOPLE of GB. The people of GB were naturally opposed to the enslavement and/or slaughter of all enemies because the people of GB feared dictatorships. The King/Queen of GB was responsible to the elected parliament, therefore the King or Queen could not turn the Army on the citizens if 'they' were 'displeased'. The people knew that one desenter is the same as another if someone is lusting for power so the people opposed out and out slaughter and enslavement. I think you should learn how to read with comprehension, Cynapse. Comprehension involves thinking; assimilating underlying reasons for actions taken with the immidiate causes of actions and re actions.

Well, the trained US native agitators, are too well trained to do dumb things like beating up CH reporters, OPP officers, etc. It's like the Dudley George situation, the local natives get all inflamed up and do something unpredictable. The well trained ex army rent a ,native always stay in the background.

In many blogs you will come across this person Hazel Hill, she is related to the Hill guy attempting to bring this casino in.

My contact in Caledonia has mentioned that about 4% of the protesters are local. The rest from all over.

What upsets me most about the recent violence in Caledonia is that the OPP stood by and did absolutely NOTHING when an elderly couple was assaulted on Friday. Apparently, their personal safety needs(lack of riot gear)and directives from OPP Administration prevented them from rescuing the couple (consequently, the elderly man was taken to hospital with an MI). The rescue was effected by a local unarmed resident, without back-up.

I greatly sympathize with OPP officers who are hand-cuffed by directives from the OPP Administration, who in turn are hand-cuffed by the Ontario Government. But, to stand by when Canadian citizens are assaulted, and do nothing, is totally inexcusable. They should be fired, period.

It is hard to believe that this deliberate complete disregard for the rule of law just happened in Canada.

Re my earlier comments about the OPP. I saw a spokesperson on local TV and she says they will be arresting those people if they "come across" them. Yeah, that's right, if they stumble over them, look out!
Could be a new program: "Law and Order - Come Across Unit....men and women of law enforcement who arrest people when they bump into them on street corners...these are their stories."
As others have pointed out, they won't go onto six nations land, so she evaded the issue by saying they would be working with the six nations police force.

T2: Yeah, we've been conditioned/brainwashed into thinking that simply speaking the truth about someone with a different skin colour from ours or from a different race is "racist." Well, it isn't. It might just be facts you're talking.

If the Six Nations are interested in talking about being "racist," they might look at their own behaviour and their own talk: Do they ever put "whitey" down? Do they occupy lands because they belong to mainly European, mainly white-skinned people? Do they drag mainly European, mainly white-skinned people out of cars and SUVs to assault them and then rob them? OR do they do these things to all people, regardless of their colour or race/tribe?

I suggest that the Six Nations' people are "racist" for their recent actions against a particular segment of the population who are racially different from them and whose skin is a different colour. I'd say it's the pot calling the kettle black and I'd say to the Six Nations: Get out of the kitchen if you can't stand the heat.

Check out Canoe.ca...attempted murder, robbery and forceble confinement is Albert Douglas age 31 and 3 men from Ohsweken. One woman from Victoria B.C.. Trevor Miller age 30 of no fixed address and another unidentified man. Big mistake swarming a U.S. Border Patrol. Geo. W. just might shake our feds into action.

Ben - this is an Ontario problem and your Ontario Premier is the guy to solve it. More than that it is a Toranna story and your Toranna Mayor should solve it. You people can talk about it and give the terrorists what they demand (the Liberano/Dipper way) or you can think about who you vote for next trip to the polls.

From Angry in the Great White North:

http://angrygwn.mu.nu/

"The OPP are looking for several people with regards to violence at the Caledonia stand-off involving the Six Nations Reserve.

One of those people is Ken Hill:

Ken Hill, 47, of Ohsweken, faces two counts of assault

Ken Hill is not just some two-bit hooligan. He's a two-bit hooligan with a business plan:"

http://www.canab.com/mainpages/events/archive_files/press/2004_press/2004economiccon/2004EcDevCon.pdf

Read the rest and see what this business plan was about....

Cynapse quotes Ward Churchill and nobody calls him on it? That's Ward Churchill the faux-Indian member of the Wannabe clan who wrote that the people who died in the World Trade Center were "little Eichmanns". Here's what the latest commission investigating Churchill's "academic misconduct" found:

The University released its investigative committee findings on May 16, 2006. The committee agreed unanimously that Churchill had engaged in "serious research misconduct," including four counts of falsifying information, two counts of fabricating information, two counts of plagiarizing the works of others, improperly reporting the results of studies, and failing to “comply with established standards regarding author names on publications.” However, the committee disagreed on what sanctions should be imposed on Churchill. Three members felt termination was a permissible response to the misconduct. Two members favored a two year suspension without pay, two favored a five year suspension without pay, and one favored outright termination. Churchill's actual punishment will be determined by the University.

Reference link for the above, but just Google his name and you'll find loads of similar stuff: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ward_Churchill

Now, back to Caledonia. Stephen Harper and the feds would be insane to go anywhere near this disaster. This is Dalton's tar baby. Law and order in Ontari-ari-ari-o is DALTON'S JOB. The provincial police are under Dalton's command. They are following his orders. Don't blame them. Blame Dalton and his gang of Liberal knaves and poltroons. This their baby. Let them wear it.

Does anyone know how to say "intifada" in each of the languages of the Six Nations?

T2 Said "The natives were conquered by us hundereds of years ago. The only reason they are even still here is we were nice enough to let them live and even gave them land to live on. They have no right to anything, only what we have been genorous enough to let them have. The sad truth of it is, we won, they lost, we get to make the rules now. If they aren't Canadian citizens then they are a foriegn country and in Caladonia they have declared war on Canada. If we wanted to we could declare war back and use the full force of the military to force them to surrender and then confiscate all land they have now in the name of Canada. Is that what they want? I know this sounds really racist but it's the real truth when you get down to it. If they want to start taking back parts of Canada from us then they better have a bigger and stronger army than Canada has and be prepared to fight the entire nation of Canada for every spec of land they seize."

This post highlights the basic premise of SDA, and it is wrong.
No First Nations people were "conquered" in Canada. In fact, Canada would not be a country today if not for the First Nations people. SDA and many of the people in it are out to lunch, hateful and ignorant. Ignorant of history, ignorant of facts, and ignorant of what it is to be Canadian. For your own elucidation, check out the history of Aboriginal Canadians in our World Wars I and II.
A pack of liars and thieves is what SDA is.
"Nice enough"? T2 and his/her ilk aren't fit for the compost heap, let alone "nice" enough to be a real Canadian.
"Sounds really racist"? IS really racist.
Get some facts, or get back to whichever "old country" you came/come from. Take your ignorance, hate and yourselves back to the cesspool you made of your old place, fouled so bad you had to emigrate, and now are doing the same thing here. Canada doesn't need you, never wanted you, and is getting tired of your fear and hate.

IMO- Dalton was "disappointed" , now his government has "exhausted its patience". Apparently, he isn't yet too worried about the OPPtics of the situation - wait until disaster strikes. He is currently crossing the country on a magical mystery tour. Meanwhile, his political advisor WK, along with some old Liberal cronies, get together following the "so called" terrorists arrests to organise a feel-good concert (this is municipal election year for TO, provincial next). Maybe Dalton will have something resolved by then.

Hockey hooligans cause damage in Edmonton, soccer in Toronto. Ottawa phone-in host was victim of smashed car windows - discovers over 3 hour program that this particular infraction as well as robberies and vandalism wide-spread due to roaming teens at all hours. Where are parents? Cops overworked, collect stats, and tell you to call insurance company.

Let's all hold hands and repeat after me "We ain't skeert!"

The Ward Churchill quote is hardly unique. Much evidence of Indian genocide can be found elsewhere. Want another quote? (making the huge assumption that any of you actually care)

Its such a distressing situation, to me it brings to mind the last words of Col Wm Custer back at the little big Horn when he said"Major Reno, what is up with these natives, they were fine at the dance last night"

Positive news.
Hamilton area radio reports that the barricades are coming down at Caledonia, Douglas Estates situation remains unchanged, no info as to whether there has been any move regarding assistance with locating those named in the arrest warrants.
I have the link but keep getting caught in spam filter when links are posted, I am sure the info will be up on Nealenews.

Jema54: nice little dodge. I've probably studied more world history than you do, which explains why I have to point out the obvious -->

The British Empire had slavery, and its colonies continued to practice slavery long after Britain itself ended the practice. Moreover, when the British outlawed black slavery in colonies like Trinidad and Tobago, they simply brought in East as "indentured servants" (indentured + servant = slave).

Furthermore, to separate the Americans from their Colonial forefathers is a bit dishonest. Thomas Jefferson declared that all men were equal (which is non-Totalitarian language) while himself holding slaves. Do you honestly think this deserves distinction from open slave societies?

The rest of what your wrote is fluff: not everything criticizing your valued institutions is the product of "socialist brainwashing". Perhaps you should try comprehending my words and engage in some honest dialog.

Jema, ever heard of Barbados?

"Sugar demanded labour and this poured into Barbados in increasingly large numbers, quickly making the island not only the most populated of England's overseas colonies, but also one of the most densely populated places in the world. Initially whites from Britain were brought in, either as indentured servants or prisoners. For example, after the Somerset uprising, many West Country men were exiled or "barbadosed" by Judge Jeffreys. Nearly 7000 Irish were transported to the island during the Cromwellian period.

Barbados quickly acquired the largest white population of any of the English colonies in the Americas. In many respects, Barbados became the springboard for English colonisation in the Americas, playing a leading role in the settlement of Jamaica and the Carolinas, and sending a constant flow of settlers to other areas throughout the seventeenth and early eighteenth centuries.

However as the cost of white labour in England went up, planters, on the advice of Dutch and Sephardic merchants, turned to West Africa for their source of manpower. Black slaves were imported in large numbers from the Gold Coast region in particular, especially from what is today the country of Ghana. The Asante, Ewe, Fon and Fante peoples provided the bulk of imports into Barbados. Nigeria also provided slaves for Barbados, the Yoruba, Efik, Igbo and Ibibio being the main ethnic groups targeted.

It is estimated that between 1627 to 1807, some 387 000 Africans were shipped to the island against their will, in overcrowded, unsanitary ships, which made the Middle Passage a synonym for barbaric horror. Over time, many of these individuals were re-exported to other slave owning colonies, either in the West Indies or to North America. However, and this is especially true for the seventeenth and early eighteenth centuries, the high mortality rate among slaves working on the sugar plantations necessitated a constant input of fresh slaves in order to maintain a work force.

...

The black population also had characteristics which were different from those of other islands. From the beginning of the eighteenth century, the majority of Barbadian blacks were born locally. This high percentage of Creole born blacks, as opposed to Africans, contributed to the early development of a Barbadian identity. Also, as was the case in the white population, the sex ratio among Barbadian blacks was the norm. That is, there was an excess of women over men in both racial groups, a pattern which emerged in the last decades of the seventeenth century, making Barbados quite unlike other Caribbean islands, where there was an excess of men over women in both racial groups.

This enabled the black population to reproduce itself during the second half of the eighteenth century, rather than rely on fresh imports from Africa to maintain population levels. This was quite a contrast to what occurred on other English speaking West Indian islands, where the mortality rate exceeded the birth rate, and projections show that without imports, the slave population would have died out.

As a result, Barbados was the only one of the British islands which supported the passage of the act abolishing the slave trade. Put bluntly, Barbadian planters recognised that the island had a growing slave population which would guarantee on going sugar production, whereas the other territories would be hampered in their economic development, if denied access to slave labour. This was especially true of the newly conquered territories such as Trinidad, Essequibo, Demerara and Berbice. Barbadian abolitionism therefore was economically driven, although in all fairness, one should point out that there were influential white Barbadian abolitionists such as John Alleyne and R.B. Niccols, Dean of Middleham, who were genuine in their concerns and efforts.

Nevertheless, the slave trade was of importance for Barbados. Because of the geographical location of the island and the favourable trade winds, Barbados (Bridgetown in particular), became an entrepot for the re-exportation of slaves to North America, other Caribbean islands and to the Captaincy-General of Venezuela."

Hopefully that wasn't too long or too Socialist (re: unfavourable) to read. The point is, the widespread aversion to enslavement and genocide you croon about was in fact not widespread and for the most part ended for the same reason it began - economics. Offering relatively favourable treatment to a certain class of people (white Brits) does not negate this fact. You've just given the Liberals a huge endorsement.

Note: Long Quote from BBC. Thanks for letting it through, Kate

Cynapse, Why did you not read what I wrote - I see that I was right though, you are one of the '(s)tupidopia kids'. Trudeau was so hell bent on distroying 'rule by the people' that he ignored the 'evils' of all Totalitarian States. The Liberanos/Dippers deliberatly re-wrote Canadian History to 'expose' the 'evil' of Democracy. You typically rant on and on about "bad British" - where are your quotes about French, German, Dutch, Russian, Zulu, Chinese, etc. 'utopias' in their conquered lands? Where are your 'slavery' examples from Cuba, U.S.S.R. and China? Comparison and contrast are valuable tools in the study of History.

We have heard from an unhappy OPP that, because of the results of Ipperwash, that the OPP had decided before they came to Caledonia that they would perform no actions against the natives, no matter what they did, so as to protect themselves from actions afterwards.
If this is true, then the OPP are a cowardly group of law enforcers, ad it is no wonder people all over Ontario have lost respect for them. As human beings, it would have been expected they would go to the aid of anyone being assaulted, and arrest those responsible immediately.

hey Cynapse: congratulations on your valiant attempts to make known your beliefs and the reasons for them, especially in such a hostile environment.

Jema54: you're skilled in obfuscation and selective hearing. I applaud your appreciation of comparison and contrast, BUT ....where are your quotes about French, German, Dutch, Russian, Zulu, Chinese, etc. 'utopias' in their conquered lands? Where are your 'slavery' examples from Cuba, U.S.S.R. and China?